The Birther Conspiracy Thread (2 Viewers)

[The Commish]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

 

[matuski]

Tim, you make all sorts of silly assertions. For instance, you thought Palin would forever be tied to the Giffords shooting, but yet that is a distance memory and nobody associates Palin with that anymore.

That was a prediction, not an assertion of fact. What I said was that it would marginalize her further. I think it has, though unfortunately not to the extent I predicted. If she was actually running for President I think it would matter more.

You are playing a game of semantics. An assertion is a confident and forceful statement of fact or belief. It has absolutely not come true, and also you are not doing a very good job at immediately admitting when you were wrong.

You have promised a thorough post on Hawaii's lax BC laws for weeks. You gonna come through on this or back off it like so many other angles you've tried and failed on?Waiting patiently.

 

[TobiasFunke]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

This question has been answered repeatedly. A right-wing nut news site took the figure that the Obama spent on legal fees for the campaign and made the ridiculous, obviously incorrect assumption that all of that money went to the birther fight. After this stupidity made the rounds enough to get noticed, more responsible journalists and commentators pointed out the obvious error, and supplemented this by pointing out that the McCain campaign had spent a similar amount in legal fees.

Sorry...I missed it after I asked and I certainly wasn't going back to wade through the crazy to find where someone else asked and it got answered....thanks for saving me from that. I just wanted to understand where they were getting the accusation.

No problem.You should consider wading back through the crazy, though. It's hilarious.

 

[randall146]

I'll do some more later. There's just far too many. Have to make sure I get some of Jon and Bronco Billy's more silly comments.

So how does this affect my position. I've stated several times that I thought he was born in Hawaii.I still don't understand how a guy who pledged to run the most transparent administration in this country's history has to take 3 years to do something as simple as present his birth certificate. If he was waiting for some kind of politically advatageous time to do it, why does he gets flushed from cover by a politically irrelevant guy like Trump? He feels the need to get Trump off his back so he trots it out, but he couldn't step up & produce it when Dr. Lakin requested it and instead let the 18 year vet go to Leavenworth for 6 months and then take a dishonorable discharge instead? That pretty sums up what this guy is all about.

Yes, he's clearly all about expecting military personnel to accept their orders instead of trying to wiggle out of them.

 

[timschochet]

So now it is actually being argued that Obama had a responsibility to save that idiotic nut who went to Leavenworth? The guy who disobeyed orders because he believed Obama to be illegitimate? Of all the points Bronco Billy has made in this thread, this is possibly the worst one.

 

[Bronco Billy]

Yes, he's clearly all about expecting military personnel to accept their orders instead of trying to wiggle out of them.

Let me make my position clear as I have previously - I thought Lakin used extremely poor judgment and poor tactics in fighting his fight the way he did. I do not agree with his methods, and I think he was foolhardy to do what he did.But let's also not make any mistakes - Lakin had an impeccable service record with multiple tours of duty into combat zones and service at Walter Reed. He never shirked his duty and by all accounts his service was nothing short of exemplary.This also muddies the argument that despite Lakin using very poor judgment, Obama by a simple act could have circumvented Lakin's exemplary service to date from being flushed down the toilet and could have kept Lakin out of Leavenworth with a simple act that we now see he was easily able to perform. Lakin would have done another tour of duty, could have continued to serve the country admirably, and most importantly could have continued to provide top-notch medical attention to our soldiers overseas.Lakin was stupid to do what he did IMO, but Obama was intentionally and deliberately neglectful in allowing the drama to play itself when he could have done exactly what he did yesteday a couple of months earlier and stopped it in its tracks.

 

[Fennis]

I'll do some more later. There's just far too many. Have to make sure I get some of Jon and Bronco Billy's more silly comments.

So how does this affect my position. I've stated several times that I thought he was born in Hawaii.I still don't understand how a guy who pledged to run the most transparent administration in this country's history has to take 3 years to do something as simple as present his birth certificate. If he was waiting for some kind of politically advatageous time to do it, why does he gets flushed from cover by a politically irrelevant guy like Trump? He feels the need to get Trump off his back so he trots it out, but he couldn't step up & produce it when Dr. Lakin requested it and instead let the 18 year vet go to Leavenworth for 6 months and then take a dishonorable discharge instead? That pretty sums up what this guy is all about.

