Why no love for Flacco? (1 Viewer)

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

I am hearing a lot of talk about Kevin Kolb, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan and Palmer having potential top 10 years, but why no love for Flacco? Flacco has improved weapons with the additions of Boldin, Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon. He has a young solid offensive line that was starting to gel at the end of the 2009 season. Joe is also heading his 3rd year where we often see a huge step forward for young QB's. Last year Flacco had 21 TD's to only 12 INT's and I expect another huge progression in 2010, with a celing of 30 TD's.....which would take him easily into the top 10 ranks. Again, why no love for Flacco?? I see nothing but upside.....as much upside as Kolb, Manning, Ryan, and Palmer.

 

[zed2283]

I'm in. Been trying to trade for him in my dynasty league.

 

[identikit]

IIRC most Flacco discussion has been pretty negative on the Audibles I've listened to, going back to before his rookie draft.

FWIW, he's pretty much outperformed what I've heard(Audible-wise).

 

[The Real Hipster Doofus]

I don't think Flacco is all that talented in comparison to other QBs ranked around him. I expect him to improve his numbers again this year, but I think his upside is still a low QB1. Could be a good value in redraft, but there are a lot of good young dynasty QBs in his same range.

 

[baconisgood]

I am hearing a lot of talk about Kevin Kolb, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan and Palmer having potential top 10 years, but why no love for Flacco? Flacco has improved weapons with the additions of Boldin, Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon. He has a young solid offensive line that was starting to gel at the end of the 2009 season. Joe is also heading his 3rd year where we often see a huge step forward for young QB's. Last year Flacco had 21 TD's to only 12 INT's and I expect another huge progression in 2010, with a celing of 30 TD's.....which would take him easily into the top 10 ranks. Again, why no love for Flacco?? I see nothing but upside.....as much upside as Kolb, Manning, Ryan, and Palmer.

Stallworth is a flier addition- he missed a year of football, struggled hugely his last season with the Browns, and put up pretty weak numbers with a record breaking offense in NE. Rookie TEs don't often add much to the passing game- maybe in a year or two we can start talking about them impacting things in the passing game. Boldin is a nice acquisition.Eli put up 4100 and 27 last season- is reasonably young himself and has 3 young and talented receivers. Saying that Flacco has as much upside as Manning this year is ignoring Manning's positives. Kolb is an unknown but McNabb has been on a 3800+ yard pace for six straight years in that offense and their top 3 receiving options are very young and could improve. He is in about as good a situation as any QB in the league (not named Brees or Peyton) this year. Palmer has already thrown for 4000 yards twice and broken 30 TDs once. A return to form with solid weapons this year could mean big things.Flacco's offense has a running game that is effective everywhere on the field, would you take the #5 in rushing yards, #4 in y/c and t#1 in rushing TDs and turn that rushing offense into a primarily passing one? Or would you use your passing attack to compliment it?

 

[massraider]

I am hearing a lot of talk about Kevin Kolb, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan and Palmer having potential top 10 years, but why no love for Flacco? Flacco has improved weapons with the additions of Boldin, Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon. He has a young solid offensive line that was starting to gel at the end of the 2009 season. Joe is also heading his 3rd year where we often see a huge step forward for young QB's. Last year Flacco had 21 TD's to only 12 INT's and I expect another huge progression in 2010, with a celing of 30 TD's.....which would take him easily into the top 10 ranks. Again, why no love for Flacco?? I see nothing but upside.....as much upside as Kolb, Manning, Ryan, and Palmer.

You should be terribly excited then. With expectations like that, you should be able to get Flacco in every league you are in. He has an improved weapon in Boldin, no doubt, but why are Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon an improvement? No one knows if they can play at all, and even if they can, counting on mid-round rookie TEs isn't usually a wise fantasy strategy. And what if Mason is done? He's 36 now, I think? I like Flacco, and identikit is right, if you listen to the Audible, you would have thought he was undraftable. But really, it's more likely, to me, that he is a good NFL QB, but not a great fantasy QB. I don't think the Ravens want to put it in the air as much as would be required to flirt with 30 TDs. With that running game and defense, why risk it?

 

[baconisgood]

I like Flacco, and identikit is right, if you listen to the Audible, you would have thought he was undraftable

Flacco looks to be pretty undraftable where he is going right now. He is going a full round higher than Eli who had 400 yards and 6 TDs more than he did last year and he is going 3+ rounds higher than Stafford who's 10 games in 2010 pro rate to better stats than Flacco's 2nd year and also has improved weapons over last year. The problem with Flacco is that there are easily 5 or 6 guys being drafted behind him who have a solid chance to outproduce him. How many players of those ahead of him is Flacco going to out produce? Farve, Kolb, Schaub, Romo, Peyton, Brady, Rodgers, Ryan and Cutler are those with a higher ADP in redraft leagues. I would personally take him over Ryan but otherwise I don't see him as being a better 1 year bet.

 

[FreeBaGeL]

I am hearing a lot of talk about Kevin Kolb, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan and Palmer having potential top 10 years, but why no love for Flacco? Flacco has improved weapons with the additions of Boldin, Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon. He has a young solid offensive line that was starting to gel at the end of the 2009 season. Joe is also heading his 3rd year where we often see a huge step forward for young QB's. Last year Flacco had 21 TD's to only 12 INT's and I expect another huge progression in 2010, with a celing of 30 TD's.....which would take him easily into the top 10 ranks. Again, why no love for Flacco?? I see nothing but upside.....as much upside as Kolb, Manning, Ryan, and Palmer.

I'm not sure what you're looking for here. Flacco is ranked ahead of Palmer and basically even with Kolb/Ryan in the staffer's rankings.The only guy that you mentioned that Flacco is actually ranked behind is Manning, who just last season put up numbers that you yourself said you considered to be Flacco's ceiling.

 

[massraider]

I like Flacco, and identikit is right, if you listen to the Audible, you would have thought he was undraftable

Flacco looks to be pretty undraftable where he is going right now. He is going a full round higher than Eli who had 400 yards and 6 TDs more than he did last year and he is going 3+ rounds higher than Stafford who's 10 games in 2010 pro rate to better stats than Flacco's 2nd year and also has improved weapons over last year. The problem with Flacco is that there are easily 5 or 6 guys being drafted behind him who have a solid chance to outproduce him. How many players of those ahead of him is Flacco going to out produce? Farve, Kolb, Schaub, Romo, Peyton, Brady, Rodgers, Ryan and Cutler are those with a higher ADP in redraft leagues. I would personally take him over Ryan but otherwise I don't see him as being a better 1 year bet.

