Vick to be suspended 1 year (1 Viewer)

[Stompin' Tom Connors]

If the Yahoo story is true, Goodell is not suspending Vick for being indicted for dogfighting. He is suspending Vick for lying to him as to his knowledge of what was going on on that property. All it takes is some credit card receipts, airplane receipts, eyewitness reports etc that place Vick at or near his property more than "almost never". The fact that dog fighting took place there is a fact. One defendant has already pleaded guilty to it. Vick told Goodell that there was not and that he was never at the property. If Goodell has evidence of all this (like a conviction of another defendant), then he can ban Vick for lying. If Vick is found to be innocent (which does not alter the fact of dog abuse on the property, just lawyer trickery) then he still was suspended for lying to the Commish, not for being indicted. So he will have no grounds. As for his endorsers, I'm sure Nike's lawyers rival the NFL's and they are pretty sure their culpability is secure should Vick be exoenerated.What you're saying is valid, IF and only IF, they were suspending him for the indictments. But they're not, it's for lying to the Commissioner.

The Yahoo article does not mention anything about the suspension being tagged to Vick lying to the Commissioner. Rather, it posits that any suspension will likely be justified by the gambling aspects of the case, where there is precedence of suspension, and not because of Vick lying to the Commissioner.That evidence pertaining to dogfighting on property Vick owns is not in dispute; but this evidence alone does not prove Vick's culpability beyond reasonable doubt. It would be hard for Goodell to justify suspending Vick for lying to him when he hasn't been found guilty of his alleged crimes.

 

[mad sweeney]

If the Yahoo story is true, Goodell is not suspending Vick for being indicted for dogfighting. He is suspending Vick for lying to him as to his knowledge of what was going on on that property. All it takes is some credit card receipts, airplane receipts, eyewitness reports etc that place Vick at or near his property more than "almost never". The fact that dog fighting took place there is a fact. One defendant has already pleaded guilty to it. Vick told Goodell that there was not and that he was never at the property. If Goodell has evidence of all this (like a conviction of another defendant), then he can ban Vick for lying. If Vick is found to be innocent (which does not alter the fact of dog abuse on the property, just lawyer trickery) then he still was suspended for lying to the Commish, not for being indicted. So he will have no grounds. As for his endorsers, I'm sure Nike's lawyers rival the NFL's and they are pretty sure their culpability is secure should Vick be exoenerated.What you're saying is valid, IF and only IF, they were suspending him for the indictments. But they're not, it's for lying to the Commissioner.

The Yahoo article does not mention anything about the suspension being tagged to Vick lying to the Commissioner. Rather, it posits that any suspension will likely be justified by the gambling aspects of the case, where there is precedence of suspension, and not because of Vick lying to the Commissioner.That evidence pertaining to dogfighting on property Vick owns is not in dispute; but this evidence alone does not prove Vick's culpability beyond reasonable doubt. It would be hard for Goodell to justify suspending Vick for lying to him when he hasn't been found guilty of his alleged crimes.

I reread the Yahoo article and you're right tht it doesn't mention the lying. But in a lot of other articles that I must have been thinking of, Vick's April meeting with the commish prior to indictments, were going to be the basis for the suspension because it was on;y his first indictment. At that meeting Goodell told Vick that he was responsible for what goes on on his property adn Vick assured him that there was no dogfighting there and he never went there.Regardless, if Vick is suspended, be assured that an army of lawyers that even Vick couldn't muster will have pored over it. Remember everyone said the Pacman suspension wouldn't hold up on the basis of due process, but who's wrestling (sort of) now instead of playing football.

 

[2stix]

Police are suspended without pay all the time when they are caught up in a investigation.

 

[Traders2001]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

 

[RedZone]

Micahel Vick is an adult who was granted many privileges due to his immense talent and skill as an athlete. Assuming he was raised in a culture wherein dog fighting and possessing an aggressive dog for personal and property protection was common and accepted (from my observations, this appears to be true in many low-income communities, understandably so given the rate of crimes against person and property), one can understand the escalation of his interest in this practice as his income and resources increased exponentially as a professional football player.

