Will Roethlisberger Be Suspended This Season? (2 Viewers)

[az_prof]

Maybe I'm naive, but I don't get this. He's a single guy partying with women. If he forced somebody to have sex with him, that's a crime, and I would like to see him in prison. But there is no evidence that this ever happened. Therefore, any suspension seems unfair to me. And I also don't know why we're condemning him.

How about if it was your daughter, still no problem?The guy is trash and will get away with it. Please explain why he continues to put himself in these situations. He is not the only rich football, baseball, basketball, soccer, NASCAR, Hockey, TV, movie celebrity that could be extorted, why does this not happen to ALL the rich young professionals out there. We both know why, there is more to life than proof, everyone can be bought off for a price.

I would hope that it wouldn't matter whose daughter it was..... and if it were my daughter and it really happened, I would be encourgaing her to pursue it all the way....just like I would encourage your duaghter to do the same.....

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room. On the other hand, if she were raped I would also want her to pursue it to the end and get justice. Somehow this doesn't seem as simplistic a case as some would make out--that Ben is an conniving seducer who got this girl drunk and then took advantage of her. And it seems like she didn't think there was a problem until her friends convinced her that there was--her initial response was that she wasn't raped. The story changed as the friends continued to push her to report it. Then it was out of control.So, if my daughter did do this I would have a long talk with her about personal responsibility and about putting yourself in dangerous and compromising situations. The same talk I would be having with Ben if he were my son.

 

[Kenny Powers]

Maybe so, although I think most of these people are overreacting at the same time. Im as big of a sports fan as anybody, and Pittsburgh teams especially, but I judge players based on their ability on the field, not their character off the field. That doesnt mean was Roethlisberger or Holmes have been accused of, charged with, etc doesnt impact how I feel about them, but based on their actions up to this point, I still want them on my team.

Maybe thats just me, but Im amazed at all these fans who probably couldnt name a dozen players on the Steelers yet are reacting with such strong negative feelings and emotions towards Roeth (not saying youre one of these people). If Zach Duke was accused of raping someone, I dont think too many people would care because the Pirates are terrible, yet fans are increasingly sick of guys like Roethlisberger & Holmes all of a sudden who IMO without the Steelers still wouldnt have a Super Bowl win since the 70's.

Sports is cutthroat, athletes, shouldnt be role models, and every player isnt someone you'd want to date your sister. I can understand why people dont like how these players actions have tarnished the Steelers brand, but Id rather have Ben Roethlisberger as my QB than christ reborn Tim Tebow.

Whether or not you believe that athletes should be role models is irrelevant. They are role models, like it or not. On top of that, both Ben and Santonio KNEW that how they conduct themselves off the field matters - to most fans and, more importantly, to the league. Goodell has been commissioner long enough that every NFL player knows what will happen to them if they get into trouble off the field.The problem is that both Ben and Santonio either didn't care about the repercussions and what that would mean to the team or are too dumb to fully understand that what they were doing is wrong in the eyes of the league. There is no third option here. It's one or the other - they either didn't care about their team or they are idiots. Either way, I wouldn't want either of them on my team for this reason.

Theyre role models, like it or not? Really?! Just because athletes are famous, that doesnt mean theyre role models. Athletes have been implicated with so many negative things, from murder to just being an #######, that clearly they are not role models, and any good parent should realize that.Last time I checked, there's nothing wrong with being an eligible bachelor and trying to pick up women in a bar either

 

[Jeremy]

Maybe so, although I think most of these people are overreacting at the same time. Im as big of a sports fan as anybody, and Pittsburgh teams especially, but I judge players based on their ability on the field, not their character off the field. That doesnt mean was Roethlisberger or Holmes have been accused of, charged with, etc doesnt impact how I feel about them, but based on their actions up to this point, I still want them on my team.

Maybe thats just me, but Im amazed at all these fans who probably couldnt name a dozen players on the Steelers yet are reacting with such strong negative feelings and emotions towards Roeth (not saying youre one of these people). If Zach Duke was accused of raping someone, I dont think too many people would care because the Pirates are terrible, yet fans are increasingly sick of guys like Roethlisberger & Holmes all of a sudden who IMO without the Steelers still wouldnt have a Super Bowl win since the 70's.

Sports is cutthroat, athletes, shouldnt be role models, and every player isnt someone you'd want to date your sister. I can understand why people dont like how these players actions have tarnished the Steelers brand, but Id rather have Ben Roethlisberger as my QB than christ reborn Tim Tebow.

Whether or not you believe that athletes should be role models is irrelevant. They are role models, like it or not. On top of that, both Ben and Santonio KNEW that how they conduct themselves off the field matters - to most fans and, more importantly, to the league. Goodell has been commissioner long enough that every NFL player knows what will happen to them if they get into trouble off the field.The problem is that both Ben and Santonio either didn't care about the repercussions and what that would mean to the team or are too dumb to fully understand that what they were doing is wrong in the eyes of the league. There is no third option here. It's one or the other - they either didn't care about their team or they are idiots. Either way, I wouldn't want either of them on my team for this reason.

Theyre role models, like it or not? Really?! Just because athletes are famous, that doesnt mean theyre role models. Athletes have been implicated with so many negative things, from murder to just being an #######, that clearly they are not role models, and any good parent should realize that.Last time I checked, there's nothing wrong with being an eligible bachelor and trying to pick up women in a bar either

I think the point is, children are watching. And Roger Goodell and the league would like them to continue to watch. An athelete is a role model, either positive or negative. You've got kids in Pittsburgh wearing his jersey and some parents with some difficult conversation ahead of them. You wish these guys would realize their responsibilities in this area, but that's probably asking too much.