I agree, I was referring to Flacco coming out of college.I'd actually take Ryan over him as well.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

Everyone acts like Flacco has been around the league for a very long time. It was his 2nd year for cripes sacks! He improved last season and I expect him to improve this season for the above reasons. I think Flacco has a concensus ranking of #14 out of QB's, which I agree with coming into the year....but he has every bit as much upside as Ryan, Stafford (who FFG's are all over), Palmer, Kolb,.....and all the other guys ranked around him. I hear no mention that Flacco can make the next jump, which is kind of unfair. 21 TD's and 12 INT's for a 2nd year QB very respectable.

Let's look at the numbers for a few other QB's in their sophomore season's:

Peyton Manning: 4,135 yards, 26 TD's, 15 INT's

Eli Manning: 3,763, 24 TD's, 17 INT's

Carson Palmer: 2,897, 18 TD's, 18 INT's (13 games played)

Matt Ryan: 2,916, 22 TD's, 14 INT's

Jay Cutler: 3,497, 20 TD's, 14 INT's

Joe Flacco: 3,613, 21 TID's, 12 INT's

Other guys didn't play much or develop until long after their 2nd season: Rivers, Brees, Romo, Schuab, Brady. These guys were able to sit back and mature....but if they had played their numbers would have been much like Flacco's 2nd year numbers.

Given that Flacco was thrown to the wolves so to speak right out of college, I think he as adjusted well with really no WR's options around him. He's right there with Eli's 2nd year numbers and not too far from what Peyton's did his sophomore year.

Sigmund actually has McNabb, Eli, Kolb, Stafford, Palmer, and Ryan all rated ahead of Flacco. Sure you can make an argument for all of the above, but Joe will finish ahead of at least 3 of these 5 this year. Mark it down.

 

[Sinrman]

I absolutely see Flacco having a great year. The Ravens appear to me to run the ball a bit more, but I could see him turning into the next Aaron Rodgers. He has all the tools and weapons that Rodgers has...

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

I am hearing a lot of talk about Kevin Kolb, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan and Palmer having potential top 10 years, but why no love for Flacco? Flacco has improved weapons with the additions of Boldin, Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon. He has a young solid offensive line that was starting to gel at the end of the 2009 season. Joe is also heading his 3rd year where we often see a huge step forward for young QB's. Last year Flacco had 21 TD's to only 12 INT's and I expect another huge progression in 2010, with a celing of 30 TD's.....which would take him easily into the top 10 ranks. Again, why no love for Flacco?? I see nothing but upside.....as much upside as Kolb, Manning, Ryan, and Palmer.

Stallworth is a flier addition- he missed a year of football, struggled hugely his last season with the Browns, and put up pretty weak numbers with a record breaking offense in NE. Rookie TEs don't often add much to the passing game- maybe in a year or two we can start talking about them impacting things in the passing game. Boldin is a nice acquisition.Eli put up 4100 and 27 last season- is reasonably young himself and has 3 young and talented receivers. Saying that Flacco has as much upside as Manning this year is ignoring Manning's positives. Kolb is an unknown but McNabb has been on a 3800+ yard pace for six straight years in that offense and their top 3 receiving options are very young and could improve. He is in about as good a situation as any QB in the league (not named Brees or Peyton) this year. Palmer has already thrown for 4000 yards twice and broken 30 TDs once. A return to form with solid weapons this year could mean big things.Flacco's offense has a running game that is effective everywhere on the field, would you take the #5 in rushing yards, #4 in y/c and t#1 in rushing TDs and turn that rushing offense into a primarily passing one? Or would you use your passing attack to compliment it?

Boldin, Mason, Stallworth (slot) >>>>>>>>>> Mason, Clayton, scrub in slot (Clayton, Williams). NOT EVEN CLOSE!!!Dixon/Pitta I was talking more long term.Eli Manning - it took him 6 years to finally come up with those numbers and I agree I like Eli more this coming season, but in dynasty I'd give Flacco the slight edge if you can wait on him. Flacco had just as good of a sophomore season as Eli did.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

QB: 2nd YEAR STATS => 3rd YEAR STATS

Peyton Manning: 4,135 , 26 TD, 15 INT => 4,413, 33 TD, 13 INT

Eli Manning: 3,763, 24 TD, 17 INT => 3,244, 24 TD,18 INT

Carson Palmer: 2,897, 18 TD's, 18 INT's (13 games) => 3,836, 33 TD, 12 INT

Matt Ryan: 2,916, 22 TD's, 14 INT's => ???

Jay Cutler: 3,497, 20 TD's, 14 INT's => 4,526, 25 TD’s, 18 INT’s

Joe Flacco: 3,613, 21 TID's, 12 INT's => ???

I predict 3,900 yards, 26 TD's, 15 INT....which isn't unreasonable and only a modest improvement on last season. This would easily land him in the top 10 for fantasy.

 

[treat88]

Flacco has already exceeded my expectations, but I remain skeptical about his ability to take that next step.

Maybe it is my preconceived perceptions in play, and I fully admit that, but when I watch him I see a one read, questionable short-mid range accuracy QB with poor pocket presence, especially when things are not going in his favor. Essentially a glorified Derek Anderson.

Cameron hides his deficiencies well as does his surrounding cast, but I believe Flacco is the limiting factor on that offense. I don't see the Ravens D allowing them to play with the lead regularly and I just don't think Flacco is up to the challenge of carrying them when opposing defenses know he has to move the offense through the air. Not because he is not ready, but because he lacks the talent both mentally and physically to do so. Now or ever.

That said, I understand that he has the opportunity to make statistical gains and freely admit I could be very wrong about him. If he does break out though, he won't do it on any of my teams as I'm not willing to invest in what I consider to be an average talent going at an above average price.

More power to those that believe and are willing to invest. Honestly, I hope the kid does prove me wrong. I think the Ravens have built a solid, classy organization, particularly now that Bart Scott has moved along.

 

[NorrisB]

Bloom had Brian Brohm over Flacco by a significant margin his rookie year and has continued to be down on Flacco ever since.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

I don't see the Ravens D allowing them to play with the lead regularly

That's one of the biggest pluses for Flacco from a fantasy standpoint. He's going to have to put up points for them to win. You can be a pretty mediocre QB and still put up decent fantasy stats with Boldin, Mason, Heap and Rice.

 

[Go deep]

Bloom had Brian Brohm over Flacco by a significant margin his rookie year and has continued to be down on Flacco ever since.

Bias is the biggest problem for even the best FF'ers. I watch it happen all the time on this board, and from some of the most respected posters.

 

[treat88]

I don't see the Ravens D allowing them to play with the lead regularly

That's one of the biggest pluses for Flacco from a fantasy standpoint. He's going to have to put up points for them to win. You can be a pretty mediocre QB and still put up decent fantasy stats with Boldin, Mason, Heap and Rice.

Generally I would agree.In Flacco's case, I think he will struggle.The situation may translate into improved yardage totals, but I think it will also translate into increased TO's and him taking a lot of punishment.

 

[treat88]

Bloom had Brian Brohm over Flacco by a significant margin his rookie year and has continued to be down on Flacco ever since.

