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Reggie Bush's Swelling Knee (1 Viewer)

whodeywhodey

Footballguy
For some reason this news hasn't really been discussed. It will be.

He tore his PCL in this knee in 2007. Unlike some ligaments the PCL and ACL do not heal after a complete tear. In other words if his PCL is still torn this could be big trouble for Bush. In any event a swollen knee is BIG trouble for a RB --- see McGahee's recent surgery.

I'm targeting Thomas in just about any draft I can get him in. I have been getting him anywhere from round 10 to round 15.

He is obviously a must have handcuff for RBush owners.

The Link

Reggie Bush probably won't play in Saturday night's preseason game against the Houston Texans, Coach Sean Payton said. Bush has had some swelling in his left knee, which kept him out of practice on Thursday for the second time this week. But Bush didn't seem concerned.
 
He says it's just from running and cutting a lot in practice and that if it was a regular-season game it wouldn't hold him out.

:lmao:

Proceed with caution, I guess.

 
He says it's just from running and cutting a lot in practice and that if it was a regular-season game it wouldn't hold him out.:lmao:Proceed with caution, I guess.
Sure he says that but a swollen knee is never normal. There are hundreds of other RBs in the NFL that practice and play that never get swollen knees. A swollen knee is a sign that inside there is damage.
 
He says it's just from running and cutting a lot in practice and that if it was a regular-season game it wouldn't hold him out.:shrug:Proceed with caution, I guess.
Sure he says that but a swollen knee is never normal. There are hundreds of other RBs in the NFL that practice and play that never get swollen knees. A swollen knee is a sign that inside there is damage.
Brian Westbrook was on Sirius NFL this week and he said that he has played with some sort of swelling in his knee for years and as long as he gets proper treatment during the week its not an issue.
 
Sure he says that but a swollen knee is never normal. There are hundreds of other RBs in the NFL that practice and play that never get swollen knees. A swollen knee is a sign that inside there is damage.
My knee swells up from walking the golf course and I've never injured it. :lol: (of course, I'm also older than dirt)
 
Ok, I may be overstating that it never happens. But it has to be cause for concern especially since we know that he tore the PCL and did not have it repaired.

 
Ok, I may be overstating that it never happens. But it has to be cause for concern especially since we know that he tore the PCL and did not have it repaired.
concerns me a little as well. was hoping to get him in the 3rd, but making me think twice. colston has a knee issue of swelling as well.guess we will know more if they can play a preseason game and see the results.
 
He says it's just from running and cutting a lot in practice and that if it was a regular-season game it wouldn't hold him out.:confused:Proceed with caution, I guess.
Sure he says that but a swollen knee is never normal. There are hundreds of other RBs in the NFL that practice and play that never get swollen knees. A swollen knee is a sign that inside there is damage.
Brian Westbrook was on Sirius NFL this week and he said that he has played with some sort of swelling in his knee for years and as long as he gets proper treatment during the week its not an issue.
He has very little cartilidge. That can be managed. He knows what it is.What is the cause of Reggie's swelling?
 
He says it's just from running and cutting a lot in practice and that if it was a regular-season game it wouldn't hold him out.:mellow:Proceed with caution, I guess.
Sure he says that but a swollen knee is never normal. There are hundreds of other RBs in the NFL that practice and play that never get swollen knees. A swollen knee is a sign that inside there is damage.
Brian Westbrook was on Sirius NFL this week and he said that he has played with some sort of swelling in his knee for years and as long as he gets proper treatment during the week its not an issue.
He has very little cartilidge. That can be managed. He knows what it is.What is the cause of Reggie's swelling?
Torn/missing PCL most likely.
 
Of course torn or missing PCL's can still be played with unlike ACL's. PCL's prevent the tibia bone from gliding back on the femur. When you are stopping and cutting ACL's get all the work. Just because a PCL is torn or missing isnt a huge concern in the immediate future. It would in the long run just because the joint is not as stable as the if it were there or more taut. That would lead to meniscal damage---down the road, and that is usaully cleaned up with arthroscopic knee surgery in the offseason.

