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Those two little words sum up that crash and burn experience too well. I got chills.Bravo for looking at the lessons learned instead of playing the 'poor me' card. You obviously have the talent. It's just a matter of deciding if you want to take it to the next level or not.
And hey - you still kicked my ### by 13 minutes. 
. Since then I have drank almost 120 ounces and thankfully it is back to almost clear.
This is an easy one. You're dehydrated after your run, so your urine is some weird/dark/dramatic/unusual shade of yellow. If you're "soaked from hat to shoes," I doubt it's realistically possible to consume enough fluids to not have ####ed-up urine, unless you're a hard core endurance athlete and you're running Badwater and you have a member of your support team who inspects your urine every few miles.Seriously, drinking during a run is good, but it takes a little while for water to get assimilated into the body. I've had runs where my urine afterwards was basically brown and practically gelatinous despite taking regular fluids. High temps and humidity do that to a person.I have been doing a little research on urine color today. I was curious as mine was bright yellow about an hour after my run this morning, and didn't understand why since the last few weeks I rarely drink anything but water, and a lot of that. When I switched I bought two of these, and I drink at least both every day.
Anyway, bright yellow urine can be caused by two much Vitamin C or betacarotene,, also dehydration. This morning, I ran 6 including walking mile 5, it was 74 degrees with humidity at 94%, when I got home I was soaked from hat to shoes. I drank about 30 ounces before my run today, and the other half within the hour, I did not drink anything during the run though I had 20 ounces of water with me. When I went it was almost fluorescent
You guys probably all know this, but to be honest I have never really considered it. I think if I drank more during the runs I would get through them easier, especially with the temps and humidity going up. A weird thing about Florida is it is hotter, 86-95, in the afternoon but the humidity is usually about 40-50%. In the morning the temps are relatively low, 65-75, yet the humidity is usually 90-100%. These approximations are my biggest fear for marathon training.
Prosopis, I know it gets hotter there, and i feel for you. Just bless your dry heat.
Love my fuel belt for this reason, though it is only 48 ounces. I know some of the running groups will stash water jugs all over town for their long runs and I've seen people who clearly have others bring them water during the run. I'm always amazed when I see people out running long distances with no water.
Yup, pretty sure we all know how that one goes. It makes for a tough race; at least Ivan was able to finish it.
IK - good points here ...and congrats on giving a good effort. Big picture, you DID just complete another marathon, and that's no small feat.I absolutely agree about the mileage. I had four weeks in excess of 60 miles in my training, did a lot of focused hill work, and in addition to a 20 miler I had two @ 21 and two @ 22 - all aspects easily exceeding my previous three marathon training cycles. That extra work clearly made me stronger (which was most evident to me, oddly enough, in a solid 5K race a week before Boston). Pushing into the sub-4:00 range calls for some strong training because the heart needs to be pumping efficiently and the legs need to be strong. So as you note, you learned something valuable. And, you now get to relax and drink beer.
--Darrin, I find that after long/tough runs, the thirst is still there even a couple of hours later. So beyond taking in some fluids after you finish, keep focused on continual hydration for a while after that. Beyond water, you might also consider drinks like Muscle Milk, Accelerade, or the new G3 from Gatorade (much like Muscle Milk). That gets you protein/vitamins in addition to the basic fluids.
Great report and you had meRace Report (Fargo Marathon, 5/21/11) -- Long and self-indulgent.
Cliffs notes: Went out too fast and crashed and burned. You guys could just about write up the rest of the report for me, because this is a pretty standard entry in the genre.
