Wife uses sex as a weapon (1 Viewer)

[Third]

That is good news. I hope this is a turning point for the good for the rest of your life. I wanted to recommend a book as well because it helped me see that not just frequency, but quality also mattered to a man. It is called Sheet Music, Uncovering the Secrets of Sexual Intimacy in Marriage, by Kevin Leman.http://www.amazon.com/Sheet-Music-Uncovering-Intimacy-Marriage/dp/0842360247/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1306861493&sr=8-1It is written from a Christian perspective, but it is pretty explicit, yet simplistic. I think we have more sex than 5 regular married couples, but it taught me a few things. It is written to both husband and wife. It was a free ebook at one point.Good luck, guys.

This looks good. On my list to get.Thanks for the recommendation.

I read this book about 8 years ago. It came to my mind as I read Athol's book because there is a section of Sheet Music that basically says get the P off the pedestal. I need to pull that book off the shelf and take another look.

 

[Sconch]

Pretty sure I'd rather get kicked in the nads 25 times in a row than talk to my mom about my marital/intimacy problems.

Not that it matters, it was my stepmom. My mom will not be knowing the details.

Either way. I'm not telling mom/dad/stepmom/3rd half-step-cousin about banging/not banging my wife...at least until after I file for divorce.

 

[St. Louis Bob]

Pretty sure I'd rather get kicked in the nads 25 times in a row than talk to my mom about my marital/intimacy problems.

I'm 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% certain my mom would take my wife's side in any dispute.

 

[hamster_13]

I wonder if whatever your wife did Friday night was the cause of this. Sounds like she talked to some family/friends about it and they possibly took your side and told her as much. Either way, congrats Bogart. Good first steps!

 

[Disco Stu]

Shorty Defazzio approves of this unusual item.

 

[Mrs. BSR]

Thanks for the update Bogart. Sounds good. I hope she starts to open up to you too and you both can communicate better.

 

[culdeus]

back from the dead?

 

[Dr. Awesome]

back from the dead?

Just like Jesus!

Glad this thread has returned. Kudos to faceless mods for bringing it back. I've stored away many nuggets for my future relationships from this thread. Really rooting for Bogart.

 

[goonsquad]

Thanks for the update Bogart. Sounds good. I hope she starts to open up to you too and you both can communicate better.

 

[Mrs. BSR]

Thanks for the update Bogart. Sounds good. I hope she starts to open up to you too and you both can communicate better.

 

[Sabertooth]

I've read about half of the book mentioned in here. Some good things in there that I hadn't really considered.

 

[gianmarco]

Not a weapon here.

 

[Bogart]

One step forward, twelve steps back.

Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."

It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable.

I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

 

[offdee]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

Just move on my man. At this point, it's not worth the hassle as odds of actually making it work at this point are extremely minimal. Will suck in the near future, but 2 years from now you'll look back and wonder why you didn't do it sooner and have much more clarity and enjoyment of life.

 

[culdeus]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

FWIW the child custody stuff in a clean divorce is pretty canned in TX if the dad doesn't push for an alternative custody arrangement and there aren't any crazy assets tied up in estates and crap. With her working you won't probably owe much beyond the child support, but it's maybe time to talk with a lawyer.

 

[Disco Stu]

She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife

Silly woman.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife

What did you say?

 

[offdee]

She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife

What did you say?

The correct answer would be..."what next wife? Once this is over I've realized that there is absolutely no need to get married again."

 

[gianmarco]

She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife

What did you say?

"You. But better."

 

[Disco Stu]

She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife

What did you say?

10 years younger, 30 pounds lighter, perky Bs, accessible ######.

 

[Bogart]

She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife

What did you say?

She got the "I honestly do not know. I haven't even thought about that."I was going to have to go to sleep at some point.

 

[Buck Bradcanon]

Stu> Please take this gentleman to Urban Taco or somesuch when things get finalized.

Yours in baby christ,

Buck

Bogart, You have done the majority of the work in this marriage it seems. Dont let her convince you otherwise.

 

[MikeIke]

She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife

What did you say?

The correct answer would be..."what next wife? Once this is over I've realized that there is absolutely no need to get married again."

I've told myself at least 3,000 times that this is my first and only marriage. If a divorce ever comes, I'll be single until I die.

