If it is not finished, you can look at the first floor from the basement and see which way the joists run. The odds are very good the floor joists from each floor run the same direction. The floor joists again are the numerous large wood boards (usually 2" wide and 12" tall) which give your floor strength.
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The Renovate Otis's New House Thread (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Otis
- Start date
Copeman
Footballguy
Cool.Yup, I will do that.Understood. Can you just copy the pics and share them via image shack or something? Not a big deal, just curious.There are pictures. I'd rather not link here because then lunatics like HighOct@ne43 will know where my family lives.
Otis
Footballguy
I've seen enough HGTV to know that the guy is going to open the wall up and I'm going to come home from work and they're going to be like "Otis, we have a problem," and they'll tell us about some issue that doubles the budget and means my wife won't bet able to get the bathroom makeover she wants as part of the project and then she'll start crying.
Otis
Footballguy
Otis
Footballguy
Cool.Yup, I will do that.Understood. Can you just copy the pics and share them via image shack or something? Not a big deal, just curious.There are pictures. I'd rather not link here because then lunatics like HighOct@ne43 will know where my family lives.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
I do admire the "Leeeeerrrooooooyyyy Jeennnkkkiiiiiiiiinnns!" style of home purchasing and renovation you seem to be embracing.
OC Zed
Footballguy
gianmarco
Footballguy
Ned
Footballguy
Sarnoff
Footballguy
Sarnoff
Footballguy
krista4
Footballguy
CONGRATS!!! That one looked gorgeous from the outside, and the better location and lot just can't be beat. Those two things would have driven you crazy in the other one, and they can't be changed.Decided to bail on our offer on UglyHouse. The offer put in was way higher than it's worth; seller had multiple offers and came back with a counter, asking for new counters by 1pm. We're pulling out.
Just as we pull out, the owners on the original house we loved came around. We have a deal at asking price. Which is less than we offered on UglyHouse. And a lot more house for the money, better location, much bigger lot. Oh and it's not ugly.
FOR THE WIN. Sorry for bailing on the build. Someone let Keith know we can shut this one down.
James Daulton
Footballguy
To avoid the reverse google search, just alter the image a bit with some squiggly lines or something using photoshop or something.
Otis
Footballguy
Will do shortly. Maybe will post a floor plan too for all the ArchiNerds to tell me what I'm screwing up.
OMGEYEROLZ.....
BroncoFreak_2K3
sucker for Orange
Otis
Footballguy
Here's a picture of the first floor floor plan.
Ideally I'd like to knock out as much of that wall between the breakfast area and living room as possible, including the walls around the stairs down to the basement. It's not all that much wall space. Even if we can't knock the walls out, I'd love to somehow open up a passthrough with a ledge, so you can see and hear into that room. Something like that.
I also wouldn't mind expanding the openings from the center hall into the living room and dining room. No reason for all that wall there, and the wider doorways would make for a much more open flow, more light, etc. And that doesn't seem like a big job.
Again, minor things. One day we may want to bump out the back of the house a little, all the way along the back, and do a gut reno of the kitchen/great room kind of thing. But that's some years off.
Ideally I'd like to knock out as much of that wall between the breakfast area and living room as possible, including the walls around the stairs down to the basement. It's not all that much wall space. Even if we can't knock the walls out, I'd love to somehow open up a passthrough with a ledge, so you can see and hear into that room. Something like that.
I also wouldn't mind expanding the openings from the center hall into the living room and dining room. No reason for all that wall there, and the wider doorways would make for a much more open flow, more light, etc. And that doesn't seem like a big job.
Again, minor things. One day we may want to bump out the back of the house a little, all the way along the back, and do a gut reno of the kitchen/great room kind of thing. But that's some years off.
If you knocked out that corner between the Living Room and Breakfast, you at most will have a 2.5' passage. I am not sure I would make a bet on which way the joists run without seeing the house. The assumption was the joist ran from front to back, but with a 30' long Living Room, there would have to be a beam somewhere to make that span. It is possible they instead decided to run the floor joists above the Living Room from side to side. There is a good chance at least one wall of that little corner is weight bearing in either case. A small pass-thru would not be a problem, but it would probably only be between the wall studs which may give you about a 14" wide passage.
As far as the Center Hall....if any of the second-floor floor joists run side to side, they are weight-bearing. You would have to replace the headers above the openings with a longer beam to enlarge those openings. It is all doable, but you absolutely need to know what the floor system looks like on the second floor before tearing out walls. For all the effort, I am not sure you will gain that much as far as openess goes. I would be more interested at getting some french doors between the Family Room and Living Room.
As far as the Center Hall....if any of the second-floor floor joists run side to side, they are weight-bearing. You would have to replace the headers above the openings with a longer beam to enlarge those openings. It is all doable, but you absolutely need to know what the floor system looks like on the second floor before tearing out walls. For all the effort, I am not sure you will gain that much as far as openess goes. I would be more interested at getting some french doors between the Family Room and Living Room.
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Otis
Footballguy
Yeah if this is to scale, that's a small opening. I was hoping I could remove the wall and leave it open where the stairs are too to get some more open space /walk through space. Trouble is that square landing is two steps down from the main level. Not sure how you level that back up to the living room.
Otis
Footballguy
The living room is going to become the man family room. Will put a TV over the fireplace and make the the man hangout. Too big a room to waste. The family room will end up being a second TV room, office, playroom, or something. But we want to use that living room as the main hangout. Just wish I had a good way to open that up more than the kitchen without bumping out the back of the house.
