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When do we go in and wipe out ISIS? (2 Viewers)

The outflow of support from across the world in response to the France attacks reminded me of something I read in an article about the IS long term strategy earlier this year:

"In their propaganda, they see themselves waging a war against a crusader alliance, between the US and the UK and other countries of the West that is seeking to eradicate Islam," Mr McCants said.

"They see this battle as culminating soon in the great clash between the Muslim army of the Islamic world and the Christian armies of the West.

"And this confrontation is going to take place along the eastern Mediterranean - so Jerusalem, Damascus and Aleppo - but they will also take the fight to Rome."

And ISIS supporters believe the final battle could be coming sooner rather than later.

According to their theory, "nations gathering under 80 flags will confront the Muslim armies".

For many jihadists, the alliance of Western and other powers against ISIS in bombing raids over Iraq and Syria is seen as the fulfilment of that prophecy.

Mr McCants said ISIS fanatics are constantly counting the number of nations that have pledged to fight against ISIS.

And to date, more than 60 nations have committed to fight against the terror network.

It means that were a handful more countries to join the growing anti-ISIS alliance, jihadists could act on their terrifying prediction.
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Uruk-Hai said:
UniAlias said:
Otis said:
UniAlias said:
Some really solid, well thought out rationale in here.

"IT WORKED IN WW2!! NUKE EVERYTHING!!1!1"
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Well, the current plan is going off without a hitch. :thumbup:
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Stop letting your emotions control your thought process. Aren't you a lawyer? Shouldn't that be one of your strengths? Thinking logically and rationally? I'm fairly certain you're just fishing, but if you seriously think killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people is a good idea (or that doing so will solve anything) you really need to reevaluate some things.
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You're pretty smart for one of cosjob's dishwashers
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I offer an excellent apprenticeship program and other education benefits.

 
It is an Islamic problem. ISIS goes away when the Muslim community polices itself from within. Until then, expect alot attack/counterattack violence for A long time.

 
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GROOT said:
It is an Islamic problem. ISIS goes away when the Muslim community polices itself from within. Until then, expect alot attack/counterattack violence for A long time.
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You say this as though there is a single Muslim community.

eta - Islam is also part of OUR community.

 
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Hopefully this wakes our own nation and that of the world into a real strategy and action. This is not a "JV" terrorist organization which is only the problem of Syria and Iraq. That has been evident for a very long time now for anyone that has a brain and is paying attention.

They are intent on death and destruction. We have seen them kill NGO workers and journalists with beheadings. We have seen them kill a downed fighter pilot in horrific fashion. We have seen them kill line up Christian men and behead them for no reason other than being Christian. We have heard of them raping and selling women for sex slavery. We have seen them throw men accused of being gay off of buildings for no reason other than being gay. We know they have committed mass murder of captured forces opposing them and men of military age. We have seen them bomb airplanes, Lebanon, and now Paris with increasing sophistication.

Our bomb and hope strategy has long been a failure. We have no real strategy. It is time to wake up.

 
GROOT said:
It is an Islamic problem. ISIS goes away when the Muslim community polices itself from within. Until then, expect alot attack/counterattack violence for A long time.
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ISIS is killing more Muslim than non Muslims. Also, there are Muslim armies engaged in huge battles with ISIS daily. Just last night, the ISIS controlled city of Sinjar fell to an army of 7,500 Kurds.

 
Ilov80s said:
GROOT said:
It is an Islamic problem. ISIS goes away when the Muslim community polices itself from within. Until then, expect alot attack/counterattack violence for A long time.
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ISIS is killing more Muslim than non Muslims. Also, there are Muslim armies engaged in huge battles with ISIS daily. Just last night, the ISIS controlled city of Sinjar fell to an army of 7,500 Kurds.
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That is correct. At the same time the recruitment of the jihadist is exclusively run by certain sects of Islam, the most prominent of which is championed by our fabulous friend in the Middle East, Saudi Arabia.

 
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
So who is funding the ISIS operations? Someone has to be, is it not as easily identified as AQ and OBL?
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It is pretty varied. Oil is a big revenue source for them as they hold some land very rich in oil reserves. They get about a million a day on smuggling oil over into Turkey. They have a lot of criminal enterprises and they collect taxes in the territory that they control. And yes, there are donations from wealthy sympathizers from around the Sunni Muslim world.