Vick's suddenly acquired finances offered him an opportunity to escape/avoid the environment wherein a person need be constantly vigilant and aggression is used as a form of protection, but he instead chose to promote the anti-social (by mainstream American standards) behaviors that have plagued reports of his character, including the Ron Mexico incident, the "finger" and now his apparent involvement in the Bad Newz Kennel dogfighting operation.

Dogfighting is a culturally accepted sport in many less developed countries, as is cockfighting, bullfighting, etc. These practices persist in certain communities (maybe not bullfighting) here in the U.S. as they are engrained in the society of certain groups. Dogfighting has a historical place in military tradition, as wardogs were considered expendable and fear-inspiring shock troops used in the earliest stages of battle. Even to the mid-20th century, dogs were used in Europe by Nazi Germany (most often against civilian populations), and some dogs were used in tunnel searches/flushes in East Asia if I recall correctly. Wasn't there comments about dogs being used in Iraqi detention prisons for intimidation purposes? Many genteel Americans possess a large breed dog for the purposes of home security. This is accepted so long as the dog is well-controlled/contained and is trained for defensive purposes only, not offensive.

That being said, I vehemently oppose dogfighting, not only because it subjects dogs to a role that is no longer necessary or natural (dogs will fight dogs to protect territory or establish pecking order but not for sport and very rarely to the death), but because of the strong correlation between violence towards animals and violence towards people. Domesticated dogs are not simply animals, such as game animals like deer, turkey, etc which are openly hunted during season. Domesticated dogs represent a relationship between a person/family and a sentinent and responsive being. Frankly, the argument that human life is more precious holds little weight. If a person is abusive towards an animal, he/she has a higher risk of being abusive to a person, especially a vulnerable or dependent person.

There can be little comparison between Vick's suspension and either criminal legal proceedings (entirely different process and rules - remember, OJ Simpson lost the civil wrongful death case which entailed financial award to the Brown and Goldman families) or previous commissions. Goodell has been consistent in his approach and it is realistic to assume that the NFL's investigation, which likely involved players, coaches, support staff and interviews with law enforcement agencies that may have been capable of being more open about revealing details of their investigations, consists of matters that are not generally known. The one-year suspension is an appropriate stop-gap in that it allows due process to continue in the legal matters but also allows Goodell to demonstrate his limited tolerance for such behavior and show his willingness to enforce the standards that NOW reign in the NFL. Certainly, the public should have taken stronger stances against acts of violence (including sexual violence), habitual drug use/alcohol abuse, gambling, etc. It is as much the fault of the fan base as it is the previous commissions that these privileged athletes were allowed to behave in such a manner with limited/no penalty.

It would be most prudent of the Falcons organization to withhold pursuing the return of any money from Vick until the federal criminal proceedings have completed, as he may be exonerated (the American legal system certainly makes this possible, though highly unlikely if the charges are accurate).

Sadly, Michael Vick appears to be an example of a person who was provided an opportunity to escape/avoid a lifestyle associated with low socio-economic status and be a role model to children and young adults. Instead,he fulfilled hedonistic desires and has lost what very few people could every hope to attain, fame as an athlete and immense wealth.

If he is innocent, I sincerely hope the story will be emblazoned across every front page, home page and opening story. Unfortunately, I do not believe this to be true and if that is the case, do not wish him to serve as a role model to impressionable youth who often turn to public figures from the entertainment and athletic realms for guidance on how to be a man. Instead, let him serve as an example of what a person can lose, any person, if they cannot conform to the basest standards of behavior for American society.

 

[silentmark]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?i...e=ESPNHeadlines

 

[3C's]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?i...e=ESPNHeadlines

What would you expect them to say?

 

[silentmark]

Just posting the link, shrug ...

 

[dlos]

Here is a question.

If Vick gets suspended, is he still on the Falcon active roster?

