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Vikings negotiating with Frazier... (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter FunkyPlutos
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GridironMenace
Footballguy
How has he earned the shot? Because he is a long time DC? Please. Frazier is a bad idea for the Vikings to hire him. The only reason why he would get the job is because he will be cheap. His defense leaves a lot to be desired and if he didn't just happen to have the 2 most dominant DT's in the league for several years, they would be much worse than they currently are. He is too vanilla and has no innovation. The Vikings need to clean house and hire everyone from outside the organization. There isn't one person I would retain on that coaching staff if I were Zigi. Especially with the mountains of terrific coaching candidates: Fox, Cowher, Gruden etc...
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Bad move by the Vikes
GridironMenace
Footballguy
How exactly does he remind you of him? Because he's black? They aren't anything alike. Tomlin blitzed, disguised packages, moved people around, made changes within the game, etc... Frazier doesn't and hasn't done any of that for years. Watching the Vikings defense pre-snap is like watching a bunch of statues. But I will say that your post is another reason why Zigi probably wants to retain him. He doesn't want to watch Frazier have success elsewhere. However, the bottom line is that they are 2 different people and chasing the past is a bad idea for success in the present.
It's kind of silly to say that because Frazier's defenses have been vanilla (not sure I agree with that), he's unlikely to be a good HC. He's organized, a good communicator, a good motivator, and the players like him and want to play for him. I think it's a great fit, especially given all the uncertainty about 2011-2012, and where the Vikings may end up. They'd have to overpay for any of the Big Names out there.
FunkyPlutos
Footballguy
I think he is a better candidate as a head coach than a DC. He is a leader and a good game planner who can communicate with players and knows how to motivate them.
BigJim®
Footballguy
He might be referring to Dungy.
PlasmaDogPlasma
Footballguy
He also might have been referring to demeanor more than tactics. Maybe he'll tell us.
DoubleG
Footballguy
Anyone that has manuevered through the Favre minefield and the post-Moss, post-Chilly mess and still managed to put together a nice little run (including a HUGE win over a Philly team in Philly that was fighting for a playoff seeding), would be near the top of any list of possible HC candidates going into 2011. IMHO, the Vikes would be smart to make sure they lock him up before he starts sniffing around other teams.Well the Vikings run a cover 2 do they not? It is a basic and non-innovative philosophy. I think he'd be good for them. He can manage a locker room.
To be honest idk why nobody is throwing Sidney Rice under the bus for ruining Childress and Favre. If he would have got his surgery done when it was supposed to, the Viking are playoff bound. Can't take favre's go to guy and win.
To be honest idk why nobody is throwing Sidney Rice under the bus for ruining Childress and Favre. If he would have got his surgery done when it was supposed to, the Viking are playoff bound. Can't take favre's go to guy and win.
Summer Wheat
Footballguy
As a Lion fan I am very happy they are keeping Frazier as HC. 
As a Vikings fan, I think it's a pretty good move, for the reasons I stated above. Why do you hate it, Rusty?
ScottyFargo
Footballguy
As a Lion fan I am very happy they are keeping Frazier as HC.
Gopher State
Footballguy
As a Packer fan please please sign Frazier, with him as HC Rogers will have two BIG games every year
snellman
Footballguy
I was referring to Dungy. He seems like a very low key coach who can relate to the players because he was a former player.
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I almost spit up my Irish coffee when you posted Dungy. Seriously? He is nothing like Dungy and not to mention Dungy created legendary defenses for Minnesota when he was the DC there. He(Dungy) forced his way into someone's organization to gve him a shot. Frazier has been interviewing for years now and even has been on record as not wanting to continue interviews for teams he will never get a shot to coach. He felt the Rooney Rule was almost abusing him. This is a poor process and hire for the Vikings organization. They will be paying 3 head coaches salaries pretty soon if they hire Frazier. The players like him? The players liked Wade Phillips too...not everyone that is soft spoken is a Tonu Dungy in the making. I apologize if I am laying it on strong, you are just voicing a fan's opinion but honestly I think to most outsiders who don't root for the Vikes and can be objective about this...nothing is similar between Frazier and a young Tony Dungy circa 1995.
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I hate it for several reasons. In the last several years our defense has not been as good as the talent on it. This year it was just painful to watch.He is a Childress guy and that did not work. I think a clean break from the old regime is best.The main reason I dislike this move is that there are some very very good proven coaches out there. Why not try Bill Cowher? Jon Gruden? And most likely to have taken the job is Brian Billick. I think Billick could take the Vikes all the way.That said if we hire him I will wish him only sucess. The sour taste in my mouth just will not be gone. It will be easier to get Greenway back now if we want to. I think he will be a solid coach and may be a good one but there are several proven guys out there that I wish the Vikings would go after. Last time around Ziggi inerviewed one guy and hired him. I just want to win and I do not think LF is the answer.
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I get the Cowher/Gruden/proven coach concept, but think those guys will command a lot more money that Zygi will be interested in paying, given the uncertainties about the next collective bargaining agreement, and where the Vikings might end up, pending resolution of the stadium question here. Billick is an interesting (but not very exciting, to me anyway) thought.And MOP, I see your point about Dungy, but the Dungy factor isn't really part of my thought process on this. I agree with you about Wade Phillips, but the difference between the Dallas/Phillips situation and the one here in Minnesota is that the players both like and respect Frazier. I don't think that was the case in Dallas.
