Who's the 2016 NFL MVP right now? (1 Viewer)

[Sabertooth]

The Packers offensive line is awesome as well.  They routinely give Rodgers an eternity to pass.  And they have paved the way for a wide receiver to 6.0 ypc while he was learning the nuance of the pro level.  Not taking anything away from Dallas, but Green Bay's is right there with them.  

 

[FUBAR]

When comparing quarterbacks, it's useful to look at how well each team's offense has done, since the QB is the leader of the offense.

The Atlanta Falcons lead the NFL in scoring with 502 points scored. Second place is the New Orleans Saints with 437 points. Rounding out the top 5 are Oakland, Dallas, and New England.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in SRS with +10.7 points per game above average. In second is New Orleans with +6.6, followed by Dallas, Green Bay, and Oakland.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in DVOA at 24.8%. In second is Dallas with 22.8%, followed by New England, Washington, and New Orleans.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in points per possession with 3.01. In second is New Orleans with 2.60, followed by Dallas, Green Bay, and Washington.

The Washington offense leads the NFL in yards per possession with 40.85. In second is Atlanta with 40.34, followed by New Orleans, Green Bay, and Dallas.

Seems like the leader of the Atlanta offense might be worth some serious consideration.

Fair points. 

Which lead to the question of where does kyle shanahan coach next year? 

 

[MaxThreshold]

When comparing quarterbacks, it's useful to look at how well each team's offense has done, since the QB is the leader of the offense.

The Atlanta Falcons lead the NFL in scoring with 502 points scored. Second place is the New Orleans Saints with 437 points. Rounding out the top 5 are Oakland, Dallas, and New England.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in SRS with +10.7 points per game above average. In second is New Orleans with +6.6, followed by Dallas, Green Bay, and Oakland.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in DVOA at 24.8%. In second is Dallas with 22.8%, followed by New England, Washington, and New Orleans.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in points per possession with 3.01. In second is New Orleans with 2.60, followed by Dallas, Green Bay, and Washington.

The Washington offense leads the NFL in yards per possession with 40.85. In second is Atlanta with 40.34, followed by New Orleans, Green Bay, and Dallas.

Seems like the leader of the Atlanta offense might be worth some serious consideration.

All of those stats for Atlanta are more of a TEAM effort than the Herculean effort of one guy (Ryan).  Simply put, if you remove Matt Ryan, Atlanta would still be putting up numbers.  That is not the case at all for Rodgers - you remove Rodgers and GB goes down the toilet.  Remember, it is Most Valuable Player, not Most Valuable Team.

 

[massraider]

Simply put, there's no way to know that.

 

[Ghost Rider]

Something else - Rodgers made Davante Adams fantasy relevant.

Matt Ryan made Taylor Gabriel fantasy relevant. 

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

Rodgers played like dog #### more than half the season. He's not getting it. 

 

[Ghost Rider]

Rodgers played like dog #### more than half the season. He's not getting it. 

Don't be so sure. Voters put a lot of stock into how players play down the stretch. Look at last year: Brady was the better QB for the majority of the season, but Cam played better down the stretch, and he got the nod from voters. 

 

[Dedfin]

Don't be so sure. Voters put a lot of stock into how players play down the stretch. Look at last year: Brady was the better QB for the majority of the season, but Cam played better down the stretch, and he got the nod from voters. 

And considering there is so much on the line on Sunday, he may get more credit for that game than Ryan gets for being excellent early in the year.  Rodgers' Sunday game might be what wins him the MVP despite what Ryan does.

 

[DropKick]

Rodgers is the MVP and it's not even close.

Update:  Actually, I think David Johnson is definitely in the running too.  Rodgers or Johnson or both.  I'd be cool with that.

Of course it's close - Ryan, Brady, even Prescott is in the discussion if you want to value team success/expectation which is what they'll do with David Johnson vs. Zeke.

No WR is in the discussion and Zeke would be a "fashionable" pick but I think it will be a QB and will come down to Rodgers or Ryan.  Too much politics going against Brady.  I lean Ryan based on Packer's struggles over the first half of the season,  It all could come down to this weekend's games.

