thatguy
Footballguy
Bad posting. See my post above.higgins said:
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World's Greatest Draft (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter timschochet
- Start date
Abrantes
Footballguy
Very nice pick. Dude's compositions are exquisite, but once again, I have no idea where he'll end up in the ranking.
thatguy
Footballguy
Hell, I'll repost it, and bold the parts that make my case:
III. Mohandas Gandhi (1869-1948)
When Gandhi was studying law in London 1894, he wrote a "Guide to London," which mentioned of Tolstoy that "few men have been more given to wine and cigarettes... a man stupefies himself with these stimulants..."14 This, Gandhi's first reference to Tolstoy, suggests that his knowledge came through vegetarian and health literature. Gandhi was not deeply moved until the publication of The Kingdom of God is Within You, a book which, he wrote, "overwhelmed me."15
The circumstances of this event are interesting. Gandhi was 24, living alone in Pretoria, South Africa. He compared Tolstoy's teaching to that of the fundamentalists who had been pressing him to accept Christ. "Before the independent thinking, profound morality, and the truthfulness of this book, all the books given me ... paled into insignificance," he wrote.16 This suggests that he did not find these qualities in his missionary friends. It also suggests that this was what he was searching for.
Gandhi later wrote of Tolstoy's book, "Its reading cured me of my skepticism and made me a firm believer in ahimsa [nonviolence]."17 It also helped him resolve the question of religious identity, for Tolstoy's Christianity was not based on special revelation, but was simply one instance of a universal law. The law of love was the mark of true religion in every tradition. Gandhi thereafter understood Christianity in Tolstoy's way. It liberated him from orthodoxy, as it had liberated Tolstoy, and provided a foundation for his identification with Hinduism.
Ten years pass before we find another reference to Tolstoy in Gandhi's writings, though he had read many of Tolstoy's pamphlets and books, and kept a picture of Tolstoy in his law office.
When Gandhi was in London in 1909, he sent a letter to Tolstoy about the condition British Indians in South Africa. Tolstoy responded, "I have just received your most interesting letter which has give me great pleasure. God helps our dear brothers and co-workers in the Transvaal. That same struggle of the tender against the harsh, of meekness and love against pride and violence, is every year making itself more and more felt here among us also, especially in one of the very sharpest of the conflicts of the religious law with the worldly laws - in refusals of military service. Such refusals are becoming ever more and more frequent... I greet you fraternally, and am glad to have intercourse with you."18
Gandhi continued the correspondence. Gandhi wrote 5 times to Tolstoy, and Tolstoy wrote 3 times to Gandhi. Tolstoy's last letter to Gandhi stated, "Your activity is the most essential work, the most important of all the work now being done in the world."19 Tolstoy died on November 7, 1910.
Despite Gandhi's admiration for Tolstoy, and his consistent citation of Tolstoy as the greatest proponent of nonviolence, there were significant differences between them. "Gandhi differed from Tolstoy both in his much more positive attitude toward the state and the nation, and in his belief in the need for active resistance to evil."20
Tolstoy taught absolute non-resistance. He believed that all coercive action was forbidden by Jesus, and this included almost all actions of government, not only war. He believed that as religion was based on the Law of Love, and the state was based on violence, they were incompatible. He also believed that the power which would undermine the state and permit a return to true religion was consistent individual refusal to cooperate. Such individual action could also lead to the formation of small voluntary communities of non-resistants living the new life and spreading the doctrine.
Gandhi taught nonviolent resistance. While asserting, with Tolstoy, the ethical primacy of nonviolence, he believed in taking purposive action to remove evils and to establish a better society. Unlike Tolstoy, Gandhi did not see nonviolent action as simply the refusal to participate in state violence, but as a means of inducing the state to change its policies. He took a more political route, seeking not to supplant the state with a perfectionist society, but to transform it by the efficacy of nonviolent means of social reform. Thus Gandhian nonviolence is not non-resistance, it is nonviolent resistance or nonviolent transformation.
III. Mohandas Gandhi (1869-1948)
When Gandhi was studying law in London 1894, he wrote a "Guide to London," which mentioned of Tolstoy that "few men have been more given to wine and cigarettes... a man stupefies himself with these stimulants..."14 This, Gandhi's first reference to Tolstoy, suggests that his knowledge came through vegetarian and health literature. Gandhi was not deeply moved until the publication of The Kingdom of God is Within You, a book which, he wrote, "overwhelmed me."15
The circumstances of this event are interesting. Gandhi was 24, living alone in Pretoria, South Africa. He compared Tolstoy's teaching to that of the fundamentalists who had been pressing him to accept Christ. "Before the independent thinking, profound morality, and the truthfulness of this book, all the books given me ... paled into insignificance," he wrote.16 This suggests that he did not find these qualities in his missionary friends. It also suggests that this was what he was searching for.