The weather forecast the night before the event was for heavy rain and thunderstorms along with winds. When I went to bed, I fully expected to fall back to my "B" goal of sub-4:00, which I did at Twin Cities last October. However, the actual weather on race day was way beter than advertised. No rain at all, overcast, low-60s, and while it was still pretty windy, the wind was out of the SE on a course that tends S for the first half and N for the second, so at least it would be a tailwind during the back half. I had been training with 3:50 as a time goal, which would be almost a 9 minute PR for me. I didn't feel like I was under any special pressure though, and I would have been cool with going out slower and repeating my TCM time. But then it occured to me that if this race wasn't that big a deal, then why not go out for 3:50 and if I fall apart at the end, hey this wasn't that big a deal right? Being unable to find any holes in this obviously impeccable logic, I lined up near then 3:50 pacer and away we went.
On a side note, this is kind of a funny event in the sense that the entire city of Fargo is pretty much preoccupied with it. This is their Boston, their Indianapolis 500, their Wimbeldon. I watched the local news the night before, and I think every story was somehow marathon-related. If you don't know the culture of the upper midwest, it's hard to describe just how earnest they are about this kind of stuff. It's really sweet.
Anyway, you guys know how this goes. The first several miles were stupid easy. To be honest, I started to notice things getting a little harder than I would have liked around the 10K mark, but I decided to give it a few more miles. Around Mile 9 or 10, it was clear that there was no way I was going to be able to hold this pace when the race got serious later on. You guys all know what I mean. If this was a 10-13 mile training run, holding an 8:47 pace would have been a good workout but no serious problem. But when I was running 9:09s in Twin Cities, it was still stupid easy at the halfway point, but became quite difficult during the last 10K. By Mile 10, 8:47 was doable but no longer "OMG I can go forever" easy, so I dialed it back to 4:00 pace.
Too late. I crossed the halfway mark at 1:56 and change, and I that point I was still sort of expecting to PR, but by Mile 16 I was having a tough time running 9:09, and the wheels finally came off at Mile 18 when I had to start mixing in some walking. The rest of the race was a bunch of miles in the 12-13 minute "deathmarch" category.
A few highlights of the deathmarch: The 4:00 group passed me during Mile 19, at which point I more or less checked out psychologically. I'm not going to voluntarily take a DNF obviously, but if this was R&R Vegas and the sweep bus was right behind the 4:00 pacer, I wouldn't have minded too much. Around Mile 20 I got passed by a slow chick who works in my building. Her son and my son are in the same grade and play on the same basketball team. Her husband and son had been along the course in several spots already cheering her on. She tapped me on the shoulder and said hi when she passed, which was a 100% friendly gesture. This is one of the nicest families you'll ever meet and I hope she met whatever time goal she was shooting for. (The website is down right now, so no results).
Around the 23.5 mile mark -- the details are a little fuzzy at this point -- I got passed by the 4:30 pace group. Okay, I said I had already mentally checked out of the race, but come on. A man has to have some standards. I passed them back pretty handily and death-shuffled the last couple of miles instead of walking, except for a late aid station. I thought I had a nice sized buffer for 4:30, but when I got to the 26 mile marker, I looked at my Garmin and saw that I only had a little over 90 seconds to spare if I wanted my time to read 4:29x. Not a huge deal since my time was really "Crash and Burn" anyway, but I dropped the hammer at the end (hammer? lol) and came in at 4:29:58 Garmin time. The 4:30 pacer must have missed his quota, because they were not within sight when I finished, and yes I know they didn't pass me back because I was keeping an eye out for them.
So. What to make of this? First of all, I am not the slightest bit disappointed or sad. I knew that 3:50 was an aggressive goal for me. It wasn't stupid like "Hey, lets knock 45 minutes of your PR and get a BQ" but it was on the aggressive side of what was reasonable. I don't feel foolish for trying and failing.
What it really came down to is the fact that I trained with a 3:50 goal in mind. If I'm not going to go for it when I get B+ conditions, the why the hell did I pick that goal? When I lined up, I was uncertain as to whether I could do this, but I really wanted to know: Given the genes my parents gave me and my training regimen, can I run a 3:50 marathon? I got my answer, and that's a valuable outcome.