Bias is the biggest problem for even the best FF'ers. I watch it happen all the time on this board, and from some of the most respected posters.

Bias affects all of us, no matter how objective we try to be.Sometimes the trick is just being able to recognize one's own bias's and rationally question them.

 

[NeverEnough]

I've been high on Flacco since he was drafted. Not sure why others are not. He is a talented QB. Is he Marino? No, but he's not a bust either.

I'd draft him without thinking twice.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

Bloom had Brian Brohm over Flacco by a significant margin his rookie year and has continued to be down on Flacco ever since.

Thus Bloom wants him to fail so he isn't wrong in his pre-NFL thoughts on him. Bloom you can't deny that Flacco has shown progression.....pretty impressive progression for just his first 2 seasons....with no real receiving weapons. In comes Boldin.....we shall see. I am not saying top 5, but top 10 is possible. I'd take him over Ryan, Stafford, Kolb, and maybe even Palmer.Bloom, I love you man. You were all over Ray Rice last year before anyone else was.....thanks to you I worked out a trade for Ray in my dynasty league.....but I think you are wrong on Flacco.

 

[Chase Stuart]

Bloom had Brian Brohm over Flacco by a significant margin his rookie year and has continued to be down on Flacco ever since.

Bias is the biggest problem for even the best FF'ers. I watch it happen all the time on this board, and from some of the most respected posters.

I don't recall what Bloom actually said about Flacco when he came out in the draft, but I don't think it's particularly relevant. For example, I was super high on Shonn Greene last season, and thought he was a very smart pick in dynasty leagues. But right now, I think he's overvalued. Just because I liked someone in June 2009 doesn't mean I like them in 2010, and vice versa. Every year a player needs to be reevaluated by each fantasy owners because each year a player's ADP and draft value changes. I didn't particularly love MJD when he came out, then I was super high on him the next year, and now I've sort of felt like he's being accurately valued. Every year you need to have a new evaluation, IMO.Now there are certain players you may be particularly high on every year (Steve Smith, CAR, is one for me) but I don't think that's got anything to do with bias. It just so happens that the reasons the fantasy community tends to downgrade or upgrade are player are reasons I reject, and they may repeat themselves over a course of a few years.

 

[Chase Stuart]

As for me and Flacco...

I like him, but think his upside is pretty limited. Sure, he could be top 10 if he starts 16 games and doesn't get injured, but there are over 20 QBs you could say that about. On a FP/G or FP/quarter basis, I don't think I'd put him in my top 15, and I'd be surprised (but not shocked) if he cracked the top 8.

 

[massraider]

Thus Bloom wants him to fail so he isn't wrong in his pre-NFL thoughts on him. Bloom you can't deny that Flacco has shown progression.....pretty impressive progression for just his first 2 seasons....with no real receiving weapons.

Gosh, Bloom said all this??????

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

I was not originally sold on Flacco, but I'm kind of excited for him in 2010. Boldin is awesome and Stallworth is a very talented WR, but we'll see how he does after a year off. Either way, third year starting and with improved weapons... he could be gold. But I'll tell you why I'm cautious and so should you be: last year's game log. He was averaging 279 yds/gm before the bye week with an 11/5 TD/INT ratio (thru 6 games). During the bye they seemed to have decided to change the game plan. Flacco started throwing less and Rice started running more (check out his splits - he could get 300 carries this year if they keep up that pace). In the last 10 games Flacco only averaged 194 yds/gm with a 10/6 TD/INT ratio. I think it is safe to expect a jump in numbers, but which numbers? Those two Flaccos were very different. They only went 3-3 thru those first six, but they probably should've gone 5-1 if you watched the games. It was enough to scare them into a new offensive philosophy, though. I think Flacco could explode this year, especially if the defense weakens any further and they have to lean on him. But given his soft stats after the bye week, I think we'd all be wise to think twice before extrapolating his last two years' stats into a monster 3rd year.

Point well taken. I had heard that Flacco injured his back before the bye, thus they scaled back on his passing......I don't know if this is true or not, but pre-injury (bye-week) he was solid. Post he wasn't startable, I agree.

 

[Go deep]

Bloom had Brian Brohm over Flacco by a significant margin his rookie year and has continued to be down on Flacco ever since.

Bias is the biggest problem for even the best FF'ers. I watch it happen all the time on this board, and from some of the most respected posters.

Bias affects all of us, no matter how objective we try to be.Sometimes the trick is just being able to recognize one's own bias's and rationally question them.

Yep, being able to stay unbiased is hard to do, but the better you do it, the better off your dynasty teams will be.

 

[ty247]

I was not originally sold on Flacco, but I'm kind of excited for him in 2010. Boldin is awesome and Stallworth is a very talented WR, but we'll see how he does after a year off. Either way, third year starting and with improved weapons... he could be gold. But I'll tell you why I'm cautious and so should you be: last year's game log. He was averaging 279 yds/gm before the bye week with an 11/5 TD/INT ratio (thru 6 games). During the bye they seemed to have decided to change the game plan. Flacco started throwing less and Rice started running more (check out his splits - he could get 300 carries this year if they keep up that pace). In the last 10 games Flacco only averaged 194 yds/gm with a 10/6 TD/INT ratio. I think it is safe to expect a jump in numbers, but which numbers? Those two Flaccos were very different. They only went 3-3 thru those first six, but they probably should've gone 5-1 if you watched the games. It was enough to scare them into a new offensive philosophy, though. I think Flacco could explode this year, especially if the defense weakens any further and they have to lean on him. But given his soft stats after the bye week, I think we'd all be wise to think twice before extrapolating his last two years' stats into a monster 3rd year.

Flacco was also dealing with a few injuries the last quarter of the season and into the playoffs. I can't recall the injury exactly but it was either his hip or his foot that he planted with, I believe it was his hip though.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

I was not originally sold on Flacco, but I'm kind of excited for him in 2010. Boldin is awesome and Stallworth is a very talented WR, but we'll see how he does after a year off. Either way, third year starting and with improved weapons... he could be gold. But I'll tell you why I'm cautious and so should you be: last year's game log. He was averaging 279 yds/gm before the bye week with an 11/5 TD/INT ratio (thru 6 games). During the bye they seemed to have decided to change the game plan. Flacco started throwing less and Rice started running more (check out his splits - he could get 300 carries this year if they keep up that pace). In the last 10 games Flacco only averaged 194 yds/gm with a 10/6 TD/INT ratio. I think it is safe to expect a jump in numbers, but which numbers? Those two Flaccos were very different. They only went 3-3 thru those first six, but they probably should've gone 5-1 if you watched the games. It was enough to scare them into a new offensive philosophy, though. I think Flacco could explode this year, especially if the defense weakens any further and they have to lean on him. But given his soft stats after the bye week, I think we'd all be wise to think twice before extrapolating his last two years' stats into a monster 3rd year.

