Ran a 10k in June (7 Viewers)

[Darrinll40]

So basically, I've got some guys telling me it's bad to stretch before a run, and some other guys telling me it's bad to stretch after a run. Can I just assume, then, that you guys think stretching is just a bad thing that should be avoided? If so, can you point me to some basis for this, because I've always understood that stretching is good both before and after a run, if done correctly of course.

I don't stretch before or after. I do warm up a bit by walking and hopping, but that is about it.

 

[culdeus]

oh i'm stretching alright

i think what did me in is that the plan doubled my total run time from Friday last week to Monday this week.

How old are your shoes? What surfaces are you running on?Some shin pain is meant to just be fought through. I don't think it can be chronic if you have more. It's just a matter of how much you can stand.

Also stretching should be done before runs and after bike rides. Stretching after a run won't do anything for you as the muscle is as stretched out as it's gonna get.

I won't speak for biking (although I stretch afterwards for biking too), but that's simply not true for running. Stretching after is to aid in recovery for your next run. I trained for 2 years with tri-coaches who broke me of my Pre-run stretch habit and I was suprised by how effective the post run stretch is.

Horrible idea. Just terrible. Not only does it do nothing for you, but you really increase your chance of muscle problems. And of course it's "effective" the muscles are as stretched out as a thai hooker. In reality for the vast majority of people no stretching is better than any stretching as very few people actually know what the #### they are doing. But with post run stretching all you are doing is getting all the risks associated with stretching and none of the benefit.

And pre-run stretch will just tear muscles that have not been warmed up.

Exactly, but somewhere between 0 and 0 people have the patience to run for 5 minutes, stop, stretch, continue running which is what you should do.

 

[mr. furley]

legs are a bit sore this morning. running 16 minutes with 5 1/2 minutes of walking mixed in.

it goes:

3 min run

90 sec walk

5 min run

2 1/2 min walk

3 min run

90 sec walk

5 min run

those last 5 minutes are rough. the last 3 of it are mental torture right now. BUT the whole process felt a lot easier and i felt better afterwards last nite as compared to Monday nite when my legs were literally numb for 20 minutes after the run.

part of me thinks it'd be easier to just straight run the 16 rather than chop it up with walking. guess i'll find that out next friday when i have to run 20 minutes straight w/o walking.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

guess i'll find that out next friday when i have to run 20 minutes straight w/o walking.

 

[Dash]

Re stretching, my personal experience: in the gym I always warm up between 5-10 minutes and lightly stretch unless I'm doing a "rest" workout where the goal is low and slow with long, easy stretching at the end. On the bike I do a stepped effort warmup and stretch after the workout because stretching before the main effort seems to do nothing for me. Before soccer games I would warmup, strectch a little, and then do standard pre-game drills. I've never found stretching to help reduce the likeliness of injury, but the additional range of motion helps with lower back soreness and making the muscles more supple for massage. So, for me, stretching is done based on the workout activity and goals and with consideration to post-workout recovery methods. Regardless though, it is never done cold or bouncing. Straining the muscles is not a goal, just teaching them to be accustomed to the stretch and felxibility.

Furley: keep sticking to the plan. The fact that you want to go for longer is a good sign -- confidence is building.

Century ride training update: I'm finding myself logging more miles and being less sore in the neck and shoulders. During the first three weeks my shoulder fatigue cut short most rides. Weekly mileages have been 13.5 (one ride), 48, 93, 64 (unforseen circumstances forced me to miss a 24 miler), and so far this week 80 on four rides. I'll be doing ~20-23 more tomorrow morning to hit ~100 for the week. I'm not focusing on speed right now as much as distance and time in the saddle (my longest ride was roughly 2 hours). My legs feel good and refreshed, probably because I'm taking a slow and steady approach. On the 22nd the local club is doing a preview ride for the century I want to complete and I'll definitely be doing the 30 miler and may even try the 62 option if the neck and shoulders are trouble free by them.

 

[wraith5]

oh i'm stretching alright

i think what did me in is that the plan doubled my total run time from Friday last week to Monday this week.

How old are your shoes? What surfaces are you running on?Some shin pain is meant to just be fought through. I don't think it can be chronic if you have more. It's just a matter of how much you can stand.

Also stretching should be done before runs and after bike rides. Stretching after a run won't do anything for you as the muscle is as stretched out as it's gonna get.

I won't speak for biking (although I stretch afterwards for biking too), but that's simply not true for running. Stretching after is to aid in recovery for your next run. I trained for 2 years with tri-coaches who broke me of my Pre-run stretch habit and I was suprised by how effective the post run stretch is.

Horrible idea. Just terrible. Not only does it do nothing for you, but you really increase your chance of muscle problems. And of course it's "effective" the muscles are as stretched out as a thai hooker. In reality for the vast majority of people no stretching is better than any stretching as very few people actually know what the #### they are doing. But with post run stretching all you are doing is getting all the risks associated with stretching and none of the benefit.

Culdeus, I respectfully submit that you are off your rocker on this one. Pretty much everything I've ever read/heard about running and stretching is to NOT stretch before, but to absolutely, positively spend some time stretching afterwards. I just saw something in Runners World about stretching but I'll have to check after work to see what exactly it was.

Ran 4 miles Tues morning, and yesterday I accidentially did my first "brick" - I did 16 miles of mostly trail riding when I popped my back tire going over a curb. Since I had neither patch nor pump, and I was 3 miles from home, I had to jog with the bike for 1/2 mile to get near a convenient pick-up point, lock it to a tree, and run the rest of the way home. I'm surprisingly tired today, and I don't think it's because of the rousing bocce ball game I played in the evening... or the beer.

 

[tri-man 47]

I'm in a three-week stretch of hard training before a two week taper leading up to my 1/2-Ironman on August 4. This week:

M - 55 minute swim

T - hour-long bike workout (finally feeling very good in one of the gears for blend of power/speed)

W - three-hour bike workout

Th - 8 mile run this morning (with some 'hills' ...working some loops of expressway overpasses, pushing the pace both up and down)

Yesterday's ride was great. I worked different gears on each loop of an 8 mile circle of a forest preserve paved trail (Busse Woods). My stamina at the end was as strong as the start. In the past, I've tended to slip as I got around 2 hours, but I was still strong toward the end of 3 hours (and this equates to my upcoming bike leg ..time and distance). Very encouraging!

