Flying Spaghetti Monster
Footballguy
Tea Party is holding the economy hostage.
The big O is waiting until the heat from this gets too hot and then will offer a token face saving compromise to the big B, he will cry and take it.
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The Tea Party is back in business! (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter timschochet
- Start date
The big O is waiting until the heat from this gets too hot and then will offer a token face saving compromise to the big B, he will cry and take it.
Joe T
Footballguy
I couldn't care less about her politics, but I can listen to any random interview of her speaking and figure out she likely has an IQ of around 70.
Joe T
Footballguy
I typed random nancy pelosi into google, here is the interview. Seriously, she's what you guys are hanging your hats on?
http://abcnews.go.com/ThisWeek/video/nancy-pelosi-interview-16389109
http://abcnews.go.com/ThisWeek/video/nancy-pelosi-interview-16389109
![[icon]](/data/avatars/m/5/5167.jpg?1660313464){kind=avatar}
[icon]
Insoxicated
timschochet
Footballguy
(AP) Some in GOP not heeding old big business allies
By CHARLES BABINGTON and JIM KUHNHENN
Associated Press
WASHINGTON
Business leaders are taking sides with Democratic President Barack Obama after failing to persuade their traditional Republican allies in Congress to avert a government shutdown.
Obama, whose health care and regulatory agenda they have vigorously opposed, is embracing the business outreach, eager to employ groups like the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and Wall Street CEOs to portray House Republicans as out of touch even with their long-established corporate and financial patrons.
Yet, the partial closing of the government and the looming confrontation over the nation's borrowing limit highlight the remarkable drop in the business community's influence among House Republicans, who increasingly respond more to tea party conservatives than to the Chamber of Commerce.
On Wednesday, Obama hosted 14 chief executives from the nation's biggest financial firms for more than an hour of meetings. Moreover, the Chamber of Commerce has sent a letter to Congress signed by about 250 business groups urging no shutdown and warning that a debt ceiling crisis could lead to an economic disaster. They say that the policy disputes over health care and spending that are separating Democrats and Republicans should be debated later.
Summing up the Wall Street CEOs' message on the White House driveway Wednesday, Lloyd Blankfein, chairman and CEO of Goldman Sachs, said:
"You can re-litigate these policy issues in a political forum, but we shouldn't use threats of causing the U.S. to fail on its obligations to repay its debt as a cudgel."
The divide between some GOP lawmakers and the corporate groups that have helped shape the Republican agenda in the past is partly a result of a legacy of the Wall Street bailouts of 2008-09 and a changing communication and campaign finance landscape that has weakened the roles of corporate donors and of the major political parties.
Interviews with House Republicans from all regions of the country demonstrate the corporate community's waning clout. Most of these lawmakers say local business owners and chambers of commerce have not raised the potential economic downside of a government shutdown or debt default.
Rep. Ted Poe, R-Texas, like many of his colleagues, said the overwhelming message he hears from business owners is their dislike of Obama's health care overhaul, which is at the center of Congress' impasse and the government shutdown. Likewise, Rep. Steve Chabot, R-Ohio, said he mostly hears business owners complain "about the negative effects of `Obamacare' upon their ability to do business and hire people."
When Rep. Dana Rohrabacher, R-Calif., was asked if he had heard business groups express fears of a government shutdown's economic impact, he replied: "No. And it wouldn't make any difference if I did."
Still, major business groups are raising alarms, citing the economic cost of a shutdown and warning of even more serious consequences if Congress doesn't act quickly to raise the $16.7 trillion borrowing limit, which the government is expected to hit around mid-October.
The letter circulated by the Chamber of Commerce urges lawmakers to raise the debt ceiling "in a timely manner and remove any threat to the full faith and credit of the United States government." It also acknowledges Republican fears over the unsustainable growth of major benefit programs such Medicare and Social Security and the need for a more business-friendly tax system.
But in a rejection of the tactics of House Speaker John Boehner, the letter urges Congress to pass first a short-term spending bill, then raise the debt ceiling, "and then return to work on these other vital issues."
