When does Manning's legacy as a "loser" finally (1 Viewer)

[H.K.]

Up to this point, Manning won the biggest do-or-die game of the year. Can we at least give him a little bit of a break and props for this? Or, is it just anti-Manning sentiment that dictates that he can't get credit for anything good but gets all the blame for everything bad?

I agree with that. When I typed the following phrase, did it sound Anti-Manning?Manning did not choke, he rose above. He had a chance to go in the tank after his pick but he responded like a Champion.

 

[Liquid Tension]

He won A big one, he did not win THE big one. In reality, the win this week could harm his legacy more than help it, because now he has a chance to lose a Super Bowl. The Bears are an inferior opponent, and Indy should win without much difficulty.Many people think Manning has turned it around in the post season this year. I agree with them. In the regular season, he had a 3 to 1 TD/Int ratio. In the playoffs, its 1 to 3.The Colts have an incredible team, but they still need to get another win. All Manning has to do is not screw it up. We'll see, but he's been extremely shaky so far. He could cement his legacy by laying an egg on the games biggest stage in two weeks or he could wipe the slate clean by not blowing it. We'll see...

HK, you can say that you are not a Manning hater, but your incredibly slanted view of Manning has made you lose any credibility.Last week it was EVERYTHING IS SET UP PERFECTLY NOW FOR MANNING, as you were trying to set him up. Well, he played GREAT yesterday. Even with the pick the other way, he was fantastic and did so against TIGHT coverage and a lot of pressure.Say whatever you want, but it is obvious you don't want to have a meaningful discussion, you just want to bash Manning. I don't even like the Colts, but some people on this board have an agenda and it does not Make for meaningful discussions.

 

[H.K.]

HK, you can say that you are not a Manning hater, but your incredibly slanted view of Manning has made you lose any credibility.Last week it was EVERYTHING IS SET UP PERFECTLY NOW FOR MANNING, as you were trying to set him up. Well, he played GREAT yesterday. Even with the pick the other way, he was fantastic and did so against TIGHT coverage and a lot of pressure.Say whatever you want, but it is obvious you don't want to have a meaningful discussion, you just want to bash Manning.

I already typed this in this thread, go look it up for yourself:

I like Peyton. I want to see him do well and win it.

Everything was set up perfectly for Manning. Play at home against the Patriots for the chance to play a weaker opponent to win it all in the Super Bowl. As I also previously stated, the Colts defense is playing very well. If it weren't, they wouldn't be where they are.He had a chance to beat his nemesis and he did it. Now all he has to do is beat an inferior NFC opponent. If he is a good as everyone says he is, it should not be a problem. People get so riled up when Manning's playoff failures are brought up. I hope to God he wins a Super Bowl and finally does on the filed what his supporters say could do if he had a great team around him.

 

[cobalt_27]

Up to this point, Manning won the biggest do-or-die game of the year. Can we at least give him a little bit of a break and props for this? Or, is it just anti-Manning sentiment that dictates that he can't get credit for anything good but gets all the blame for everything bad?

I agree with that. When I typed the following phrase, did it sound Anti-Manning?Manning did not choke, he rose above. He had a chance to go in the tank after his pick but he responded like a Champion.

No, that sounded appropriate to me, at least. You followed it up with a "however" statement, but that's fine. There are folks who will never really give Manning credit until he wins the Super Bowl. It just reflects how disproportionate that outcome is associated with QB greatness for a lot of folks.You're right about Manning's legacy, and he'll need to win the SB before most people really give him the due I, personally, think he deserves it anyway--win or lose in the SB. I don't downgrade Marino at all for failure to win in the SB, and I wouldn't with Manning either. I felt the same way about Elway before winning his first, and then second, SB; but, I was happy for him that he could shed all the naysayers by winning it all.

That being said, I still maintain that, if you were to give me the choice of either of these two to start a team, I would pick Manning and Marino in my top-5, right along side two quarterbacks who have won THREE Super Bowls (Montana, Brady) as well as Elway. But, because I don't see a direct, linear relationship between QB greatness and SB outcomes, I can look at the overwhelming data in other areas that Manning and Marino have clearly established and judge them accordingly.

