Racist rancher,feds at a standoff.Drone strike looming! (1 Viewer)

[fatness]

The comments on that article are interesting.

Janson Smithers • 10 hours ago
the fed have unlimited resources. If they want martial law, they will force it on us.

Lonestar • 10 hours ago
And We Will DISobey.

rmg21943 • 10 hours ago
And you will DIE!

Lonestar • 9 hours ago
I'd rather die proud and free than die a sniveling coward dirt bag slave like you.

20pizzapies • 9 hours ago
You should go an pick cotton .

 

[Ditka Butkus]

This guy needs to go down hard. Caught up in his own minor celebrity, his true colors are coming out. Nut jobs like this can't hide them for long.

 

[Rove!]

You know who isn't racist? Harry Reid. He has Chinese friends. So close friends that he is getting them public lands for their solar panels. Great guy he is.

I hear Harry would never make racist comments about dialects or skin tone...

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

Would love to see an end of the day update of this.

Tonight should be an extra special Hannity.

It was an extra special Colbert.

 

[TheIronSheik]

Drone strike on the cattle.

 

[tom22406]

Drone strike on the cattle.

Make sure to save one for his house!

 

[Sweet J]

“I want to tell you one more thing I know about the Negro,” the rancher began as he described a "government house" in Las Vegas where he recalled that all the people who sat outside seemed to "have nothing to do."

“And because they were basically on government subsidy, so now what do they do?” he said, as quoted by the Times. “They abort their young children, they put their young men in jail, because they never learned how to pick cotton. And I’ve often wondered, are they better off as slaves, picking cotton and having a family life and doing things, or are they better off under government subsidy? They didn’t get no more freedom. They got less freedom.”

Cliven Bundy. Right-wing hero.

1. He clearly lacks an understanding of how much if an atrocity slavery was. Family life? Kids and wives were sold to others. Terribly uneducated thing to say

2. He also is not aware that most welfare recipients are white. I know that the MSM has sold a different caricature, but that's not reality

3. His observation that the social safety net structure and breakdown of the family has not served poor people well is correct.

Thanks for clearing this up for us.

Actually, I kind of like Rove's post. I think it is well overdue to have a thoughtful conversation (and maybe some decent research and analysis) about whether the "social safety net structure" as a whole has been better for people or worse. I'd love to see folks like Levitt and Dubner (the Freakonomics guys) tackle this. Maybe they have.

 

[squistion]

Stephen Colbert looks at Sean Hannity's close devotion to racist Cliven Bundy

 

[fatness]

I think it is well overdue to have a thoughtful conversation (and maybe some decent research and analysis) about whether the "social safety net structure" as a whole has been better for people or worse. I'd love to see folks like Levitt and Dubner (the Freakonomics guys) tackle this. Maybe they have.

Better or worse than slavery?

 

[Apple Jack]

I think it is well overdue to have a thoughtful conversation (and maybe some decent research and analysis) about whether the "social safety net structure" as a whole has been better for people or worse. I'd love to see folks like Levitt and Dubner (the Freakonomics guys) tackle this. Maybe they have.

Better or worse than slavery?

That is quite "thoughtful."

 

[Sweet J]

I think it is well overdue to have a thoughtful conversation (and maybe some decent research and analysis) about whether the "social safety net structure" as a whole has been better for people or worse. I'd love to see folks like Levitt and Dubner (the Freakonomics guys) tackle this. Maybe they have.

Better or worse than slavery?

Jesus, I guess I have to be pretty damn specific. If it wasn't blazingly clear, I'm not limiting my discussion to just black people who receive safety net type services. And I'm not comparing to slavery. But rather the use of the current safety net structures (AFDC, food stamps, direct payment, welfare, Medicare/Medicade), and whether or not there has been a net positive on the people it was supposed to help or a negative.

Much broader issue than what we are talking about in this thread, I know. I'm just referring to Rove's point #3. I won't go as far as to agree with it. But I would say that it is a good question to ask. Essentially, what are the unintended consequences of some of these programs? Both conservatives and liberals seem to avoid these questions. My guess is that the late great Patrick Moynahan was the last big name to be really interested in this issue.

