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US Healthcare Business Stinks Thread II (1 Viewer)

Seems like this might be a good place to ask this question, how does one reliably find a new doctor? Will a PCP let a patient have a consult to see if they're a good fit? My old doctor is leaving their practice and I'll need a new one. The last time i had to find a new doctor i just looked at who was accepting new patients and took the first one. I was lucky and found a good doctor this way, but the right fit is important to me in any new heathcare partnership so ideally i would like to meet a new doctor first. Just curious if anyone has any recent experience switching doctors and did more than just grab the first one they could find?
My primary care doc went concierge and I didn't want to pay an extra $3K a year on top of getting billed through insurance. I went to about 4 doctors before finding another one I liked. Best way is through referral. Otherwise you'll be reading reviews and throwing darts.
Similar situation with my PCP. It's a pia to switch doctors just to not get along well and then initiate the process all over again. I sure would love to get it right the first time and not waste everyone's time including my own. I did get referred by my doctor to another at the same practice and I'll give them a try, but still wonder if there's a better way to find a new doctor other than throwing darts. Guess the best you can do is call around and see if anyone is willing to do a consult ahead of any new patient process. Just feels like you need to commit first with most practices and hope it works out.
 
Maybe off topic, but just mind-blowing how much waste/over charging exists today. My 90 year old mom had a stroke in January. We caught it early (the 4 hour rule is so important) She was in the ICU for 3 days and then in a regular room for 2 days before release. We were in a full on blizzard and they wanted to kick her out at 8:00 pm at night despite the fact the entire family was there from 6:00 am that morning and we just went home for the night--that is another story. She was released home with services. She has Medicare and a supplemental insurance program. We got the summary of services and costs--$318,000 :eek: . I went through the 18 page bill and there were services listed for things I sure don't remember her getting. but who knows. Her out of pocket cost---zero.

The ambulance immediately billed us for $2,500, but if we paid right away they would take $1,750. I let it ride for a month and sure enough it was reduced to $249.00. Now her blood thinner meds are a whole other world. The prescription we left the hospital with was going to run $3,000 a month because it was in a tier 5 level. However we got another prescription that If she didn't have the supplemental benefit, would have been free, but because she does, we have a $3,000 deductible and a $47 a month co-payment. Not the worst, but just upsetting.

I see these kinda bills all the time. $318k for a total of 5 days in the hospital - 3 of which in ICU, seems about right. Insurance (in this case Medicare) will knock that initial amount down considerably (like having 90% knocked of the ambulance ride). No idea who benefits from them initially charging such an astronomical amount.
 
I have employer-provided heath care with a great plan. I just wanted to schedule my annual physical. June 13 was the first available date.

Neat system.
 
I have employer-provided heath care with a great plan. I just wanted to schedule my annual physical. June 13 was the first available date.

Neat system.
They do hold spots open for sick people. I found that out after telling them I was going to urgent care for other medical events.
 
Why the rush for annual physicals?

I’ve said it before: they’re medical theatre, never proven to provide tangible benefits. Even targeted exams in the presence of symptoms are hit-or-miss.

That’s not to say you should avoid seeing a doctor somewhat regularly, but the exam itself is fairly useless. FTR, here’s a compendium of evidence-based preventative health recommendations.
 
I have employer-provided heath care with a great plan. I just wanted to schedule my annual physical. June 13 was the first available date.

Neat system.
I did my annual physical and had an appointment in 3 days.

I never have a problem getting my annual checkup. I call in to the office have them write a prescription for bloodwork and on that call set up a visit usually within 5 to 7 days.
 
Why the rush for annual physicals?

I’ve said it before: they’re medical theatre, never proven to provide tangible benefits. Even targeted exams in the presence of symptoms are hit-or-miss.

That’s not to say you should avoid seeing a doctor somewhat regularly, but the exam itself is fairly useless. FTR, here’s a compendium of evidence-based preventative health recommendations.

My firm gives me a $25 per check credit if I get an annual wellness form filled out by my primary (which requires bloodwork). If I don't get it done, they deduct that money from my pay. Worth a 30 minute checkup, once a year.
 
was at the dr. and was given a prescription, just happened to ask if it was expensive and she said she'll go through cost drugs plus it shouldn't be that expensive. ok great. get to the pharmacy, pharmacist says will be $250, seemed high but ok was about to pay, was then like is that for a year and she's like no 3 months, so I'm like Whoa are you sure, that seems really high, can you double check that. she goes to the back, comes back actually we do have a lower price, through cost drugs plus it's $25. So almost got taken for a ride, but thankfully asked.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.
😳
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.
For that price might as well just hire a personal chef.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.
😳
My son has lost about 95 lbs in a year. There are some side effects but he's tolerating them.
If your wife visits the manufacturer's website there may be a discount coupon that can be used.
Be aware that due to its popularity my son sometimes has to call up to 3 pharmacies to get the prescription filled.
Good luck.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"

A quick google search tell me a month of Wegovy costs &1,349 in the US, $137 in Germany, $82 in the UK, $265 in Canada. We are cheaper than in the United Arab Emirates where it’s $1,865, though I doubt there is much demand there.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"