Flacco was also dealing with a few injuries the last quarter of the season and into the playoffs. I can't recall the injury exactly but it was either his hip or his foot that he planted with, I believe it was his hip though.

Yes, that is what it was, his hip! His production did take a hit after that injury.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

Bloom has Flacco rated as the 21st QB in dynasty leagues. That is absolutely absurd! 11 or 12 seems about more like it. Sigmund.....Vince Young infront of Joe?? Really Sigmund?? Geez! You have got to be kidding me!

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...p;howrecent=200

 

[Team ROFLCOPTERS]

I don't see the Ravens D allowing them to play with the lead regularly

That's one of the biggest pluses for Flacco from a fantasy standpoint. He's going to have to put up points for them to win. You can be a pretty mediocre QB and still put up decent fantasy stats with Boldin, Mason, Heap and Rice.

Generally I would agree.In Flacco's case, I think he will struggle.The situation may translate into improved yardage totals, but I think it will also translate into increased TO's and him taking a lot of punishment.

You keep saying this but until he's in the situation you can't get a real read on that. You really have not brought up anything that supports your thoughts except voicing your opinion... which I respect. Your Derek Anderson comparison is as far off as you can get. Flacco is a very smart qb that doesn't take the same risks. Flacco's ability to read defenses are amongst his best qualities whereas Anderson admittedly struggles with db recognition.

 

[treat88]

I don't see the Ravens D allowing them to play with the lead regularly

That's one of the biggest pluses for Flacco from a fantasy standpoint. He's going to have to put up points for them to win. You can be a pretty mediocre QB and still put up decent fantasy stats with Boldin, Mason, Heap and Rice.

Generally I would agree.In Flacco's case, I think he will struggle.The situation may translate into improved yardage totals, but I think it will also translate into increased TO's and him taking a lot of punishment.

You keep saying this but until he's in the situation you can't get a real read on that. You really have not brought up anything that supports your thoughts except voicing your opinion... which I respect. Your Derek Anderson comparison is as far off as you can get. Flacco is a very smart qb that doesn't take the same risks. Flacco's ability to read defenses are amongst his best qualities whereas Anderson admittedly struggles with db recognition.

Fair enough. Our opinions differ. You see things in Flacco that I don't. For the time being, I'll stand by the DA comparison until he does something to disprove my take.I'm not sure what you want to hear that would support my projection....? I don't get how saying he is smart and can read defenses supports your take while saying he lacks intermediate accuracy and pocket presence doesn't support mine.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

I am hearing a lot of talk about Kevin Kolb, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan and Palmer having potential top 10 years, but why no love for Flacco? Flacco has improved weapons with the additions of Boldin, Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon. He has a young solid offensive line that was starting to gel at the end of the 2009 season. Joe is also heading his 3rd year where we often see a huge step forward for young QB's. Last year Flacco had 21 TD's to only 12 INT's and I expect another huge progression in 2010, with a celing of 30 TD's.....which would take him easily into the top 10 ranks. Again, why no love for Flacco?? I see nothing but upside.....as much upside as Kolb, Manning, Ryan, and Palmer.

I think you and others are drastically overestimating the possible numbers Flacco could put up this year. Cam Cameron's offense is not geared around throwing the ball all over the place like some teams. Cameron's QBs have never hit even 3700 yards and only once has a Cameron QB had 25 or more TDs. That was Drew Brees and he had something Flacco doesn't: a big time red zone target in Antonio Gates. Brees is also one of the most accurate QBs I have ever seen and Flacco's accuracy is average at best. Also, look at how the Ravens used Ray Rice last year. For the most part, Rice was not the featured back full time until week 7. Take a look at the numbers below, comparing weeks 1-6 and weeks 8-17 (week 7 was their bye). Weeks 1-6:Ray Rice had 73 carries, an average of 12 per game. Joe Flacco had 225 pass attempts, an average of 37.5 per gameFlacco had 1674 passing yards for an average of 279Weeks 8-17:Rice had 181 carries for an average of 18 per gameFlacco had 274 pass attempts for an average of 27 per gameFlacco had 1939 passing yards for an average of 194 per gameFlacco also had 11 TDs in the first 6 games and 10 in the last 10Basically, when Ray Rice emerged, Flacco's numbers went down and it was significant. I'm not saying his 2010 numbers will be as low as the last 10 games of 2009, but expecting really big numbers is too optimistic for me. The main reason is Cameron's offense is not one that throws the ball all over the field. I think Flacco could improve a bit on last year, but he also could have a better season football wise and have stats similar or perhaps a bit lower than last year. The thing I fail to see is this huge upside that I have seen in this thread. The offense and play calling limit what Flacco can do. This is a team dominated by defense and ball control and as long as that is the case, I don't see Flacco putting up anything higher than mid to upper QB2 numbers.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

I absolutely see Flacco having a great year. The Ravens appear to me to run the ball a bit more, but I could see him turning into the next Aaron Rodgers. He has all the tools and weapons that Rodgers has...

I disagree with this. Rodgers is much more accurate than Flacco (in short, medium and deep zones), he has more escapability, and plays in a QB-friendly offense. Flacco plays in an offense dominated by the RBs and that has been ignored a lot in this thread. Rodgers also has Jennings, who has averaged over 16 yards per reception in each of the last 3 years and is a big play waiting to happen. Flacco lacks a player like that. I'm not saying Flacco can't put up solid numbers, but I don't think there is anything similar between him and Rodgers.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

Bloom has Flacco rated as the 21st QB in dynasty leagues. That is absolutely absurd! 11 or 12 seems about more like it. Sigmund.....Vince Young infront of Joe?? Really Sigmund?? Geez! You have got to be kidding me!

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...p;howrecent=200

I fail to see why that is so outlandish. In the weeks that Vince Young started, he was QB12. His running ability makes a big difference in fantasy scoring. Not everyone thinks of Flacco as a top 12 QB. I personally think ranking him as high as QB12 is more absurd than ranking him lower than QB20. But that is just my opinion. I am not seeing the upside here and am not overwhelmed with Flacco's talent. In dynasty, I have Rodgers, Brees, Manning, Romo, Rivers, Brady, Schaub, Roethlisberger, Stafford, Ryan, Kolb, and Cutler in the top 12. In my tiers, there is a decent drop after these QBs and there is no chance I would rank Flacco in this group.

The next group is Eli Manning, Bradford, McNabb, Henne, Young, Flacco, Palmer, and Sanchez. To me, Flacco's upside is the upper part of this tier which is QB13. I have him as QB18 right now. I know some will disagree and that's fine, but I fail to see why Flacco should be a QB1. Just saying a QB will improve from year 2 to year 3 is not enough because Flacco could play much better from a game perspective and not put up bigger numbers. That is what i am expecting and a big reason is the way the Ravens play. The offense limits Flacco in my opinion and I don't see that changing anytime soon. If the coaching situation was not this stable, I may think differently, but the fact is this coaching staff and its philosophy isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

 

[Uruk-Hai]

Cameron hides his deficiencies well as does his surrounding cast, but I believe Flacco is the limiting factor on that offense.