Prosopis mentiond Pfitzinger's book above. There is a B&N literally right behing my hotel, so yesterday I picked up a copy and read it while sitting around. It is abundantly clear to me that I need more miles. I already suspected this from lurking at the RW forums. My training program had 5 runs of 18+ miles (18/20/20/22/22), but it maxed out at 42 mpw with four days per week throughou. What I learned today is that that just isn't enough if I want to improve. If I am content to have 4:00 be my top-end time in ideal conditions, then I can keep doing what I'm doing. I was hoping that a second marathon cycle in a 12-month period would improve my fitness enought to knock 10 minutes off my PR, but I try very hard to be honest with myself, and the fact is that my training for Fargo did not go appreciably better than my training for TCM, so race day magic was not enough to give me that improvement. Okay, my training went a little better, but that's because I was doing a bunch of long runs in February and March in cold temperatures as opposed to July and August. Surprise! It's easier to do training runs when you're bundled up for a 10-degree day than when it's 80 and humid. I'm not going to make any plans right now, but I could see 18/55 in my future, provided I spend some time building my base in preparation.
In other words, the race itself was a huge fail, but I learned something valuable, gained good race experience, and I'm happy that I erred on the side of aggression instead of being more conservative.
Now all that's left to do is to drink the beer I bought yesterday and deposited in my hotel fridge. Before any of you #######s chime in, yes I know alcohol slows recovery. But it does wonders for one's attitude. That counts, right?
Also, I should add here that the FFA is awesome in general, but this thread in particular is a great place for thinking out loud / venting about this kind of stuff. Just typing all of this up was a useful way to gather my thoughts. Thanks guys.
You did finish another marathon !!! I dont know that I like that advanced marathon book but one thing did strike me which you seemed to allude to. A lot of marathon success is genetic. According to Pfitz we are born with our max HR and lactate threshold fixed. There is no improving that. I find that some what comforting. I am pretty sure there is no sub 4 marathon in my genetic make up. Doesn't mean I wont keep trying but when I dont get it I wont feel so bad.
Yep. 18/55 is an 18 week training program with a peak of 55 mpw.______Thanks so much for the feedback and encouragement, guys. I appreciate it.
Thanks
Great job of turning a negative into a positive, Ivan.'IvanKaramazov said:
Also, count me as another person who thinks you're dead-on about the mileage. Like I said the other day, I still think Pfitz was instrumental in me taking it to the next level as a marathoner. I'm glad to see so many of you guys drinking the Kool-Aid.
I'm visiting my sister in Minneapolis, so I don't have my book with me, but I don't ever remember reading that, nor do I believe it's true. Otherwise, why would he have you do tempo runs or other workouts specifically designed to improve your LT??Are you sure???'prosopis said:
I own both a Fuel Belt and a Amphipod handheld that holds about 20 ounces. I use both of them, but I really prefer the latter.On my longer runs, I'll often just do series of 7- or 8-mile loops starting from my house. I put a cooler in the garage with a few bottles of Gatorade, and that way I can circle back every hour or so and refill my handheld. Works pretty slick.'FBG26 said:
Dunno. That said, I have old tri-friends who are crazy fit but still hit their ceilings time-wise.
Man you sure do pole on the miles, man. That's outstanding stuff especially with your recent stretch of races.
Great write up Ivan. Big props for going for your goal. Each to their own, but I could never run the same race over and over shooting for the same result.Some of your further thoughts are giving me serious doubts about my 11/35 plan.'IvanKaramazov said:Race Report (Fargo Marathon, 5/21/11) -- Long and self-indulgent.
Cliffs notes: Went out too fast and crashed and burned. You guys could just about write up the rest of the report for me, because this is a pretty standard entry in the genre.
