Rumor: Mega-deal between 3 teams... (1 Viewer)

[Z-Dog]

Typical Jets fan, always dreamin' of something..

Whatever fella. I posted this as a rumor, not a dream scenario. I'd be pleased if we traded down to #7 and snatched Davis, Hawk, or Ngata. We've been having the same discussions on our site about the details and reliability of this Bongo fella. Like here, some think he's completely full of crap, others are listening. I posted it here because, either way it's been interesting. I believe this trade or some permutation of it is plausible because I believe in the basic tenets it's founded upon:

1. Oakland wants Leinart.

2. The Saints want Mario or D'Brick.

3. Tennessee wants one of the top-3 QBs but, isn't too concerned which one and, given that, would like to possibly trade down from 3 to get one of them + picks/players.

4. The Jets want Mario or to trade down. They're not taking a QB. They don't view Cutler or Young as good values at #4 and Leinart will be gone at #4.

5. Jets are open to moving Dewayne Robertson.

I've never heard of a team being truly indifferent between a few players. You don't spend all that time and money evaluating talent to come away with a 'aw heck, I'll take whichever guy falls to me'. If Tennessee truly felt that way, they could trade all the way down to 10 and take whichever QB was left at that spot.Actually, everything we know about Tennessee is that there are competing voices within the organization advocating for different QBs. To say that the franchise is ultimately indifferent as to which they select is stupid.

 

[Z-Dog]

Typical Jets fan, always dreamin' of something..

5. Jets are open to moving Dewayne Robertson.

News flash...he's not near what he was projected to be...why would anyone give anything worth of value for him? I believe he even has a hefty salary to boot.I have to agree that DREAMING would qualify if you or anyone else thinks Robertson would get a high draft pick in return.

Robertson has a medical prob and unfortunately he is likely to have a short career. I can't recall what. A degenerative prob in his knee? back?

Robertson has a degenerative knee condition, but it is not clear to what extent it will affect him - some players are able to play for years despite such conditions. Regardless, my understanding is that Robertson can't be traded b/c of horrific cap implications.

 

[smcindoe]

You guys are no fun.

If it's made up, give him credit -- at least he's putting some effort into it.

Much better than the usual "rumors" (i.e. "do you think [my team] will give up [four crappy guys with bad contracts] to get [uber-stud player who would never be available]? Maybe we could throw in a sixth round pick to make it work!").

 

[freddyg]

Robertson has a degenerative knee condition, but it is not clear to what extent it will affect him - some players are able to play for years despite such conditions. Regardless, my understanding is that Robertson can't be traded b/c of horrific cap implications.

Not only is he tradeable, he's cuttable before June 1st. Not saying the Jets would cut him but, the scenario is would certainly not be "horrific" and could be in the teams long term interest. Personally, I like him and think he could play well as our NT but he's making a TON of money over the next few years. He's due a 2.8mil roster bonus on June 1 and so the trade or cut would have to occur before then.

 

[*****]

I'll play, another way to make the Condon Conspiracy happen would be to have Oakland trade up and everyone else agree to trade down one spot (for compensation).

1. Hou - Bush

2. Oak - Leinart

3. NO - Mario

4. Tenn - Young/Cutler

5. NYJ - Brick

6/7. GB/SF - Hawk, Davis, etc.

In that event, everyone gets the player they want, almost all of the teams save a little $$ by getting their guy at a lower draft slot and some picks/players move around as well.

No way this happens, but if we use our imaginations, hypothetical trades like this can be fun to think up. Oakland would have to give up a mint to get everyone else to play along.

 

[Z-Dog]

Robertson has a degenerative knee condition, but it is not clear to what extent it will affect him - some players are able to play for years despite such conditions. Regardless, my understanding is that Robertson can't be traded b/c of horrific cap implications.

Not only is he tradeable, he's cuttable before June 1st. Not saying the Jets would cut him but, the scenario is would certainly not be "horrific" and could be in the teams long term interest. Personally, I like him and think he could play well as our NT but he's making a TON of money over the next few years. He's due a 2.8mil roster bonus on June 1 and so the trade or cut would have to occur before then.

