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Taunting “emphasis” is the worst rule change ever: agree or disagree? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Hot Sauce Guy
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
The problem is it’s an interpretation. Hard to learn when the goalposts shift.
I’m talking about the subtle ones, not he throat slash gesture or preventing a player from getting up kinda stuff.
wgoldsph
Footballguy
Exactly this. A guy is going to get up celebrating after a big play, take a step or two towards the other teams bench because that's the way he was facing when he got up and then draw a foul. Get one of those questionable flags on a big 4th quarter play and suddenly half the football watching world is debating if a player was taunting their opponents or the sky.
Either way glad to see the NFL taking on its biggest problems first, like they always do.
crushedspirit
Footballguy
Watching a game turn because someone stared at a sideline in a menacing fashion was brutal to watch, even though it benefitted the team I cheer for. I'm not a fan of that call, or anything similar. Problem with the NFL is they leave the refs to interpret the vagueness of the rule, and that's when you get the foolish random calls from nowhere. A rule like this needs a clear black and white guideline to ever be implemented properly.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
That’s my belief as well.
Provide a clearly defined list of gestures and/or actions that constitute a taunting penalty.
That way the players, coaches & refs all know what is, and is not against the rules.
Otherwise it has potential to have a major impact on the outcome of a game, as we’ve seen in 2021.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
No, then people will P&M about how the list is too long and hard to remember, and has silly inclusions, and...
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
They're gonna P&M regardless, so better to have it all clearly defined.
Remember: NONE of this "emphasis" was due to fan or public outcry. This was something NFL owners wanted.
And it reeks of when they clamped down on celebrations in the NFL and faced huge public backlash as the "no fun league" - and they caved, and celebrations were allowed again, including team-celebrations.
So this seems like their petty way of pushing back.
It would be super easy to have a list. They want it to be nebulous. Because they don't want players celebrating after big plays at all.
Neil Beaufort Zod
Footballguy
Can they make a rule saying that, when a player forces a turnover and they all run into the end zone (that they didn't cross during the play) to celebrate...the player is ejected?
They can taunt, fight, whatever. But stop running into the end zone to celebrate when you didn't even score. It's dumb.
They can taunt, fight, whatever. But stop running into the end zone to celebrate when you didn't even score. It's dumb.
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Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
99-ish% of it is simple...start with not directing your antics in the direction of your opponent.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I agree. It’s that 1% of the time that potentially ruins the credibility of the game that I take issue with.Andy Dufresne said:
Any nebulous interpretive call at the end of a close & right game is problematic, in my opinion.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
It's called football for a reason
-You just can't have players running over and spiking the ball on the opposing sidelines and regardless of whether that happens on every interception or fumble it eventually dissolves into something close to this and then fights break out.
-In hockey you can do it because they allow for a certain number of fights to occur during a game. Eventually the 2 bullies work it out but in football that's not allowed. Maybe they should allow for a 20-30 second fistfight in between Quarters but my guess is most would prefer that never happens. So in lieu of this, outlawing taunting seems logical even if we disagree from a fan's stand every once in a while.
-You just can't have players running over and spiking the ball on the opposing sidelines and regardless of whether that happens on every interception or fumble it eventually dissolves into something close to this and then fights break out.
-In hockey you can do it because they allow for a certain number of fights to occur during a game. Eventually the 2 bullies work it out but in football that's not allowed. Maybe they should allow for a 20-30 second fistfight in between Quarters but my guess is most would prefer that never happens. So in lieu of this, outlawing taunting seems logical even if we disagree from a fan's stand every once in a while.
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SeniorVBDStudent
Footballguy
1. Tuck Rule (and that's from a Pats fan!)
2. Whatever emphasis change made TO's catch not a catch
3. Taunting emphasis (why the F do they allow those inherently stupid team celebrations mugging in front of monitors?)
2. Whatever emphasis change made TO's catch not a catch
3. Taunting emphasis (why the F do they allow those inherently stupid team celebrations mugging in front of monitors?)
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
no one is advocating for this though.