I'm trying to keep my runs to twice a week (and about 20 miles/week) due to the sore Achilles tendon.

I'm hoping to take Friday afternoon off and head to the Chicago lakefront with my wetsuit for some swimming in Lake Michigan.

Stretching: I try to mix in stretching/flexibility throughout the week, and therefore don't do much before or after specific workouts (time constraints enter in as well). I know I loosen up after about a mile of running (or, as recently noted, when biking before a run). I'm the old guy here and can get by without much stretching. I think we each need to know our own situation and deal with it accordingly.

 

[RoarinSonoran]

Did 5k on Tuesday night in 31mins. Did the first 2.5miles at a 9:00 pace (left my music at home, but STILL couldn't find a slower gear), then decided to walk the 0.1 before finishing the final 0.5, but couldn't get started again and walked most of the final 0.5. :X I didn't really feel bad, but I think the heat may have sucked out my energy for the last mile. It's still 100degrees at 10pm here, so there's really no escaping it (other than running at 5am at ~82degrees).

The newest Runner's World (August) has an article about getting ready for a half-marathon, but it seemed like it was geared more towards "look at me! I'm Ryan Hall and I set the American record for the half in my first attempt, and just a few days after running a full marathon!". I'll have to re-read it.

 

[El Floppo]

I'm in a three-week stretch of hard training before a two week taper leading up to my 1/2-Ironman on August 4. This week:

M - 55 minute swim

T - hour-long bike workout (finally feeling very good in one of the gears for blend of power/speed)

W - three-hour bike workout

Th - 8 mile run this morning (with some 'hills' ...working some loops of expressway overpasses, pushing the pace both up and down)

Yesterday's ride was great. I worked different gears on each loop of an 8 mile circle of a forest preserve paved trail (Busse Woods). My stamina at the end was as strong as the start. In the past, I've tended to slip as I got around 2 hours, but I was still strong toward the end of 3 hours (and this equates to my upcoming bike leg ..time and distance). Very encouraging!

I'm trying to keep my runs to twice a week (and about 20 miles/week) due to the sore Achilles tendon.

I'm hoping to take Friday afternoon off and head to the Chicago lakefront with my wetsuit for some swimming in Lake Michigan.

Stretching: I try to mix in stretching/flexibility throughout the week, and therefore don't do much before or after specific workouts (time constraints enter in as well). I know I loosen up after about a mile of running (or, as recently noted, when biking before a run). I'm the old guy here and can get by without much stretching. I think we each need to know our own situation and deal with it accordingly.

Absolutely jealous of your upcoming 1/2! Is this the same one you did last year? Sounds like you're ready for it... given the bike report. The wetsuit, openwater swim sounds like a great idea- get your body back in the swing of things on both fronts.

Blood, man! just hearing about this is making me jones to get back in the tri-game... gotta figure out how to get back on the bike once things settle into some kind of normalcy with the baby (yeah, I know... never).

Keep the reports coming in- makes a retired tri-poppa all kinds of happy to hear about them!

 

[El Floppo]

Did about 4.5, with 4 x .25m pickups in the middle. Upped each .25 pickup from 7:45 to 7:30 and slowed down to 9:30s on the rest .25s.

Figure I'll do a light run Tuesdays, hills or speedwork Thursdays and long run on Sundays. Try my best to throw in a couple of bike rides (either on the road or on the trainer until I figure out more of a schedule with the baby) on Wed and Sat and get back into the pool on Fridays (especially once the wife recovers from the C-sectino and joins me).

At worst, get myself back into enough shape to run the Marathon. At best, ... do a tri this fall, or at least get myself back into the swing of things to set myself back up for a full tri season in '08.

 

[tri-man 47]

Absolutely jealous of your upcoming 1/2! Is this the same one you did last year? Sounds like you're ready for it... given the bike report. The wetsuit, openwater swim sounds like a great idea- get your body back in the swing of things on both fronts. Blood, man! just hearing about this is making me jones to get back in the tri-game... gotta figure out how to get back on the bike once things settle into some kind of normalcy with the baby (yeah, I know... never). Keep the reports coming in- makes a retired tri-poppa all kinds of happy to hear about them!

Yes, same race as last year. But now I know the course and have laser-corrected eyes. If I can relax more with the swim (which is likely, given better pre-race timing and good eyesight), I'll breath better and come out in better shape for all that's to follow. Add in the marathon base to help me run better, and I hope to knock off some time from last year (15-25 minutes?).And you be patient! Getting marathon-ready over the next few months will be a handful for you, pops. (When do you change age-brackets?) Anyway, you're in this for the long-haul - look at Liquors' enjoyment of the family tri-event or my own enjoyment of having my teenage daughter proudly joining me on race weekends. Patience ...

 

[IvanKaramazov]

The newest Runner's World (August) has an article about getting ready for a half-marathon, but it seemed like it was geared more towards "look at me! I'm Ryan Hall and I set the American record for the half in my first attempt, and just a few days after running a full marathon!".

If you ever set an American record for a particular distance, you are officially allowed to play the "LOOK AT ME!" schtick without shame or apology.

 

[El Floppo]

Absolutely jealous of your upcoming 1/2! Is this the same one you did last year? Sounds like you're ready for it... given the bike report. The wetsuit, openwater swim sounds like a great idea- get your body back in the swing of things on both fronts. Blood, man! just hearing about this is making me jones to get back in the tri-game... gotta figure out how to get back on the bike once things settle into some kind of normalcy with the baby (yeah, I know... never). Keep the reports coming in- makes a retired tri-poppa all kinds of happy to hear about them!

Yes, same race as last year. But now I know the course and have laser-corrected eyes. If I can relax more with the swim (which is likely, given better pre-race timing and good eyesight), I'll breath better and come out in better shape for all that's to follow. Add in the marathon base to help me run better, and I hope to knock off some time from last year (15-25 minutes?).And you be patient! Getting marathon-ready over the next few months will be a handful for you, pops. (When do you change age-brackets?) Anyway, you're in this for the long-haul - look at Liquors' enjoyment of the family tri-event or my own enjoyment of having my teenage daughter proudly joining me on race weekends. Patience ...