I once looked into his contract, and as I recall, his cap hit is like $9 million if he is cut or traded link

 

[freddyg]

Robertson has a degenerative knee condition, but it is not clear to what extent it will affect him - some players are able to play for years despite such conditions. Regardless, my understanding is that Robertson can't be traded b/c of horrific cap implications.

Not only is he tradeable, he's cuttable before June 1st. Not saying the Jets would cut him but, the scenario is would certainly not be "horrific" and could be in the teams long term interest. Personally, I like him and think he could play well as our NT but he's making a TON of money over the next few years. He's due a 2.8mil roster bonus on June 1 and so the trade or cut would have to occur before then.

I once looked into his contract, and as I recall, his cap hit is like $9 million if he is cut or traded link

It's 9mil, less the roster bonus of 2.8mil on June 1st. 6.2mil(4.6mil in base, 1.6mil in signing bonus).Obviously, trading him would be the most likely option. A team like NO could take that on.

All I'm saying is that those aren't horrific numbers for the Jets considering his role right now is up in the air and his compensation only goes higher the next couple of years.

Don't dismiss that the Jets would move him...that's all I'm saying.

 

[Z-Dog]

When trading a player, the original team takes the same cap hit as if they were cutting him. The new team is responsible only for the remaining unpaid salaries and bonuses. Ferguson has enormous unpaid salaries remaining, and would be a giant cap hit on the Jets. That makes him a poor choice to be cut or traded this year.

 

[freddyg]

When trading a player, the original team takes the same cap hit as if they were cutting him. The new team is responsible only for the remaining unpaid salaries and bonuses. Ferguson has enormous unpaid salaries remaining, and would be a giant cap hit on the Jets. That makes him a poor choice to be cut or traded this year.

If he were traded pre June 1 the cap hit would be 6.2mil...You agree?

 

[LawFitz]

And why would the Raiders want noodle arm Lienart to run their new (old) vertical stretch offense?

Doesn't Al have a penchant for strong-armed QBs?

If this deal goes through, I will be SHOCKED.

The Raiders will stay put and take either Davis or Justice. Or if the do trade up it will be for Mario.

 

[Raiders Fan]

And why would the Raiders want noodle arm Lienart to run their new (old) vertical stretch offense?

Doesn't Al have a penchant for strong-armed QBs?

If this deal goes through, I will be SHOCKED.

The Raiders will stay put and take either Davis or Justice. Or if the do trade up it will be for Mario.

Agreed.. Raiders more pressing needs are defense. I would see them only moving up to get Mario.

 

[-OZ-]

And why would the Raiders want noodle arm Lienart to run their new (old) vertical stretch offense?

Doesn't Al have a penchant for strong-armed QBs?

If this deal goes through, I will be SHOCKED.

The Raiders will stay put and take either Davis or Justice. Or if the do trade up it will be for Mario.

Agreed.. Raiders more pressing needs are defense. I would see them only moving up to get Mario.

Add Hawk, and I agree.

 

[Z-Dog]

When trading a player, the original team takes the same cap hit as if they were cutting him. The new team is responsible only for the remaining unpaid salaries and bonuses. Ferguson has enormous unpaid salaries remaining, and would be a giant cap hit on the Jets. That makes him a poor choice to be cut or traded this year.

If he were traded pre June 1 the cap hit would be 6.2mil...You agree?

Dewayne Robertson's contract: Signing bonus:

$3,000,000.

Base salaries:

$1,746,000 (2003);

$2,182,000 (2004, plus $10,000,000 option bonus);

$2,618,000 (2005);

$3,054,000 (2006);

$3,491,000 (2007);

$3,927,000 (2008);

$1,600,000 (2009).

Notes: If the Jets exercise the $10,000,000 option payment in 2004, the base salaries are reduced to

$516,250 (2004);

$952,000 (2005);

$1,388,000 (2006);

$1,450,000 (2007).

