What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.

QB Zach Wilson, DEN (1 Viewer)

BobbyLayne said:
Over first 20 career starts

Zach Wilson JaMarcus Russell
70.7 Pass Rating 70.6
13-16 Pass TD-INT 15-13
55.6% Comp pct 52.1%
6.3 Yards/Att 6.2
8-12 W-L 6-14
Click to expand...
Young QBs are unpredictable. Josh Allen after 20 starts . . .

77.23 rating
23-19 TD to INT ratio
56.8% Comp%
6.7 YPA
12-8 W-L
However, Allen made great strides in starts #15-20 (8 TD vs, 0 INT with 3 games of 100+ passer ratings). Prior to that, his numbers would have looked as bad or worse than Wilson's. I am not suggesting that Wilson is anywhere near Allen, only that it takes a while for guys to figure stuff out. In Wilson's case, he looks like he isn't getting better (in Allen's case he showed flashes and obviously went to another level right after these numbers). The Jets are sort of stuck down the stretch here. Long term, they are probably better served to see if Wilson can turn things around the rest of this year and definitely conclude one way or the other if they want to give him another shot next year.
 
You have to admit this team has all the pieces in place to make a post season run, save for a quarterback. And while Joe Flacco isn't a QB that can win on his own and is a statue in the pocket, he's won a Super Bowl, understands how to read a defense pre and post snap, and still has a plus arm. He could at least make teams respect the pass. Who knows what would happen, but this team is at an inflection point. At some point you just have to cut your losses and admit Wilson was a huge mistake, and he clearly was. Rip off the band-aid and move on while you still have a chance to win this year. Wilson adds nothing positive to this offense or this team, and likely never will in the future. I'm typing all this as someone who liked the pick and believed in his talent but he's clearly in over his head and regressing, which considering how bad he's been is mind boggling to think about. He can't read a D, he's inaccurate, he's not a leader. Complete mission failure.
rockaction said:
kface said:
they need to make the switch
Click to expand...

To who? Mike White? Joe Flacco? Streveler? Jim Kelly's nephew who just won the Grey Cup?

Who is going to QB this offense more effectively this year?

After the year they probably need to switch, but they won't know unless they see more of Wilson.
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
We really can't use Allen's progression to asses every single QB coming into the league. Let us also not forget who he had as WRs before Diggs arrived year 3. It's no coincidence that's the year Allen took off.

Wilson has had more pieces in place early on to be honest, and a top D as well.
 
I know wins / losses isn't the best way to evaluate a QB, but Flacco is 4-17 in his last 21 starts. Having won a SB 10 years ago probably is not so relevant when he is 37 and even less mobile now.
 
Anarchy99 said:
I know wins / losses isn't the best way to evaluate a QB, but Flacco is 4-17 in his last 21 starts. Having won a SB 10 years ago probably is not so relevant when he is 37 and even less mobile now.
Click to expand...
Likely a fair assessment. But it's also fair to point out he's been a part of some pretty horrendous Jets and Broncos teams in that time frame and wasn't he like 6-3 his final year with the Ravens before getting hurt and giving the keys to Lamar? Anyway, at this point, how could he be worse? Give him a chance.
 
Dr. Octopus said:
Jacob's Ladder said:
how could he be worse? Give him a chance.
Click to expand...
Because he’s a statue.
Click to expand...
I already said Flacco was a statue. But he also has some plusses. Ability to read a D pre and post snap, experience, and a plus arm. Also, he likely has the respect of his teammates where it's very likely Wilson does not. Again, how could he possibly be worse? What Wilson doing is historically bad. I don't remember a top draft pick being this bad of a passer going all the way back to Tim Tebow but at least Tebow could run. Wilson doesn't even use his legs to positive effect a game. All that athleticism he displayed in college and workouts seems like a mirage at this point. Wilson is done. He will never amount to anything, I'm quite confident in saying that at this point unless he's hurt and we aren't being told about the injury. It's ugly out there.
 
BobbyLayne said:
Dr. Octopus said:
Jacob's Ladder said:
how could he be worse? Give him a chance.
Click to expand...
Because he’s a statue.
Click to expand...

And is like the biggest check down QB around at this stage of his career - IIRC he and Mike are the only QBs with 10% of attempts to RBs the past two years

OTOH the statue has two more TDs in 3 g than Zach has in 7.
Click to expand...
Flacco averaged 300 yards in his three starts this year against three legit defenses. He had 5 TDs and 3 INTs in that span. He likely cost them one game, won them another, and the third was a wash but they did lose. This was before the rest of their team hit their stride. I would like to see him get a shot now. It's not like he's the answer for the future, but neither is Wilson, that much is clear. At least Flacco gives you a glimmer of hope and allows your weapons to develop with an actual NFL QB. This is important. Wilson, Sims, Moore. These are great talents. Letting them whither away and die or leave after their contracts expire because of Wilson may set your offense back years.
 
