The Birther Conspiracy Thread (2 Viewers)

[Sam Quentin]

I really don't get the people who are so opposed to the birthers. I get that the birthers are loony and easy to make fun of. But some people get so worked up being anti-birthers, they're just as bad. And I really don't understand the objection to the initial request. I mean, there are only two qualifications needed to become president, so, when this was first brought up, I don't get why people objected so vehemently to a person being asked to prove those qualifications.

For me, I actually think its a pretty interesting issue. And while I have no doubts that Obama was born in Hawaii, I do have my suspicions that he's hiding something.

*** SPOILER ALERT! Click this link to display the potential spoiler text in this box. ***");document.close();

The irony is that he doesn't seem to be hiding that...

 

[timschochet]

Different inquires or priorities I suppose, but having questions about the background of the president does not make one a racist, nor should you be so quick to label. As I recall this is not the first time you have quickly played that card.

I am not calling you a racist. Nor am I accusing any single birther in particular of being a racist. But I do think that racism is an ingrained part of this whole thing, and I'm not going to apologize for saying it. Yes there have been questions about the background of every president, but never to this extent.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Young men may do some ill-advised things when desperately seeking education. I want to know whether the man with his finger on the button had a history of desperate ill considered behavior. Even if he did i might accept explanation thereof, but i won't, in the office of president be satisfied with a "its none of your business he has privacy interests". For me these questions are reasonable,

Bro... the Feds comes and have a sit down and do a massive background check with everyone. From governors to congressmen to presidents and his cabinet. They just don't let you (Joe Public) know about any of it. Though a couple have made mention of it along the years, but they are quickly quieted down because its a national security matter.

 

[Phase of the Game]

Different inquires or priorities I suppose, but having questions about the background of the president does not make one a racist, nor should you be so quick to label. As I recall this is not the first time you have quickly played that card.

I am not calling you a racist. Nor am I accusing any single birther in particular of being a racist. But I do think that racism is an ingrained part of this whole thing, and I'm not going to apologize for saying it. Yes there have been questions about the background of every president, but never to this extent.

Before you claim racism is involved I am curious as to how far back we have to go to find a President that hasn't produced a birth certificate. No, I am not a birther, just asking.

 

[Phase of the Game]

Young men may do some ill-advised things when desperately seeking education. I want to know whether the man with his finger on the button had a history of desperate ill considered behavior. Even if he did i might accept explanation thereof, but i won't, in the office of president be satisfied with a "its none of your business he has privacy interests". For me these questions are reasonable,

Bro... the Feds comes and have a sit down and do a massive background check with everyone. From governors to congressmen to presidents and his cabinet. They just don't let you (Joe Public) know about any of it. Though a couple have made mention of it along the years, but they are quickly quieted down because its a national security matter.

I am curious as to the links you can provide to show what background checks the Feds do for Presidential candidates.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Young men may do some ill-advised things when desperately seeking education. I want to know whether the man with his finger on the button had a history of desperate ill considered behavior. Even if he did i might accept explanation thereof, but i won't, in the office of president be satisfied with a "its none of your business he has privacy interests". For me these questions are reasonable,

Bro... the Feds comes and have a sit down and do a massive background check with everyone. From governors to congressmen to presidents and his cabinet. They just don't let you (Joe Public) know about any of it. Though a couple have made mention of it along the years, but they are quickly quieted down because its a national security matter.

I am curious as to the links you can provide to show what background checks the Feds do for Presidential candidates.

They would shut those down so fast it wouldnt matter.

 

[Phase of the Game]

Young men may do some ill-advised things when desperately seeking education. I want to know whether the man with his finger on the button had a history of desperate ill considered behavior. Even if he did i might accept explanation thereof, but i won't, in the office of president be satisfied with a "its none of your business he has privacy interests". For me these questions are reasonable,

Bro... the Feds comes and have a sit down and do a massive background check with everyone. From governors to congressmen to presidents and his cabinet. They just don't let you (Joe Public) know about any of it. Though a couple have made mention of it along the years, but they are quickly quieted down because its a national security matter.

I am curious as to the links you can provide to show what background checks the Feds do for Presidential candidates.

