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Steelers Receivers (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Otter
- Start date
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
I dont think so. The only advantage GB has is at TE. Wallace is slightly better than Jennings, Brown and Sanders are better than Nelson and Jones. Hines is better than Driver, but theyre both mostly irrelevant.Id take the Steelers group, plus theyre younger across the board
loose circuits
Footballguy
don't forget Cotchery, not a bad WR5
duece2626
Footballguy
Cobb >> Cotchery
nysportsfan
Footballguy
Toss up. But the guy slinging the rock is better so in my eyes: GB>Pit
Anonymous Internet User
Footballguy
Mike Sims-Walker
Mike Thomas
Jason Hill
Marcedes Lewis
Jarrett Dillard
money
Mike Thomas
Jason Hill
Marcedes Lewis
Jarrett Dillard
money
duaneok66
Footballguy
instant laughter! Thank you!
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
Well Cotchery doesnt even see the field really, but I wouldnt disagree.I dont think that changes my opinion either. PIT has a better overall receiving corps.
Drunken Cowboy
Footballguy
Wallace is way better than Jennings.
Kitrick Taylor
Footballguy
Some of you need to put down the peace pipe. The Steelers have a good WR crew no doubt. They are not a better corp than the Packers however. Antonio Brown has 1 career TD, and 50 career catches. Sanders has 4 career TDs and 46 catches in his career. It's been reported in numerous places that Brown struggles with his route running as well.
Contrast that with Nelson and Jones. Jones has 168 career catches and 16 TDs. Nelson has 124 career catches and 10 TDs in the regular season, and 22/297/3 in the postseason. That includes 9/140/1 vs the Steelers in the Superbowl. They know the offense exceptionally well, being able to lineup in any of the WR positions interchangeably.
As for Wallace vs Jennings, I'll take Jennings. Wallace is getting better as a complete receiver and not just a speed guy. Jennings is a complete receiver at this point however. He and Rodgers are completely in sync, and have been basically unstoppable since Finley got hurt last season. The Steelers knew the Packers tendencies with Jennings in the slot in the Superbowl, and still couldn't stop it. It was a truly tremendous performance on the biggest stage. This, after completely shredding the Bears and Falcons for a combined 16/231 in the two previous playoff games.
Driver and Ward are almost non factors at this point of their careers, with the exception that the Steelers are not reducing Wards' snaps, while the Packers are curtailing Driver's quite a bit.
The Packers also added Randall Cobb this year, which looks like it will keep them 4 deep at the position for years to come. Throw in Finley as a joker, and the Packers have a pretty big advantage in pass catchers vs the Steelers.
Contrast that with Nelson and Jones. Jones has 168 career catches and 16 TDs. Nelson has 124 career catches and 10 TDs in the regular season, and 22/297/3 in the postseason. That includes 9/140/1 vs the Steelers in the Superbowl. They know the offense exceptionally well, being able to lineup in any of the WR positions interchangeably.
As for Wallace vs Jennings, I'll take Jennings. Wallace is getting better as a complete receiver and not just a speed guy. Jennings is a complete receiver at this point however. He and Rodgers are completely in sync, and have been basically unstoppable since Finley got hurt last season. The Steelers knew the Packers tendencies with Jennings in the slot in the Superbowl, and still couldn't stop it. It was a truly tremendous performance on the biggest stage. This, after completely shredding the Bears and Falcons for a combined 16/231 in the two previous playoff games.
Driver and Ward are almost non factors at this point of their careers, with the exception that the Steelers are not reducing Wards' snaps, while the Packers are curtailing Driver's quite a bit.
The Packers also added Randall Cobb this year, which looks like it will keep them 4 deep at the position for years to come. Throw in Finley as a joker, and the Packers have a pretty big advantage in pass catchers vs the Steelers.
This is probably the HOMER in me coming out, but I agree with the above. I consider Jennings = Wallace (really a toss up); Nelson > Brown; Jones > Sanders, Finley> Miller; and Cobb> Cotchery. If drafting them today, this is how I would rank them.. Even though Big Ben is on Fire, I don't think you can argue who is the better QB feeding them the ball either..
treat88
Footballguy
I like the Packers crew better AT THIS POINT as well....but any given day either could outplay the other.