Thanks for the advice, gramps!Next year I'll be in the 40-45 bracket... not much help, really.Knowing the course is a HUGE advantage in a tri- so I have confidence you'll do great. I PRed my 10k run time at the NYC tri one year- I was really fit, yes- but mostly as soon as I got into Central Park, I knew every square inch of that race course and knew I could go throw everything at it. I forget- are you a decent swimmer, or an anchor like me? Do you two-beat kick or flutter? How often do you breath? Both sides or one side? What happened last year that messed up your timing? I've said before- I'm terrible in the water regardless of my effort, but I always come out in decent shape for the bike on race-day. I two-beat kick, draft as much as possible, and breath as easy as possible even when the waves behind me come swimming up over my back en masse. I always come out of the water feeling tired in my upper body, but fresh in the legs and cardio, which is all I can ask for given my swimming ineptitude.

 

[IvanKaramazov]

Question for the triathletes:

As I mentioned before, I'm recovering from an injured knee/pelvis and can't run right now. I've been trying swimming 2-3 times a week as a temporary alternative (and biking the other 2-3 days so as to get in five decent workouts a week). What I'm curious about is how you would say swimming stacks up to running or biking in terms of exercise.

I'm a really terrible swimmer who routinely gets lapped by overweight, middle-aged women. That's okay, because I'm not planning on entering any swimming races any time soon. If I'm ever in the ocean and somebody spots a shark, I am probably a goner because I'll be the last one out of the water, but that's just a risk I'll have to take. From a workout standpoint, though, it seems like this would be sort of to my advantage. If I swim inefficiently, then I'm doing more work to cover the same distance as somebody who is actually skilled at this, right? So in principle, I should be able to maintain a decent level of fitness for a while as long as I keep at it. Or at least that's my hypothesis.

FWIW, our pool is only open for lap-swimming for one hour at a time (one hour in the morning and one hour in the afternoon), so I am time-constrained on how long I can spend in the pool. On Tuesday, I was able to do 1600 meters in approximately an hour. Today I did 1750. This is with a combination of crawl and breastroke if it matters. I know those distances are pretty awful for a full hour's work, but the main thing is that while I'm a rotten swimmer, I'm in good enough shape to go continuously for an hour.

Comments?

ETA: When I get back to running, my goal is maintain a steady 15-20 miles per week. Serious, but nothing extreme either.

 

[El Floppo]

Question for the triathletes:As I mentioned before, I'm recovering from an injured knee/pelvis and can't run right now. I've been trying swimming 2-3 times a week as a temporary alternative (and biking the other 2-3 days so as to get in five decent workouts a week). What I'm curious about is how you would say swimming stacks up to running or biking in terms of exercise. I'm a really terrible swimmer who routinely gets lapped by overweight, middle-aged women. That's okay, because I'm not planning on entering any swimming races any time soon. If I'm ever in the ocean and somebody spots a shark, I am probably a goner because I'll be the last one out of the water, but that's just a risk I'll have to take. From a workout standpoint, though, it seems like this would be sort of to my advantage. If I swim inefficiently, then I'm doing more work to cover the same distance as somebody who is actually skilled at this, right? So in principle, I should be able to maintain a decent level of fitness for a while as long as I keep at it. Or at least that's my hypothesis. FWIW, our pool is only open for lap-swimming for one hour at a time (one hour in the morning and one hour in the afternoon), so I am time-constrained on how long I can spend in the pool. On Tuesday, I was able to do 1600 meters in approximately an hour. Today I did 1750. This is with a combination of crawl and breastroke if it matters. I know those distances are pretty awful for a full hour's work, but the main thing is that while I'm a rotten swimmer, I'm in good enough shape to go continuously for an hour.Comments?ETA: When I get back to running, my goal is maintain a steady 15-20 miles per week. Serious, but nothing extreme either.

I'm not a good one to comment too much about this, as I'm only marginally faster than you- even after having tri-coaches and a number of years of races/training.However- if you're flutter kicking (churning the water behind you)- you're getting a great cardio workout and a decent lower body workout. It's not going to keep you in any kind of shape for running, however (the slowest runners in my tri club were the competitive swimmers)- but it'll keep you fit. As a former soccer player who only lifted enough weights to keep from getting pushed off the ball- I noticed the swimming gave me a great upper body workout (shoulders and lats- but only doing freestyle) without having to hit the dumby-bells.That you can swim a mile+ is pretty frigging awesome for a non-swimmer, regardless of how long it takes you. Come to the dark side of tris, my friend- you won't be sorry... and you won't be alone in the water

 

[RoarinSonoran]

The newest Runner's World (August) has an article about getting ready for a half-marathon, but it seemed like it was geared more towards "look at me! I'm Ryan Hall and I set the American record for the half in my first attempt, and just a few days after running a full marathon!".

If you ever set an American record for a particular distance, you are officially allowed to play the "LOOK AT ME!" schtick without shame or apology.

Well, maybe that wasn't the most appropriate analogy, but when I read the cover, I thought about you guys in this thread figuring "oh cool, half-marathon tips, the guys will want to hear about this", but it seemed more like a biography about this guy. Anyhow, I came back in here to post that it pays to read your emails. I was registering for the Virginia Beach half-marathon, and had to log in as a returning registrant (since I'm doing the series of races). I had to do the "forgot my logon" routine the last time I registered, so I searched my emails to see if that one was still around. One of the other emails that turned up in the search was a request for post-race feedback sent after the San Diego marathon last month. I opened it figuring I'd read and then delete, but it offered a registration discount for completing the survey. It had a deadline of June 15, but I did it anyhow....and the coupon code worked! So....

Look at me, I saved $15!!!

lol

 

[Darrinll40]

Just finished my first real bike ride in years. I rode the 11 mile course I am going to run on Saturday and finished it in just over 45 minutes. But I did spend about 2 minutes at a long stop light. It seems there is some kind of race tonight at Daytona Speedway and the traffic is heavy right by the track. My new bike rode great. I am looking forward to even longer rides in the future.