 

[Mark Wimer]

Maybe so, although I think most of these people are overreacting at the same time. Im as big of a sports fan as anybody, and Pittsburgh teams especially, but I judge players based on their ability on the field, not their character off the field. That doesnt mean was Roethlisberger or Holmes have been accused of, charged with, etc doesnt impact how I feel about them, but based on their actions up to this point, I still want them on my team.

Maybe thats just me, but Im amazed at all these fans who probably couldnt name a dozen players on the Steelers yet are reacting with such strong negative feelings and emotions towards Roeth (not saying youre one of these people). If Zach Duke was accused of raping someone, I dont think too many people would care because the Pirates are terrible, yet fans are increasingly sick of guys like Roethlisberger & Holmes all of a sudden who IMO without the Steelers still wouldnt have a Super Bowl win since the 70's.

Sports is cutthroat, athletes, shouldnt be role models, and every player isnt someone you'd want to date your sister. I can understand why people dont like how these players actions have tarnished the Steelers brand, but Id rather have Ben Roethlisberger as my QB than christ reborn Tim Tebow.

Whether or not you believe that athletes should be role models is irrelevant. They are role models, like it or not. On top of that, both Ben and Santonio KNEW that how they conduct themselves off the field matters - to most fans and, more importantly, to the league. Goodell has been commissioner long enough that every NFL player knows what will happen to them if they get into trouble off the field.The problem is that both Ben and Santonio either didn't care about the repercussions and what that would mean to the team or are too dumb to fully understand that what they were doing is wrong in the eyes of the league. There is no third option here. It's one or the other - they either didn't care about their team or they are idiots. Either way, I wouldn't want either of them on my team for this reason.

Theyre role models, like it or not? Really?! Just because athletes are famous, that doesnt mean theyre role models. Athletes have been implicated with so many negative things, from murder to just being an #######, that clearly they are not role models, and any good parent should realize that.Last time I checked, there's nothing wrong with being an eligible bachelor and trying to pick up women in a bar either

I think the point is, children are watching. And Roger Goodell and the league would like them to continue to watch. An athelete is a role model, either positive or negative. You've got kids in Pittsburgh wearing his jersey and some parents with some difficult conversation ahead of them. You wish these guys would realize their responsibilities in this area, but that's probably asking too much.

Here's a clip of Charles Barkley thoughtfully discussing the notion of Pro Sports figures being role models - it's worth watching for people who think that pro sports players should (or shouldn't) be considered role models.My .02.

 

[Kenny Powers]

My .02.

Too bad this wasnt the accuser's BAC

 

[cobalt_27]

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room.

Haven't you heard...nobody's daughter here does that? It's just everyone else's daughter. From your perspective, I can understand why you think they deserve everything they get.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

Those numbers Godsbrother threw out and some people agreed with about 80% of Steeler fans being okay if they got rid of Ben, and 50% being happy if they would, I think are WAY off.

People were/are in an uproar they got rid of Holmes for a 5th round pick. If they released/traded Roethlisberger, who knows what would happen. Maybe the first riot in Pittsburgh.

If as many as 50% of fans actually want him gone and would be happy if that happened, Id say 90% of those same fans would be the ones calling in to talkshows for Tomlin, Rooney, or whoevers head because the Steelers are 2-6 to start the year

I think you are underestimating how upset people are at Roethlisberger & Holmes. These guys are giving an organization I care about very much a bad name. I think the Steelers are capable of winning with players that don't continually have brush-ins with the law.

Maybe so, although I think most of these people are overreacting at the same time. Im as big of a sports fan as anybody, and Pittsburgh teams especially, but I judge players based on their ability on the field, not their character off the field. That doesnt mean was Roethlisberger or Holmes have been accused of, charged with, etc doesnt impact how I feel about them, but based on their actions up to this point, I still want them on my team.Maybe thats just me, but Im amazed at all these fans who probably couldnt name a dozen players on the Steelers yet are reacting with such strong negative feelings and emotions towards Roeth (not saying youre one of these people). If Zach Duke was accused of raping someone, I dont think too many people would care because the Pirates are terrible, yet fans are increasingly sick of guys like Roethlisberger & Holmes all of a sudden who IMO without the Steelers still wouldnt have a Super Bowl win since the 70's.

Sports is cutthroat, athletes, shouldnt be role models, and every player isnt someone you'd want to date your sister. I can understand why people dont like how these players actions have tarnished the Steelers brand, but Id rather have Ben Roethlisberger as my QB than christ reborn Tim Tebow.

Whether or not you believe that athletes should be role models is irrelevant. They are role models, like it or not. On top of that, both Ben and Santonio KNEW that how they conduct themselves off the field matters - to most fans and, more importantly, to the league. Goodell has been commissioner long enough that every NFL player knows what will happen to them if they get into trouble off the field.The problem is that both Ben and Santonio either didn't care about the repercussions and what that would mean to the team or are too dumb to fully understand that what they were doing is wrong in the eyes of the league. There is no third option here. It's one or the other - they either didn't care about their team or they are idiots. Either way, I wouldn't want either of them on my team for this reason.

thing is....he didn't actually get into any trouble yet.....the DA decided there was not enough evidence to prosecute and we have no idea what all of that entails.....it could be anywhere in between "she came back and told us she made the whole thing up" to "my wife is a huge Big Ben fan and she told me she would cut me off and I am a sex addict so I decided not to prosecute".....somewhere in there.....