There are escalators each season 2006-2009. Total: 7 years, $24,579,250, with potential for 7 years, $54,000,000.

The Jets did exercise the option bonus, which means as follows:

$3 million/7 ~ $430k

Three years have gone by, which means the remaining bonus is 4*$430k, which is about $1.71 million.

Next, we have an option bonus of $10 million. Only two years have gone by for that bonus, meaning 4 years remains. That works out to about $6.7 million.

$1.71 million + $6.7 million = about $8.4 million that will hit the cap if he's cut before 6/1.

If he's cut after 6/1, only one year worth of amoritzation from both bonuses will count this year, which is $430k + $1.67, or about $2 million, and the net cap impact for this year will be less than that b/c his $1.38 million salary will come off the books. However, the following year, you wind up with $6.4 million of dead money that will hit all at once.

If the Jets trade him during the draft, it's a $8.4 million - $1.38 or about $7 million cap hit this year. If the Jets cut him or trade him after 6/1, it's about $600k net this year, and $6.4 million next year. To me, that's horrific. As for his remaining salaries, they are palatable for this year and next year.

 

[Raiders Fan]

And why would the Raiders want noodle arm Lienart to run their new (old) vertical stretch offense?

Doesn't Al have a penchant for strong-armed QBs?

If this deal goes through, I will be SHOCKED.

The Raiders will stay put and take either Davis or Justice.  Or if the do trade up it will be for Mario.

Agreed.. Raiders more pressing needs are defense. I would see them only moving up to get Mario.

I am not sure they would move UP to get hawk.. Mario I see as the only guy that they should move up for.

 

[Iron_Far]

All of this became invalid due to the preposterous proclamation of Al Davis' love for chopstick-arms Leinart.

Say what you will about Davis, but the man knows TRUE talent, and will take Vince Young 300 times before he even touches Leinart.

...And for all of you east coast ppl that equate Northern Cali with SoCal.

Leinart might be hot ish in LA and the surrounding areas, but his star in NorCal is about as bright as it would be in any other part of America.

 

[freddyg]

The latest from Bongo59 on the JetsInsider Board:

the latest is now the Raiders may be willing to deal with the Titans directly...................7 to 2 if ML is there at 3..................7 69 and Porter...................for the move up..............the Raider fans have even caught wind of it and things are now being talked about on Sports talk radio out there and by the Bay area media..................something is going to happen at the top of this draft................apparently the Saints want the Raiders 07 one ot be included and Davis will not give it up...................

Loomis has really overplayed his hand in my opinion a bit too early.............he is actively shopping CGrant to 4 teams so everyone knows he wants Williams.....................Mario i think is way overrated but i do think GB would take him..............The Saints will take Williams at two or Hawk if they trade down...............

 

[freddyg]

When trading a player, the original team takes the same cap hit as if they were cutting him. The new team is responsible only for the remaining unpaid salaries and bonuses. Ferguson has enormous unpaid salaries remaining, and would be a giant cap hit on the Jets. That makes him a poor choice to be cut or traded this year.

If he were traded pre June 1 the cap hit would be 6.2mil...You agree?

Dewayne Robertson's contract: Signing bonus:

$3,000,000.

Base salaries:

$1,746,000 (2003);

$2,182,000 (2004, plus $10,000,000 option bonus);

$2,618,000 (2005);

$3,054,000 (2006);

$3,491,000 (2007);

$3,927,000 (2008);

$1,600,000 (2009).

Notes: If the Jets exercise the $10,000,000 option payment in 2004, the base salaries are reduced to

$516,250 (2004);

$952,000 (2005);

$1,388,000 (2006);

$1,450,000 (2007).

There are escalators each season 2006-2009. Total: 7 years, $24,579,250, with potential for 7 years, $54,000,000.

The Jets did exercise the option bonus, which means as follows:

$3 million/7 ~ $430k

Three years have gone by, which means the remaining bonus is 4*$430k, which is about $1.71 million.