However, keep in mind, this is Sanders/Brown's second season in the league. Sanders had about a half season's worth of snaps last year and Brown barely saw the field. There is plenty of reason to believe they will continue to develop and become more consistent, more dynamic threats than either Nelson or Jones.
Very different types of players though so it's tough to really compare them heads up.
Basically they are what Cobb should be next season, and I would expect him to quickly take the #3 job from Jones and challenge Nelson for targets soon.
However, keep in mind, this is Sanders/Brown's second season in the league. Sanders had about a half season's worth of snaps last year and Brown barely saw the field. There is plenty of reason to believe they will continue to develop and become more consistent, more dynamic threats than either Nelson or Jones.
Very different types of players though so it's tough to really compare them heads up.
Basically they are what Cobb should be next season, and I would expect him to quickly take the #3 job from Jones and challenge Nelson for targets soon.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
Brown and Sanders both have a lot of potential, but Nelson is clearly the best of the four right now, and Jones is still solid enough to give GB's tandem the nod.But Brown and Sanders should definitely be on the field more. No way should Ward still be starting (when he is healthy).
loose circuits
Footballguy
Best ReceiversittsburghGreen BayPhiladelphiain that order, IMO.
The Eagles definitely deserve some consideration as well with Maclin, Jackson, Avant, Smith, and Cooper throw in double trouble at TE with Harbor/Celek not to mention McCoy close to the best receiving back in the league. I'd put those 5 WR's up against anyone. With the running game they just don't need to feature them as much and don't get them all involved like Pitt and GB do.
Kitrick Taylor
Footballguy
Agree that it certainly is possible for Sanders and Brown to surpass Nelson and Jones. That hasn't happened yet, and there are no guarantees on potential. As for James Jones, he's quietly becoming a much bigger part of the Packer offense as the season grows. He seems to be over last years dropsies, and is really playing well. Those handful of drops that he had last year that could have been long TDs, are actually turning into TDs this year. He's taking snaps from Driver and Nelson at this point, and its actually a toss up between Jones and Nelson right now for more snaps on a weekly basis. They are essentially sharing the WR2 role right now. To assume Cobb will leapfrog Jones and Nelson next year is a reach at this point. Cobb has a long ways to go to learn the offense, and Nelson and Jones know it well. That means a lot in this offense, and is why Aaron Rodgers made his case to resign James Jones this past summer.
Reepicheep
Footballguy
I agree, for now the Packers unit have a longer track record of production and experience as edges. Mike Wallace certainly has the potential to pass Jennings in the WR pecking order but that hasn't happened yet.
treat88
Footballguy
I don't disagree with any of this.Just my take on things, but I think Cobb is the kind of player that once he "gets it" will simply be unable to be kept off the field.
Deamon
Footballguy
I think arguments could be made for Green Bay, Pitt, and Philly as the top WR corps. Remember last night was the WORST pass d in the league, I'm sure that was at least part of the reasons those guys all performed so well. Take away that game and it evens out a bit more. Green Bay is extremely deep, but I think Rodgers can make almost any receiver look good. Philly not as deep as the other 2 perhaps, but may have the best 1-2 punch of any of the three, and has a very above average 3-4-5 in Avant/Smith/Cooper.
:X
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
No way. Both Pittsburgh and GB have deeper receiving corps than Dallas, and Dallas' two "great" WRs are far too inconsistent. If I had to take two WRs from those three teams, I'd take Wallace and Jennings (in real or fantasy terms).
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I'd argue "deeper" is pretty irrelevant. It's already been mentioned a few times that the 4th WR on each totem pole is largely absent from each team's gameplan. The Boys' #3 guy has multiple hundred yard games already this year.As to the argument about "inconsistency," I'd say that has a lot more to do with Romo vs. Rodgers and Big Ben than it has to do with the WR's. I think the physical package Austin and Dez bring trumps anything on the Steelers or Pack. Witten is no worse than a push at TE with Finley. I'd say the only reason either the Pack or the Steelers would even be in the same argument with Austin/Bryant/Robinson/Witten is because they are head and shoulders above Dallas in terms of QB play.I'll continue to maintain that if you take out the top 2 WR's and the TE from either team, and plug in Dallas's starting 3, you see improved numbers across the board, at every position...including QB.