Asking for a clearly specified list of “Things you cannot do” isn’t suggesting we should throw knives & chainsaws on the field like Thunderdome.
Just say what they can’t do & there it is.
Celebrating after a big play is part of the emotion of the sport.
These aren’t rock em sock em robots. Humans get fired up after a big play. Let ‘em have their fun.
Taunting is taunting though. Define that, and there we are.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I’d say 1/2 of the people are ok with this, 1/2 are ambivalent, and the other 1/2 aren’t good at fractions.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
This is fair.If you can get banned from FBGs for taunting, it should be worth a 15 yard penalty in the NFL
wgoldsph
Footballguy
I've been banned for cursing out those terrible Aaron Rodgers state farm commercials before. How many yards is that?If you can get banned from FBGs for taunting, it should be worth a 15 yard penalty in the NFL
Again, when I stand up after hitting a guy and just happen to be facing my opponent because that's a 1/4th of the field...Andy Dufresne said:
much ado about nothing. 99% of taunting calls are for things I would be yelling at my own kid for doing on the field. PRO doesn't mean they should lack basic courtesy and sportsmanship. Quite the contrary, PRO should mean they demnonstrate it at all times one the field.
Trash talking is.....STUPID. I have absolutely no problem with flagging it
Trash talking is.....STUPID. I have absolutely no problem with flagging it
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
One could.
One could also get off your lawn, and turn down that rap and roll music.
:shakesfist:
JoeSteeler
Footballguy
Seems like this is the case for a lot of penalties. Holding, pass interference etc.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I have a big problem with DPI as well. That’s actually my biggest issue with the modern game. I get like a Costanza at Festivus when I start talking about that one.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
I'd rather be that type than the "anything you don't tell me I can't do I'm gonna do" type.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
I just don’t think it’s too much to ask for potential game-changing penalties to be clearly defined.
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
They are, just not to your liking.
Now, they might be enforced inconsistently but you're never going to take the human element out of human activities.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Much like you’re never going to take the joy of celebration out of a football player who made a game-changing play.
The Frankman
Footballguy
Here's the thing about this: If you are a player, you have to realize you can do pretty much any kind of taunt or celebration known to man... just don't do it directly in some dude's face or the opposing sideline and you're OK! How ingrained is it in players' minds that you tip a pass or you get beat by 5 yards but the opposing WR is overthrown, why do you have to immediately get in the dudes' face? It's moronic. No one is saying you need to act like a robot, but the NFL and most other sports (NBA says hi) that as long as you don't start something, you won't get penalized (mostly).
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Agree with pretty much everything here.
And for the most part the refs probably get it right.
I care more about the “emphasis” part where it might be overzealously applied.
Then it’s just one more thing for the refs to screw up. I want less of those opportunities for refs. They blow enough calls.
BoltBacker
Footballguy
I'm with you here.
They have trouble enough with simply the black and white rules that really matter. Did the guy have two feet in and possession. Did the ball hit the ground before the receiver scooped it up. Was the ball coming out before the knee was down.
There are just too many rules full stop, adding subjective rules for the refs to interpret is moving in the wrong direction.
But to answer the original question the "rule" where a player can catch the ball with two feet in bounds in the endzone, go out of bounds after the TD, and yet has to remain in possession of the ball as he's rolling around after the play is long over...... THAT is the dumbest rule change that has ever happened to the sport.
NO NO NO NO.
basic sportsmanship MATTERS. It matters to me because I want my kids and my grandkids to know HOW TO ACT. Don't be a doushwaffle....simple as that. Refs NEED to have a way to keep these young multi millionares in check, a way to keep them from acting like doushwaffles to each other, period. This isn't even a close matter, and I'm surprised that any (non- doushwaffle) would even wanna debate it.