 
It drops Bush's value on my charts, I was not high on him to begin with. I think his value is really at best in PPR leagues but otherwise he is not much of a runner so far.

Swelling in the knee could be a lot of things and so far Bush has not proven he can keep a full work load up so it might be time to drop him down a little on the rankings.

 
I'd be less concerned about it if he hadn't looked so tentative running in the first preseason game. Granted, it's just a preseason game and he only had a few carries but he looked like the Reggie Bush of last season and not the assertive, explosive Reggie Bush that we saw in the final several games of his rookie season.

I don't think he's a good value pick in non-PPR leagues. In PPR leagues he keeps falling to the end of the second round in most of the drafts I've seen. If you're picking there I think you're debating between Bush, a stud WR or a stud QB. Not long ago, I thought Bush was the easy call there. Now I'm not so sure.

 
So what does this do to Pierre's value? A lot of discussion about Bush but not much about who would replace him.

I think even before this injury they would have split the carries about 60(Bush)/40(Thomas). Now I think it will have to be about 50/50 or even more to Thomas in order to keep Bush healthy enough for the playoffs.

This team's offense is going to be good. And to get the guy who might have 50% or more of the carries this year in the 10-15 round range is just fantastic.

He ranks up there with MoMo and Hightower as guys who have nothing but upside based on their ADP, imo.

 
So what does this do to Pierre's value? A lot of discussion about Bush but not much about who would replace him.

I think even before this injury they would have split the carries about 60(Bush)/40(Thomas). Now I think it will have to be about 50/50 or even more to Thomas in order to keep Bush healthy enough for the playoffs.

This team's offense is going to be good. And to get the guy who might have 50% or more of the carries this year in the 10-15 round range is just fantastic.

He ranks up there with MoMo and Hightower as guys who have nothing but upside based on their ADP, imo.
Deuce McAllister is the #2 RB, not Thomas.
 
So what does this do to Pierre's value? A lot of discussion about Bush but not much about who would replace him.

I think even before this injury they would have split the carries about 60(Bush)/40(Thomas). Now I think it will have to be about 50/50 or even more to Thomas in order to keep Bush healthy enough for the playoffs.

This team's offense is going to be good. And to get the guy who might have 50% or more of the carries this year in the 10-15 round range is just fantastic.

He ranks up there with MoMo and Hightower as guys who have nothing but upside based on their ADP, imo.
Deuce McAllister is the #2 RB, not Thomas.
For now. I don't think Deuce is the #2 by midseason.
 
Deuce McAllister is the #2 RB, not Thomas.
Thomas will be the #2 RB. Deuce is coming off an ACL repair on one knee AND microfracture surgery on the other.Here is what another website was saying even before the Bush injury became known:
New Orleans SaintsCoach: Sean Payton| Average Rushes/Year: 382Projected 2008 Carries: 385This is a pass-first team that must play from ahead to get high rushing totals. With Deuce McAllister out last year, their running backs had 62 fewer rushes than the year prior. Even if Deuce isn't 100% this season, they should be more balanced after Drew Brees attempted the third-most passes in NFL history.Reggie Bush: 175Pierre Thomas: 105Deuce McAllister: 70Aaron Stecker: 35No one expects Deuce McAllister to stay healthy for long, assuming he even makes the opening week roster. This would be a career high in rushes for Bush by 20, but he's not going to top 200. That leaves a big role for super sleeper Thomas. Stecker is useful in case of emergency.
 
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So what does this do to Pierre's value? A lot of discussion about Bush but not much about who would replace him.

I think even before this injury they would have split the carries about 60(Bush)/40(Thomas). Now I think it will have to be about 50/50 or even more to Thomas in order to keep Bush healthy enough for the playoffs.

