The People Most Likely To Write A Great Love Song Are The Most Likely To Embarrass You As A Tastemaker (1 Viewer)

[rockaction]

Why is this so true in modern society? Is it true? 

I was thinking of Pitchfork's review of Alkaline Trio's Maybe I'll Catch Fire. 

It said something to the effect of "we laugh at losers like you."

This is a band, years later, that would go on to be cited as a great love song writing band for songs like Clavicle by AV Club.

i've been on top of the world since about six months ago, marking the first time i laid eyes on you.

i lost all train of thought as i entered the room.

i saw what looked like really good food, then i saw you and so did you.

i wanna wake up naked next to you, kissing the curve in your clavicle. kissing your clavicle.

i've been on top of the world since about 1 week ago, marking a time when i was drunk enough to talk to you.

i lost all train of thought as your eyes met mine. told you i thought you were gorgeous. you gave me your phone number, i gave you mine.

before you left i said that you can bet i'll be bothering you soon. you said, "no bother, please do."

i've called you twice. it's been a hellish fight to not think about you all the time. sitting around waiting for your call.

i wanna wake up naked next to you, kissing the curve in your clavicle. kissing your clavicle. i wanna wake up naked next to you, kissing the curve in your clavicle. 

But what is it about sincerity and awe that go so unrewarded in our society? Why are we at a period in the world where any expressions like these are met with doubt and skepticism? I'd like to hear any thoughts.  Feel free to rip me, roll eyes, not comment, whatever. 

I know something is wrong in this age of such skepticism.  

 

[AAABatteries]

 

 

[cockroach]

cuz love is gay... throw in music and singing and the gayness increases exponentially.

 

[rockaction]

I expected these reactions, actually.  I have no problem with them, I'm just curious how long we choose to live in darkness. I am sure even the happily married among us are put off. Both sexes.  

More light, guys, more light. 

 

[TheMagus]

 

[rockaction]

The people most likely to talk about love and sincerity are likely to embarrass the most.  Why is this?  

 

[snogger]

The people most likely to talk about love and sincerity are likely to embarrass the most.  Why is this?  

This thread is confusing me as I'm not 100% sure just what you are trying to grasp but..

 I have no problem letting people know I my wife with all that I am.. Yesterday we celebrated our 26th anniversary and I posted this to her Facebook page:

26 years ago my Best friend, and the love of my life, said "I do" and changed my life forever. I love you dear and can't wait to see what the next 26 years bring!!

are you saying I should be embarrassed by proclaiming my love for her, or that others will have skepticism about my love

 

[rockaction]

This thread is confusing me as I'm not 100% sure just what you are trying to grasp but..

 I have no problem letting people know I my wife with all that I am.. Yesterday we celebrated our 26th anniversary and I posted this to her Facebook page:

26 years ago my Best friend, and the love of my life, said "I do" and changed my life forever. I love you dear and can't wait to see what the next 26 years bring!!

are you saying I should be embarrassed by proclaiming my love for her, or that others will have skepticism about my love

I love what you wrote and you shouldn't be embarrassed at all. I'm saying other cynics will doubt and that is what dominates society today in the cultural/artistic world. There are very few expressions of true love that go rewarded critically.

But that is not a criticism of what you wrote -- on the contrary, it's a 

 

[wikkidpissah]

Oh, you should see what i see.

I was in the music biz 40 yrs ago - though not in any creative capacity - but, because of it, i was sought out by reunion-types when i moved back to Boston earlier this decade. A lot of em were decent riffmeisters backinaday and remembered that i had written the lyrics for the 'masterpiece' (a rock opera based on Azimov's Foundation trilogy) of a local keyboard prodigy who went schizophrenic not long after and is a legend in local musical circles now.

Anyways, these dudes (all past 50) all wanted me to hear the CD they been workin on since the biz drummed em out for outliving their potential decades ago. A lot of em wouldnt know a bridge if they were boating on the Thames, but the lyrics..............maaaan - it's like NONE of em have ever heard a song on the radio. It's all mopeydopeyshmoopypoopy leagues worse than that cited above or masturbatory D&D Tolkien bull#### that makes Rush sound like Dante.