 

[fatness]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

 

[Dinsy Ejotuz]

I think it is well overdue to have a thoughtful conversation (and maybe some decent research and analysis) about whether the "social safety net structure" as a whole has been better for people or worse. I'd love to see folks like Levitt and Dubner (the Freakonomics guys) tackle this. Maybe they have.

Better or worse than slavery?

That is quite "thoughtful."

And long overdue.

 

[Captain Quinoa]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Actually he was comparing living under the government's thumb versus living under slavery (inelegantly, to be sure). Not the current state of all black people. Also that video is conveniently edited - you should try watching the entire 3+ minutes. I know you really want him to be a horrible racist but he's just not.

 

[TobiasFunke]

I think it is well overdue to have a thoughtful conversation (and maybe some decent research and analysis) about whether the "social safety net structure" as a whole has been better for people or worse. I'd love to see folks like Levitt and Dubner (the Freakonomics guys) tackle this. Maybe they have.

Better or worse than slavery?

Jesus, I guess I have to be pretty damn specific. If it wasn't blazingly clear, I'm not limiting my discussion to just black people who receive safety net type services. And I'm not comparing to slavery. But rather the use of the current safety net structures (AFDC, food stamps, direct payment, welfare, Medicare/Medicade), and whether or not there has been a net positive on the people it was supposed to help or a negative.

Much broader issue than what we are talking about in this thread, I know. I'm just referring to Rove's point #3. I won't go as far as to agree with it. But I would say that it is a good question to ask. Essentially, what are the unintended consequences of some of these programs? Both conservatives and liberals seem to avoid these questions. My guess is that the late great Patrick Moynahan was the last big name to be really interested in this issue.

It's a good question to ask if it arises in the context of a reasonable discussion on the subject. Less so in a feeble attempt to make a horrible racist seem slightly less so. You pick your spots.

I'm pro-drug legalization and I'm sure this anti-government idiot is too. But if he went on a crazy rant about how blacks aren't really free because they're all a bunch of drug users and dealers and our drug laws put them in prison and they were better off as slaves, I wouldn't feel the urge to point out that our drug laws are bad, even if maybe this guy went a bit overboard. I'd just call him the miserable piece of #### that he is and fight that battle another day.

 

[Sweet J]

I think it is well overdue to have a thoughtful conversation (and maybe some decent research and analysis) about whether the "social safety net structure" as a whole has been better for people or worse. I'd love to see folks like Levitt and Dubner (the Freakonomics guys) tackle this. Maybe they have.

Better or worse than slavery?

Jesus, I guess I have to be pretty damn specific. If it wasn't blazingly clear, I'm not limiting my discussion to just black people who receive safety net type services. And I'm not comparing to slavery. But rather the use of the current safety net structures (AFDC, food stamps, direct payment, welfare, Medicare/Medicade), and whether or not there has been a net positive on the people it was supposed to help or a negative.

Much broader issue than what we are talking about in this thread, I know. I'm just referring to Rove's point #3. I won't go as far as to agree with it. But I would say that it is a good question to ask. Essentially, what are the unintended consequences of some of these programs? Both conservatives and liberals seem to avoid these questions. My guess is that the late great Patrick Moynahan was the last big name to be really interested in this issue.

It's a good question to ask if it arises in the context of a reasonable discussion on the subject. Less so in a feeble attempt to make a horrible racist seem slightly less so. You pick your spots.

I'm pro-drug legalization and I'm sure this anti-government idiot is too. But if he went on a crazy rant about how blacks aren't really free because they're all a bunch of drug users and dealers and our drug laws put them in prison and they were better off as slaves, I wouldn't feel the urge to point out that our drug laws are bad, even if maybe this guy went a bit overboard. I'd just call him the miserable piece of #### that he is and fight that battle another day.

Fair enough.

 

[timschochet]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Actually he was comparing living under the government's thumb versus living under slavery (inelegantly, to be sure). Not the current state of all black people. Also that video is conveniently edited - you should try watching the entire 3+ minutes. I know you really want him to be a horrible racist but he's just not.