 
Chadstroma said:
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
So who is funding the ISIS operations? Someone has to be, is it not as easily identified as AQ and OBL?
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It is pretty varied. Oil is a big revenue source for them as they hold some land very rich in oil reserves. They get about a million a day on smuggling oil over into Turkey. They have a lot of criminal enterprises and they collect taxes in the territory that they control. And yes, there are donations from wealthy sympathizers from around the Sunni Muslim world.
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whelp, its time to take em out, if that's the royal family in Saudi, then so be it

 
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Chadstroma said:
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
So who is funding the ISIS operations? Someone has to be, is it not as easily identified as AQ and OBL?
Click to expand...
It is pretty varied. Oil is a big revenue source for them as they hold some land very rich in oil reserves. They get about a million a day on smuggling oil over into Turkey. They have a lot of criminal enterprises and they collect taxes in the territory that they control. And yes, there are donations from wealthy sympathizers from around the Sunni Muslim world.
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whelp, its time to take em out, if that's the royal family in Saudi, then so be it
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Easier said than done. It is not so much that the donators are protected (though some may very well be) but it is not an easy task to detect and obstruct these donations. Even more so than usual in a cash heavy culture like that.

 
Thursday night there were 37 killed and over a hundred wounded in 2 suicide bombings in suburban Beirut. Two days in a row, two major cities. So sad, but I hope people just end the narrative of Muslims/Arabs needing to police themselves.

 
well it seems to me they are intent on picking a fight with every civilized country on the planet ...cant all these countries band together and send in enough troops and fire power on the ground and just crush them to death with numbers ?

 
BustedKnuckles said:
well it seems to me they are intent on picking a fight with every civilized country on the planet ...cant all these countries band together and send in enough troops and fire power on the ground and just crush them to death with numbers ?
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Where are you sending all these troops exactly?

 
BustedKnuckles said:
well it seems to me they are intent on picking a fight with every civilized country on the planet ...cant all these countries band together and send in enough troops and fire power on the ground and just crush them to death with numbers ?
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Not many countries have the capability of projecting force overseas by themselves. We would be the conduit to move their forces and keep them supplied.

Assume that is no problem.

Next- where are these forces going? Not Syria unless you are Russia or Iran. Jordan, Turkey and Iraq are the options. Where do they operate? Syria, Iraq or both? Who do we work with and who do we attack? (there are a lot more groups than ISIS milling around in Syria). What cooperation if any do we have with Russia now that they are in Syria? What about Assad? What happens post-Daesh? How long do forces stay and the willingness to do so versus pulling out prematurely due to political pressure that sets the stage for a later crisis?

It is not an easy thing to hammer out and certainly not as easy as to send troops. We desperately need a strategy and a plan. The half-assed thing we have done for the last few years is obviously not working. We do need to work with other countries and come up with an effective plan to deal with the threat. I have not seen anything from our current President that tells me that he has the capability to do this. We HAVE to take the lead- we haven't and it is has just messed up things more with widening the conflict and inviting Russia and Iran into the power void. It is not easy but we have to answer the hard questions and put a plan into place.

 
Chadstroma said:
We do need to work with other countries and come up with an effective plan to deal with the threat. I have not seen anything from our current President that tells me that he has the capability to do this
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Who of the next lot of Presidential candidates do (from either side)? That's a rhetorical question btw.

IMHO we are a bit short of that sort of talent these days

 
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bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Chadstroma said:
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
So who is funding the ISIS operations? Someone has to be, is it not as easily identified as AQ and OBL?
Click to expand...
It is pretty varied. Oil is a big revenue source for them as they hold some land very rich in oil reserves. They get about a million a day on smuggling oil over into Turkey. They have a lot of criminal enterprises and they collect taxes in the territory that they control. And yes, there are donations from wealthy sympathizers from around the Sunni Muslim world.
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whelp, its time to take em out, if that's the royal family in Saudi, then so be it
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It will work even worse than getting rid of the shah and Hussein.

 
matuski said:
BustedKnuckles said:
well it seems to me they are intent on picking a fight with every civilized country on the planet ...cant all these countries band together and send in enough troops and fire power on the ground and just crush them to death with numbers ?
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Where are you sending all these troops exactly?
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To ISIS controlled cities and provinces? There are currently armies fighting ground battles with ISIS for territory.
 
Ilov80s said:
matuski said:
BustedKnuckles said:
well it seems to me they are intent on picking a fight with every civilized country on the planet ...cant all these countries band together and send in enough troops and fire power on the ground and just crush them to death with numbers ?
Click to expand...
Where are you sending all these troops exactly?
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To ISIS controlled cities and provinces? There are currently armies fighting ground battles with ISIS for territory.
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How does that remove the threat of terrorism?

 
msommer said:
Ilov80s said:
matuski said:
BustedKnuckles said:
well it seems to me they are intent on picking a fight with every civilized country on the planet ...cant all these countries band together and send in enough troops and fire power on the ground and just crush them to death with numbers ?
Click to expand...
Where are you sending all these troops exactly?
Click to expand...
To ISIS controlled cities and provinces? There are currently armies fighting ground battles with ISIS for territory.
Click to expand...
How does that remove the threat of terrorism?
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I am not advocating it, I don't have a plan. I am just answering the question of where you would send troops.

