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Star Wars The Last Jedi Episode 8 thread: this thread sucks, you should avoid it even after you've seen the movie (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Capella
- Start date
need2know
Footballguy
I can't believe they didn't get rid of her character in this movie
They had multiple chances. Instead we get the mary Poppins weird space floating
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Thunderlips
Footballguy
That's just kooky then. The guys old as ####.
Its like Lethal Weapon 4......Riggs couldn't beat Jet Li.
Scoresman
Footballguy
zoonation
Footballguy
I’m in the camp that was
mostly disappointed with Luke (story and acting). Just wasn’t impressed really and the narrative didn’t sit with me.
Thiguht the ending of that arc was badass though. Agree the tossing of the lightsaber at the beginning was all kinds of cheese.
Looking forward to seeing it again to see if my views on certain things change.
The Monte Carlo bit could have left on the editing floor imo.
mostly disappointed with Luke (story and acting). Just wasn’t impressed really and the narrative didn’t sit with me.
Thiguht the ending of that arc was badass though. Agree the tossing of the lightsaber at the beginning was all kinds of cheese.
Looking forward to seeing it again to see if my views on certain things change.
The Monte Carlo bit could have left on the editing floor imo.
Insein
Footballguy
AcerFC
Footballguy
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Capella
Footballguy
So goodI loved Luke tossing the lightsaber at the beginning. Star Wars nerds spent two years analyzing the last scene of TFA and how that scene would go in TLJ and him just tossing it over his shoulder was
joey
Footballguy
I love the force broom!
Was just joking with my kids about the tie ins between Star Wars and Harry Potter with the stupid broom.
Tony Jabroni
Footballguy
Buzzbait
Footballguy
Insein
Footballguy
Tony Jabroni
Footballguy
If there's one seemingly glaring flaw in this movie, it's that they had TWO excellent chances to off a character they HAVE to kill, but let her survive. Maybe they write her away more awesomely, but it's hard to imagine.
It was better for me on a 2nd viewing, but I still nearly fell asleep and again hardly a reaction at all from the crowd I was in.
Probably won't watch it again until I have the power to FF all the Casino/DelToro stuff
The General
Footballguy
Just saw it can’t read through 50 pages.
It was pretty solid. Probably my least fav of these reboots but still good couple of hours
Good nostalgia. Some good stuff with Ren and Luke.
Ripping through the Sith was pretty great.
Space Leia. Oof.
The Finn story line with Rose (that her name?) and the hacker, running out of gas was just bad. Not sure why that was even in there. Looked at my watch a few times during that.
Glad I can finally read the internet without spoilers
It was pretty solid. Probably my least fav of these reboots but still good couple of hours
Good nostalgia. Some good stuff with Ren and Luke.
Ripping through the Sith was pretty great.
Space Leia. Oof.
The Finn story line with Rose (that her name?) and the hacker, running out of gas was just bad. Not sure why that was even in there. Looked at my watch a few times during that.
Glad I can finally read the internet without spoilers
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
And like the new Star Wars movies, this Hitler Reacts video is just a pale reflection of the much superior originals.
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
it really is. I first thought it was some sort of morphing technology. The comments under it seem to indicate that it is a blend.
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Smack Tripper
Footballguy
Smack Tripper
Footballguy
You know, one other element I'm not liking with regard to taking the force out of bloodline... you're kind of depriving Rey of some perhaps needed evolution and arc.... in that you're not giving her the growth of training and that trial and error progression. Now she's just thrown into the standard disney heroine arc of orphan looking for their parents.
Scoresman
Footballguy
What do you mean by “taking the force out of bloodline”. The force was never limited to a particular bloodline, was it?
ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
Unless Abrams decides Kylo was lying, this is literally the opposite of her story arc now. She's forging her own path now and I think has accepted the Resistance as her "family". You could interpret the mirror scene as Rey being willing to court the power of the dark side if it meant getting her answers about her parents...but in the end, what she found within herself was the truth that she only needed herself. While in the original trilogy, Luke found his greatest fear in the Dark side cave (that he would be like Darth Vader), in this one Rey found the strength within herself to rebuff the Dark side and just be herself. imo. I'm sure people interpret that scene differently.
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ConnSKINS26
Footballguy
I also don't get these complaints about Rey being some master with the Force without training...she really isn't. She's naturally talented, but she's raw as hell.
She doesn't flip around like a Jedi ninja.
She doesn't Force-push entire squads of Stormtroopers.
She doesn't actively use the Force while focusing on a Lightsaber duel the way many Jedi and Sith studly talents have in past movies.
Things she does do:
She is competent and naturally gifted with the Lightsaber, which tracks given her previous martial skill with a staff.
She has a natural talent for simple brute force mind stuff, which can easily be linked to the fact that she clearly has a strong force of will. You could argue that's just an extension of her personality and her greatest positive trait, and her strong willpower just translates really well to the jedi mind stuff, especially pushing BACK when Kylo tries to get into her mind, which is when she realizes she has some power too.