Seriously?

 

[squistion]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Actually he was comparing living under the government's thumb versus living under slavery (inelegantly, to be sure). Not the current state of all black people. Also that video is conveniently edited - you should try watching the entire 3+ minutes. I know you really want him to be a horrible racist but he's just not.

I have watched the entire 3+minutes, plus what he has said subsequently - he is a horrible racist and even Sean Hannity couldn't put a positive spin on it.

 

[urbanhack]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Actually he was comparing living under the government's thumb versus living under slavery (inelegantly, to be sure). Not the current state of all black people. Also that video is conveniently edited - you should try watching the entire 3+ minutes. I know you really want him to be a horrible racist but he's just not.

I have watched the entire 3+minutes, plus what he has said subsequently - he is a horrible racist and even Sean Hannity couldn't put a positive spin on it.

Amazing.

 

[urbanhack]

It's almost like black people couldn't even get a regular job or choose to live in a nice neighborhood back in the 40s, 50s and 60s. Pretty horrible they just chose to live under the government's thumb.

 

[Arsenal of Doom]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Actually he was comparing living under the government's thumb versus living under slavery (inelegantly, to be sure). Not the current state of all black people. Also that video is conveniently edited - you should try watching the entire 3+ minutes. I know you really want him to be a horrible racist but he's just not.

I have watched the entire 3+minutes, plus what he has said subsequently - he is a horrible racist and even Sean Hannity couldn't put a positive spin on it.

Amazing.

He did have this clarifying follow-up in the wake of his original comments:

"Maybe I sinned, maybe I need to ask forgiveness, and maybe I don't know what I actually said," Bundy said. "But when you talk about prejudice, we're talking about not being able to exercise what we think and our feelings — we don’t have freedom to say what we want. If I say 'Negro' or 'black boy' or 'slave' — I’m not — if those people cannot take those kinda words and not be offensive, then Martin Luther King hasn’t got his job done yet."

Apparently if "those people" would just have thicker skin, they would get the meaning of what he was trying to say and not be distracted by his overt racism. So you can see how it's really not his fault.

 

[Sweet J]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Sure he was. That fact isn't uncomfortable to me. I don't know about Rove. I don't have any investment in this guy, I think what he is doing is wrong.

I did watch the video.

It sounds like your line for determining whether someone is racist is a person's lack of understanding of a slave's experience in 19th century America (and comparing that person's understanding of the slave's experience to his understanding of the black welfare experience in 21st century America). Sounds like if a person makes such as comparison, you are comfortable calling him a racist. I guess I'm not there. I'm ok with that.

From my (very limited) understanding of this matter, this guy is a jackass, a scofflaw, and wants to take what isn't his and not pay for it. He sounds like a jerk too. I'd love nothing more than to see a bunch of Burning Man hippies set up shop on the federal property next to him without paying for it and see how he likes it.

There are a lot of things about this situation that frustrates me and makes me think that this guy sucks. This stupid video of him saying some uneducated and ignorant things doesn't really affect my indignant meter, however.

 

[TheIronSheik]

"Maybe I sinned, maybe I need to ask forgiveness, and maybe I don't know what I actually said," Bundy said. "But when you talk about prejudice, we're talking about not being able to exercise what we think and our feelings — we don’t have freedom to say what we want. If I say 'Negro' or 'black boy' or 'slave' — I’m not — if those people cannot take those kinda words and not be offensive, then Martin Luther King hasn’t got his job done yet."

Apparently if "those people" would just have thicker skin, they would get the meaning of what he trying to say and not be distracted by his overt racism. So you can see how it's really not his fault.

Yeah. If MLK wasn't so lazy and just got back to work, we could have this job done within the month.

 

[Captain Quinoa]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Actually he was comparing living under the government's thumb versus living under slavery (inelegantly, to be sure). Not the current state of all black people. Also that video is conveniently edited - you should try watching the entire 3+ minutes. I know you really want him to be a horrible racist but he's just not.

