Red Sox trade Arroyo (1 Viewer)

[Pat Patriot]

,Mar 21 2006, 02:16 PM]

I still think it was a bad deal by the Sox.  Wells is going to be an issue here at some point and Arrojo was willing to go to the bullpen in the meantime.

Oh well...what's done is done.

Okay... Right now We've got 6 starters:

Schilling

Beckett

Clement

Wakefield

Wells

Papelbon

So let's say Wells becomes an issue...

Schilling

Beckett

Clement

Wakefield

Papelbon

Now let's assuem Beckett goes on the DL with blister problems at the SAME TIme that Wells has problems..... big deal, we bring up Alvarez or Lester (both of whom Boston is expecting to contribute in some form to the big club this year) for a spot start or three.

While I suppose the luxury of carrying 7 starters JUST IN CASE is nice... it's frankly a bit of a waste of a roster spot. If Boston has any plans of Papelbon seeing the rotation then Arroyo was certainly a bit of a roadbllock as well (despite his willingness to pitch out of the pen for stretches, that is NOT where he's effective and there was no way we were going to leave him out there all year.

If you like Arroyo.. that's fine. He was an intriguing kid and one who pitched with stones at times.... but this was certainly a good trade for the Sox.

I think counting on Lester/Alvarez now is too risky.I think Wells will cause problems and I have zero faith in Foulke. I would plan on Papelbom being in the closer or set up role this year.

Wells gone.

Arroyo as the #5 starter.

Listen...I'm not trying to say that Arroyo is the second coming of Cy Young. He's a guy that has handled the pressure (not all can). He's a guy willing to pitch anywhere. He's a guy who is very low on the payroll.

I know we have a lot of starters. I don't think I've heard of a team having too many starters in August. It seems like everyone is trying to plug holes with who ever they can find at that point. (Jeremi Gonzalez started for the Sox in the recent past.)

Are you trying to say we need MORE outfielders? Obviously the three starters. How about Stern? Kapler? Mohr? David Murphy in minors? etc, etc.

Finally, it bothers me that they kind of screwed him in regards to the hometown discount. Don't expect any player to give the Sox a home town discount anymore.

Again with this hometown discount crap. He is at best a #4 starter and I believe he had a 3 yr contract for $4 million a year. Sounds reasonable to me. Just a couple of years ago the Sox got him off waivers from the PIRATES for god's sake.Was there really a TREMENDOUS market out there where Arroyo was going to get $6 million per year?

 

[Peyton Marino]

Just wanted to mention that Pena isn't a guy with "potential" that will be hitting platoon for a while. He's a freaking monster with the bat and at times a monster in the field (he makes great plays but ridiculous errors). Trouble is he's inconsistent at times and he's going to strike out 150 times a year. Other than that though, he's good enough to start now for the Sox and hit 30-35 HRs and drive in 100 runs while hitting .250-.260.

I could see him improving on these numbers, but to say he has "potential and is only a platoon hitter for now" is a ####### slap in the face.

edit: I think this is a good trade for the Reds though. Dunn plays left, upgrade defensively right there. Hatteberg plays first, upgrade defensively there. Arroyo slides into the rotation, big upgrade there. Also, I think Kearns and Pena are pretty even in run production.

 

[wilked]

"Boston and Cincinnati may not be done. The pitching-starved Reds have been eyeing relief pitcher Jermaine Van Buren, who was sent to the minors last week with the first round of cuts. The Sox are expected to trade Tony Graffanino within the next week.''

http://www.metrowestdailynews.com/sportsCo...&format=&page=2

 

[SteelCurtain]

,Mar 21 2006, 02:16 PM]

I still think it was a bad deal by the Sox.  Wells is going to be an issue here at some point and Arrojo was willing to go to the bullpen in the meantime.

Oh well...what's done is done.

Okay... Right now We've got 6 starters:

Schilling

Beckett

Clement

Wakefield

Wells

Papelbon

So let's say Wells becomes an issue...

Schilling

Beckett

Clement

Wakefield

Papelbon

Now let's assuem Beckett goes on the DL with blister problems at the SAME TIme that Wells has problems..... big deal, we bring up Alvarez or Lester (both of whom Boston is expecting to contribute in some form to the big club this year) for a spot start or three.

While I suppose the luxury of carrying 7 starters JUST IN CASE is nice... it's frankly a bit of a waste of a roster spot. If Boston has any plans of Papelbon seeing the rotation then Arroyo was certainly a bit of a roadbllock as well (despite his willingness to pitch out of the pen for stretches, that is NOT where he's effective and there was no way we were going to leave him out there all year.