The Jerk
Footballguy
Personally, if I was forced to pick, I'd go Packers, Steelers, Cowboys but it's all very close. I want to expand on your idea that the perception of the receivers is affected by Rodgers vs. Ben vs. Romo. To me, it goes much deeper than that to include offensive line play, offensive scheme, and also defense. It all works together much better for the Steelers and especially the Packers than it does for the Cowboys.Specific to the wide receivers, I agree that Bryant and Austin are the most physical tandem, but with the rules changes over the past decade or so, I would argue that raw physicality is no longer as necessary, since the officials prevent cornerbacks from mugging receivers as they could back in the early 2000s. In fact, raw speed among at least one receiver in order to stretch the defense is at least as valuable as physicality, and in Jennings (and Jones) for Green Bay, and in Wallace (and Brown) for the Steelers, both teams have a better deep threat than the Cowboys. Not only does this allow for actual deep passes and touchdowns, but the threat of that speed leads to several easier catches underneath for these players.I also find it interesting that most of this discussion has avoided discussing the aging veterans in Driver and Ward. Perhaps their greatest asset now is as mentors to their young, talented teammates. Even so, as 4th-5th options, they are still credible threats when their teams choose to go five wide.
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
That might be, but those receivers are still threats to be accounted for when in the spread offense, which a team like GB is in a lot.
That is one more than Austin and Bryant have COMBINED so far this year.
That's all fine, but Witten is definitely better than Finley, and I'll still take GB's corps over Dallas'. Austin was awesome in 2009, but he has mostly very good since the start of last year (not great), and Bryant is still a bit inconsistent and raw. He'll get better, but right now, here and now, Dallas' receiving corps does not touch Green Bay's, IMO.
Deamon
Footballguy
Maclin > DezDjax > AustinRobinson = Avant (slight nod to robinson)WItten > CelekHow are you not including philly here
Walton Goggins
Footballguy
I have Mike Wallace and funny enough with Roddy on his bye picked up Brown. I'm actually debating now to start Brown over Roddy given all the targets he'll get with Wallace being the focal point in the passing game.
Not including Philly for two reasons.A. Because I don't necessarily agree with anything in bold above.
B. Because including Philly in a discussion about whether Dallas's receiving corps is on par with Pittsburgh's or Green Bay's is a bit like including Elton John in a discussion about impressionist painters.
Deamon
Footballguy
Well from a fantasy stand point the bold has held true. I'm not saying fantasy means talent on the field, but I think Maclin and Djax have definitely proven they are up there. And the discussion was 'does pitt have the best wr corps in the league and who else is up there with them"
loose circuits
Footballguy
those of you questioning Philly's depth, I think that's only because you don't see Cooper & Smith on the field much. Cooper has some significant potential and if forced into action I think coaching staff would be comfortable with either of them if they were forced into action
Kitrick Taylor
Footballguy
Greg Cosell tweeted during the offseason his top 6 WRs in the league. They were:
1. AJ
2. CJ
3. Jennings
4. Fitz
5. Holmes
6. White
Wallace may make his list now, but that's what he tweeted back on May 25th.
http://twitter.com/#!/gregcosell
1. AJ
2. CJ
3. Jennings
4. Fitz
5. Holmes
6. White
Wallace may make his list now, but that's what he tweeted back on May 25th.
http://twitter.com/#!/gregcosell
Ghost Rider
Footballguy
There is no way, in real terms, that Dez is better than Maclin right now. Dez might look more beastly given his style, but he is still very raw; I am not sure he has the head to ever ascend into being a consistently elite WR. Maclin, on the other had, is already a very good and reliable WR.
treat88
Footballguy
Not going to guess how Cosell would rank'em but I'm sure that list would change somewhat after this half season.
That was the discussion in the OP, not in the post you quoted, which you asked me directly about. Philly was irrelevant there.
sbonomo
Footballguy
This group is so good it is hard to tell who is the best and who is the worst...