 

[tri-man 47]

Question for the triathletes:What I'm curious about is how you would say swimming stacks up to running or biking in terms of exercise. Comments?

I would say swimming is the best exercise because it physically involves the entire body along with the cardiovascular effects. Running seems so beneficial because we feel the sweat and hear our deep breathing. But I've noticed that a good swim does the same, really, and more (I don't sweat in the pool, obviously, but I notice that I get thirsty from the effort). And all in all, I can finish a swim workout without feeling as 'beat up' as I sometimes do after a long run. Swimming's more multi-dimensional, and doesn't pound the body (really good swimmers can have shoulder problems, but I'm not really good). That said, swimming takes a lot of work for those of us that didn't learn proper technique when we were kids. While there's more to running than meets the eye, as we've discussed here, it's still easy enough to just go out and run. Swimming efficiently is difficult. I'm to the point where I can swim at about a minute per lap (so about a 35-36 minute mile), but I still have to concentrate so much!

 

[tri-man 47]

I forget- are you a decent swimmer, or an anchor like me? Do you two-beat kick or flutter? How often do you breath? Both sides or one side? What happened last year that messed up your timing? I've said before- I'm terrible in the water regardless of my effort, but I always come out in decent shape for the bike on race-day. I two-beat kick, draft as much as possible, and breath as easy as possible even when the waves behind me come swimming up over my back en masse. I always come out of the water feeling tired in my upper body, but fresh in the legs and cardio, which is all I can ask for given my swimming ineptitude.

I'm middle-of-the pack ..as just mentioned to IK, about 35 minutes/mile. Kicking varies. When I breath bilaterally, I have a smooth three kicks per stroke. When breathing right side (most of the time), instead of having that six kick sequence, I tend to have three firm kicks and the other three mostly nuttin (is that a three-beat kick?). Those firm kicks involve a firm, definitive down stroke with the top of my foot, creating a nice fin-like effect.Last year, I arrived rather late for the start. I didn't get to hop in the lake to warm up, nor think through final mental checks. The start was jumping six feet off of a pier (trying not to land on the person in front of you), and that was kind of freaky. Also, we were swimming so that the sun was right in our sight-line. Add that to the weak eyesight, and I couldn't maintain a good line. I just didn't relax, so I breathed poorly, and came out bloated. It took an hour or more for that to pass (so to speak).

 

[El Floppo]

I forget- are you a decent swimmer, or an anchor like me? Do you two-beat kick or flutter? How often do you breath? Both sides or one side? What happened last year that messed up your timing? I've said before- I'm terrible in the water regardless of my effort, but I always come out in decent shape for the bike on race-day. I two-beat kick, draft as much as possible, and breath as easy as possible even when the waves behind me come swimming up over my back en masse. I always come out of the water feeling tired in my upper body, but fresh in the legs and cardio, which is all I can ask for given my swimming ineptitude.

I'm middle-of-the pack ..as just mentioned to IK, about 35 minutes/mile. Kicking varies. When I breath bilaterally, I have a smooth three kicks per stroke. When breathing right side (most of the time), instead of having that six kick sequence, I tend to have three firm kicks and the other three mostly nuttin (is that a three-beat kick?). Those firm kicks involve a firm, definitive down stroke with the top of my foot, creating a nice fin-like effect.Last year, I arrived rather late for the start. I didn't get to hop in the lake to warm up, nor think through final mental checks. The start was jumping six feet off of a pier (trying not to land on the person in front of you), and that was kind of freaky. Also, we were swimming so that the sun was right in our sight-line. Add that to the weak eyesight, and I couldn't maintain a good line. I just didn't relax, so I breathed poorly, and came out bloated. It took an hour or more for that to pass (so to speak).

Do you feel like your legs are ok coming out of the water, or a little tired? File this in the "do as I say, not as I do" category... but my tri-coaches (TNT and my club) all pushed the same "two-beat" kick on us. The kick is more like kicking a flip-flop (sandal) off your foot: quick, but not big, and more from the ankle not the knee. With the two beats, every time you stroke, you do a little flip kick with the opposite foot. It ends up being more about creating a nice rotation in the water than propelling you... great for form which ends up helping the speed, and really great for saving your legs for the bike/run. For some reason, I was able to "get" the kick, but it still doesn't help my typical 45 minute 1/2 IM swim time. On the last leg of my IM, I drafted for more than 1/2 mile behind a guy who didn't kick at all! Made for excellent drafting, as there was no kick to dodge with my outstretched stroke hand. In fact- both loops of the IM swim were PRs for me at the 1/2IM distance- it was like a big washing machine swirl just tugging you along.Hey... while I'm dredging up swim memories... do you have a plan for your sighting? ie: every 10 strokes or whatever? I do 10 mostly because I end up losing count much past 10 . It also takes me about 10 strokes to turn myself perpindicular to the race course, so I like to keep my zig-zag nice and steady...

 

[tri-man 47]

Do you feel like your legs are ok coming out of the water, or a little tired? Hey... while I'm dredging up swim memories... do you have a plan for your sighting?

The legs are good ...I know not to kick too hard, given the bike and run to follow. Last year was my first in a wetsuit, so I'm still acclimating to the ease and joy of swimming with that! It's like having a body-length floatie. Sighting has historically been something of a pain since I swam without my contacts so my vision was blurred. That's been fixed with the lasik. I don't have much of a plan for sighting - I just look occasionally, both peeking above the waterline with a bit of a lunge stroke and doing some four-stroke breathing so I can keep my head in the water to look around (and exhale fully). Of course, last year I got into a strong rhythm and stopped looking ...and ended up drifting way off course almost back to shore. How the heck do ya get lost on a straight-shot swim?? OK, sorry. Anybody racing this weekend? I don't recall hearing of specific events.

 

[Darrinll40]

OK, sorry. Anybody racing this weekend? I don't recall hearing of specific events.

I have a prediction run, sort of a fun run on Sunday afternoon. The distance is somewhere between 2.7 and 3 miles, the winner is the one who is closest to predicting his/her actual time. I predicted 27:05. But, no races for me until a 4 miler on September 15. Dangit.

I will be doing my longest ever run on Saturday morning. 11 miles.