 

[roadkill1292]

Fight The Power.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

Maybe so, although I think most of these people are overreacting at the same time. Im as big of a sports fan as anybody, and Pittsburgh teams especially, but I judge players based on their ability on the field, not their character off the field. That doesnt mean was Roethlisberger or Holmes have been accused of, charged with, etc doesnt impact how I feel about them, but based on their actions up to this point, I still want them on my team.

Maybe thats just me, but Im amazed at all these fans who probably couldnt name a dozen players on the Steelers yet are reacting with such strong negative feelings and emotions towards Roeth (not saying youre one of these people). If Zach Duke was accused of raping someone, I dont think too many people would care because the Pirates are terrible, yet fans are increasingly sick of guys like Roethlisberger & Holmes all of a sudden who IMO without the Steelers still wouldnt have a Super Bowl win since the 70's.

Sports is cutthroat, athletes, shouldnt be role models, and every player isnt someone you'd want to date your sister. I can understand why people dont like how these players actions have tarnished the Steelers brand, but Id rather have Ben Roethlisberger as my QB than christ reborn Tim Tebow.

Whether or not you believe that athletes should be role models is irrelevant. They are role models, like it or not. On top of that, both Ben and Santonio KNEW that how they conduct themselves off the field matters - to most fans and, more importantly, to the league. Goodell has been commissioner long enough that every NFL player knows what will happen to them if they get into trouble off the field.The problem is that both Ben and Santonio either didn't care about the repercussions and what that would mean to the team or are too dumb to fully understand that what they were doing is wrong in the eyes of the league. There is no third option here. It's one or the other - they either didn't care about their team or they are idiots. Either way, I wouldn't want either of them on my team for this reason.

Theyre role models, like it or not? Really?! Just because athletes are famous, that doesnt mean theyre role models. Athletes have been implicated with so many negative things, from murder to just being an #######, that clearly they are not role models, and any good parent should realize that.Last time I checked, there's nothing wrong with being an eligible bachelor and trying to pick up women in a bar either

I think the point is, children are watching. And Roger Goodell and the league would like them to continue to watch. An athelete is a role model, either positive or negative. You've got kids in Pittsburgh wearing his jersey and some parents with some difficult conversation ahead of them. You wish these guys would realize their responsibilities in this area, but that's probably asking too much.

part of that conversation could very well include...."c'mere son, this is an example of how the justice system works....you see in order to be found guilty of something there has to be enough evidence to actually show that you are guilty"......ain't it great?.....cause sometimes things don't neccessarily happen the way some people say they did"granted sometimes people get away with stuff....but we have to trust the system to get it right....

 

[Deadman31]

Its not over yet.

Boston attorney Harry Manion claims that he recently investigated accusations against Ben Roethlisberger that the Steelers' quarterback may have sexually assaulted yet another (unnamed) woman in Nevada.

Manion claims the allegations were "absolutely identical to this Georgia girl’s story," of which charges were dismissed on Monday. Manion's alleged case never made it to legal or civil court, but this is an obvious trend. "There is a history here that is just super troubling," added Manion. "And the next one, the wrath of God’s going to come down on him, if there is a next one."

Source: WEEI Boston

 

[az_prof]

Its not over yet.Boston attorney Harry Manion claims that he recently investigated accusations against Ben Roethlisberger that the Steelers' quarterback may have sexually assaulted yet another (unnamed) woman in Nevada.Manion claims the allegations were "absolutely identical to this Georgia girl’s story," of which charges were dismissed on Monday. Manion's alleged case never made it to legal or civil court, but this is an obvious trend. "There is a history here that is just super troubling," added Manion. "And the next one, the wrath of God’s going to come down on him, if there is a next one."Source: WEEI Boston

Wow. It is amazing how stories proliferate and how the sharks circle. The guy retracted his statement later in the day.

 

[Andy Herron]

Lots of talk this morning about possible a suspension for Roethlisberger. By either the NFL or the Steelers. What's your guess on this?J

Without reading through this entire post, I don't think there is any question.I'm expecting from 1-2 weeks. If Goodell leaves it to the Steelers Organization, it's at least one.If it's up to Goodell, it's at least two.

 

[Godsbrother]

Former NFL player Amani Toomer said he's watching closely and advocated a half-season suspension for Roethlisberger. He told ESPN Radio (via the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review):"I'm interested to see what's going to happen with Roger Goodell, because there's precedent in this situation with Pacman Jones. He never got convicted of anything, but he got arrested a lot of times. What is (Goodell) going to do?"Ben Roethlisberger ... the NFL is running away from this like the plague. ... He should be suspended for at least eight games."I always liked Amani

Roethlisberger may be no better of a human being than Pacman but the fact remains he has never been arrested. Jones has been arrested at least 6 times. If the NFL would suspend a player for 8 games that was not even charged in the incident in question I am thinking the players union would file a grievance immediately.

 

[az_prof]

Former NFL player Amani Toomer said he's watching closely and advocated a half-season suspension for Roethlisberger. He told ESPN Radio (via the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review):"I'm interested to see what's going to happen with Roger Goodell, because there's precedent in this situation with Pacman Jones. He never got convicted of anything, but he got arrested a lot of times. What is (Goodell) going to do?"Ben Roethlisberger ... the NFL is running away from this like the plague. ... He should be suspended for at least eight games."I always liked Amani

Roethlisberger may be no better of a human being than Pacman but the fact remains he has never been arrested. Jones has been arrested at least 6 times. If the NFL would suspend a player for 8 games that was not even charged in the incident in question I am thinking the players union would file a grievance immediately.