There are those here in Baltimore who think it's just the opposite - that Cameron held Flacco back, that he should've turned him loose a little more. I think it's a combination of the two - there are some throws that Flacco struggled with (& the hip injury certainly didn't help his progression) and that Cam was maybe a little too cautious. I also think that Flacco is a bright guy & he rarely makes the same mistakes over and over. He's also got a cannon for an arm and is a little more mobile than some seem to think. We'll see.

From a fan's perspective, I'm not so much concerned with how much his numbers increase. I want to see him lead. The players say all the right things about his potential to do so, but this is the year where he has to do it on the field.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

Bloom has Flacco rated as the 21st QB in dynasty leagues. That is absolutely absurd! 11 or 12 seems about more like it. Sigmund.....Vince Young infront of Joe?? Really Sigmund?? Geez! You have got to be kidding me!

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...p;howrecent=200

I fail to see why that is so outlandish. In the weeks that Vince Young started, he was QB12. His running ability makes a big difference in fantasy scoring. Not everyone thinks of Flacco as a top 12 QB. I personally think ranking him as high as QB12 is more absurd than ranking him lower than QB20. But that is just my opinion. I am not seeing the upside here and am not overwhelmed with Flacco's talent.

The big deal is, have you seen Vince Young throw? If you compare Young to Flacco there is no comparison in passing ability. Young created his fantasy points last year with smoke and mirrors.....many broken plays. Trust me I watched.....I do have NFL Sunday Ticket, so this isn't just an attempt to make things up. Vince Young seems like a good leader, I'll give him that....but pure passing skills and making the right reads.....no, Vince doesn't have that.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

I am hearing a lot of talk about Kevin Kolb, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan and Palmer having potential top 10 years, but why no love for Flacco? Flacco has improved weapons with the additions of Boldin, Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon. He has a young solid offensive line that was starting to gel at the end of the 2009 season. Joe is also heading his 3rd year where we often see a huge step forward for young QB's. Last year Flacco had 21 TD's to only 12 INT's and I expect another huge progression in 2010, with a celing of 30 TD's.....which would take him easily into the top 10 ranks. Again, why no love for Flacco?? I see nothing but upside.....as much upside as Kolb, Manning, Ryan, and Palmer.

I think you and others are drastically overestimating the possible numbers Flacco could put up this year. Cam Cameron's offense is not geared around throwing the ball all over the place like some teams. Cameron's QBs have never hit even 3700 yards and only once has a Cameron QB had 25 or more TDs. That was Drew Brees and he had something Flacco doesn't: a big time red zone target in Antonio Gates. Brees is also one of the most accurate QBs I have ever seen and Flacco's accuracy is average at best. Also, look at how the Ravens used Ray Rice last year. For the most part, Rice was not the featured back full time until week 7. Take a look at the numbers below, comparing weeks 1-6 and weeks 8-17 (week 7 was their bye). Weeks 1-6:Ray Rice had 73 carries, an average of 12 per game. Joe Flacco had 225 pass attempts, an average of 37.5 per gameFlacco had 1674 passing yards for an average of 279Weeks 8-17:Rice had 181 carries for an average of 18 per gameFlacco had 274 pass attempts for an average of 27 per gameFlacco had 1939 passing yards for an average of 194 per gameFlacco also had 11 TDs in the first 6 games and 10 in the last 10Basically, when Ray Rice emerged, Flacco's numbers went down and it was significant. I'm not saying his 2010 numbers will be as low as the last 10 games of 2009, but expecting really big numbers is too optimistic for me. The main reason is Cameron's offense is not one that throws the ball all over the field. I think Flacco could improve a bit on last year, but he also could have a better season football wise and have stats similar or perhaps a bit lower than last year. The thing I fail to see is this huge upside that I have seen in this thread. The offense and play calling limit what Flacco can do. This is a team dominated by defense and ball control and as long as that is the case, I don't see Flacco putting up anything higher than mid to upper QB2 numbers.

Didn't Brees have two good years under Cameron in San Diego? If I remember correctly, Brees had two seasons in SD with mid 20's in TD's (around 25-27 TD's)......with only Gates as a receiving target?This is all great, but guess what the Ravens learned last year? They learned that they can't win it all doing it the same way. I see a more balanced offense this year....that is why they brought in Boldin and Stallworth. They didn't have those weapons last season or in Joe's rookie year. Boldin is a #1 WR. Stallworth adds big play ability and I believe Mason can still play at a decent level. Joe has the players now and he will take advantage.If there is one thing I'd seriously take way from last season's numbers it is 21 TD's and 12 INT's. These numbers tell me that Joe is make the right reads.....which reinforces what I watched on the fall Sundays of 2009.

 

[Avery]

Bloom has Flacco rated as the 21st QB in dynasty leagues. That is absolutely absurd! 11 or 12 seems about more like it. Sigmund.....Vince Young infront of Joe?? Really Sigmund?? Geez! You have got to be kidding me!

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...p;howrecent=200

I fail to see why that is so outlandish. In the weeks that Vince Young started, he was QB12. His running ability makes a big difference in fantasy scoring. Not everyone thinks of Flacco as a top 12 QB. I personally think ranking him as high as QB12 is more absurd than ranking him lower than QB20. But that is just my opinion. I am not seeing the upside here and am not overwhelmed with Flacco's talent.

The big deal is, have you seen Vince Young throw? If you compare Young to Flacco there is no comparison in passing ability. Young created his fantasy points last year with smoke and mirrors.....many broken plays. Trust me I watched.....I do have NFL Sunday Ticket, so this isn't just an attempt to make things up. Vince Young seems like a good leader, I'll give him that....but pure passing skills and making the right reads.....no, Vince doesn't have that.

Comparing NFL QB abilities is a different discussion than fantasy QB worth. The better you understand that, the better you'll be at dynasty.In many leagues rushing yards and TDs are valued higher than passing yards and TDs so a rushing QB gets a big bump despite what their respective "real world" QB skills are.

Mike Vick was a top QB for a number of years is many leagues despite his clear deficiencies at playing QB.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

Bloom has Flacco rated as the 21st QB in dynasty leagues. That is absolutely absurd! 11 or 12 seems about more like it. Sigmund.....Vince Young infront of Joe?? Really Sigmund?? Geez! You have got to be kidding me!

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...p;howrecent=200

I fail to see why that is so outlandish. In the weeks that Vince Young started, he was QB12. His running ability makes a big difference in fantasy scoring. Not everyone thinks of Flacco as a top 12 QB. I personally think ranking him as high as QB12 is more absurd than ranking him lower than QB20. But that is just my opinion. I am not seeing the upside here and am not overwhelmed with Flacco's talent.