If you like Arroyo.. that's fine. He was an intriguing kid and one who pitched with stones at times.... but this was certainly a good trade for the Sox.

I think counting on Lester/Alvarez now is too risky.I think Wells will cause problems and I have zero faith in Foulke. I would plan on Papelbom being in the closer or set up role this year.

Wells gone.

Arroyo as the #5 starter.

Listen...I'm not trying to say that Arroyo is the second coming of Cy Young. He's a guy that has handled the pressure (not all can). He's a guy willing to pitch anywhere. He's a guy who is very low on the payroll.

I know we have a lot of starters. I don't think I've heard of a team having too many starters in August. It seems like everyone is trying to plug holes with who ever they can find at that point. (Jeremi Gonzalez started for the Sox in the recent past.)

Are you trying to say we need MORE outfielders? Obviously the three starters. How about Stern? Kapler? Mohr? David Murphy in minors? etc, etc.

Finally, it bothers me that they kind of screwed him in regards to the hometown discount. Don't expect any player to give the Sox a home town discount anymore.

Again with this hometown discount crap. He is at best a #4 starter and I believe he had a 3 yr contract for $4 million a year. Sounds reasonable to me. Just a couple of years ago the Sox got him off waivers from the PIRATES for god's sake.Was there really a TREMENDOUS market out there where Arroyo was going to get $6 million per year?

He won 14 games last year and 10 the year before. he had more quality starts last year on the Red Sox than any other pitcher. However you value him, he signed a 3 year deal worth between $3-4 million a year and the assumption is that he would have gained more via arbitration.

 

[Jefferson the Caregiver]

He won 14 games last year and 10 the year before. he had more quality starts last year on the Red Sox than any other pitcher.

However you value him, he signed a 3 year deal worth between $3-4 million a year and the assumption is that he would have gained more via arbitration.

Let's not overstate Arroyo's value.The Sox won 95 games last year. Wakefield won 16 games, Wells won 15 games, Clement won 13 games. For the most part, the Sox pitching staff won games. Don't discount the fact that the team scored some runs for them too.

Arroyo won't win 10 games in Cincy.

 

[Jefferson the Caregiver]

.

I could see him improving on these numbers, but to say he has "potential and is only a platoon hitter for now" is a ####### slap in the face.

Who's slapping him in the face? That's what he is right now, a platoon hitter. Hate for reality to get in the way of your opinion.

 

[[icon]]

Willy Mo Goes Yard in his first game as a Red Sox platoon guy.....against the yankees no less

 

[wilked]

]Willy Mo Goes Yard in his first game as a Red Sox platoon guy.....against the yankees no less

 

[shuke]

How'd these guys do yesterday?

 

[NY/NJMFDIVER]

How'd these guys do yesterday?

No Manny, no Ortiz though.

 

[HellToupee]

How'd these guys do yesterday?

uh oh they lost a spring training game

 

[shuke]

How'd these guys do yesterday?

uh oh they lost a spring training game

I was talking about Arroyo and Pena's lines.

 

[HellToupee]

How'd these guys do yesterday?

uh oh they lost a spring training game

I was talking about Arroyo and Pena's lines.

nice line by Bronson yesterday

 

[Giant Wooden Badger]

How'd these guys do yesterday?

No Manny, no Ortiz though.

Manny played. Impressive game by Arroyo but it is just a ST game. One game doesn't mean anything, particularly in ST.

 

[Borat]

Finally, it bothers me that they kind of screwed him in regards to the hometown discount. Don't expect any player to give the Sox a home town discount anymore.

I agree that the Sox took advantage of the situation, but let's be honest here - Arroyo played the fool when he took a hometown discount. Here's a guy who was on the trading block as it was - then he takes a lower salary, which only increases his trade value. Once he signed that contract, was there ever any doubt that he'd be traded at some point this season? It was just an idiotic move on his part. His agent advised him against it, and his common sense should've done the same.

 

[Darth Cheney]

Finally, it bothers me that they kind of screwed him in regards to the hometown discount.  Don't expect any player to give the Sox a home town discount anymore.

I agree that the Sox took advantage of the situation, but let's be honest here - Arroyo played the fool when he took a hometown discount. Here's a guy who was on the trading block as it was - then he takes a lower salary, which only increases his trade value. Once he signed that contract, was there ever any doubt that he'd be traded at some point this season? It was just an idiotic move on his part. His agent advised him against it, and his common sense should've done the same.