And this post sums up what you're all about. A lot was accomplished in the last 24 hours.

 

[Bronco Billy]

And this post sums up what you're all about. A lot was accomplished in the last 24 hours.

Expecting a President to be accountable to his constituency? Supporting a citizen's right to question politicians? Okay, guilty as charged.

 

[Buddy Ball 2K3]

Lakin was stupid to do what he did IMO, but Obama was intentionally and deliberately neglectful in allowing the drama to play itself when he could have done exactly what he did yesteday a couple of months earlier and stopped it in its tracks.

It takes time to photoshop a new b/c.

 

[The Commish]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Sam?

 

[Mr. Pickles]

I'll do some more later. There's just far too many. Have to make sure I get some of Jon and Bronco Billy's more silly comments.

So how does this affect my position. I've stated several times that I thought he was born in Hawaii.I still don't understand how a guy who pledged to run the most transparent administration in this country's history has to take 3 years to do something as simple as present his birth certificate. If he was waiting for some kind of politically advatageous time to do it, why does he gets flushed from cover by a politically irrelevant guy like Trump? He feels the need to get Trump off his back so he trots it out, but he couldn't step up & produce it when Dr. Lakin requested it and instead let the 18 year vet go to Leavenworth for 6 months and then take a dishonorable discharge instead? That pretty sums up what this guy is all about.

Never change.

 

[timschochet]

Yes, he's clearly all about expecting military personnel to accept their orders instead of trying to wiggle out of them.

Let me make my position clear as I have previously - I thought Lakin used extremely poor judgment and poor tactics in fighting his fight the way he did. I do not agree with his methods, and I think he was foolhardy to do what he did.But let's also not make any mistakes - Lakin had an impeccable service record with multiple tours of duty into combat zones and service at Walter Reed. He never shirked his duty and by all accounts his service was nothing short of exemplary.This also muddies the argument that despite Lakin using very poor judgment, Obama by a simple act could have circumvented Lakin's exemplary service to date from being flushed down the toilet and could have kept Lakin out of Leavenworth with a simple act that we now see he was easily able to perform. Lakin would have done another tour of duty, could have continued to serve the country admirably, and most importantly could have continued to provide top-notch medical attention to our soldiers overseas.Lakin was stupid to do what he did IMO, but Obama was intentionally and deliberately neglectful in allowing the drama to play itself when he could have done exactly what he did yesteday a couple of months earlier and stopped it in its tracks.

Sorry, but this is simply wrong. I don't care what this guy did in the past, though I thank him for his service. His present action proves him an idiot, likely racist, who is unworthy of the uniform. I'm glad he's in prison. I wouldn't want him serving again. The idea that Obama was "intentionally and deliberately neglectful" by not immediately responding to a bunch of whackos, racists, and opportunists is absurd. The only reason he "gave in" yesterday is because the Republican party was embarrassing itself with its poll results. It's you guys, not him, that should be ashamed of yourselves.

 

[[icon]]

I'll do some more later. There's just far too many. Have to make sure I get some of Jon and Bronco Billy's more silly comments.

So how does this affect my position. I've stated several times that I thought he was born in Hawaii.I still don't understand how a guy who pledged to run the most transparent administration in this country's history has to take 3 years to do something as simple as present his birth certificate. If he was waiting for some kind of politically advatageous time to do it, why does he gets flushed from cover by a politically irrelevant guy like Trump? He feels the need to get Trump off his back so he trots it out, but he couldn't step up & produce it when Dr. Lakin requested it and instead let the 18 year vet go to Leavenworth for 6 months and then take a dishonorable discharge instead? That pretty sums up what this guy is all about.

My god we really are through the looking glass.

Bronco Billy? Is that You?!

 

[Bronco Billy]

The only reason he "gave in" yesterday is because the Republican party was embarrassing itself with its poll results. It's you guys, not him, that should be ashamed of yourselves.

 

[CBusAlex]

I would like a prediction from people.

A week ago, a national poll found that some 40% of Republicans believed that Obama was born outside of the United States, while another 20% was unsure. I am assuming there will be another poll in a few days or week from now, once today's news has had time to sink in.

Please predict how Republicans will react to this news. Will the numbers change significantly?

I think the numbers will actually increase. I mean, if the birth certificate from two years ago didn't convince someone, there's no reason this one should.