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
I think it's interesting that all the WR groups named here have great QB's. (Maybe Romo is not "great" but he definitely qualifies as "very good.")
Once upon a time Wayne/Collie/Garcon/Clark might have qualified, but now... not so much. Are they any less excellent receivers?
Also, about PIT WR's again, anyone have any idea whatsoever from FF perspective if Brown & Sanders continue to produce when Ward gets "better"?
Also if Ward keeps starting for the rest of the year it's hard to qualify the PIT WR group for "best" if 2 of them do not get their full playing time.
Once upon a time Wayne/Collie/Garcon/Clark might have qualified, but now... not so much. Are they any less excellent receivers?
Also, about PIT WR's again, anyone have any idea whatsoever from FF perspective if Brown & Sanders continue to produce when Ward gets "better"?
Also if Ward keeps starting for the rest of the year it's hard to qualify the PIT WR group for "best" if 2 of them do not get their full playing time.
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BigSteelThrill
Footballguy
Pretty sure Brown will. He is getting plenty of targets even with Ward around. After 5 weeks he was team leader, then fell behind Wallace after week 6, and is team leader once again.And despite his low TD output, he really has been targeted an awful lot in the end zone. Yesterday he had 3 additional end zone targets (at least), on 3 different drives, besides the drive were he actually did score.
I wont be surprised if his TD #s start to come around in the second half of the season, Id be surprised if they didnt.
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treat88
Footballguy
It's simply a matter of time before Ward is phased out of 3 receiver sets outside of the red zone.In fact, he's essentially been functioning as a rotational #2/3 since Sanders has regained full health.Ward will get snaps as long as he is on the team, but I don't think his presence significantly changes either Brown or Sanders production. In fact, the player who Ward impacts the most is likely Heath Miller as they are utilized on the same type of routes and coverages regardless of position designation.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
So for the people who say the GB corps is better than PIT, if you put Rodgers on PIT (with PITs OL), and Roethlisberger on GB (with GBs OL), do you still think the GB corps would be better? I think Rodgers makes those WRs look better, even Jennings, whereas the PIT WRs are producing more because of their talent and have their numbers somewhat limited by PITs below average OL.
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Shawnky
Footballguy
Saints crew is even better.
Saints might be the best. Depth with underrated Lance Moore, Meachem and Henderson. The top TE target in the game. And a solid Colston that isn't going to wow you like Dez, DJax, and even Jennings, but he's a tough matchup for any defense with Brees feeding him.
Saints > Patriots > Packers > Steelers > Eagles > Cowboys.
Saints > Patriots > Packers > Steelers > Eagles > Cowboys.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
Moore is their WR2 and youre bringing the Saints into the discussion?! Colston isnt as good as PIT, GB, PHI, or DAL top WR either.The fact that you have NE over the rest is even more laughable. I realize their TEs are very good, but overall they arent even close and there's a reason why youre the first person to bring them up.
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Shawnky
Footballguy
I'll take Colston over everyone except Jennings. He's better than Miles/Dez and Wallace. I really like Wallace, but he's nowhere the complete WR that Colston is.
Kenny Powers
Footballguy
How is Colston a complete WR? I would say he's a bigger redzone threat than Wallace, but on the same note, NO doesnt run screens or quick slants for Colston. Just because Wallace has more speed doesnt mean he is not as complete of a WR. Not like fantasy pts should be the decision, but this years PPG in my league areWallace: 15.96ptsColston: 10.98ptsAgain, not like fantasy is a judge for talent but thats a pretty big gap (Wallace is actually ahead of Jennings). I realize this thread wasnt based on potential/age, but Id def rather have Dez or Maclin than Colston as well.I'll take Colston over everyone except Jennings. He's better than Miles/Dez and Wallace. I really like Wallace, but he's nowhere the complete WR that Colston is.
Islanders rule
Footballguy
Agreed. Especially with Sproles in the mix.Free tip - Pick up and play the Chiefs Defense the next two weeks. Look at who they play! Sweet!
duaneok66
Footballguy
Henderson and Meachem are limited - they often disappear during long stretches of games.
Drunken Cowboy
Footballguy
Yes. They got old.