I have watched the entire 3+minutes, plus what he has said subsequently - he is a horrible racist and even Sean Hannity couldn't put a positive spin on it.

ok

 

[Captain Quinoa]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Sure he was. That fact isn't uncomfortable to me. I don't know about Rove. I don't have any investment in this guy, I think what he is doing is wrong. I work with the very folks who are going after him, and just had a conversation in the hallway a couple of days ago with them about what they are going to do with him. But I digress.

I did watch the video.

It sounds like your line for determining whether someone is racist is a person's lack of understanding of a slave's experience in 19th century America (and comparing that person's understanding of the slave's experience to his understanding of the black welfare experience in 21st century America). Sounds like if a person makes such as comparison, you are comfortable calling him a racist. I guess I'm not there. I'm ok with that.

From my (very limited) understanding of this matter, this guy is a jackass, a scofflaw, and wants to take what isn't his and not pay for it. He sounds like a jerk too. I'd love nothing more than to see a bunch of Burning Man hippies set up shop on the federal property next to him without paying for it and see how he likes it.

There are a lot of things about this situation that frustrates me and makes me think that this guy sucks. This stupid video of him saying some uneducated and ignorant things doesn't really affect my indignant meter, however.

DASSSS RACISSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Sinn Fein]

So, just to recap, the racist welfare queen, who has been leeching off the US gov't for years, is #####ing about other welfare queens?

 

[Sweet J]

So, just to recap, the racist welfare queen, who has been leeching off the US gov't for years, is #####ing about other welfare queens?

Again, just to be fair here: In the video he isn't saying that the other (black) welfare queens are morally wrong (or bad people, or whatever) for taking money from the government. He is saying that the government giving them money has made their lives worse (something about the welfare money effectively being chains that are worse than the chains of slavery; I don't quite understand it).

 

[squistion]

Henry Decker ‏@HenryADecker 19h

Lots of #ClivenBundy fans look really dumb today -- but my favorite is Alan Keyes, who compared him to Rosa Parks http://www.wnd.com/2014/04/at-the-bundy-ranch-a-rosa-parks-moment/ …

 

[Jackstraw]

Bundy just reiterated mainstream conservative thinking in a little less elegant manner. How much difference is there between what Bundy said and what Paul Ryan said? Not much. Do we all have to pretend this isn't how conservatives really feel? Own that ####. It's ok. Just spit it out already.

”We have got this tailspin of culture, in our inner cities in particular, of men not working and just generations of men not even thinking about working or learning the value and the culture of work, and so there is a real culture problem here that has to be dealt with…you need to get involved, you need to get involved yourself, whether through a good mentor program or some religious charity, whatever it is to make a difference. And that’s how we resuscitate our culture.”

 

[squistion]

Bundy just reiterated mainstream conservative thinking in a little less elegant manner. How much difference is there between what Bundy said and what Paul Ryan said? Not much. Do we all have to pretend this isn't how conservatives really feel? Own that ####. It's ok. Just spit it out already.

”We have got this tailspin of culture, in our inner cities in particular, of men not working and just generations of men not even thinking about working or learning the value and the culture of work, and so there is a real culture problem here that has to be dealt with…you need to get involved, you need to get involved yourself, whether through a good mentor program or some religious charity, whatever it is to make a difference. And that’s how we resuscitate our culture.”

Um, I think the part about slavery does make it different.

 

[Buckfast 1]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Actually he was comparing living under the government's thumb versus living under slavery (inelegantly, to be sure). Not the current state of all black people. Also that video is conveniently edited - you should try watching the entire 3+ minutes. I know you really want him to be a horrible racist but he's just not.

You're going with the racist comments were taken out of context approach, huh?

 

[Todd Andrews]

KooKpocalypse!!

 

[Sinn Fein]

So, just to recap, the racist welfare queen, who has been leeching off the US gov't for years, is #####ing about other welfare queens?

Again, just to be fair here: In the video he isn't saying that the other (black) welfare queens are morally wrong (or bad people, or whatever) for taking money from the government. He is saying that the government giving them money has made their lives worse (something about the welfare money effectively being chains that are worse than the chains of slavery; I don't quite understand it).

