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QB Trey Lance, LAC (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Faust
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fantasycurse42
Footballguy Jr.
Cannon for an arm, big, strong, & fast.
With some good coaching (which sadly I don’t believe he currently has), I think he can be a monster. Has all the tools you would want.
zamboni
Footballguy
Hopefully they’ll get him some help in the off-season with his passing mechanics, such as the Manning camp or something of that ilk.
Football Jones
Footballguy
I don't have high hopes for this guy at all. Lance obviously has nice raw tools, but he's not nearly good enough of a runner to offset his erratic arm & mediocre (or worse) feel for the game.
Low chance of developing into a quality long-time starter, IMO. I view him similar to Jalen Hurts.
Low chance of developing into a quality long-time starter, IMO. I view him similar to Jalen Hurts.
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zamboni
Footballguy
Kiddnets
Footballguy
Agreed - a lot depends on how he performs in the playoffs. They could keep him for one more year but unless he makes a deep run I would think they have to cash in and deal him. They could probably land a late 1st rder - they invested just way too much into Lance but who knows how he has looked in practice,
I think the Niners know that JG is not the answer and will move forward with Lance next year. Heck, they went to the Super Bowl two years ago and still made a huge move for Trey.
They'll take advantage of JGs enhanced value and deal him. The incoming QB class is underwhelming and somebody will take on JGs very reasonable contract.
After the draft, Jed York was interviewed and the possibility of Lance not playing for 2 years was something that had been discussed.
https://www.nbcsports.com/bayarea/49ers/49ers-jed-york-comfortable-if-trey-lance-doesnt-play-two-years
I think if they can get a return similar to what they got for Alex Smith, they move on from Garoppolo without question. If not, I can see him staying. Personally, I am hoping that Lance takes over. There will be growing pains but I think the ceiling is so much higher.
https://www.nbcsports.com/bayarea/49ers/49ers-jed-york-comfortable-if-trey-lance-doesnt-play-two-years
I think if they can get a return similar to what they got for Alex Smith, they move on from Garoppolo without question. If not, I can see him staying. Personally, I am hoping that Lance takes over. There will be growing pains but I think the ceiling is so much higher.
tombonneau
Footballguy
In retrospect, such a puzzling deal for the Niners. It's not like he was on the board so they drafted "for value" despite their QB situation. They actively paid a ton to go get him. Looking like a major unforced error by management. I don't think both will be on the roster next year. Question is who is dealt. If Flores lands with Caserio in Houston, Jimmy G could make a ton of sense there. But maybe they keep the vet and cash in .75 on the dollar for Lance to a team desperate for a splash at QB (given no marquee QBs in this draft) like Washington, New Orleans or Carolina. Lance and CMC would be quite the combo.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
This is silly, this situation is really not that much different than the Smith/Mahomes situation except that the 49ers paid way more of a premium for Lance. Which makes it even less likely that they’d want to move on from him, and tells you the ceiling they hope he has. It cost them a lot but in terms of roster building, there’s nothing wrong with having a solid vet already on the roster and continuing to try to compete while you develop a raw ball of clay with a lot of tools and talent.
Having an issue with the cost of the trade up for Lance? Logical. Thinking Lance will be a bust? Logical. Thinking they would have been fine with just riding with Jimmy G and using that draft capital to support him? Logical. All of these things, while I wouldn’t agree, are logical. Saying it’s puzzling, the situation makes no sense, it was an unforced error—none of those are logical positions. What they did and why they did it makes perfect sense, even if you disagree with the cost or doubt the outcome. If they’re right about Lance, which is always the caveat with drafting a rookie QB, then none of this will look weird looking back. And there’s no reason to think that wanting him to sit and develop means they were wrong about him. If they were wrong, then yeah, that sucks and they paid too much and it was a huge (and probably era-defining for their franchise) error. As is the case with any team that makes a big gamble at QB and fails. But until then, what they did and why they did it is perfectly logical if you assume they love Lance and what he can grow into. You can only get so far with a Jimmy G. Eventually you have to try to shoot for greatness. It’s a huge risk but there’s nothing puzzling or off about it.
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Kiddnets
Footballguy
I agree - but they also cant waste a 2d year of that rookie contract. Jimmy G's value will likely never be higher and he has a reasonable salary to a trading partner along with no big cap hit to SF for dealing him....Det, Pitt, NO, Wash would be all over him. Just cant see how SF can avoid dealing him short of an epic super bowl run.
tombonneau
Footballguy
Let me be clear I'm pro Lance. And I'm also pro Jimmy G. But they will have now burned 1 year of a rookie contract where a QB who desperately needs reps have gotten hardly any. I'm saying it is puzzling now in retrospect. At the time it seemed clear, they wanted to move on from Jimmy G, but now they are in a position where the incumbent could win 1-2 playoff games and they will have an even bigger question of what to do. Because I believe Jimmy is more than "a solid vet" this isn't Gus Frerrote keeping the seat warm. Some team (like Pitt) could instantly be a contender with him. That's where it can potentially turn into an unforced error if they go into 2022 with both on the roster and Jimmy is again starting. You are not two years burned of a rookie contract and have a young QB even further removed from action and live reps.