They would shut those down so fast it wouldnt matter.

So what proof do you have that the Feds actually do that?

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

I am ready to be educated, right here, right now, by you. I happen to have no issue with his birth. I do not need to see a copy of his certificate of live birth. I would like to know his grades at Occidental, Columbia, and Yale. I would be interested in his course work and concentrations. I would like to know if, like other young men of his age, he registered for selective service as required. I would be interested in how he paid for his schooling and whether he applied for government funded financial aid and any claims he made to obtain the same. I would be interested in his legislative calendar from his time in the Illinois statehouse and in his most recent physical before he became President. These documents have all been routinely provided by candidates on both sides of the political spectrum. I would like to know these things about him from records, not from claims. Point me to those records.

1.So Obama refuses to release his grades transcripts. This probably has to do with his grades at Occidental. He's admitted to taking drugs at Occidental, I liked drugs. I took drugs. I do not judge him for this, though some might.and his grades improved after he stopped. So are you now conceding that we don't have the information, more or less exactly as I said; though you stated I should know this unless I was purposely listening to biased sources for nefarious racists purposes? It sounds like it, in which case you owe me an apology for the aspirtions cast.We know he didn't graduate with honors from Columbia, though his GPA had to be at least 3.3 to get into Yale. Did it, were there no exceptions for students of exceptionally diverse background? Your assumption may be correct, but it is an assumption, not a fact. I thought you said the facts were easily Knowable but to racists that would not look for them. Is it that you are one who cannot look? He graduated Columbia with a degree in political science, with a specialty in International Relations. That is certainly some information, and I knew this. I wanted a greater depth of knowledge on the specific courses he took and the grades therein, much like we had on bush, gore, and kerry. Is there a reason we should not have this on Obama when we had it on others. My transcripts were required of me for a far less sensitive employment opportunity than President of the U.S. Why is it unreasonable to demand of him what we demanded of other candidates, and what we ourselves have had to produce? Many say the request for information has to be justified. I say that has never been the standard for aspirants to the lands highest office, rather they have to justify not being forthcoming, except for Obama Law school was another story for Obama. He graduated magna cum laude from Harvard Law School (the second highest honor available) in 1991. He also was the first black president of the Harvard Law Review, a very prestigious honor. What more do we need to know? What secret are you expecting to find? 2. No idea about whether he received government aid. Who cares? I care if he committed fraud to obrtain it. Many did. I do not presume one way or the other whether he did without further inquiry, but I think one's unguarded moments and one's statements when one is seeking personal gain can reflect on the quality of the person. I believe these statements, if made, one way or the other may be very telling of he man since they did not occur when he had his eye towards the presidency and so were not as calculated as were later statements. In less guarded moments we may gain insight. I ask for that insight. He is within his legal right to deny that insight, but then I am within my rights to ponder why without having you imply I am ignorant or a racist.

3. I have no idea about the rest of it. The only sources I can find that even claim this information is hidden are far right wing websites like WorldNet Daily which I don't find reputable. If you are saying that source is highly biased, I agree. Now I await what you implied I could readily know. Your failure to supply it belies your statements. You owe me an apology at this point. I likely won't accept it, but you owe it. You insulted me, were given a chance to put up or shut up, and you copped out.I don't get what any of this has to do with his performance as President. I have never heard of any other president questioned in quite this way. There seems to be a need to make this guy illegitimate.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

Different inquires or priorities I suppose, but having questions about the background of the president does not make one a racist, nor should you be so quick to label. As I recall this is not the first time you have quickly played that card.

I am not calling you a racist. Nor am I accusing any single birther in particular of being a racist. But I do think that racism is an ingrained part of this whole thing, and I'm not going to apologize for saying it. Yes there have been questions about the background of every president, but never to this extent.

You imply without explicitly stating so that you do not have to own the statements. You are an intellectual coward. Your game is tired.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

If McCain had been elected, this issue would have come up, and perhaps a few thousand people would have raised it. But it would NOT have been questioned by 40% of Democrats. It would have stayed a very tiny minority of people who believed there was some question.

We'd like to think so, but there's really no way to know. It's hard to accurately forecast crazy.