A quick google search tell me a month of Wegovy costs &1,349 in the US, $137 in Germany, $82 in the UK, $265 in Canada. We are cheaper than in the United Arab Emirates where it’s $1,865, though I doubt there is much demand there.
That sums up our entire healthcare system. Absolutely unacceptable.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"

A quick google search tell me a month of Wegovy costs &1,349 in the US, $137 in Germany, $82 in the UK, $265 in Canada. We are cheaper than in the United Arab Emirates where it’s $1,865, though I doubt there is much demand there.
That sums up our entire healthcare system. Absolutely unacceptable.
Everyone in the US needs to get their kickbacks.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"

A quick google search tell me a month of Wegovy costs &1,349 in the US, $137 in Germany, $82 in the UK, $265 in Canada. We are cheaper than in the United Arab Emirates where it’s $1,865, though I doubt there is much demand there.
UAE are pretty fat, with higher average BMI than the US.

Then again, maybe they’re plagued by high-BMI, not remotely obese, middle aged athletes so common on boards like these.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"

A quick google search tell me a month of Wegovy costs &1,349 in the US, $137 in Germany, $82 in the UK, $265 in Canada. We are cheaper than in the United Arab Emirates where it’s $1,865, though I doubt there is much demand there.
That sums up our entire healthcare system. Absolutely unacceptable.
Everyone in the US needs to get their kickbacks.
It's not "everyone". It's a very specific group of people.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"

A quick google search tell me a month of Wegovy costs &1,349 in the US, $137 in Germany, $82 in the UK, $265 in Canada. We are cheaper than in the United Arab Emirates where it’s $1,865, though I doubt there is much demand there.
That sums up our entire healthcare system. Absolutely unacceptable.
Everyone in the US needs to get their kickbacks.
It's not "everyone". It's a very specific group of people.
Fair. That was a generalized "everyone". I'd like to see less Big Pharma influence in our healthcare system.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"

A quick google search tell me a month of Wegovy costs &1,349 in the US, $137 in Germany, $82 in the UK, $265 in Canada. We are cheaper than in the United Arab Emirates where it’s $1,865, though I doubt there is much demand there.
That sums up our entire healthcare system. Absolutely unacceptable.
Everyone in the US needs to get their kickbacks.
It's not "everyone". It's a very specific group of people.

While the drug is being used mainly by “a very specific group of people”, it’s generally speaking being funded by everyone in the US, via health insurance premiums. I don't take any of these GLP drugs, but I pay health insurance premiums (as does my employer) which go to pay for them.
 
Last week my son picked up his Wegovy at Walgreen. He doesn't have money to burn so he's pretty much on top of what his share should be. He was expecting about $200. They charged him $25.
He doesn't want to be surprised later on with owing $175, so he asked an insurance rep about it. They just said that maybe the pharmacy was able to apply some coupon and didn't say anything about it. That was nice a nice surprise. Hopefully it's not $500 next month.
:shrug:
I had no idea how much Wegovy was. My wife went in for a checkup for several smaller issues that have been brewing. While she was there she vented to her doctor about not being able to lose weight. My wife has been working hard and changed her diet substantially over the last two months. I let her know its a process that will take some time to see results, but she's of course discouraged. Without much dialog about it, the doctor prescribers her Wegovy. I was a bit surprised how quickly and easily it was prescribed.

She gets to the Pharmacy to pickup and its 780 for a month's supply. Shocked we ask if insurance didn't cover it. They said it did, knocked the price down from 1,600 a month. We have pretty good health insurance, so I was surprised. Obviously we passed on that.

It’s manufacturer (Novo Nordisk) had $41 billion in sales last year, with a profit margin of nearly 50%. It’s not an American company, though.
My immediate question would be "how much does the same drug cost in Canada, France, the UK, etc.?"

A quick google search tell me a month of Wegovy costs &1,349 in the US, $137 in Germany, $82 in the UK, $265 in Canada. We are cheaper than in the United Arab Emirates where it’s $1,865, though I doubt there is much demand there.
That sums up our entire healthcare system. Absolutely unacceptable.
Everyone in the US needs to get their kickbacks.
It's not "everyone". It's a very specific group of people.

While the drug is being used mainly by “a very specific group of people”, it’s generally speaking being funded by everyone in the US, via health insurance premiums. I don't take any of these GLP drugs, but I pay health insurance premiums (as does my employer) which go to pay for them.
I think meant a "very specific group of people" need to get their kickbacks. Specifically, those in Congress who refuse to allow drug reimportation, something that would instantly solve 90%+ of the issue of price discrepancy between the US and other developed nations.
 
We should just call it HealthBusiness instead of Healthcare.

Had to go to urgent care on Saturday. Horrible headache and trouble breathing. Diagnosed with walking pneumonia. Prescribed antibiotics, and inhaler. Doc tells me that I don't need the plastic tube to use with the inhaler. Go to pick up my prescription on site and the pharmacist is reviewing my order. I'm not all that coherent at the time because of my condition. I see that they included the plastic tube and the pharmacist also tells me that it's not necessary. Pretty sure I saw the line item charged to my card and I said I like to remove it and then he says he pretty sure it was included and covered by insurance. He pulls out the receipt and double checks and says yes, it was covered.