I actually understand his point, and if people took off the racist blinders, it would be an interesting discussion. But it is far too nuanced for him to carry out in sound bites.

 

[Captain Quinoa]

Cliven Bundy was comparing the current state of black people with their state under slavery.

Rove! was trying to move the discussion away from that uncomfortable fact. It looks like you are, too. I could be wrong, though. Did you watch the video of Bundy saying what he said? Did he seem like someone asking a philosophical question? To me he looked and sounded exactly like a thoughtless racist old guy.

With a bunch of militia supporting him.

Actually he was comparing living under the government's thumb versus living under slavery (inelegantly, to be sure). Not the current state of all black people. Also that video is conveniently edited - you should try watching the entire 3+ minutes. I know you really want him to be a horrible racist but he's just not.

You're going with the racist comments were taken out of context approach, huh?

I know right!

 

[Lutherman2112]

It is no coincidence that Bundy's pocket constitution was published by the National Center for Constitutional Studies. Cleon Skousen founded the Freeman Institute in 1971, and eventually became the NCCS.

Skousen's views:

Skousen disregarded all federal regulatory agencies and argued for the abolition of everything from the Occupational Safety and Health Administration to the Environmental Protection Agency. He also wanted to repeal the minimum wage, eliminate unions, nullify anti-discrimination laws, sell off public lands and national parks, end the direct election of senators, eliminate the income tax and the estate tax, remove the walls separating church and state, and end the Federal Reserve System.

Skousen spoke against communism throughout his career. He stood fast with John Birch Society co-founder Robert W. Welch Jr.'s contention that President Dwight D. Eisenhower was a communist agent. He did not believe the U.S. should establish diplomatic relations with the People's Republic of China, claiming that the U.S. State Department was engaging in treason with respect to Secretary of State Henry Kissinger's visit to "his old friend Mao Tse-tung." In the 1970s, he spoke to a Latter-Day Saint group aboard a cruise ship returning from Israel, stating that the previous 10 U.S. national elections had been illegitimate because voters had not truly had a choice. He also referred to what he argued was the betrayal of Chiang Kai-shek.

Skousen spoke of billionaire banker David Rockefeller as being one of the most powerful men in the world. Skousen criticized Rockefeller for praising Mao Zedong in a 1973 New York Times article, in which he stated that the communist leader was one of the greatest leaders of the 20th century. Later Skousen claimed that the Rockefellers and Wall Street had conspired to elect Jimmy Carter president. Skousen was also known as a strong supporter of law and order and believed that local police departments were being undermined in order to promote a national police state.

 

[Jackstraw]

"Black people can't or won't take care of themselves and all the secret welfare they get just encourages them to be even more lazy than they'd otherwise be."

That's the belief I'm talking about and it is common. This isn't fringe thinking. It has to be related in code words and dog whistles (FOOD STAMP PRESIDENT) but its there.

Doesn't have a thing to do with racism, redlining neighborhoods, crappy inner city schools, drug war/profiling, inequal treatment by the justice system, lack of jobs, generations of poverty, wage theft etc etc. Not one social or institutianal barrier exists.

If the blacks would just get off their asses then they would have everything everyone else did. IN FACT they actually have it easier than us hard working white folks because of hiring quotas, scholarships etc. But they are inherently inferior so we have to foot the bill for them. Aren't they bad and aren't we awesome.

 

[squistion]

A Day in the Life of The Negro (according to Cliven bundy)

Just this morning while I was sitting on the government house porch, my son came and sat down next to me. Since we both had nothing to do, a long tense silence passed between us. I knew he had something to say so I patiently waited for him to speak his mind. You have a lot of time to do that when you have nothing to do but sit on a government house porch. After a while, he finally spoke;

"I know I survived the abortion and everything and I'm lucky to be alive but can you not put me in jail this summer? I'd rather just pick some cotton for free for white people if it's alright."

