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Who's better, MJD or Bush (1 Viewer)

Who's better, MJD or Bush

  • MJD

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  • Bush

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TheFanatic

Footballguy
In the MJD vs. Fred Taylor thread asking what to expect from each this year there were frequent comparisons between MJD and Bush.

Both started off their careers pretty spectacularly. Both split time with an established vet. One was the second overal pick. One was a second round pick.

Who's better?

 
In the MJD vs. Fred Taylor thread asking what to expect from each this year there were frequent comparisons between MJD and Bush.

Both started off their careers pretty spectacularly. Both split time with an established vet. One was the second overal pick. One was a second round pick.

Who's better?
In fantasy or in the NFL ?
 
Now? Seems like MJD is a more polished runner than Bush is.

In the future? Even though MJD will be solid, Bush will be better.

 
It don't care if you are talking Fantasy or real NFL, right now MJD is the better player. I am and have been one of the biggest Bush supporters for year, but this is not even close IMO. MJD does everything that Bush does +. He runs between the tackles far better and is one of the best short yardage RBs in the game after only one year.

 
It don't care if you are talking Fantasy or real NFL, right now MJD is the better player. I am and have been one of the biggest Bush supporters for year, but this is not even close IMO. MJD does everything that Bush does +. He runs between the tackles far better and is one of the best short yardage RBs in the game after only one year.
He also doesn't have the other team focusing just on him. Re-visit this in november.
 
It don't care if you are talking Fantasy or real NFL, right now MJD is the better player. I am and have been one of the biggest Bush supporters for year, but this is not even close IMO. MJD does everything that Bush does +. He runs between the tackles far better and is one of the best short yardage RBs in the game after only one year.
He also doesn't have the other team focusing just on him. Re-visit this in november.
Right, the 24th ranked passing attack and make-shift group of Garrard, Jones, Williams, Wilford and Taylor were far more to worry about than the the #1 passing attack of Brees, Colston, Horn, Henderson and McAllister.
 
It don't care if you are talking Fantasy or real NFL, right now MJD is the better player. I am and have been one of the biggest Bush supporters for year, but this is not even close IMO. MJD does everything that Bush does +. He runs between the tackles far better and is one of the best short yardage RBs in the game after only one year.
He also doesn't have the other team focusing just on him. Re-visit this in november.
Who are they focusing on when he's in the game? David Garrard? Reggie Williams? George Wrighster?
 
It don't care if you are talking Fantasy or real NFL, right now MJD is the better player. I am and have been one of the biggest Bush supporters for year, but this is not even close IMO. MJD does everything that Bush does +. He runs between the tackles far better and is one of the best short yardage RBs in the game after only one year.
He also doesn't have the other team focusing just on him. Re-visit this in november.
Who are they focusing on when he's in the game? David Garrard? Reggie Williams? George Wrighster?
George Wrighster?
 
It don't care if you are talking Fantasy or real NFL, right now MJD is the better player. I am and have been one of the biggest Bush supporters for year, but this is not even close IMO. MJD does everything that Bush does +. He runs between the tackles far better and is one of the best short yardage RBs in the game after only one year.
He also doesn't have the other team focusing just on him. Re-visit this in november.
:bag:
 
It don't care if you are talking Fantasy or real NFL, right now MJD is the better player. I am and have been one of the biggest Bush supporters for year, but this is not even close IMO. MJD does everything that Bush does +. He runs between the tackles far better and is one of the best short yardage RBs in the game after only one year.
He also doesn't have the other team focusing just on him. Re-visit this in november.
Who are they focusing on when he's in the game? David Garrard? Reggie Williams? George Wrighster?
George Wrighster?
As good as any other name in that sorry passing game.
 
I think Reggie is the whole key to that offense and D coordiantors do plan to take him out of the game.

MJD isn't half the wr that Bush is or they would have passed it more to him considering no one else could catch the ball on that team lst year. Now I'll agree short yardage MJD is definetly the better back and probably inbetween the tackles also but give Reggie time. Just like the second half of the season last year all he needs is one play to get his #'s.

 
This might turn out ugly.
I fully expect it to do exactly that....
How are you expecting the results to look?
Just like they have turned out. Everyone will go for the guy that got the monster contract, the national commercial deals and the sick hype machine. But when you look at the raw numbers the guy without the PR firm on retainer is the better player. Will that remain so a year from now, 2 years, 5 years, 10 years? Who knows. I didn't address whether it was now, or in the future in the question to spawn more debate.
 