Gotta agree. Basically any sort of suspension is just to please the Mob.

 

[cobalt_27]

Former NFL player Amani Toomer said he's watching closely and advocated a half-season suspension for Roethlisberger. He told ESPN Radio (via the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review):

"I'm interested to see what's going to happen with Roger Goodell, because there's precedent in this situation with Pacman Jones. He never got convicted of anything, but he got arrested a lot of times. What is (Goodell) going to do?

"Ben Roethlisberger ... the NFL is running away from this like the plague. ... He should be suspended for at least eight games."

I always liked Amani

Roethlisberger may be no better of a human being than Pacman but the fact remains he has never been arrested. Jones has been arrested at least 6 times. If the NFL would suspend a player for 8 games that was not even charged in the incident in question I am thinking the players union would file a grievance immediately.

Gotta agree. Basically any sort of suspension is just to please the Mob.

This is an interesting description of people genuinely disgusted by Roeth's history. Is it always your tact to resort to name-calling when you find yourself in the minority view?

 

[delusional]

Knowing Goodell, probably 4 games.

Hate to see what would have happened if he was actually found guilty.

 

[ookook]

I think he just gets a talking-to.

He has not been CHARGED with a crime, let alone convicted.

Goodell is not the mindless disciplinarian folks here make him out to be. He is concerned about precedent and I am not sure he wants to go here.

Disclaimer: I have always thought Roethlisberger was overrated as a QB and as a humn being (if that were even possible).

 

[fatness]

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room. On the other hand, if she were raped I would also want her to pursue it to the end and get justice.

What if she chose not to, because the guy had the money to investigate, embarrass, and besmirch the hell out of her up to and during the trial?

 

[fatness]

Gotta agree. Basically any sort of suspension is just to please the Mob.

Both parties had been drinking alcohol prior to meeting each other. They did not know each other before this evening, but did meet at different bars throughout the night. They participated in conversations, some of a sexual nature. After midnight, Mr. Roethlisberger and his entourage were at the Capital City Club and the manager let them use the V.I.P. area. The victim went with her sorority sisters to the nightclub later. Mr. Roethlisberger invited them into the V.I.P. area where he provided shots of alcohol for them. Everyone agrees that the victim was highly intoxicated due to consuming alcohol. One of the bodyguards guided the victim down a back hallway. Mr. Roethlisberger followed her down the hallway into a small bathroom.

Link

 

[Hipple Long Ware & Peete]

yes, 2 games.

 

[TitusIII]

I'm sure the girl received a nice chunk of change from BR, and as much as I believe the guy is a piece of human $%#&, you can't go down this slippery slope. He may get 1 game, but even that is a stretch...one day his money will not be able to buy his innocence...

 

[dickey moe]

raise your hand if you would be in jail right now if having sex in a public bathroom was illegal......

Men's or Women's?

 

[az_prof]

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room. On the other hand, if she were raped I would also want her to pursue it to the end and get justice.

What if she chose not to, because the guy had the money to investigate, embarrass, and besmirch the hell out of her up to and during the trial?

If she is telling the truth then she has nothing to fear. In any case, you do the right thing. The only reason you wouldn't is if you have something to hide.

 

[az_prof]

Former NFL player Amani Toomer said he's watching closely and advocated a half-season suspension for Roethlisberger. He told ESPN Radio (via the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review):

"I'm interested to see what's going to happen with Roger Goodell, because there's precedent in this situation with Pacman Jones. He never got convicted of anything, but he got arrested a lot of times. What is (Goodell) going to do?

"Ben Roethlisberger ... the NFL is running away from this like the plague. ... He should be suspended for at least eight games."

I always liked Amani

Roethlisberger may be no better of a human being than Pacman but the fact remains he has never been arrested. Jones has been arrested at least 6 times. If the NFL would suspend a player for 8 games that was not even charged in the incident in question I am thinking the players union would file a grievance immediately.

Gotta agree. Basically any sort of suspension is just to please the Mob.

This is an interesting description of people genuinely disgusted by Roeth's history. Is it always your tact to resort to name-calling when you find yourself in the minority view?

Only when I find people engaging in Band Wagon thinking. I call it like it is. It certainly isn't justice. Justice relies upon the facts and a reasonable presentation of them. Do you think that the sort of character assassination we see here and elsewhere reflects people who even know the facts? I certainly don't. Beyond that, not only do most people have a complete disregard of the facts but they think they know the truth above and beyond any presentation of the facts. So, that's a mob mentality in my estimation. If I am wrong, please explain how you and your cohorts know more than the prosecutor who finally concluded that there were not even enough facts to present probable cause and arrest/charge?

 

[Steeler]

Only when I find people engaging in Band Wagon thinking. I call it like it is. It certainly isn't justice. Justice relies upon the facts and a reasonable presentation of them. Do you think that the sort of character assassination we see here and elsewhere reflects people who even know the facts? I certainly don't. Beyond that, not only do most people have a complete disregard of the facts but they think they know the truth above and beyond any presentation of the facts. So, that's a mob mentality in my estimation. If I am wrong, please explain how you and your cohorts know more than the prosecutor who finally concluded that there were not even enough facts to present probable cause and arrest/charge?

Justice was served in this case because Ben wasn't charged with a crime, and I don't know anybody saying he should have been charged. However, I (and others) can still view his behavior as unsavory even if there isn't enough evidence for the legal system to proceed.And let me be clear: he can hook up with an different 20 year old every night if he wants to as long as they are willing. I'm just not sure she was willing based on what the DA said in his presser.

