Steelers/Browns (1 Viewer)

[gandalas]

So I didn't see...did Harrison get credit for that sack or not?

its perplexing. pbp on cbs says it was intentional grounding. im pretty sure the ref explicitly said it wasnt bc the ball crossed the los.

the ref did but then I think a Side judge came in and overruled him (prolly watched the replay on the jumbotron). I was expecting a review but then they ruled him down I thought? But was watching on my smartphone (smoke break on roof) so I couldn't tell.

Can it still be intentional grounding if the QB is outside the tackle box, but the pass does not pass the LOS? I did not know if that is indeed the case...

 

[zftcg]

Wow...Antonio Brown is GOOD. I don't know if I like him or Wallace better for next season.

What does anyone think about this? Wallace or Brown next year?

Wallace will have better numbers, Brown will be a much better value.

ESPN's fantasy podcast was discussing the other day how there are lots of teams where the WR2s have equaled or even outperformed WR1s (Brown/Wallace, Nelson/Jennings, Cruz/Nicks, Robinson/Bryant). It could just be a function of teams focusing on stopping the WR1s and leaving WR2s single-covered. That said, Brown is very good, and will be a good asset next year.

 

[Kenny Powers]

I really like Noorwood as a shifty/welker type WR for us.

He was very good at PSU...surprised he hasnt stuck as CLE's #3 WR

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

So I didn't see...did Harrison get credit for that sack or not?

its perplexing. pbp on cbs says it was intentional grounding. im pretty sure the ref explicitly said it wasnt bc the ball crossed the los.

the ref did but then I think a Side judge came in and overruled him (prolly watched the replay on the jumbotron). I was expecting a review but then they ruled him down I thought? But was watching on my smartphone (smoke break on roof) so I couldn't tell.

Can it still be intentional grounding if the QB is outside the tackle box, but the pass does not pass the LOS? I did not know if that is indeed the case...

Generally they won't call it if it's near the line.

 

[AhrnCityPahnder]

randons shot:

I know Chris Kemo was never great a player, but wattf. He's flat out terrible now. I don't ever want to see him playing again.

William Gay with a very nice game. As someone said before, feels weird to type that.

Antonio Brown.

I am really glad they have 11 days off and not 7.

 

[zftcg]

Look, McCoy's not a good QB, but I will say I was impressed by his escapability in this game. Steelers should have had a lot more sacks than they did.

 

[shnikies]

So I didn't see...did Harrison get credit for that sack or not?

its perplexing. pbp on cbs says it was intentional grounding. im pretty sure the ref explicitly said it wasnt bc the ball crossed the los.

They changed it to intentional grounding. It's one of those unlucky plays if you were hoping for a sack. If they kept the call as incomplete it would have been reversed to a sack.

If they kept the call as incomplete (and not called the penalty) then the ball would have returned to the original line of scrimmage. You can't have a sack and an incomplete pass on the same play.

Really?!?!?! The Steelers would have challenged and the play would have been reversed to a sack.

 

[Fallerjw]

I feel badly for Cleveland fans. The offense is bad - whatever happened to Joe Thomas?

I do think Tom Heckert is an excellent GM. I like his picks so far. If I'm the Browns, I select RB Trent Richardson with the first pick, select a guard with the second first round pick to put between Mack and Thomas, and run the football because we don't have a QB.

As a Browns fan, I want ANYBODY other than Trent Richardson in early round 1. Take a RT, take a WR, take a CB, but please don't take a RB. From what I've seen around the league, a good line can make an average back good. They ran the ball just fine with Hillis last year. RB can't be their top priority in the draft.

 

[I love my screen name]

Here is the play by play from CBS. According to this the ball was moved to the 16 yard line which coincides with the grounding call.

Cleveland Browns at 07:10

1-10-CLE44 (7:10) C.McCoy pass short right to M.Massaquoi to PIT 44 for 12 yards (W.Gay).