Always had the gift of poesy, never really the taste for it, though, til this musical i fell into workin on since i retired. I can now put lyrics to anything, Wish i knew i was this good 40 yrs ago. My arranger blew our arrangement because of it. He was working for almost nothing simply because i fixed the awfulawfulawful "when we used to dance/situations rose from circumstance" lovesick patrician didact wimpy rhymefart bull#### of the lyrics of his 'lifetime' CD. I was down visiting his home studio last year and he put three tracks in front of me that he said he had written but never found lyrics for. In 24 hours i had melody lines & lyrics for all three and all fairly evolved - a str8up rocker about know-it-alls called Troubleshooter that could be a Foreigner single like THAT if it was 100 yrs ago, a nostalgic ballad about the sights & sounds of an old beach town and a rocky Prince-ish tease about a guy whose chick is trying to drag him inside for a quickie but he's gotta go. All done for love of my newfound skill (any new toy is a joy in your 60s) and the old pal who was helping me out. Turns out they were someone else's tracks and my pal had pre-sold my efforts. I dont have an arranger anymore............

The biggest faults in lyrics:

- the most common these days, like the one cited above, are functions of hiphop's legacy and Taylor Swift's autobiographical shtick. so many pop/rock songs now begin with staccato, multisyllabic, two-note, dear-diary accounts of a sitch, then lapse into how dey phyllin bout dat. that #### was tired when it was new and now it's all over the place

- lack of perspective. i'm reminded of legendary comic Bill Hicks's Miracle of Childbirth routine every time i hear an amateur love song - EVERYBODY thinks their love story is unprecendented and NOBODY else agrees. if you cant at least make it 3rd-person, stop, just ####in stop. if you cant capture a relatable moment, a repeatable phrase, or a sense of how words sound when they're sung, it aint gonna work.

- rushing to the rhyme. it's fun when things rhyme, can be cool when things rhyme, can be great when complex rhyme schemes work, can be art when deep thought & feeling can be made in word as beautifully as they feel inside and rhyme to boot. you dont have that skill. dont try. if your first line ends with the word "heat', you're lucky - lotsa nice words rhyme with that. DONT try to find out how quickly you can get to another word that does. you shouldnt do anything that causes you to break your brain making up things that sound stupider than you actually are and nothing sounds stupider than a forced rhyme. hiphop does it, but it's spoken word, usually has a rhythmic complexity that forgives rhymehead a lil bit and STILL dont cut it half the time. Just sing 'Hot night/in the city/set the world on fire/wanna shout/way im feelin/and i dont know why. Personal, expressive, dont mean a thing, dont get in the way of the musical stuff youre actually good at when you sing it. Or sing "scrambled eggs" words, pure nonsense, dont connect it or else. Unless you have something to say and know how to say it, dont. just dont. 

 

[rockaction]

The above comment, while well thought-out, is one I generally disagree with. 

I think that: 

a) autobiography and first-person narrative are fine in the hands of deeper souls. First-person narrative and autobiography have their place in the critical pantheon. I hope not to have to debate that too much. Disliking Taylor Swift and other emotionally-based artists is fine, though I disagree. Let's not implicate the entire form that's been consensus accepted for generations upon generations unless there's a really good reason for dissent, which I'm open to hearing. I personally dislike the general idea of a novel and like short stories more. I'm not averse to going against consensus. But if we're going to have that debate, it has to be really well thought-out.

b) certain love stories are more interesting than others. Not everybody thinks their love story is unprecedented, but some ask for respect for quietude, a natural progression reflected within art. Others ask for pyrotechnics because love moves us to do strange things. Those we seek out. We crave them, both as humans and society because this is what keeps the engine moving, as it were. Because we all innately feel it, to some degree. Yes, songwriting is an art form. Yes, maudlin and mawkish love songs suck. But all lyrics apply to this standard, not just love songs. I think the higher standard love songs are held to is because the writers themselves don't know what to do with something this universal and yet so particular. It's almost a critical taunt. "See if you can rhyme with orange -- see if you can quibble with love..."

c) speaking of orange, what is "rushing to the rhyme?" I'm not sure why this digression happened within the post. If it was a shot at modern songwriting in general, okay, what particularity about love songs leads one to "rush to the rhyme?" If anything, love songs tend to stutter because such deep emotions are trying to be condensed into short form. I think this was more about a quibble with modernity than with love songs, which are certainly not modern, and ancient as all get out.  