 

[fatness]

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room. On the other hand, if she were raped I would also want her to pursue it to the end and get justice.

What if she chose not to, because the guy had the money to investigate, embarrass, and besmirch the hell out of her up to and during the trial?

If she is telling the truth then she has nothing to fear. In any case, you do the right thing. The only reason you wouldn't is if you have something to hide.

Just to be clear here, if she chose not to proceed for that reason, you'd be saying your daughter was a liar?

 

[Godsbrother]

Justice was served in this case because Ben wasn't charged with a crime, and I don't know anybody saying he should have been charged. However, I (and others) can still view his behavior as unsavory even if there isn't enough evidence for the legal system to proceed.

Agreed. However I am thinking that unsavory behavior will not result in an 8-game suspension as Mr. Toomer suggests. The NFL wants this to go away as quickly as possible and is not going to want to deal with a grievance from the players union. For that reason I see a 1 or 2-game suspension or pehaps a 3-game suspension with a reduction if Ben can behave himself.

 

[Birdie048]

The biggest issue I see Ben having is that IF he paid the Georgia 20 yo student to not press charges, and the Nevade Lawyer gets he to testify for their case as a "trend" of behavior, it would open a whole can of nasty for him.

 

[B-Deep]

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room. On the other hand, if she were raped I would also want her to pursue it to the end and get justice.

What if she chose not to, because the guy had the money to investigate, embarrass, and besmirch the hell out of her up to and during the trial?

If she is telling the truth then she has nothing to fear. In any case, you do the right thing. The only reason you wouldn't is if you have something to hide.

you are kind of slimeyIn case you have never known a rape victim, even when there background is CRYSTAL clear a trial is VERY tough. If there's even the slightest thing they are not proud of in their past, knowing it could be brought up is going to be the worlds business is a big deal. And even if not, facing the person who raped you and listening to him say how you wanted it is tough So yes, if she is telling the truth what she has to fear is a high priced attorney calling her a whore digging through hr past to find any dirt, and saying she wanted the man who forced himself on her (assuming her allegations are true) so there is a LOT she has to fear.I have no idea what went into her decision to ask for thi to be dropped. All it tells me is she did not want to carry on with it. A lot of rape cases go unpursued, and additudes like yours contribute to it.

 

[Stinkin Ref]

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room. On the other hand, if she were raped I would also want her to pursue it to the end and get justice.

What if she chose not to, because the guy had the money to investigate, embarrass, and besmirch the hell out of her up to and during the trial?

If she is telling the truth then she has nothing to fear. In any case, you do the right thing. The only reason you wouldn't is if you have something to hide.

you are kind of slimeyIn case you have never known a rape victim, even when there background is CRYSTAL clear a trial is VERY tough. If there's even the slightest thing they are not proud of in their past, knowing it could be brought up is going to be the worlds business is a big deal. And even if not, facing the person who raped you and listening to him say how you wanted it is tough So yes, if she is telling the truth what she has to fear is a high priced attorney calling her a whore digging through hr past to find any dirt, and saying she wanted the man who forced himself on her (assuming her allegations are true) so there is a LOT she has to fear.I have no idea what went into her decision to ask for thi to be dropped. All it tells me is she did not want to carry on with it. A lot of rape cases go unpursued, and additudes like yours contribute to it.

what you wrote is pretty common knowledge to everyone and something she probably knew before going to the po-po in the first place.....if you are going to make a pretty serious accusation you have to consider that it will involve serious circumstances and you better be willing to follow through with it and see it to the end....otherwise if there is no risk to making a serious accusation against someone, it would happen all the time.....not speaking directly to this case, but any type of accusation.......if covering up your dirty laundry and not wanting to put up with some tough testimony starts to outweigh the hurt that was caused to you in your accusation, then that is a decision you have to make, and then you can't hold it against people if they start to wonder about the truth behind your initial accuusation....not neccessarily right, but the way it goesquite honestly I think Ben is a dirt-bag.....but that doesn't have a ton to do with the way things work

 

[Holy Schneikes]

I am absolutely amazed that there is even any consideration of a suspension.

As many have mentioned, unless there are some more FACTS to the story that I don't know about, I have no idea what he would be suspended FOR. Having sex with a 20 year old girl in a bathroom as a single 28 year old guy is not illegal. It may be immoral depending on the circumstances, but it certainly isn't illegal.

Sure, the league can and does suspend players for doing things that aren't illegal if they aren't good for the league or within the rules of the league, but again, I'm not sure what the suspension would be for.

I am sick to death of the smoke/fire analogy. The first claim against the guy was absolute BS. Please, look back at the details of that "case". Read the results of all of that and tell me how it should brand this guy forever with the "this isn't the first accusation so..." nonsense. That woman was looking to get PAID and it was painfully obvious (which is why there was never a criminal charge, and the even the civil suit was dropped very quickly after the facts came out). So because of THAT, he is instantly less credible if someone accuses him of a similar crime? Ridiculous.

Then we have "what if he BOUGHT his way out of it"? A) We have no idea if that happened. Any assumption would be a complete guess. Are we going to suspend a guy based on a compete guess? B) Even he DID do that, what was he "buying"? Did he commit a crime and buying his way out of being accountable for it? OR, is it possible that he DIDN'T commit a crime, but is willing to spend some money to not have his name drug through the mud any more than it already has been. I know I would consider it. So do we suspend a guy for that?