 
Ilov80s said:
msommer said:
Ilov80s said:
matuski said:
BustedKnuckles said:
well it seems to me they are intent on picking a fight with every civilized country on the planet ...cant all these countries band together and send in enough troops and fire power on the ground and just crush them to death with numbers ?
Click to expand...
Where are you sending all these troops exactly?
Click to expand...
To ISIS controlled cities and provinces? There are currently armies fighting ground battles with ISIS for territory.
Click to expand...
How does that remove the threat of terrorism?
Click to expand...
I am not advocating it, I don't have a plan. I am just answering the question of where you would send troops.
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Pointless to send troops if that will not achieve the goal

 
Best bet might be to declare all out open war with ISIS. Offer free plane tickets and an AK-47 to anyone from anywhere in the world that wants to join with ISIS. Then, fully engage them.

and yes I am mostly being sarcastic.

 
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msommer said:
Ilov80s said:
msommer said:
Ilov80s said:
matuski said:
BustedKnuckles said:
well it seems to me they are intent on picking a fight with every civilized country on the planet ...cant all these countries band together and send in enough troops and fire power on the ground and just crush them to death with numbers ?
Click to expand...
Where are you sending all these troops exactly?
Click to expand...
To ISIS controlled cities and provinces? There are currently armies fighting ground battles with ISIS for territory.
Click to expand...
How does that remove the threat of terrorism?
Click to expand...
I am not advocating it, I don't have a plan. I am just answering the question of where you would send troops.
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Pointless to send troops if that will not achieve the goal
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If ISIS has 200,000 troops in Syria and is expanding it's political influence, power, etc. It does make sense if you can meet them on the ground and remove them from power. I don't thin ground warfare can end the ideologies that lead to terrorism, but it can damage the infrastructure that is supporting terrorism.

 
Couple ways we can do this. We can drop some more pamphlets and maybe set up some clinics, as these guys continue to blow themselves up in our urban areas. They eventually will be all blowed up, but probably not until they kill off 200 innocents for every 8 or so of the loons.

Another options I we just go in and nuke them into the stratosphere. I guess the question is would we be able to kill less than 200 or so innocents there for every 8 bad guys. Although it's actually a little more complicated than that, right? Because I'd gladly see a bunch of strangers go before my wife and children. So there's some +EV in us getting to choose the innocents that have to go.

Or maybe if we upgrade to the glossy paper for the pamphlets.

 
We should stop calling them IS or ISIS. They want to be called IS or ISIS because it implies they are some kind of legitimate Islamic State and represent Islam. The Islamic world calls them Daesh. Daesh is an acronym of Arabic words that has a few meanings: "someone that causes trouble", bigot and has very negative historical connotations in the Muslim world. The word has been banned in areas that Daesh controls.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2014/10/09/words-matter-isis-war-use-daesh/V85GYEuasEEJgrUun0dMUP/story.html?s_campaign=bostonglobe%3Asocialflow%3Atwitter

 
Ilov80s said:
We should stop calling them IS or ISIS. They want to be called IS or ISIS because it implies they are some kind of legitimate Islamic State and represent Islam. The Islamic world calls them Daesh. Daesh is an acronym of Arabic words that has a few meanings: "someone that causes trouble", bigot and has very negative historical connotations in the Muslim world. The word has been banned in areas that Daesh controls.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2014/10/09/words-matter-isis-war-use-daesh/V85GYEuasEEJgrUun0dMUP/story.html?s_campaign=bostonglobe%3Asocialflow%3Atwitter
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that will show em

smack their images with shoes too.

 
bicycle_seat_sniffer said:
Ilov80s said:
We should stop calling them IS or ISIS. They want to be called IS or ISIS because it implies they are some kind of legitimate Islamic State and represent Islam. The Islamic world calls them Daesh. Daesh is an acronym of Arabic words that has a few meanings: "someone that causes trouble", bigot and has very negative historical connotations in the Muslim world. The word has been banned in areas that Daesh controls.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/2014/10/09/words-matter-isis-war-use-daesh/V85GYEuasEEJgrUun0dMUP/story.html?s_campaign=bostonglobe%3Asocialflow%3Atwitter
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that will show em

smack their images with shoes too.
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There is power in words, especially in a war of recruitment.

 
tipsy mcstagger said:
This won't stop. Ever. No matter what we do.
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Likely not. This is really a form of a continuation of the warfare that has been raging since the Byzantine-Arab Wars which started during the initial Muslim conquests. Then later of course the Crusades, colonial rule and modern day terrorism. The specifics have changed over the centuries but it has been there and will continue.

 
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