That advice is being ignored by the GOP-led House.
"There is an element of the more independent, tea party coalition Republicans that, frankly, don't listen to very many people," said John Engler, the former Republican governor of Michigan and now president of the Business Roundtable, one of the groups that signed the chamber letter. "They are on a mission, often defined on the basis of their view of the world, and they aren't paying very much attention to what this means beyond maybe their own districts."
Concerned, the Chamber of Commerce is preparing to participate in political primaries, protecting friendly lawmakers from conservative challengers. "Clearly we're getting to a point where we need a Congress that's going to be productive, proactive and create a stable environment for economic growth and job creation," said Scott Reed, a Republican political consultant who is advising the chamber on its strategy.
A changing environment has given conservatives plenty of tools to challenge establishment Republicans by using new technology and social media to organize and mobilize highly motivated voters. Campaign finance laws have also given donors a greater playing field that is not limited to the political parties.
What's more, the bank bailouts of 2008 and 2009 soured the public, which resulted in a new wave of populist Republicans in 2010 driven by a decentralized tea party movement that was not beholden to the GOP establishment.
As a result, said Kevin Madden, a former senior House Republican leadership aide and an adviser to Mitt Romney' presidential campaign, the political parties, congressional committee chairmen and big donors no longer wield the clout they once did.
"Now it's more of a bottom-up model, where you see these grass-roots organizations and grass-roots voters are now empowered and they feel they have a stronger voice," he said. "There is less of an emphasis on the parties. They used to have much more outsize control over who the candidates were and what party discipline was. Now a lot of that is gone."
Rep. Tim Huelskamp, R-Kan., emphasized that point. "I'm from a district that pretty much ignores Washington," he said. "If you say government is going to shut down, they say, `OK, which part can we shut down?'"
By CHARLES BABINGTON and JIM KUHNHENN
Associated Press
WASHINGTON
Business leaders are taking sides with Democratic President Barack Obama after failing to persuade their traditional Republican allies in Congress to avert a government shutdown.
Obama, whose health care and regulatory agenda they have vigorously opposed, is embracing the business outreach, eager to employ groups like the U.S. Chamber of Commerce and Wall Street CEOs to portray House Republicans as out of touch even with their long-established corporate and financial patrons.
Yet, the partial closing of the government and the looming confrontation over the nation's borrowing limit highlight the remarkable drop in the business community's influence among House Republicans, who increasingly respond more to tea party conservatives than to the Chamber of Commerce.
On Wednesday, Obama hosted 14 chief executives from the nation's biggest financial firms for more than an hour of meetings. Moreover, the Chamber of Commerce has sent a letter to Congress signed by about 250 business groups urging no shutdown and warning that a debt ceiling crisis could lead to an economic disaster. They say that the policy disputes over health care and spending that are separating Democrats and Republicans should be debated later.
Summing up the Wall Street CEOs' message on the White House driveway Wednesday, Lloyd Blankfein, chairman and CEO of Goldman Sachs, said:
"You can re-litigate these policy issues in a political forum, but we shouldn't use threats of causing the U.S. to fail on its obligations to repay its debt as a cudgel."
The divide between some GOP lawmakers and the corporate groups that have helped shape the Republican agenda in the past is partly a result of a legacy of the Wall Street bailouts of 2008-09 and a changing communication and campaign finance landscape that has weakened the roles of corporate donors and of the major political parties.
Interviews with House Republicans from all regions of the country demonstrate the corporate community's waning clout. Most of these lawmakers say local business owners and chambers of commerce have not raised the potential economic downside of a government shutdown or debt default.
Rep. Ted Poe, R-Texas, like many of his colleagues, said the overwhelming message he hears from business owners is their dislike of Obama's health care overhaul, which is at the center of Congress' impasse and the government shutdown. Likewise, Rep. Steve Chabot, R-Ohio, said he mostly hears business owners complain "about the negative effects of `Obamacare' upon their ability to do business and hire people."