This team's offense is going to be good. And to get the guy who might have 50% or more of the carries this year in the 10-15 round range is just fantastic.

He ranks up there with MoMo and Hightower as guys who have nothing but upside based on their ADP, imo.
Deuce McAllister is the #2 RB until he gets hurt in Week 3
Fixed. :sarcasm:
 
Hey Anthony here are some links for you about Deuce and the mountain that he needs to climb at the age of 30 to even get back on the field.

Link

Coming back from his second torn ACL injury in three seasons - one on each knee - and a microfracture procedure on the right knee he injured in 2005, his chances of being a leading NFL running back aren't exactly a given.
 
With the Bush & McAllister bashing, perhaps value will present itself.

Thomas and Stecker are just good handcuff candidates to me.

I also like handcuffs Booker, Williams, and a couple Jacksons.

 
With the Bush & McAllister bashing, perhaps value will present itself.Thomas and Stecker are just good handcuff candidates to me.I also like handcuffs Booker, Williams, and a couple Jacksons.
Bush basing? No, just concerned.Deuce bashing? Absolutely. He has 2 surgically repaired ACLs plus microfracture surgery and he is over 30. I'm staying away this year.
 
He says it's just from running and cutting a lot in practice and that if it was a regular-season game it wouldn't hold him out.:bag:Proceed with caution, I guess.
Sure he says that but a swollen knee is never normal. There are hundreds of other RBs in the NFL that practice and play that never get swollen knees. A swollen knee is a sign that inside there is damage.
I would clarify damage vs. inflammation. Not all knee inflamation requires surgery until it becomes chronic; but agreed, people should watch closely.
 
I thought he looked pretty explosive tonight. Maybe it's just me, but he also looks like he may have gained a little weight.

 
Of course torn or missing PCL's can still be played with unlike ACL's. PCL's prevent the tibia bone from gliding back on the femur. When you are stopping and cutting ACL's get all the work. Just because a PCL is torn or missing isnt a huge concern in the immediate future. It would in the long run just because the joint is not as stable as the if it were there or more taut. That would lead to meniscal damage---down the road, and that is usaully cleaned up with arthroscopic knee surgery in the offseason.
Funny to see Westbrook mentioned in this thread along with the bolder comment above. Westbrook is missing an ACL in one knee.
 
Of course torn or missing PCL's can still be played with unlike ACL's. PCL's prevent the tibia bone from gliding back on the femur. When you are stopping and cutting ACL's get all the work. Just because a PCL is torn or missing isnt a huge concern in the immediate future. It would in the long run just because the joint is not as stable as the if it were there or more taut. That would lead to meniscal damage---down the road, and that is usaully cleaned up with arthroscopic knee surgery in the offseason.
Funny to see Westbrook mentioned in this thread along with the bolder comment above. Westbrook is missing an ACL in one knee.
Huh? Where did you get this information from?
 
Being with Kim Kardashian is a bigger concern to me.

Why can't he find a nice, wholesome big booty girl?

(and leave Kim for me)

:shrug:

 
whodeywhodey said:
Pictus Cat said:
With the Bush & McAllister bashing, perhaps value will present itself.Thomas and Stecker are just good handcuff candidates to me.I also like handcuffs Booker, Williams, and a couple Jacksons.
Bush basing? No, just concerned.Deuce bashing? Absolutely. He has 2 surgically repaired ACLs plus microfracture surgery and he is over 30. I'm staying away this year.
Would you take Deuce with your last pick? What is his value if he stays healthy? Would you take Pierre Thomas before Duece?Perhaps a tricky play would be to take them both close to eachother.At some point that combo will represent enough value to warrant two fantasy roster spots.Switching gears, Bush is a unique talent. Having Duece and Pierre to grind it out allows him to be used the way he should be. Will NO have a potent enough offense to support two fantasy RBs? If Bush can reach 100 receptions, 1000 yds Recieving and 500 - 1000 Rushing, that's one. If Duece/Pierre can play the :bus: role, that's could be two.I think understanding there roles and who would take on that role if someone gets hurt andhow well they would do is important.Pierre would fill in nicely for Duece.Stecker was sufficient filling in for Bush.Bush & Duece are ideal though.I thank the posters that help us understand injuries too.Combine that with understanding NO offense, and some value might present itself.Just because a player can barely get up on Mondaydoesn't mean he can't be spectacular on Sunday.
 