Gandhi later wrote of Tolstoy's book, "Its reading cured me of my skepticism and made me a firm believer in ahimsa [nonviolence]."17 It also helped him resolve the question of religious identity, for Tolstoy's Christianity was not based on special revelation, but was simply one instance of a universal law. The law of love was the mark of true religion in every tradition. Gandhi thereafter understood Christianity in Tolstoy's way. It liberated him from orthodoxy, as it had liberated Tolstoy, and provided a foundation for his identification with Hinduism.
Ten years pass before we find another reference to Tolstoy in Gandhi's writings, though he had read many of Tolstoy's pamphlets and books, and kept a picture of Tolstoy in his law office.
When Gandhi was in London in 1909, he sent a letter to Tolstoy about the condition British Indians in South Africa. Tolstoy responded, "I have just received your most interesting letter which has give me great pleasure. God helps our dear brothers and co-workers in the Transvaal. That same struggle of the tender against the harsh, of meekness and love against pride and violence, is every year making itself more and more felt here among us also, especially in one of the very sharpest of the conflicts of the religious law with the worldly laws - in refusals of military service. Such refusals are becoming ever more and more frequent... I greet you fraternally, and am glad to have intercourse with you."18
Gandhi continued the correspondence. Gandhi wrote 5 times to Tolstoy, and Tolstoy wrote 3 times to Gandhi. Tolstoy's last letter to Gandhi stated, "Your activity is the most essential work, the most important of all the work now being done in the world."19 Tolstoy died on November 7, 1910.
Despite Gandhi's admiration for Tolstoy, and his consistent citation of Tolstoy as the greatest proponent of nonviolence, there were significant differences between them. "Gandhi differed from Tolstoy both in his much more positive attitude toward the state and the nation, and in his belief in the need for active resistance to evil."20
Tolstoy taught absolute non-resistance. He believed that all coercive action was forbidden by Jesus, and this included almost all actions of government, not only war. He believed that as religion was based on the Law of Love, and the state was based on violence, they were incompatible. He also believed that the power which would undermine the state and permit a return to true religion was consistent individual refusal to cooperate. Such individual action could also lead to the formation of small voluntary communities of non-resistants living the new life and spreading the doctrine.
Gandhi taught nonviolent resistance. While asserting, with Tolstoy, the ethical primacy of nonviolence, he believed in taking purposive action to remove evils and to establish a better society. Unlike Tolstoy, Gandhi did not see nonviolent action as simply the refusal to participate in state violence, but as a means of inducing the state to change its policies. He took a more political route, seeking not to supplant the state with a perfectionist society, but to transform it by the efficacy of nonviolent means of social reform. Thus Gandhian nonviolence is not non-resistance, it is nonviolent resistance or nonviolent transformation.
higgins
Footballguy
Bad posting. See my post above.higgins said:
Deleted my post as soon as I saw it had merit -- learn something new every day.
thatguy
Footballguy
Bad posting. See my post above.higgins said:
larry_boy_44
Footballguy
its a great pick if you look at influence... a bit early since he isn't as 'literary' as others, but still a great pick...almost anything that is labelled "fantasy" is based upon his work... D&D, Final Fantasy, Warcraft... everything...So...that's an interesting pick.J. R. R. Tolkien = Author - might be a little early but I have to follow Yankee's advice after losing Joan of Arc.
krista4
Footballguy
I'll remain open-minded-ish. The write-up on this one will be important.its a great pick if you look at influence... a bit early since he isn't as 'literary' as others, but still a great pick...almost anything that is labelled "fantasy" is based upon his work... D&D, Final Fantasy, Warcraft... everything...So...that's an interesting pick.J. R. R. Tolkien = Author - might be a little early but I have to follow Yankee's advice after losing Joan of Arc.