Flacco turned the ball over 8 times his first 3 games this year? Jets are in a tough spot. A real qb has them in the playoffs, but then you know you are going to a new QB next year. Staying with Hack Wilson means maybe losing the locker room and jeopardizing the playoffs. I think if you go away from Hack now, he is done as this team's long term answer.....but realistically, he's just not a pro qb.
 
Jacob's Ladder said:
Dr. Octopus said:
Jacob's Ladder said:
how could he be worse? Give him a chance.
Click to expand...
Because he’s a statue.
Click to expand...
I already said Flacco was a statue. But he also has some plusses. Ability to read a D pre and post snap, experience, and a plus arm. Also, he likely has the respect of his teammates where it's very likely Wilson does not. Again, how could he possibly be worse? What Wilson doing is historically bad. I don't remember a top draft pick being this bad of a passer going all the way back to Tim Tebow but at least Tebow could run. Wilson doesn't even use his legs to positive effect a game. All that athleticism he displayed in college and workouts seems like a mirage at this point. Wilson is done. He will never amount to anything, I'm quite confident in saying that at this point unless he's hurt and we aren't being told about the injury. It's ugly out there.
Click to expand...
Wilson is able to escape pressure - the problem is instead of running he makes some dumb off balance throw instead.
The Jets lost their top 3 OT - Wilson is constantly under pressure. Flacco would be a sitting duck back there. He’s also not very good anymore. He had a great 4Q against Cleveland but was bad for most of the game and all of the Baltimore and Cinncy games.
I could see turning to Mike White or Streveler because Wilson has been so bad - but going to Flacco just makes the situation worse.
 
Mike White actually had a couple of pretty good games last year (including a 400 yard, 3 TD game against Cincy) before he got hurt, then he came back and gave his best Zach Wilson impression. Why shouldn't White be given another chance?
 
Last edited:
I’m on the fence about Wilson vs. Flacco at this stage with the playoffs still in reach. I have more confidence in Flacco managing the offense - he’s got the experience and would probably make smarter decisions. On the other hand, with the state of the OL, he’d be under pressure to get the ball out quickly to the WRs. He could do that but at some point you need mobility to escape the pocket, and obviously he can’t do that.

If I’m Saleh, I give Zach the first half to get things right, and if he’s still struggling mightily, make the move to Flacco at halftime.
 
Dr. Octopus said:
Jacob's Ladder said:
Dr. Octopus said:
Jacob's Ladder said:
how could he be worse? Give him a chance.
Click to expand...
Because he’s a statue.
Click to expand...
I already said Flacco was a statue. But he also has some plusses. Ability to read a D pre and post snap, experience, and a plus arm. Also, he likely has the respect of his teammates where it's very likely Wilson does not. Again, how could he possibly be worse? What Wilson doing is historically bad. I don't remember a top draft pick being this bad of a passer going all the way back to Tim Tebow but at least Tebow could run. Wilson doesn't even use his legs to positive effect a game. All that athleticism he displayed in college and workouts seems like a mirage at this point. Wilson is done. He will never amount to anything, I'm quite confident in saying that at this point unless he's hurt and we aren't being told about the injury. It's ugly out there.
Click to expand...
Wilson is able to escape pressure - the problem is instead of running he makes some dumb off balance throw instead.
The Jets lost their top 3 OT - Wilson is constantly under pressure. Flacco would be a sitting duck back there. He’s also not very good anymore. He had a great 4Q against Cleveland but was bad for most of the game and all of the Baltimore and Cinncy games.
I could see turning to Mike White or Streveler because Wilson has been so bad - but going to Flacco just makes the situation worse.
Click to expand...
Saying Flacco would fail because of a bad offensive line isn't fair. Getting the ball out early to the right guy with a running game to boot can cover up a lot of holes in any offensive line. I'm not comparing Peyton Manning to Joe Flacco, but Peyton Manning got the ball out early and won a Super Bowl in Denver with one of the worst offensive lines that's probably ever even played in the big game. And truthfully, Flacco IS Peyton Manning compared to Zach Wilson lol.

I'm sorry, but Zach Wilson has more than a singular problem. He's been terrible at...EVERYTHING. I'm fine going with White, Flacco, anyone else. Flacco makes the most sense to me, maybe not someone else. Sticking with Wilson because you can't admit he was a mistake is the worst move you can make at this point. Cut your losses and move on. I think they already know what they have in White. Practice team guy? I've seen crazier things. Just make a move.
 