I must have looked confused because he continued;

"Look, mother, I don't know how black mothers got the power to control the justice system and put their sons in jail but this has to stop! All I want is backbreaking labor to do and I want to do it for free! Why can't you understand?"

I shook my head and turned to him;

"We already talked about this. You're not picking cotton. You're going to jail and I don't wanna hear another word about it. Your cousin Leo is expecting you."

My son dropped his shoulders and sulked.

"Never have nothing to do but be put in jail by my own mother and sit on a porch..." he mumbled.

Before I had a chance to answer, my do-nothing daughter walked out of the open door and sat with us. I knew what she was on before she even started.

"Look, young girl, I already told you, I don't have nothing for you to do. Stop bugging me and sit on this porch!"

I try not to look at her too much because it freaks me out. She's actually a ghost because she was aborted. She doesn't even exist. Why should it matter that she has nothing to do? Crazy kids.

I turned my thoughts back to my government subsidy check. Where's that damn mailman? He's always late. I won't be able to send my son to jail on time or pay for my next abortion. #######it.

There has to be a better way...

 

[Captain Quinoa]

DOG WHISTLE!!!!!!!!!

 

[Sweet J]

"Black people can't or won't take care of themselves and all the secret welfare they get just encourages them to be even more lazy than they'd otherwise be."

That's the belief I'm talking about and it is common. This isn't fringe thinking. It has to be related in code words and dog whistles (FOOD STAMP PRESIDENT) but its there.

Doesn't have a thing to do with racism, redlining neighborhoods, crappy inner city schools, drug war/profiling, inequal treatment by the justice system, lack of jobs, generations of poverty, wage theft etc etc. Not one social or institutianal barrier exists.

If the blacks would just get off their asses then they would have everything everyone else did. IN FACT they actually have it easier than us hard working white folks because of hiring quotas, scholarships etc. But they are inherently inferior so we have to foot the bill for them. Aren't they bad and aren't we awesome.

I really hate to harp on this issue, particularly with posters I like and generally agree with, but: I think this type of argument/attack doesn't help a dialogue with respect to real welfare reform, because any time someone mentions "hey, I'm not sure welfare (as it currently is used), is good for society" then there is the chance that they will get shouted down by folks as racist.

 

[B-Deep]

listen

this is a vocabulary issue

what he really meant when he said negroes may have been better off as slaves was that white people were better off when negores were slaves

no wait, that doesn't make it any better

I cannot think of a way to make that statement better. Hell Hitler probably thinks that statement was over the line

 

[Ditka Butkus]

To think conservative politicians were in this guys corner......

 

[Premier]

If I say 'Negro' or 'black boy' or 'slave' Im not if those people cannot take those kinda words and not be offensive, then Martin Luther King hasnt got his job done yet."

democrats are paying this guy to keep talking, right?

 

[Jackstraw]

"Black people can't or won't take care of themselves and all the secret welfare they get just encourages them to be even more lazy than they'd otherwise be."

That's the belief I'm talking about and it is common. This isn't fringe thinking. It has to be related in code words and dog whistles (FOOD STAMP PRESIDENT) but its there.

Doesn't have a thing to do with racism, redlining neighborhoods, crappy inner city schools, drug war/profiling, inequal treatment by the justice system, lack of jobs, generations of poverty, wage theft etc etc. Not one social or institutianal barrier exists.

If the blacks would just get off their asses then they would have everything everyone else did. IN FACT they actually have it easier than us hard working white folks because of hiring quotas, scholarships etc. But they are inherently inferior so we have to foot the bill for them. Aren't they bad and aren't we awesome.

I really hate to harp on this issue, particularly with posters I like and generally agree with, but: I think this type of argument/attack doesn't help a dialogue with respect to real welfare reform, because any time someone mentions "hey, I'm not sure welfare (as it currently is used), is good for society" then there is the chance that they will get shouted down by folks as racist.

If welfare reform is within the top half dozen priorities for this country considering the way we are getting gangstered by corporations we really have some problems. Seems like kicking the poors is a recreational activity here in Kansas.