 

[El Floppo]

Do you feel like your legs are ok coming out of the water, or a little tired? Hey... while I'm dredging up swim memories... do you have a plan for your sighting?

The legs are good ...I know not to kick too hard, given the bike and run to follow. Last year was my first in a wetsuit, so I'm still acclimating to the ease and joy of swimming with that! It's like having a body-length floatie. Sighting has historically been something of a pain since I swam without my contacts so my vision was blurred. That's been fixed with the lasik. I don't have much of a plan for sighting - I just look occasionally, both peeking above the waterline with a bit of a lunge stroke and doing some four-stroke breathing so I can keep my head in the water to look around (and exhale fully). Of course, last year I got into a strong rhythm and stopped looking ...and ended up drifting way off course almost back to shore. How the heck do ya get lost on a straight-shot swim??

Cool and gb the wetsuit- I feel like I'm swimming at a permanent 90deg angle, bent at the hips with my butt and legs scraping the sea-floor until I put on the wetsuit.Give the 10 or 12 stroke sighting method a try :( (I push down with my left stroke hand when I sight to get my head up a little more)- it definitely helps with the sighting, and also helps break down the swim into small components- but get's in the way of staying in a nice rhythm (I'll avoid sighting if I'm drafting off somebody). When are you doing the lake/wetsuit swim?

 

[El Floppo]

Meanwhile... I've got an 8 mile run scheduled for Sunday as part of marathon training.

Haven't run that far since last fall- and even though I'm not worried about the distance, I'm kinda worried about pushing too hard and/or putting too much stress on the gimpy knee. If it starts hurting, I guess I'll just walk a little and then run a little... good plan?

 

[Cowboys#1]

10 miles yesterday.. really boring and hot out.

Pretty funny, I was wearing one of those tight Nike dri fit base layers (red) underneath my cotton t-shirt (wasn't thinking!). I was so hot I had to take that t-shirt off and run in the base layer, the embarassment brought me home quicker.

Slow first 6 miles (52 minutes) finished the last 4miles in about 29 minutes.

Legs feel like bricks today though...

 

[RoarinSonoran]

I have a prediction run, sort of a fun run on Sunday afternoon. The distance is somewhere between 2.7 and 3 miles, the winner is the one who is closest to predicting his/her actual time. I predicted 27:05.

You should have predicted 30:00. Then, you come to a complete stop a couple feet from the finish line and start watching the seconds tick off. As it's about to hit 30:00, you step across the line. Winner winner chicken dinner!

 

[El Floppo]

Does anybody use the Polar foot pod?

It was acting up on yesterday's run- having problems reading for a stretch at a time which would screw up the distance.

 

[RoarinSonoran]

5k again last night, and again, around 31mins with a wall at 2-2.5mi. I suppose I'm just going to have to start dragging my butt out of bed in the morning to run. Last Saturday morning was ok, I don't recall noticing much heat, I just started out way too fast and soon crashed. I ran after 9pm last night, and the weatherdude on the 10pm news said it was still 104degrees. I suppose it could be worse...Bullhead City (NW AZ, across from Laughlin NV) has been 120+ most of this week.

I-Ts are still malingering, but not a problem (just the usual they've been doing for several weeks now). However, my calf cramp/stitch/whatever that popped up in the San Diego marathon a month ago reared its ugly head last night. I stopped to stretch it at the halfway point, but it's still there (achey) today.

 

[RoarinSonoran]

Oh, I've been meaning to post this. I've mentioned in previous posts that I've had problems with my Garmin 201 not being accurate (Nashville and San Diego marathons measuring >26.2mi). It occured to me recently that this might be due to having travelled several hundred miles from home, and not re-setting the 'home' reference point. Now, I've had the watch fuss at me when I've had it on inside my house ("weak GPS signal"), and one of the questions it asks is if I'm >500miles from home. It never asked me about this before these races. I'm planning to check this before my next races (I'll have to check the manual to figger out how to set the 'home' point).

Something to consider if your watch (Garmin or other) is having accuracy problems when you stray far from home.

 

[tri-man 47]

Oh, I've been meaning to post this. I've mentioned in previous posts that I've had problems with my Garmin 201 not being accurate (Nashville and San Diego marathons measuring >26.2mi). It occured to me recently that this might be due to having travelled several hundred miles from home, and not re-setting the 'home' reference point. Now, I've had the watch fuss at me when I've had it on inside my house ("weak GPS signal"), and one of the questions it asks is if I'm >500miles from home. It never asked me about this before these races. I'm planning to check this before my next races (I'll have to check the manual to figger out how to set the 'home' point).Something to consider if your watch (Garmin or other) is having accuracy problems when you stray far from home.

Man, I get enough constant nagging from my wife ...don't know if I could handle having a machine pestering me as well!Favorite sight while running in Phoenix area a few years ago: The watering system for houses is basically to have small berms around the yards, and flood the yards in the morning (before that nasty heat kicks in). As I was running through some neighborhood, I saw a few ducks hanging out in the front yard 'pond' of a house. Weird.Floppo, heading out now for a lake swim!

 

[El Floppo]

Oh, I've been meaning to post this. I've mentioned in previous posts that I've had problems with my Garmin 201 not being accurate (Nashville and San Diego marathons measuring >26.2mi). It occured to me recently that this might be due to having travelled several hundred miles from home, and not re-setting the 'home' reference point. Now, I've had the watch fuss at me when I've had it on inside my house ("weak GPS signal"), and one of the questions it asks is if I'm >500miles from home. It never asked me about this before these races. I'm planning to check this before my next races (I'll have to check the manual to figger out how to set the 'home' point).Something to consider if your watch (Garmin or other) is having accuracy problems when you stray far from home.

Man, I get enough constant nagging from my wife ...don't know if I could handle having a machine pestering me as well!Favorite sight while running in Phoenix area a few years ago: The watering system for houses is basically to have small berms around the yards, and flood the yards in the morning (before that nasty heat kicks in). As I was running through some neighborhood, I saw a few ducks hanging out in the front yard 'pond' of a house. Weird.Floppo, heading out now for a lake swim!

I remember trying to run out in Phoenix the first time I visited- springtime, so the temps were only in the 90s. My running shoes felt like they were melting onto the pavement while running... not fun. Have fun in the lake! Mebbe I'll head down to the East River for a quick dip... ... (even though my dad used to swim in it when he was a kid).