I think Reggie is the whole key to that offense and D coordiantors do plan to take him out of the game. MJD isn't half the wr that Bush is or they would have passed it more to him considering no one else could catch the ball on that team lst year. Now I'll agree short yardage MJD is definetly the better back and probably inbetween the tackles also but give Reggie time. Just like the second half of the season last year all he needs is one play to get his #'s.
MJD is a better runner, almost as good a receiver, and a better returner. Better at the goalline, better at scoring TD's overall. Just as explosive and elusive. MJD had a 74 yd run, a 51 yd Rec and a 93 yd return. Bush had an 18 yd run( :goodposting: ), a 74 yd rec and a 65 yd return. The ONLY thing you can maybe say is Bush is a slightly better receiver, but then again, he had Brees checking down to him versus Garrard and Leftwich.The numbers don't lie. If you want to use them to prove that Bush is the better receiver, then you must give MJD the edge in EVERY other category.
 
I think Reggie is the whole key to that offense and D coordiantors do plan to take him out of the game. MJD isn't half the wr that Bush is or they would have passed it more to him considering no one else could catch the ball on that team lst year. Now I'll agree short yardage MJD is definetly the better back and probably inbetween the tackles also but give Reggie time. Just like the second half of the season last year all he needs is one play to get his #'s.
MJD is a better runner, almost as good a receiver, and a better returner. Better at the goalline, better at scoring TD's overall. Just as explosive and elusive. MJD had a 74 yd run, a 51 yd Rec and a 93 yd return. Bush had an 18 yd run( :wall: ), a 74 yd rec and a 65 yd return. The ONLY thing you can maybe say is Bush is a slightly better receiver, but then again, he had Brees checking down to him versus Garrard and Leftwich.The numbers don't lie. If you want to use them to prove that Bush is the better receiver, then you must give MJD the edge in EVERY other category.
Bush is taller too. Gotta give him the edge there. If Drew were 2 inches taller he'd get the respect he deserves and these poll results would probably be pretty different. Many are still misguided that this guy is small.
 
I think Reggie is the whole key to that offense and D coordiantors do plan to take him out of the game. MJD isn't half the wr that Bush is or they would have passed it more to him considering no one else could catch the ball on that team lst year. Now I'll agree short yardage MJD is definetly the better back and probably inbetween the tackles also but give Reggie time. Just like the second half of the season last year all he needs is one play to get his #'s.
MJD is a better runner, almost as good a receiver, and a better returner. Better at the goalline, better at scoring TD's overall. Just as explosive and elusive. MJD had a 74 yd run, a 51 yd Rec and a 93 yd return. Bush had an 18 yd run( :wall: ), a 74 yd rec and a 65 yd return. The ONLY thing you can maybe say is Bush is a slightly better receiver, but then again, he had Brees checking down to him versus Garrard and Leftwich.The numbers don't lie. If you want to use them to prove that Bush is the better receiver, then you must give MJD the edge in EVERY other category.
Bush is taller too. Gotta give him the edge there. If Drew were 2 inches taller he'd get the respect he deserves and these poll results would probably be pretty different. Many are still misguided that this guy is small.
Yep. Numbers don't lie.:Judge Smails: "How do you measure yourself against other golfers?":Ty Webb: " Height."This guy is a stud and I am glad he is on my keeper roster as RB3. Westy, Parker, MJD with Shanny's new toy T Henry as RB4. Parker is my "big" back at 5'10"!!!
 
I think Reggie is the whole key to that offense and D coordiantors do plan to take him out of the game.

MJD isn't half the wr that Bush is or they would have passed it more to him considering no one else could catch the ball on that team lst year. Now I'll agree short yardage MJD is definetly the better back and probably inbetween the tackles also but give Reggie time. Just like the second half of the season last year all he needs is one play to get his #'s.
Is that because Bush is more of a WR than he is a RB? Bush isn't half the between the tackles runner that MJD is. MJD led the top 32 Fantasy RB's in YPC last year with a 5.67 YPC. Bush was 29th with a 3.62 YPCOh, and MJD had just as many receiving TD's as Bush with half the receptions and had more than a yard better YPR.