 

[Bucsfan5493]

The Packers offensive line is awesome as well.  They routinely give Rodgers an eternity to pass.  And they have paved the way for a wide receiver to 6.0 ypc while he was learning the nuance of the pro level.  Not taking anything away from Dallas, but Green Bay's is right there with them.  

Yep, people seem to forget that too. The Raiders o-line is amazing as well, which is part of the reason why I never considered Carr as a serious candidate to win it, although I was fine with him being in the discussion. 

I think MVP has to be Ryan. He's leading probably the best offense in the league this year, and is doing it without insane talent around him. Sure, Julio is great but even he has been kind of streaky and missed a few games this year with his injuries. His o-line is solid but nothing that special and the rest of his weapons aren't that great. Definitely would say he is the most VALUABLE to his team.

If the Cardinals had a better record and could make the playoffs, then David Johnson would be in the top 3 for me.

 

[massraider]

I think it would be great if Johnson won it, he has been amazing, and has been dragging the Cards up and down the field, all by himself.

But the MVP doesn't come from bad teams, and we know this.  I don't necessarily agree with that policy, but arguing it is pointless.  In reality, DJ isn't a serious contender.  That's silly, but hey, that's the way it is.  

 

[massraider]

Yep, people seem to forget that too. The Raiders o-line is amazing as well, which is part of the reason why I never considered Carr as a serious candidate to win it

Avoid players with good players around them for MVP talk.  Good policy.  

Terrelle Pryor for MVP.

 

[Bucsfan5493]

Avoid players with good players around them for MVP talk.  Good policy.  

Terrelle Pryor for MVP.

That's not what I said. If a guy is surrounded by excellent talent though, it is hard to say really how valuable they are to their team. In Carr's case, he has an excellent o-line (he has been hit only 36 times which is easily the least in the league), a solid running game (4.5 YPC, which is top 10 in the NFL) and 2 very talented and good receivers in Cooper and Crabtree. Yes, his defense isn't good which makes him have to throw a lot sometimes, but overall, he is in a pretty great situation. I am very interested to see how McGloin fares the next few weeks.

In Ryan's case, while his supporting cast isn't bad by any means, it is definitely not at a guy like Carr's, Dak's or Rodgers' level. He's been hit 100 times (7th worst in the league), which is almost 3 times as much as Carr has been, and other than Julio who has been streaky and hurt throughout the year, his weapons aren't anything that special. Hell, he's helped turn Taylor Gabriel, who went as a UDFA 2 years ago, into a legitimate threat. In addition to all of this, Ryan is in the top 3 in pretty much every single big QB stat (yards, YPA, TD, INT, Completion %, QB Rating).

Trust me, as a Bucs fan, I don't talk up Falcons players often, but Ryan has had one hell of a year and deserves more credit than he is getting. He should definitely be the MVP.

 

[massraider]

That's not what I said. If a guy is surrounded by excellent talent though, it is hard to say really how valuable they are to their team. In Carr's case, he has an excellent o-line (he has been hit only 36 times which is easily the least in the league), a solid running game (4.5 YPC, which is top 10 in the NFL) and 2 very talented and good receivers in Cooper and Crabtree. Yes, his defense isn't good which makes him have to throw a lot sometimes, but overall, he is in a pretty great situation. I am very interested to see how McGloin fares the next few weeks.

In Ryan's case, while his supporting cast isn't bad by any means, it is definitely not at a guy like Carr's, Dak's or Rodgers' level. He's been hit 100 times (7th worst in the league), which is almost 3 times as much as Carr has been, and other than Julio who has been streaky and hurt throughout the year, his weapons aren't anything that special. He's helped turn Taylor Gabriel, who went as a UDFA 2 years ago, into a legitimate threat. In addition to all of this, Ryan is in the top 3 in pretty much every single big QB stat (yards, YPA, TD, INT, Completion %, QB Rating).

Carr's receivers led the NFL in drops, and the team led the NFL in penalties. Those are two league leading stats that are not great for a QB.  