The more I read people flail in their defenses of Flacco and White, the more inclined I am to stick with Wilson or sign "Swag" Kelly from the Canadian Football League.
 
Zach Wilson and Mac Jones are roster cloggers in start 1QB leagues. You don’t want to drop them and you can’t trade them. I have both in one league. In 2021 I drafted Wilson at the 2.05 and Jones at 3.04. I should have known better. I can see both going too high in SF and it’s a real killer in SF. In Superflex bum QBs are drafted too high because people are so desperate for QBs.
 
rockaction said:
The more I read people flail in their defenses of Flacco and White, the more inclined I am to stick with Wilson or sign "Swag" Kelly from the Canadian Football League.
Click to expand...
To be fair, it's not so much a defense of Flacco, or White, or any QB on the practice squad. It's an indictment of Wilson that these guys are even in the conversation at this point. The guy is straight trash, and that's putting it lightly. He isn't who we thought he was.
 
Last edited:
zamboni said:
I’m on the fence about Wilson vs. Flacco at this stage with the playoffs still in reach. I have more confidence in Flacco managing the offense - he’s got the experience and would probably make smarter decisions. On the other hand, with the state of the OL, he’d be under pressure to get the ball out quickly to the WRs. He could do that but at some point you need mobility to escape the pocket, and obviously he can’t do that.

If I’m Saleh, I give Zach the first half to get things right, and if he’s still struggling mightily, make the move to Flacco at halftime.
Click to expand...
if saleh goes away from hack now, it makes his decision last week to not pull him all the more baffling. it was one of those jet games where you knew they weren’t going to score or complete a pass.
 
White had a 400 yard game then was over confident and confused. They "have to" see what he's learned.

I just don't see "it" with Wilson and never have.
Granted I was thinking that about Fields a month ago but....
 
Bri said:
White had a 400 yard game then was over confident and confused. They "have to" see what he's learned.

I just don't see "it" with Wilson and never have.
Granted I was thinking that about Fields a month ago but....
Click to expand...
I am hardly a QB evaluator, but from the limited amount I have seen of Wilson in college, last year, and this year he seems like he can make throws that many other guys can’t. And he seems to be pretty athletic. But it looks like he struggles to process things and understand coverages.

As covered already by a lot of people, he panics under pressure. He needs to step up in the pocket instead of rolling out backwards and panicking.

IMO, he needs a QB Whisperer to help him understand plays and concepts, improve his pre-snap reads, and make better decisions. It’s the classic case of someone that’s athletic and talented that needs to be taught how to be a pro QB.

I put an equal amount of blame on coaching as I do Wilson. But I question his drive and work ethic to continually want to improve. I haven’t exactly heard stories that he is the first one in and the last one to leave or that he spends hour and hour pouring himself over game tape. Maybe he is and we haven’t heard about it.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Bri
Anarchy99 said:
Bri said:
White had a 400 yard game then was over confident and confused. They "have to" see what he's learned.

I just don't see "it" with Wilson and never have.
Granted I was thinking that about Fields a month ago but....
Click to expand...
I am hardly a QB evaluator, but from the limited amount I have seen of Wilson in college, last year, and this year he seems like he can make throws that many other guys can’t. And he some to be pretty athletic. But it looks like he struggles to process things and understand coverages.

As covered already by a lot of people, he panics under pressure. He needs to step up in the pocket instead of rolling out backwards and panicking.

IMO, he needs a QB Whisperer to help him understand plays and concepts, improve his pre-snap reads, and make better decisions. It’s the classic case of someone that’s athletic and talented that needs to be taught how to be a pro QB.

I put an equal amount of blame on coaching as I do Wilson. But I question his drive and work ethic to continually want to improve. I haven’t exactly heard stories that he is the first one in and the last one to leave or that he spends hour and hour pouring himself over game tape. Maybe he is and we haven’t heard about it.
Click to expand...
A lineman once said of Marc Wilson, "he had a scared look on his face".
 
  • Like
Reactions: Bri
i am biased as a longtime ravens fan with a literal signed poster of Flaccattack from the super bowl run on my wall lol …

but I would point out jets have a 50/50 chance of making playoffs this year it’s worth seeing if my guy comes out on point, and u know he can handle pressure if the run gathers steam

even if it’s not gonna be ”the year” that locker room has been through a lot and id imagine the bonuses coming down from a playoff appearance or two would go a long way toward happy players at training camp next season

very talented foster tho, insane defense, much respect for ur team regardless
 
zamboni said:
Schefter reporting Zach is indeed being benched
Click to expand...