To say he isn't half the WR is a little extreme. I would need to see how many times MJD was targetted as opposed to Bush. If MJD had a higher completion percentage in terms of targets your point is null. MJD can't throw to himself or call his number in the huddle. The Saints OC called 25 early and often. If we look at completions in terms of targets we have something to compare. But I'm talking compareable stats here and know I just lost you. Keep looking at the big 89 over MJD's 46, but realize those stats can be deceiving :lol:

For a guy that runs as well as MJD, he does pretty well in the passing game. 1st in YPC and 6th in YPR as opposed to Bush who is 29th in YPC and 13th in YPR at RB. I've got a phenomenal RB with great hands. You have a pretty mediocre RB with pretty good hands. Remember, Quantity does not equal Quality.

And to the rest of the board who will want to take offense at this post, realize that I am in a league with the BJ's here and this is mainly a shot at him :confused: :wall:

 
I think Reggie is the whole key to that offense and D coordiantors do plan to take him out of the game.

MJD isn't half the wr that Bush is or they would have passed it more to him considering no one else could catch the ball on that team lst year. Now I'll agree short yardage MJD is definetly the better back and probably inbetween the tackles also but give Reggie time. Just like the second half of the season last year all he needs is one play to get his #'s.
Is that because Bush is more of a WR than he is a RB? Bush isn't half the between the tackles runner that MJD is. MJD led the top 32 Fantasy RB's in YPC last year with a 5.67 YPC. Bush was 29th with a 3.62 YPCOh, and MJD had just as many receiving TD's as Bush with half the receptions and had more than a yard better YPR.

To say he isn't half the WR is a little extreme. I would need to see how many times MJD was targetted as opposed to Bush. If MJD had a higher completion percentage in terms of targets your point is null. MJD can't throw to himself or call his number in the huddle. The Saints OC called 25 early and often. If we look at completions in terms of targets we have something to compare. But I'm talking compareable stats here and know I just lost you. Keep looking at the big 89 over MJD's 46, but realize those stats can be deceiving :lol:

For a guy that runs as well as MJD, he does pretty well in the passing game. 1st in YPC and 6th in YPR as opposed to Bush who is 29th in YPC and 13th in YPR at RB. I've got a phenomenal RB with great hands. You have a pretty mediocre RB with pretty good hands. Remember, Quantity does not equal Quality.

And to the rest of the board who will want to take offense at this post, realize that I am in a league with the BJ's here and this is mainly a shot at him :confused: :wall:
Call it whatever you want. I'd just call it accurate.
 
I think Reggie is the whole key to that offense and D coordiantors do plan to take him out of the game. MJD isn't half the wr that Bush is or they would have passed it more to him considering no one else could catch the ball on that team lst year. Now I'll agree short yardage MJD is definetly the better back and probably inbetween the tackles also but give Reggie time. Just like the second half of the season last year all he needs is one play to get his #'s.
MJD is a better runner, almost as good a receiver, and a better returner. Better at the goalline, better at scoring TD's overall. Just as explosive and elusive. MJD had a 74 yd run, a 51 yd Rec and a 93 yd return. Bush had an 18 yd run( :X ), a 74 yd rec and a 65 yd return. The ONLY thing you can maybe say is Bush is a slightly better receiver, but then again, he had Brees checking down to him versus Garrard and Leftwich.The numbers don't lie. If you want to use them to prove that Bush is the better receiver, then you must give MJD the edge in EVERY other category.
Once again another short-sighted argument against Bush. 4.8 yards a carry over the 2nd half, 10 TDs including the playoffs and receptions of 88, 61 and 74 yards. People too often dwell on Reggie's poor start, and misinterpret his stats.I've argued this before and it's always the same story. Keep looking at the stats and think you know who the better player is.
 
Everyone will go for the guy that got the monster contract, the national commercial deals and the sick hype machine.
You'd think people in the "shark pool" would watch more football. :X
Did you watch the Saints/Eagles in the playoffs. The Eagles were so scared of Reggie in the flats that the vaunted TE trio of Miller/Owens/Campbell combined for over 100 yards.
 