I am convinced that the large numbers of birthers on the conservative side has to do with racism. I don't like to think this, but there really is no other conclusion that makes any kind of sense.

I don't think the partisan idiocy on display has much to do with race. Most of the people who think that Obama is a Kenyan-born Muslim would not think the same about Alan Keyes upon identical evidence. People are biased in favor of their in-group and against their out-group; but I suspect that, in this case, it's much more of a right-left thing than a white-black thing.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Young men may do some ill-advised things when desperately seeking education. I want to know whether the man with his finger on the button had a history of desperate ill considered behavior. Even if he did i might accept explanation thereof, but i won't, in the office of president be satisfied with a "its none of your business he has privacy interests". For me these questions are reasonable,

Bro... the Feds comes and have a sit down and do a massive background check with everyone. From governors to congressmen to presidents and his cabinet. They just don't let you (Joe Public) know about any of it. Though a couple have made mention of it along the years, but they are quickly quieted down because its a national security matter.

I am curious as to the links you can provide to show what background checks the Feds do for Presidential candidates.

They would shut those down so fast it wouldnt matter.

So what proof do you have that the Feds actually do that?

Proof? What proof do i have that the Feds do any background checks that I could link? Cant really, if such information was out there they would shut it down. But over the years Ive seen several times where individual politicians have made some small mention of it. But its typically (I can only assume they straight tell them to shut up about it) not something talked about much.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

I am ready to be educated, right here, right now, by you. I happen to have no issue with his birth. I do not need to see a copy of his certificate of live birth. I would like to know his grades at Occidental, Columbia, and Yale. I would be interested in his course work and concentrations. I would like to know if, like other young men of his age, he registered for selective service as required. I would be interested in how he paid for his schooling and whether he applied for government funded financial aid and any claims he made to obtain the same. I would be interested in his legislative calendar from his time in the Illinois statehouse and in his most recent physical before he became President. These documents have all been routinely provided by candidates on both sides of the political spectrum. I would like to know these things about him from records, not from claims. Point me to those records.

If you genuinely want to know all of that stuff, and are not just making a rhetorical point . . . man, you must be really bored.

 

[timschochet]

Now I await what you implied I could readily know. Your failure to supply it belies your statements. You owe me an apology at this point. I likely won't accept it, but you owe it. You insulted me, were given a chance to put up or shut up, and you copped out.

The question of whether you will accept it or not is moot, because I'm not going to give it. People that read my posts around here know that I am ALWAYS willing to apologize when I have done wrong, but in this case I don't think I have. I didn't insult you personally. I stated that, to the best of my knowledge, there is nothing hidden from Obama's story which differentiates him from previous presidents. Nothing you have written, and nothing that I have found on my own, makes me think otherwise. As I already wrote, the only sites I have been able to find that even imply this are not only biased but known for spreading falsehoods, and therefore I don't find them reliable.But even if it turns out that you are right about this and I am wrong, that doesn't call for an apology, because I did not insult you in any way. I happen to respect you a lot, DW, I simply think you are wrong about this issue. If I discover that in fact I am the wrong one then I will come in here and acknowledge that. But I won't apologize.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

I am ready to be educated, right here, right now, by you. I happen to have no issue with his birth. I do not need to see a copy of his certificate of live birth. I would like to know his grades at Occidental, Columbia, and Yale. I would be interested in his course work and concentrations. I would like to know if, like other young men of his age, he registered for selective service as required. I would be interested in how he paid for his schooling and whether he applied for government funded financial aid and any claims he made to obtain the same. I would be interested in his legislative calendar from his time in the Illinois statehouse and in his most recent physical before he became President. These documents have all been routinely provided by candidates on both sides of the political spectrum. I would like to know these things about him from records, not from claims. Point me to those records.

If you genuinely want to know all of that stuff, and are not just making a rhetorical point . . . man, you must be really bored.

I am. Oh, and I do not personally want to know all of it, just some. Tim's snotty condescension to all who do not think exactly as he does has spurred the rest of my rant. This actually is not an issue for me, as one might guess from my lack of participation in the thread before now.