The weather forecast the night before the event was for heavy rain and thunderstorms along with winds. When I went to bed, I fully expected to fall back to my "B" goal of sub-4:00, which I did at Twin Cities last October. However, the actual weather on race day was way beter than advertised. No rain at all, overcast, low-60s, and while it was still pretty windy, the wind was out of the SE on a course that tends S for the first half and N for the second, so at least it would be a tailwind during the back half. I had been training with 3:50 as a time goal, which would be almost a 9 minute PR for me. I didn't feel like I was under any special pressure though, and I would have been cool with going out slower and repeating my TCM time. But then it occured to me that if this race wasn't that big a deal, then why not go out for 3:50 and if I fall apart at the end, hey this wasn't that big a deal right? Being unable to find any holes in this obviously impeccable logic, I lined up near then 3:50 pacer and away we went.
On a side note, this is kind of a funny event in the sense that the entire city of Fargo is pretty much preoccupied with it. This is their Boston, their Indianapolis 500, their Wimbeldon. I watched the local news the night before, and I think every story was somehow marathon-related. If you don't know the culture of the upper midwest, it's hard to describe just how earnest they are about this kind of stuff. It's really sweet.
Anyway, you guys know how this goes. The first several miles were stupid easy. To be honest, I started to notice things getting a little harder than I would have liked around the 10K mark, but I decided to give it a few more miles. Around Mile 9 or 10, it was clear that there was no way I was going to be able to hold this pace when the race got serious later on. You guys all know what I mean. If this was a 10-13 mile training run, holding an 8:47 pace would have been a good workout but no serious problem. But when I was running 9:09s in Twin Cities, it was still stupid easy at the halfway point, but became quite difficult during the last 10K. By Mile 10, 8:47 was doable but no longer "OMG I can go forever" easy, so I dialed it back to 4:00 pace.
Too late. I crossed the halfway mark at 1:56 and change, and I that point I was still sort of expecting to PR, but by Mile 16 I was having a tough time running 9:09, and the wheels finally came off at Mile 18 when I had to start mixing in some walking. The rest of the race was a bunch of miles in the 12-13 minute "deathmarch" category.
A few highlights of the deathmarch: The 4:00 group passed me during Mile 19, at which point I more or less checked out psychologically. I'm not going to voluntarily take a DNF obviously, but if this was R&R Vegas and the sweep bus was right behind the 4:00 pacer, I wouldn't have minded too much. Around Mile 20 I got passed by a slow chick who works in my building. Her son and my son are in the same grade and play on the same basketball team. Her husband and son had been along the course in several spots already cheering her on. She tapped me on the shoulder and said hi when she passed, which was a 100% friendly gesture. This is one of the nicest families you'll ever meet and I hope she met whatever time goal she was shooting for. (The website is down right now, so no results).
Around the 23.5 mile mark -- the details are a little fuzzy at this point -- I got passed by the 4:30 pace group. Okay, I said I had already mentally checked out of the race, but come on. A man has to have some standards. I passed them back pretty handily and death-shuffled the last couple of miles instead of walking, except for a late aid station. I thought I had a nice sized buffer for 4:30, but when I got to the 26 mile marker, I looked at my Garmin and saw that I only had a little over 90 seconds to spare if I wanted my time to read 4:29
So. What to make of this? First of all, I am not the slightest bit disappointed or sad. I knew that 3:50 was an aggressive goal for me. It wasn't stupid like "Hey, lets knock 45 minutes of your PR and get a BQ" but it was on the aggressive side of what was reasonable. I don't feel foolish for trying and failing.
What it really came down to is the fact that I trained with a 3:50 goal in mind. If I'm not going to go for it when I get B+ conditions, the why the hell did I pick that goal? When I lined up, I was uncertain as to whether I could do this, but I really wanted to know: Given the genes my parents gave me and my training regimen, can I run a 3:50 marathon? I got my answer, and that's a valuable outcome.