A guy in our league took him at our auction for $6 with the plan of sitting on him for the year and using him as his keeper for next year. However, he must be on the active roster for him to hold on to him.

 

[3C's]

Here is a question.If Vick gets suspended, is he still on the Falcon active roster?

nope

 

[Robbie Cooper]

Let's say (however unlikely it seems) that Vick is found innocent. I imagine that Vick would sue the NFL to (at the very least) recoup his wages for that year, based on the NFL's proactive move to punish Vick for a crime he would not have committed. I imagine Vick and his lawyer would also go after all of his endorserment money as well. I imagine in this case, Vick would be successful recouping a lot of that money. All of these suits would be settled out of court, of course, but if the NFL decided to take a hard line against this countersuit, and it was disputed all the way up to the Supreme Court, do you think they would find in favor of the NFL's conduct policy, or uphold the presumption of innocence?

You do know that Scott "Scooter" Libby was found guilty and sentenced to prision for lying during an investigation about a crime that didn't happen (the outing of Valerie Plame). Right? And this occured even after the prosecutor, Fitzgerald, knew that there was no crime committed, and even knew that is was Robert Novak who "outed plame". But in his zeal for a conviction, he kept pressing Scooter Libby until he caught him in a lie --- again, about a crime that never occured.I don't think your knowledge of THINGS LEGAL is all that comprehensive.

 

[Shooter McGavin]

that cheering you hear is from Atlanta's WRs.

ATL WRs: "Yay, Vick's gone, so maybe we'll have a QB that can get us the ball!"Coach: "Meet your new starting QB -- Joey Harrington."ATL WRs:

 

[ravnzfan]

( murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc )

(no comment)On Vick:

I think the year is about right for what we've found out thus far...

...if the aligations are true, a lifetime ban isn't out of the question---if the actions were anywhere near what has been reported, the jailtime that should be imposed for the crime would in effect be the ban, as he won't see the light of day until well after his prime

 

[dapunisher]

Let's say (however unlikely it seems) that Vick is found innocent. I imagine that Vick would sue the NFL to (at the very least) recoup his wages for that year, based on the NFL's proactive move to punish Vick for a crime he would not have committed. I imagine Vick and his lawyer would also go after all of his endorserment money as well. I imagine in this case, Vick would be successful recouping a lot of that money. All of these suits would be settled out of court, of course, but if the NFL decided to take a hard line against this countersuit, and it was disputed all the way up to the Supreme Court, do you think they would find in favor of the NFL's conduct policy, or uphold the presumption of innocence?

You do know that Scott "Scooter" Libby was found guilty and sentenced to prision for lying during an investigation about a crime that didn't happen (the outing of Valerie Plame). Right? And this occured even after the prosecutor, Fitzgerald, knew that there was no crime committed, and even knew that is was Robert Novak who "outed plame". But in his zeal for a conviction, he kept pressing Scooter Libby until he caught him in a lie --- again, about a crime that never occured.I don't think your knowledge of THINGS LEGAL is all that comprehensive.

That would be I. Lewis Libby. No comment on the other inaccuracies above.

 

[Enderdog]

"Would you, ummm, you know, like some, you know, umm fries wif, you know, dat?"

Converted to Vickspeak.

 

[twistd]

that cheering you hear is from Atlanta's WRs.

ATL WRs: "Yay, Vick's gone, so maybe we'll have a QB that can get us the ball!"Coach: "Meet your new starting QB -- Joey Harrington."ATL WRs:

 

[Mark Wimer]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Some criminal acts are much less likely to damage the integrity of the game than high-stakes, interstate gambling rings. Vick needs to be removed from the league - not because of the PR hit or because his offense is more heinous - but on account of the credibility of the the individual performances and outcomes of games being called into question due to the influence of heavy-handed gamblers.