1-10-PIT44 (6:35) M.Hardesty right guard to PIT 39 for 5 yards (J.Farrior; J.Harrison).

2-5-PIT39

(5:59) C.McCoy pass short left to M.Hardesty to PIT 34 for 5 yards (I.Taylor) [J.Harrison]. CLV-C.McCoy was injured during the play. CLV-A.Smith was injured during the play. PENALTY on PIT-J.Harrison, Roughing the Passer, 15 yards, enforced at PIT 34.

1-10-PIT19 (5:38) M.Hardesty left guard to PIT 18 for 1 yard (J.Worilds).

2-9-PIT18 (5:01) S.Wallace pass short right to E.Moore to PIT 5 for 13 yards (T.Polamalu).

1-5-PIT5 (4:18) (Shotgun) M.Hardesty right guard to PIT 6 for -1 yards (T.Polamalu).

2-6-PIT6

(3:35) C.McCoy pass incomplete short right. PENALTY on CLV-C.McCoy, Intentional Grounding, 10 yards, enforced at PIT 6.

3-16-PIT16 (3:19) (Shotgun) C.McCoy pass deep left intended for M.Massaquoi INTERCEPTED by W.Gay at PIT -4. Touchback

 

[zftcg]

Here is the play by play from CBS. According to this the ball was moved to the 16 yard line which coincides with the grounding call.

Cleveland Browns at 07:10

1-10-CLE44 (7:10) C.McCoy pass short right to M.Massaquoi to PIT 44 for 12 yards (W.Gay).

1-10-PIT44 (6:35) M.Hardesty right guard to PIT 39 for 5 yards (J.Farrior; J.Harrison).

2-5-PIT39

(5:59) C.McCoy pass short left to M.Hardesty to PIT 34 for 5 yards (I.Taylor) [J.Harrison]. CLV-C.McCoy was injured during the play. CLV-A.Smith was injured during the play. PENALTY on PIT-J.Harrison, Roughing the Passer, 15 yards, enforced at PIT 34.

1-10-PIT19 (5:38) M.Hardesty left guard to PIT 18 for 1 yard (J.Worilds).

2-9-PIT18 (5:01) S.Wallace pass short right to E.Moore to PIT 5 for 13 yards (T.Polamalu).

1-5-PIT5 (4:18) (Shotgun) M.Hardesty right guard to PIT 6 for -1 yards (T.Polamalu).

2-6-PIT6

(3:35) C.McCoy pass incomplete short right. PENALTY on CLV-C.McCoy, Intentional Grounding, 10 yards, enforced at PIT 6.

3-16-PIT16 (3:19) (Shotgun) C.McCoy pass deep left intended for M.Massaquoi INTERCEPTED by W.Gay at PIT -4. Touchback

Yep. It was a doubly incorrect call, but if that was what the officials declared, it's not going to be amended later. All I know is if I lose my playoff matchup by less than a point, Ed Hochuli's got a chunk coming out of his behind.

 

[Fallerjw]

And the Browns cover!

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Here is the play by play from CBS. According to this the ball was moved to the 16 yard line which coincides with the grounding call.

Cleveland Browns at 07:10

1-10-CLE44 (7:10) C.McCoy pass short right to M.Massaquoi to PIT 44 for 12 yards (W.Gay).

1-10-PIT44 (6:35) M.Hardesty right guard to PIT 39 for 5 yards (J.Farrior; J.Harrison).

2-5-PIT39

(5:59) C.McCoy pass short left to M.Hardesty to PIT 34 for 5 yards (I.Taylor) [J.Harrison]. CLV-C.McCoy was injured during the play. CLV-A.Smith was injured during the play. PENALTY on PIT-J.Harrison, Roughing the Passer, 15 yards, enforced at PIT 34.

1-10-PIT19 (5:38) M.Hardesty left guard to PIT 18 for 1 yard (J.Worilds).

2-9-PIT18 (5:01) S.Wallace pass short right to E.Moore to PIT 5 for 13 yards (T.Polamalu).