 

[jvdesigns2002]

Bad pizza, not showering for weeks on end, and now "embarrassing tastemakers"?? You really need to get out of Temecula brah. 

 

[rockaction]

Bad pizza, not showering for weeks on end, and now "embarrassing tastemakers"?? You really need to get out of Temecula brah. 

   So true. Found reasonable pizza at a place called Blaze (not like New Haven or New York or Chicago or LA, but passable); the showering thing is ages ago; and embarrassing tastemakers is more a question about how we react to sincerity in society. Doesn't sound too radical, just a bit probing.  

I do need to get out of T-Mec, though. Looking at too many years here isn't any good. I'll catch my death out here among the strip malls. Any thoughts?  I'm thinking the Midwest, but that would require a trip to Illinois to pass the bar or passing it out here and relying on pro hac vice from a firm out here. 

Either way, I'm a bit behind the eight ball on this.  

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Smokey Robinson - the alpha and omega of how to write a love song. 

 

[rockaction]

Smokey Robinson - the alpha and omega of how to write a love song. 

And one of my favorite artists, ever, hands down. I can remember living in D.C. when our generation didn't really appreciate him, listening to him on the radio, thinking, "What? You don't love Smokey?" (thump thump went my head). 

Four Tops's "Bernadette" is another great example of a great love song that -- to my point -- might not fly today because of the need for both self-insular thoughts and self-consciousness about not allowing raw soul, raw beauty to come out of hiding. It's so easy to ridicule, so hard to write and perform. 

Anyway, Uruk, thanks for the Smokey comment.  

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Smokey wrote rhymes inside of rhymes and they all worked. "Tracks Of My Tears" may be the most perfect record ever in this case.

 

[rockaction]

Smokey wrote rhymes inside of rhymes and they all worked. "Tracks Of My Tears" may be the most perfect record ever in this case.

My smile is my make up I wear since my break-up with you...

Oooh take a good look at my face/I see the smile looks out of place/If you look closer it's easy to trace/The Tracks of My Tears...

 

[dickey moe]

Sometimes I don't get you.

 

[rockaction]

Sometimes I don't get you.

A mythical lover as a lyric? Or the OP posting dumb stuff? I'm not upset, I'm just laughing.  

I just like love songs, think they're great, and wonder what the critical revulsion is to them. They're sappy, sentimental, and laden with a little bit of overwroughtness, but for the most part, they're part of a tradition that should be respected. People love this stuff, with good reason. It's a chance to say all the things you can't in real life if you do it well enough. 

Heck, even Bread's "Everything I Own" is a great love song. 

But enough on my end about the new sincerity and blah blah; I've clearly taken the stance the love song should be defended -- more to Uruk's point in enlisting Smokey anecdotally: What makes a great love song?  

 

[Uruk-Hai]

My smile is my make up I wear since my break-up with you...

Oooh take a good look at my face/I see the smile looks out of place/If you look closer it's easy to trace/The Tracks of My Tears...

I mean, how great is that line? Even Linda Ronstadt in her ham-fisted version couldn't screw it up.

Love songs get to the meat of our being. Topical music fades, but good songs about/from the heart never do.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Heck, even Bread's "Everything I Own" is a great love song. 

That song has more legs than anything the Jefferson Airplane or Green Day or the Pistols ever wrote. 

 

[rockaction]

I mean, how great is that line? Even Linda Ronstadt in her ham-fisted version couldn't screw it up.

Love songs get to the meat of our being. Topical music fades, but good songs about/from the heart never do.

As for the bolded, In my mind, there's no doubt about that. It's why modern criticism puzzles me so. You've succinctly stated my position and reason for starting the thread. Thanks, man.  