Then we have the always lovely "What if it was YOUR daughter" routine. Guess what, it doesn't matter. Would I be angrier about a real crime? Absolutely. But that's why they don't make angry fathers of accusing daughters judges or jury members. Little things like facts and evidence should matter a bit more than emotional responses based on complete conjecture (sound familiar?). If he was guilty of rape or even sexual assault, yeah - put him away. It's an awful crime. But have NO real evidence that that occurred. None. If there was evidence, he'd be charged right now.

Then we have ANOTHER favorite of mine. "Yeah, the DA didn't charge him, but he wanted to. He believed her." WHAT?? Where is this awesome piece of legal analysis coming from? Now the "TONE" of a DA's announcement that there is not enough evidence to even support a hearing is grounds for suspension? Riiiight. The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Then we have the illustrious Amani Toomer (esquire) suggesting a large suspension is in order based on the Pacman case. Problem is, Amani flat out states that Pacman was never convicted of anything which is of course 100% incorrect. Pacman was CONVICTED at least three times, one of which was a felony. And he was charged with a BUNCH of felonies. Ben has not been charged or convicted of anything. Talk about your apples and oranges.

Oh, and I also love all of the "If that was me, I'd be fired" nonsense. In short, NO, you wouldn't be. If you were fired for something somebody accused you of but you were never even charged for (it wouldn't happen, but if it did), you'd be on the phone to your lawyer immediately. I was once accused of (and brought in to the "station" for questioning for) beating a homeless guy with a baseball bat and putting him into a coma. Why? Because my bike was parked in front of a frat house (I lived down the street, and the available spots happened to be up the road that day), and some witnesses to the crime heard someone say "get away from my bike". That's an awful crime, but I'm sure glad I didn't get kicked out of school for it.

Now that I have all that off my chest, let me say that I think Ben R is an idiot. I think he likely has low moral standards, and I have NO problem if my favorite team wants to get rid of him based on that. They know him better than I do. I'd be happy to cheer for somebody else who SEEMS like a better, more appreciative guy (not that we ever really know for sure).

But for the league to suspend this guy would be an absolute travesty IMO. You just don't punish people for unproved accusations.

 

[Godsbrother]

In case you have never known a rape victim, even when there background is CRYSTAL clear a trial is VERY tough. If there's even the slightest thing they are not proud of in their past, knowing it could be brought up is going to be the worlds business is a big deal. And even if not, facing the person who raped you and listening to him say how you wanted it is tough So yes, if she is telling the truth what she has to fear is a high priced attorney calling her a whore digging through hr past to find any dirt, and saying she wanted the man who forced himself on her (assuming her allegations are true) so there is a LOT she has to fear.I have no idea what went into her decision to ask for thi to be dropped. All it tells me is she did not want to carry on with it. A lot of rape cases go unpursued, and additudes like yours contribute to it.

In this case it seemed liked there was not much of a chance of a conviction so what is to be gained by putting yourself through a lengthy trial? No doubt that had this goine to trial a lot of less-than-flattering details of the young lady's actions that night would be brought up in excrutiating detail. She is likely going to get a sizable monetary settlement and while her accuser won't be going to jail he is certainly paying a price for his actions that night, which should make her feel that at least some justice has been served. On the other hand if she wasn't truly raped then she did the right thing by not pressing charges.

 

[Black]

He should be suspended for that terrible Mickey Rourke hair do. C'mon Ben...pay for a real haircut.

 

[treat88]

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room.

Haven't you heard...nobody's daughter here does that? It's just everyone else's daughter. From your perspective, I can understand why you think they deserve everything they get.

So...if all the mothers, wives, and daughters you associate with have drunk, public restroom sex and you are good with that...what do you think Ben did wrong again?

 

[Copeman]

He should be suspended for that terrible Mickey Rourke hair do. C'mon Ben...pay for a real haircut.

Link

 

[Steeler]

The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Exactly right. However, being a scumbag can get you suspended too

 

[Holy Schneikes]

The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Exactly right. However, being a scumbag can get you suspended too :(

Not really. There are a lot of scumbags out there, and none of them were suspended JUST for being scumbags that I can think of. Suspensions are based on actual crimes and/or ACTIONS detrimental to the league. What action that we KNOW Ben took was detrimental to the league?Being at a bar?Having sex with a girl he met at a bar?Drinking and getting drunk with a girl at a bar?He's a scumbag IMO because he was taking advantage of his fame and picking up young girls. At 28, that's kind of slimy. But that's all we know for sure. And I don't think the league can suspend a guy for that unless it wants to suspend a nice hefty portion of the league.

 

[Jeremy]

Justice was served in this case because Ben wasn't charged with a crime, and I don't know anybody saying he should have been charged. However, I (and others) can still view his behavior as unsavory even if there isn't enough evidence for the legal system to proceed.

Agreed. However I am thinking that unsavory behavior will not result in an 8-game suspension as Mr. Toomer suggests. The NFL wants this to go away as quickly as possible and is not going to want to deal with a grievance from the players union. For that reason I see a 1 or 2-game suspension or pehaps a 3-game suspension with a reduction if Ben can behave himself.

I voted 4 games in the poll, but I'm more coming around to your thinking on this. 2 games seems the most likely. Any more than that and you're inviting a fight from the union, like you said. On the other hand, if they don't at least slap his wrist, there's going to be accusations of favorable treatment for star players and/or white players. I guess I'm glad I'm not Goodell, because he's sort of in a no win situation here. Suspending players who are never even charged with a crime seems like a slippery slope. But a whole lot of people think he raped that girl, or at least violated her in some way. I wouldn't complain if they didn't suspend him, but a lot of people would, and it would be a PR nightmare if they "let him off". I'm actually more curious to see what the Steelers organization does. When I was a kid, if I got in trouble at school and my parents found out, the punishment at home was far, far worse. I wouldn't be surprise if that same kind of thing applies here.