Prosopis mentiond Pfitzinger's book above. There is a B&N literally right behing my hotel, so yesterday I picked up a copy and read it while sitting around. It is abundantly clear to me that I need more miles. I already suspected this from lurking at the RW forums. My training program had 5 runs of 18+ miles (18/20/20/22/22), but it maxed out at 42 mpw with four days per week throughou. What I learned today is that that just isn't enough if I want to improve. If I am content to have 4:00 be my top-end time in ideal conditions, then I can keep doing what I'm doing. I was hoping that a second marathon cycle in a 12-month period would improve my fitness enought to knock 10 minutes off my PR, but I try very hard to be honest with myself, and the fact is that my training for Fargo did not go appreciably better than my training for TCM, so race day magic was not enough to give me that improvement. Okay, my training went a little better, but that's because I was doing a bunch of long runs in February and March in cold temperatures as opposed to July and August. Surprise! It's easier to do training runs when you're bundled up for a 10-degree day than when it's 80 and humid. I'm not going to make any plans right now, but I could see 18/55 in my future, provided I spend some time building my base in preparation.
In other words, the race itself was a huge fail, but I learned something valuable, gained good race experience, and I'm happy that I erred on the side of aggression instead of being more conservative.
Now all that's left to do is to drink the beer I bought yesterday and deposited in my hotel fridge. Before any of you #######s chime in, yes I know alcohol slows recovery. But it does wonders for one's attitude. That counts, right?
Also, I should add here that the FFA is awesome in general, but this thread in particular is a great place for thinking out loud / venting about this kind of stuff. Just typing all of this up was a useful way to gather my thoughts. Thanks guys.
I have the paper back version. On page 19 in Elements of training he says "Your maximal heart rate is determined genetically."page 21 he does talk about improving your lactate threshold so I am probably wrong there.
What kind/brand of fuel belt do you use?
bnb- fwiw, my tri-coaches didn't put that much running mileage on our legs per week in IM training. IIRC, the longest run I had in all my training was 2:30, which wasn't even 20m. Also, we'd only do 2x runs per week, probably about 30m max per week. But also a 100-200 miles on the bike per week. I think you'll be *ok* if you're getting good biking in (which I assume you are).Great write up Ivan. Big props for going for your goal. Each to their own, but I could never run the same race over and over shooting for the same result.Some of your further thoughts are giving me serious doubts about my 11/35 plan.'IvanKaramazov said:Race Report (Fargo Marathon, 5/21/11) -- Long and self-indulgent.
Cliffs notes: Went out too fast and crashed and burned. You guys could just about write up the rest of the report for me, because this is a pretty standard entry in the genre.
The weather forecast the night before the event was for heavy rain and thunderstorms along with winds. When I went to bed, I fully expected to fall back to my "B" goal of sub-4:00, which I did at Twin Cities last October. However, the actual weather on race day was way beter than advertised. No rain at all, overcast, low-60s, and while it was still pretty windy, the wind was out of the SE on a course that tends S for the first half and N for the second, so at least it would be a tailwind during the back half. I had been training with 3:50 as a time goal, which would be almost a 9 minute PR for me. I didn't feel like I was under any special pressure though, and I would have been cool with going out slower and repeating my TCM time. But then it occured to me that if this race wasn't that big a deal, then why not go out for 3:50 and if I fall apart at the end, hey this wasn't that big a deal right? Being unable to find any holes in this obviously impeccable logic, I lined up near then 3:50 pacer and away we went.
On a side note, this is kind of a funny event in the sense that the entire city of Fargo is pretty much preoccupied with it. This is their Boston, their Indianapolis 500, their Wimbeldon. I watched the local news the night before, and I think every story was somehow marathon-related. If you don't know the culture of the upper midwest, it's hard to describe just how earnest they are about this kind of stuff. It's really sweet.