The big deal is, have you seen Vince Young throw? If you compare Young to Flacco there is no comparison in passing ability. Young created his fantasy points last year with smoke and mirrors.....many broken plays. Trust me I watched.....I do have NFL Sunday Ticket, so this isn't just an attempt to make things up. Vince Young seems like a good leader, I'll give him that....but pure passing skills and making the right reads.....no, Vince doesn't have that.

Comparing NFL QB abilities is a different discussion than fantasy QB worth. The better you understand that, the better you'll be at dynasty.In many leagues rushing yards and TDs are valued higher than passing yards and TDs so a rushing QB gets a big bump despite what their respective "real world" QB skills are.

Mike Vick was a top QB for a number of years is many leagues despite his clear deficiencies at playing QB.

But if you look at Vince's numbers he was putrid most years. I do know, because I owned him in my dynasty league. Flacco is going into his 3rd year.......why do people forget this? I am not saying have him ranked in the top 10, but most do not even think he has the chance ever to get there.......which is the point of this thread. Bloom has him ranked as #21 in dynasty. Last year he was #15 in my league's fairly standard scoring platform.......he improved his skills and this year he'll improve more. Cracking the top 10 for him is 50-50 in my books......a very good possibility. I'd take Flacco in my QBBC if I was in a redraft league and pair him with Cutler, Palmer, Eli........play the match up every week with confidence.

 

[simmonjm]

Only my opinion here but I am staying away from Flacco; Mason, Heap, and Boldin are old and injury prone add in the fact that Stallworth has been out of football for 1+ year and their WR corp does not inspire confidence and I would wager that the combo (Mason, Boldin, Heap) are not available for 14+ games this year. I realize on paper they look alright but im staying away.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

Bloom has Flacco rated as the 21st QB in dynasty leagues. That is absolutely absurd! 11 or 12 seems about more like it. Sigmund.....Vince Young infront of Joe?? Really Sigmund?? Geez! You have got to be kidding me!

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...p;howrecent=200

I fail to see why that is so outlandish. In the weeks that Vince Young started, he was QB12. His running ability makes a big difference in fantasy scoring. Not everyone thinks of Flacco as a top 12 QB. I personally think ranking him as high as QB12 is more absurd than ranking him lower than QB20. But that is just my opinion. I am not seeing the upside here and am not overwhelmed with Flacco's talent.

The big deal is, have you seen Vince Young throw? If you compare Young to Flacco there is no comparison in passing ability. Young created his fantasy points last year with smoke and mirrors.....many broken plays. Trust me I watched.....I do have NFL Sunday Ticket, so this isn't just an attempt to make things up. Vince Young seems like a good leader, I'll give him that....but pure passing skills and making the right reads.....no, Vince doesn't have that.

I do not disagree one bit about Young's ability when it comes to pure passing ability. But that didn't stop him from putting up QB12 numbers in the period of games he started. Of course a lot of his big plays are broken plays...that is the way it is with QBs like Young. His passes don't have to be pretty spirals. Pure passing skills are not the sole reason to like a QB for fantasy purposes. Young's running ability generates a lot of fantasy points either by rushing yards or throwing passes after his running ability creates more time. His pure passing skills will never be textbook or pretty, but his QB play was good enough to put up low QB1 numbers last year in the games he played.

 

[Anthony Borbely]

I am hearing a lot of talk about Kevin Kolb, Eli Manning, Matt Ryan and Palmer having potential top 10 years, but why no love for Flacco? Flacco has improved weapons with the additions of Boldin, Stallworth, and Pitta/Dixon. He has a young solid offensive line that was starting to gel at the end of the 2009 season. Joe is also heading his 3rd year where we often see a huge step forward for young QB's. Last year Flacco had 21 TD's to only 12 INT's and I expect another huge progression in 2010, with a celing of 30 TD's.....which would take him easily into the top 10 ranks. Again, why no love for Flacco?? I see nothing but upside.....as much upside as Kolb, Manning, Ryan, and Palmer.

I think you and others are drastically overestimating the possible numbers Flacco could put up this year. Cam Cameron's offense is not geared around throwing the ball all over the place like some teams. Cameron's QBs have never hit even 3700 yards and only once has a Cameron QB had 25 or more TDs. That was Drew Brees and he had something Flacco doesn't: a big time red zone target in Antonio Gates. Brees is also one of the most accurate QBs I have ever seen and Flacco's accuracy is average at best. Also, look at how the Ravens used Ray Rice last year. For the most part, Rice was not the featured back full time until week 7. Take a look at the numbers below, comparing weeks 1-6 and weeks 8-17 (week 7 was their bye). Weeks 1-6:Ray Rice had 73 carries, an average of 12 per game. Joe Flacco had 225 pass attempts, an average of 37.5 per gameFlacco had 1674 passing yards for an average of 279Weeks 8-17:Rice had 181 carries for an average of 18 per gameFlacco had 274 pass attempts for an average of 27 per gameFlacco had 1939 passing yards for an average of 194 per gameFlacco also had 11 TDs in the first 6 games and 10 in the last 10Basically, when Ray Rice emerged, Flacco's numbers went down and it was significant. I'm not saying his 2010 numbers will be as low as the last 10 games of 2009, but expecting really big numbers is too optimistic for me. The main reason is Cameron's offense is not one that throws the ball all over the field. I think Flacco could improve a bit on last year, but he also could have a better season football wise and have stats similar or perhaps a bit lower than last year. The thing I fail to see is this huge upside that I have seen in this thread. The offense and play calling limit what Flacco can do. This is a team dominated by defense and ball control and as long as that is the case, I don't see Flacco putting up anything higher than mid to upper QB2 numbers.

Didn't Brees have two good years under Cameron in San Diego? If I remember correctly, Brees had two seasons in SD with mid 20's in TD's (around 25-27 TD's)......with only Gates as a receiving target?This is all great, but guess what the Ravens learned last year? They learned that they can't win it all doing it the same way. I see a more balanced offense this year....that is why they brought in Boldin and Stallworth. They didn't have those weapons last season or in Joe's rookie year. Boldin is a #1 WR. Stallworth adds big play ability and I believe Mason can still play at a decent level. Joe has the players now and he will take advantage.If there is one thing I'd seriously take way from last season's numbers it is 21 TD's and 12 INT's. These numbers tell me that Joe is make the right reads.....which reinforces what I watched on the fall Sundays of 2009.

Comparing Brees to Flacco is apples and oranges. The only thing they have in common is Cam Cameron. As QBs, they have nothing in common. Brees is one of the most accurate QBs I've ever seen and Flacco's accuracy is average at best. Also, Brees' highest TD totals under Cameron were 27 and 24...and Gates was responsible for almost half of them (23 of the 51). Flacco doesn't have a red zone target even close to Gates. I just can't see Flacco putting up the numbers Brees did with less accuracy and no big red zone target like Gates...not to mention an offense that is not favorable to QBs. Making the right reads wins games...but it doesn't make a QB a fantasy stud. Big numbers do.