And to your point that Frazier had been interviewed several times around the league, but never hired, the reports we're hearing in Minnesota is that the Denver owner wished he'd chosen Frazier over McDaniel previously and is very interested Frazier now that he's jetisoned Josh. All anecdotal reporting, but that's in the mix.
A bigger question in Minnesota than who is going to be the head coach is who is going to run football operations for the Vikings. When Chilly was here, decisions were made by a trio comprised of Rick Spielman, Rob Brzezinski and Chilly... and I think that clearly has to change. The Vikings need a much clearer organizational structure go forward.
Sweet Love
IBL Representative
With the money they pay these guys to be in the booth, I think we are going to see the "obvious candidates", become the misses going forward. I am not sure exactly what they make, but given Sanders had a bow out a few years back because he want something like 2 million and only got 1 million+, I find it hard to see some of these guys turning down what is really a 9-5er, for the rigors of coaching in the NFL. I could definitely be wrong, but i would be surprised if both Cowher and Gruden accept HC jobs in 2011. I also think between Fisher and Fox, one will take the year off, and now you have two of the four big names, off the market. There are also teams with strong cores (Cowboys, Titans) that may/will be looking for a HC in 2011 and all of the sudden, the Vikes are in a 50/50 shot of having a HOF-type coach or an "also-ran"...with not much in the middle...The know Frazier, have played decently with him and he knows the personnel...with or without Favre, this team's window is shutting, and they don't have a couple of years for someone to get to know the nuances of the squad.GridironMenace said:
THE SNOWMAN
Footballguy
I agree, and I never agree with anything you have to say.Ministry of Pain said:
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
They won't owe Frazier nearly what they will if the have to part ways with him in a year or two. Chilly ws locked in for a few yers IIRC. If they hire someone else they will be paying Chilly's and the new guy, so 2. I just think Frazier will be a disaster as a HC.
Maelstrom
Footballguy
I like Frazier as a hire, and also want to point out two things. We don't know what kind of control Chilly had over the DF game plan, but a lot of the vanilla on both OF and DF I attribute to him, not the coordinators. Also, Frazier will hopefully bring in his own coordinators. There is no saying he will keep Childress' staff next year, and I hope he doesn't.
Geez, I can understand the take that the Vikings should go through the interview process, do additional due diligence on potential candidates, etc -- I think that would have been my preference, too. But to say that you think he'll be a disaster as a head coach -- what do you see in his background that would suggest that, MOP?
Heatman
Footballguy
As a Vikings fan the jury is still out imo. His defense has not been that great but he does seem to motivate the players. I would have liked them to do some more interviews before hiring him but at least I don't watch them play and scream "WTF are you doing!" at the TV since he's been head coach.
Donnybrook
Footballguy
Congrats on the win today. BTW: Vikings will drafting just in front of Detriot.Summer Wheat said:
fatness
Footballguy
So in other words it costs them the same as another coach. If Frazier or another coach doesn't work out in a year or 2, they pay a 3rd salary.
wish it were more far-fetched than it is.Then again Holmgren is expected to hire a former QB to coach the Browns and everyone assumes it'll be MornhinwegThat would be the most awesome trainwreck ever. Please let it happen.
Summer Wheat
Footballguy
Mornhinweg is one of those guys who are great assistants but not so good as the HC.wish it were more far-fetched than it is.Then again Holmgren is expected to hire a former QB to coach the Browns and everyone assumes it'll be Mornhinweg
snellman
Footballguy
jackdubl
Footballguy
Good move.
THE SNOWMAN
Footballguy
Yes, for the rest of the NFC.
Maelstrom
Footballguy
Things I found interesting in the article listed above.I get that some people think you need to be jumping up and down and screaming is a sign of passion but I don't think you need to express it in that manner to really have a passion for the game and for winning. Different people express themselves differently, and it works for them.
I'm pretty happy with the hire, and am interested in who he puts around him as far as assistant coaches.
snellman
Footballguy
Maelstrom said:
I was looking for those numbers earlier in this argument and was just coming here to post them. Everyone says the Vikings had such a bad defense, and I don't understand where that argument is coming from. A lot of the late defensive breakdowns this year came because of pure exhaustion and the offense not being able to put up any points and putting the defense in a bad spot. He has done a very good job with the defense and I think it will carry over to the team in general.
FunkyPlutos
Footballguy
They are interviewing Josh McDaniels for the Offensive Coordinator job and Singletary for the Linebackers' Coach job. Frazier seems to want to surround himself with talented coaches (even if they weren't good head coaches).
I think McDaniels would be an excellent hire as an OC. Maybe they can bring in Orton while they are at it.
I think both of these would be VERY good moves if they can pull it off.
TeamDingo
Footballguy
Would this mean KOrton is the Vikings QB next year?
snellman
Footballguy
I think that would depend on what Denver wants for him. I would be happy if it happened. Orton is not the type of QB that is going to win a game, but he will also not lose a game. With a better running game and defense than he had in Denver, I think he could be serviceable. Not sure if I like the McDaniels story, but I LOVE the Singletary possibility.
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