Best case scenario is they go into Dallas and Jimmy looks good but they lose. Then they can trade him to Pitt, Houston or Denver in off season and throw all their chips in with Lance. As someone who spent a first on Lance last season, this is the scenario I root for.
zamboni
Footballguy
The bolded is where I think we fantasy folks contradict with real-life situations. Lance certainly carries more fantasy upside, but his win ceiling compared to Jimmy - which is only what coaches and management care about - is a huge unknown.
Business/economics will ultimately make the determination, no doubt, but it might not be as soon as we Lance owners would like if the Niners beat the Cowboys.
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JohnnyU
Footballguy
-OZ-
Footballguy
wouldn’t think Houston would be overly interested right now. Pittsburgh or Denver makes a lot of sense, as would NO.Let me be clear I'm pro Lance. And I'm also pro Jimmy G. But they will have now burned 1 year of a rookie contract where a QB who desperately needs reps have gotten hardly any. I'm saying it is puzzling now in retrospect. At the time it seemed clear, they wanted to move on from Jimmy G, but now they are in a position where the incumbent could win 1-2 playoff games and they will have an even bigger question of what to do. Because I believe Jimmy is more than "a solid vet" this isn't Gus Frerrote keeping the seat warm. Some team (like Pitt) could instantly be a contender with him. That's where it can potentially turn into an unforced error if they go into 2022 with both on the roster and Jimmy is again starting. You are not two years burned of a rookie contract and have a young QB even further removed from action and live reps.
Best case scenario is they go into Dallas and Jimmy looks good but they lose. Then they can trade him to Pitt, Houston or Denver in off season and throw all their chips in with Lance. As someone who spent a first on Lance last season, this is the scenario I root for.
Wingnut
Footballguy
If either is dealt, it will be Jimmy. Lance isn't going anywhere before he has a chance to start a full season. York is giving Kyle at least one full season with Lance as the starter, even if it doesn't happen until 2023.
I think the only way Jimmy stays is if SF gets to the NFCCG or further this season. If that happens, I can see Lance staying the backup next season, but I think we'd see a shorter leash on Jimmy, especially since Lance will have a full season plus learning the system and Kyle will be drawing up more plays and packages for Lance this offseason.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Not impressed but I want to stress that i think it will pay off that he wasn't asked to do a ton, started 2-3 games due to injury, didn't look amazing but he got to carry a clipboard and with the same coaches next season, I see him being a trajectory for massive improvement, if he doesn't then he will have a short lived and overhyped, over drafted career. I'm not ready to upgrade or downgrade him terribly based on 2021.
Craig_MiamiFL
Footballguy
Have always thought Jimmy would wind up with Sean Payton with the EIU tie and talent/fit in his offense.
Nothing to sugarcoat with Lance year 1 but I'd be stunned if Jimmy G were a Niner next year. Should be able to get a decent return this offseason
Nothing to sugarcoat with Lance year 1 but I'd be stunned if Jimmy G were a Niner next year. Should be able to get a decent return this offseason
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
What team or teams will Jimmy G be a significant upgrade over? What is this decent return ye speaketh of?Craig_MiamiFL said:
Kiddnets
Footballguy
See below - could also structure it like Carson Wentz deal based on playing time and incentives - if Carson can go for a 1st and Sam Darnold a 2d and 4th then Jimmy G should get a good return.
Detroit - Jimmy G > Goff - very high 2d rd pick and a mid rd pick
Pitt - Jimmy G > Haskins - late 1st rder
NO - Jimmy G > Hill and Winston after surgery - tough spot - 18th pick a little too high - maybe a 2d and 3rd this year
Wash - Jimmy G > Henke - pretty high 2d rd.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Kiddnets
Footballguy
SF advancing is not good for Lance getting the job next year. Jimmy G didnt play great but he has shown to be able to win with this team where Lance is an unknown. Each playoff game he wins it will be harder and harder to make the switch - but at the same time the compensation will get higher and higher. I just dont know how they can keep Lance on the bench after paying all that draft capital but its possible.
Can't see Jimmy being a 49'er next year.
As to where he goes hard to say right now because right or wrong we got a ton of seeds from the Bellichick tree that are about to be head coaches and that to me is where he's most likely to go, to a team with a staff that has a history with him. So if/when Daboll, Flores, Mayo and McDaniels land on a team in need of a QB that's were I see him most likely going.
As to where he goes hard to say right now because right or wrong we got a ton of seeds from the Bellichick tree that are about to be head coaches and that to me is where he's most likely to go, to a team with a staff that has a history with him. So if/when Daboll, Flores, Mayo and McDaniels land on a team in need of a QB that's were I see him most likely going.