But if you interpret anything in this thread as some kind of goodwill examination of welfare programs then go for it. I see nothing in the current debate on welfare or entitlements that doesn't indicate a desire to strip them bare.

 

[Rove!]

A Day in the Life of The Negro (according to Cliven bundy)

Just this morning while I was sitting on the government house porch, my son came and sat down next to me. Since we both had nothing to do, a long tense silence passed between us. I knew he had something to say so I patiently waited for him to speak his mind. You have a lot of time to do that when you have nothing to do but sit on a government house porch. After a while, he finally spoke;

"I know I survived the abortion and everything and I'm lucky to be alive but can you not put me in jail this summer? I'd rather just pick some cotton for free for white people if it's alright."

I must have looked confused because he continued;

"Look, mother, I don't know how black mothers got the power to control the justice system and put their sons in jail but this has to stop! All I want is backbreaking labor to do and I want to do it for free! Why can't you understand?"

I shook my head and turned to him;

"We already talked about this. You're not picking cotton. You're going to jail and I don't wanna hear another word about it. Your cousin Leo is expecting you."

My son dropped his shoulders and sulked.

"Never have nothing to do but be put in jail by my own mother and sit on a porch..." he mumbled.

Before I had a chance to answer, my do-nothing daughter walked out of the open door and sat with us. I knew what she was on before she even started.

"Look, young girl, I already told you, I don't have nothing for you to do. Stop bugging me and sit on this porch!"

I try not to look at her too much because it freaks me out. She's actually a ghost because she was aborted. She doesn't even exist. Why should it matter that she has nothing to do? Crazy kids.

I turned my thoughts back to my government subsidy check. Where's that damn mailman? He's always late. I won't be able to send my son to jail on time or pay for my next abortion. #######it.

There has to be a better way...

 

[The General]

It's great that Bundy has brought us a thoughtful conversation on the state of welfare. I wouldn't really give him any credit but people dug it out of the story that he is at the center of so whatever. No sarcasm, some great stuff in the posts above. I would expect this angle to become the focus of right leaning folks who have been supporting the ideas behind this Bundy fiasco - much better than the Harry Reid BS. There is at least some meat to this discussion.

Far to complex, nuanced to be discussed well in a forum IMO but there are some posters in FFA on both sides politically who always impress me with how well and quickly they express things.

The core of this story though is an ingrate surrounded by a bunch of armed lunatics not wanting to pay taxes.

 

[Fennis]

Some random racist: I hate America and think the blacks are only good at getting welfare

FFA Poster: I think this is a good time to have a reasonable discussion on welfare reform, why are people all worked up when I try to have that discussion?

 

[fatness]

I thought about what Reverend Martin Luther King said. I thought about Rosa Park taking her seat at the front of the bus. Reverend Martin Luther King did not want her to take her seat in the front of the bus. That wasn't what he was talking about. He did not say go to the front of the bus and that's where your seat was. What Reverend King wanted was that she could sit anywhere in the bus and nobody would say anything about it. You and I can sit anywhere in the bus. That's what he wanted. That's what I want. I want her to be able to sit anywhere in the bus and I want to be able to sit by her any where in that bus. That's what he wanted. He didn't want this prejudice thing like the media tried to put on me yesterday. I'm not going to put up with that because that's not what he wanted. that's not what I want. I want to set by her anywhere on that bus and I want anybody to be able to do the same thing. That's what he was after, it's not a prejudice thing, but make us equal.

http://www.thewire.com/politics/2014/04/watch-cliven-bundy-explains-why-martin-luther-king-jr-would-be-on-his-side/361216/#disqus_thread

If I call — if I say 'negro' or 'black boy' or 'slave,' I'm — If those people cannot take those kind of words and not be offensive, then Martin Luther King hasn't got his job done yet.

Today, from Cliven Bundy. This is priceless.

 

[fatness]

I hope this guy gives a press conference every day.

Please let this happen.

 

[fatness]

Today's video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=3T-JWhGDIsw

 

[Chaka]

What was it Jon Stewart said? Something like, If you don't recognize the federal government then you should probably make your own flag.