 

[RoarinSonoran]

Favorite sight while running in Phoenix area a few years ago: The watering system for houses is basically to have small berms around the yards, and flood the yards in the morning (before that nasty heat kicks in). As I was running through some neighborhood, I saw a few ducks hanging out in the front yard 'pond' of a house. Weird.

Yeah, flood irrigation is popular around here, but not so much in the newer developments. Kind of a result of how the ancient injuns that lived here used to water their crops. They were quite the engineers. They figured out that they could dig a canal far upstream on the Salt River (that runs through the middle of Phoenix; currently dry due to dams upstream), and direct the water to wherever they needed it. Palefaces come along a few hundred years later, discover the remains of the canal system, and re-use it in the same manner to create the current oasis in the desert.

 

[mr. furley]

christmas

today was a rough one. legs were dead. i did a bit of walking on wednesday nite after running... my legs were really sore on Thursday. never got a chance to recover. i knew going in that today was gonna be rough.

was on the last 5 minute leg, barely jogging, when i came up on a friend of mine's house. he was outside talking to 2 cops

that made me laugh a bit and made the last 3 minutes a lot easier.

 

[cacksman]

Just to try and relate with some of the runners... I am now officially trying to start a good base for this winters indoor track season. I will be running at either Spokane Falls or Whatcom Community College and today I went for a run for the 1st time in months and felt very bad. Oh well, at least i'm starting very early and have time to work my way into shape.

 

[2Young2BBald]

Out of nowhere, I think I’ve hit a wall. I think I got myself a little excited and over confident on how things were going. For the last three days or so, I have been sore everywhere. He is how I think it happened (and, because I am needy, I hoping I can’t get some help figuring out how to fix it, sorry if this ends up long): A week ago Saturday, I did longer run of 7 miles, did an hour and a minute and felt great. Played the coed kickball thing on Monday Night and woke up sore in my back and my knees on Tuesday Morning (its was dry as heck here and the field was like concrete). On Tuesday I drove 7 hours for a meeting @ our home office, which went like crap. Pissed, I checked in to the hotel and went for a run, only a 5K in 90+ degree heat and high humidity. I knocked it out in around 25 minutes, but my legs felt like crap and it literally took 2 hours to reduce my heart rate. Next day, more meeting and then back in the car 5 hours to another location overnight and meetings the next day. Drive home 2 more ours after meeting on Thursday and run 6 miles that night at right around an hour. Ran 5 miles on Saturday of last week, more kickball on Monday and ran 5 miles on the 4th. The soreness has definitely been there since the game/trip combo and has gotten progressively worse. I shut it down for two days and am still achy, but better today. So here comes the questions, do I shut it down for a few more days? (I have been a bit psycho, weighing myself, stretching, etc and am antsy as hell). Or, do I run, easy, through it for a while? When I have run with the aches, I loosen up and feel great while running, but then end up tight. I suppose I could walk too, but I feeling this insane urge to run. And, I am not missing kickball on Monday, which I am guessing is the main culprit in all of this. My chances to play sports with hot twenty-something women are fading as I race towards 40, I’d guess.

One more theory, could there be some kind of bad karma-like curse when you actually put virtual pen to paper and sign up for you first long race? My wife and I just signed up for both the Detroit ½ in October & a 10 Miler up in Flint in late August (as a test of sorts).

Finally, I feel like I am taking and never givng here, so here are a few things I have picked up lately. The EAS combo of the prerun Catapult and Post Run Recovery have proven amazing in a few more tries. I don’t do the prerun all the time, but it has had great impact, especially running after drinking the night before. Also, I wanted to plug going to a running store for the whole shoe profile thing. There is a Hanson’s near my house (a MI thing). My Asics were getting a bit soupy. The guy looked at my current shoe and asked if my back was getting sore (maybe its not just kickball). You can’t beat this type of expert knowledge and customer service. I picked my (I think) 6th pair of Asics. The new Gel Nimbus 9. I got the black, which my wife loves but I am not all that fond of. The shoe is so light, but so sturdy and has so much more bounce back in the heal (strike thingy).

That’s it for me, back to pacing the house deciding to run or not this morning.

 

[El Floppo]

2Young... not sure what you're overall training schedule is like, but my former coaches always incorporated a rest week into our trainng. We'd have 3 weeks 'on', and 1 week 'off'. Resting your body helps it get stronger in the long run, or else you end up just breaking down. The off week is still full of workouts- just smaller and at an easy pace. Even if you feel fresh, don't cheat the off week workouts by going hard- in the long run, I found the rest weeks really made a difference.

 

[2Young2BBald]

2Young... not sure what you're overall training schedule is like, but my former coaches always incorporated a rest week into our trainng. We'd have 3 weeks 'on', and 1 week 'off'. Resting your body helps it get stronger in the long run, or else you end up just breaking down. The off week is still full of workouts- just smaller and at an easy pace. Even if you feel fresh, don't cheat the off week workouts by going hard- in the long run, I found the rest weeks really made a difference.

Thanks for the quick feedback, and I'll try, but wern't you climbing the walls during the rest weeks?

 

[Darrinll40]

Just finished my first 11 mile run. I completed it in 1:57:53 a ta pace of 10:42 m/m. Though to be honest the actual time should be about 3 minutes less at 1:55:53. The Busch race was rained out last night and is being run this morning. My running course takes me right by the speedway and I got stopped for two minutes by race traffic. It was the same place I got stopped in my bike ride on Thursday. I did try to keep moving while at the light and I think that might have hurt me more in the end. I basically bounced for two minutes and in the last mile my hips started bothering me a bit. The next time I get stopped at a light I am just going to stand and wait for it turn.

Overall I feel pretty good, knees and legs are fine. For the first time since I decided to run the half marathon I am positive that I will be able to run the complete distance.

I hope that everyone else has as good a Saturday as I am having.

Darrin

 

[El Floppo]

2Young... not sure what you're overall training schedule is like, but my former coaches always incorporated a rest week into our trainng. We'd have 3 weeks 'on', and 1 week 'off'. Resting your body helps it get stronger in the long run, or else you end up just breaking down. The off week is still full of workouts- just smaller and at an easy pace. Even if you feel fresh, don't cheat the off week workouts by going hard- in the long run, I found the rest weeks really made a difference.