As for the italicized, In my contracts class in law school -- I'll get anecdotal -- my contracts professor was trying to make a bizarre analogy (and bear with me here) about efficient breach and Tracks Of My Tears. I used to show up Mondays at 8:30, completely banked out from nights of debauchery, and had to take the seat directly in front of him in a lecture hall, the result of missing a first class, which both me and him regretted. Anyway, he starts trying to talk about breach and he starts talking about Smokey. I perk up. Smokey is long a favorite of mine. And the guy goes, you know that song, the break-up song...and I just look him, bloodshot eyes aglow with jaundice and we start singing a duet, me in the front of the class and he as the teacher. Everybody laughed, and not nervously. I was in this #### seat in the front row, and just used to lay there all banked out until he said something, and this time it was funny.  

Anyway, "Tears Of A Clown" and "Tracks of My Tears" and "Ooh Baby Baby" will always have a place in my heart, deservedly. 

 

[rockaction]

That song has more legs than anything the Jefferson Airplane or Green Day or the Pistols ever wrote. 

I think that might be an overstatement but every time I think of my parents or anyone else I've known, it's close to true. 

I still think the Pistols' first album does justice to topical things that haven't died; Green Day and Jefferson Airplane, not so much.  

 

[Uruk-Hai]

I think that might be an overstatement but every time I think of my parents or anyone else I've known, it's close to true. 

I still think the Pistols' first album does justice to topical things that haven't died; Green Day and Jefferson Airplane, not so much.  

I hear ya, but "Mandy" will last longer than anything like "Anarchy In The UK".

 

[wikkidpissah]

My favorite Smokey lyric was one of his weirdest and not a Smokey hit. "Aint ThatPeculiar" was a great, bouncy tune Smokey wrote for Marvin Gaye that had great chords, a repeatable tag line and lyrics that didnt get in the way so i didnt pay much attention to em. Stayed that way til a very early girl band, Fanny, had an FM hit with a cover. Twas then i heard the verses and said, "Well, that aint bouncy at ALL. That's depressing af. A man wrote that?!

You do me wrong but still I'm crazy about you
Stay away too long and I can't do without you
Every chance you get you seem to hurt me more and more
But each hurt makes my love stronger than before
I know flowers come from rain
But how can love come from pain?

Ain't that peculiar?
A peculiar-arity
Ain't that peculiar, baby?
Peculiar as can be

Oh, you tell me lies that should be obvious to me
But I love you so much, baby, 'that i'm too blind to see
That things you do and say are designed to make me blue
It's a doggone shame my love for you makes all your lies seem true
But if the truth makes love last longer
Why do lies make my love stronger? (stronger, stronger, stronger)

Ain't that peculiar?
Peculiar as can be
Ain't that peculiar?
A peculiar-arity, hey, hey

I cried so much just like a child that's lost a toy
Maybe, baby, you think these tears I cry are tears of joy
A child can cry so much until you do everything they say
But unlike a child my tears don't help me to get my way
I know love can last through years
But how can love last through tears? (tears, tears, tears)

Now ain't that peculiar baby?
Peculiar-arity
Ain't it peculiar, honey?
Peculiar as can be

Said I don't understand it baby
It's so strange sometimes
Ain't it peculiar, darling?

The incongruity stuck in my head for decades til i moved back to Santa Fe in the mid-90s and an old emptynester friend told me she was gonna try to get back in the biz by putting together a cabaret act (Cab Calloway's daughter had retired to SF and her cabaret act was the hottest thing in town then) - did i have any arrangements for her? A slow, John-Hammond-blues-stomp (the pace of Prince's 'howcumudontcallmeanymore' for u youngns) more befitting "Aint That Peculiar" was my first suggestion, it was huge for her right off, we ended up having fun changing male rock hits like ECostello's Clubland & Floyd's Learning to Fly into piano cabaret numbers, and she's still workin - Peculiar still her showstopper - last i knew. Started w Smokey writing one of the great girl tunes of all time & giving it to a boy.

 

[wikkidpissah]

The above comment, while well thought-out, is one I generally disagree with. 