1-5-PIT5 (4:18) (Shotgun) M.Hardesty right guard to PIT 6 for -1 yards (T.Polamalu).

2-6-PIT6

(3:35) C.McCoy pass incomplete short right. PENALTY on CLV-C.McCoy, Intentional Grounding, 10 yards, enforced at PIT 6.

3-16-PIT16 (3:19) (Shotgun) C.McCoy pass deep left intended for M.Massaquoi INTERCEPTED by W.Gay at PIT -4. Touchback

Yep. It was a doubly incorrect call, but if that was what the officials declared, it's not going to be amended later. All I know is if I lose my playoff matchup by less than a point, Ed Hochuli's got a chunk coming out of his behind.

I thought intentional grounding counts as a sack for the Defense? Maybe I just have that wrong.

 

[zftcg]

Here is the play by play from CBS. According to this the ball was moved to the 16 yard line which coincides with the grounding call.

Cleveland Browns at 07:10

1-10-CLE44 (7:10) C.McCoy pass short right to M.Massaquoi to PIT 44 for 12 yards (W.Gay).

1-10-PIT44 (6:35) M.Hardesty right guard to PIT 39 for 5 yards (J.Farrior; J.Harrison).

2-5-PIT39

(5:59) C.McCoy pass short left to M.Hardesty to PIT 34 for 5 yards (I.Taylor) [J.Harrison]. CLV-C.McCoy was injured during the play. CLV-A.Smith was injured during the play. PENALTY on PIT-J.Harrison, Roughing the Passer, 15 yards, enforced at PIT 34.

1-10-PIT19 (5:38) M.Hardesty left guard to PIT 18 for 1 yard (J.Worilds).

2-9-PIT18 (5:01) S.Wallace pass short right to E.Moore to PIT 5 for 13 yards (T.Polamalu).

1-5-PIT5 (4:18) (Shotgun) M.Hardesty right guard to PIT 6 for -1 yards (T.Polamalu).

2-6-PIT6

(3:35) C.McCoy pass incomplete short right. PENALTY on CLV-C.McCoy, Intentional Grounding, 10 yards, enforced at PIT 6.

3-16-PIT16 (3:19) (Shotgun) C.McCoy pass deep left intended for M.Massaquoi INTERCEPTED by W.Gay at PIT -4. Touchback

Yep. It was a doubly incorrect call, but if that was what the officials declared, it's not going to be amended later. All I know is if I lose my playoff matchup by less than a point, Ed Hochuli's got a chunk coming out of his behind.

I thought intentional grounding counts as a sack for the Defense? Maybe I just have that wrong.

Nope. IG in the end zone counts as a safety for the D, but a penalty is a penalty.

 

[Diamond]

Isn't intentional grounding a spot of the foul type penalty? It should have been 10 yards from where he threw it (the 16?). His knee hit before the pass came out, so it should have been ruled a sack, and I thought that's what they ruled. I think CBS or whoever screwed up here, but I don't know if it will get fixed before the stat corrections next Thursday.

Edit: Nope, I'm wrong, it's spot of the foul only if passer's more than 10yds behind the LOS. 10yd penalty, otherwise.

link

Intentional Grounding of Forward Pass

1. Intentional grounding of a forward pass is a foul: loss of down and 10 yards from previous spot if passer is in the field of play or loss of down at the spot of the foul if it occurs more than 10 yards behind the line or safety if passer is in his own end zone when ball is released.

 

[I love my screen name]

Isn't intentional grounding a spot of the foul type penalty? It should have been 10 yards from where he threw it (the 16?). His knee hit before the pass came out, so it should have been ruled a sack, and I thought that's what they ruled. I think CBS or whoever screwed up here, but I don't know if it will get fixed before the stat corrections next Thursday.

The penalty was called at the 6 yard line.