Thanks for the quick feedback, and I'll try, but wern't you climbing the walls during the rest weeks?

Oh yeah- especially at first. But it allows you to make the 'on' weeks that much tougher on yourself. My coaches would seriously kick our asses in the 3rd week before the rest week. Got to the point where I was most definitely ready for those rest weeks and took advantage of them when they came. Made for nice month-long cycles of training. If you can really hold back on your rest week, you'll feel the dividends for the rest of your training- trust me.

 

[2Young2BBald]

2Young... not sure what you're overall training schedule is like, but my former coaches always incorporated a rest week into our trainng. We'd have 3 weeks 'on', and 1 week 'off'. Resting your body helps it get stronger in the long run, or else you end up just breaking down. The off week is still full of workouts- just smaller and at an easy pace. Even if you feel fresh, don't cheat the off week workouts by going hard- in the long run, I found the rest weeks really made a difference.

Thanks for the quick feedback, and I'll try, but wern't you climbing the walls during the rest weeks?

Oh yeah- especially at first. But it allows you to make the 'on' weeks that much tougher on yourself. My coaches would seriously kick our asses in the 3rd week before the rest week. Got to the point where I was most definitely ready for those rest weeks and took advantage of them when they came. Made for nice month-long cycles of training. If you can really hold back on your rest week, you'll feel the dividends for the rest of your training- trust me.

Just finished and easy 5K w/ a mile walk after. I was working to keep the time around 10 minute miles. Ended up finishing in 27:35. I wasn't watching all that close, but I hit the lake (St. Clair) at 1.25 miles and did bust it a bit as there were plenty of "spectators" and I'm sure I sped up a bunch here. My knees and back feel really good, we'll see how they feel later. I have another pain/ache where my backside meets my thigh but its no more than a dull ache. No running tomorrow, kickball on Monday and I'll gauge how I feel on Tuesday, but will try and do no more than a walk on that day. I like the thought of the rest and then busting it even more.On an unrealated, yet related note, I added some new music to the MP3. I have couple of new ones I am going to add to the running folder. I added Chevelle's I get it, Shinedown's Simple Man accoustic, Red's Breathe in to Me & The Whitestripe's Icky Thump (this would be perfect around the one hour mark of any run, I'm guessing). Couple other favorites include Adema's Immortal, Fozzy's Enemy, Breaking Benjamin's Polyamourus & Thousdand Foot Crush'd Move.

 

[Darrinll40]

On an unrealated, yet related note, I added some new music to the MP3. I have couple of new ones I am going to add to the running folder. I added Chevelle's I get it, Shinedown's Simple Man accoustic, Red's Breathe in to Me & The Whitestripe's Icky Thump (this would be perfect around the one hour mark of any run, I'm guessing). Couple other favorites include Adema's Immortal, Fozzy's Enemy, Breaking Benjamin's Polyamourus & Thousdand Foot Crush'd Move.

I never heard of any of those people. I must be old.

 

[Darrinll40]

On an unrealated, yet related note, I added some new music to the MP3. I have couple of new ones I am going to add to the running folder. I added Chevelle's I get it, Shinedown's Simple Man accoustic, Red's Breathe in to Me & The Whitestripe's Icky Thump (this would be perfect around the one hour mark of any run, I'm guessing). Couple other favorites include Adema's Immortal, Fozzy's Enemy, Breaking Benjamin's Polyamourus & Thousdand Foot Crush'd Move.

I never heard of any of those people. I must be old.

These are on my shuffle.Walking On Sunshine Katrina & The Waves Twisted Sister - We're Not Gonna Take It Sweet Home Alabama 4:45 Lynyrd Skynyrd Rockin' The Paradise 3:35 Styx Rock This Town 2:40 Stray Cats Play That Funky Music 4:52 KC and the Sunshine Band Miss America 4:59 Styx Mickey 3:39 Toni Basil Maggie May 5:13 Rod Stewart I Can't Drive 55 4:15 Sammy Hagar Hot Stuff 3:48 Donna Summer Goody Two Shoes 3:32 Adam Ant Come On Eileen 4:13 Dexys Midnight Runners BTO - Takin' Care of Business 4:49 Bat Out of Hell 9:50 Meat Loaf All Revved Up... 4:20 Meat Loaf Ain't Goin' Down ('Til The Sun Comes Up) 4:46 Garth Brooks

 

[El Floppo]

2Young... not sure what you're overall training schedule is like, but my former coaches always incorporated a rest week into our trainng. We'd have 3 weeks 'on', and 1 week 'off'. Resting your body helps it get stronger in the long run, or else you end up just breaking down. The off week is still full of workouts- just smaller and at an easy pace. Even if you feel fresh, don't cheat the off week workouts by going hard- in the long run, I found the rest weeks really made a difference.

Thanks for the quick feedback, and I'll try, but wern't you climbing the walls during the rest weeks?

Oh yeah- especially at first. But it allows you to make the 'on' weeks that much tougher on yourself. My coaches would seriously kick our asses in the 3rd week before the rest week. Got to the point where I was most definitely ready for those rest weeks and took advantage of them when they came. Made for nice month-long cycles of training. If you can really hold back on your rest week, you'll feel the dividends for the rest of your training- trust me.

Just finished and easy 5K w/ a mile walk after. I was working to keep the time around 10 minute miles. Ended up finishing in 27:35. I wasn't watching all that close, but I hit the lake (St. Clair) at 1.25 miles and did bust it a bit as there were plenty of "spectators" and I'm sure I sped up a bunch here. My knees and back feel really good, we'll see how they feel later. I have another pain/ache where my backside meets my thigh but its no more than a dull ache. No running tomorrow, kickball on Monday and I'll gauge how I feel on Tuesday, but will try and do no more than a walk on that day. I like the thought of the rest and then busting it even more.On an unrealated, yet related note, I added some new music to the MP3. I have couple of new ones I am going to add to the running folder. I added Chevelle's I get it, Shinedown's Simple Man accoustic, Red's Breathe in to Me & The Whitestripe's Icky Thump (this would be perfect around the one hour mark of any run, I'm guessing). Couple other favorites include Adema's Immortal, Fozzy's Enemy, Breaking Benjamin's Polyamourus & Thousdand Foot Crush'd Move.

