Welcome to Our Forums. Once you've registered and logged in, you're primed to talk football, among other topics, with the sharpest and most experienced fantasy players on the internet.
I don’t see a problem comparing Emmitt’s numbers to Barry’s. It’s the sentiment that Emmitt’s YPC was a negative in a vacuum that I question. It should only be compared to other players who rushed before nickel was the base defense . And even then, the Cowboys offense was unbalanced for the time. That gave Emmitt plenty of opportunities to rack up volume stats, but certainly didn’t help his efficiency metrics.
He wasn’t comparing the talent. Look at he numbers—the Lions had a more potent passing offense. It’s a fact.
Don't underestimate the defense comparison either. I'm sure Dallas had a lot more plays than their opponents during Smith's tenure. In the end, I hate using these types of excuses as to why Smith doesn't belong near the top 5. What's really important is to use your eyes. I've been fortunate to see all these RBs play with the exception of Brown, and to me it is clear there were more than 5 RBs better than Emmitt Smith.
How can a team have a lot more possessions than their opponent? You give the ball back every time you score, save onside kicks.
Potent? Because they had a ####ty defense and had to throw a ton? Because they played from behind more often and thus got garbage time stats?
1990: 475 pass/393 rush
I probably should have used the word "plays" instead of possessions. A lot of 3 and outs help with that defense and I'm sure Dallas produced many of them given how good they were.
I was fairly young at the time, but the #1 thing I remember about Barry is the amount of times he was hit in the backfield and had to make something out of nothing. His line was pretty terrible. The Cowboy's line was one of the best that decade.Biabreakable said:
I didn't say Barry couldn't run between the tackles or play with a FB. So I am not sure what you are disagreeing with.
In 1995 Scott Mitchell threw for 4,300 yards and 32 TDs. Troy Aikman threw for 3,300 and 16 TDs. Nobody is arguing that Scott Mitchell was a better QB, but the Lions were clearly a more potent passing offense.
Why don’t you look up league averages, then? They were routinely near the bottom in terms of passing attempts and near the top of rushing attempts.
Perhaps. And Emmitt’s volume was certainly helped by that. But his efficiency was hurt by it. It’s harder to run the ball when you’re trying to kill the clock and protect a sizable lead.
I'm flabbergasted that anyone would consider E Smith over B Sanders in any ranking. It's almost like people just enjoy being contrarian / Oppositional defiant disorder (ODD).
If Barry was running behind the Dallas offensive line no one would have had to worry about Barry “going of script” as often.
I’ve said multiple times that I think Barry was better. Like you, I voted 6-10 for Emmitt.
Well it was a long time ago.
I think you might be misdiagnosing him. Even he would probably admit to some Homerism in this case.
79 passing TDs and 57 INTs while in Detroit. Mitchell had a single year with a QBR > 80 while in Detroit.
having great power, influence, or effect.
owerful, strong, mighty, formidable, influential, dominant, forceful;
Unless I get super-bored, I probably won't. (Feel free to do so on your own though.) But I feel confident that the league was passing at a higher rate than the Cowboys, but not by such a degree that it would drastically alter defenses very much. Regardless, I'm not sure how you can quantify those Cowboys' offenses as "unbalanced." If what you are saying is true though, I'm not sure that argument works in your favor. If defenses are built and designed to stop the pass all the time, and a team comes in that runs heavily on them, those defenses won't be as equipped to stop that running team as they would be the offenses they see in the other 14 or 15 games of the season.
That happened 1 time in Sanders' career. In 1995, Detroit was #2 in both passing yards and passing TDs. And in 1992, Dallas was #5 in both. Not seeing a real difference.
Probably.
Troy Aikman never threw more than 16 TDs in a season*. Even during the Pete years - and I wouldn’t call those passing offenses potent - the Lions were throwing more than that. Mitchell did it 3 times himself.
Do you mean efficient? I won’t argue that the Lions were more efficient.
So for you "potent" can mean "inefficiently productive." Because let's face it, that's what Scott Mitchell (and the passing offense) was.
Waaaaay to early for the Barkley to Barry comparisons
That’s a straw man. Troy Aikman was very good and I never said otherwise. If he played in different offenses, he’d have put up big numbers. He just wasn’t asked to do that in Dallas. They were an especially run heavy team, ever for the time.
Show me who called Mitchell better than Aikman, please. You either misread me or are being dishonest.
The original claim was *more* potent. I’m not even arguing for Smith over Barry. I think it’s fair to compare YPC stats. Just that it’s not fair to assume Emmitt’s YPC was propped up by his offensive line. With a lesser offensive line, they’d have to run a different, more balanced offense. Emmitt’s volume numbers would surely suffer as a result; but his efficiency metrics would jump.
Deep breaths.... this isn't personal. Even suggesting that Scott Mitchell was more productive (but less efficient or something) than Aikman is pretty ridiculous. Maybe take a break from this conversation and come back a little later. Honestly, I'm appreciating your input, but you've gone a bit astray.
Yeah, I get the thought process. It's just really odd to use the word "potent."
You suggested I said something that I didn’t, then made fun of me for it. I’m not taking it personally, I’m just calling you out for it. Now that I’ve called you out for it, rather than acknowledge it or clarify, you are deflecting and (again) misreading or misrepresenting my tone.
That’s certainly fair. I didn’t mean to argue that the Cowboys couldn’t beat those numbers if they wanted or needed to. The Cowboys had better parts, for sure. Aikman could have put up 4K and 30+ more efficiently than Mitchell did, if asked to do so. My point was that he wasn’t; that he was asked to drive the bus of a run-heavy offense.
Show me who made fun of you, please. You either misread me or are being dishonest.
![[scooter]](/data/avatars/m/22/22287.jpg?1659477690){kind=avatar}
What other Cowboys fan mentioned Scott Mitchell? I’m not sure what you get out of this, but yeah—let’s move on.