Anyway, you guys know how this goes. The first several miles were stupid easy. To be honest, I started to notice things getting a little harder than I would have liked around the 10K mark, but I decided to give it a few more miles. Around Mile 9 or 10, it was clear that there was no way I was going to be able to hold this pace when the race got serious later on. You guys all know what I mean. If this was a 10-13 mile training run, holding an 8:47 pace would have been a good workout but no serious problem. But when I was running 9:09s in Twin Cities, it was still stupid easy at the halfway point, but became quite difficult during the last 10K. By Mile 10, 8:47 was doable but no longer "OMG I can go forever" easy, so I dialed it back to 4:00 pace.
Too late. I crossed the halfway mark at 1:56 and change, and I that point I was still sort of expecting to PR, but by Mile 16 I was having a tough time running 9:09, and the wheels finally came off at Mile 18 when I had to start mixing in some walking. The rest of the race was a bunch of miles in the 12-13 minute "deathmarch" category.
A few highlights of the deathmarch: The 4:00 group passed me during Mile 19, at which point I more or less checked out psychologically. I'm not going to voluntarily take a DNF obviously, but if this was R&R Vegas and the sweep bus was right behind the 4:00 pacer, I wouldn't have minded too much. Around Mile 20 I got passed by a slow chick who works in my building. Her son and my son are in the same grade and play on the same basketball team. Her husband and son had been along the course in several spots already cheering her on. She tapped me on the shoulder and said hi when she passed, which was a 100% friendly gesture. This is one of the nicest families you'll ever meet and I hope she met whatever time goal she was shooting for. (The website is down right now, so no results).
Around the 23.5 mile mark -- the details are a little fuzzy at this point -- I got passed by the 4:30 pace group. Okay, I said I had already mentally checked out of the race, but come on. A man has to have some standards. I passed them back pretty handily and death-shuffled the last couple of miles instead of walking, except for a late aid station. I thought I had a nice sized buffer for 4:30, but when I got to the 26 mile marker, I looked at my Garmin and saw that I only had a little over 90 seconds to spare if I wanted my time to read 4:29
So. What to make of this? First of all, I am not the slightest bit disappointed or sad. I knew that 3:50 was an aggressive goal for me. It wasn't stupid like "Hey, lets knock 45 minutes of your PR and get a BQ" but it was on the aggressive side of what was reasonable. I don't feel foolish for trying and failing.
What it really came down to is the fact that I trained with a 3:50 goal in mind. If I'm not going to go for it when I get B+ conditions, the why the hell did I pick that goal? When I lined up, I was uncertain as to whether I could do this, but I really wanted to know: Given the genes my parents gave me and my training regimen, can I run a 3:50 marathon? I got my answer, and that's a valuable outcome.
Prosopis mentiond Pfitzinger's book above. There is a B&N literally right behing my hotel, so yesterday I picked up a copy and read it while sitting around. It is abundantly clear to me that I need more miles. I already suspected this from lurking at the RW forums. My training program had 5 runs of 18+ miles (18/20/20/22/22), but it maxed out at 42 mpw with four days per week throughou. What I learned today is that that just isn't enough if I want to improve. If I am content to have 4:00 be my top-end time in ideal conditions, then I can keep doing what I'm doing. I was hoping that a second marathon cycle in a 12-month period would improve my fitness enought to knock 10 minutes off my PR, but I try very hard to be honest with myself, and the fact is that my training for Fargo did not go appreciably better than my training for TCM, so race day magic was not enough to give me that improvement. Okay, my training went a little better, but that's because I was doing a bunch of long runs in February and March in cold temperatures as opposed to July and August. Surprise! It's easier to do training runs when you're bundled up for a 10-degree day than when it's 80 and humid. I'm not going to make any plans right now, but I could see 18/55 in my future, provided I spend some time building my base in preparation.
In other words, the race itself was a huge fail, but I learned something valuable, gained good race experience, and I'm happy that I erred on the side of aggression instead of being more conservative.
Now all that's left to do is to drink the beer I bought yesterday and deposited in my hotel fridge. Before any of you #######s chime in, yes I know alcohol slows recovery. But it does wonders for one's attitude. That counts, right?
