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The price of embracing right wing media (5 Viewers)
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FairWarning
Footballguy
Chaz McNulty
Footballguy
The wording of the original article was poor. From re-reading it sounds like atleast 60% of hospital cases are unvaccinated people and 40% have had 1 or 2 shots. If we estimate 78% of the UK population being vaccinated with 1 or 2 shots then I think your numbers are off a little.
745 is the average daily admittance to the hospital. A population of 53M above the age of 12.
Unvaccinated daily hospitalizations is 447 out of 11.66M. = .0000383%
Vaccinated daily hospitalizations is 298 out of 41.3M. = .0000072%
Unvaccinated people are being hospitalized daily at 5.3 times the rate of unvaccinated people. This would be around 84% vax effective.
Ben Shiprio is hated because he is successful at doing exactly what the mainstream media does. Ben doesn't twist the news by relying on dubious information or misinformation. Ben stays with accurate and reliable facts. He just presents facts which support his side, which is exactly what the mainstream media has been doing for decades. Ben is beating them at their own game which really makes them mad.
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This was kind of my original point, although I was too lazy to finish the job. The "40% of hospitalizations are vaxxed" headline is just wildly misleading, even ignoring the fact that all 40% weren't "fully vaxxed".
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
The reason I don't like him is he comes off as the podcast version of the talking heads that dominate the news channels. I flock to the medium of podcasts to avoid people like him.
supermike80
Footballguy
Hmmm...Im gonna say the article was pretty harsh but I do agree with the general concept. It's comical to come out and say that Shapiro doesn't tell falsehoods, rejects most right wing conspiracy ideas( vaxxing, Trump winning etc) yet is STILL a bad thing because, God forbid, he looks at things from a conservative perspective.
It reeks of censorship based on political ideology and nothing more, and that's not a good thing
The Commish
Footballguy
I can't tell if this is the ultimate self own / backtracking on "mainstream media" post or your way of expressing your utter hatred and disgust for Ben Shiprio. FWIW....I agree with this particular assessment of MSM.
djmich
Footballguy
Maybe I'm missing something that the daily data is illustrating (not sure where you got it from original article linked but assume its good).
I have two simple data points. 68% of UK is double vaccinated (which is what is recommended). At least 40% of hospitalizations are from double vaccinated. So imo, unless you think "at least" means a lot less than 40% (maybe thats what your daily data shows?) I don't see how that looks anywhere close to the published numbers effectiveness?
Again, maybe that 40% from the UK Science Chief is way off?
The bolded is incorrect. The actual stat was 60% are completely unvaxxed, meaning 40% were one shot, two shots, or two shots + 2-3 week period to be fully vaxxed. They did not have stats on the percentage that were "fully vaxxed".
Edit: To answer your earlier question, that's where the "up to 40% are fully vaxxed" came from. In theory, yes, if 60% are unvaxxed, up to 40% could be, theoretically, fully vaxxed, but it's not proof that they are.
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djmich
Footballguy
I have mixed feelings about Shapiro.
Interestingly I think we have a lot of folks on this board that self-identify as former "conservatives" but turned away by the republican party of recent times that fundamentally Shapiro would seemingly appeal to. I mean a conservative who is loudly anti Trump. He's pro vaccine. He will explain his positions.
My exposure to Shapiro is mostly from a few video clips I saw a few years ago and his sit down with Joe Rogan (which I would recommend if you want to understand Shapiro better).
Not sure how to describe him, but he's combative at essentially the same level as most talking heads (as you point out KP), which is generally a turn-off. But he is actually smart and consistent. I'm not saying Hannity or Tucker or Maddow aren't smart...but Shapiro will actually explain to why he feels the way he does with something other than "them people bad". And when he doesn't agree with something, sides do not sway him. Anti Trump should be a huge feather in his camp...what other "talking head" on either side has done something comparable.
Unfortunately I think Daily Wire is pretty crummy, haven't gone on recently but lots of Adware and not a lot of meat. Maybe its improved, I expect that it will.
Censorship sounds reasonable when it is framed as falsehoods about Healthcare. But it takes about a day before it gets expanded to things we disagree with.
KarmaPolice
Footballguy
That was my exposure to him initially, thought he came off well, and therefore started listening to the podcast. Then IMO on his show he turns more into the stuff I hate as he puts on what I assume is a bit of a show. There are nuggets of goodness in there, but just tired of feeling like I was getting yelled at and how he resorts to the lame "Sleepy Joe" type of shots. Unsubscribed and would much rather listen to other pods that we listed, especially ones where there are 2 people on to counter each other.
I think you're right about how Shapiro appeals. From the little I've seen of him, he makes a case and doesn't revert to "them people bad" as you said. His whole thing of "facts over feelings" can be abrasive but also there can be truth there too that's needed. It's a balance.
From a pure business angle, I've been interested in Daily Wire. They do seem to be making changes. I've only listened to one episode of their new podcast but I thought it was well done. https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/morning-wire/id1576594336
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supermike80
Footballguy
djmich
Footballguy
One thing I think Shapiro does really well is explain how he reconciles his faith with politics, for example LGBTQ. He's legit Jewish, not a "I say I'm Jewish because I was born Jewish but I don't really do any Jewish things or really believe" person.
This is one of the views that he takes a lot of heat on but again, if you listen to him you understand his position and clearly he has thought through it. I think he has said some things that he has taken heat on with this topic. I honestly have no idea how much of it is a dumb statement, an out of context statement, or just a statement that he genuinely holds that others don't that gets overblown.