The Raiders weren't passing alot because their defense was bad, they were passing a lot because they were constantly in 1st and long, and 2nd and long situations because of penalties.  Crabtree wasn't considered 'very good' until Carr got hold of him.  They signed him as a free agent for peanuts.  

I would vote for Ryan as well, but skill position wise he has Freeman/Coleman and Julio/Sanu/Gabriel.  Ryan's supporting cast is not a negative at all.  it's not worth arguing where supporting cast ranks, but this isn't the Browns or 49ers here, he has very good talent around him.  

Ryan, Rodgers, Carr, Brady all have good talent around them, enough to say that they are not at a disadvantage (No GB running game being a notable exception).  Ryan has had the best statistical year, I think it should probably go to him or Zeke.  

 

[rockaction]

Like others have said, Dallas OL. 

That said, reality is that Elliott, Rodgers, Brady, or Carr will win this. 

Ryan should be in the discussion.

Johnson leads the league in total yards. So should he.  

 

[Shlon]

When comparing quarterbacks, it's useful to look at how well each team's offense has done, since the QB is the leader of the offense.

The Atlanta Falcons lead the NFL in scoring with 502 points scored. Second place is the New Orleans Saints with 437 points. Rounding out the top 5 are Oakland, Dallas, and New England.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in SRS with +10.7 points per game above average. In second is New Orleans with +6.6, followed by Dallas, Green Bay, and Oakland.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in DVOA at 24.8%. In second is Dallas with 22.8%, followed by New England, Washington, and New Orleans.

The Atlanta offense leads the NFL in points per possession with 3.01. In second is New Orleans with 2.60, followed by Dallas, Green Bay, and Washington.

The Washington offense leads the NFL in yards per possession with 40.85. In second is Atlanta with 40.34, followed by New Orleans, Green Bay, and Dallas.

Seems like the leader of the Atlanta offense might be worth some serious consideration.




 

Atlanta and Matt Ryan faced the hardest schedule in terms of opponent defenses (according to footballoutsiders) and they still put up #'s.

 

[Shlon]

All of those stats for Atlanta are more of a TEAM effort than the Herculean effort of one guy (Ryan).  Simply put, if you remove Matt Ryan, Atlanta would still be putting up numbers.  That is not the case at all for Rodgers - you remove Rodgers and GB goes down the toilet.  Remember, it is Most Valuable Player, not Most Valuable Team.




 

Matt Schaub would not put up the #'s Matt Ryan has, no way. Falcons would definitely not be NFC South champs with Schaub at the helm.

 

[Bucsfan5493]

Carr's receivers led the NFL in drops, and the team led the NFL in penalties. Those are two league leading stats that are not great for a QB.  

The Raiders weren't passing alot because their defense was bad, they were passing a lot because they were constantly in 1st and long, and 2nd and long situations because of penalties.  Crabtree wasn't considered 'very good' until Carr got hold of him.  They signed him as a free agent for peanuts.  

I would vote for Ryan as well, but skill position wise he has Freeman/Coleman and Julio/Sanu/Gabriel.  Ryan's supporting cast is not a negative at all.  it's not worth arguing where supporting cast ranks, but this isn't the Browns or 49ers here, he has very good talent around him.  

Ryan, Rodgers, Carr, Brady all have good talent around them, enough to say that they are not at a disadvantage (No GB running game being a notable exception).  Ryan has had the best statistical year, I think it should probably go to him or Zeke.  

Fair, the penalties and drops are legitimate concerns. That would make sense as to why he is throwing more too, I remember your game against us where you set the record for penalties in a game lol.

In regards to Crabtree, I definitely think he was considered a good receiver in SF. In fact, he had the best season of his career there in 2012. He also was a top 10 pick and had at least least 600 yards in every season there so it's not like he was some scrub. I think he's pretty clearly one of the best WR2's in the NFL. A hell of a lot better than Gabriel and Sanu, that's for sure.

Again, I'm not saying Ryan's supporting cast was bad, just saying it isn't on the same level as some of these other QB's who are competing for MVP. Add in the fact that his numbers are the best as well, and I don't know how it could really go to anyone else.