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

The Steelers probably have to suspend him just to keep the peace in the locker room.Former teammate marvel smith had this to say:

``“I’m not going to say Ben gets away with a lot, but he’s held to a different standard, for sure. If they plan on using Santonio [Holmes] as a scapegoat for that, they are going to have a huge issue in that locker room. Guys already feel like, I guess you can say, they put Ben on a pedestal. He gets away with more than any other guy on the team would.”

 

[Steeler]

The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Exactly right. However, being a scumbag can get you suspended too

Not really. There are a lot of scumbags out there, and none of them were suspended JUST for being scumbags that I can think of. Suspensions are based on actual crimes and/or ACTIONS detrimental to the league. What action that we KNOW Ben took was detrimental to the league?Being at a bar?Having sex with a girl he met at a bar?Drinking and getting drunk with a girl at a bar?He's a scumbag IMO because he was taking advantage of his fame and picking up young girls. At 28, that's kind of slimy. But that's all we know for sure. And I don't think the league can suspend a guy for that unless it wants to suspend a nice hefty portion of the league.

You didn't mention the fact that she was by all accounts totally hammered, that Ben used a body guard to help isolate her from her friends, and that she sustained some kind of injuries during their encounter.... that level of scumbagery is enough for a suspention.

 

[az_prof]

I have a 20 year old daughter and she doesn't go out drinking and bar hopping until 1:30 in the morning, flirting and hanging out in private parties where only women are allowed into the room.

Haven't you heard...nobody's daughter here does that? It's just everyone else's daughter. From your perspective, I can understand why you think they deserve everything they get.

I never said "they deserve everything they get." Whatever that means. I am saying as my father used to tell me that "it takes two to tango." I am saying that if you go out bar hopping and drinking and flirting with men (when you are underage) and stay out until 1:30 in the morning that you have to bear some responsibility and realize that behavior like this is immature and will lead to situations. I am saying that this is more complicated than some innocent "girl" (she's a woman) being "taken advantage of." It sounds a lot more like she wanted to party and then she felt ashamed after her friends made an issue out what she had done with Ben.

 

[Jeremy]

The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Exactly right. However, being a scumbag can get you suspended too

Not really. There are a lot of scumbags out there, and none of them were suspended JUST for being scumbags that I can think of. Suspensions are based on actual crimes and/or ACTIONS detrimental to the league. What action that we KNOW Ben took was detrimental to the league?Being at a bar?

Having sex with a girl he met at a bar?

Drinking and getting drunk with a girl at a bar?

He's a scumbag IMO because he was taking advantage of his fame and picking up young girls. At 28, that's kind of slimy. But that's all we know for sure. And I don't think the league can suspend a guy for that unless it wants to suspend a nice hefty portion of the league.

It's quite a bit more scumbaggy than that. She was by all reports, extremely drunk. All human decency says a woman that drunk is off limits. Or is there no honor in the world anymore?

 

[az_prof]

The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Exactly right. However, being a scumbag can get you suspended too

Not really. There are a lot of scumbags out there, and none of them were suspended JUST for being scumbags that I can think of. Suspensions are based on actual crimes and/or ACTIONS detrimental to the league. What action that we KNOW Ben took was detrimental to the league?Being at a bar?Having sex with a girl he met at a bar?Drinking and getting drunk with a girl at a bar?He's a scumbag IMO because he was taking advantage of his fame and picking up young girls. At 28, that's kind of slimy. But that's all we know for sure. And I don't think the league can suspend a guy for that unless it wants to suspend a nice hefty portion of the league.

You didn't mention the fact that she was by all accounts totally hammered, that Ben used a body guard to help isolate her from her friends, and that she sustained some kind of injuries during their encounter.... that level of scumbagery is enough for a suspention.

Again, you are inferring a lot of things that you don't know. She was hammered? So was he. Why is he the responsible one? If anyone is responsible for them being hammered it is the bar. You infer that he used his body guard to isolate her. Let's remember that his body guards are off duty cops. How you characterize it could be what happened or it could be that his security was trying to make sure he was safe.Being at a bar is not conduct detrimental.Being drunk is a problem if you drive or break the law as a result. But if being drunk in a bar with a designated driver is conduct detrimental then over half the league needs to be suspended I presume.Having sex with a 20 year old? Again, better suspend half the league. I don't know why you think a 28 year old being with a 20 year old is "slimey." I think at bottom we have alot of people who want to impose their morality on others. They object to him having sex outside of marriage. Again, that may offend you but we don't live under Sharia as in Islamic theocracies. We have the freedom to carry guns; drink; gamble; and yes, even have sex. That's called personal liberty and if it offends your morality, too bad.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Exactly right. However, being a scumbag can get you suspended too

Not really. There are a lot of scumbags out there, and none of them were suspended JUST for being scumbags that I can think of. Suspensions are based on actual crimes and/or ACTIONS detrimental to the league. What action that we KNOW Ben took was detrimental to the league?Being at a bar?Having sex with a girl he met at a bar?Drinking and getting drunk with a girl at a bar?He's a scumbag IMO because he was taking advantage of his fame and picking up young girls. At 28, that's kind of slimy. But that's all we know for sure. And I don't think the league can suspend a guy for that unless it wants to suspend a nice hefty portion of the league.