Next, we have an option bonus of $10 million. Only two years have gone by for that bonus, meaning 4 years remains. That works out to about $6.7 million.

$1.71 million + $6.7 million = about $8.4 million that will hit the cap if he's cut before 6/1.

If he's cut after 6/1, only one year worth of amoritzation from both bonuses will count this year, which is $430k + $1.67, or about $2 million, and the net cap impact for this year will be less than that b/c his $1.38 million salary will come off the books. However, the following year, you wind up with $6.4 million of dead money that will hit all at once.

If the Jets trade him during the draft, it's a $8.4 million - $1.38 or about $7 million cap hit this year. If the Jets cut him or trade him after 6/1, it's about $600k net this year, and $6.4 million next year. To me, that's horrific. As for his remaining salaries, they are palatable for this year and next year.

Wow, good work...but I still disagree.According to the sources I'm using (see below), if Dewayne were cut, something I don't think will happen, it would be after June 1st under the new CBA and the cap hit would be $4,466,666. There would be a cap hit next year as well but, the jets are in good shape and fine next year, especially considering the cap increase of next year.

His base salary this year is $4,669,994 +Bonus $1,666,666 +Roster Bonus $2,800,000, due before the season begins I believe. Of course, if he already received that roster bonus, chances are he's a Jet next year.

As I said a trade is much more likely and takes him off the books completely for next year but, there would be only a minor savings on the cap for this year.

See NFLPA.com and jetscap.com

Edit: these sources don't include the 10mil option bonus so if you could point me to a source on that I'd like to verify it.

 

[massraider]

Does Bongo, by any chance, have his own web site??

http://www.nfldrafthits.com/

If not someone has been copying off of his paper here.

BTW, the notion that an agent is somehow pulling the strings in this whole thing is an insult to any fan's intelligence.

 

[freddyg]

Does Bongo, by any chance, have his own web site??

http://www.nfldrafthits.com/

If not someone has been copying off of his paper here.

BTW, the notion that an agent is somehow pulling the strings in this whole thing is an insult to any fan's intelligence.

That is a very interesting site indeed...pretty much everything Bongo has been posting on the Jets, Titans, and Saints fan sites. Bongo does have a history though so I'm leaning towards this site reporting his stuff, unless they're connected somehow. I don't see them mentioning the source of the rumors. Thanks.

 

[NFL Draft Hits]

Hello fellas,

My name is Sam, I am the owner of NFL Draft Hits. I stumbled upon this thread while looking through my site counter, and just wanted to let you guys know that my site and this Bongo guy are not related in any way, except he seems to be getting the same info as I am. I asked my contact (he's with New Orleans) if he was "bongo" because I had been getting a lot of e-mails asking if I was just copying off the Jets forums. He said no, and didn't have any idea as to what I was talking about.

That being said, please, if you see anyone make this assumption about my site, tell them otherwise and that you got it straight from the top. Feel free to respond to this post or e-mail me at nfldrafthits@yahoo.com.

Thanks guys,

Sam

 

[massraider]

Hello fellas,

My name is Sam, I am the owner of NFL Draft Hits. I stumbled upon this thread while looking through my site counter, and just wanted to let you guys know that my site and this Bongo guy are not related in any way, except he seems to be getting the same info as I am. I asked my contact (he's with New Orleans) if he was "bongo" because I had been getting a lot of e-mails asking if I was just copying off the Jets forums. He said no, and didn't have any idea as to what I was talking about.

That being said, please, if you see anyone make this assumption about my site, tell them otherwise and that you got it straight from the top. Feel free to respond to this post or e-mail me at nfldrafthits@yahoo.com.

Thanks guys,

Sam

Well, talk about your quick responses. Anyways, Sam, thuanks for trying to clear it up a bit.

 

[jburns]

sam,

i checked out your big board.

no deangelo williams in your top 100? whats up with that?

 

[NFL Draft Hits]

Wow, big mistake on my part, will be fixed momentarily.

 

[Donnybrook]