Also, I should add here that the FFA is awesome in general, but this thread in particular is a great place for thinking out loud / venting about this kind of stuff. Just typing all of this up was a useful way to gather my thoughts. Thanks guys.
I've got nothing but doubt. And good wishes. It's a paradox.I'm sure the real runners here will have a better idea for you... I'm thinking it's probably a goal better suited for next year, after you've logged a lot of miles consistently between then and now and built up to running some longer races/training runs at or near that pace. Even one half at that pace doesn't really prove much, IME. But I look forward to hearing from the experts- and also to being proven horribly wrong by you. GL!
What you're basically saying is that within six months, you want to be able to run a marathon at about your current 5K pace. That's not going to happen.I'm not trying to be mean or anything -- just saying that this isn't a realistic goal.
Check out the The McMillan running calculator to get a rough idea of what you could potentially run. I think this calculator is on the aggressive side, but it's a good start. Also read a few of the last pages here. There's some great commentary about just how much mileage you need to get under your belt to be successful at this game. It's mind boggling. At least to me.
Agreed, did nearly the same thing, except maybe 3-4 runs per week but typ. max run week was 30-35 miles but big bike miles with usually a 5-6 hr bike which goes a long way to HUGE aerobic base. However, I plan on a more traditional run plan for my next marathon this fall though as I don't have a big bike base to fall back on this time and don't have time to do that long stuff so frequent anymore.
Another podium for Sand!!!Did you see any critters with teeth...other than the Auburn chicks.BnB - those are absolutely studly power numbers, iBike or not. ;-)
Ivan - congrats on finishing another one. Inspiration for those of us too chicken to even take one on.
----
Race Report:
7am, Pensacola. The Bay Bridge stretched out for 3.3 miles awaiting us fools to swim the length. I did meet one tri-friend there and we chatted during the pre-race nerves. It started a bit late since they put timing chips on us (still not sure why). Anyway, the water was 76 degrees and quite nice. Much saltier than last year, but cooler, as well. Only one yahoo decided to wear a wetsuit.
Anyway, we jumped in and were off. I ended up behind a group of three girls/women. They got in a bit before the start and I ushered them to get in front of me - they were college age and had their team swimsuits on. Auburn. Oh yeah - like that's fair. I wanted to ask how many Olympic medals they had between them. As it turned out I passed two of them along the way. Saw the other one until about 2.5k and she pulled away.
Ended up being a pretty lonely race. After the initial crush I passed one guy and one of the girls at 1k and the second girl at 4k or so. Never saw anyone else. I was definitely moving better than last year, though I was having some physical issues. I pulled a small muscle in my left shoulder at some point and was getting a side stitch in the other. I managed to ignore those and plod on. The last 1.5k or so got really hard for some reason - I was trying to avoid sighting as it seemed I was really slowing every time I looked up. The looking up was also tightening my legs and giving my abs fits. I felt like an 80 year old at this point.
About 1k to go I start to get my (now typical) calf cramp issues - my left was itching to cramp and I kept it as loose as I could. Pretty successfully until the last little bit.
I rounded the dock and headed for home (last 250y or so) and made my one big mistake of the race. Once the water was about waist deep I decided to dolphin dive the rest of the way (it is typically faster than swimming). The instant I pushed off both calves lock up solid. I came to a dead stop in pretty excruciating pain. There really wasn't anything I could do about it, so I just put my head down and sprinted the rest of the way in. When I ran out of water, I crawled up the beach and over the line.
#######' embarrassing. But I did finish 6 seconds ahead of the butthead who wore the wetsuit. My kid has some great pictures of me in pain crawling across the line. I need to figure out how to tactfully delete those - he's proud of them.
Final time: 1:29:32 1 minute slower than last year. Huh - that initially sucked until I saw that all the top times were about ten minutes slower than last year. Winner last two years was 1:05 and 1:08. This year was 1:20. So maybe not so bad. People talked about currents, but I never feel those. Makes sense, though. So this year I was 9 minutes behind the winner - last year was 20.