You didn't mention the fact that she was by all accounts totally hammered, that Ben used a body guard to help isolate her from her friends, and that she sustained some kind of injuries during their encounter.... that level of scumbagery is enough for a suspention.

Actually, I did mention (or allude to) the fact that she was hammered. And that is part of what makes him a scumbag, but is something a lot of other players in the NFL are likely to have done.As for the body guard, that makes no sense. The body guard was there to watch out for Ben. That is what he was hired for. That doesn't mean he couldn't have taken other actions or had other effects on the situation - hard to know. But where else would a body guard be? If he wasn't outside that door or in the immediate vicinity, he wouldn't be a very good body guard.Similarly, the fact that a drunk girl sustained injuries in a bar bathroom during a (probably) sexual encounter doesn't make Ben's scumbaggery any more "punishable" to me. Like I have been saying, there is no evidence those injuries were purposefully caused by Ben. If there were any evidence of that, Ben would be charged with a crime. So you absolutely can not (IMO) punish him for something he wasn't even charged with doing.Which leads us back to "suspend him for something someone accused him of but there is no evidence of", or "suspend him for scoring with a drunk chick at a bar", neither of which makes sense to me.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

I don't know why you think a 28 year old being with a 20 year old is "slimey."

He didn't say that, I did. I think the circumstances were slimey. The age difference wasn't the only factor IMO, but it is a factor. Getting a college age girl drunk on shots and then banging her in a bar bathroom is borderline slimey even for a college kid, but it's a little more slimey (again, IMO) for a guy Ben's age and in his position. Seems like he should just grow up to me.You are right though, it is strictly a personal, moral judgment on my part, and nothing that should be a punishable action.

 

[Holy Schneikes]

The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Exactly right. However, being a scumbag can get you suspended too

Not really. There are a lot of scumbags out there, and none of them were suspended JUST for being scumbags that I can think of. Suspensions are based on actual crimes and/or ACTIONS detrimental to the league. What action that we KNOW Ben took was detrimental to the league?Being at a bar?

Having sex with a girl he met at a bar?

Drinking and getting drunk with a girl at a bar?

He's a scumbag IMO because he was taking advantage of his fame and picking up young girls. At 28, that's kind of slimy. But that's all we know for sure. And I don't think the league can suspend a guy for that unless it wants to suspend a nice hefty portion of the league.

It's quite a bit more scumbaggy than that. She was by all reports, extremely drunk. All human decency says a woman that drunk is off limits. Or is there no honor in the world anymore?

The question isn't "Is Ben a scumbag?", or "Would you let your daughter date Ben?", it's "Should/will Ben be suspended by his employer for the actions he took?". Very different questions.

 

[Jeremy]

The tone may very well indicate that the DA though Ben is a scumbag. But he can be a scumbag without any laws being broken.

Exactly right. However, being a scumbag can get you suspended too

Not really. There are a lot of scumbags out there, and none of them were suspended JUST for being scumbags that I can think of. Suspensions are based on actual crimes and/or ACTIONS detrimental to the league. What action that we KNOW Ben took was detrimental to the league?Being at a bar?

Having sex with a girl he met at a bar?

Drinking and getting drunk with a girl at a bar?

He's a scumbag IMO because he was taking advantage of his fame and picking up young girls. At 28, that's kind of slimy. But that's all we know for sure. And I don't think the league can suspend a guy for that unless it wants to suspend a nice hefty portion of the league.

It's quite a bit more scumbaggy than that. She was by all reports, extremely drunk. All human decency says a woman that drunk is off limits. Or is there no honor in the world anymore?

The question isn't "Is Ben a scumbag?", or "Would you let your daughter date Ben?", it's "Should/will Ben be suspended by his employer for the actions he took?". Very different questions.

That's true, and on that question I'm fine with anything in the 0-2 games range from the league. I just thought you were greatly understating the level of his scumbaggines. You've got to be a real POS to take a woman that drunk to a bathroom and having your way with her knowing that she's that impaired. Let's be honest enough to admit it was more than "having sex at a bar". It's not slimy because he's 28. It's slimy because it's slimy all on its own. Whether or not being "slimy" is enough to get you suspended by the NFL...we'll I guess we'll find out. Admittedly, having a person suspended without criminal charges ever being filed is a questionable position to take by the NFL. It'll be interesting to see if the union will challenge it (assuming it happens).

 

[treat88]

Posted this in the other thread as well.

Fact is this incident can be spun many different ways, anywhere from deviant and sinister to normal and innocent.

I believe that most of the direction one chooses to spin it is based on influences other than the specifics of the case: perception of the Steelers/Roeth, perceptions of men/women, life experiences etc.

With that said, serious question. If a man is accused of a crime of this nature, what does it take to exonerate him in the public eye? Is that even possible?

In Ben's case we have a young woman who is refusing to press charges and a DA that has stated there isn't enough evidence to meet the threshold of probable cause.

Without being intentionally leading, what more is required for a man, or Ben in this case, to be fully exonerated?

 

[Leeroy Jenkins]

An Open Letter To Big Ben

 

[Steeler]

But if being drunk in a bar with a designated driver is conduct detrimental then over half the league needs to be suspended I presume.Having sex with a 20 year old? Again, better suspend half the league. I don't know why you think a 28 year old being with a 20 year old is "slimey." I think at bottom we have alot of people who want to impose their morality on others. They object to him having sex outside of marriage. Again, that may offend you but we don't live under Sharia as in Islamic theocracies. We have the freedom to carry guns; drink; gamble; and yes, even have sex. That's called personal liberty and if it offends your morality, too bad.

Now who's inferring too much about my comments