I'm ok with them getting one or two of these calls wrong over the coarse of a season, because they NEED the rule, they NEED the punishment that goes with it, and I trust that they're going to get it right 98% of the time. They see and hear more on that field then we'll ever see on the TV. I'd bet my house that at least half the "bad unsportsmanlike calls" we see are actually good calls and we just don't get a good look/LISTEN into what precipitated them. This league would look a lot different without this rule, because lets face it, the NFL has a lot of not so stellar young men in it who absolutely WOULD act like doushwaffles without an associated penalty.
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
No one’s saying to allow taunting. yes, players can’t go unchecked.
it’s just a little nebulous. The “emphasis” part resulted in a massive uptick in penalty calls. It felt a little silly at times.
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BoltBacker
Footballguy
I enjoy your presence on the board and enjoy most of your posts but if I'm being completely honest.... I give zero ##### how the NFL effects your kids or grandkids.
Honestly, if the NFL or Hollywood or video game programmers are the deciding factor how your kids(and their kids) turn out then you have lost. You should just open the shoe box and watch the amish channel 'cos the NFL is not for you and your family. The NFL gave a one year ban for a player that drove drunk and KILLED a homeless person. An NFL owner did the same thing Watson did. No punishment. Another NFL player gets his offseason grins and giggles fighting dogs against one another until they die and comes back afterward. A "HOF QB" that just last year took his farewell tour and not many mentioned the rape accusation that most likely magically disappeared when the right number of zeroes found their way at the end of a check. At least the league put its foot down and Rae Carruth never played another down.
The "think of the children" argument just doesn't past muster in most cases. If you are afraid your children are going to turn out like an NFL player believe me taunting is not the thing that should be giving you nightmares. You might want to consider getting them away from NFL football altogether if they are that impressionable. That will leave them more time to surf the internet.
Again, I like you as a poster. I just really don't like that argument.
this is virtually impossible....as with anything else....they will come up with new ones that we "haven't seen before"....
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Safe to say this would not be allowed today
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CbtvLlWDP9j/?utm_medium=copy_link
it shouldn't matter how much time is on the clock....you can't ask refs to call it differently depending on game time, score, etc....you just cant...
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Correct. I’m not arguing that at all. I’m saying when they blow a call in a close and late game it’s a more significant problem.
so by having more penalties subject to interpretation, it increases the chances of a blown call in a late and close situation.
you keep getting hung up on "game changing penalties".....you will continue to be frustrated if this is the way you are approaching the subject....score, momentum, time left on the clock, etc....have nothing to do with it...
I think many in here are confusing "celebrating" with "taunting"....
and I tried to look it up but none of the explanations really make sense to me....what is the sliding the fingers under the nose thing mean....in the sports world or whatever....I know what that kinda meant to me when I was in high school....and its not safe to describe....
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
If it’s a blown call because someone interpreted a rule incorrectly, then the situation absolutely matters. If a ref makes an incorrect call late and close it can literally determine the outcome of the game. That is why I take issue with calls that are a matter of interpretation. This isn’t a complex concept.
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its a 60 minute game...when you start asking refs to ref different in the last 5 minutes than the first 5 minutes....you are going to have a ton of problems....and you will 100% complain about that too....
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just imagine if it was "known" and agreed upon that the refs will "call it different" at the end of a game than at the beginning....have fun with that...
Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
Again, I am not asking for that.
how do you keep misunderstanding the point I’ve made 3x? I’ll try again.
i want fewer calls that are a matter of interpretation.
separate statement: when any call is blown late and close, it can determine the outcome of a game.
related statement: if a call that is a matter of interpretation is blown late and close, it is also bad.
Conclusion: it is my belief that we should have fewer rules that are subject to interpretation by the refs. This would reduce the number of games ruined by bad calls subject to interpretation close and late.
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Hot Sauce Guy
Footballguy
This is like the longest running straw man argument of all time. Maybe you should post 9 more times in defense of something that literally no one is saying.
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