 

[tommyboy]

hang in there.

my answer to the "next wife" question would have been a chick that likes to have sex 2-4 times per week, willingly.

but never fear, i know a man who's wife is a stay at home with 3 kids, doesn't do any house work, doesn't do any of the kids activities, is 50lbs overweight, spends money/steals money from hubbie (out of control spender), gets furious when he leaves town without her and the dude is really really cool. Only reason he seems to put up with it is the kids. I feel really bad for him. At least you have thought this through.

 

[Sabertooth]

hang in there.

my answer to the "next wife" question would have been a chick that likes to have sex 2-4 times per week, willingly.

but never fear, i know a man who's wife is a stay at home with 3 kids, doesn't do any house work, doesn't do any of the kids activities, is 50lbs overweight, spends money/steals money from hubbie (out of control spender), gets furious when he leaves town without her and the dude is really really cool. Only reason he seems to put up with it is the kids. I feel really bad for him. At least you have thought this through.

The kids what? Sounds like a rationalization to me. Either he's too weak to leave or it isn't as bad as he makes it out to be.

 

[Spike]

hang in there.

my answer to the "next wife" question would have been a chick that likes to have sex 2-4 times per week, willingly.

but never fear, i know a man who's wife is a stay at home with 3 kids, doesn't do any house work, doesn't do any of the kids activities, is 50lbs overweight, spends money/steals money from hubbie (out of control spender), gets furious when he leaves town without her and the dude is really really cool. Only reason he seems to put up with it is the kids. I feel really bad for him. At least you have thought this through.

The kids what? Sounds like a rationalization to me. Either he's too weak to leave or it isn't as bad as he makes it out to be.

What's so hard to understand? He doesn't want to be in a situation in which his children aren't living with him.

 

[Clifford]

Stop waking up with the kids on the weekends and let her handle it. Once the kids are in bed at night, go out.

What makes you think she will "handle it" if he doesn't do these things? Seems likely to me that this plan would result in a sink full of dirty dishes and the kids watching 3 hours of TV every weekend morning.

TV isn't gonna hurt them and neither is a sink full of dishes. She'll probably think he's gonna revert back if she gives him time. It'll take a while for her to either 1. start picking up the slack, 2. start #####ing about it which is a GOOD thing in this case because it opens communication channels, 3. do nothing which just shows she is unwilling to change or 4. ask for a divorce.I just think Bogart needs to change the status quo in his marriage. It's not working.

Great thinking. Wish I had suggested this 15 pages ago.

 

[Clifford]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

To me this plays in your favor. She quickly (almost immediately) recognized that you're not going to put up with any more ####, and changed her tune. She's testing you to see if you are serious and have actually thought this through. Let her know the truth, that things did get so bad you really were considering it.One for the thread: what if the problem is that you seriously are no longer interested in having sex with your wife?

 

[Frostillicus]

One for the thread: what if the problem is that you seriously are no longer interested in having sex with your wife?

Because you're gay or some other reason?

 

[BigJim®]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

So one week she's buying lingerie and the next she's talking about life after divorce? Wow. I agree with another poster who opined she's testing you to see if you'd actually leave; in her mind it was probably getting to that point where she might have to <gasp> have sex yet again already so she figured she'd investigate the alternative consequences. Just keep fighting the good fight. Sounds to me like she doesn't have much clue about healthy marriages if she really thinks any wife would/should isolate you after 14 years. Might be a challenge to rewire a brain that perceives that as normal. Good luck.

 

[culdeus]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

So one week she's buying lingerie and the next she's talking about life after divorce? Wow. I agree with another poster who opined she's testing you to see if you'd actually leave; in her mind it was probably getting to that point where she might have to <gasp> have sex yet again already so she figured she'd investigate the alternative consequences. Just keep fighting the good fight. Sounds to me like she doesn't have much clue about healthy marriages if she really thinks any wife would/should isolate you after 14 years. Might be a challenge to rewire a brain that perceives that as normal. Good luck.

Yeah, what were the middle steps between and

 

[KGB]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

So one week she's buying lingerie and the next she's talking about life after divorce? Wow. I agree with another poster who opined she's testing you to see if you'd actually leave; in her mind it was probably getting to that point where she might have to <gasp> have sex yet again already so she figured she'd investigate the alternative consequences. Just keep fighting the good fight. Sounds to me like she doesn't have much clue about healthy marriages if she really thinks any wife would/should isolate you after 14 years. Might be a challenge to rewire a brain that perceives that as normal. Good luck.