When Rep. Dana Rohrabacher, R-Calif., was asked if he had heard business groups express fears of a government shutdown's economic impact, he replied: "No. And it wouldn't make any difference if I did."
Still, major business groups are raising alarms, citing the economic cost of a shutdown and warning of even more serious consequences if Congress doesn't act quickly to raise the $16.7 trillion borrowing limit, which the government is expected to hit around mid-October.
The letter circulated by the Chamber of Commerce urges lawmakers to raise the debt ceiling "in a timely manner and remove any threat to the full faith and credit of the United States government." It also acknowledges Republican fears over the unsustainable growth of major benefit programs such Medicare and Social Security and the need for a more business-friendly tax system.
But in a rejection of the tactics of House Speaker John Boehner, the letter urges Congress to pass first a short-term spending bill, then raise the debt ceiling, "and then return to work on these other vital issues."
That advice is being ignored by the GOP-led House.
"There is an element of the more independent, tea party coalition Republicans that, frankly, don't listen to very many people," said John Engler, the former Republican governor of Michigan and now president of the Business Roundtable, one of the groups that signed the chamber letter. "They are on a mission, often defined on the basis of their view of the world, and they aren't paying very much attention to what this means beyond maybe their own districts."
Concerned, the Chamber of Commerce is preparing to participate in political primaries, protecting friendly lawmakers from conservative challengers. "Clearly we're getting to a point where we need a Congress that's going to be productive, proactive and create a stable environment for economic growth and job creation," said Scott Reed, a Republican political consultant who is advising the chamber on its strategy.
A changing environment has given conservatives plenty of tools to challenge establishment Republicans by using new technology and social media to organize and mobilize highly motivated voters. Campaign finance laws have also given donors a greater playing field that is not limited to the political parties.
What's more, the bank bailouts of 2008 and 2009 soured the public, which resulted in a new wave of populist Republicans in 2010 driven by a decentralized tea party movement that was not beholden to the GOP establishment.
As a result, said Kevin Madden, a former senior House Republican leadership aide and an adviser to Mitt Romney' presidential campaign, the political parties, congressional committee chairmen and big donors no longer wield the clout they once did.
"Now it's more of a bottom-up model, where you see these grass-roots organizations and grass-roots voters are now empowered and they feel they have a stronger voice," he said. "There is less of an emphasis on the parties. They used to have much more outsize control over who the candidates were and what party discipline was. Now a lot of that is gone."
Rep. Tim Huelskamp, R-Kan., emphasized that point. "I'm from a district that pretty much ignores Washington," he said. "If you say government is going to shut down, they say, `OK, which part can we shut down?'"
quickhands
Footballguy
I was wondering which side of the argument you were gonna take. now I know which side im on. you are brilliant. (even if you are prejudice against gays).Todd Andrews said:
3C's
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
For all of the progressives out there who are always complaining about corporate financing, I hope you read the article I posted: this is what happens without it. The Tea Party has been funded by corporate guys like the Koch brothers in the past, but the members of the Tea Party are no longer listening to the Koch Brothers, or to any corporate donors. They're listening to "the people". Rush Limbaugh and Alex Jones are the ones who influence them, not Wall Street or CEOs. This is the Pandora's Box that the Republican party has opened. When the "establishment" is weakened, the populists replace it. And then woe is us.
TheIronSheik
SUPER ELITE UPPER TIER
Once again, completely glossed over by Tim. :(And here I thought we were friends.
timschochet
Footballguy
What I meant by that, Mr. Sheik, is that I didn't want JoeT to insinuate that you were a slavish follower of mine, parroting my thoughts and ideas.Once again, completely glossed over by Tim. :(And here I thought we were friends.
timschochet
Footballguy
I hope you don't mind me referring to you as Mr. Sheik. I don't really know you well enough to call you The Iron.