For his legacy, and just for the sake of having everyone calibrate their opinions of him to where (I think) they should be, I hope Manning wins "the big one." But, if he doesn't, I'll still be a supporter of his legacy as one of the greatest QBs to ever play the game.

 

[H.K.]

You're right about Manning's legacy, and he'll need to win the SB before most people really give him the due I, personally, think he deserves it anyway--win or lose in the SB. I don't downgrade Marino at all for failure to win in the SB, and I wouldn't with Manning either. I felt the same way about Elway before winning his first, and then second, SB; but, I was happy for him that he could shed all the naysayers by winning it all.

When/if Manning wins a Super Bowl (regardless of how he does it), it puts him in a different category. There is no legitmate argument against him as one of the all-time greats if he can lead his team to a title.Style points and stats are nice, but its a net/net result which is what matters.

That being said, I still maintain that, if you were to give me the choice of either of these two to start a team, I would pick Manning and Marino in my top-5, right along side two quarterbacks who have won THREE Super Bowls (Montana, Brady) as well as Elway. But, because I don't see a direct, linear relationship between QB greatness and SB outcomes, I can look at the overwhelming data in other areas that Manning and Marino have clearly established and judge them accordingly.

This is a whole different debate, and I know this will open up the flood gates, but I would not include Marino in my top five. Quick release and strong arm? Absolutely. Yet he was in some ways a sitting duck in the pocket. He lacked the mobility and elusiveness that Montana, Elway, Favre, Young and even Brady possess to get out of trouble. Marino had a great reputation for not getting sacked, but I do believe he lacked an aspect required by the position to threaten the defense with his legs. If a defense knows the QB can't hurt them in any other way than with his arm, that QB is one that is easier to defend than one who can beat you multiple ways. IMO, this is partially why Marino never won it all. I have seen Manning run on occasion, he doesn't do it a ton, but he can make plays when he must. I'd put Manning ahead of Marino for this reason.

For his legacy, and just for the sake of having everyone calibrate their opinions of him to where (I think) they should be, I hope Manning wins "the big one."

Amen.

 

[Vibe Raiders]

I just really get bored with this stuff...Manning has proven he isn't a loser years ago. One person doesn't make a team....Brady has had an advantage Manning has not....and his name is Belichick....put Brady in a Colts Uniform and Manning in a Patriots uniform and I think New England still has three superbowl wins...but at least it gives us something to talk about.

 

[H.K.]

I just really get bored with this stuff...Manning has proven he isn't a loser years ago. One person doesn't make a team....Brady has had an advantage Manning has not....and his name is Belichick....put Brady in a Colts Uniform and Manning in a Patriots uniform and I think New England still has three superbowl wins...but at least it gives us something to talk about.

I don'tknow about that and we never will. But what I do know is that if you put Manning in a Colt uniform and Brady in a Patriot uniform, then Manning can win an AFC championship.

 

[Billy Ball Thorton]

Manning is notorious for choking in playoff games and could not win with a very talented team in college with Tennessee...a team Tee freaking Martin took to win a title the very next year. None of the Mannings have the "winner" gene, and the shine has come off Eli already with the main stream media. Peyton however, is some sort of changeling freak who can seemingly morph into a winner and trick the masses when only a small sub sect of us can see him for the charletan he is.So here we are in the 2007 playoffs with Manning throwing pick after pick after pick only to be bailed out by his defense, a defense he has thrown under the bus in the past. It is only a matter of time until that defense cannot bail Manning out and this week against the Patriots is it.So when Manning gets bounced from the playoffs yet again and the Colts' window for a Super Bowl is all but shut, will the main stream media finally shed some light on the fact that Manning just does not have "it" in big games?

Bagger-Excuse me waiter I think I'lol have the CROW sandwich. How's it taste?