 

[SoBeDad]

Aaron Rodgers ran for more first downs than Prescott, Luck and Mariotta. He also ran for 4 TDs. And he's played well down the stretch against some good defenses. He'll be the MVP, barring a  bad game against the Lions. 

 

[skinsrule05]

I am not sure who I would vote for between Brady and Rodgers, but both are clearly the MVPs of their respective teams and without them their respective teams would be pedestrian without them at the helm.  

I disagree, we had a good indication of where the patriots would be without him. They would be a 12 win team. So he helped them get one more win. 

As far as for the season I think it is Ryan by a landslide. However, if the voters do put more value on late season performance like some have said then Rodgers is right there with him. 

 

[Anarchy99]

People are stuck on "valuable." They should just call it the offensive player on the best team of the year award. 

 

[voiceofunreason]

Still the Dallas line. Below average defense, rookie qb, rookie rb, Dez hurt for a month and they cruised to homefield advantage in the playoffs. Prescott or Elliot as the MVP is a joke. 10 other guys at their position could have easily stepped right now.

For one guy, probably Matt Ryan.

 

[bostonfred]

This year's mvp will have more to do with the voters than the players. There are people who won't vote for brady for a number of reasons. Twelve games played, the deflation, sick of him, etc There are other people who will vote for him as a lifetime achievement award, or because he led the best team, or because he just played great.

There are people who will vote rodgers because he got hot at the end of the year, because he willed the packers to wins, because he had awesome fantasy numbers. There are others who will hold his mediocre early season numbers against him and because his team is a borderline playoff contender.

There are people who will vote ryan because of his efficiency numbers and the team's turnaround. But a lot of that is the offensive line, julio and the running backs, and they're not really one of the top teams 

There are people who will vote for elliott because of the turnaround the cowboys made this year and his possible rookie record. There are others who would rather vote a qb, or who think he's rookie of the year not mvp or who think he might not be the mvp on his own team.

All of them have a decent case. I wouldn't be surprised to see a tie.

 

[Anarchy99]

All of them have a decent case. I wouldn't be surprised to see a tie.

I'm surprised there haven't been more ties over the years. There are 50 votes. That's it. No 1st-2nd-3rd place votes, etc. Voters pick one player and that's it (although people might be able to allocate half a vote to PLAYER A and half to PLAYER B, but I'm not sure on that one).

 

[menobrown]

People are stuck on "valuable." They should just call it the offensive player on the best team of the year award. 

MVP just sounds a lot better than biggest contributor to contending team or player contending team could have least afforded to lose but that's really the two criteria for this award.

I've always thought Dak and Elliot would cut into each others votes, Brady will get "punished" for missing 4 games and team doing fine without him. Rodgers and Ryan I have as 1 and 2 in voting but Ryan has been more consistent all season and if they get seed #2 I think Ryan takes it. He is the QB on the current #2 seed of a team that averages over 4 points a game more than the next closest team, I think an all-time top 10 scoring team year.

 

[ZWK]

Rodgers has been great lately, but the MVP voting should not be ignoring the first third of the season. Here's what people were saying about Rodgers in mid-October:

Rodgers' numbers are already incredible from a career standpoint, but it's clear that he isn't the QB he was two years ago.  Forget the numbers (which aren't as good), watch him play. He just isn't the awesome QB on a regular basis like he used to be. 

Adam RankVerified account ‏@adamrank 48m48 minutes ago

It's pretty cool of Aaron Rodgers to honor Brett Favre by playing like Favre in his final years.

I've been saying this since last fall.  It wasn't because of jordy being gone.  I don't know the cause but he's basically the tiger woods of football.  Totally lost his mojo.  Yes, one good first half this year.  Not the same guy anymore. 

His mechanics are awful. Not even stepping into his throws in the most clean of pockets.  It may be loss of mojo...or maybe a degenerative knde condition.  Who knows for sure but it is painfully clear he is not the same guy as 2014 and prior.

I thought this was a pretty good breakdown of what's wrong with Rodgers

From today's Milwaukee Journal Sentinel

Why can't it be both?  I hate McCarthy and agree that Rodgers has made him look much smarter than he really is.  Having said that Rodgers is off.  McCarthy didn't cause Rodgers to miss a wide open Randall Cobb in the end zone tonight.  He didn't cause Rodgers to throw a terrible interception.  Rodgers just isn't playing up to par and McCarthy sucks.