Everyone will go for the guy that got the monster contract, the national commercial deals and the sick hype machine.
You'd think people in the "shark pool" would watch more football. :goodposting:
Did you watch the Saints/Eagles in the playoffs. The Eagles were so scared of Reggie in the flats that the vaunted TE trio of Miller/Owens/Campbell combined for over 100 yards.
Yeah, OK let's do that. Only 2nd half stats:MJD

| WK OPP | RSH YD | RECYD | TD |+----------+-------------+--------+----+| 10 hou | 3 11 | 56 | 1 || 11 nyg | 9 45 | 16 | 1 || 12 buf | 8 78 | 47 | 1 || 13 mia | 5 46 | 0 | 1 || 14 ind | 15 166 | 15 | 2 || 15 ten | 25 98 | 47 | 1 || 16 nwe | 19 131 | 41 | 2 || 17 kan | 12 46 | 16 | 1 |Rushing: 96 carries, 621 yds, 6.47 avgReceiving: 25 rec, 238 yds, 9.52 avg

10 total TDs

107.4 total yds, 1.25 Tds per game

Bush

+----------+-------------+--------+----+| WK OPP | RSH YD | RECYD | TD |+----------+-------------+--------+----+| 10 pit | 10 49 | 40 | 1 || 11 cin | 13 51 | 58 | 0 || 12 atl | 5 24 | 21 | 0 || 13 sfo | 10 37 | 131 | 4 || 14 dal | 6 37 | 125 | 1 || 15 was | 7 14 | 19 | 0 || 16 nyg | 20 126 | 23 | 1 || 17 car | 3 20 | 13 | 1 | phi | 12 52 1 | 3 22 0 chi | 4 19 0 | 7 132 1Rushing: 90 carries, 429 yds, 4.77 avgReceiving: 52 rec, 584 yds, 11.2 avg

101.3 total yds, 0.90 Tds per game

Even your cherry picked stats show MJD as the better player. MJD scored more TDs in less games and on far less touches (I gave Bush the benefit of his 2 playoff games). Furthermore, MJD has better total yardage, the same yds per touch and a far better yds per carry.

For all the progress Bush made during the 2nd half of last season. He was in reality only shipping away at the iceberg that was catching up to MJD.

 
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jurb26,

The argument for MJD is even stronger over the latter part of the season considering he did this with the likes of Garrard at QB and nobody at WR or TE. Opposing Defenses could clearly key in on the running game, and yet MJD still had 1.5 yards more per carry than Reggie. MJD also had more than 1 yard per carry more than his running mate Taylor. Reggie barely had an edge over his running mate Deuce with 0.2 yards more per carry.

 
jurb26,The argument for MJD is even stronger over the latter part of the season considering he did this with the likes of Garrard at QB and nobody at WR or TE. Opposing Defenses could clearly key in on the running game, and yet MJD still had 1.5 yards more per carry than Reggie. MJD also had more than 1 yard per carry more than his running mate Taylor. Reggie barely had an edge over his running mate Deuce with 0.2 yards more per carry.
Apparently Garrard was the focal point of the defense. Haven't you been paying attention DB. :pickle:
 
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I'm glad we are having this debate. I now know that next year people will be taking John Kitna over Bulger, Vick, Palmer and Brady cause he scored more points last year.

It was last year people....get over it. Reggie might be more of a wr than a rb or he might be really good at both, time will tell.

As for MJD's avg. telling you he is a better runner, that stat doesn't mean squat. If he broke alot of long runs...which he did, it would inflate that # and make it look like he was a more consistant runner than he really was. Just for your info, I did say he was better than Reggie right now between the tackles but since you point out he led the league are you stating you think he is the best in the NFL between the tackles?

Also "fanatic" if the Bucs throw the ball twice to Alstott and he comes down with both....does that mean he is a better wr than both Bush and MJD because his completition percentage is better? Might be the most flawed comment that I've ever heard come out of your mouth (or from your keyboard). It's probably alittle harder to get Reggie the ball when defenses know it is coming and are trying to defend it more.

"I've got a phenomenal RB with great hands. You have a pretty mediocre RB with pretty good hands. Remember, Quantity does not equal Quality."

You obviously didn't watch any games of Bush last year to make this statement...nevermind that is the most flawed comment to ever come out of your mouth (keyboard).

Take all the "shots" you want fact is MJD had a great year last year and I take nothing away from him but Reggie is a better talent and we will all just have to see who stays and who shows he was a flash in the pan.

(PS I'm not trying to rip on MJD, I really liked what I saw out of him. I just get amused when people see one good year and get over excited.

Remember Patrick Jeffers Scotty...........

 
Michael Turner had a higher ypc than the LT last year. Therefore he is obviously a superior player based on the logic dictated in this thread.

Further, Reuben Droughns put up better numbers than Cadillac for the second consecutive year. Therefore clearly, once again dictated by the logic in this thread, he is a superior player. Were the Giants to get drunk and offer the clearly superior Droughns to the Bucs straight up for Cadillac, Gruden would obviously jump at the chance immediately.