I looked over my receipt yesterday and sure enough they charged me $20 for the plastic tube. He just straight up lied to my face. I'm sure there are great margins on that stuff.

/rant
 
Fair. That was a generalized "everyone". I'd like to see less Big Pharma influence in our healthcare system.
I understand. I was pointing out that there is a very specific group looking for their handouts.

While the drug is being used mainly by “a very specific group of people”, it’s generally speaking being funded by everyone in the US, via health insurance premiums. I don't take any of these GLP drugs, but I pay health insurance premiums (as does my employer) which go to pay for them.
I was replying to the kickbacks not the meds.
 
We should just call it HealthBusiness instead of Healthcare.

Had to go to urgent care on Saturday. Horrible headache and trouble breathing. Diagnosed with walking pneumonia. Prescribed antibiotics, and inhaler. Doc tells me that I don't need the plastic tube to use with the inhaler. Go to pick up my prescription on site and the pharmacist is reviewing my order. I'm not all that coherent at the time because of my condition. I see that they included the plastic tube and the pharmacist also tells me that it's not necessary. Pretty sure I saw the line item charged to my card and I said I like to remove it and then he says he pretty sure it was included and covered by insurance. He pulls out the receipt and double checks and says yes, it was covered.

I looked over my receipt yesterday and sure enough they charged me $20 for the plastic tube. He just straight up lied to my face. I'm sure there are great margins on that stuff.

/rant
Hmmmm….by “plastic tube”, do you mean a spacer? Depending on the inhaler, they are recommended, to optimize delivery of the drug to your lungs.
Maximising airway deposition of a pMDI-delivered drug requires a slow (30 L·min−1), deep inhalation commencing immediately after pMDI activation followed by a breath-hold pause of ≥4 s and optimally up to 10 s [2]. Even with optimal technique and modern hydrofluoroalkane propellants, however, pMDIs deliver, at best, only ∼20% of the emitted dose to the lower airways, leaving ∼80% in the oropharynx [2]. With suboptimal or incorrect technique, this fraction is further reduced, potentially to zero.

The concept of activating the pMDI into a spacer (an additional reservoir placed between the mouthpiece of the pMDI and the mouth of the patient) or a valved holding chamber (VHC) (a reservoir with a one-way valve permitting airflow into, but not out of, the patient's mouth) prior to inhalation was developed in the 1950s [3, 4] to address some, but not all, of the problems and potentially critical errors when using a pMDI. Use of a spacer/VHC slows down the aerosolised particles emitted from the pMDI, which may further increase lung deposition of the respirable fine particles, although the clinical significance of this effect is not well established. It certainly significantly filters out and thereby reduces oropharyngeal deposition of the larger particles emitted from a pMDI, even with “perfect” technique [5].

The correct use of a spacer/VHC negotiates with the common and potentially critical problem of poor coordination of activation of the pMDI with commencement of inhalation [1]. Although some synchrony of activation of the pMDI with inhalation is still desirable when using a spacer/VHC, the patient has a lot more time to accomplish this effectively. Breath-activated pMDIs are also available for the delivery of some inhaled drugs and these may also assist with poor coordination, but do not deliver all of the potential advantages of a spacer/VHC. No inhaler device can fully obviate the propensity for patients to breathe in too quickly (although some more recent devices warn patients of this using a whistle activated above a flow threshold, while another device whistles if used correctly) or to fail to hold their breath following inhalation.
It’s probably more likely the antibiotics weren’t indicated, as about a third of those prescriptions are unnecessary. Yet another reason our healthcare stinks.
 
On a positive note, it sounds like we might see drug prices coming down in the near future.

Yes, was interesting as that came out as we were discussing a particular drug’s cost above. I believe it’s just a short list of drugs, but some of those GLPs may be included. It is an industry that needs some looking into, specifically the price differences from country to country for the identical drug.
 
On a positive note, it sounds like we might see drug prices coming down in the near future.

Yes, was interesting as that came out as we were discussing a particular drug’s cost above. I believe it’s just a short list of drugs, but some of those GLPs may be included. It is an industry that needs some looking into, specifically the price differences from country to country for the identical drug.
Jimmy Dore was talking about this on his show the other day. His take is that the US subsidizes drug costs for the rest of the world. We're paying 10X the cost of a drug so other countries can get it cheaper and companies still make their massive profits. Once drug prices are pushed lower in the US, these same companies will be screaming that the US markup is what drives innovation and research... which is a stretch.
 
On a positive note, it sounds like we might see drug prices coming down in the near future.

Yes, was interesting as that came out as we were discussing a particular drug’s cost above. I believe it’s just a short list of drugs, but some of those GLPs may be included. It is an industry that needs some looking into, specifically the price differences from country to country for the identical drug.
Jimmy Dore was talking about this on his show the other day. His take is that the US subsidizes drug costs for the rest of the world. We're paying 10X the cost of a drug so other countries can get it cheaper and companies still make their massive profits. Once drug prices are pushed lower in the US, these same companies will be screaming that the US markup is what drives innovation and research... which is a stretch.
I think the margins are just regulated in other countries. It's not like they are unprofitable.
 