This is one of the views that he takes a lot of heat on but again, if you listen to him you understand his position and clearly he has thought through it. I think he has said some things that he has taken heat on with this topic. I honestly have no idea how much of it is a dumb statement, an out of context statement, or just a statement that he genuinely holds that others don't that gets overblown.
djmich
Footballguy
Bee-mageddon
Being a science believer, I remember many a sleepless night thinking about the impending ecological collapse that our mistreatment of the honey bee was creating.
Being a science believer, I remember many a sleepless night thinking about the impending ecological collapse that our mistreatment of the honey bee was creating.
sho nuff
Footballguy
Why Im dismissive of the fringe media sources
Bannon…a person who called for the beheading of Wray and Fauci. Who stated he throws crap out there to flood the zone. Who was arrested for fraud and needed presidential pardon. Yet he is a big part of right wing news and information.
Charlie Kirk…already had a poor opinion of him…his ranting on Simone Biles today was awful.
People like a podcaster Julie Kelly spouting off calling the officers who testified today “crisis actors”.
Just deplorable commentary by some lately. I just cant under that.
Bannon…a person who called for the beheading of Wray and Fauci. Who stated he throws crap out there to flood the zone. Who was arrested for fraud and needed presidential pardon. Yet he is a big part of right wing news and information.
Charlie Kirk…already had a poor opinion of him…his ranting on Simone Biles today was awful.
People like a podcaster Julie Kelly spouting off calling the officers who testified today “crisis actors”.
Just deplorable commentary by some lately. I just cant under that.
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Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Ramblin Wreck
Footballguy
Herb
Footballguy
Funny. Welcome back. Please don't ruin the non-shtick 1/6 threads with your outbursts. TIA.
I did not go anywhere, well except a real vacation. . Funny what you consider an outburst though.
BladeRunner
Footballguy
You might want to follow your own advice. This kick you're on blaming people you disagree with for derailing threads is not a good look. In fact, it actually perpetuates what you accuse others of doing. You're doing the same thing in other threads with me and other posters as well.
Things you don't like to hear doesn't always mean someone is trying to derail a thread. Sometimes the truth is hard to bear, but it needs to be said in order to advance the conversation. We're trying to break the bubble here, not add to it. Let's do it together, deal?
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Herb
Footballguy
You're opinion is noted and received. I have definitely been in a pattern of calling out other posters lately, which is not what Joe wants. I understand.You might want to follow your own advice. This kick you're on blaming people you disagree with for derailing threads is not a good look. In fact, it actually perpetuates what you accuse others of doing. You're doing the same thing in other threads with me and other posters as well.
Things you don't like to hear doesn't always mean someone is trying to derail a thread. Sometimes the truth is hard to bear, but it needs to be said in order to advance the conversation. We're trying to break the bubble here, not add to it. Let's do it together, deal?
The relief I felt after Trump got bounced last fall and the optimism that followed hoping that there would be a return to some sort of normalcy has disappeared. While I've been pleasantly surprised by Biden's tenure so far, the Trump-fueled division has been ratcheting up. That disappoints me, to say the least.
I have 2 young kids that cannot be vaccinated yet. I see the backslide that's occurring with relation to covid rates spawned by misinformation and defiance and it infuriates me that my children could be affected by it.
I see the existential threat that Trump represented being amplified by his sycophants in Congress and media being amplified. I see perfectly normal, rational, intelligent people buying into the narrative that Jan 6 was "no big deal" and telling me that organized dissidents storming the Capitol in order to delay or stop the peaceful transfer of power is nowhere near as concerning as protests and riots that occurred last summer in the name of Justice. Protests that at times were violent and destructive, but at no time ever remotely threatened the sanctity of the American political process, despite being sometimes terrible in their own right.
I see American citizens that consider themselves proud patriots being all too ready to build the foundation of authoritarianism in our nation based on lies perpetuated by a party that they still believe in, despite mountains of evidence that the GOP believes in nothing other than promulgating it's own power, influence and wealth.
I see extremists constantly being held up as standard bearers for everyone subscribing to even a shred of similar ideology, and the demonization of all of them, not just the extremists, that follows.
I'm pissed. And I'm all too aware that many of my points can be reversed and turned back on liberals/ progressives, who are absolutely flawed and guilty of much of the same behavior. But I also see that at the Federal level, at least that constituency appears to be TRYING to make positive changes for rank and file Americans. I see very little from the GOP side other than rampant Trumpism and the damage it continues to cause to the American fabric.
I apologize for doing so much targeting toward certain posters. I will try to do better. But I thoroughly understand why intelligent, thoughtful, fact-based posters and thinkers like @Henry Ford, @SaintsInDome2006, @TobiasFunke and many others have left, as they feel like they can't be frank and honest here anymore, because those on the GOP side of the political spectrum have spent the last five-plus years ignoring and excusing the wreckage of their own party and identity politics, while simultaneously ratcheting up their anger towards those they see as their enemies doing the same thing.
Again, I'm not ignoring that the opposite is true in far too many cases, and I'm not a Democrat, despite my political leanings. And @BladeRunner, I'm all for trying to break the bubble. But I do not see you and many of your cohort making an attempt to do the same when the bulk of your posts are whataboutisms and don't address any of the problems " your side" facilitates. Can we show that we can work together?
Ben & Jerry's
Footballguy
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