 

[skinsrule05]

Rodgers has been great lately, but the MVP voting should not be ignoring the first third of the season. Here's what people were saying about Rodgers in mid-October:

I agree with this. I don't think the end of season should mean any more then the beginning.  So that should cut out Rodgers and Brady. With them out I don't see anyone that can challenge Ryan. 

 

[MaxThreshold]

Yep, people seem to forget that too. The Raiders o-line is amazing as well, which is part of the reason why I never considered Carr as a serious candidate to win it, although I was fine with him being in the discussion. 

I think MVP has to be Ryan. He's leading probably the best offense in the league this year, and is doing it without insane talent around him. Sure, Julio is great but even he has been kind of streaky and missed a few games this year with his injuries. His o-line is solid but nothing that special and the rest of his weapons aren't that great. Definitely would say he is the most VALUABLE to his team.

If the Cardinals had a better record and could make the playoffs, then David Johnson would be in the top 3 for me.

Wait...what?  Are you serious?  That's ridiculous.  Julio Jones, Devante Freeman and Tevin Coleman are all extremely talented.  It's an embarrassment of riches, in fact.

 

[MaxThreshold]

Matt Schaub would not put up the #'s Matt Ryan has, no way. Falcons would definitely not be NFC South champs with Schaub at the helm.

Sorry, but Julio, Freeman and coleman still put the Falcons in the pole position.  It's not just Ryan.

 

[Bucsfan5493]

Wait...what?  Are you serious?  That's ridiculous.  Julio Jones, Devante Freeman and Tevin Coleman are all extremely talented.  It's an embarrassment of riches, in fact.

So, 2 good running backs and an elite receiver who has been hurt/up and down all season. Compared to guys like Carr, Dak and Rodgers, that really isn't a ton. Ryan doesn't get to sit in the pocket all day like those three do which makes a huge difference. I'd say offensive line and pass protection is the most important thing and Ryan's isn't anything special.

 

[FUBAR]

Rodgers played like dog #### more than half the season. He's not getting it. 

It's funny how memory works.  I recall thinking he's lost something but looking back, statistically, he only had a couple bad games.  He hasn't thrown an interception since week 10, and hasn't had a really bad game against the 6 playoff teams he's faced (although his game against the Giants was not good).

Eta: and I do think late season play plus performance against good teams matter more than early season play. But that might just be the college fan view. 

 

[Workhorse]

Ryan is having a historically great season by any objective standard. He's the clear MVP in my mind.

 

[massraider]

Ryan is having a historically great season by any objective standard. He's the clear MVP in my mind.

Exactly.

Rodgers is having a nice eason.  Great.  Not as good as Ryan, and his team might not make the playoffs.  

Brady only leads Ryan in the statistical category of media fellatio.  

Albert Breer on his podcast said that Brady should win the MVP because the Pats traded Collins and Jones.  

 

[Sabertooth]

Depends how you look at it.  Rodgers has 40 touchdowns all purpose (36 passing).  Isn't that the point of offense?  Score touchdowns?  He has almost 20% more touchdowns than Ryan.  Ryan has been efficient sure.  But his weapons are much stronger right one down the line.  

Rodgers all day.  

 

[Anarchy99]

Depends how you look at it.  Rodgers has 40 touchdowns all purpose (36 passing).  Isn't that the point of offense?  Score touchdowns?  He has almost 20% more touchdowns than Ryan.  Ryan has been efficient sure.  But his weapons are much stronger right one down the line.  

Rodgers all day.  

Isn't the point to win games?

 

[Sabertooth]

Isn't the point to win games?

No.  That's what the playoff structure is for.  You win games to get into the playoffs.  The MVP is the most valuable player.  Its an individual award.  Which goes to the best player.  Which is quite obviously Aaron Rodgers because he doesn't ####### cheat so he doesn't get suspended.   