 

[bigbottom]

And (given that he has a U.S. Passport), he has. But I'm more interested in debating McCain's constitutional eligibility to be president. Shouldn't he have proved his eligibility before the election?

absolutely

How would he go about doing that? Filing a lawsuit to seek a judicial declaration regarding the natural born citizen requirement of the Constitution?

 

[timschochet]

Different inquires or priorities I suppose, but having questions about the background of the president does not make one a racist, nor should you be so quick to label. As I recall this is not the first time you have quickly played that card.

I am not calling you a racist. Nor am I accusing any single birther in particular of being a racist. But I do think that racism is an ingrained part of this whole thing, and I'm not going to apologize for saying it. Yes there have been questions about the background of every president, but never to this extent.

You imply without explicitly stating so that you do not have to own the statements. You are an intellectual coward. Your game is tired.

No, I'm being honest in what I think. I am not implying anything. What I wrote is what I truly believe.

 

[bigbottom]

Different inquires or priorities I suppose, but having questions about the background of the president does not make one a racist, nor should you be so quick to label. As I recall this is not the first time you have quickly played that card.

I am not calling you a racist. Nor am I accusing any single birther in particular of being a racist. But I do think that racism is an ingrained part of this whole thing, and I'm not going to apologize for saying it. Yes there have been questions about the background of every president, but never to this extent.

You imply without explicitly stating so that you do not have to own the statements. You are an intellectual coward. Your game is tired.

I bet that left a mark.

 

[the moops]

He went Harvard folks, not Yale.

 

[timschochet]

Different inquires or priorities I suppose, but having questions about the background of the president does not make one a racist, nor should you be so quick to label. As I recall this is not the first time you have quickly played that card.

I am not calling you a racist. Nor am I accusing any single birther in particular of being a racist. But I do think that racism is an ingrained part of this whole thing, and I'm not going to apologize for saying it. Yes there have been questions about the background of every president, but never to this extent.

You imply without explicitly stating so that you do not have to own the statements. You are an intellectual coward. Your game is tired.

I bet that left a mark.

Actually it did. That and the "snotty condescending" remarks hurt my feelings because DW is a poster that I really respect around here. I wasn't attempting to be snotty nor condescending nor insulting.

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

Now I await what you implied I could readily know. Your failure to supply it belies your statements. You owe me an apology at this point. I likely won't accept it, but you owe it. You insulted me, were given a chance to put up or shut up, and you copped out.

The question of whether you will accept it or not is moot, because I'm not going to give it. People that read my posts around here know that I am ALWAYS willing to apologize when I have done wrong, only when excoriated into total embarassment and as a way of trying to re-establish cred but in this case I don't think I have. I didn't insult you personally. No you just insulted a large group thoughtlessly and then lumped me with that group. You want to argue that a syllogism isnt a statement. Sorry, in interpersonal communication it is clearly meant to be. Own it you coward.I stated that, to the best of my knowledge, there is nothing hidden from Obama's story which differentiates him from previous presidents. Nothing you have written, and nothing that I have found on my own, makes me think otherwise. As I already wrote, the only sites I have been able to find that even imply this are not only biased but known for spreading falsehoods, and therefore I don't find them reliable.But even if it turns out that you are right about this and I am wrong, that doesn't call for an apology, because I did not insult you in any way. I happen to respect you a lot, DW, I simply think you are wrong about this issue. If I discover that in fact I am the wrong one then I will come in here and acknowledge that. But I won't apologize. As I said I expect nothing different from the likes of you. You have a fine mind, and many fine qualities, but you are a blind coward on some matters, far too quick to play the race card, and though I recognize your qualities I do not respect you because of the nature of your flaws. .

 

[Ditkaless Wonders]

For what it is worth many of the vocal, simple straight forward birthers give me the creeps and I suspect there motives to the point where i am willing to label most of he group quite negatively. I would not, however, label them all.