I'm not saying you are doing it..... but with some people the players cannot win. If they ask for more money, become a hired gun, or complain about their salary they are greedy, selfish, not loyal and a detriment to the game. If they take less money to help the team out, or because they like the situation they are in..... they are dumb. Loyalty works both ways and the Sox office looks classless in this one. ( Even though their fans might not care when Willy Moe goes 35/100/.280 this year)

 

[Borat]

Finally, it bothers me that they kind of screwed him in regards to the hometown discount. Don't expect any player to give the Sox a home town discount anymore.

I agree that the Sox took advantage of the situation, but let's be honest here - Arroyo played the fool when he took a hometown discount. Here's a guy who was on the trading block as it was - then he takes a lower salary, which only increases his trade value. Once he signed that contract, was there ever any doubt that he'd be traded at some point this season? It was just an idiotic move on his part. His agent advised him against it, and his common sense should've done the same.

I'm not saying you are doing it..... but with some people the players cannot win. If they ask for more money, become a hired gun, or complain about their salary they are greedy, selfish, not loyal and a detriment to the game. If they take less money to help the team out, or because they like the situation they are in..... they are dumb. Loyalty works both ways and the Sox office looks classless in this one. ( Even though their fans might not care when Willy Moe goes 35/100/.280 this year)

Let's face facts: fans are generally extremely hypocritical. They plead for loyalty, but in all but the most extreme situations, they are remarkably disloyal. Yankees fans booed Jeter. Sox fans booed Foulke. There are a million other examples.

 

[Alias]

It's a shame he couldn't get a no trade clause or better yet a clause that gives him a bonus if traded - that would have been perfect - probably not that common in the bigs tho

 

[Darth Cheney]

It's a shame he couldn't get a no trade clause or better yet a clause that gives him a bonus if traded - that would have been perfect - probably not that common in the bigs tho

They also might have told him that signing a front office friendly deal doesn't guarantee a lifetime career with the RedSox in which case caveat emptor. But if they fed him lines on how he'll be a intergal part of the rotation for the rest of his career for doing this then they did him wrong.

 

[shuke]

HR race:

Arroyo 1

Pena 0

 

[jafo]

HR race:

Arroyo 1

Pena 0

Wily Mo might even end up with more strikeouts than Arroyo throws...

 

[Raider Nation]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good. Pena is painful to watch at the plate. Looked like a little-leaguer last night. Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

 

[wilked]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good. Pena is painful to watch at the plate. Looked like a little-leaguer last night. Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

 

[NY/NJMFDIVER]

Finally, it bothers me that they kind of screwed him in regards to the hometown discount.  Don't expect any player to give the Sox a home town discount anymore.

I agree that the Sox took advantage of the situation, but let's be honest here - Arroyo played the fool when he took a hometown discount. Here's a guy who was on the trading block as it was - then he takes a lower salary, which only increases his trade value. Once he signed that contract, was there ever any doubt that he'd be traded at some point this season? It was just an idiotic move on his part. His agent advised him against it, and his common sense should've done the same.

I'm not saying you are doing it..... but with some people the players cannot win. If they ask for more money, become a hired gun, or complain about their salary they are greedy, selfish, not loyal and a detriment to the game. If they take less money to help the team out, or because they like the situation they are in..... they are dumb. Loyalty works both ways and the Sox office looks classless in this one. ( Even though their fans might not care when Willy Moe goes 35/100/.280 this year)

Let's face facts: fans are generally extremely hypocritical. They plead for loyalty, but in all but the most extreme situations, they are remarkably disloyal. Yankees fans booed Jeter. Sox fans booed Foulke. There are a million other examples.

When did Yankee fans boo Jeter?

 

[jafo]

HR race:

Arroyo 2

Pena 0

 

[PizzaDeliveryGuy]

HR race:

Arroyo 2

Pena 0

Arroyo 2 for 2 w/ 2HRs and a walk

 

[Capella]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good.  Pena is painful to watch at the plate.  Looked like a little-leaguer last night.  Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

This is hilarious coming from a guy who is part of the fanbase that floods this forum with new threads every time somebody on the team so much as gets a beej."Ortiz got serviced by a GREAT looking spanish chick who looked JUST like the same girl that Manny was tagging last year."

 

[MelvinTScupper]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good. Pena is painful to watch at the plate. Looked like a little-leaguer last night. Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

This is hilarious coming from a guy who is part of the fanbase that floods this forum with new threads every time somebody on the team so much as gets a beej."Ortiz got serviced by a GREAT looking spanish chick who looked JUST like the same girl that Manny was tagging last year."

 

[shuke]

HR race:

Arroyo 2

Pena 0

 

[shuke]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good.  Pena is painful to watch at the plate.  Looked like a little-leaguer last night.  Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

This is hilarious coming from a guy who is part of the fanbase that floods this forum with new threads every time somebody on the team so much as gets a beej."Ortiz got serviced by a GREAT looking spanish chick who looked JUST like the same girl that Manny was tagging last year."