The beauty of having two sets of Frech Doors is you could open with the Family Room and Living Room when entertaining a larger party or you can close them off as separate rooms.
glock
"Don't grumble, give a whistle!"
This is why you don't buy this house.Otis said:
For chrissakes- these houses were not built to accommodate the HGTV Open ConceptTM crap without looking messed up. Walls define spaces. Some can be moved/removed to open spaces, but that kitchen is locked over in that corner with the main staircase between it and the living space. It ain't happening unless you throw all sorts of money at this place.
Then what is the point of buying this place??
:heavysigh:
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
I felt like you just recapped every single episode of Love it or List it.Otis said:
glock
"Don't grumble, give a whistle!"
Consider making the existing dining room a family/play room that can be closed off from the center hall/rest of house with pocket doors or french doors. If you can work out kitchen access to the existing living room, make the "top" half of it the dining room for your "open concept" ...with the existing family room going half office, half pool room. 
What the hell.
What the hell.
Henry Ford
Footballguy
I think instead you should take out some floors and refinish the walls.
El Floppo
Footballguy
this.This is why you don't buy this house.Otis said:
For chrissakes- these houses were not built to accommodate the HGTV Open ConceptTM crap without looking messed up. Walls define spaces. Some can be moved/removed to open spaces, but that kitchen is locked over in that corner with the main staircase between it and the living space. It ain't happening unless you throw all sorts of money at this place.
Then what is the point of buying this place??
:heavysigh:
sorry otis.
Pushing the Living Room up (adding on) is your only bet, short of moving those stairs (bad idea).
I'm not a fan of the Family Room off the Living Room the way this is set up, unless you don't mind the constant required movement through the more formal Living Room.
I'd prefer having the Dining Room area more of the informal hanging/family/kids space and somehow moving the Dining over to the top of the Living Room (addition? rearraging the LR).
Patriotsfatboy1
Footballguy
We use our formal dining room 2-3 times a year for holidays. The rest of the time, the table has crap on it from the kids and my wife uses it as a secondary office.
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El Floppo
Footballguy
an office would be a great secondary/primary use.We use our formal dining room 2-3 times a year for holidays. The rest of the time, the table has crap on it from the kids and my wife uses it as a secondary office.
Does she have a separate space/desk that can disappear when it's used a dining room, or is her stuff just piled on top of the dining table?
Patriotsfatboy1
Footballguy
She has a separate desk that matches the table and hutch. She uses one of the chairs at her desk. When we have people over, she clears the top of her desk a little and we use it as serving space.an office would be a great secondary/primary use.We use our formal dining room 2-3 times a year for holidays. The rest of the time, the table has crap on it from the kids and my wife uses it as a secondary office.
Does she have a separate space/desk that can disappear when it's used a dining room, or is her stuff just piled on top of the dining table?
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belljr
Footballguy
thisWe use our formal dining room 2-3 times a year for holidays. The rest of the time, the table has crap on it from the kids and my wife uses it as a secondary office.
glock
"Don't grumble, give a whistle!"
We are currently transitioning one of our son's bedroom (he is conveniently pursuing his masters out of townthisWe use our formal dining room 2-3 times a year for holidays. The rest of the time, the table has crap on it from the kids and my wife uses it as a secondary office.
) into an office. Moving him into the basement. SO looking forward to freeing up both kitchen and dining room tables as well as the tops of both the washer and dryer. 
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BroncoFreak_2K3
sucker for Orange
glock
"Don't grumble, give a whistle!"
gianmarco
Footballguy
For this exact reason, our design for our build does not have a formal dining room. Complete waste of space.
El Floppo
Footballguy
Until you need it...
But that's why I always want to cross-program the room... office is perfect, if you can make sure it's all hidden away the 3 times a year you're using it as a dining room.
lumpy19
Footballguy
We did the same thing...used dining room space to make kitchen bigger. No formal dining room and we're 6 years in and haven't needed it yet.
The Commish
Footballguy
We do....it's usually the "buffet" for our parties. Then we also use it on holidays. Not a whole lot in that room though...table, chairs, china hutch and my wife's grandmother's crystal light fixture.
DA RAIDERS
Footballguy
blow out that mudroom and you have the space you want off the kitchen.
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El Floppo
Footballguy
The Z Machine
Footballguy
NCCommish
Footballguy
When I was a kid all my relatives had these formal living rooms. No one was allowed in them because all the stuff was too nice to actually, you know, use. What a waste.
Otis
Footballguy
Totally agree. Yet people (us included) still want them. Tradition and nostalgia are powerful.
Otis
Footballguy
El Floppo
Footballguy
Don't get me wrong- I think they're incredibly useful and I get the appeal (if you have the space for them). But I just see them always as wasted/empty space 99% of the time, so I always want to make a secondary- really, a primary- use for them. I haven't had a big-bucks client yet who wants that... even the ones who live in the city "crammed" into 4k+ aparments or townhouses.
Patriotsfatboy1
Footballguy
I think that you run into problems when you want to structurally change the building. Widening a doorway and putting in French doors is simple. Repurposing a room is easy too.
Blowing out load-bearing walls is a big deal, particularly right when you are starting out. It would have to be a totally kick-### lot and neighborhood.
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