On a positive note, it sounds like we might see drug prices coming down in the near future.

Yes, was interesting as that came out as we were discussing a particular drug’s cost above. I believe it’s just a short list of drugs, but some of those GLPs may be included. It is an industry that needs some looking into, specifically the price differences from country to country for the identical drug.
Jimmy Dore was talking about this on his show the other day. His take is that the US subsidizes drug costs for the rest of the world. We're paying 10X the cost of a drug so other countries can get it cheaper and companies still make their massive profits. Once drug prices are pushed lower in the US, these same companies will be screaming that the US markup is what drives innovation and research... which is a stretch.
Not a stretch at all. This is exactly what they will say. This is what almost ALL the "free market" types say when we talk about the government taking over the negotiation of drug prices and regulating the industry. It's the boogey man of Boogey men. We DO subsidize the costs for other countries. Our politicians allow it with glee. Our drug/pharma industry is built off the backs of PhD students and research universities. Being gracious, I'd say 5% of the meaningful work is done in the commercial space. 99.999999999% of the monetization is done there though.
 
We're paying 10X the cost of a drug so other countries can get it cheaper and companies still make their massive profits. Once drug prices are pushed lower in the US, these same companies will be screaming that the US markup is what drives innovation and research... which is a stretch.
That's been their argument for years and years, and pharmaceutical lobbies have always steered Congress away from doing much tangible about it. Lobbying and contributions do an awful lot. It'll be interesting now because numerous Congresscritters will now feel pushed to support limiting prices when they previously opposed it. Which is a very good change IMO.

It'll take time to push drug prices lower, and will need the involvement of Congress, but this is a really good time to get it done. Congress approved, in recent years, some lowering of Medicare prices on a set number of drugs, so there's been some support already for it in the slow-moving government.

a couple current articles explaining the political steps that have to be gone through:

 
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It'll take time to push drug prices lower, and will need the involvement of Congress, but this is a really good time to get it done. Congress approved, in recent years, some lowering of Medicare prices on a set number of drugs, so there's been some support already for it in the slow-moving government.

This isn't necessarily true. Congress could authorize reimportation of drugs from other countries and drug prices would fall immediately.
 


UnitedHealth Group, the nation’s largest healthcare conglomerate, has secretly paid nursing homes thousands in bonuses to help slash hospital transfers for ailing residents – part of a series of cost-cutting tactics that has saved the company millions, but at times risked residents’ health, a Guardian investigation has found.

Those secret bonuses have been paid out as part of a UnitedHealth program that stations the company’s own medical teams in nursing homes and pushes them to cut care expenses for residents covered by the insurance giant.

In several cases identified by the Guardian, nursing home residents who needed immediate hospital care under the program failed to receive it, after interventions from UnitedHealth staffers. At least one lived with permanent brain damage following his delayed transfer, according to a confidential nursing home incident log, recordings and photo evidence.

No one is truly investigating when a patient suffers harm. Absolutely no one,” said one current UnitedHealth nurse practitioner who recently filed a congressional complaint about the nursing home program. “These incidents are hidden, downplayed and minimized. The sense is: ‘Well, they’re medically frail, and no one lives for ever.’”

The Guardian’s investigation is based on thousands of confidential corporate and patient records obtained through sources, public records requests and court files, interviews with more than 20 current and former UnitedHealth and nursing home employees, and two whistleblower declarations submitted to Congress this month through the non-profit legal group Whistleblower Aid.

The documents and sources provide a never-before-seen window into the company’s successful effort to insert itself into the day-to-day operations of nearly 2,000 nursing homes in small towns and urban commercial strips across the nation – an approach which has helped UnitedHealth secure a vast stream of federal dollars from Medicare Advantage plans that cover more than 55,000 long-term nursing home residents.

UnitedHealth said the suggestion that its employees have prevented hospital transfers “is verifiably false”. It said its bonus payments to nursing homes help prevent unnecessary hospitalizations that are costly and dangerous to patients and that its partnerships with nursing homes improve health outcomes.

Under Medicare Advantage, insurers collect lump sums from the federal government to cover seniors’ care. But the less insurers spend on care, the more they have for potential profit – an opportunity that UnitedHealth higher-ups have systematically sought to exploit when it comes to long-term nursing home residents.

To reduce residents’ hospital visits, UnitedHealth has offered nursing homes an array of financial sweeteners that sounded more like they came from stockbrokers than medical professionals.

Over the past seven years, the company has shelled out “Premium Dividend” and “Shared Savings” payments that boosted nursing homes’ bottom lines. Through its “Quality and Shared Risk” program, UnitedHealth offered an even bigger cut to nursing homes that drove down medical spending, but threatened to claw back money from those that didn’t, according to former employees and internal corporate documents.

One term that UnitedHealth executives obsessed over was “admits per thousand” – APK for short. It was a measure of the rate that nursing homes sent their residents to the hospital. Under the “Premium Dividend” program, a low APK qualified a nursing home for the various bonus payments the insurer offered. A high APK meant that a nursing home received nothing.