 

[The Commish]

I would like a prediction from people.

A week ago, a national poll found that some 40% of Republicans believed that Obama was born outside of the United States, while another 20% was unsure. I am assuming there will be another poll in a few days or week from now, once today's news has had time to sink in.

Please predict how Republicans will react to this news. Will the numbers change significantly?

I think the numbers will actually increase. I mean, if the birth certificate from two years ago didn't convince someone, there's no reason this one should.

This.....I suspect the 40% will increase. The "unsure" will definitely decrease.

 

[Slapdash]

Lakin was stupid to do what he did IMO, but Obama was intentionally and deliberately neglectful in allowing the drama to play itself when he could have done exactly what he did yesteday a couple of months earlier and stopped it in its tracks.

It takes time to photoshop a new b/c.

You need to try harder to hang with the whackos in this thread.

 

[The Commish]

Lakin was stupid to do what he did IMO, but Obama was intentionally and deliberately neglectful in allowing the drama to play itself when he could have done exactly what he did yesteday a couple of months earlier and stopped it in its tracks.

He gave them the evidence two years ago and it wasn't good enough. What was given yesterday still isn't good enough. The conspiracy lives on!!!! Keep it up crazies There are a ton of things that folks can rip on Obama for, but this isn't one of them, yet here we are with crap like this....good job.

 

[Mr. Pickles]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

Now the real question is why did the White House put out an obvious fake b/c?

Uh oh

Open it up in photoshop, its clearly been altered.

Great stuff from Alex Jones, as usual. "We have Photoshop experts. Hundreds of Photoshop sites have taken a look at this. People with degrees in Photoshop have looked at it."

"Okay, so we open this in Illustrator..."



Lots of hobbyists who scored a free copy of Illustrator are suddenly learning how the program works for the first time.

Embrace your ignorance. The world is a complicated place. Knowing stuff about stuff is hard work.

 

[TinHat]

Tim, you make all sorts of silly assertions. For instance, you thought Palin would forever be tied to the Giffords shooting, but yet that association was proven inaccurate and nobody associates Palin with that anymore.

Yeah, but there was so much evidence that Sarah Palin had nothing to do with the Giffords shootings that only true wingnuts like Paul Krugman grasp at some connection. Let's face it -- a good portion of Birthers likely are racists and Trump is associated with that movement. Then Trump went on to suggest that Obama didn't have the grades to get into Ivy League schools which hints at a affirmative action. Now, most recently, Trump said Obama needs to spend less time on the basketball court. None of the positions themselves are necessarily racist, but when you put them all together that's the picture many get and that's what The Donald has now been labelled with. I don't think that's going away anytime soon because people are more emotional about that issue, and it's more difficult to refute than the allegations against Palin. It might not be true, but Trump will be wearing that racist label in a lot of people's eyes for sometime to come.

He should have said golf course...

 

[bigbottom]

Yes, he's clearly all about expecting military personnel to accept their orders instead of trying to wiggle out of them.

Let me make my position clear as I have previously - I thought Lakin used extremely poor judgment and poor tactics in fighting his fight the way he did. I do not agree with his methods, and I think he was foolhardy to do what he did.But let's also not make any mistakes - Lakin had an impeccable service record with multiple tours of duty into combat zones and service at Walter Reed. He never shirked his duty and by all accounts his service was nothing short of exemplary.This also muddies the argument that despite Lakin using very poor judgment, Obama by a simple act could have circumvented Lakin's exemplary service to date from being flushed down the toilet and could have kept Lakin out of Leavenworth with a simple act that we now see he was easily able to perform. Lakin would have done another tour of duty, could have continued to serve the country admirably, and most importantly could have continued to provide top-notch medical attention to our soldiers overseas.Lakin was stupid to do what he did IMO, but Obama was intentionally and deliberately neglectful in allowing the drama to play itself when he could have done exactly what he did yesteday a couple of months earlier and stopped it in its tracks.

"I'm going to refuse to follow orders unless President Obama sends me an autographed basketball!""I'm going to refuse to follow orders unless President Obama calls me on my birthday and sings happy birthday over the phone!""I'm going to refuse to follow orders unless President Obama works in a 'hoo-rah' into his next speech!""If the President allows me to go to prison for disobeying orders, when then he's just a selfish unAmerican jerk!"