I think that: 

a) autobiography and first-person narrative are fine in the hands of deeper souls. First-person narrative and autobiography have their place in the critical pantheon. I hope not to have to debate that too much. Disliking Taylor Swift and other emotionally-based artists is fine, though I disagree. Let's not implicate the entire form that's been consensus accepted for generations upon generations unless there's a really good reason for dissent, which I'm open to hearing. I personally dislike the general idea of a novel and like short stories more. I'm not averse to going against consensus. But if we're going to have that debate, it has to be really well thought-out.

b) certain love stories are more interesting than others. Not everybody thinks their love story is unprecedented, but some ask for respect for quietude, a natural progression reflected within art. Others ask for pyrotechnics because love moves us to do strange things. Those we seek out. We crave them, both as humans and society because this is what keeps the engine moving, as it were. Because we all innately feel it, to some degree. Yes, songwriting is an art form. Yes, maudlin and mawkish love songs suck. But all lyrics apply to this standard, not just love songs. I think the higher standard love songs are held to is because the writers themselves don't know what to do with something this universal and yet so particular. It's almost a critical taunt. "See if you can rhyme with orange -- see if you can quibble with love..."

c) speaking of orange, what is "rushing to the rhyme?" I'm not sure why this digression happened within the post. If it was a shot at modern songwriting in general, okay, what particularity about love songs leads one to "rush to the rhyme?" If anything, love songs tend to stutter because such deep emotions are trying to be condensed into short form. I think this was more about a quibble with modernity than with love songs, which are certainly not modern, and ancient as all get out.  

well, i was talking more about the amateur love song and the lyrical faults (still evident in much professional work but less egregious & more evened out) which have kept so many good musicians from becoming good songwriters. I could discuss Tailored Swill, i mean, Taylor Swift's singlehanded ruination of the pop song, but it would be the equivalent of discussing Jimmy Choo v Manolo Blahnik - not worth the internet oxygen.

 

[rockaction]

I hear ya, but "Mandy" will last longer than anything like "Anarchy In The UK".

Yeah, I think it's a gentle disagreement. Anarchy In The UK actually sounded stale back when I was listening to it in the '90s (though had grown up with it). It was things like "Holidays In The Sun" and "EMI" that really popped off of that album to me, and still do. 

 

[Politician Spock]

Love songs are popular to people in love. Most people aren't in love. Most relationships end in break up. Half of marriages end up in divorce. The amount of society that is in love at any given time is a small fraction of the whole. Love songs are niche market. 

 

[rockaction]

well, i was talking more about the amateur love song and the lyrical faults (still evident in much professional work but less egregious & more evened out) which have kept so many good musicians from becoming good songwriters. I could discuss Tailored Swill, i mean, Taylor Swift's singlehanded ruination of the pop song, but it would be the equivalent of discussing Jimmy Choo v Manolo Blahnik - not worth the internet oxygen.

Yeah, I sort of got that you were talking about amateurism or complete over-the-top algorithmic stuff. I definitely took your points. I did take Taylor Swift in a draft recently, and that was met with :thumbs down:. But it was a pure pop song, through and through.  

There is a lot in ourselves that leads us to be unable to see that which is uninteresting, maudlin, or mawkish within our own hearts. To hear that on a sound recording must be wildly embarrassing, as you're pointing out. 

But however to refine if not putting it out there is another story. Some great thoughts start off awfully, some awful ones start off greatly. That's why I'm sort of asking about the music critic and leeway. How much leeway do we give? It seems modern criticism is so withering toward anything sincere, anything real, as to smother it. 

 

[rockaction]

Love songs are popular to people in love. Most people aren't in love. Most relationships end in break up. Half of marriages end up in divorce. The amount of society that is in love at any given time is a small fraction of the whole. Love songs are niche market. 

Wow. You're sort of the audience these critics seek, aren't you? I mean, I get what you're saying, but that's rough.  

Okay, make it broader. Why do we try for love in the modern world and so often fail? That's a fair discussion for this thread.  

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Love songs are popular to people in love. Most people aren't in love. Most relationships end in break up. Half of marriages end up in divorce. The amount of society that is in love at any given time is a small fraction of the whole. Love songs are niche market. 

You're trying too hard here

 

[Politician Spock]

You're trying too hard here

Pimpin' a'int easy.

 

[wikkidpissah]

But however to refine if not putting it out there is another story. Some great thoughts start off awfully, some awful ones start off greatly. That's why I'm sort of asking about the music critic and leeway. How much leeway do we give? It seems modern criticism is so withering toward anything sincere, anything real, as to smother it. 