“APK drove everything,” said one former national UnitedHealth executive who worked on the initiative with nursing homes in more than two dozen states and spoke about the confidential contracts on the condition of anonymity. “You gain profitability by denying care, and when profitability suffers for the shareholders, that’s when people get crazy and do things that are not appropriate.”

The secret bonuses were just one of many maneuvers UnitedHealth devised to track and cut expenses in its nursing home initiative.

Internal emails show, for example, that UnitedHealth supervisors gave their teams “budgets” showing how many hospital admissions they had “left” to use up on nursing home patients.

The company also monitored nursing homes that had smaller numbers of patients with “do not resuscitate” – or DNR – and “do not intubate” orders in their files. Without such orders, patients are in line for certain life-saving treatments that might lead to costly hospital stays.

Two current and three former UnitedHealth nurse practitioners told the Guardian that UnitedHealth managers pressed nurse practitioners to persuade Medicare Advantage members to change their “code status” to DNR even when patients had clearly expressed a desire that all available treatments be used to keep them alive.

"They’re pretending to make it look like it’s in the best interest of the member,” another current UnitedHealth nurse practitioner said. “But it’s really not.”

In response to questions, UnitedHealth said its nursing home initiative improves care for older residents by providing “on-site nurse practitioners, tailored care plans for chronic conditions, and enhanced communication between staff, families and providers”.

The company denied that it had prevented hospital transfers or inappropriately pushed patients to change their code status to DNR.

The program’s cost-cutting schemes were only possible because of the sprawling nature of UnitedHealth, a $300bn-plus conglomerate which has grown into one of the world’s biggest companies thanks to its relentless efforts to embed itself into nearly every corner of the healthcare industry. UnitedHealth’s insurance arm covers millions more Medicare Advantage seniors than any of its rivals, and another subsidiary, Optum, employs or affiliates with tens of thousands of doctors and nurse practitioners.

When nursing homes under the bonus program allowed medical teams from one UnitedHealth subsidiary to work in their facilities, they allowed the corporate giant to influence critical healthcare decisions for residents, which had a direct impact on the insurance side of its business.

The Guardian’s reporting also found that the program offered nursing homes even larger sums for every senior enrolled in the insurer’s offerings for long-term nursing home residents, which are called “Institutional Special Needs Plans”. In some cases, these payments incentivized nursing homes to leak confidential resident records to UnitedHealth sales teams so they could directly solicit elderly residents and their families, according to a whistleblower lawsuit currently being fought in federal court in Georgia as well as internal nursing home records and interviews with more than a dozen current and former nursing home employees and UnitedHealth salespeople.

One former UnitedHealth employee in Georgia admitted to the Guardian that she got nursing home staff to leak her confidential resident records then backdated permission-to-contact forms to circumvent federal rules meant to protect seniors from aggressive sales pitches. The employee was fired after failing to meet her sales quota, according to a former colleague.

After one nursing home near Savannah, Georgia, disclosed confidential patient records to UnitedHealth, families complained that their loved ones had been shifted on to the company’s Medicare Advantage plan even though they lacked the cognitive ability to make such decisions, according to a former UnitedHealth executive, federal court filings in Georgia and leaked patient files reviewed by the Guardian.

All told, the various payments that came with increasing UnitedHealth enrollments and minimizing medical expenses could add up to hundreds of thousands of dollars annually for a typical midsize nursing home, sources said.

But the nursing home residents, who had signed up for UnitedHealth’s Medicare Advantage program and whose federal dollars were financing the program, did not know about the confidential incentive payments and anti-hospitalization tactics affecting their care.

UnitedHealth declined to answer questions about how much it has paid out to nursing homes through the secret contract clauses. The company said its payments incentivize high-quality outcomes for residents and reward efforts that lead to improved care.

Maxwell Ollivant, a former UnitedHealth nurse practitioner, filed a congressional declaration this month with help from Whistleblower Aid, asking the federal government to hold the healthcare giant accountable.

In an interview with the Guardian – his first-ever public comment on the nursing home initiative – Ollivant urged lawmakers to make sure that UnitedHealth was “not skimping out on care” and that patients were not “signing up for a service and not receiving the service when the time comes”.

Ollivant previously filed a lawsuit in federal court in Washington state accusing UnitedHealth of withholding necessary services to nursing home residents, making their requests for Medicare payments violations of the federal False Claims Act. In 2023, the nurse practitioner dropped the suit after the Department of Justice declined to intervene. His congressional declaration provides new details of his experience.

In a statement, UnitedHealth said Ollivant “lacks both the necessary data and expertise” to assess the effectiveness of its programs. “The US Department of Justice investigated these allegations, interviewed witnesses, and obtained thousands of documents that demonstrated the significant factual inaccuracies in the allegations,” the company said. “After reviewing all the evidence during its multi-year investigation, the Department of Justice declined to pursue the matter.”
 
Dubious diagnoses, delayed hospitalizations
UnitedHealth pitches its nursing home initiative as a positive for long-term residents. It provides them access to UnitedHealth nurse practitioners via in-person visits as well as to remote medical professionals who provide guidance to facility nurses at night and on weekends.