Taking a day off is nice- but you'll feel the dividends if you schedule this stuff and take a full week- even with big-boobied spectators luring you to speed every step of the way.

 

[2Young2BBald]

On an unrealated, yet related note, I added some new music to the MP3. I have couple of new ones I am going to add to the running folder. I added Chevelle's I get it, Shinedown's Simple Man accoustic, Red's Breathe in to Me & The Whitestripe's Icky Thump (this would be perfect around the one hour mark of any run, I'm guessing). Couple other favorites include Adema's Immortal, Fozzy's Enemy, Breaking Benjamin's Polyamourus & Thousdand Foot Crush'd Move.

I never heard of any of those people. I must be old.

I'll be 39 in a few months, but I love XM's Squizz. I'd never have heard of this stuff either w/out sattelite radio. Great "angry" energy type music.

 

[El Floppo]

Was all scheduled to take a short run this afternoon- but the wife mis-read her own scheduled massage by half hour, which completely screws up the 1/2 hour I was going to run. Now I'm home with the boy knowing that when my wife gets home she'll want to have dinner and there won't be time for me to go for my run.

This lack of sleep, no time for yourself thing is not one of the positives of having a baby. Selfish little *******.

 

[El Floppo]

On an unrealated, yet related note, I added some new music to the MP3. I have couple of new ones I am going to add to the running folder. I added Chevelle's I get it, Shinedown's Simple Man accoustic, Red's Breathe in to Me & The Whitestripe's Icky Thump (this would be perfect around the one hour mark of any run, I'm guessing). Couple other favorites include Adema's Immortal, Fozzy's Enemy, Breaking Benjamin's Polyamourus & Thousdand Foot Crush'd Move.

I never heard of any of those people. I must be old.

I'll be 39 in a few months, but I love XM's Squizz. I'd never have heard of this stuff either w/out sattelite radio. Great "angry" energy type music.

39 myself, and a bit more into newer alternative music than Darrin seems to be from his list- but I've not heard of most of that stuff either. You don't have to go making stuff up just to fit in, you know.

 

[El Floppo]

Was all scheduled to take a short run this afternoon- but the wife mis-read her own scheduled massage by half hour, which completely screws up the 1/2 hour I was going to run. Now I'm home with the boy knowing that when my wife gets home she'll want to have dinner and there won't be time for me to go for my run. This lack of sleep, no time for yourself thing is not one of the positives of having a baby. Selfish little *******.

oh ####... he just woke up.

 

[Schmegma]

These are on my shuffle.

Walking On Sunshine Katrina & The Waves

Twisted Sister - We're Not Gonna Take It

Sweet Home Alabama 4:45 Lynyrd Skynyrd

Rockin' The Paradise 3:35 Styx

Rock This Town 2:40 Stray Cats

Play That Funky Music 4:52 KC and the Sunshine Band

Miss America 4:59 Styx

Mickey 3:39 Toni Basil

Maggie May 5:13 Rod Stewart

I Can't Drive 55 4:15 Sammy Hagar

Hot Stuff 3:48 Donna Summer

Goody Two Shoes 3:32 Adam Ant

Come On Eileen 4:13 Dexys Midnight Runners

BTO - Takin' Care of Business 4:49

Bat Out of Hell 9:50 Meat Loaf

All Revved Up... 4:20 Meat Loaf

Ain't Goin' Down ('Til The Sun Comes Up) 4:46 Garth Brooks

I'll be 39 in a few months, but I love XM's Squizz. I'd never have heard of this stuff either w/out sattelite radio. Great "angry" energy type music.

39 myself, and a bit more into newer alternative music than Darrin seems to be from his list- but I've not heard of most of that stuff either. You don't have to go making stuff up just to fit in, you know.

I'm also 39, and love running to the "angry energy type music", so I'll have to check out some of the bands on 2Young's playlist. I also LOVE running to the podcasts found at Podrunner (also available FREE on iTunes). Based on the songs I've highlighted in Darrin's list above, I'm going to guess he's just a little older than I am - probably about 42 or 43.

 

[Darrinll40]

These are on my shuffle.

Walking On Sunshine Katrina & The Waves

Twisted Sister - We're Not Gonna Take It

Sweet Home Alabama 4:45 Lynyrd Skynyrd

Rockin' The Paradise 3:35 Styx

Rock This Town 2:40 Stray Cats

Play That Funky Music 4:52 KC and the Sunshine Band

Miss America 4:59 Styx

Mickey 3:39 Toni Basil

Maggie May 5:13 Rod Stewart

I Can't Drive 55 4:15 Sammy Hagar

Hot Stuff 3:48 Donna Summer

Goody Two Shoes 3:32 Adam Ant

Come On Eileen 4:13 Dexys Midnight Runners

BTO - Takin' Care of Business 4:49

Bat Out of Hell 9:50 Meat Loaf

All Revved Up... 4:20 Meat Loaf

Ain't Goin' Down ('Til The Sun Comes Up) 4:46 Garth Brooks

I'll be 39 in a few months, but I love XM's Squizz. I'd never have heard of this stuff either w/out sattelite radio. Great "angry" energy type music.

39 myself, and a bit more into newer alternative music than Darrin seems to be from his list- but I've not heard of most of that stuff either. You don't have to go making stuff up just to fit in, you know.

I'm also 39, and love running to the "angry energy type music", so I'll have to check out some of the bands on 2Young's playlist. I also LOVE running to the podcasts found at Podrunner (also available FREE on iTunes). Based on the songs I've highlighted in Darrin's list above, I'm going to guess he's just a little older than I am - probably about 42 or 43.

42 now and 43 in December.

 

[BassNBrew]

Still fighting knee issues here...improving though. Still working on my race schedule for the balance of the year. Considering a trip to PA to do a double century followed by a metric century the next day. I September I'm torn between an adventure triathlon and the bridge to bridge century. One is on Sat, the other on Sunday. Someone dispel the notion that I can do both...please.