ESPN's Adam Schefter reports won't start for the Jets in Week 12 against the Bears.​

Mike White would presumably get the nod as the No. 2 QB on the Jets depth chart, though it wouldn't be stunning to see No. 3 Joe Flacco get the call. Wilson's indescribably awful Week 11 performance against the Patriots — and subsequent media and locker room flailing — proved too much to overcome for the struggling former first rounder. Only Baker Mayfield has a worse completion rate over expected than Wilson this season. His complete inability to read a defense or feel a pass rush has squelched New York's offensive production for much of this season. Jets head coach Robert Saleh, with an otherwise solid roster that has a real shot at the postseason, could no longer let Wilson develop in critically important regular season games. It creates real questions about Wilson's Jets future, especially if his backup fuels a playoff run. Wilson has lost the organization's trust, perhaps in more ways than one.
SOURCE: Adam Schefter on Twitter
Nov 23, 2022, 11:05 AM ET
Click to expand...
 
Things are falling in place for Geno Smith and his agent: SEA, NJY, TB?, NE?, HOU, PIT, IND, CAR, WAS, NYG. Lamar too.
 
There is only one thing that will make us all happy...start Elijah Moore at QB.

Good for The Jets...Wilson is awful and doesn't look like he has the head/mind/leadership qualities to be an NFL QB...cut bait now and move on from him so you don't waste these young players on their rookie contracts...just heard Bert Breer on the radio and he said don't be surprised if Jimmy G lands there as he has history with the coaches.
 
Boston said:
There is only one thing that will make us all happy...start Elijah Moore at QB.

Good for The Jets...Wilson is awful and doesn't look like he has the head/mind/leadership qualities to be an NFL QB...cut bait now and move on from him so you don't waste these young players on their rookie contracts...just heard Bert Breer on the radio and he said don't be surprised if Jimmy G lands there as he has history with the coaches.
Click to expand...
I was just thinking how they should have gone after him, instead he’s leading Perhaps (one of) the top NFC team at this point.
 
JohnnyU said:
Must be a bitter pill for those who drafted him in SF, because you know it was a high 1st.
Click to expand...
This is me. I have an incredibly talented roster outside of QB, and it’s held me back from getting an early pick. I’ve offered multiple firsts for other QBs and am always rejected. I’ve been fortunate enough to lose a lot this year so finally might get my shot in 2023.
 
His reaction to adversity (not taking blame/responsibility) is almost as damning as his poor play. Hopefully this chance to take a backseat will allow him to mature as a player and a leader (for the Jets sake).
 
saleh defiantly said no when adked if he was replacing wilson next game. what changed robert?? oh i know woody johnson is a mental midget and fraidey cat who hates confrontation but id bet the farm he chewed saleh's ear off and told him to make the change. at the same time he shouldve told bobby saleh in no uncertain terms ..if youre still here next yr, you lose to the patriots again, youre fired on the spot. if the game is in NE you fly home alone on delta in coach.
 
:kicksrock:

Utterly disappointing for my dynasty rebuild. I was hoping Wilson would develop. Kid’s been snake-bit since he was drafted.

Maybe he turns it around. Hard to hold out hope for that though.
 
JohnnyU said:
Hot Sauce Guy said:
:kicksrock:

Utterly disappointing for my dynasty rebuild. I was hoping Wilson would develop. Kid’s been snake-bit since he was drafted.

Maybe he turns it around. Hard to hold out hope for that though.
Click to expand...
I'm thankful I only had a brain fart in one league.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I got him as one of the 5 pieces back in my Mahomes deal. Higgins, CEH, Wilson & 2x 2023 1sts. I dealt CEH for what’s going to be the 2023 1.01

So I still did pretty ok in that deal, but not as ok as if Wilson was a competent football player. There’s still a chance - Jets invested too much in him to give up yet.

Still - Not the most promising start to his career. :no:
 

NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Zach Wilson has struggled with the "yips" since the spring.​

Rapoport said he spoke with people inside the Jets organization who said Wilson "couldn't make the simple throws" and struggled with his "basic mechanics." "Something was just wrong," Rapoport added. The Jets hired QB coach John Beck to work with Wilson, to no avail. Jets head coach Robert Saleh, in announcing Wilson's benching on Wednesday, said there were some "basic fundamental things have gotten really out of whack" for Wilson in recent weeks. Mike White is set to start for the Jets in Week 12 against the Bears. If he plays well, he'll likely get more starting opportunities as Wilson fights through the yips.
SOURCE: Ian Rapoport on Twitter
Nov 24, 2022, 8:10 AM ET
Click to expand...
 