 

[Anarchy99]

No.  That's what the playoff structure is for.  You win games to get into the playoffs.  The MVP is the most valuable player.  Its an individual award.  

Years and years of MVP balloting would disagree with you. There is very little to the "most valuable" part in the voting.

Like it or not, how good the team is (and the team W-L record) has a huge impact on the voting. That's just how it is. People can dance around that as much as they want, but the voting HAS NOT focused on what a team's record might have been if PLAYER X wasn't playing.

I concur with many others that is SHOULDN'T be like that, but it doesn't change the fact that that's how it is.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

I wonder how the other MVP candidates would do playing with Brady's current group of skill players. 

 

[Hawkeye21]

I wonder how the other MVP candidates would do playing with Brady's current group of skill players. 

In that system?  I'm going to say they would do very well.

 

[FUBAR]

In that system?  I'm going to say they would do very well.

Yep, if the others get his supporting cast they also get the coaching staff. 

 

[Hawkeye21]

I don't understand why it's so terrible having Gronk, Edelman, Bennett, Lewis and Blount as weapons to use.  Some here make it seem like those guys wouldn't even start on other teams.  If Stafford or Ryan were in NE's system they would be thriving.

 

[bostonfred]

Brady probably runs for more yards than elliott behind that o line, too, if he was in that system!

Is that how this works?

 

[Anarchy99]

I don't understand why it's so terrible having Gronk, Edelman, Bennett, Lewis and Blount as weapons to use.  Some here make it seem like those guys wouldn't even start on other teams.  If Stafford or Ryan were in NE's system they would be thriving.

Gronk was pretty good those four weeks this year. Lewis missed over half the season and Bennett has been playing on one ankle for most of the year. 

There was no Jody Nelson or Julio Jones for Brady this year. All this doesn't mean Brady should be the MVP, but at some point he deserves some credit. People want to knock him for having good coaching and a solid defense, but he has no control over that. 

Where were people years ago when the Niners had the best offense, the best defense, the best coaching, the best WR to ever play, and a dual threat RB. I don't remember people saying Montana had it easy. 

 

[Hawkeye21]

Gronk was pretty good those four weeks this year. Lewis missed over half the season and Bennett has been playing on one ankle for most of the year. 

There was no Jody Nelson or Julio Jones for Brady this year. All this doesn't mean Brady should be the MVP, but at some point he deserves some credit. People want to knock him for having good coaching and a solid defense, but he has no control over that. 

Where were people years ago when the Niners had the best offense, the best defense, the best coaching, the best WR to ever play, and a dual threat RB. I don't remember people saying Montana had it easy. 

I don't think people are knocking him in saying he's not that great, I think they are just saying that it's not a reason to be named the MVP.  I don't think anyone will deny the talent that Brady has because we've all seen it year after year.  I just can't get over the fact that I've seen back up QBs come in for Brady and still continue to win which tells me NE has a great system in place and knows how to game plan regardless of who their QB is.

My final conclusion is that Brady is still a great QB and he had a good season but he is not the league MVP this year.

 

[STEADYMOBBIN 22]

I'm obviously biased but I think all this talk that it's a forgone conclusion it's only between Brady and Rodgers discounts what might be a 14-2 season for Dak and Zeke. I'd like to see co-mvps between the two. 

Point is, I'm not sure it's a two man race between Brady and Rodgers. 

 

[bostonfred]

Exactly.

Rodgers is having a nice eason.  Great.  Not as good as Ryan, and his team might not make the playoffs.  

Brady only leads Ryan in the statistical category of media fellatio.  

Albert Breer on his podcast said that Brady should win the MVP because the Pats traded Collins and Jones.  

It's not just the media "fellating" him. There is a real, intangible value to Brady just being Tom Brady and playing well.

If almost any other team had their star qb out for 4 games, traded away two of their best defensive players during the season, and lost their second best offensive player for the season, the team might have folded. The Patriots didn't, in part because they know that any year Tom Brady plays is a year the Patriots are going to compete for a title.

I don't mean that they say "we intend to compete". I mean they are one win away from playing in their sixth afc championship game in a row and two wins from playing in their third Superbowl in six years. 