The definer for me is whether processing the lyrics is optional. That emptynest cabaret singer i was just talkin about - which i dont mind doing cuz she was a hot, merciless #### and i like thinking about her - and i were driving around town once with her son (who's been a working Emo electronica artist, Pictureplane, for over a decade now). She & i lived in a miner's shack in a commune 20some yrs before and just about all we did was sing together, so every minute we're in a car, we're singing along to something. After a while, her boy says "Uncle wikkid, do you know the lyrics to every song ever written?!"

That cracked me up because i cant remember half the titles of album songs and can hardly quote a single lyric unless you can play me right up to it. Often, i'm lost discussing thematic elements of songs cuz i havent listened to the words i've defacto memorized. To me that's huge - can i sing it, get it, know what's being gone for, without parsing it? That's the first element of great songwriting. Not only is it so facile & connective but, then, when i break it down for performance. i get to add my own element, phrasing - which creates an entire level of newness to a song with which i already have great intimacy - and it's the lush bloom of a flower.

So it's the marriage to the melody, the melting into it, that comes first for me. The moments it creates within my soul is next and the actual cleverness & poignancy is frosting.

 

[massraider]

Okay, make it broader. Why do we try for love in the modern world and so often fail? That's a fair discussion for this thread.  

Because it goes against the nature of animals?  

How many societies in history was monogomy the standard?  How many animals mate for life?  

We have these brains and these emotions, and we manage to talk ourselves into things that might not be as natural as people think.  

 

[rockaction]

Because it goes against the nature of animals?  

How many societies in history was monogomy the standard?  How many animals mate for life?  

We have these brains and these emotions, and we manage to talk ourselves into things that might not be as natural as people think.  

Bolded: Birds? Certain mammals? 

I don't think that's so. 

Italicized: Almost every society in history had monogamy as the standard. Why marriage? This seems a little off. 

Discussions of the natural pull of polyamory are indeed legitimate, but what societies monogamy the standard? Nearly every civilized democracy.  

 

[massraider]

Bolded: Birds? Certain mammals? 

I don't think that's so. 

Italicized: Almost every society in history had monogamy as the standard. Why marriage? This seems a little off. 

Discussions of the natural pull of polyamory are indeed legitimate, but what societies monogamy the standard? Nearly every civilized democracy.  

What kind of qualification is ''civilized democracy?''

 

[massraider]

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/darwin-eternity/201109/why-we-think-monogamy-is-normal

As I noted in my last post, the ethnographic evidence suggests that human nature is adapted to an ancestral mating system that was predominately polygynous (one husband, multiple wives). Most ancestral men aspired to polygyny (even though most weren't impressive enough to attract more than one wife), and some ancestral women preferred to be the co-wife of a really impressive man than the sole wife of a second-rate one.

In other words, the genetically encoded psychological machinery of human mating behavior was built by, and for, a world in which striving for polygyny was often reproductively advantageous. That's why people living in modern societies often seem inclined towards polygyny, even in cultures that have attempted to abolish it.

 

[Politician Spock]

Wow. You're sort of the audience these critics seek, aren't you? I mean, I get what you're saying, but that's rough.  

Okay, make it broader. Why do we try for love in the modern world and so often fail? That's a fair discussion for this thread.  

For sex. 

 

[Lutherman2112]

Why is this so true in modern society? Is it true? 

I was thinking of Pitchfork's review of Alkaline Trio's Maybe I'll Catch Fire. 

It said something to the effect of "we laugh at losers like you."

This is a band, years later, that would go on to be cited as a great love song writing band for songs like Clavicle by AV Club.

i've been on top of the world since about six months ago, marking the first time i laid eyes on you.

i lost all train of thought as i entered the room.

i saw what looked like really good food, then i saw you and so did you.

i wanna wake up naked next to you, kissing the curve in your clavicle. kissing your clavicle.

i've been on top of the world since about 1 week ago, marking a time when i was drunk enough to talk to you.

i lost all train of thought as your eyes met mine. told you i thought you were gorgeous. you gave me your phone number, i gave you mine.

before you left i said that you can bet i'll be bothering you soon. you said, "no bother, please do."

i've called you twice. it's been a hellish fight to not think about you all the time. sitting around waiting for your call.

i wanna wake up naked next to you, kissing the curve in your clavicle. kissing your clavicle. i wanna wake up naked next to you, kissing the curve in your clavicle. 