 

[bigbottom]

[badboys]#### just got real.[/badboys]

 

[Sam Quentin]

Hmmm. Am I an "anti-birther"? Because I recall expressly stating upthread that I'm okay with some sort of qualification procedure prior to the election.

no it makes you a lunatic whacko wingnut"birther" and in Tim's eyes, a racist

 

[timschochet]

Now I await what you implied I could readily know. Your failure to supply it belies your statements. You owe me an apology at this point. I likely won't accept it, but you owe it. You insulted me, were given a chance to put up or shut up, and you copped out.

The question of whether you will accept it or not is moot, because I'm not going to give it. People that read my posts around here know that I am ALWAYS willing to apologize when I have done wrong, only when excoriated into total embarassment and as a way of trying to re-establish cred but in this case I don't think I have. I didn't insult you personally. No you just insulted a large group thoughtlessly and then lumped me with that group. You want to argue that a syllogism isnt a statement. Sorry, in interpersonal communication it is clearly meant to be. Own it you coward.I stated that, to the best of my knowledge, there is nothing hidden from Obama's story which differentiates him from previous presidents. Nothing you have written, and nothing that I have found on my own, makes me think otherwise. As I already wrote, the only sites I have been able to find that even imply this are not only biased but known for spreading falsehoods, and therefore I don't find them reliable.But even if it turns out that you are right about this and I am wrong, that doesn't call for an apology, because I did not insult you in any way. I happen to respect you a lot, DW, I simply think you are wrong about this issue. If I discover that in fact I am the wrong one then I will come in here and acknowledge that. But I won't apologize. As I said I expect nothing different from the likes of you. You have a fine mind, and many fine qualities, but you are a blind coward on some matters, far too quick to play the race card, and though I recognize your qualities I do not respect you because of the nature of your flaws. .

I don't like the fact that you feel this way about me. My initial reaction is that I did not insult anyone, I did not engage in cowardice, and that I am not an intellectual coward. But because you are a very thoughtful poster and would not make these accusations lightly, I'm going to give more consideration to what you have written here, and to try and determine in my own mind whether or not I did engage in cowardice, and whether or not I use the race card too often. (Yes I have been accused of this in the past, but because it was from a poster whom I respect far less than you I didn't take it seriously.)Anyhow, I promise I will think harder about these matters before I attempt to justify my attitudes further.

 

[bueno]

Different inquires or priorities I suppose, but having questions about the background of the president does not make one a racist, nor should you be so quick to label. As I recall this is not the first time you have quickly played that card.

I am not calling you a racist. Nor am I accusing any single birther in particular of being a racist. But I do think that racism is an ingrained part of this whole thing, and I'm not going to apologize for saying it. Yes there have been questions about the background of every president, but never to this extent.

Perhaps that is because for the first time in a long time we have a President that has a father that is a foreigner, who spent a great deal of his early life outside of the US, visited Pakistan when travel by US citizens there was prohibited, apparently has registered in college under names other than the one he ran for election on, received financial aid that was earmarked for foreign students and refuses to release the long form version of his birth certificate.I'm not a birther, and I think that he is likely a natural born citizen, but the thought of the Constitutional crisis we will find ourselves in if I'm wrong scares me.I also think something good could come out of this - a definitive vetting process by an independent group to ensure our candidates are eligible for office.

 

[bueno]

Young men may do some ill-advised things when desperately seeking education. I want to know whether the man with his finger on the button had a history of desperate ill considered behavior. Even if he did i might accept explanation thereof, but i won't, in the office of president be satisfied with a "its none of your business he has privacy interests". For me these questions are reasonable,

Bro... the Feds comes and have a sit down and do a massive background check with everyone. From governors to congressmen to presidents and his cabinet. They just don't let you (Joe Public) know about any of it. Though a couple have made mention of it along the years, but they are quickly quieted down because its a national security matter.

They should let Joe Public know about it. The government is responsible to us, not the other way around.

 

[rolyaTy]

The birthers need to abort their little crusade - they're acting like babies.

 

[bueno]

Bro... the Feds comes and have a sit down and do a massive background check with everyone. From governors to congressmen to presidents and his cabinet. They just don't let you (Joe Public) know about any of it. Though a couple have made mention of it along the years, but they are quickly quieted down because its a national security matter.

I am curious as to the links you can provide to show what background checks the Feds do for Presidential candidates.

They would shut those down so fast it wouldnt matter.