Faust said:

NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Zach Wilson has struggled with the "yips" since the spring.​

Rapoport said he spoke with people inside the Jets organization who said Wilson "couldn't make the simple throws" and struggled with his "basic mechanics." "Something was just wrong," Rapoport added. The Jets hired QB coach John Beck to work with Wilson, to no avail. Jets head coach Robert Saleh, in announcing Wilson's benching on Wednesday, said there were some "basic fundamental things have gotten really out of whack" for Wilson in recent weeks. Mike White is set to start for the Jets in Week 12 against the Bears. If he plays well, he'll likely get more starting opportunities as Wilson fights through the yips.
SOURCE: Ian Rapoport on Twitter
Nov 24, 2022, 8:10 AM ET
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Interesting. Yips can be fixed - kid played well in college. In a way that’s good news.

Mental issues can be coached. Losing Greg Knapp in his 1st year, during a COVID-y preseason was certainly a blow to his development.

Thanks for sharing.
 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
Faust said:

NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Zach Wilson has struggled with the "yips" since the spring.​

Rapoport said he spoke with people inside the Jets organization who said Wilson "couldn't make the simple throws" and struggled with his "basic mechanics." "Something was just wrong," Rapoport added. The Jets hired QB coach John Beck to work with Wilson, to no avail. Jets head coach Robert Saleh, in announcing Wilson's benching on Wednesday, said there were some "basic fundamental things have gotten really out of whack" for Wilson in recent weeks. Mike White is set to start for the Jets in Week 12 against the Bears. If he plays well, he'll likely get more starting opportunities as Wilson fights through the yips.
SOURCE: Ian Rapoport on Twitter
Nov 24, 2022, 8:10 AM ET
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Interesting. Yips can be fixed - kid played well in college. In a way that’s good news.

Mental issues can be coached. Losing Greg Knapp in his 1st year, during a COVID-y preseason was certainly a blow to his development.

Thanks for sharing.
Click to expand...
I believe Cheech Marin could help him - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNtsw9NQRFU&ab_channel=coachmikegee
 
JohnnyU said:
Hot Sauce Guy said:
Faust said:

NFL Network's Ian Rapoport reports Zach Wilson has struggled with the "yips" since the spring.​

Rapoport said he spoke with people inside the Jets organization who said Wilson "couldn't make the simple throws" and struggled with his "basic mechanics." "Something was just wrong," Rapoport added. The Jets hired QB coach John Beck to work with Wilson, to no avail. Jets head coach Robert Saleh, in announcing Wilson's benching on Wednesday, said there were some "basic fundamental things have gotten really out of whack" for Wilson in recent weeks. Mike White is set to start for the Jets in Week 12 against the Bears. If he plays well, he'll likely get more starting opportunities as Wilson fights through the yips.
SOURCE: Ian Rapoport on Twitter
Nov 24, 2022, 8:10 AM ET
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

Interesting. Yips can be fixed - kid played well in college. In a way that’s good news.

Mental issues can be coached. Losing Greg Knapp in his 1st year, during a COVID-y preseason was certainly a blow to his development.

Thanks for sharing.
Click to expand...
I believe Cheech Marin could help him - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNtsw9NQRFU&ab_channel=coachmikegee
Click to expand...
One of my favorite scenes in one of my favorite movies.
 
I don't believe he developed the yips. This was something Matt Waldman and others flat out saw in their evaluations of him. Thor Nystrom, too. I generally don't like Nystrom and I sure didn't like the racial element of the Fields/Wilson evaluation done by media/film grinder types, but it seems like Waldman, who had no real axe to grind, unlike Doug Farrar and Ted Nguyen, got it right and so did Nystrom.

There's going to be a lot of victory lapping by Fields truthers, but that's all horsebleep. Their eval was just as flawed. They were making excuses for him holding the ball. Guess what and newsflash -- he holds the ball longer than almost every other quarterback still. But then he can run.

Anyway, back to Wilson. He looked so lost and bad out there. Better to give him a seat and let him watch, because I'm guessing Flacco and White won't get it done. Saleh is probably being prophetic when he says that Zach will play again. If Wilson watching is the Jets' only hope, then watch he must.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

ericttspikes
WR Jason Brownlee, NYJ
Replies
3
Views
652
Faust
Faust
T
Travdogg's 3 round mock draft
2
Replies
76
Views
2K
Deamon
Deamon
T
Travdogg's pre-combine mock draft
2
Replies
52
Views
2K
(HULK)
(HULK)

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 2 (members: 0, guests: 2)
Top