You can read the original indictment of Vick here (19 pages) and the 13 page plea deal from Vick business associate Tony Taylor here.Important to note on the first page of the plea deal is that Vick is now accused of "traveling in interstate commerce...to promote, manage, establish, carry and facilitate the promotion, management, and carrying on of an unlawful activity, to wit: a business enterprise involving gambling"

In the plea deal there are several corroborating witnesses listed in the document detailing payments received and payouts made by Vick (on page 3 it is alleged that Bad Newz Kennels' operating and gambling funds were "almost exclusively provided by Vick". On page 8 we learn of Vick allegedly accompanying Taylor, Peace and Phillips across state lines from Virginia to North Carolina to gamble for $3000 on a dog named Jane. In count 33 Vick and his companions allegedly received $3000 for Jane's victory.

Counts 49, 50, and 51 on page 11 (about a dog fight hosted at the 1915 Moonlight Rd. property in Virginia with Vick present) are attested to by a corroborating witness (CW #3).

Remember, the government is filing a new indictment of Vick, Peace and Phillips this month with (presumably) additional charges. The carrying on of an illegal business enterprise opens up a Pandora's box of additional federal charges that may be leveled against Vick, including racketeering and tax evasion

Vick isn't looking at probation here, guys. He's probably fighting for his entire fortune (if convicted for racketeering, his entire income and holdings are forfeit to the government) and to avoid a long, mandatory prison sentence at a federal penitentiary. So, IMO, a lifetime ban from the NFL is not at all far-fetched.

Also, note that the personal conduct policy of the NFL does NOT require a conviction if a player has been determined to be involved in illegal gambling. Credible evidence of association with known illegal gamblers or credible evidence of illegal gambling behavior by any player (regardless of a conviction in a court of law or not) is enough for the commissioner to suspend or ban a player from the league.

My .02

 

[Andy Herron]

This is just a continuation of what I've been telling you all what would happen concerning the Michael Vick case for over a month now:

Michael Vick's NFL career is over. Take off the rose-colored glasses.

 

[twistd]

This is just a continuation of what I've been telling you all what would happen concerning the Michael Vick case for over a month now:Michael Vick's NFL career is over. Take off the rose-colored glasses.

I've been saying the same thing, and getting abused about it. The NFL probably won't even have to do much, other than keep him on the sideline for the year. After that the prison system will take over, and his NFL career becomes a moot point.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

these were dogs. raised to fight.

so overblown

 

[MelvinTScupper]

This is just a continuation of what I've been telling you all what would happen concerning the Michael Vick case for over a month now:Michael Vick's NFL career is over. Take off the rose-colored glasses.

"what I've been telling you"

 

[3C's]

these were dogs.

Held in higher regard than you by many.

 

[j3r3m3y]

You're still missing the point. If the Yahoo story is true, Goodell is not suspending Vick for being indicted for dogfighting. He is suspending Vick for lying to him as to his knowledge of what was going on on that property. What you're saying is valid, IF and only IF, they were suspending him for the indictments. But they're not, it's for lying to the Commissioner.

To anyone who is still confused, or even thinks about uttering the words "innocent until proven guilty", please read the quoted text 10 times and let it sink in before you say anything else.

 

[Mark Wimer]

You're still missing the point. If the Yahoo story is true, Goodell is not suspending Vick for being indicted for dogfighting. He is suspending Vick for lying to him as to his knowledge of what was going on on that property.

What you're saying is valid, IF and only IF, they were suspending him for the indictments. But they're not, it's for lying to the Commissioner.

To anyone who is still confused, or even thinks about uttering the words "innocent until proven guilty", please read the quoted text 10 times and let it sink in before you say anything else.

As has been stated in multiple Vick threads, people commenting on this case are constantly conflating a person's rights in a court of law (innocent until proven guilty) with the prerogatives of an employer. There is a significant difference between the two.A person is considered innocent until proven guilty under the eyes of the law. That is his/her constitutional right.

A person is not guaranteed a job by the Constitution. Employers may terminate employees for violating the rules of the workplace REGARDLESS of whether said violation is or is not a violation of the law.