So what proof do you have that the Feds actually do that?

Proof? What proof do i have that the Feds do any background checks that I could link? Cant really, if such information was out there they would shut it down. But over the years Ive seen several times where individual politicians have made some small mention of it. But its typically (I can only assume they straight tell them to shut up about it) not something talked about much.

And we thought the birthers were

 

[timschochet]

Question for others besides DW:

If I claim that racism is a main impetus besides the Birther movement (which I truly believe) is that the same as labelling anyone who questions Obama's birth or life history as racist? Is it either contradictory or cowardly of me to suggest that this is a motivating factor without calling individuals racist?

This is a question I have struggled with, not just over this issue, but over the issues of illegal immigration, the 9-11 Mosque, and gay marriage. In all of those issues I tend to believe that bigotry plays a big part, but that does not mean that everyone with a strong opinion opposing mine is racist. Is this inconsistent?

 

[mad sweeney]

Question for others besides DW: If I claim that racism is a main impetus besides the Birther movement (which I truly believe) is that the same as labelling anyone who questions Obama's birth or life history as racist? Is it either contradictory or cowardly of me to suggest that this is a motivating factor without calling individuals racist? This is a question I have struggled with, not just over this issue, but over the issues of illegal immigration, the 9-11 Mosque, and gay marriage. In all of those issues I tend to believe that bigotry plays a big part, but that does not mean that everyone with a strong opinion opposing mine is racist. Is this inconsistent?

You're willing to call the birther movement racist, on the whole if not individually, but the biggest anti-Muslim (among a few other groups) on the board you go out of your way to declare is not a racist? Not much consistency.

 

[bueno]

Question for others besides DW: If I claim that racism is a main impetus besides the Birther movement (which I truly believe) is that the same as labelling anyone who questions Obama's birth or life history as racist? Is it either contradictory or cowardly of me to suggest that this is a motivating factor without calling individuals racist? This is a question I have struggled with, not just over this issue, but over the issues of illegal immigration, the 9-11 Mosque, and gay marriage. In all of those issues I tend to believe that bigotry plays a big part, but that does not mean that everyone with a strong opinion opposing mine is racist. Is this inconsistent?

Here is what you are saying:1. I believe birthers are motivated in part or in whole by racism2. DW is a birther.3. Therefore DW is motivated in part or in whole by racism.At least that is how many take it, including DW.I am against illegal immigration, I think the muslims are showing insensitivity by building the 9/11 mosque, and I believe the government should not recognize anything but the contractual law part of a marriage.Yet I probably have more Mexican friends than most on this board, am married to an Iraqi and have several Egyptian and Iraqi friends, and have gay and transgender friends.So generalizing on racism is a very dangerous thing for you to do.And you do play the race card a lot.

 

[bigbottom]

Yet I probably have more Mexican friends than most on this board, am married to an Iraqi and have several Egyptian and Iraqi friends, and have gay and transgender friends.So generalizing on racism is a very dangerous thing for you to do.And you do play the race card a lot.

And you play the "let me share my resume" and "I have a ______ friend/relative" cards a lot. It's part of your charm, though, so please don't stop being you.

 

[bueno]

Yet I probably have more Mexican friends than most on this board, am married to an Iraqi and have several Egyptian and Iraqi friends, and have gay and transgender friends.So generalizing on racism is a very dangerous thing for you to do.And you do play the race card a lot.

And you play the "let me share my resume" and "I have a ______ friend/relative" cards a lot. It's part of your charm, though, so please don't stop being you.

Thank you. I have no intention of changing anytime soon. :kiss:

 

[bigbottom]

Perhaps that is because for the first time in a long time we have a President that has a father that is a foreigner, who spent a great deal of his early life outside of the US, visited Pakistan when travel by US citizens there was prohibited, apparently has registered in college under names other than the one he ran for election on, received financial aid that was earmarked for foreign students and refuses to release the long form version of his birth certificate.

I thought the bolded was debunked by the Snopes link posted earlier today. Is that not the case?