 

[Lutherman2112]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.

I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Full list of lawsuits available here.Scorecard:

Total Cases: 74

Obama Defense: 3

Gov Defense: 9

Unknown: 1

Trial/Original Court

Total Cases: 74

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 73

Pending: 1

Appellate Court

Rulings: 43

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 41

Pending: 2

Supreme Court

Rulings: 15

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 15

Pending: 0

 

[Charlie Frown]

Forget Trump's tax returns, I wanna see his real hairline.

 

[Bronco Billy]

"I'm going to refuse to follow orders unless President Obama sends me an autographed basketball!""I'm going to refuse to follow orders unless President Obama calls me on my birthday and sings happy birthday over the phone!""I'm going to refuse to follow orders unless President Obama works in a 'hoo-rah' into his next speech!""If the President allows me to go to prison for disobeying orders, when then he's just a selfish unAmerican jerk!"

Didn't expect that from you.

 

[CBusAlex]

18 suits filed by whom?

Chris Matthews, obviously.

 

[randall146]

Yes, he's clearly all about expecting military personnel to accept their orders instead of trying to wiggle out of them.

Let me make my position clear as I have previously - I thought Lakin used extremely poor judgment and poor tactics in fighting his fight the way he did. I do not agree with his methods, and I think he was foolhardy to do what he did.But let's also not make any mistakes - Lakin had an impeccable service record with multiple tours of duty into combat zones and service at Walter Reed. He never shirked his duty and by all accounts his service was nothing short of exemplary.This also muddies the argument that despite Lakin using very poor judgment, Obama by a simple act could have circumvented Lakin's exemplary service to date from being flushed down the toilet and could have kept Lakin out of Leavenworth with a simple act that we now see he was easily able to perform. Lakin would have done another tour of duty, could have continued to serve the country admirably, and most importantly could have continued to provide top-notch medical attention to our soldiers overseas.Lakin was stupid to do what he did IMO, but Obama was intentionally and deliberately neglectful in allowing the drama to play itself when he could have done exactly what he did yesteday a couple of months earlier and stopped it in its tracks.

Yes it would be excellent precedent to allow soldiers to force their commanders to prove their credentials each time they gave an order.

 

[The Commish]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.

I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Full list of lawsuits available here.Scorecard:

Total Cases: 74

Obama Defense: 3

Gov Defense: 9

Unknown: 1

Trial/Original Court

Total Cases: 74

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 73

Pending: 1

Appellate Court

Rulings: 43

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 41

Pending: 2

Supreme Court

Rulings: 15

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 15

Pending: 0

If I am reading this correctly, these are suits filed AGAINST Obama, yes? Sam and company are complaining that he's spending money to defend himself? How about getting mad at the whackos for filing these bogus lawsuits causing Obama to have to defend himself?

 

[TinHat]

Tim, you make all sorts of silly assertions. For instance, you thought Palin would forever be tied to the Giffords shooting, but yet that association was proven inaccurate and nobody associates Palin with that anymore.

Yeah, but there was so much evidence that Sarah Palin had nothing to do with the Giffords shootings that only true wingnuts like Paul Krugman grasp at some connection. Let's face it -- a good portion of Birthers likely are racists and Trump is associated with that movement. Then Trump went on to suggest that Obama didn't have the grades to get into Ivy League schools which hints at a affirmative action. Now, most recently, Trump said Obama needs to spend less time on the basketball court. None of the positions themselves are necessarily racist, but when you put them all together that's the picture many get and that's what The Donald has now been labelled with. I don't think that's going away anytime soon because people are more emotional about that issue, and it's more difficult to refute than the allegations against Palin. It might not be true, but Trump will be wearing that racist label in a lot of people's eyes for sometime to come.

Trying to tie the word target and a picture of a what a target looks like to an assassination attempt by some kook is crazy, dangerous and intolerant.

 

[randall146]

Lakin would have done another tour of duty, could have continued to serve the country admirably, and most importantly could have continued to provide top-notch medical attention to our soldiers overseas.

He's the one who chose not to continue providing medical attention to the soldiers he was duty-bound to serve. He's a deserter and, if your assessment of his medical prowess is correct, he's now responsible for our soldiers getting worse medical care.