 

[cvnpoka]

no its just 10 yards from los unless he is farther back

 

[gradin123]

Isn't intentional grounding a spot of the foul type penalty? It should have been 10 yards from where he threw it (the 16?). His knee hit before the pass came out, so it should have been ruled a sack, and I thought that's what they ruled. I think CBS or whoever screwed up here, but I don't know if it will get fixed before the stat corrections next Thursday.

The clock stopped without a timeout. If it was a sack it would have ran after it was spotted but it didn't. It was ruled intentional grounding on the field.

 

[Utter Chaos]

So I didn't see...did Harrison get credit for that sack or not?

its perplexing. pbp on cbs says it was intentional grounding. im pretty sure the ref explicitly said it wasnt bc the ball crossed the los.

They changed it to intentional grounding. It's one of those unlucky plays if you were hoping for a sack. If they kept the call as incomplete it would have been reversed to a sack.

If they kept the call as incomplete (and not called the penalty) then the ball would have returned to the original line of scrimmage. You can't have a sack and an incomplete pass on the same play.

Really?!?!?! The Steelers would have challenged and the play would have been reversed to a sack.

Yes, if intentional grounding was not called and the pass was ruled incomplete then the Steelers could have challenged the play and if it was overturned then it would have been reversed to a sack. You're bolded statement above made no mention of a challenge.

 

[Fensalk]

I feel badly for Cleveland fans. The offense is bad - whatever happened to Joe Thomas?

I do think Tom Heckert is an excellent GM. I like his picks so far. If I'm the Browns, I select RB Trent Richardson with the first pick, select a guard with the second first round pick to put between Mack and Thomas, and run the football because we don't have a QB.

As a Browns fan, I want ANYBODY other than Trent Richardson in early round 1. Take a RT, take a WR, take a CB, but please don't take a RB. From what I've seen around the league, a good line can make an average back good. They ran the ball just fine with Hillis last year. RB can't be their top priority in the draft.

Richardson would be a great fit for their WCO. He'll make an excellent receiver out of the backfield as well. It makes perfect sense to draft him.

 

[shnikies]

So I didn't see...did Harrison get credit for that sack or not?

its perplexing. pbp on cbs says it was intentional grounding. im pretty sure the ref explicitly said it wasnt bc the ball crossed the los.

They changed it to intentional grounding. It's one of those unlucky plays if you were hoping for a sack. If they kept the call as incomplete it would have been reversed to a sack.

If they kept the call as incomplete (and not called the penalty) then the ball would have returned to the original line of scrimmage. You can't have a sack and an incomplete pass on the same play.

Really?!?!?! The Steelers would have challenged and the play would have been reversed to a sack.

Yes, if intentional grounding was not called and the pass was ruled incomplete then the Steelers could have challenged the play and if it was overturned then it would have been reversed to a sack. You're bolded statement above made no mention of a challenge.

Sorry, I thought it was blatantly implied.

 

[shnikies]

I feel badly for Cleveland fans. The offense is bad - whatever happened to Joe Thomas?

I do think Tom Heckert is an excellent GM. I like his picks so far. If I'm the Browns, I select RB Trent Richardson with the first pick, select a guard with the second first round pick to put between Mack and Thomas, and run the football because we don't have a QB.

As a Browns fan, I want ANYBODY other than Trent Richardson in early round 1. Take a RT, take a WR, take a CB, but please don't take a RB. From what I've seen around the league, a good line can make an average back good. They ran the ball just fine with Hillis last year. RB can't be their top priority in the draft.

Richardson would be a great fit for their WCO. He'll make an excellent receiver out of the backfield as well. It makes perfect sense to draft him.

If they get a chance at JB they will be on him like white on rice.

 

[Kenny Powers]

I feel badly for Cleveland fans. The offense is bad - whatever happened to Joe Thomas?

I do think Tom Heckert is an excellent GM. I like his picks so far. If I'm the Browns, I select RB Trent Richardson with the first pick, select a guard with the second first round pick to put between Mack and Thomas, and run the football because we don't have a QB.