Of course Belichick is a huge part of that. And of course there are other good players on the Patriots. But there really is something unique about having the winningest qb in history playing at an mvp candidate level. It is a big part of the reason the Patriots can overcome adversity. I get that you'll never give him credit for that, for whatever reason, just like Red Sox fans used to call Jeter captain intangible sarcastically for a long time. It's just how fandom works. But it doesn't diminish Albert Breer's credibility on football to say that Brady leading this team to a bye and likely afccg appearance is a big positive on his mvp resume.

 

[Deamon]

I'm obviously biased but I think all this talk that it's a forgone conclusion it's only between Brady and Rodgers discounts what might be a 14-2 season for Dak and Zeke. I'd like to see co-mvps between the two. 

Point is, I'm not sure it's a two man race between Brady and Rodgers. 

It's not a two man race.  Matt Ryan is very much in the conversation.

 

[FUBAR]

Gronk was pretty good those four weeks this year. Lewis missed over half the season and Bennett has been playing on one ankle for most of the year. 

There was no Jody Nelson or Julio Jones for Brady this year. All this doesn't mean Brady should be the MVP, but at some point he deserves some credit. People want to knock him for having good coaching and a solid defense, but he has no control over that. 

Where were people years ago when the Niners had the best offense, the best defense, the best coaching, the best WR to ever play, and a dual threat RB. I don't remember people saying Montana had it easy.

Joe was only mvp twice and all pro 3x in 13 years as a 49er.

 

[massraider]

It's not just the media "fellating" him. There is a real, intangible value to Brady just being Tom Brady and playing well.

If almost any other team had their star qb out for 4 games, traded away two of their best defensive players during the season, and lost their second best offensive player for the season, the team might have folded. The Patriots didn't, in part because they know that any year Tom Brady plays is a year the Patriots are going to compete for a title.

I don't mean that they say "we intend to compete". I mean they are one win away from playing in their sixth afc championship game in a row and two wins from playing in their third Superbowl in six years. 

Of course Belichick is a huge part of that. And of course there are other good players on the Patriots. But there really is something unique about having the winningest qb in history playing at an mvp candidate level. It is a big part of the reason the Patriots can overcome adversity. I get that you'll never give him credit for that, for whatever reason, just like Red Sox fans used to call Jeter captain intangible sarcastically for a long time. It's just how fandom works. But it doesn't diminish Albert Breer's credibility on football to say that Brady leading this team to a bye and likely afccg appearance is a big positive on his mvp resume.

They don't hand out awards based on intangibles.  

That's as simple as I can make it.  Tom doesn't get some lifetime acheivement award for this year because no one else had an all-time, never before acheived season.  That's stupid.  

If you want to give Tom credit for the entire team overcoming the advrsity that the team gave itself, simply because of his mere presence, that's cool.  Completely un-provable and irrelevant to an MVP discussiopn, but cool.  

So Jimmy Garappolo's numbers for 2 games, while apparently worthy of a 1st round pick in trade, are partially due to the fact that Jimmy knew Tom Brady would come back, someday, and they would be fine?  Well, that is certainly impressive.  

The moving of the goal posts is hilarious, in general:

Jamie Collins is amazing.  [Pats trade Jamie Collins]  ''Meh, he really isn't that good, he is freelancing too much..''  [Comes time to discuss Brady's MVP candidacy]  ''How did the Pats overcome this adversity???''

By the way, when you trade a player away, that's not adversity.  A bunch of offensive linemen getting injured, a coach dying, that's adversity.  

 

[bostonfred]

I'm obviously biased but I thik all this talk that it's a forgone conclusion it's only between Brady and Rodgers discounts what might be a 14-2 season for Dak and Zeke. I'd like to see co-mvps between the two. 

Point is, I'm not sure it's a two man race between Brady and Rodgers. 

Zeke definitely belongs in the conversation.  He's had a phenomenal year. Hard to make a case for dak over the other qbs if you can't make a case for him as the standalone mvp.

It really comes down to brady, zeke, rodgers and ryan. They all have arguments for and against, and it will be more about how each voter prioritizes things than any kind of consensus