Yeah, what were the middle steps between and

yea, i feel like we missed something. 5 new outfits and then.......

 

[Bogart]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

So one week she's buying lingerie and the next she's talking about life after divorce? Wow. I agree with another poster who opined she's testing you to see if you'd actually leave; in her mind it was probably getting to that point where she might have to <gasp> have sex yet again already so she figured she'd investigate the alternative consequences. Just keep fighting the good fight. Sounds to me like she doesn't have much clue about healthy marriages if she really thinks any wife would/should isolate you after 14 years. Might be a challenge to rewire a brain that perceives that as normal. Good luck.

Yeah, what were the middle steps between and

yea, i feel like we missed something. 5 new outfits and then.......

That is kinda what I am trying to figure out. I feel like the lingerie was a desperation act based on the conversation we had the night before, she was able to check it off her list, feel like she saved things for now, and go back to her life as normal. So now we have another conversation this Saturday night, and she feels like she has to act again. This morning as I am leaving. she kisses me passionately and says "Let's get the kids down early tonight." Naturally, I'm all but in the back of my head, I have to wonder if this is just another desperate measure. Trying to give her the benefit of the doubt that she is working on changing, but having my doubts.

 

[NewlyRetired]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

So one week she's buying lingerie and the next she's talking about life after divorce? Wow. I agree with another poster who opined she's testing you to see if you'd actually leave; in her mind it was probably getting to that point where she might have to <gasp> have sex yet again already so she figured she'd investigate the alternative consequences. Just keep fighting the good fight. Sounds to me like she doesn't have much clue about healthy marriages if she really thinks any wife would/should isolate you after 14 years. Might be a challenge to rewire a brain that perceives that as normal. Good luck.

Yeah, what were the middle steps between and

yea, i feel like we missed something. 5 new outfits and then.......

That is kinda what I am trying to figure out. I feel like the lingerie was a desperation act based on the conversation we had the night before, she was able to check it off her list, feel like she saved things for now, and go back to her life as normal. So now we have another conversation this Saturday night, and she feels like she has to act again. This morning as I am leaving. she kisses me passionately and says "Let's get the kids down early tonight." Naturally, I'm all but in the back of my head, I have to wonder if this is just another desperate measure. Trying to give her the benefit of the doubt that she is working on changing, but having my doubts.

Holy yo- yo Batman. Is there any chance she is bi-polar? These are enormous extremes in the span of hours.

 

[fatguyinalittlecoat]

One for the thread: what if the problem is that you seriously are no longer interested in having sex with your wife?

What exactly are you asking? Whether people in that situation should always divorce?

 

[Socrates11]

Holy yo- yo Batman. Is there any chance she is bi-polar? These are enormous extremes in the span of hours.

 

[Buck Bradcanon]

Holy yo- yo Batman. Is there any chance she is bi-polar? These are enormous extremes in the span of hours.

I dont know if she is bi-polar but she sounds like she suffers from depression. Or said a different way she at least sounds like someone who could benefit from professional counseling on her own, regardless of the path she and Bogart take.I say this as someone who has battled depression myself. As much as I am rooting for Bogart, I also feel sorry for his wife as she seems to be battling some things she may not be able to control without professional or even medical assistance.

 

[JFT Ben]

One step forward, twelve steps back.

Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."

It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable.

I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

So one week she's buying lingerie and the next she's talking about life after divorce? Wow. I agree with another poster who opined she's testing you to see if you'd actually leave; in her mind it was probably getting to that point where she might have to <gasp> have sex yet again already so she figured she'd investigate the alternative consequences. Just keep fighting the good fight. Sounds to me like she doesn't have much clue about healthy marriages if she really thinks any wife would/should isolate you after 14 years. Might be a challenge to rewire a brain that perceives that as normal. Good luck.

Yeah, what were the middle steps between and

yea, i feel like we missed something. 5 new outfits and then.......