 
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Michael Turner had a higher ypc than the LT last year. Therefor he is obviously a superior player based on the logic dictated in this thread.Further, Reuben Droughns put up better numbers than Cadillac for the second straight here. Therefor clearly, once again dictated by the logic in this thread, he is a superior player.
:thumbup: obviously, didn't you know
 
Michael Turner had a higher ypc than the LT last year. Therefore he is obviously a superior player based on the logic dictated in this thread.Further, Reuben Droughns put up better numbers than Cadillac for the second consecutive year. Therefore clearly, once again dictated by the logic in this thread, he is a superior player. Were the Giants to get drunk and offer the clearly superior Droughns to the Bucs straight up for Cadillac, Gruden would obviously jump at the chance immediately.
OK, then give us one valid reason Bush is a better RB than MJD this year. Other than he was drafted earlier. FYI, it was the Bush supporters that asked us to look at last years 2nd half numbers.
 
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I just get amused when people see one good year and get over excited.
I get amused when people disregard facts because of draft position.The fact of the matter is that had MJD been just 2 inches taller he would have been pretty darn close to the same level of prospect coming out of college and a sure 1st rounder. His size was the only real knock on him and he has proven that knock to be false. You can kick and scream all you want about how it was only a year. We learned an awful lot in that years time though.
 
Michael Turner had a higher ypc than the LT last year. Therefore he is obviously a superior player based on the logic dictated in this thread.

Further, Reuben Droughns put up better numbers than Cadillac for the second consecutive year. Therefore clearly, once again dictated by the logic in this thread, he is a superior player. Were the Giants to get drunk and offer the clearly superior Droughns to the Bucs straight up for Cadillac, Gruden would obviously jump at the chance immediately.
OK, then give us one valid reason Bush is a better RB than MJD this year. Other than he was drafted earlier. FYI, it was the Bush supporters that asked us to look at last years 2nd half numbers.
The #'s I did (both of their last 10 games {even with Reggie's short game against Carolina} had MJD with 1 more point (without kickoff returns)I'm not stating Bush is a better RB...right now. I've admitted MJD along with plenty of others can run the ball better inside. However, as an all around player I think Bush is better.

I think he has better vision, hands, speed, agility, moves, athleticism and a gear that MJD will never have and again remember I like MJD but when Bush kicks in that last gear...well see ya.

Power and patience however probably go to Drew right now and for a rb those are 2 important things to have.

 
I just get amused when people see one good year and get over excited.
I get amused when people disregard facts because of draft position.The fact of the matter is that had MJD been just 2 inches taller he would have been pretty darn close to the same level of prospect coming out of college and a sure 1st rounder. His size was the only real knock on him and he has proven that knock to be false. You can kick and scream all you want about how it was only a year. We learned an awful lot in that years time though.
HE IS A NICE PLAYER.....I AGREEI'm not disregarding anything due to draft position I watched them both play and like Reggie more.

I'd love to have a link saying that if MJD was 2 inches taller he would be a first rounder. Isn't this coming from the person that goes off facts?

 
Alittle FWI

13 out of 17 experts on footballguys like Reggie more in a redraft and 4 for 4 in dynasty.

Obviously the fanatic knows more than them though

Keep up the good work Scotty :goodposting:

 
I just get amused when people see one good year and get over excited.
I get amused when people disregard facts because of draft position.The fact of the matter is that had MJD been just 2 inches taller he would have been pretty darn close to the same level of prospect coming out of college and a sure 1st rounder. His size was the only real knock on him and he has proven that knock to be false. You can kick and scream all you want about how it was only a year. We learned an awful lot in that years time though.
HE IS A NICE PLAYER.....I AGREEI'm not disregarding anything due to draft position I watched them both play and like Reggie more.

I'd love to have a link saying that if MJD was 2 inches taller he would be a first rounder. Isn't this coming from the person that goes off facts?
It was written about quite a bit before last season. One example:http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writ...ickashaw/1.html

 
Its been one year in the NFL... hardly a fair amount of time to decide but

Bush has leaps and bounds more potential.

I think when thier careers are over MJD will go down as a great Running Back but Bush will go down as someone who could single handedly change the outcome of games.

 
I just get amused when people see one good year and get over excited.
I get amused when people disregard facts because of draft position.The fact of the matter is that had MJD been just 2 inches taller he would have been pretty darn close to the same level of prospect coming out of college and a sure 1st rounder. His size was the only real knock on him and he has proven that knock to be false. You can kick and scream all you want about how it was only a year. We learned an awful lot in that years time though.
HE IS A NICE PLAYER.....I AGREEI'm not disregarding anything due to draft position I watched them both play and like Reggie more.