Just about everything has fallen right for the 49ers in terms of their (likely) grand plan - keep Jimmy, make playoffs and advance to push 2022 pick late, give Lance time to develop. It all hinges now on Lance's off-season development. What they give him to work on. I'm bullish that he puts in the work and comes in ready to take over the starting role.
zamboni
Footballguy
As discussed above, I don't think it's a given that Lance takes over next year even if the Niners fall flat to the Packers. Jimmy has done a credible job this year - he doesn't post eyepopping stats, but has still managed the offense reasonably well to get where it is. Granted, the draft capital traded to get Lance may force the team's hand, but we're assuming that a team will trade for Jimmy and take on his contract. And if they don't, I can't imagine the Niners would outright cut Jimmy. This will be one of the more interesting storylines in the offseason.
joey
Footballguy
Yeah, I think this has all gone according to the best case scenario from the 9ers brass pov. Trey had to sit this year since he’s obviously raw. Jimmy's trade capital must’ve increased with a full, healthy season and a playoff win in his back pocket. I think they trade him to one of the many teams needing a QB upgrade this off-season.
the craziest scenario is: what do the 9ers do if Jimmy actually leads them to a SB win?. How could they possibly not keep the band together for a repeat run next year? But, then again…winning solves everything. If they win the SB, I’d like to think the fans and media will "allow" another year of Trey sitting and Jimmy staring. Then again, I live in the Bay Area and have heard way too much sports radio to know that this fan base is fickle, spoiled and irrational, so Im likely wrong on this point.
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zamboni
Footballguy
That's another thing that may work in the Niners favor - tons of teams need QB upgrades, and the rookie draft is not overly strong. All that said, trades don't easily happen and Jimmy has a pretty sizable contract to take on. But I guess if the Eagles could find a way to get Wentz's contract off their books given the cap implications, the Niners can as well.
joey
Footballguy
Yeah, and if I’m the 9ers, I know they paid a 2nd for him, but I’d take a high/mid 3rd to move on from his contract and get the kid in the mix.
But Jimmy is really just a game manager. Is he really an upgrade over a lot of teams situations. He isn't the kind of QB that can come from behind and win a game. He plays well with a lead and strong running game.......not coming from behind. He is the same as many other QB's out there.
Sure someone can talk themselves into Jimmy G being an upgrade but I just don't see it except in extreme circumstances. Is he really better than Teddy B? I see them as the same guy really.
ETA: I think SF keeps him as Lance is not close to being ready. Jimmy G fits perfectly to what Shanny wants to do in run the ball and play with a lead with a strong D. I see another year of Jimmy G and Lance on the bench.
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I'd bet my soul this does not happen.
Can't pay what they did for Lance and pay Jimmy $24M another year and sitting another year does not help Lance get ready.
When SF loses their next game you can shut the chapter on Jimmy G's SF career.
zamboni
Footballguy
Not so sure about that. In 47 career starts, he's had 10 fourth quarter comebacks/game winning drives. https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/comeback.cgi?player=GaroJi00
As for being an upgrade over QB needy teams, I think he most certainly is. Whether its enough of an upgrade for a team to take on his contract though is certainly up for debate.
Not all fourth quarter comebacks are created equal. I know he has had some but I wouldn't put him on the list of QB's I want with 2 minutes left and need to score to win.
I think he is a solid NFL QB for sure. But I think he is in that middle of the pack where he a lot like Cousins in that I don't see him as a QB I can count on to win me a game on his own.
Terpman22
Footballguy
Not sure what the plan is in New Orleans, but Jimmy G has GOT to be better than Jameis and that other guy right?
Jimmy is gone regardless of how the remainder of the post season shakes out for the Niners. Too many teams are hurting at QB and Jimmy would be a great bridge for several teams. They didn’t give up what they did for Lance for him to be still holding a clipboard his sophomore year.
Wingnut
Footballguy
Hes only 21 years old (will turn 22 in May) so I could see a scenario where Jimmy stays, but like most here I think he will be traded after the season. Hopefully theyll sign a decent veteran backup.
I don't think so, no. But there are several teams mentioned where the answer is yes.
They may not know yet either, last I heard a few days ago Sean Payton was mulling over whether or not he was going to return for final year of his deal.
But should they get in position to want to trade for Jimmy G they will need to yet again pull off some salary cap gymnastics.
IIRC Jimmy has no guaranteed money left. Even if they can't trade Jimmy - and I think they'll be able to - Lance + a couple decent free agents at CB (signed using Jimmy's cap savings) is probably worth more than keeping Jimmy on for another year.
facook
Footballguy
Not sure he's better than a healthy, Sean Payton coached Jameis, but definitely a better passer than Taysom Hill obviously. I didn't list them though, because Payton seems to be able to win with whoever at qb so I don't think he'd think Jimmy would be enough of an upgrade to pay for him.
GreenNGold
Footballguy
SF should really consider trading Lance and sticking with Jimmy G.
ffmail4me
Footballguy
You serious Clark? They gave up a ton of draft capitol to get Lance. ZERO % chance that happens.
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