 

[timschochet]

Question for others besides DW: If I claim that racism is a main impetus besides the Birther movement (which I truly believe) is that the same as labelling anyone who questions Obama's birth or life history as racist? Is it either contradictory or cowardly of me to suggest that this is a motivating factor without calling individuals racist? This is a question I have struggled with, not just over this issue, but over the issues of illegal immigration, the 9-11 Mosque, and gay marriage. In all of those issues I tend to believe that bigotry plays a big part, but that does not mean that everyone with a strong opinion opposing mine is racist. Is this inconsistent?

Here is what you are saying:1. I believe birthers are motivated in part or in whole by racism2. DW is a birther.3. Therefore DW is motivated in part or in whole by racism.At least that is how many take it, including DW.I am against illegal immigration, I think the muslims are showing insensitivity by building the 9/11 mosque, and I believe the government should not recognize anything but the contractual law part of a marriage.Yet I probably have more Mexican friends than most on this board, am married to an Iraqi and have several Egyptian and Iraqi friends, and have gay and transgender friends.So generalizing on racism is a very dangerous thing for you to do.And you do play the race card a lot.

Thank you. I will keep this in mind.

 

[bigbottom]

Different inquires or priorities I suppose, but having questions about the background of the president does not make one a racist, nor should you be so quick to label. As I recall this is not the first time you have quickly played that card.

I am not calling you a racist. Nor am I accusing any single birther in particular of being a racist. But I do think that racism is an ingrained part of this whole thing, and I'm not going to apologize for saying it. Yes there have been questions about the background of every president, but never to this extent.

You imply without explicitly stating so that you do not have to own the statements. You are an intellectual coward. Your game is tired.

I bet that left a mark.

Actually it did. That and the "snotty condescending" remarks hurt my feelings because DW is a poster that I really respect around here. I wasn't attempting to be snotty nor condescending nor insulting.

Way to be snotty and condescending to all the posters not named Ditkaless Wonders who you don't respect. Sheesh.

 

[bueno]

Perhaps that is because for the first time in a long time we have a President that has a father that is a foreigner, who spent a great deal of his early life outside of the US, visited Pakistan when travel by US citizens there was prohibited, apparently has registered in college under names other than the one he ran for election on, received financial aid that was earmarked for foreign students and refuses to release the long form version of his birth certificate.

I thought the bolded was debunked by the Snopes link posted earlier today. Is that not the case?

Maybe it has, I don't really pay that much attention to the birthers most of the time but the sum total of all of the above is why there are so many questions.

 

[Rohn Jambo]

Sorry, I don't have time to read all 22 pages. Is this about a conspiracy theory that Obama is the anti-Christ?

Can someone please post the Cliff Notes?

 

[jon_mx]

Question for others besides DW: If I claim that racism is a main impetus besides the Birther movement (which I truly believe) is that the same as labelling anyone who questions Obama's birth or life history as racist? Is it either contradictory or cowardly of me to suggest that this is a motivating factor without calling individuals racist? This is a question I have struggled with, not just over this issue, but over the issues of illegal immigration, the 9-11 Mosque, and gay marriage. In all of those issues I tend to believe that bigotry plays a big part, but that does not mean that everyone with a strong opinion opposing mine is racist. Is this inconsistent?

As much as you hate seeing the communist card played, conservatives despise seeing the race card played. Instead of trying to win arguments by questioning the motives of the people, why not win the points on the merits? It adds nothing to pull the race card.

 

[bueno]

Sorry, I don't have time to read all 22 pages. Is this about a conspiracy theory that Obama is the anti-Christ? Can someone please post the Cliff Notes?

Some people think Obama is unqualified to be president. A small subset of that group thinks he is ineligible to be president.

 

[jon_mx]

Sorry, I don't have time to read all 22 pages. Is this about a conspiracy theory that Obama is the anti-Christ? Can someone please post the Cliff Notes?

Obama is the anti-Christ. The end is near. Plan accordingly. HTH.

 

[datonn]

Sorry, I don't have time to read all 22 pages. Is this about a conspiracy theory that Obama is the anti-Christ? Can someone please post the Cliff Notes?