As a Browns fan, I want ANYBODY other than Trent Richardson in early round 1. Take a RT, take a WR, take a CB, but please don't take a RB. From what I've seen around the league, a good line can make an average back good. They ran the ball just fine with Hillis last year. RB can't be their top priority in the draft.

Richardson would be a great fit for their WCO. He'll make an excellent receiver out of the backfield as well. It makes perfect sense to draft him.

If they get a chance at JB they will be on him like white on rice.

JB Smoove? Didnt realize he was that highly touted.

 

[infantsam]

I feel badly for Cleveland fans. The offense is bad - whatever happened to Joe Thomas?

It is a QB league.Get one.

 

[Evilgrin 72]

All I want for Christmas is a Browns win over the Steelers tonite.

Even Santa ignores you.

 

[3C's]

GOGOGOGOGOGOGOWooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Interceptaberger!!!!

suck it beej

It was the only moment of joy I'll get this NFL season. It was great.

 

[Godsbrother]

All I want for Christmas is a Browns win over the Steelers tonite.

Even Santa ignores you.

 

[The_Man]

Steelers WILL NOT just grind away a win here with the running game. They do not have the running backs or Oline to dominate a game like this. It's kind of like saying the Packers will just run all day if they played the Browns, not saying Pitt is anywhere near Rodgers and the Pack, just comparing the running game being so mediocre that it will never take control of a game.

I think it will be interesting to see what Haden can do. I am probably going to play Brown since game plan may not be to test Haden and Sanders is out this week.

Keep in mind, your fantasy players usually score big points in blowouts. The amount of times you get in the redzone increases the chances you score a TD which really makes your week.



I wouldn't bench anyone in the passing game just cause you think Steelers will run all night on them cause they physically aren't capable of that type of game.

This was a good posting. After seeing how Baltimore gashed Cleveland for 300 yards on the ground, I really thought Pittsburgh would grind out the running game vs. a beat-up Browns team on a short week. But they were absolutely unable to do it -- even with Ben on one leg, they still had to throw all the time to move the ball. That was a great, gritty performance by Roethlisberger, but I'm not convinced the Steelers are Super Bowl contenders at this point. They really seem unable to mount an effective ground game, and that's really going to hurt them if Ben's output is affected by his injury.

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

All I want for Christmas is a Browns win over the Steelers tonite.

Even Santa ignores you.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

Once again, I didn't see why they overturned it. Did his knee touch, or did his foot go out of bounds?

you must be kidding his knee dragged the ground and flicked up blades of grass and dirt. One of the more obvious calls in a while.

That wasn't even close to not being down. Like watching a snow plow shoot snow up on the sides and wondering if the plow is actually touching the snow.

OK. I'm watching an online feed on a small screen, so I must have just missed it.

He actually had a grass stain on his knee the size of a tennis ball.

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

What a ####### warrior Big Ben is. His ankle on slo mo replay bent at a 90 degree angle to his foot. That knocks out 90% of the qbs in this league for a game/multiple games even, Is he just that limber? Dude must do a #### ton of yoga with the blinds drawn.

 

[Cookiemonster]

What a ####### warrior Big Ben is. His ankle on slo mo replay bent at a 90 degree angle to his foot. That knocks out 90% of the qbs in this league for a game/multiple games even, Is he just that limber? Dude must do a #### ton of yoga with the blinds drawn.

It looked closer to 180* with his knee pointing to the screen's left, and the ankle to the right. 1 part rubber, 1 part iron, stir and bake at 37* for 3 hours. I have to assume he got a shot in the ankle at halftime and if it weren't him, I'd question his ability to play next week despite finishing the game. 9ers will be teeing off on him, and a gimped Big Ben makes me think the 9ers are the favorites next week.

 

[Pabst Blue Ribbon]

There can't be any Vicodin left in the Pittsburgh area, Ben ate them all at halftime. His pill collection has to be enormous.

 

[Limp Ditka]

All I want for Christmas is a Browns win over the Steelers tonite.