Fennis
Footballguy
a lot of unintended irony in this postSo have any of the libtards started calling Boner a terrorist yet?
timschochet
Footballguy
Great article from the Atlantic
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/10/the-republican-hardliners-arent-conservatives-theyre-radicals/280217/
All that is part of a larger problem that exists, one that has had me referring to the drivers in the GOP not as conservatives but as radicals. Rod Dreher, writing in The American Conservative in a piece called "Republicans, Over the Cliff," eloquently makes the same point. Conservatives believe in limited government — but also that the government we need to have — the services from national security to homeland security to interstate transportation — should be efficiently and competently provided, and that when government intervenes, it should do so with as much deference to the marketplace as possible.
The current drivers of the GOP are much more hostile to government. Thus, the assault on all federal employees via cuts in pay and benefits; the all-out attack to delegitimize the Internal Revenue Service and its employees by Darrell Issa and his cronies, designed to make it harder for them to carry out their basic functions; the enthusiasm for the sequester; and the lack of concern about the societal impact of mindless cuts to basic research, food safety, and homeland security.
Some of this impulse is libertarian in nature, as evidenced by Senator Rand Paul’s preferred budget, which makes Rep. Paul Ryan’s look New Dealish by comparison. Some of it reflects ignorance or willful suspension of disbelief — not understanding, for example, the impact of indiscriminate cuts on our health research infrastructure and on our nation’s seed corn in terms of our technological edge; or supporting the sequester but then decrying its cuts in medical research (without noting that these cuts would not occur without the sequester).
But a lot of it is an emotional, zealous reaction to America today — an ardent willingness to break crockery and demolish existing institutions to achieve the goal of eviscerating government as we know it, the good with the bad. As Dreher put it, "When I think of the Republican Party, I don’t think of principled conservative legislators who are men and women of vision strategy. I think of ideologues who are prepared to wreck things to get their way. They have confused prudence — the queen of virtues, and the cardinal virtue of conservative politics — with weakness."
Not all congressional Republicans are in that camp. Many, especially in the Senate, fit a more traditional conservative mold. But few are willing to stand up to the zealots, and even fewer are willing to cast votes that depart from the pack. All of them dutifully recite the mantra that Obamacare is an abomination that ought to be eliminated, and none notes that it is basically the same plan as 1994’s Grassleycare/Hatchcare/Durenbergercare/Chafeecare, which was built around an individual mandate, private insurers on exchanges, and premium support for less fortunate Americans. More strikingly, no one notes that Ryan’s long-term plan for Medicare, built around regulated exchanges and premium support, is basically Obamacare for seniors. Every opportunity to reform and refine the Affordable Care Act through traditional institutional means, working with both parties, has been rejected by them.
Here is Dreher’s conclusion: "The Republicans cannot govern. These people aren’t conservatives. They are radicals. What on earth would Russell Kirk say if he were alive to see this?"
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2013/10/the-republican-hardliners-arent-conservatives-theyre-radicals/280217/
All that is part of a larger problem that exists, one that has had me referring to the drivers in the GOP not as conservatives but as radicals. Rod Dreher, writing in The American Conservative in a piece called "Republicans, Over the Cliff," eloquently makes the same point. Conservatives believe in limited government — but also that the government we need to have — the services from national security to homeland security to interstate transportation — should be efficiently and competently provided, and that when government intervenes, it should do so with as much deference to the marketplace as possible.
The current drivers of the GOP are much more hostile to government. Thus, the assault on all federal employees via cuts in pay and benefits; the all-out attack to delegitimize the Internal Revenue Service and its employees by Darrell Issa and his cronies, designed to make it harder for them to carry out their basic functions; the enthusiasm for the sequester; and the lack of concern about the societal impact of mindless cuts to basic research, food safety, and homeland security.
Some of this impulse is libertarian in nature, as evidenced by Senator Rand Paul’s preferred budget, which makes Rep. Paul Ryan’s look New Dealish by comparison. Some of it reflects ignorance or willful suspension of disbelief — not understanding, for example, the impact of indiscriminate cuts on our health research infrastructure and on our nation’s seed corn in terms of our technological edge; or supporting the sequester but then decrying its cuts in medical research (without noting that these cuts would not occur without the sequester).