Show up 2 hours late for work 5 days in a row, and you'll probably be unemployed. Is it illegal to show up for work late? No.

Get plastered at the company Christmas party, make a pass at a topiary in the corner of the room (mistaking it for a person), and then puke on your boss - you'll probably be unemployed. Is it illegal to make a fool of yourself? No. Is it bad for your career? Yes.

Play a professional sport, associate with known illegal gamblers. Whether you bet on football games or not, whether you fight dogs or not, whether you just like to be seen as tough and on the edge but never place a wager on anything - it doesn't matter. The NFL has a vested interest to be sure that employees playing on Sunday are not involved with illegal gambling because, as the Black Sox showed in 1919, professional sports games can be fixed to suit unscrupulous gamblers' interests. This rule is not some "surprise" to the NFL players or the NFLPA - or Michael Vick - it is a well-known ban. Merely hanging out with illegal gamblers can get you suspended or banned regardless of whether the behavior results in a criminal conviction. It says so explicitly in the CBA. This is necessary for the integrity of the game.

Legal rights and employee conduct rules are two entirely different kettles of fish.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

these were dogs.

Held in higher regard than you by many.

yeah, those PETA people are who I look to for sane advice.

 

[Kleck.]

these were dogs. raised to fight.so overblown

It's not like Vick was sneaking into people's homes, stealing 'Rusty' during the night, and fighting him.

 

[j3r3m3y]

these were dogs. raised to fight.so overblown

It's not like Vick was sneaking into people's homes, stealing 'Rusty' during the night, and fighting him.

So it is ok to torture animals because they were raised for it?And again, the dogfighting is getting all the press, but the big deal to the NFL is the gambling.

 

[Kleck.]

these were dogs. raised to fight.

so overblown

It's not like Vick was sneaking into people's homes, stealing 'Rusty' during the night, and fighting him.

So it is ok to torture animals because they were raised for it?And again, the dogfighting is getting all the press, but the big deal to the NFL is the gambling.

That's where I see the the bigger of problems. Gambling and unreported income.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

These are dogs. Mans best friend and our pets. You underestimate the power of that.I know 2 business's (one construction and one landscape) that right now are not using Home Depot and both called HD and let them know they wont be back as long as Michael Vick is still an Atlanta Falcon. In my estimation that cannot just be a localized occurance. I think you would see a hit taken from the advertisers on TV and radio. You would see a hit taken on merchandise. That wont stop the NFL from being a monstrosity, but it will cause a serious hit to their revenue.And noone else is comparable. Murderers and thugs can be "cool" and can actually increase the sales of jerseys and at least cause a break-even scenario.Not so with massive dog abusers. There will be hell to pay.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

These are dogs. Mans best friend and our pets. You underestimate the power of that.I know 2 business's (one construction and one landscape) that right now are not using Home Depot and both called HD and let them know they wont be back as long as Michael Vick is still an Atlanta Falcon. In my estimation that cannot just be a localized occurance. I think you would see a hit taken from the advertisers on TV and radio. You would see a hit taken on merchandise. That wont stop the NFL from being a monstrosity, but it will cause a serious hit to their revenue.And noone else is comparable. Murderers and thugs can be "cool" and can actually increase the sales of jerseys and at least cause a break-even scenario.Not so with massive dog abusers. There will be hell to pay.

LOFLJamal Lewis dealt Coke. And played. THAT SEASON!OH NO, BRETT FAVRE HUNTS DEER!!!!!

 

[MelvinTScupper]

these were dogs. raised to fight.

so overblown

It's not like Vick was sneaking into people's homes, stealing 'Rusty' during the night, and fighting him.

So it is ok to torture animals because they were raised for it?And again, the dogfighting is getting all the press, but the big deal to the NFL is the gambling.

That's where I see the the bigger of problems. Gambling and unreported income.

Yeah, these pro players don't gamble on the planes, or anything.