 

[flufhed]

 

[TinHat]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.I'd WAG a couple hundred K

The Obama campaign was also larger than the McCain one in scope (meaning more offices with more leases and more bills, more venues used, etc). Plus any money he spent fighting birthers wouldn't necessarily have been avoided by releasing the document he released yesterday earlier. As we're seeing now, many of the lunatics who initially bought into this are crazy enough to keep fighting the fight no matter what. They could have been in the delivery room staring right up his mother's hoo-ha with a magnifying glass, and they still could bring a lawsuit that would necessitate a reply if they wanted to.

If somebody's willing to work up a ballpark estimate we can have that posted. We know the two million number was way high, but nobody else has put a number out there.

 

[TinHat]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Taitz, Keyes, Doniforio (sp?), Martin others

 

[CBusAlex]

If I am reading this correctly, these are suits filed AGAINST Obama, yes? Sam and company are complaining that he's spending money to defend himself? How about getting mad at the whackos for filing these bogus lawsuits causing Obama to have to defend himself?

If Obama had only released his long form birth certficate, his college transcripts, his baby photos, his full medical and dental records, his baptismal records, his REAL long form birth certificate, and admitted that he's a foreign muslim terrorist and resigned in disgrace, he could have avoided all these lawsuits in the first place. Doesn't it seem suspicious that he's spending millions of dollars in legal fees to avoid this simple request?

 

[matuski]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.

I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Full list of lawsuits available here.Scorecard:

Total Cases: 74

Obama Defense: 3

Gov Defense: 9

Unknown: 1

Trial/Original Court

Total Cases: 74

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 73

Pending: 1

Appellate Court

Rulings: 43

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 41

Pending: 2

Supreme Court

Rulings: 15

Birthers win: 0

Constitution wins: 15

Pending: 0

If I am reading this correctly, these are suits filed AGAINST Obama, yes? Sam and company are complaining that he's spending money to defend himself? How about getting mad at the whackos for filing these bogus lawsuits causing Obama to have to defend himself?

100% correct. Also misleading to imply that any candidate or political office holder doesn't "spend" money defending ridiculous lawsuits.0 for 73. This is awesome.

 

[The Commish]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Taitz, Keyes, Doniforio (sp?), Martin others

So why are folks upset with Obama if these morons are bringing these suits against him? Why wouldn't they be upset at them?

 

[TinHat]

18 suits filed by whom?

Chris Matthews, obviously.

He keeps "staining" them when obama give a speech

 

[The Commish]

If I am reading this correctly, these are suits filed AGAINST Obama, yes? Sam and company are complaining that he's spending money to defend himself? How about getting mad at the whackos for filing these bogus lawsuits causing Obama to have to defend himself?

If Obama had only released his long form birth certficate, his college transcripts, his baby photos, his full medical and dental records, his baptismal records, his REAL long form birth certificate, and admitted that he's a foreign muslim terrorist and resigned in disgrace, he could have avoided all these lawsuits in the first place. Doesn't it seem suspicious that he's spending millions of dollars in legal fees to avoid this simple request?

 

[TinHat]

If I am reading this correctly, these are suits filed AGAINST Obama, yes? Sam and company are complaining that he's spending money to defend himself? How about getting mad at the whackos for filing these bogus lawsuits causing Obama to have to defend himself?

If Obama had only released his long form birth certficate, his college transcripts, his baby photos, his full medical and dental records, his baptismal records, his REAL long form birth certificate, and admitted that he's a foreign muslim terrorist and resigned in disgrace, he could have avoided all these lawsuits in the first place. Doesn't it seem suspicious that he's spending millions of dollars in legal fees to avoid this simple request?

 

[TobiasFunke]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.

I'd WAG a couple hundred K

The Obama campaign was also larger than the McCain one in scope (meaning more offices with more leases and more bills, more venues used, etc). Plus any money he spent fighting birthers wouldn't necessarily have been avoided by releasing the document he released yesterday earlier. As we're seeing now, many of the lunatics who initially bought into this are crazy enough to keep fighting the fight no matter what. They could have been in the delivery room staring right up his mother's hoo-ha with a magnifying glass, and they still could bring a lawsuit that would necessitate a reply if they wanted to.

If somebody's willing to work up a ballpark estimate we can have that posted. We know the two million number was way high, but nobody else has put a number out there.