So what does this do to Pierre's value? A lot of discussion about Bush but not much about who would replace him.

I think even before this injury they would have split the carries about 60(Bush)/40(Thomas). Now I think it will have to be about 50/50 or even more to Thomas in order to keep Bush healthy enough for the playoffs.

This team's offense is going to be good. And to get the guy who might have 50% or more of the carries this year in the 10-15 round range is just fantastic.

He ranks up there with MoMo and Hightower as guys who have nothing but upside based on their ADP, imo.
Deuce McAllister is the #2 RB, not Thomas.
The question is whether Thomas is backing up both Deuce and Bush. As Deuce is more likely the one who will show up needing a replacement, that plus any Bush problems moves Thomas a little further from the end of the bench. In any case he's a double handcuff and you don't have room on your roster for too many of those. It's not like someone who is vying to win the starting job.
 
I thought he looked pretty explosive tonight. Maybe it's just me, but he also looks like he may have gained a little weight.
I love it when people talk to themselves -- the ultimate selfishness.Actually, I'm not sure I'm interested in what the antecedent to "he" is in this posting.
 
I thought he looked pretty explosive tonight. Maybe it's just me, but he also looks like he may have gained a little weight.
I love it when people talk to themselves -- the ultimate selfishness.Actually, I'm not sure I'm interested in what the antecedent to "he" is in this posting.
Wrong board, guy.
See, I see it just the opposite. But that's because I would say WHO I thought was pretty explosive. There were at least 5 backs being discussed. So a post about "he" should be on ItThem.com instead of FootballGuys.com.You guys seen the movie Idiocracy? Ah, you wouldn't understand.
 
Bush is probably the most overrated real-time football player in the NFL, IMO. He produces in FF (PPR) because of his catches, but if I owned him, I'd sell at the first chance of a good return. His lack of NFL production will catch up to him at some point. Maybe Thomas passes him, maybe they draft a top RB, but unless he significantly improves his play (& I'm not counting on it), not only will he fall out of favor with the Saints, he'll eventually fall out of FF graces, as well.

He's got to up his average per carry/catch. Those numbers aren't nearly good enough. Despite his lofty draft status & athleticism, he simply might not be a good football player.

 
I thought he looked pretty explosive tonight. Maybe it's just me, but he also looks like he may have gained a little weight.
I love it when people talk to themselves -- the ultimate selfishness.Actually, I'm not sure I'm interested in what the antecedent to "he" is in this posting.
Wrong board, guy.
See, I see it just the opposite. But that's because I would say WHO I thought was pretty explosive. There were at least 5 backs being discussed. So a post about "he" should be on ItThem.com instead of FootballGuys.com.You guys seen the movie Idiocracy? Ah, you wouldn't understand.
Turn it way down if you want to keep posting here. TIA.J
 
See, I see it just the opposite. But that's because I would say WHO I thought was pretty explosive. There were at least 5 backs being discussed. So a post about "he" should be on ItThem.com instead of FootballGuys.com.You guys seen the movie Idiocracy? Ah, you wouldn't understand.
Please never post again.
 
Bush didn't seem to have any problem with his knee when he hurdled that dude going into the endzone last night.