1/13 in AG. 11th Overall out of 135 or so.
Here is the race trace. Ignore the mileage and elevation - the GPS bounces around in the water.
WarriorI don't know a lick about swimming, but it's pretty telling of the ### kicking you served up if you still won with crawling over the finish.
Butthead
I agree, super aggressive, but that is my personality.Let's entertain it for a moment...which program would be favored for training?
Don't want to rain on your parade but I think you are being unrealistic and asking for an injury. I did a 1:39 half marathon (it was a good day for me and probably couldn't have gone much faster). I did my first marathon about 4 months later and did it in 3:39. Your body's ability to increase mileage and maintain speed at the longer distances is really tough.
I would recommend Higdon Advanced training program but I still think you are asking for trouble. Keep us posted if you go through with this.
I've been running in a similar form to this for 7+ years. It makes sense to me and I haven't had many injuries or anything using this type of running style. It takes some time to transition as your calves will take a beating while you adjust. Try it and if you commit know it will take time. Count foot strikes, think about form, do some "stride" drills, etc.
I'll agree with those that raise the note of caution. But of course, it's your call! I would recommend playing around with some numbers in the McMillan calculator that has already been linked above. That's a very good guide. Two other benchmarks:- half-marathon time doubled, plus 10 minutes- "Yasso" half-mile repeats. If you want a 3:02 marathon, you should be running half-mile repeats at around 3:02 (min:sec).But ...why the 3:02? The Boston qualifying times are five minute increments. And note: with the new Boston standards, merely meeting the qualifier for 2012 doesn't guarantee getting a spot. Those that beat the standard by 20/10/5 minutes get to go first. For 2013, note that the qualifying times drop by six minutes. Enjoy the challenge!
With all due respect, wilked, it's not gonna happen.Just to give you an idea, I just ran a 1:27:01 (of faster) half marathon a couple of weeks ago. I've run 14 marathons, routinely run weekly mileage in the 50s, and peak in the 70s during my training cycles. My PR is 3:06:10, and I'm hoping to go sub-3 this fall.
What do you know- you can't even run a sub-40 10k.
It's the sub-19 5K that I'm waiting for.'El Floppo said:What do you know- you can't even run a sub-40 10k.'gruecd said:
Damn. You'd think a brother could get acknowledgement for what he's done instead of being chided for his shortcomings.Geez.'tri-man 47 said:It's the sub-19 5K that I'm waiting for.What do you know- you can't even run a sub-40 10k.
You always have the Clydesdale division as a fall back boost for your ego...........Damn. You'd think a brother could get acknowledgement for what he's done instead of being chided for his shortcomings.Geez.'tri-man 47 said:It's the sub-19 5K that I'm waiting for.What do you know- you can't even run a sub-40 10k.
You always have the Clydesdale division as a fall back boost for your ego...........Damn. You'd think a brother could get acknowledgement for what he's done instead of being chided for his shortcomings.Geez.'tri-man 47 said:It's the sub-19 5K that I'm waiting for.What do you know- you can't even run a sub-40 10k.
ilingon:
You always have the Clydesdale division as a fall back boost for your ego...........Damn. You'd think a brother could get acknowledgement for what he's done instead of being chided for his shortcomings.Geez.'tri-man 47 said:It's the sub-19 5K that I'm waiting for.What do you know- you can't even run a sub-40 10k.
grue when I grow up I want to be just like you. Back to 60 mpw already is 
You guys take me for granted. You're gonna miss me when I'm gone....You always have the Clydesdale division as a fall back boost for your ego...........Damn. You'd think a brother could get acknowledgement for what he's done instead of being chided for his shortcomings.Geez.'tri-man 47 said:It's the sub-19 5K that I'm waiting for.What do you know- you can't even run a sub-40 10k.