 

[j3r3m3y]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

These are dogs. Mans best friend and our pets. You underestimate the power of that.I know 2 business's (one construction and one landscape) that right now are not using Home Depot and both called HD and let them know they wont be back as long as Michael Vick is still an Atlanta Falcon. In my estimation that cannot just be a localized occurance. I think you would see a hit taken from the advertisers on TV and radio. You would see a hit taken on merchandise. That wont stop the NFL from being a monstrosity, but it will cause a serious hit to their revenue.And noone else is comparable. Murderers and thugs can be "cool" and can actually increase the sales of jerseys and at least cause a break-even scenario.Not so with massive dog abusers. There will be hell to pay.

LOFLJamal Lewis dealt Coke. And played. THAT SEASON!OH NO, BRETT FAVRE HUNTS DEER!!!!!

There is a new Sheriff in town and he is not going to let the NFL's reputation get any worse. What happened previously is no longer relevant.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

These are dogs. Mans best friend and our pets. You underestimate the power of that.I know 2 business's (one construction and one landscape) that right now are not using Home Depot and both called HD and let them know they wont be back as long as Michael Vick is still an Atlanta Falcon. In my estimation that cannot just be a localized occurance. I think you would see a hit taken from the advertisers on TV and radio. You would see a hit taken on merchandise. That wont stop the NFL from being a monstrosity, but it will cause a serious hit to their revenue.And noone else is comparable. Murderers and thugs can be "cool" and can actually increase the sales of jerseys and at least cause a break-even scenario.Not so with massive dog abusers. There will be hell to pay.

LOFLJamal Lewis dealt Coke. And played. THAT SEASON!OH NO, BRETT FAVRE HUNTS DEER!!!!!

There is a new Sheriff in town and he is not going to let the NFL's reputation get any worse. What happened previously is no longer relevant.

Sorry brosef, Vick will play again.This, like every other overblown media hyped blip on the radar screen, will pass.

 

[BigSteelThrill]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

These are dogs. Mans best friend and our pets. You underestimate the power of that.I know 2 business's (one construction and one landscape) that right now are not using Home Depot and both called HD and let them know they wont be back as long as Michael Vick is still an Atlanta Falcon. In my estimation that cannot just be a localized occurance. I think you would see a hit taken from the advertisers on TV and radio. You would see a hit taken on merchandise. That wont stop the NFL from being a monstrosity, but it will cause a serious hit to their revenue.And noone else is comparable. Murderers and thugs can be "cool" and can actually increase the sales of jerseys and at least cause a break-even scenario.Not so with massive dog abusers. There will be hell to pay.

LOFLJamal Lewis dealt Coke. And played. THAT SEASON!OH NO, BRETT FAVRE HUNTS DEER!!!!!

But that is your perspective, so they have no worry of losing MTS's dollar. So thats not an issue. And it's also not the only perspective.

 

[j3r3m3y]

FWIW

NFL Denies Vick Suspension

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20246677/

 

[j3r3m3y]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

These are dogs. Mans best friend and our pets. You underestimate the power of that.I know 2 business's (one construction and one landscape) that right now are not using Home Depot and both called HD and let them know they wont be back as long as Michael Vick is still an Atlanta Falcon. In my estimation that cannot just be a localized occurance. I think you would see a hit taken from the advertisers on TV and radio. You would see a hit taken on merchandise. That wont stop the NFL from being a monstrosity, but it will cause a serious hit to their revenue.And noone else is comparable. Murderers and thugs can be "cool" and can actually increase the sales of jerseys and at least cause a break-even scenario.Not so with massive dog abusers. There will be hell to pay.

LOFLJamal Lewis dealt Coke. And played. THAT SEASON!OH NO, BRETT FAVRE HUNTS DEER!!!!!

There is a new Sheriff in town and he is not going to let the NFL's reputation get any worse. What happened previously is no longer relevant.

Sorry brosef, Vick will play again.This, like every other overblown media hyped blip on the radar screen, will pass.