This “enhanced care coordination”, as the company puts it, is supposed to help reduce unnecessary hospitalizations, which are costly for UnitedHealth and can expose patients to additional complications.

In several cases identified by the Guardian, the company’s insertion of itself into nursing home emergency protocols helped delay or avert transfers for patients who could have benefited from immediate hospital care.

In one incident from 2019, a remote UnitedHealth medical provider working for the program received a report shortly after midnight about a nursing home resident in Renton, Washington, who was slurring her words and unable to move her arm – textbook stroke symptoms.

In stroke cases, every minute counts. When blood flow to the brain is blocked or interrupted, brain cells quickly die. The sooner patients get to the hospital, the better the chance doctors have to prevent long-term neurological damage.

In this case, the nurse at her nursing home reported to UnitedHealth that it looked like a stroke, according to an incident log. But instead of greenlighting an immediate hospitalization for a possible stroke, the remote UnitedHealth employee suggested the resident might be suffering from a less serious condition called a transient ischemic attack (TIA), a temporary loss of brain function caused by blood flow blockage.

The remote employee then advised the nurse to run a blood test and update the company again in four hours, confidential UnitedHealth records show.

The patient’s independent primary care doctor told the Guardian she was never informed of this failure to transfer her patient.

“I would have wanted them to contact me right away so that I could have made a decision,” she said, speaking on the condition of anonymity to discuss sensitive patient matters. “The time frame matters.”

The independent doctor also said she was disturbed by the remote UnitedHealth employee’s working diagnosis, which called for ruling out a TIA, rather than a stroke. The remote employee was an early-career nurse practitioner, not a physician.

“Their diagnosis says TIA, [but] nobody can say that so early,” the patient’s doctor said.

In another incident that year, a nursing home nurse in Puyallup, Washington, delayed hospitalizing a resident also exhibiting potential stroke symptoms because of UnitedHealth protocols that pushed facility staff to wait for guidance from the company.

According to confidential nursing home records obtained by the Guardian, the nurse phoned a remote UnitedHealth provider, who was unsure about what to do and failed to call for an immediate transfer. Tired of waiting for a callback, the nurse finally bypassed the remote provider and called an independent doctor, who ordered the patient to be transferred.

But the delay meant that about an hour passed before the resident was actually taken to the hospital, which was only a few minutes away from his facility.

After the belated hospitalization, the patient suffered permanent verbal slurring and facial droop on the right side of his face, audio recordings and photos obtained by the Guardian show.

Citing confidentiality rules, UnitedHealth declined to comment on the specific patient cases. But the company noted that it does not prevent nursing homes themselves from contacting residents’ independent doctors, and that hospitalization decisions can depend on many factors including a patient’s goals of care, symptoms and the input of their care team.

UnitedHealth’s pressure on nursing home staff
UnitedHealth denied that its employees prevented hospital transfers and said it was the responsibility of the treating physician and the facility to decide on a patient’s best course of care.

But in practice, the company’s tactics put pressure on facility nurses to turn over patient care decisions to UnitedHealth staffers, according to internal documents and interviews with current and former UnitedHealth medical providers.

“There was never any caveat, given, like, ‘It’s up to you all,’” said one former UnitedHealth doctor involved in the program. Nurses at the long-term care facilities “were calling the nurse practitioner or on-call provider who was responsible. The implication was that they were calling for advice that was meant to be followed.”

A lot of times the nurses want to send people out and we have to go in and try to stop it,” said another current UnitedHealth nurse practitioner, who also spoke to the Guardian anonymously citing fears of retaliation. “And if we don’t, it’s on us. They take us out on to the carpet.”

In one patient case identified by the Guardian, nursing home staff sent a resident to the hospital because she was found unresponsive, drooling and with a “slant to the side” – possible stroke symptoms. She was admitted to the intensive care unit for a brain bleed, according to a UnitedHealth email reviewed by the Guardian.

But after the incident, instead of praising the facility team for the prompt hospitalization, a UnitedHealth manager alerted her subordinates that the facility team had bypassed the company’s protocol, failing to contact UnitedHealth’s remote on-call team first to receive guidance.

The manager met with the nursing home’s director of nursing services, and scheduled training to re-educate the facility’s nurses, the email shows.

UnitedHealth notes that unnecessary hospitalizations can expose patients to pressure injuries, falls and other complications. In response to questions from the Guardian, UnitedHealth pointed to one 2019 study which heralded the program’s success in reducing hospitalizations and noted the potential harms of hospital care.

But in an interview with the Guardian, Ollivant, the former UnitedHealth nurse practitioner turned whistleblower, argued such analyses fail to account for the negative health outcomes that patients suffer from missing hospital care.

“How many of those people were further harmed because they never received the care that they needed?” he said. “When you just look at the percentage reductions in hospitalizations, it doesn’t say anything about patient outcomes.”

A plan of care, an ailing patient
Kevin Keep never knew – until the Guardian called him last month and told him – that his father had suffered a possible stroke at a nursing home that partnered with UnitedHealth.

On the evening of 23 February 2019, a UnitedHealth remote employee received a report about Keep’s father, Donald Keep, a retired auto mechanic with dementia and an amputated leg living at a nursing home in Bremerton, Washington.