But what is it about sincerity and awe that go so unrewarded in our society? Why are we at a period in the world where any expressions like these are met with doubt and skepticism? I'd like to hear any thoughts.  Feel free to rip me, roll eyes, not comment, whatever. 

I know something is wrong in this age of such skepticism.  

I think it's cynicism by critics, and it has always been that way to a certain extent. 

“No, no. You see, you’re dealing with cynical, jaded critics here, who in a lot of cases, are frustrated musicians. The people who have given us the ‘humorless’ tag are the frustrated, jaded people…cynical…who think that the only thing that’s good is what’s funny and off-color.”

– J. Kordosh interviews N. Peart (“Rush: But Why Are They in Such a Hurry?” Creem, June 1981




 

 

[wikkidpissah]

Okay, make it broader. Why do we try for love in the modern world and so often fail? That's a fair discussion for this thread.  

Ecclesiastes: God will judge us for every secret thing.

We want someone to know our secrets, to seek our touch, to know what the way we turn in bed means and, if extremely lucky, to begin each day knowing there is already one person on our side, rooting for us if possible. And we want to feel all the stages of burning - ignition, licking flame, conflagration, destruction of undergrowth, heat-generation, warm sustaining glow, ash. For all the pain it may cause - it's the way to most know you're actually here.

We fail because we take too much of life personally. It's boring, everybody does it, i hate it

 

[rockaction]

What kind of qualification is ''civilized democracy?''

What kind of broad statement is "how many societies...?"

A ton. Try the history of Europe.  

You're being as broad as I am narrow, in the least.  

 

[rockaction]

Ecclesiastes: God will judge us for every secret thing.

We want someone to know our secrets, to seek our touch, to know what the way we turn in bed means and, if extremely lucky, to begin each day knowing there is already one person on our side, rooting for us if possible. And we want to feel all the stages of burning - ignition, licking flame, conflagration, destruction of undergrowth, heat-generation, warm sustaining glow, ash. For all the pain it may cause - it's the way to most know you're actually here.

We fail because we take too much of life personally. It's boring, everybody does it, i hate it

We will hopefully be judged by all our secret and benevolent impulses we never act upon. That is sort of what this thread is about. Why we cannot do this.   

 

[rockaction]

I think it's cynicism by critics, and it has always been that way to a certain extent. 

I think you're right, Lutherman2112. 

But...Rush? Did you have to, 2112?  

 

[massraider]

What kind of broad statement is "how many societies...?"

A ton. Try the history of Europe.  

You're being as broad as I am narrow, in the least.  

The Greco-Romans decided that monogomy was going to be the law, and Christianity embraced it.  

My question being broad was as a way of answering your question, guy.  I didn't qualify it.  And I asked it because I already knew the answer:  The Minority.  

We have millions of years of biological history going against the pursuit of love.  That's my answer to your question, anyway.  

 

[rockaction]

The Greco-Romans decided that monogomy was going to be the law, and Christianity embraced it.  

My question being broad was as a way of answering your question, guy.  I didn't qualify it.  And I asked it because I already knew the answer:  The Minority.  

We have millions of years of biological history going against the pursuit of love.  That's my answer to your question, anyway.  

Ah, okay, so polyamory. We should embrace that as the artistic ideal. Why?  

 

[Lutherman2112]

I think you're right, Lutherman2112. 

But...Rush? Did you have to, 2112?  

 

[rockaction]

If everything is relative, can we not let the stupid monogamists have their say in the game without ridicule? 

Jane's Addiction cut Three Days -- Hey, it was great. It was also rare.  

 

[Ilov80s]

Going to a Go-Go 

 

[rockaction]

Going to a Go-Go 

Na na na na hey hey 

 

[Ilov80s]

Na na na na hey hey 

Smokey is a god on that

 

[rockaction]

Smokey is a god on that

I used to have so much steamed broccoli back in the day and listen to the two-cd set they had remastered of The Miracles. Hoo boy.  

So dope. Hands down, will never forget it.