Even Santa ignores you.

mfer

 

[McBokonon]

William Gay with a very nice game. As someone said before, feels weird to type that.

http://forums.footballguys.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=558646&view=findpost&p=12346654 Nice notebook.

 

[Deadman31]

There can't be any Vicodin left in the Pittsburgh area, Ben ate them all at halftime. His pill collection has to be enormous.

He keeps his Vicodin next to his Roofies.

 

[thatguythere]

Steelers WILL NOT just grind away a win here with the running game. They do not have the running backs or Oline to dominate a game like this. It's kind of like saying the Packers will just run all day if they played the Browns, not saying Pitt is anywhere near Rodgers and the Pack, just comparing the running game being so mediocre that it will never take control of a game.

I think it will be interesting to see what Haden can do. I am probably going to play Brown since game plan may not be to test Haden and Sanders is out this week.

Keep in mind, your fantasy players usually score big points in blowouts. The amount of times you get in the redzone increases the chances you score a TD which really makes your week.



I wouldn't bench anyone in the passing game just cause you think Steelers will run all night on them cause they physically aren't capable of that type of game.

This was a good posting. After seeing how Baltimore gashed Cleveland for 300 yards on the ground, I really thought Pittsburgh would grind out the running game vs. a beat-up Browns team on a short week. But they were absolutely unable to do it -- even with Ben on one leg, they still had to throw all the time to move the ball. That was a great, gritty performance by Roethlisberger, but I'm not convinced the Steelers are Super Bowl contenders at this point. They really seem unable to mount an effective ground game, and that's really going to hurt them if Ben's output is affected by his injury.

It was a great posting....no doubt. Thanks again.

Got hit with a virus threat right in the middle of the third quarter last night. Nearly shat when Wallace scored... that was huge, oh and then they took it away, and my opponents mendy was sure to get the short short TD. Guess not! Why in the heck didn't they bring in 3 or 4 receivers and run out of that package? If they were intent on running so bad. Couldn't believe the Browns held. The Brown TD was what I needed bad. Fun game to watch.

 

[Fensalk]

I feel badly for Cleveland fans. The offense is bad - whatever happened to Joe Thomas?

I do think Tom Heckert is an excellent GM. I like his picks so far. If I'm the Browns, I select RB Trent Richardson with the first pick, select a guard with the second first round pick to put between Mack and Thomas, and run the football because we don't have a QB.

As a Browns fan, I want ANYBODY other than Trent Richardson in early round 1. Take a RT, take a WR, take a CB, but please don't take a RB. From what I've seen around the league, a good line can make an average back good. They ran the ball just fine with Hillis last year. RB can't be their top priority in the draft.

Richardson would be a great fit for their WCO. He'll make an excellent receiver out of the backfield as well. It makes perfect sense to draft him.

If they get a chance at JB they will be on him like white on rice.

I hope not. Rule #1 of the NFL: Win the line of scrimmage. Rule #2 of the NFL: If you don't have a franchise QB, RUN THE BALL. There is absolutely no reason to take JB in the first round because even if he's good we don't have anyone to get him the ball. This team needs an RB because the ones they got don't have a track record of performance. Its needs more talented blockers up front as well.When the Steelers started to get good again in 1992, they didn't have a QB. What did they do? They ran Barry Foster all day. Then they traded for Bettis and ran the Bus all day. They were a run-first team pretty much from 1992 until Roethlisberger got there. Why? Because they are smart. They had to wait 13 years to find a QB in the draft. THEN they opened up the offense.The Browns are at 1992. They gotta start at square one and be a run-first team.

 

[Fensalk]

The Browns right now have 465 passing attempts and 346 rushing attempts. That is just stupid. This team will never win with that ratio. This offense needs to develop an attitude of running the ball. Keep pounding the rock until the offensive line gets enough reps to gel and then they'll start to open holes.

 

[Statorama]

See Kimo, that's what happens when you DON'T twist a QB's ankle when you sack him.