As Vick sits at home and watches his team play pre-season games.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

These are dogs. Mans best friend and our pets. You underestimate the power of that.I know 2 business's (one construction and one landscape) that right now are not using Home Depot and both called HD and let them know they wont be back as long as Michael Vick is still an Atlanta Falcon. In my estimation that cannot just be a localized occurance. I think you would see a hit taken from the advertisers on TV and radio. You would see a hit taken on merchandise. That wont stop the NFL from being a monstrosity, but it will cause a serious hit to their revenue.And noone else is comparable. Murderers and thugs can be "cool" and can actually increase the sales of jerseys and at least cause a break-even scenario.Not so with massive dog abusers. There will be hell to pay.

LOFLJamal Lewis dealt Coke. And played. THAT SEASON!OH NO, BRETT FAVRE HUNTS DEER!!!!!

There is a new Sheriff in town and he is not going to let the NFL's reputation get any worse. What happened previously is no longer relevant.

Sorry brosef, Vick will play again.This, like every other overblown media hyped blip on the radar screen, will pass.

As Vick sits at home and watches his team play pre-season games.

he did the crime, he'll do the time. We disagree greatly on the latter.

 

[j3r3m3y]

he did the crime, he'll do the time. We disagree greatly on the latter.

He has already been told not to report to camp. He is currently not playing. Sure he is being paid at this point, but he is already "doing the time".

 

[TitusIII]

Lifetime ban to follow. Or the NFL will regret it.

Ban for life = RIDICULOUSThen you should ban 25% of the players in the NFL they are all criminal ( Wife beaters , murderers ( Ray Lewis ) etc etc etc ) why would he pay for everybody , totally ridiculous comment .

Each and every person is judged by their own merits and demerits.And I didnt say what was right or wrong... I said the NFL will regret it. They will lose a ton of revenue.

No way . Let say he is found not guilty in November and plans to come back next season nothing will change they wont lose anything ( Fk Ray Lewis killed someone , did the NFL lose anything )

These are dogs. Mans best friend and our pets. You underestimate the power of that.I know 2 business's (one construction and one landscape) that right now are not using Home Depot and both called HD and let them know they wont be back as long as Michael Vick is still an Atlanta Falcon. In my estimation that cannot just be a localized occurance. I think you would see a hit taken from the advertisers on TV and radio. You would see a hit taken on merchandise. That wont stop the NFL from being a monstrosity, but it will cause a serious hit to their revenue.And noone else is comparable. Murderers and thugs can be "cool" and can actually increase the sales of jerseys and at least cause a break-even scenario.Not so with massive dog abusers. There will be hell to pay.

LOFLJamal Lewis dealt Coke. And played. THAT SEASON!OH NO, BRETT FAVRE HUNTS DEER!!!!!

There is a new Sheriff in town and he is not going to let the NFL's reputation get any worse. What happened previously is no longer relevant.

Sorry brosef, Vick will play again.

I agree, the guy is a money maker, and will always be one.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

he did the crime, he'll do the time. We disagree greatly on the latter.

He has already been told not to report to camp. He is currently not playing. Sure he is being paid at this point, but he is already "doing the time".

REALLY!?!?!?!NO ####.

 

[j3r3m3y]

he did the crime, he'll do the time. We disagree greatly on the latter.

He has already been told not to report to camp. He is currently not playing. Sure he is being paid at this point, but he is already "doing the time".

REALLY!?!?!?!NO ####.

If we don't disagree on him "doing the time" I can only assume you don't know the difference between "former" and "latter".

 

[The Man Who Met Andy Griffith]

Dogfighting is a culturally accepted sport in many less developed countries, as is cockfighting, bullfighting, etc. These practices persist in certain communities (maybe not bullfighting) here in the U.S. as they are engrained in the society of certain groups.

So is FGM.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

he did the crime, he'll do the time. We disagree greatly on the latter.

He has already been told not to report to camp. He is currently not playing. Sure he is being paid at this point, but he is already "doing the time".