But a lot of it is an emotional, zealous reaction to America today — an ardent willingness to break crockery and demolish existing institutions to achieve the goal of eviscerating government as we know it, the good with the bad. As Dreher put it, "When I think of the Republican Party, I don’t think of principled conservative legislators who are men and women of vision strategy. I think of ideologues who are prepared to wreck things to get their way. They have confused prudence — the queen of virtues, and the cardinal virtue of conservative politics — with weakness."
Not all congressional Republicans are in that camp. Many, especially in the Senate, fit a more traditional conservative mold. But few are willing to stand up to the zealots, and even fewer are willing to cast votes that depart from the pack. All of them dutifully recite the mantra that Obamacare is an abomination that ought to be eliminated, and none notes that it is basically the same plan as 1994’s Grassleycare/Hatchcare/Durenbergercare/Chafeecare, which was built around an individual mandate, private insurers on exchanges, and premium support for less fortunate Americans. More strikingly, no one notes that Ryan’s long-term plan for Medicare, built around regulated exchanges and premium support, is basically Obamacare for seniors. Every opportunity to reform and refine the Affordable Care Act through traditional institutional means, working with both parties, has been rejected by them.
Here is Dreher’s conclusion: "The Republicans cannot govern. These people aren’t conservatives. They are radicals. What on earth would Russell Kirk say if he were alive to see this?"
Fennis
Footballguy
and if anyone knows what it is like to push republicans into traffic it is Grover Norquist.
Dr Oadi
Footballguy
White House senior adviser Dan Pfeiffer likened House Republicans to suicide bombers, kidnappers and arsonists in a single interview on Thursday. "What we're not for is negotiating with people with a bomb strapped to their chest,"So have any of the libtards started calling Boner a terrorist yet?
Fennis
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
GibbyGarcia
Footballguy
Don't kid yourself. The Koch brothers are still funding all the influence. JBS folks have to just be in esctasy right now.
Joe T
Footballguy
Once you figure out that this is his job, you'll have a better appreciation for his posts.
Dr. Gobbler
Footballguy
In Tim's mind the two servers worth of posts at FBG's qualifies as 'Commercial Real Estate'.
drummer
Footballguy
CBusAlex
Footballguy
The guy who can't afford to pay up on a $100 bet doesn't really have a leg to stand on when questioning other people's jobs.
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
One main problem is that the media seems to now incite instead of offering insight.
Flying Spaghetti Monster
Footballguy
Because incitement makes more money. It is all about the money - never forget that.
badmojo1006
Footballguy
Rep. Stockman fundraising letter claims Democrats are ‘curb-stomping veterans’
Curb Stomping Veterans - Cool Punk Band name
Curb Stomping Veterans - Cool Punk Band name
[icon]
Insoxicated
White House senior adviser Dan Pfeiffer likened House Republicans to suicide bombers, kidnappers and arsonists in a single interview on Thursday. "What we're not for is negotiating with people with a bomb strapped to their chest,"So have any of the libtards started calling Boner a terrorist yet?
I knew it... awesome If that's the case he's in the running with eminesnce for hourly rate
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
You may be the biggest assswipe this forum has ever seen. Continuing to show your face around here hurling insults when you owe people $ is about as low as it gets on the internet.
Go somewhere else, loser.
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Mr.Pack
Footballguy
The Commish
Footballguy
To be fair...I think they are saying she's better than Johnny B. In the grand scheme of things, that's not saying much. Not the highest of bars being set there.
snogger
Footballguy
Leeroy Jenkins
Footballguy
Seconded.
[icon]
Insoxicated
tommyGunZ
Footballguy
Actually, those supporting Pelosi are likely doing so b/c of her accomplishments. Democrats have been trying to do health care reform for 50-60 years. She's the SOTH who actually got the votes, and got it done.
drummer
Footballguy
timschochet
Footballguy
Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
Otis
Footballguy
Gr00vus
Footballguy
According to that the government silver plan would cost me approximately 4 times what I'm currently paying for my employer provided plan.
Joe McGee
Footballguy
Seconded.
Dinsy Ejotuz
Footballguy
Bottomfeeder Sports
Footballguy
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