 

[Cecil Lammey]

I'm not going to speak for Bloom about Flacco, but there's no way he WANTS him to fail so it makes his predraft ranking look better.

Remember, we watched hours of film on Flacco and saw him at the Senior Bowl practices- that's what our analysis was based on. More film work and first hand accounts of his NFL game than most other draftniks/fantasy writers.

I've been harder on Flacco than Bloom, but it's clear that he's played well so far during his pro career.

His tape from the playoff game between Delaware and App State is one that I always referred to before he was drafted. he looked completely lost in that game, and App State hounded him like crazy. Big, strong arm, but footwork and decision making needed improvement.

We watched him at the Senior Bowl practices and he looked like the same guy to me.

I talked to his trainer back in January at the Senior Bowl this year, and he told me about all the offseason work that he does - both physically and mentally. It was very impressive to hear the kind of work he's putting into his game, and those are reasons why his game has improved. Playing with a great run game and a solid defense don't hurt either.

Flacco deserves credit for the progress he's made, but I don't see him as a top 10 fantasy QB this year. top 15? Sure, but not a guy I'd want to start every week. The Ravens are built to run the football, stop the run, and win close games. I picked them to win the Super Bowl on the Audible this past Thursday. The upgrades to the passing game are nice (love Pitta and Dickson) but it's not enough in my eyes to push Joe into the top 10 because of the philosophy of the offense.

Given the nature of the work we do we are not going to be correct about every prospect we comment on. However, we are going to tell you what we saw from film study and up close during the practices from the All Star Games. We're also going to tell you what we heard from trainers, scouts, agents, and other draftniks we talk to along the way.

As I always say on The Audible - 'prove me wrong' I don't mind when someone like Flacco (or Brent Celek) plays better than I had predicted. I'm going to tell you what I see as deficiencies in their game from tons of film study (NOT Youtube scouting ) and watching them in person, talking to them, etc.

Youtube scouting is a joke IMHO because it's a ####### highlight reel. I want to know/see/feel the flow of the game. Does this guy lift the team's spirits when they're down, or is he beating up on third-stringers because his team is down by 20? I use it only as a last ditch resort, like when I watched Truman State RB Vaness Emokpae on Veoh this last week. I also emailed some CFB insiders about their opinions on him. I don't have Truman State games in my library, but I know guys who do. Surprisingly found 80 minutes of him on Veoh, and didn't like what I saw.

we will definitely discuss this on The Audible this week!

 

[Go deep]

Bloom has Flacco rated as the 21st QB in dynasty leagues. That is absolutely absurd! 11 or 12 seems about more like it. Sigmund.....Vince Young infront of Joe?? Really Sigmund?? Geez! You have got to be kidding me!

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...p;howrecent=200

I fail to see why that is so outlandish. In the weeks that Vince Young started, he was QB12. His running ability makes a big difference in fantasy scoring. Not everyone thinks of Flacco as a top 12 QB. I personally think ranking him as high as QB12 is more absurd than ranking him lower than QB20. But that is just my opinion. I am not seeing the upside here and am not overwhelmed with Flacco's talent. In dynasty, I have Rodgers, Brees, Manning, Romo, Rivers, Brady, Schaub, Roethlisberger, Stafford, Ryan, Kolb, and Cutler in the top 12. In my tiers, there is a decent drop after these QBs and there is no chance I would rank Flacco in this group.

The next group is Eli Manning, Bradford, McNabb, Henne, Young, Flacco, Palmer, and Sanchez. To me, Flacco's upside is the upper part of this tier which is QB13. I have him as QB18 right now. I know some will disagree and that's fine, but I fail to see why Flacco should be a QB1. Just saying a QB will improve from year 2 to year 3 is not enough because Flacco could play much better from a game perspective and not put up bigger numbers. That is what i am expecting and a big reason is the way the Ravens play. The offense limits Flacco in my opinion and I don't see that changing anytime soon. If the coaching situation was not this stable, I may think differently, but the fact is this coaching staff and its philosophy isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

With all due respect, and i mean with all due respect(movie quote), but im not sure how seriously people can take your rankings. You have Stafford ranked as the #9 dynasty QB, and Stafford #18. Do you really think Stafford is that much better? Lets look at both QB's rookie season numbers.

Stafford 201/377, 2267 yards, 6.0 YPA, 13 TD/20INT

Flacco 257/428, 2971 yards, 6.9 YPA, 14 TD/12 INT

Flacco was CLEARLY the better QB in every category, and he did it with Derrick Mason as his #1 WR. Who did Stafford have? A guy coming off a top 3 WR season with Culpepper as his QB.

Flacco not only had better rookie numbers, but he improved in every category in his sophmore season, including adding 33% more TD's. Now in his 3rd season, with the addition of Boldin and Stallworth, you expect him to plateau? Yet you think stafford will be a top 10 QB?

I think i know what is going on here. You have Stafford ranked higher than any other staffer. You also have Jahvid best ranked at least 3 spots higher than any other staffer. Probably just a coincidence, lets check WR's....Oh wierd, you are the only human on this Earth who doesnt have Andre johnson as their #1 WR, anyone care to guess who Anthony has as his #1?

No offense sir, but those rankings arent worth a velvet painting of a Whale and Dolphin gettin it on(movie quote)

 

[Avery]

With all due respect, and i mean with all due respect(movie quote), but im not sure how seriously people can take your rankings. You have Stafford ranked as the #9 dynasty QB, and Stafford #18. Do you really think Stafford is that much better?

 

[massraider]

With all due respect, and i mean with all due respect(movie quote), but im not sure how seriously people can take your rankings. You have Stafford ranked as the #9 dynasty QB, and Stafford #18. Do you really think Stafford is that much better? Lets look at both QB's rookie season numbers.

Stafford 201/377, 2267 yards, 6.0 YPA, 13 TD/20INT

Flacco 257/428, 2971 yards, 6.9 YPA, 14 TD/12 INT

Flacco was CLEARLY the better QB in every category, and he did it with Derrick Mason as his #1 WR. Who did Stafford have? A guy coming off a top 3 WR season with Culpepper as his QB.

So the theory is that poor Joe Flacco was doing it all himself in the passing game with the Baltimore Ravens, while Stafford was handed the keys to a Bentley, in Detroit? You wanna rethink that one?

 

[Go deep]

With all due respect, and i mean with all due respect(movie quote), but im not sure how seriously people can take your rankings. You have Stafford ranked as the #9 dynasty QB, and Stafford #18. Do you really think Stafford is that much better? Lets look at both QB's rookie season numbers.