You can't really work up a reasonable estimate. The data's not there. You could, I suppose, subtract the amount spent by McCain as of the date of this article (1.3 million) from the amount spent by Obama (2.8 million), leaving you with 1.5 million to account for somehow. But then you'd also have to subtract that amount of that difference attributable to the much larger scope of the Obama campaign, as well as the amounts attributable to the fact that he won. We can't really know either of these.Also, it shouldn't matter. As I said, even if the people bringing the lawsuit had witnessed Obama's birth themselves and conducted DNA tests every year of his life to ensure that the person elected president was the same person they saw emerge from a birth canal in August 1961 in Hawaii, they still would have been free to bring legal challenges, and Obama would have been forced to respond. So it's not like he spent money he could have avoided spending. As we're seeing now, nutjobs are nutjobs no matter what evidence is presented.

 

[The Commish]

If I am reading this correctly, these are suits filed AGAINST Obama, yes? Sam and company are complaining that he's spending money to defend himself? How about getting mad at the whackos for filing these bogus lawsuits causing Obama to have to defend himself?

If Obama had only released his long form birth certficate, his college transcripts, his baby photos, his full medical and dental records, his baptismal records, his REAL long form birth certificate, and admitted that he's a foreign muslim terrorist and resigned in disgrace, he could have avoided all these lawsuits in the first place. Doesn't it seem suspicious that he's spending millions of dollars in legal fees to avoid this simple request?

Go back a couple pages and catch up.

 

[Jewell]

The only reason he "gave in" yesterday is because the Republican party was embarrassing itself with its poll results. It's you guys, not him, that should be ashamed of yourselves.

I have a theory as to why so many were inclined to believe Obama's birth certificate would reveal something negative.It's like a wife who knows her husband is cheating. There have been nights in the past where he was out late, but when the wife asked him if he was with another woman -- he denied it. This becomes a recurring pattern and a paranoia builds in the wife's head. Then, one night, hubby goes out with the boys after work. When wifey confronts him on it he says he was out with the guys, but she refuses to believe this truth because she knows the husband concealed that he was with another woman during those other nights out.Plenty of Birthers are racists, plenty aren't racist but honestly believed Obama was born elsewhere, and plenty took the position that so many other less desirable aspects about Obama have not been properly vetted by the media so why not this? Obama was telling the truth about his birth, but many couldn't accept it because of how the media covered up other negatives from Obama's past. Had the media been more truthful and thorough in vetting those other past aspects, I bet many would have felt more comfortable that the media got it right again when they refuted Birther claims.If you're tossing shame around for those high Birther figures, apportion a little to the media.

 

[Fennis]

Bronco Billy-

Now looking back at it, which of these "facts" that you claimed, were you right about and which were you wrong about:

[*]Race was not a "fill-in-the-blank", it was a check box selection, just as it is on government forms today.

[*]The newspaper stories of Obama’s birth were planted?

[*]Obama’s parents were unmarried?

[*]Obama wasn’t born in a hospital?

 

[TinHat]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Taitz, Keyes, Doniforio (sp?), Martin others

So why are folks upset with Obama if these morons are bringing these suits against him? Why wouldn't they be upset at them?

I think the crux of the suits was to prove his eligibility in a court of law by providing the requested document. He has every right and then some to file briefs to get the cases dismissed. What people are saying is that he spent money and time to avoid providing the document rather than providing the document. He has every right to do so, but people were questioning the justification for that decision from a financial standpoint. The only people that seem to upset are those bringing up Col deserter.

 

[Fennis]

The only reason he "gave in" yesterday is because the Republican party was embarrassing itself with its poll results. It's you guys, not him, that should be ashamed of yourselves.

I have a theory as to why so many were inclined to believe Obama's birth certificate would reveal something negative.It's like a wife who knows her husband is cheating. There have been nights in the past where he was out late, but when the wife asked him if he was with another woman -- he denied it. This becomes a recurring pattern and a paranoia builds in the wife's head. Then, one night, hubby goes out with the boys after work. When wifey confronts him on it he says he was out with the guys, but she refuses to believe this truth because she knows the husband concealed that he was with another woman during those other nights out.Plenty of Birthers are racists, plenty aren't racist but honestly believed Obama was born elsewhere, and plenty took the position that so many other less desirable aspects about Obama have not been properly vetted by the media so why not this? Obama was telling the truth about his birth, but many couldn't accept it because of how the media covered up other negatives from Obama's past. Had the media been more truthful and thorough in vetting those other past aspects, I bet many would have felt more comfortable that the media got it right again when they refuted Birther claims.If you're tossing shame around for those high Birther figures, apportion a little to the media.

percent of blame:Obama 80%the "left" 15%media 4% (although really the media is all left so we should just combine the two)birthers 2%military deserters -1%about right?