That is kinda what I am trying to figure out. I feel like the lingerie was a desperation act based on the conversation we had the night before, she was able to check it off her list, feel like she saved things for now, and go back to her life as normal. So now we have another conversation this Saturday night, and she feels like she has to act again. This morning as I am leaving. she kisses me passionately and says "Let's get the kids down early tonight." Naturally, I'm all but in the back of my head, I have to wonder if this is just another desperate measure. Trying to give her the benefit of the doubt that she is working on changing, but having my doubts.

Holy yo- yo Batman. Is there any chance she is bi-polar? These are enormous extremes in the span of hours.

It could be the divorce conversation was just an S-test. If Bogart had responded in wishy-washy ways that made it seem like he wasn't willing to really get divorced he would have failed the test, but his response was such that it was a tangible thing and hence passed? Someone else had a similar assessment. Who knows, women are hard to figure out.

 

[Bogart]

Holy yo- yo Batman. Is there any chance she is bi-polar? These are enormous extremes in the span of hours.

Yes, there is a very, very good chance of this. And another curveball thrown my way. I asked her several times on Saturday if she had anger issues, she denied each time. I'm sure any person would. Convincing her that she needs help is going to be difficult. If it happens as her husband or just her friend is the question I have to answer.

 

[Bogart]

It could be the divorce conversation was just an S-test. If Bogart had responded in wishy-washy ways that made it seem like he wasn't willing to really get divorced he would have failed the test, but his response was such that it was a tangible thing and hence passed? Someone else had a similar assessment. Who knows, women are hard to figure out.

I have been very deliberate in my conversations to show her how real this situation is. If/when the time comes and I say, "I want a divorce", it is going to be very real. I don't get couples that throw divorces threats back and forth at each other on a constant basis, but it never happens. They just become empty words at some point.

 

[culdeus]

It could be the divorce conversation was just an S-test. If Bogart had responded in wishy-washy ways that made it seem like he wasn't willing to really get divorced he would have failed the test, but his response was such that it was a tangible thing and hence passed? Someone else had a similar assessment. Who knows, women are hard to figure out.

I have been very deliberate in my conversations to show her how real this situation is. If/when the time comes and I say, "I want a divorce", it is going to be very real. I don't get couples that throw divorces threats back and forth at each other on a constant basis, but it never happens. They just become empty words at some point.

how long did her first one last?

 

[Bogart]

It could be the divorce conversation was just an S-test. If Bogart had responded in wishy-washy ways that made it seem like he wasn't willing to really get divorced he would have failed the test, but his response was such that it was a tangible thing and hence passed? Someone else had a similar assessment. Who knows, women are hard to figure out.

I have been very deliberate in my conversations to show her how real this situation is. If/when the time comes and I say, "I want a divorce", it is going to be very real. I don't get couples that throw divorces threats back and forth at each other on a constant basis, but it never happens. They just become empty words at some point.

how long did her first one last?

Her first marriage lasted 7 years. This did include time that he was overseas in the military.

 

[iamsmilin]

Not a weapon here.

I disagree with most of the stuff in that article but I cannot deny the wisdom in this quote:"Sex is a taboo in Asian society. We have ignored it in our marriages but it's all down to sex. A good wife is a good sex worker to her husband. What is wrong with being a whore ... to your husband?" she said.

 

[skillz]

Wow, I feel for you. A miserable marriage that is likely headed for divorce given how things are progressing - question is how long it takes to get to that point. If you do end up getting divorced from her she doesn't seem like an emotionally stable person. That would make me worry about leaving the kids with her (although I thought you said earlier that she wanted you to take the kids which is clearly an acknowledgment on her part that she realizes she wouldn't be able to adequately care for them). Who knows what kind of environment that will end up being for them if she does get part custody of them. That would be the hardest part to deal with in the event you get divorced - what crazy things are going on with the kids when you are not around.

 

[iamsmilin]

Bogart,

I think that your wife really is trying but it's hard to change ones mindset. So while she is trying to get some sexy time with you she does revert back to feeling like she does on a normal basis. I'm sure the conversation was part BS test part wondering how far you are mentally along the divorce track. It'll probably be a roller coaster for sometime but hopefully there will be more ups than downs.

 

[Sabertooth]

Bogart,I think that your wife really is trying but it's hard to change ones mindset. So while she is trying to get some sexy time with you she does revert back to feeling like she does on a normal basis. I'm sure the conversation was part BS test part wondering how far you are mentally along the divorce track. It'll probably be a roller coaster for sometime but hopefully there will be more ups than downs.