Stafford 201/377, 2267 yards, 6.0 YPA, 13 TD/20INT

Flacco 257/428, 2971 yards, 6.9 YPA, 14 TD/12 INT

Flacco was CLEARLY the better QB in every category, and he did it with Derrick Mason as his #1 WR. Who did Stafford have? A guy coming off a top 3 WR season with Culpepper as his QB.

So the theory is that poor Joe Flacco was doing it all himself in the passing game with the Baltimore Ravens, while Stafford was handed the keys to a Bentley, in Detroit? You wanna rethink that one?

Did i mention the teams success? I dont think so. However, if you want to bring that up, Flacco went 11-5 in his rookie season, and Stafford went 2-14. Flacco also made the playoffs in year 2. The Ravens went 5-11 the year before Flacco got there. Do you want to rethink that one?

 

[baconisgood]

Bloom has Flacco rated as the 21st QB in dynasty leagues. That is absolutely absurd! 11 or 12 seems about more like it. Sigmund.....Vince Young infront of Joe?? Really Sigmund?? Geez! You have got to be kidding me!

http://subscribers.footballguys.com/apps/v...p;howrecent=200

I fail to see why that is so outlandish. In the weeks that Vince Young started, he was QB12. His running ability makes a big difference in fantasy scoring. Not everyone thinks of Flacco as a top 12 QB. I personally think ranking him as high as QB12 is more absurd than ranking him lower than QB20. But that is just my opinion. I am not seeing the upside here and am not overwhelmed with Flacco's talent. In dynasty, I have Rodgers, Brees, Manning, Romo, Rivers, Brady, Schaub, Roethlisberger, Stafford, Ryan, Kolb, and Cutler in the top 12. In my tiers, there is a decent drop after these QBs and there is no chance I would rank Flacco in this group.

The next group is Eli Manning, Bradford, McNabb, Henne, Young, Flacco, Palmer, and Sanchez. To me, Flacco's upside is the upper part of this tier which is QB13. I have him as QB18 right now. I know some will disagree and that's fine, but I fail to see why Flacco should be a QB1. Just saying a QB will improve from year 2 to year 3 is not enough because Flacco could play much better from a game perspective and not put up bigger numbers. That is what i am expecting and a big reason is the way the Ravens play. The offense limits Flacco in my opinion and I don't see that changing anytime soon. If the coaching situation was not this stable, I may think differently, but the fact is this coaching staff and its philosophy isn't going anywhere anytime soon.

With all due respect, and i mean with all due respect(movie quote), but im not sure how seriously people can take your rankings. You have Stafford ranked as the #9 dynasty QB, and Stafford #18. Do you really think Stafford is that much better? Lets look at both QB's rookie season numbers.

Stafford 201/377, 2267 yards, 6.0 YPA, 13 TD/20INT

Flacco 257/428, 2971 yards, 6.9 YPA, 14 TD/12 INT

Flacco was CLEARLY the better QB in every category, and he did it with Derrick Mason as his #1 WR. Who did Stafford have? A guy coming off a top 3 WR season with Culpepper as his QB.

Flacco not only had better rookie numbers, but he improved in every category in his sophmore season, including adding 33% more TD's. Now in his 3rd season, with the addition of Boldin and Stallworth, you expect him to plateau? Yet you think stafford will be a top 10 QB?

I think i know what is going on here. You have Stafford ranked higher than any other staffer. You also have Jahvid best ranked at least 3 spots higher than any other staffer. Probably just a coincidence, lets check WR's....Oh wierd, you are the only human on this Earth who doesnt have Andre johnson as their #1 WR, anyone care to guess who Anthony has as his #1?

No offense sir, but those rankings arent worth a velvet painting of a Whale and Dolphin gettin it on(movie quote)

Those rookie numbers are fairly meaningless. Flacco joined a team that was 5 wins and 6 wins better than the team Stafford joined the two years prior to them getting drafted. Is Calvin Johnson > Mason? Yep. But the rest of the offense- offensive line, running game- had huge differences between the teams and all in Baltimore's favor.

 

[Carl Eller's Dead Liver]

With all due respect, and i mean with all due respect(movie quote), but im not sure how seriously people can take your rankings. You have Stafford ranked as the #9 dynasty QB, and Stafford #18. Do you really think Stafford is that much better? Lets look at both QB's rookie season numbers.

Stafford 201/377, 2267 yards, 6.0 YPA, 13 TD/20INT

Flacco 257/428, 2971 yards, 6.9 YPA, 14 TD/12 INT

Flacco was CLEARLY the better QB in every category, and he did it with Derrick Mason as his #1 WR. Who did Stafford have? A guy coming off a top 3 WR season with Culpepper as his QB.

So the theory is that poor Joe Flacco was doing it all himself in the passing game with the Baltimore Ravens, while Stafford was handed the keys to a Bentley, in Detroit? You wanna rethink that one?

I think they are hard to compare because Flacco has a decent O-Line and Stafford has cardboard cut outs playing O-Line. Stafford does however have Calvin Johnson, where Flacco basically had wash-ups at WR (Sorry Mason, no offense). Looking at the numbers, yes Flacco had a better rookie year than Stafford.....but Joe has proven he can take a step forward....we still need to see that from Stafford. I think comparing Flacco to Matt Ryan is a more fair comparison. Flacco is right there with numbers......and again finally he has a weapon!

 

[massraider]

With all due respect, and i mean with all due respect(movie quote), but im not sure how seriously people can take your rankings. You have Stafford ranked as the #9 dynasty QB, and Stafford #18. Do you really think Stafford is that much better? Lets look at both QB's rookie season numbers.

Stafford 201/377, 2267 yards, 6.0 YPA, 13 TD/20INT

Flacco 257/428, 2971 yards, 6.9 YPA, 14 TD/12 INT

Flacco was CLEARLY the better QB in every category, and he did it with Derrick Mason as his #1 WR. Who did Stafford have? A guy coming off a top 3 WR season with Culpepper as his QB.

So the theory is that poor Joe Flacco was doing it all himself in the passing game with the Baltimore Ravens, while Stafford was handed the keys to a Bentley, in Detroit? You wanna rethink that one?

Did i mention the teams success? I dont think so. However, if you want to bring that up, Flacco went 11-5 in his rookie season, and Stafford went 2-14. Flacco also made the playoffs in year 2. The Ravens went 5-11 the year before Flacco got there. Do you want to rethink that one?

If you are going to try and make an argument that they both went to bad teams/similar situations, then I'm not going to bother. It'd be like getting into an argument with someone that contends the moon is made from Marshmallow Fluff. I like Flacco, think he was underrated around here before the draft. And I think he can win Super Bowls. But I saw stuff from Stafford his rookie year, that makes me think he can be one of the best. It's just my opinion, and I could not possible care less as to what his rookie numbers, on that crappy team, looked like. And fantasy-wise, especially, I'd take Stafford over Flacco every day, in dynasty. Redraft, I think you can make a much better argument for Flacco. But long term, I don't even think it's gonna wind up being close.