I'd love to have a link saying that if MJD was 2 inches taller he would be a first rounder. Isn't this coming from the person that goes off facts?
It was written about quite a bit before last season. One example:http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writ...ickashaw/1.html
A google search will bring up plenty.
 
How is Bush an elite talent, and MJD is a "hard worker who succeeds despite his size?".

Maurice starred at national powerhouse De La Salle. The football teams he played on never lost a single game during his 3-year career. He was an elusive, high-scoring running back and return specialist on offense and a punishing linebacker on defense. Maurice literally somersaulted into the national consciousness on October 6, 2001, when, as a junior, he scored all four of De La Salle's touchdowns (TDs) in a 29-15 nationally-televised victory over Long Beach Poly in the first game that ever matched up the nation's No. 1 and No. 2 ranked high school football teams.
During his senior season, Maurice was even better. He rushed for nearly 1,500 yards, averaged nearly 12 yards per carry, and scored 26 touchdowns. He was rated the No. 1 all-purpose back in the nation by rivals.com. He is pictured outrunning a slew of defenders on the cover of the book "When the Game Stands Tall," which chronicles the De La Salle Spartan's all-time-record 151-game winning streak.
In 2005, Maurice set an all-time NCAA single-season record with a 28.5 yards per return average on 15 punt returns, breaking the previous record of 25.9 yards per return held by Bill Blackstock of Tennessee in 1951. His career average of 23.2 yards per punt return ranks second in NCAA history.
His final year in college, his junior year, he was a consensus first-team All-American as an all-purpose back and a first-team All-Pac 10 selection as a punt returner, ahead of Heisman Trophy-winner Reggie Bush.
He also led all AFC running backs in scrimmage yards per touch. Narrowly missing 1,000 yards for the season, Jones-Drew's rushing average of 5.7 yds per carry led the NFL and was the highest for an NFL running back since Barry Sanders averaged 6.1 yds per rush in 1997. In addition, he had the third-most all-purpose yards of any rookie in history. He was nominated five different times for NFL Rookie of the Week in 2006. According to one NFL scout, "Maurice Jones-Drew should be rookie of the year. He's got the biggest legs for a shorter guy and way more power than anybody gives him credit for. And he's got outstanding speed. He's just a little dynamo."
Drew has as much talent as Bush.Bush got more hype because he was at USC winning national titles.

MJD was more highly regarded coming out of HS.

MJD did far more in his rookie year then Bush, and should have been ROY.

It's is factually incorrect to stay that Bush is an elite talent, and MJD is not. MJD has been regarded as an elite talent all his life. People have DOWNGRADED him because of his size. Bush has been UPGRADED because of where he played. Do not let this confuse you. MJD is an elite RB, and has been since HS, playing for one of the elite highschool programs in the united states.

Ilov80s "

I Bet You Didn't Know...

...Jones-Drew picked up a 1st down on 28% of his carries. LT picked up a 1st down on only 23% of his runs.

LJ and Gore finished at 22%.

...Jones-Drew had the highest yards per carry average of any RB receiving at least 100 carries.

...Jones-Drew ranks 4th in the AFC for lowest % of runs stuffed.

...53% of his rushing TDs were scored inside the 10 yard line- most in the AFC.

He Has the Highlights

MJD Highlights

What Makes Him Special?

He uses his body to his advantage: his low center of gravity makes him very difficult to topple and in the age of giants (what defender isn't atleast 6-3 these days?), his lack of height makes him difficult to spot and difficult for giant defenders to reach . Very fast game speed, sharp cuts, quick change of directions, relentless will, great leg drive, powerful lower body, strong instincts, good hands, runs through arm tackles with ease and possesses amazing balance."

Bush benefited greatly from playing with the Saints. Much better offense, much better coach, much better QB. If MJD would have been drafted by the Saints, he would have had 400-500 more yards, and 5-6 more TDs. He's a far better runner (anyway you slice it) and can hold his own as a receiver. You don't think defenses schemed to stop MJD? They had no QB, no WRs, it was Fragile Fred and MJD. Trust me, defenses keyed on MJD for most of the year, and without question in the 2nd half.

 
Fantasy rankings take a lot more into account than player talent as you well know. Bush is playing for arguably the best gameday play caller in the NFL. He's playing for the top rated offense in the league with a QB that just had a monster year and playing in an offensive system tailored to meet his skill set. That might have something to do with his high ranking.

