With a temporary spending bill that kicks the can down the road a month or so followed by a longer term spending bill without wall funding once the uproar has died down.Anyhow, let’s get back to the main subject: how the #### is this shutdown going to end? I mean, I can’t see how either side backs down here.
Anyone got a prediction?
Trolling other posters and calling everyone you disagree with liars isn’t exactly advancing the discourse.You and birds can keep talking about me...but find a way not to do it and muck up yet another thread and leave this to those who would like to discuss the topic.
Walls that hold water are dams.Does this stance ever hold water, our borders are not safe in my opinion, so we will let borders have less security until will build something that would take a decade to complete?
WTF?
I’d rather see this than a wallI want $50 billion for a space elevator to the moon.
This. The Dems hold all the cards. The GOP senators will start defecting in the next few days. It’s a loser, has been since trump cracked an egg on his face in the Oval Office.The airport situation could get pretty ugly pretty quick.
I think Republicans in blue/purple states are going to start bouncing, and putting pressure to re-open the government as the affects start to get felt. Eventually, McConnell will have to give in to them.Anyhow, let’s get back to the main subject: how the #### is this shutdown going to end? I mean, I can’t see how either side backs down here.
Anyone got a prediction?
Followed by Trump taking tons of heat from his supporters until he finally uses executive order to build border fencing that gets challenged in court but ultimately holds.With a temporary spending bill that kicks the can down the road a month or so followed by a longer term spending bill without wall funding once the uproar has died down.
More blatant falsehoods.You and birds can keep talking about me...but find a way not to do it and muck up yet another thread and leave this to those who would like to discuss the topic.
OKPerfect time to show some compromise on both sides.
Please explain the issue with border security that we need to address.The issue of Border Security will survive long beyond Trump's presidency.
I'm here to help you in this time of national crisis.Thank you, sir.
I’ve done no trolling nor calling anyone a liar for disagreeing. I called Ingrahams post false because it was factually inaccurate. As she usually is which is why she lost her sponsors.Trolling other posters and calling everyone you disagree with liars isn’t exactly advancing the discourse.
Nothing i states was false...now are you going to try talking about the topic?More blatant falsehoods.
Link?I’ve done no trolling nor calling anyone a liar for disagreeing. I called Ingrahams post false because it was factually inaccurate. As she usually is which is why she lost her sponsors.
But again...try discussing the topic and not the posters...just a tip.
I'd settle for an explanation for why not so long ago Dems wanted a wall and Repubs were against one, and what ulterior motives cause each to flip flop.Please explain the issue with border security that we need to address.
Put her in charge of fact checking Trump's public comments.How do you keep a blonde busy?
What you said about the topic was false and lacking any sort of evidence. That's about the topic.Nothing i states was false...now are you going to try talking about the topic?
Veto proof vote by the congressAnyhow, let’s get back to the main subject: how the #### is this shutdown going to end? I mean, I can’t see how either side backs down here.
Anyone got a prediction?
Votes and identity politics on one side. Greed and cheap labor turned to the realization they won't be getting those people as voters on the other.I'd settle for an explanation for why not so long ago Dems wanted a wall and Repubs were against one, and what ulterior motives cause each to flip flop.
Oh please, Trump caves within a week.Veto proof vote by the congressAnyhow, let’s get back to the main subject: how the #### is this shutdown going to end? I mean, I can’t see how either side backs down here.
Anyone got a prediction?
I think you need to recall that Trump really set this up when the Senate passed the first bill. Republicans unanimously voted for a bill with no new barrier money. As the GOP House was within hours of approving that *Republican bill Trump called an emergency.Why are people still doing this back and forth? They ALL looked like idiots. The 3 people who spoke tonight are persons 1, 2, and 3 most responsible for the mess we're discussing tonight. Yet here we are picking sides and blaming and/or poking fun at the other. There is no good side to be on here people if these 3 people, and what they represent, are the only choices.
The Democrats didn’t have the House and momentum then. They do now. You don’t lose leverage and get the same deal.They should go back to the 25B deal in February and just pass that. I think it would pass now.
25B for DACA is a great deal all around.
That's a pretty good summary and what I believe (know) as well. I threw it out their expecting someone to rehash their chosen party's talking points so it was refreshing to read something truthful.Votes and identity politics on one side. Greed and cheap labor turned to the realization they won't be getting those people as voters on the other.
Trump wants to come out of negotiations with something he can present to his base as a wall, that is paid for by Mexico, so he can win. That's it. He'll also want to blame democrats for it not being better, but that's baked in.Can we start with the basics. What is it that Trump actually wants? In the past couple weeks alone it's been: A concrete wall, a steel slat wall, see-through steel wall, paid for by Mexico already, paid for in the future by savings in the "drug wars" (that was a new one tonight I think), that we already have a wall, and on and on.