REALLY!?!?!?!NO ####.

If we don't disagree on him "doing the time" I can only assume you don't know the difference between "former" and "latter".

We disagree on the AMOUNT of the latter.FYI - he hasn't missed a game yet.

 

[j3r3m3y]

he did the crime, he'll do the time. We disagree greatly on the latter.

He has already been told not to report to camp. He is currently not playing. Sure he is being paid at this point, but he is already "doing the time".

REALLY!?!?!?!NO ####.

If we don't disagree on him "doing the time" I can only assume you don't know the difference between "former" and "latter".

We disagree on the AMOUNT of the latter.FYI - he hasn't missed a game yet.

So you think it is likely that the commissioner told him not to report to camp with the intention of giving him a green light to play in the regular season? In addition you think he will have the ability to miss camp, miss the pre-season and just come in and play effectively?I don't see this commissioner giving a token meaningless message by telling Vick to sit pre-season but allowing him to play when it counts.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

he did the crime, he'll do the time. We disagree greatly on the latter.

He has already been told not to report to camp. He is currently not playing. Sure he is being paid at this point, but he is already "doing the time".

REALLY!?!?!?!NO ####.

If we don't disagree on him "doing the time" I can only assume you don't know the difference between "former" and "latter".

We disagree on the AMOUNT of the latter.FYI - he hasn't missed a game yet.

So you think it is likely that the commissioner told him not to report to camp with the intention of giving him a green light to play in the regular season? In addition you think he will have the ability to miss camp, miss the pre-season and just come in and play effectively?I don't see this commissioner giving a token meaningless message by telling Vick to sit pre-season but allowing him to play when it counts.

1. I expect him to miss at least as many games as Tank Johnson, ultimately. Frankly, I'd expect the Falcons to let him go.2. I think of the people who'd miss time, Vick would rank as a guy who would lose little playing ability.3. He WILL be back, someplace, and MOST definitely start again, someplace.4. This would be most impactful in keeper/dynasty/contract leagues. You can get him for NOTHING right now. Criminals,drug addicts, wife beaters...they ALL get a second chance. Many get a 3rd, 4th chance. He has supreme physical ability. He will be back.

 

[Sweat Hog]

Can I sue MTS for the 10 minutes of my life I wasted reading his posts?

I want my life back!!!!!

Supreme Court, here I come!!!

 

[j3r3m3y]

4. This would be most impactful in keeper/dynasty/contract leagues. You can get him for NOTHING right now. Criminals,drug addicts, wife beaters...they ALL get a second chance. Many get a 3rd, 4th chance. He has supreme physical ability. He will be back.

Gamblers don't have a good track record of getting additional chances in professional sports.

 

[MelvinTScupper]

4. This would be most impactful in keeper/dynasty/contract leagues. You can get him for NOTHING right now. Criminals,drug addicts, wife beaters...they ALL get a second chance. Many get a 3rd, 4th chance. He has supreme physical ability. He will be back.

Gamblers don't have a good track record of getting additional chances in professional sports.

Yeah, the ones that bet on their own games.Wager? You can have NEVER, I'll take the field. You pick the amount.

 

[Kleck.]

these were dogs. raised to fight.

so overblown

It's not like Vick was sneaking into people's homes, stealing 'Rusty' during the night, and fighting him.

So it is ok to torture animals because they were raised for it?And again, the dogfighting is getting all the press, but the big deal to the NFL feds is the gambling.

That's where I see the the bigger of problems. Gambling and unreported income.

Yeah, these pro players don't gamble on the planes, or anything.

Meant with the feds, not the NFL.

 

[Kleck.]

4. This would be most impactful in keeper/dynasty/contract leagues. You can get him for NOTHING right now. Criminals,drug addicts, wife beaters...they ALL get a second chance. Many get a 3rd, 4th chance. He has supreme physical ability. He will be back.

Gamblers don't have a good track record of getting additional chances in professional sports.

Jordan won three rings after getting caught.