On that day, Keep was experiencing forgetfulness and drooping on the right side of his face – “possible stroke symptoms”, according to a confidential UnitedHealth incident log.

But instead of sending the octogenarian straight to the hospital, the remote employee referred to a plan of care that called for bloodwork and giving Keep an aspirin – a course of action which one former UnitedHealth doctor said “doesn’t make sense”, given the risk of brain damage.

“That’s not useful when it might be a stroke,” said the doctor, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to comment on Keep’s confidential patient records that he reviewed at the request of the Guardian. “What they really need is a physical exam and an MRI of the brain, and it needs to be done expeditiously.”

The incident log, which doesn’t mention a hospital transfer, suggests that the UnitedHealth team didn’t treat the case with the urgency that a possible stroke would require.

Keep’s symptoms were logged shortly before 10pm on a Saturday night. The next afternoon, a UnitedHealth employee emailed the company’s nurse practitioners a follow-up note to look into what was wrong with Keep.

The email lists the proposed work-up as being for a “TIA” – the transient, less serious neurological condition, not a stroke.

As of 4pm on that Sunday, more than 18 hours after Keep was found with his face drooping, the work-up was still listed as “pending”.

Citing patient confidentiality, UnitedHealth did not respond to an inquiry about whether the retiree was ever sent to the hospital.

Hannah Recht contributed data reporting

Tomorrow, part two of UnitedHealth investigation: A tale of three whistleblowers
 
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Jimmy Dore was talking about this on his show the other day. His take is that the US subsidizes drug costs for the rest of the world. We're paying 10X the cost of a drug so other countries can get it cheaper and companies still make their massive profits. Once drug prices are pushed lower in the US, these same companies will be screaming that the US markup is what drives innovation and research... which is a stretch.
His take is exactly correct. We should immediately start paying no more than the average of the first world (or similar scheme) for Medicare, Medicaid, and the VA. That essentially sets the prices in the US as those are a big chunk of US healthcare. Then we can move on to the same with medical devices, which do the same thing.
 
What gets talked about is cost, and care levels, and profits, and fraud, etc. But what doesn't get talked about as much is individual people and the effects of the health care system on them, both good and bad. And that Guardian article @Dezbelief posted really makes me angry when it describes how United, which is supposed to insure people and help them get and afford health care, treats them instead like helpless profit-generating hunks of flesh to be taken advantage of. United was BRIBING healthcare facilities to NOT send people to the hospital.

"Those secret bonuses have been paid out as part of a UnitedHealth program that stations the company’s own medical teams in nursing homes and pushes them to cut care expenses for residents covered by the insurance giant. In several cases identified by the Guardian, nursing home residents who needed immediate hospital care under the program failed to receive it, after interventions from UnitedHealth staffers. At least one lived with permanent brain damage following his delayed transfer, according to a confidential nursing home incident log, recordings and photo evidence.

“No one is truly investigating when a patient suffers harm. Absolutely no one,” said one current UnitedHealth nurse practitioner who recently filed a congressional complaint about the nursing home program. “These incidents are hidden, downplayed and minimized. The sense is: ‘Well, they’re medically frail, and no one lives for ever.’”"
 
What gets talked about is cost, and care levels, and profits, and fraud, etc. But what doesn't get talked about as much is individual people and the effects of the health care system on them, both good and bad. And that Guardian article @Dezbelief posted really makes me angry when it describes how United, which is supposed to insure people and help them get and afford health care, treats them instead like helpless profit-generating hunks of flesh to be taken advantage of. United was BRIBING healthcare facilities to NOT send people to the hospital.

"Those secret bonuses have been paid out as part of a UnitedHealth program that stations the company’s own medical teams in nursing homes and pushes them to cut care expenses for residents covered by the insurance giant. In several cases identified by the Guardian, nursing home residents who needed immediate hospital care under the program failed to receive it, after interventions from UnitedHealth staffers. At least one lived with permanent brain damage following his delayed transfer, according to a confidential nursing home incident log, recordings and photo evidence.

“No one is truly investigating when a patient suffers harm. Absolutely no one,” said one current UnitedHealth nurse practitioner who recently filed a congressional complaint about the nursing home program. “These incidents are hidden, downplayed and minimized. The sense is: ‘Well, they’re medically frail, and no one lives for ever.’”"
Welcome to America.
 
What gets talked about is cost, and care levels, and profits, and fraud, etc. But what doesn't get talked about as much is individual people and the effects of the health care system on them, both good and bad. And that Guardian article @Dezbelief posted really makes me angry when it describes how United, which is supposed to insure people and help them get and afford health care, treats them instead like helpless profit-generating hunks of flesh to be taken advantage of. United was BRIBING healthcare facilities to NOT send people to the hospital.

"Those secret bonuses have been paid out as part of a UnitedHealth program that stations the company’s own medical teams in nursing homes and pushes them to cut care expenses for residents covered by the insurance giant. In several cases identified by the Guardian, nursing home residents who needed immediate hospital care under the program failed to receive it, after interventions from UnitedHealth staffers. At least one lived with permanent brain damage following his delayed transfer, according to a confidential nursing home incident log, recordings and photo evidence.