Oh and If anyone buys that 5 billion would cover this, well
McConnell just got full on semi-flaccid.Reuters/Ipsos poll
• 51% blame Trump for the shutdown
• 32% blame Democrats
• 7% blame Republicans
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shutdown-poll/a-growing-number-of-americans-blame-trump-for-shutdown-reuters-ipsos-poll-idUSKCN1P223U
We all know these never change. I think Trump getting Pelosi and Schumer to appear on television and address this is exactly what he wanted. I don't disagree that this poll is where we are today, but by getting them up there on all the major networks he's going to drag them into it. The average voter is pretty unsophisticated. All they've seen is Trump's picture and snippets about this, until now.Reuters/Ipsos poll
• 51% blame Trump for the shutdown
• 32% blame Democrats
• 7% blame Republicans
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shutdown-poll/a-growing-number-of-americans-blame-trump-for-shutdown-reuters-ipsos-poll-idUSKCN1P223U
That’s a NATIONAL opinion poll. It can’t be trusted. Poll nothing but people in rural America and get back to me with the numbers.Reuters/Ipsos poll
• 51% blame Trump for the shutdown
• 32% blame Democrats
• 7% blame Republicans
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shutdown-poll/a-growing-number-of-americans-blame-trump-for-shutdown-reuters-ipsos-poll-idUSKCN1P223U
Fun fact: Schumer is about 3.5 years younger than TrumpThat seems to be the only comments from the right wingers...hey look they had old people. I mean...have they looked at Trump?
. And democrats won't fund ANY wall or they lose. Even though there are places it's probably needed and they could easily compromise and get a comprehensive better boarder security package that everyone wants.Trump wants to come out of negotiations with something he can present to his base as a wall, that is paid for by Mexico, so he can win. That's it. He'll also want to blame democrats for it not being better, but that's baked in.
So if Trump doesn’t run in 2020, the Dems get left holding the bag on this issue.Reuters/Ipsos poll
• 51% blame Trump for the shutdown
• 32% blame Democrats
• 7% blame Republicans
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-shutdown-poll/a-growing-number-of-americans-blame-trump-for-shutdown-reuters-ipsos-poll-idUSKCN1P223U
He wants to stand in front of a crowd and hear them applause loudly. That’s it.Can we start with the basics. What is it that Trump actually wants? In the past couple weeks alone it's been: A concrete wall, a steel slat wall, see-through steel wall, paid for by Mexico already, paid for in the future by savings in the "drug wars" (that was a new one tonight I think), that we already have a wall, and on and on.
Oh and If anyone buys that 5 billion would cover this, well
2359013-d chess!We all know these never change. I think Trump getting Pelosi and Schumer to appear on television and address this is exactly what he wanted. I don't disagree that this poll is where we are today, but by getting them up there on all the major networks he's going to drag them into it. The average voter is pretty unsophisticated. All they've seen is Trump's picture and snippets about this, until now.
I almost think Shumer/Pelosi should have cancelled their rebuttal - Trump didn't win any points. He thinks he had his finger on the pulse and he's an idiot.
Not to reg on age but I think a better rebuttal would have been somebody younger talking about the wall being a 1950 solution to a 2018 challenge. Then talk about the technology available and that drugs are coming through ports etc.
It's crossed my mind, what if he decides he isn't going to run and just basically says the hell with it, I know if I hold this line I'll be a hero to my side and my speaking fees, books, royalties, etc. will be higher than anyone in history's. Then barring a veto proof bill, he could just decide he's holding out. Unlikely scenario but nothing is beyond the realm of possibility given some of what we've seen in recent times.So if Trump doesn’t run in 2020, the Dems get left holding the bag on this issue.
If you remove the orange one this crisis at the border fades away.So if Trump doesn’t run in 2020, the Dems get left holding the bag on this issue.
Tell her she has a chance to win in 2020?How do you keep a blonde busy?
I think the voters will decide this for him. He's going to get worked.It's crossed my mind, what if he decides he isn't going to run and just basically says the hell with it, I know if I hold this line I'll be a hero to my side and my speaking fees, books, royalties, etc. will be higher than anyone in history's. Then barring a veto proof bill, he could just decide he's holding out. Unlikely scenario but nothing is beyond the realm of possibility given some of what we've seen in recent times.
So if Trump doesn’t run in 2020, the Dems get left holding the bag on this issue.
Which is why he was so flat and boring in his presentation tonight. He had no audience feed back to fuel him.He wants to stand in front of a crowd and hear them applause loudly. That’s it.
Rebuttals to these things are like being on the cover of Madden. Seems great at first, but there's a curse that goes with it. Pelosi/Shumer did the others a favor and took an arrow on this one. Had to rebut Trump - can't concede that kind of airtime uncontested, but they didn't sacrifice any of the next-gen folks to the increase scrutiny of this stilted situation. No one comes off looking good.
@Truckasaurus is behind this? Figures.
No, they are off the hook as almost 60% blame Truck and the GOP. Only the 32% base who would support Trump if he shot someone on 5th Avenue would point the finger as the Democrats.