 

[wilked]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good.  Pena is painful to watch at the plate.  Looked like a little-leaguer last night.  Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

This is hilarious coming from a guy who is part of the fanbase that floods this forum with new threads every time somebody on the team so much as gets a beej."Ortiz got serviced by a GREAT looking spanish chick who looked JUST like the same girl that Manny was tagging last year."

yes, please hold me responsible for their actions

 

[Kirby]

Reds are some homerun hittin bastards today!

 

[[icon]]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good. Pena is painful to watch at the plate. Looked like a little-leaguer last night. Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

This is hilarious coming from a guy who is part of the fanbase that floods this forum with new threads every time somebody on the team so much as gets a beej."Ortiz got serviced by a GREAT looking spanish chick who looked JUST like the same girl that Manny was tagging last year."

Good call.. we don't anything bumping those clique threads with obscure references by a bunch of grown men to an internet chat room.

 

[Mr. Pickles]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good. Pena is painful to watch at the plate. Looked like a little-leaguer last night. Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

This is hilarious coming from a guy who is part of the fanbase that floods this forum with new threads every time somebody on the team so much as gets a beej."Ortiz got serviced by a GREAT looking spanish chick who looked JUST like the same girl that Manny was tagging last year."

yes, please hold me responsible for their actions

don't listen to the haters, dan.

 

[eroom1369]

5 Hr's (1 granny). I think Arroyo will get it done now.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good. Pena is painful to watch at the plate. Looked like a little-leaguer last night. Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

This is hilarious coming from a guy who is part of the fanbase that floods this forum with new threads every time somebody on the team so much as gets a beej."Ortiz got serviced by a GREAT looking spanish chick who looked JUST like the same girl that Manny was tagging last year."

Good call.. we don't anything bumping those clique threads with obscure references by a bunch of grown men to an internet chat room.

No doubt, might get in the way of your stapler mail-a-thon!

 

[Capella]

]

One week in, Cincinnati's side of the deal is looking good.  Pena is painful to watch at the plate.  Looked like a little-leaguer last night.  Completely overmatched by Chen twice -- K'd swinging both times.

can't wait for next week's update...

This is hilarious coming from a guy who is part of the fanbase that floods this forum with new threads every time somebody on the team so much as gets a beej."Ortiz got serviced by a GREAT looking spanish chick who looked JUST like the same girl that Manny was tagging last year."

Good call.. we don't anything bumping those clique threads with obscure references by a bunch of grown men to an internet chat room.

GREAT post. I can't wait to see more updates on HOW Adam Stern DID today.

 

[Tarkin]

Reds are some homerun hittin bastards today!

 

[WampusCat43]

We're keeping this guy.

 

[shuke]

We're keeping this guy.

 

[Tarkin]

Any chance all of my pro teams will make the playoffs?

Bengals

Suns

Devils

Reds

 

[NY/NJMFDIVER]

Any chance all of my pro teams will make the playoffs?

Bengals

Suns

Devils

Reds

I'll spare you the suspense, no.

 

[WampusCat43]

Arroyo - 1 hit shutout through six so far today.

 

[jafo]

Arroyo - 1 hit shutout through six so far today.

I was waiting for this thread to get bumped today. Best Reds trade in recent years.

 

[jafo]

reds management are idiots.

 

[blenderfrog]

Arroyo - 1 hit shutout through six so far today. 

I was waiting for this thread to get bumped today. Best Reds trade in recent years.

Finally got a decent starter!

 

[Kirby]

Arroyo - 1 hit shutout through six so far today. 

I was waiting for this thread to get bumped today. Best Reds trade in recent years.

Finally got a decent starter!

Paul Wilson is pitching in Dayton tomorrow.. it will be nice to have him back healthy.

 

[On The Rocks]

Arroyo - 1 hit shutout through six so far today. 

I was waiting for this thread to get bumped today. Best Reds trade in recent years.

Finally got a decent starter!

Paul Wilson is pitching in Dayton tomorrow.. it will be nice to have him back healthy.

why? there is no shortage of below average pitchers in the Reds rotation.

 

[shuke]

reds management are idiots.

 

[Kirby]

Arroyo - 1 hit shutout through six so far today. 

I was waiting for this thread to get bumped today. Best Reds trade in recent years.

Finally got a decent starter!

Paul Wilson is pitching in Dayton tomorrow.. it will be nice to have him back healthy.

why? there is no shortage of below average pitchers in the Reds rotation.

He'd be the 3rd best on the team... all they need is someone with an ERA below 5.