 

[culdeus]

I'm seriously dissapointed with the quality of the bumped quoted posts here.

 

[The Commish]

The only reason he "gave in" yesterday is because the Republican party was embarrassing itself with its poll results. It's you guys, not him, that should be ashamed of yourselves.

I have a theory as to why so many were inclined to believe Obama's birth certificate would reveal something negative.It's like a wife who knows her husband is cheating. There have been nights in the past where he was out late, but when the wife asked him if he was with another woman -- he denied it. This becomes a recurring pattern and a paranoia builds in the wife's head. Then, one night, hubby goes out with the boys after work. When wifey confronts him on it he says he was out with the guys, but she refuses to believe this truth because she knows the husband concealed that he was with another woman during those other nights out.Plenty of Birthers are racists, plenty aren't racist but honestly believed Obama was born elsewhere, and plenty took the position that so many other less desirable aspects about Obama have not been properly vetted by the media so why not this? Obama was telling the truth about his birth, but many couldn't accept it because of how the media covered up other negatives from Obama's past. Had the media been more truthful and thorough in vetting those other past aspects, I bet many would have felt more comfortable that the media got it right again when they refuted Birther claims.If you're tossing shame around for those high Birther figures, apportion a little to the media.

If you believe the "media" is in business to report facts. This seems to be a consistently missed fact. The media isn't in the business of getting to the truth. It's in the business of producing ratings. Knowing that, the individual is STILL responsible for understanding that and taking what they say with a grain of salt. So if the media is misleading folks, it's because they are allowing themselves to be mislead.

 

[cr8f]

Jon Stewart-wouldn't a bombshell be him not being from america?

His classic on the birther issue almost 2 years ago.

 

[tommy300]

What do the birthers and shuke have in common? Both are on 0-73 streaks, although it is lawsuits and finding pron under the mattress in a hotel...

 

[The Commish]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Taitz, Keyes, Doniforio (sp?), Martin others

So why are folks upset with Obama if these morons are bringing these suits against him? Why wouldn't they be upset at them?

I think the crux of the suits was to prove his eligibility in a court of law by providing the requested document. He has every right and then some to file briefs to get the cases dismissed. What people are saying is that he spent money and time to avoid providing the document rather than providing the document. He has every right to do so, but people were questioning the justification for that decision from a financial standpoint. The only people that seem to upset are those bringing up Col deserter.

He gave them certified documents 2.5 years ago. For normal people, that ended it. For these people, not so much. It was a bogus witch hunt. Let's not give these loon a pass. They were just as responsible for bringing the suits in the first place as Obama was for defending himself.

 

[TinHat]

Ok...so I asked this question a while ago but it got lost in the crazy. I keep hearing (not just here) that Obama spent XXX amount of money in legal fees to keep this quiet. What exactly did that money go to? What did he have to actively pay for to keep this quiet? Because if he really did spend all that money, he's really no better than the whacko birthers.

The actual number is unknownwe can compare the campiagns' post-election legal spending and see that McCain spent 1.3 million and Obama over 2 million. We also know that at least 18 suits were filed.I'd WAG a couple hundred K

18 suits filed by whom?

Taitz, Keyes, Doniforio (sp?), Martin others

So why are folks upset with Obama if these morons are bringing these suits against him? Why wouldn't they be upset at them?

I think the crux of the suits was to prove his eligibility in a court of law by providing the requested document. He has every right and then some to file briefs to get the cases dismissed. What people are saying is that he spent money and time to avoid providing the document rather than providing the document. He has every right to do so, but people were questioning the justification for that decision from a financial standpoint. The only people that seem to upset are those bringing up Col deserter.

He gave them certified documents 2.5 years ago. For normal people, that ended it. For these people, not so much. It was a bogus witch hunt. Let's not give these loon a pass. They were just as responsible for bringing the suits in the first place as Obama was for defending himself.

he posted an image on a website as his proof