 
Of course torn or missing PCL's can still be played with unlike ACL's. PCL's prevent the tibia bone from gliding back on the femur. When you are stopping and cutting ACL's get all the work. Just because a PCL is torn or missing isnt a huge concern in the immediate future. It would in the long run just because the joint is not as stable as the if it were there or more taut. That would lead to meniscal damage---down the road, and that is usaully cleaned up with arthroscopic knee surgery in the offseason.
Funny to see Westbrook mentioned in this thread along with the bolder comment above. Westbrook is missing an ACL in one knee.
Huh? Where did you get this information from?
Predraft scouting. There was also a thread here a while back... I think about Thurman Thomas that listed a number of players who played without an ACL.
 
QUOTE (gianmarco @ Aug 17 2008, 09:20 AM) QUOTE (switz @ Aug 17 2008, 08:02 AM) QUOTE (bolldpt @ Aug 16 2008, 11:31 AM) Of course torn or missing PCL's can still be played with unlike ACL's. PCL's prevent the tibia bone from gliding back on the femur. When you are stopping and cutting ACL's get all the work. Just because a PCL is torn or missing isnt a huge concern in the immediate future. It would in the long run just because the joint is not as stable as the if it were there or more taut. That would lead to meniscal damage---down the road, and that is usaully cleaned up with arthroscopic knee surgery in the offseason.Funny to see Westbrook mentioned in this thread along with the bolder comment above. Westbrook is missing an ACL in one knee.Huh? Where did you get this information from?Predraft scouting. There was also a thread here a while back... I think about Thurman Thomas that listed a number of players who played without an ACL.
Hmmm never knew he had a missing ACL!!! Thats almost unheard of in elite sport athletes due to extreme cutting motions. Decleration is very difficult without an ACL. The average joe (bryant) could live without one but I would find it darn near impossible with NFL players. Personal opinion (if that is true) Westbrooks knee is on borrowed time. Find me a link if you can Switz. I really would be interested in seeing it. Will look on my end too.
 
QUOTE (gianmarco @ Aug 17 2008, 09:20 AM) QUOTE (switz @ Aug 17 2008, 08:02 AM) QUOTE (bolldpt @ Aug 16 2008, 11:31 AM) Of course torn or missing PCL's can still be played with unlike ACL's. PCL's prevent the tibia bone from gliding back on the femur. When you are stopping and cutting ACL's get all the work. Just because a PCL is torn or missing isnt a huge concern in the immediate future. It would in the long run just because the joint is not as stable as the if it were there or more taut. That would lead to meniscal damage---down the road, and that is usaully cleaned up with arthroscopic knee surgery in the offseason.Funny to see Westbrook mentioned in this thread along with the bolder comment above. Westbrook is missing an ACL in one knee.Huh? Where did you get this information from?Predraft scouting. There was also a thread here a while back... I think about Thurman Thomas that listed a number of players who played without an ACL.
Hmmm never knew he had a missing ACL!!! Thats almost unheard of in elite sport athletes due to extreme cutting motions. Decleration is very difficult without an ACL. The average joe (bryant) could live without one but I would find it darn near impossible with NFL players. Personal opinion (if that is true) Westbrooks knee is on borrowed time. Find me a link if you can Switz. I really would be interested in seeing it. Will look on my end too.
No way that he has a missing ACL. PCL maybe but without an ACL the knee would simply be way too unstable. And no doctor in their right mind would sign-off on a player who was missing an ACL.
 
oh i whole heartily agree. I cant think of a single ortho doc that i work with would ever let a player go out and play without one. Deceleration is fundemental in sports and you need an acl to help you with that.

 
Don't know this to be true but Hines Ward's wiki page says:

When he came out of college it was discovered that Ward was missing an ACL in his left knee, which he lost during a bicycle accident during childhood.[1][2] This may well have affected his position in the NFL draft. He received his bachelor's degree in consumer economics from UGA, where he became a member of Phi Beta Sigma Fraternity.
J
 
Just like Jamal Anderson and Jamal Lewis and all the other players who have suffered season-ending knee injuries in 2001, Carolina Panthers cornerback Jimmy Hitchcock also has serious problems with his anterior cruciate ligaments.

He doesn't have any.