Other than those things, she's shown a small talent for pulling things toward her with the Force (really only a Lightsaber)...which was also Luke's first successful Force usage in Empire (minus his Death Star shot at the end of ANH). Again, this is a power that isn't overly technical and can be attributed to her raw brute power. It's only at the end of TLJ that she does something out of these bounds with the Force--she calmly lifts a truckload of good sized rocks and holds them in the air.
This is the moment where she actually starts to exhibit some control, and not just raw power--something similar to what Luke did standing on one hand and lifting boulders on Dagobah.
And this is the important part--we all remember the Rocky montage with Yoda on Dagobah from ESB. Not paying attention, many people think that literal "training" was what made Luke what he became, and are mad Rey didn't have that experience on the island or before showing off in TFA.
But do you remember the only important thing Luke actually learned from Yoda in that swamp? Yoda worked him ragged because he was a stubborn ####### who wasn't getting it, but what was that actual lesson that made things click for Luke and really let him grow into a legit Jedi?
"Do or do not. There is no try".
That's it.
Yoda literally just gave him the Dumbo lesson--just believe it's possible and let your power do the rest, dummy. You were always capable of doing it. Just believe you can and stop focusing on how hard you think it is.
Incidentally, you know what Rey was never shown having a problem with? Believing, once she got a taste of her own potential, that she could use the Force. She gleefully jumped into attempting a Kenobi Jedi mindtrick as soon as possible the minute she realized she had some power. Because she was kind of an idealistic kid who fantasized about the stories, probably (as shown by her goofily popping on that Rebel pilot helmet at the beginning of TFA and smiling in the one quiet moment of childish innocence she gets before everything goes to hell).
So it turns out Rey is naturally talented and didn't actually need the one important lesson Luke learned in his Jedi training. When looked at that way, she's the perfect conduit for the Force, and that's why she's able to just let loose and utilize her raw power, even early on.
That, combined with the fact that 90% of what she does in the two movies is NOT actually on par with what the most powerful "trained" Force users have done in past movies, totally invalidates the complaints about her being too powerful without training imo.
She doesn't flip around like a Jedi ninja.
She doesn't Force-push entire squads of Stormtroopers.
She doesn't actively use the Force while focusing on a Lightsaber duel the way many Jedi and Sith studly talents have in past movies.
Things she does do:
She is competent and naturally gifted with the Lightsaber, which tracks given her previous martial skill with a staff.
She has a natural talent for simple brute force mind stuff, which can easily be linked to the fact that she clearly has a strong force of will. You could argue that's just an extension of her personality and her greatest positive trait, and her strong willpower just translates really well to the jedi mind stuff, especially pushing BACK when Kylo tries to get into her mind, which is when she realizes she has some power too.
Other than those things, she's shown a small talent for pulling things toward her with the Force (really only a Lightsaber)...which was also Luke's first successful Force usage in Empire (minus his Death Star shot at the end of ANH). Again, this is a power that isn't overly technical and can be attributed to her raw brute power. It's only at the end of TLJ that she does something out of these bounds with the Force--she calmly lifts a truckload of good sized rocks and holds them in the air.
This is the moment where she actually starts to exhibit some control, and not just raw power--something similar to what Luke did standing on one hand and lifting boulders on Dagobah.
And this is the important part--we all remember the Rocky montage with Yoda on Dagobah from ESB. Not paying attention, many people think that literal "training" was what made Luke what he became, and are mad Rey didn't have that experience on the island or before showing off in TFA.
But do you remember the only important thing Luke actually learned from Yoda in that swamp? Yoda worked him ragged because he was a stubborn ####### who wasn't getting it, but what was that actual lesson that made things click for Luke and really let him grow into a legit Jedi?
"Do or do not. There is no try".
That's it.
Yoda literally just gave him the Dumbo lesson--just believe it's possible and let your power do the rest, dummy. You were always capable of doing it. Just believe you can and stop focusing on how hard you think it is.
Incidentally, you know what Rey was never shown having a problem with? Believing, once she got a taste of her own potential, that she could use the Force. She gleefully jumped into attempting a Kenobi Jedi mindtrick as soon as possible the minute she realized she had some power. Because she was kind of an idealistic kid who fantasized about the stories, probably (as shown by her goofily popping on that Rebel pilot helmet at the beginning of TFA and smiling in the one quiet moment of childish innocence she gets before everything goes to hell).
So it turns out Rey is naturally talented and didn't actually need the one important lesson Luke learned in his Jedi training. When looked at that way, she's the perfect conduit for the Force, and that's why she's able to just let loose and utilize her raw power, even early on.
That, combined with the fact that 90% of what she does in the two movies is NOT actually on par with what the most powerful "trained" Force users have done in past movies, totally invalidates the complaints about her being too powerful without training imo.