Cliff Notes:Obama BadDemocrats BadObama Maybe a Secret Muslim...but it's not for us to tell people what to think/believeObama Lying/Hiding SomethingObama *IS* the Anti-ChristObama kidnapped and murdered the Lindbergh babyObama behind the Bay of Pigs, and the rise of Castro, al-Gaddafi, Ahmadinejad, Hamas, al-Qaeda and the TalibanObama is a Socialist/CommunistObama hates moms, apple pie and baseball.There, I think that catches you up. Hope that helps!

 

[the moops]

I honestly have not heard one person in real life mention anything about this. I have seen a few facebook posts, and seen a few crazies on Fox news, and heard some weird #### on Hannity or something. But never once have I heard anyone say anything about this.

Who are you people?

 

[jon_mx]

Sorry, I don't have time to read all 22 pages. Is this about a conspiracy theory that Obama is the anti-Christ? Can someone please post the Cliff Notes?

Cliff Notes:Obama BadDemocrats BadObama Maybe a Secret Muslim...but it's not for us to tell people what to think/believeObama Lying/Hiding SomethingObama *IS* the Anti-ChristObama kidnapped and murdered the Lindbergh babyObama behind the Bay of Pigs, and the rise of Castro, al-Gaddafi, Ahmadinejad, Hamas, al-Qaeda and the TalibanObama is a Socialist/CommunistObama hates moms, apple pie and baseball.There, I think that catches you up. Hope that helps!

Don't exaggerate. Obama is known to like him some apple pie from time to time.

 

[bueno]

Obama hates baseball.

Finally! Something Obama and I have in common!

 

[datonn]

Like I said about 800 pages ago, if you offered me millions of dollars if I could produce my original birth certificate, I don't think I could do it. It's lost...amid an avalanche of boxes and papers my Mom has been saving for 40+ years.

So here's the point: I have white skin. If I decide tomorrow to declare my candidacy for POTUS in 2012, I would bet that the farthest the conversation about my citizenship would get would be a reporter or two asking "where were you born?," along with interviewing some of my family and K-12 classmates. My answer would be "Minnesota," and I'd bet good money that would be the end of it.

So how come for Obama, that wasn't the end of it? Even if by some apocalyptic twist of fate it was proven that Obama was not born a US citizen, what concerns me ten-times more is why the question would keep coming up for him, but not for me. Neither he or I could produce the original piece of paper that everyone is screaming for. So how come it's an issue for him, and not for me?!

 

[bueno]

Like I said about 800 pages ago, if you offered me millions of dollars if I could produce my original birth certificate, I don't think I could do it. It's lost...amid an avalanche of boxes and papers my Mom has been saving for 40+ years.So here's the point: I have white skin. If I decide tomorrow to declare my candidacy for POTUS in 2012, I would bet that the farthest the conversation about my citizenship would get would be a reporter or two asking "where were you born?," along with interviewing some of my family and K-12 classmates. My answer would be "Minnesota," and I'd bet good money that would be the end of it.So how come for Obama, that wasn't the end of it? Even if by some apocalyptic twist of fate it was proven that Obama was born a US citizen, what concerns me ten-times more is why the question would keep coming up for him, but not for me. Neither he or I could produce the original piece of paper that everyone is screaming for. So how come it's an issue for him, and not for me?!

Is the argument about producing the original birth certificate or about producing the long form version?

 

[Patrick Bateman]

Good lord people. Move on. This #### is sooooooo tired. Grow up.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

I honestly have not heard one person in real life mention anything about this. I have seen a few facebook posts, and seen a few crazies on Fox news, and heard some weird #### on Hannity or something. But never once have I heard anyone say anything about this.

Who are you people?

It's kind of like young earth creationism, or for that matter, libertarianism. It doesn't exist in real life very much, but on the innernets it's everywhere.

 

[Josie Maran]

I honestly have not heard one person in real life mention anything about this. I have seen a few facebook posts, and seen a few crazies on Fox news, and heard some weird #### on Hannity or something. But never once have I heard anyone say anything about this.

Who are you people?

It's kind of like young earth creationism, or for that matter, libertarianism. It doesn't exist in real life very much, but on the innernets it's everywhere.

I'd like to add horny Asian schoolgirls to that list.