But this thread has drifted away from the original question which was who is better, not who should be ranked higher. Based on one year in the NFL I'd say that MJD is a better traditional RB but that Bush has amazing skills that if used properly can both be productive and create mismatch opportunities for teammates. Bush should thank his lucky stars he ended up in NO, I bet if Houston takes him first overall last year we wouldn't even be having this talk. He was not very productive when used like a traditional RB and few NFL coaches would have been able to adapt their offenses to his skill set.

 
Good grief Sleeper_43,

That looks like a sentence taken directly from KISSREGGIE'SBUTT.COM. Come on.

MJD scored in 12 out of 14 games in which he touched the ball more than 4 times.

Bush scored in only 7 out of 18 games.

Who impacted more games for their team?

How can you say Bush had more impact while keeping a straight keyboard? ;)

Please spare me the tired argument about him taking the attention of the entire Defense, blah, blah, blah. Yes, Reggie is a blessed football player and yes the Saints play calling faked a few Defenses out. That argument is purely subjective and completely ignores the possible play fakes for the Jaguars when comparing MJD or any other possible RB.

You only have one year of data for each guy anything else is hype. Saying that Bush will be this or that in the future is ridiculous, claiming that another RB is less than Bush is ridiculous as well especially when no data supports your claims. Bush finished with less than a 4 YPR clip for the season, and he underperformed compared to his hype and to MJD no matter what figures you choose to leave out in order to elevate Bush!

 
Fantasy rankings take a lot more into account than player talent as you well know. Bush is playing for arguably the best gameday play caller in the NFL. He's playing for the top rated offense in the league with a QB that just had a monster year and playing in an offensive system tailored to meet his skill set. That might have something to do with his high ranking.But this thread has drifted away from the original question which was who is better, not who should be ranked higher. Based on one year in the NFL I'd say that MJD is a better traditional RB but that Bush has amazing skills that if used properly can both be productive and create mismatch opportunities for teammates. Bush should thank his lucky stars he ended up in NO, I bet if Houston takes him first overall last year we wouldn't even be having this talk. He was not very productive when used like a traditional RB and few NFL coaches would have been able to adapt their offenses to his skill set.
:ph34r: You swap MJD with Bush, and MJD would have hit 20 TDs in his sleep, and Bush would have 2 tds. And Bush would be called a huge bust, because the offense in JAX is severely limited. People talk about Addai being a product of his offense. Bush has been a product of his offense at USC and with the Saints. Look at White setting PAC-10 records, and he's a monster bust in the NFL. So if you downgrade Addai for being a product of the offense, you should downgrade Bush. Then upgrade MJD for playing in that awful JAX offense. Then come back and tell me you still rank Bush over MJD. What a joke.
 
I just get amused when people see one good year and get over excited.
I get amused when people disregard facts because of draft position.The fact of the matter is that had MJD been just 2 inches taller he would have been pretty darn close to the same level of prospect coming out of college and a sure 1st rounder. His size was the only real knock on him and he has proven that knock to be false. You can kick and scream all you want about how it was only a year. We learned an awful lot in that years time though.
HE IS A NICE PLAYER.....I AGREEI'm not disregarding anything due to draft position I watched them both play and like Reggie more.

I'd love to have a link saying that if MJD was 2 inches taller he would be a first rounder. Isn't this coming from the person that goes off facts?
It was written about quite a bit before last season. One example:http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/writ...ickashaw/1.html
I guess I was looking for a quote from someone in the NFL like a scout or a coach. Not some writer for SI.com. My bad, sorry to what info from people in the know.
 
Fantasy rankings take a lot more into account than player talent as you well know. Bush is playing for arguably the best gameday play caller in the NFL. He's playing for the top rated offense in the league with a QB that just had a monster year and playing in an offensive system tailored to meet his skill set. That might have something to do with his high ranking.But this thread has drifted away from the original question which was who is better, not who should be ranked higher. Based on one year in the NFL I'd say that MJD is a better traditional RB but that Bush has amazing skills that if used properly can both be productive and create mismatch opportunities for teammates. Bush should thank his lucky stars he ended up in NO, I bet if Houston takes him first overall last year we wouldn't even be having this talk. He was not very productive when used like a traditional RB and few NFL coaches would have been able to adapt their offenses to his skill set.
:link: You swap MJD with Bush, and MJD would have hit 20 TDs in his sleep, and Bush would have 2 tds. And Bush would be called a huge bust, because the offense in JAX is severely limited. People talk about Addai being a product of his offense. Bush has been a product of his offense at USC and with the Saints. Look at White setting PAC-10 records, and he's a monster bust in the NFL. So if you downgrade Addai for being a product of the offense, you should downgrade Bush. Then upgrade MJD for playing in that awful JAX offense. Then come back and tell me you still rank Bush over MJD. What a joke.
Going into last year NO was thought to have one of the worst Olines in the NFL.they were the 2nd worse team in football the year before.Reggie is what made the offense open up due to the attention he deserves. (I don't care if your sick of hearing it until you agree it will continue to be stated.)
 