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NewlyRetired
Footballguy
This was an interesting take on the missing lesson. I like the idea that Rey has a chance to redefine what it means to be a Jedi.
http://comicbook.com/starwars/2017/12/20/star-wars-last-jedi-luke-skywalker-rey-three-lessons/
NewlyRetired
Footballguy
Interesting piece of trivia. The word Sith is never used in the original trilogy.
Psychopav
Help us, Joebi-Wan Brynobi, you're our only ho
and you can click through to this description of the deleted scene of the third lesson.Since it's not in the movie though, it would not shock me at all to find that the third lesson is given by ghost Luke in IX.
tommyboy
Footballguy
tommyboy
Footballguy
Glad they cut that out. Seems overly convoluted and pretentious.
Since it's not in the movie though, it would not shock me at all to find that the third lesson is given by ghost Luke in IX.
I like the movie just the way they cut it.
Totally agree but I’ll add a second thing which undoubtably was mentioned by a prior poster. To have the broomstick kid at the end of the movie do a couple light saber moves a la the Star Wars kid on YouTube would have been an even better ending.
GregR
Footballguy
Anakin being the Chosen One of prophecy, he was supposed to bring balance to the Force. Which the Jedi seemed to take as removing the Dark Side, which would instead be the farthest end of the spectrum from "balance".
Snoke mentions telling Kylo Ren that as Kylo gained in power, there would be an equal to rise to oppose him. Though Snoke expected it to be Luke. Another example of balance in the Force.
Luke now blames the Jedi for the Sith existing and for the Dark Side taking over. In that above context, the Jedi were pushing everything strongly towards the Light Side. If there is balance then that means you will have greater evil arise to balance it out, so he would be right that the Jedi were responsible.
Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view.
Snoke mentions telling Kylo Ren that as Kylo gained in power, there would be an equal to rise to oppose him. Though Snoke expected it to be Luke. Another example of balance in the Force.
Luke now blames the Jedi for the Sith existing and for the Dark Side taking over. In that above context, the Jedi were pushing everything strongly towards the Light Side. If there is balance then that means you will have greater evil arise to balance it out, so he would be right that the Jedi were responsible.
Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view.
GregR
Footballguy
I think taking it further would have been unnecessarily clubbing us over the head with it. The manner chosen was blatant enough.
You are probably right, I just feel bad for the kid in real life who took such grief over that video. Who knows how he would receive such a shoutout but it feels like a cool way to do it.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
It's always been that way. Luke showed in the OT that we have to recognize and accept our emotions like anger, fear, and aggression - not subsume them like Yoda told Anakin to do in the PT.
IOW - Luke proved that the Jedi way of Yoda and Kenobi wasn't the right one even though their intentions were noble.
Smack Tripper
Footballguy
I guess we can see the “episodes” as one of two ways, it’s a Star Wars story or it’s a Skywalker family story. To me it’s always been the latter so Rey had to/has to fit there. It’s the thread through the prior 7 films
Rogue one was a great Star Wars movie unencumbered by this but also not an episode though canon. No title crawl, no force, but a good side story. Maybe Johnson would have been better here and not cutting one of the threads weaving these movies together.
It just kind of reduces the Jedi to some sort of Galatic AAU recruiting young kids when really it should have been a destiny calling
AAABatteries
Footballguy
Agree with this but what I don’t understand is that people pick these movies to death but seem to give the first 3 a pass. Those movies had just as much hokey, cringeworthy stuff in them but we seem to romanticize those 3 films. These movies, generally speaking, are great visually and better acted. When I go see Star Wars I’m already suspending disbelief before the film starts.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I really don't get this complaint by some people. How many Jedi's have we seen in these movies and how much do we know about their background? Why does it matter that much?
It is not so much that the force was limited to the bloodline. But Lucas's vision for the star wars saga was that the story was about the skywalker family and was really a story about a family and their issues. Disney has apparently scraped that vision and going a different route.
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Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I'm really glad I don't think about these movies the same way you do. It's much more enjoyable not.
I don't know why anyone would think the movies HAVE to keep the Skywalker lineage going I'm positive it will still be in the next movie. In some way the Skywalkers will be involved in the movie. They've been in every single one so far.
Hawkeye21
Footballguy
I see it more as the rebellion is a family now. Even Carrie Fisher says that in the video posted earlier. The movie is about family.
Capella
Footballguy
I mean, it was 8 movies about the Skywalkers. How much more did we need? Even Kylo will be throughout Ep9, so it will really be 9 Skywalker movies. Let's move on after that one.
Bob Sacamano
Footballguy
Capella
Footballguy
Wouldn't be surprised if Luke had a wild night at the Casino using the force to tumble the dice in his favor which eventually resulted in a child who is now cleaning stables and using his powers to pick up brooms.