Yes indeed, while it can take some players two years to come back from an ACL tear (next up on VH-1's Where Are They Now? ... former NFL MVP Terrell Davis) Hitchcock, 30, has carved out a nice career for himself -- sans ACLs.

"This is extraordinary and unique," says Panthers strength and conditioning coach Jerry Simmons. "I haven't come across anything like this in my 14 years in the NFL. And if I hadn't actually seen it firsthand, I'd say to you, 'Come on, give me a break, there's no way this could be true.' To be honest, I really don't understand it."

Those of us unfortunate souls who have blown out a knee (for me, it ended a collegiate wrestling career that was remarkable only for its unremarkableness) know that when an ACL goes it makes a loud, sickening sort of knuckle-cracking pop which leaves you with the distinct feeling that the only thing holding your leg together is skin.

Now, imagine having that feeling in both legs and then going out and covering Rams wideout Torry Holt -- on the Panthers' sawdust field no less.

Hitchcock first heard that telltale sound and felt that wobble when he was a sophomore in high school in Concord, N.C. He rehabbed his right knee without the benefit of surgery, and was back on the field a year later when he blew out his left knee while celebrating after a blocked punt.

"We just didn't have the money or the medical insurance," says the 5'10", 190-pound Hitchcock. "We just couldn't afford to fix 'em. Sometimes we underestimate the body's ability to adapt. I just think of it this way: What did people do before there was knee surgery?"

Well, if they were anything like Hitchcock, in order to stabilize their knee joints they developed the kind of quad muscles that would make Arnold wear long pants. "Plus," Hitchcock says with a straight face, "all the arthritis in there helps hold 'em together."

Then they would build up an incredible tolerance for pain. "Some days they don't hurt at all," says Hitchcock, "and some days the pain is excruciating."

Then they'd go on with their careers as if nothing had ever happened. (And in the process make the rest of us feel like surgically-repaired crybabies.)

"All these guys who have hurt their knees recently, in the back of their minds they're thinking, 'Can I come back all the way or have I lost that little edge that made me special?' " says Simmons. "Well, those guys should point to Jimmy and think, 'Hell yeah I can come back. My situation may be bad, but heck, at least I've got an ACL.' "

Hitchcock not only earned a scholarship to North Carolina, in 1995 he was projected as the top cornerback in the NFL draft. That is, until doctors got a look at his knees and Hitchcock developed a severe case of draft-day vertigo, falling all the way to the Patriots in the third round.

In 1997 he picked off a Dan Marino pass and returned it 100 yards for a TD. The following year he swiped a career-high seven passes and returned three of those to the hiz-ouse, furthering his rep as a cover guy who can get you as many big plays as he gives up. After a short stint with the Vikes, Hitchcock signed with Carolina where he has helped fill the void left by the departure of Eric Davis. Thus far in 2001, Hitchcock already has 14 tackles and a pick, playing mostly on passing downs.

"I think of my knee like a door," says Hitchcock, who draws strength, and old family herbal remedies, from his gramma Roberta. "The hinges at the top and the bottom are gone and the middle hinge is the only thing holding the whole door together. I've been lucky to be able to use that door for a long time but sooner or later that one hinge is gonna give way and pop out."

Eventually Hitchcock will probably need two-for-one knee replacement surgery. But he has no intention of getting his wheels re-wired until he's retired. Especially after the nasty spill he took in training camp this year while covering a tight end.

"I'm pretty sure that would have been an ACL tear," he says. "That is ... if I had an ACL to tear."

David Fleming is a senior writer for ESPN The Magazine.

 
Don't know this to be true but Hines Ward's wiki page says:

When he came out of college it was discovered that Ward was missing an ACL in his left knee, which he lost during a bicycle accident during childhood.[1][2] This may well have affected his position in the NFL draft. He received his bachelor's degree in consumer economics from UGA, where he became a member of Phi Beta Sigma Fraternity.
J
It's not true. Hines was a marketing major.
 

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