Is that because Bush is more of a WR than he is a RB? Bush isn't half the between the tackles runner that MJD is. MJD led the top 32 Fantasy RB's in YPC last year with a 5.67 YPC. Bush was 29th with a 3.62 YPC

Oh, and MJD had just as many receiving TD's as Bush with half the receptions and had more than a yard better YPR.

To say he isn't half the WR is a little extreme. I would need to see how many times MJD was targetted as opposed to Bush. If MJD had a higher completion percentage in terms of targets your point is null. MJD can't throw to himself or call his number in the huddle. The Saints OC called 25 early and often. If we look at completions in terms of targets we have something to compare. But I'm talking compareable stats here and know I just lost you. Keep looking at the big 89 over MJD's 46, but realize those stats can be deceiving :hey:
Reggie Bush had 122 targets compared to 61 for MJD, which makes this very convenient- Bush was targeted exactly twice as often.Bush caught 73% of the passes his way compared to 75% for MJD. Bush averaged 6.13 yards per target compared to 7.15 for MJD (that's more than a yard better, for those keeping score at home). If you prefer DVOA, MJD finished 10th to Reggie Bush's 28th. If you prefer DPAR (which is actually weighted towards players with a heavy workload), then MJD finished 7th to Reggie Bush's 12th.

Bush was the most heavily targeted RB in the entire NFL last season. Like Chris Chambers in 2005, he posted huge receiving numbers almost entirely due to the sheer number of times he was force-fed the ball.

Once again another short-sighted argument against Bush. 4.8 yards a carry over the 2nd half, 10 TDs including the playoffs and receptions of 88, 61 and 74 yards. People too often dwell on Reggie's poor start, and misinterpret his stats.

I've argued this before and it's always the same story. Keep looking at the stats and think you know who the better player is.
That's great. You can completely discard Bush's first half, for all I care, because MJD *STILL* outperformed him. You can select any sample you want and MJD will still outperform Bush. You can cherrypick Bush's best games, or just look at his home games, or just look at games in the second half of the season- none of it matters. There isn't a single split where Bush outperformed MJD.
I'm glad we are having this debate. I now know that next year people will be taking John Kitna over Bulger, Vick, Palmer and Brady cause he scored more points last year.

It was last year people....get over it. Reggie might be more of a wr than a rb or he might be really good at both, time will tell.
This is a very good point. We shouldn't be so shortsighted- let's compare their entire NFL careers here. Hmmm... looking at entire careers, Brady is better than Kitna, but MJD is still better than Bush. In fact, MJD has been better than Bush every single season of their careers.
Michael Turner had a higher ypc than the LT last year. Therefore he is obviously a superior player based on the logic dictated in this thread.

Further, Reuben Droughns put up better numbers than Cadillac for the second consecutive year. Therefore clearly, once again dictated by the logic in this thread, he is a superior player. Were the Giants to get drunk and offer the clearly superior Droughns to the Bucs straight up for Cadillac, Gruden would obviously jump at the chance immediately.
Apples and oranges. First off, some people seriously do suggest that The Burner is the next LT. Either way, though, Turner's in a better situation- he's in the exact same offense, but he's fresher than LT and defenses don't focus on him as much as LT. It's pretty easy to explain how The Burner could put up better numbers without being a better player- he's in a better situation than LT.Ditto that for Droughns/Cadillac (although I think Caddy is terribly overrated- name two good games he's posted against solid defenses).

What about Bush/MJD, though? Does anyone think that MJD is in a better situation than Bush? Bush got more touches in a more potent offense with more weapons drawing the threats away from him... and MJD still outperformed him. It's hard to explain that any way other than "MJD is better than Bush". I mean, if you have another explanation for that phenomenon, I'd LOVE to hear it.

 

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