“No one is truly investigating when a patient suffers harm. Absolutely no one,” said one current UnitedHealth nurse practitioner who recently filed a congressional complaint about the nursing home program. “These incidents are hidden, downplayed and minimized. The sense is: ‘Well, they’re medically frail, and no one lives for ever.’”"
Work in healthcare for a while and you’ll see how much of a business it really is. It’s truly disgusting.
 
Anyone in here up on what's happening with medicaid? Especially in relation to long term care facilities. It would appear to me that the federal funding for such places are going to be cut, or greatly reduced, but clear information on this specifically and it's ramifications seems hard to gather. Maybe at this point it's still unclear what's going on here?
 
What gets talked about is cost, and care levels, and profits, and fraud, etc. But what doesn't get talked about as much is individual people and the effects of the health care system on them, both good and bad. And that Guardian article @Dezbelief posted really makes me angry when it describes how United, which is supposed to insure people and help them get and afford health care, treats them instead like helpless profit-generating hunks of flesh to be taken advantage of. United was BRIBING healthcare facilities to NOT send people to the hospital.

"Those secret bonuses have been paid out as part of a UnitedHealth program that stations the company’s own medical teams in nursing homes and pushes them to cut care expenses for residents covered by the insurance giant. In several cases identified by the Guardian, nursing home residents who needed immediate hospital care under the program failed to receive it, after interventions from UnitedHealth staffers. At least one lived with permanent brain damage following his delayed transfer, according to a confidential nursing home incident log, recordings and photo evidence.

“No one is truly investigating when a patient suffers harm. Absolutely no one,” said one current UnitedHealth nurse practitioner who recently filed a congressional complaint about the nursing home program. “These incidents are hidden, downplayed and minimized. The sense is: ‘Well, they’re medically frail, and no one lives for ever.’”"
For the cherry - PE owned hospitals had a 40% higher death rate for Medicare patients.

 
Anyone in here up on what's happening with medicaid? Especially in relation to long term care facilities. It would appear to me that the federal funding for such places are going to be cut, or greatly reduced, but clear information on this specifically and it's ramifications seems hard to gather. Maybe at this point it's still unclear what's going on here?
The bill is out there. Not sure if we're allowed to link such things here or not. Probably depends on the person doing the linking, but it's not going to be good. At a 10,000 foot level, lots of rural areas are going to have their hospitals and/or urgent care groups go away. Lots of people are probably going to have to forgo standard trips to the doctor and rely more heavily on emergency rooms etc.
 
Anyone in here up on what's happening with medicaid? Especially in relation to long term care facilities. It would appear to me that the federal funding for such places are going to be cut, or greatly reduced, but clear information on this specifically and it's ramifications seems hard to gather. Maybe at this point it's still unclear what's going on here?
The bill is out there. Not sure if we're allowed to link such things here or not. Probably depends on the person doing the linking, but it's not going to be good. At a 10,000 foot level, lots of rural areas are going to have their hospitals and/or urgent care groups go away. Lots of people are probably going to have to forgo standard trips to the doctor and rely more heavily on emergency rooms etc.
My wife is in administration at a state run skilled nursing facility and she seems a bit in the dark still as there's no official word as to how this is going to directly affect their funding. We've seen and heard some numbers thrown around, but nothing concrete which is why i was hoping someone here might have a more direct knowledge of how those particular facilities will fair. Perhaps we're a ways off still and state funding will still need to be worked out when federal funding changes.
 
Lots of people are probably going to have to forgo standard trips to the doctor and rely more heavily on emergency rooms etc.
If this happens, hospital costs will go WAY up and I'd guess so will the cost of insurance. Health care and health insurance isn't my field of expertise so it's just an opinion.
 
Anyone in here up on what's happening with medicaid? Especially in relation to long term care facilities. It would appear to me that the federal funding for such places are going to be cut, or greatly reduced, but clear information on this specifically and it's ramifications seems hard to gather. Maybe at this point it's still unclear what's going on here?
The bill is out there. Not sure if we're allowed to link such things here or not. Probably depends on the person doing the linking, but it's not going to be good. At a 10,000 foot level, lots of rural areas are going to have their hospitals and/or urgent care groups go away. Lots of people are probably going to have to forgo standard trips to the doctor and rely more heavily on emergency rooms etc.
My wife is in administration at a state run skilled nursing facility and she seems a bit in the dark still as there's no official word as to how this is going to directly affect their funding. We've seen and heard some numbers thrown around, but nothing concrete which is why i was hoping someone here might have a more direct knowledge of how those particular facilities will fair. Perhaps we're a ways off still and state funding will still need to be worked out when federal funding changes.
Every state will be different. Take my comments from the 80/20 perspective. It will all depend on how well the state can fill the gaps, if they can. My dad lives in Florida and they've had several rural areas impacted when hospitals close. FL chose not to increase their medicaid funding the last time they were afforded the opportunity, so these current closings are because of that, but this is a pretty good indicator of what happens when outside support/funding goes away in areas like those. It makes complete sense to assume the same sorts of things are going to happen with this new bill too.
 

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