I agree. She's going to go back to her comfort zone frequently early on. Hopefully the frequency abates.

 

[Dr. Awesome]

Bogart,I think that your wife really is trying but it's hard to change ones mindset. So while she is trying to get some sexy time with you she does revert back to feeling like she does on a normal basis. I'm sure the conversation was part BS test part wondering how far you are mentally along the divorce track. It'll probably be a roller coaster for sometime but hopefully there will be more ups than downs.

Mostly I don't know if Bogart's wife is changing or not but any change that does come will happen in spurts. If she is changing you won't notice it as much in the day to day. But a month or two from now there will be a big difference from how she is today.

 

[Jojo the circus boy]

One step forward, twelve steps back.Huge discussion late Saturday night/early Sunday morning that ended up focusing on specifics of a life after divorce. Wife asking if I would "take the kids from her." (I said no, never). Talk of dual housing, child support, etc. She asked what did I expect to find in my next wife and did I really expect after 14 years would it be different with them. I asked if she felt she had anger issues. She denied completely. This was really the final red flag for me. She says I have already given up on the counseling and that "she is not ready to give up on this yet."It got so late, I think we both just needed the conversation to end, so we both talked about still trying 100 percent to make this work, but I don't think either of us believed it. Church on Sunday was very uncomfortable. I don't want to be the guy that drags this out, both here and IRL. My son just finished 1st grade last Friday, so the summer will be perfect to handle this situation with hopefully minimal distraction on his schoolwork.

So one week she's buying lingerie and the next she's talking about life after divorce? Wow. I agree with another poster who opined she's testing you to see if you'd actually leave; in her mind it was probably getting to that point where she might have to <gasp> have sex yet again already so she figured she'd investigate the alternative consequences. Just keep fighting the good fight. Sounds to me like she doesn't have much clue about healthy marriages if she really thinks any wife would/should isolate you after 14 years. Might be a challenge to rewire a brain that perceives that as normal. Good luck.

Yeah, what were the middle steps between and

yea, i feel like we missed something. 5 new outfits and then.......

That is kinda what I am trying to figure out. I feel like the lingerie was a desperation act based on the conversation we had the night before, she was able to check it off her list, feel like she saved things for now, and go back to her life as normal. So now we have another conversation this Saturday night, and she feels like she has to act again. This morning as I am leaving. she kisses me passionately and says "Let's get the kids down early tonight." Naturally, I'm all but in the back of my head, I have to wonder if this is just another desperate measure. Trying to give her the benefit of the doubt that she is working on changing, but having my doubts.

Play hard to get now! make her work for that bogart-lovin'.

 

[Bogart]

Wife brought her A+ game last night.

Not just the sexy time, which was , but the entire evening. She had a positive attitude from the second I walked in the door. We both gladly got the evening's chores done as quick as possible and worked to get the kids down in their own beds. She even knew the Mavs were playing and offered to stay up late if need be, with a sly grin. The idea of waiting to let me watch a game first would have never crossed her mind in the past. We took advantage of halftime, and afterwards she was like, "Go watch the game, if you miss any of it, you will hate yourself." I was pretty much shocked all evening long.

Tomorrow's session will be interesting. We will have highs and lows to discuss for the first time, not just lows. I still have shields up, many things to still fix, but I have to give her credit and give her the benefit of the doubt that she is trying to make some changes.

 

[Mad Cow]

Wife brought her A+ game last night.Not just the sexy time, which was , but the entire evening. She had a positive attitude from the second I walked in the door. We both gladly got the evening's chores done as quick as possible and worked to get the kids down in their own beds. She even knew the Mavs were playing and offered to stay up late if need be, with a sly grin. The idea of waiting to let me watch a game first would have never crossed her mind in the past. We took advantage of halftime, and afterwards she was like, "Go watch the game, if you miss any of it, you will hate yourself." I was pretty much shocked all evening long. Tomorrow's session will be interesting. We will have highs and lows to discuss for the first time, not just lows. I still have shields up, many things to still fix, but I have to give her credit and give her the benefit of the doubt that she is trying to make some changes.

Don't take this the wrong way, but she is obviously struggling to give you your language of love, even if it is difficult. That said, what are you doing for her to go above and beyond to meet her love currency/language?