Orange Crush
Footballguy
My first thought was this was a rather silly line of argument.But I think it has an interesting correlation to the judging of painters. I guess one could argue that fantasy is a 'movement" within fiction, and Tolkein is certainly the 'father' of that movement. Just as other 'movements' might include science fiction, etc.its a great pick if you look at influence... a bit early since he isn't as 'literary' as others, but still a great pick...almost anything that is labelled "fantasy" is based upon his work... D&D, Final Fantasy, Warcraft... everything...So...that's an interesting pick.
HERBERT THE HIPPO
REAL Ultimate Power
What pick are we up to?
thatguy
Footballguy
Depends on who is on auto skip I know at one time or another both DC Thunder and Doug B have been on auto skip. If they still are, Mad Sweeney is up.
Abrantes
Footballguy
Last pick was Renoir at 7.07.
Thorn
Footballguy
Mad sweeney PMed me at the beginnning of the day to be notified via PM bc the other two were on auto skip. I don't know that they are, but I'm sending him a PM now.
John Maddens Lunchbox
Footballguy
Doesn't LarryBoy still owe 1?
Boy this has been slow today
Boy this has been slow today
Yankee23Fan
Fair Tax!
I think my team is solid up and down at this point - heck all of them are. Those last 6 or so rounds are going to be key I think.
John Maddens Lunchbox
Footballguy
Round 7
2. Larry Boy 44 - Skipped
8. DC Thunder - Autoskip
9. Doug B - Autoskip
10. Mad Sweeney - UP - Times out at XX:26
11. Big Rocks
12. higgins
13. John Madden's Lunchbox
14. Usual21
15. thatguy
16. Andy Dufresne
17. Herbert The Hippo
18. Bobbylayne
19. Mister CIA
20. Abrantes
2. Larry Boy 44 - Skipped
8. DC Thunder - Autoskip
9. Doug B - Autoskip
10. Mad Sweeney - UP - Times out at XX:26
11. Big Rocks
12. higgins
13. John Madden's Lunchbox
14. Usual21
15. thatguy
16. Andy Dufresne
17. Herbert The Hippo
18. Bobbylayne
19. Mister CIA
20. Abrantes
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Thorn
Footballguy
Yes larry still owes his 7.02
Round Six
19. Larry Boy 44 - Raphael (posted late)
20. Mario Kart - JRR Tolkien (posted by FUBAR)
Round Seven
1. Mario Kart - John Maynard Keyes (posted by FUBAR)
2. Larry Boy 44 - ???? still timed out from round 6
3. Arsenal of Doom - Charles Martel
4. FUBAR - Antoine-Laurent de Lavoiser
5. Acer FC - Martin Luther King, Jr.
6. Yankee23 Fan - St. Augustine of Hippo
7. Thorn - Pierre-August Renoir
8. DCThunder - autoskip?
9. Doug B - autoskip?
10. Mad Sweeney - PM sent, not sure if he's up
John Maddens Lunchbox
Footballguy
DC Thunder & Doug B have said they could be skipped. Mad Sweeney has 14 more minutes left
Thorn
Footballguy
Ok, FWIW I didn't PM mad sweeney until 4:01 EST.
thatguy
Footballguy
Well, I think it's been said that PM's are a nice gesture but not necessary.... I've seen Mad Sweeney in here for the past hour or so,Ok, FWIW I didn't PM mad sweeney until 4:01 EST.
mad sweeney
Footballguy
Posting from iPhone so no bells and whistles. Going with the greatest of Greek tragedians who fits in nicely with my previous pick.
Sophocles
I can't Pm big rocks if someone else would be so kind.
Sophocles
I can't Pm big rocks if someone else would be so kind.
Thorn
Footballguy
Yup, he is writing now.Well, I think it's been said that PM's are a nice gesture but not necessary.... I've seen Mad Sweeney in here for the past hour or so,Ok, FWIW I didn't PM mad sweeney until 4:01 EST.
thatguy
Footballguy
Nice pick, and definitely fits in nicely with Freud. You continue to dominate this draft. I think Sophocles is a surefire top 5 in his category.ETA: Well, maybe not surefire top 5, but I would say absolutely no worse than 8th.
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Thorn
Footballguy
done
Big Rocks
Footballguy
I had no knowledge of this guy, but in researching him he appears to be influential during and after his life. Hopefully he will get a good ranking from the judges.
7.11 Masaccio, painter
Some of his famous works include Holy Trinity and The Expulsion from the Garden of Eden
Some highlights from wiki:
7.11 Masaccio, painter
Some of his famous works include Holy Trinity and The Expulsion from the Garden of Eden
Some highlights from wiki:
Yankee23Fan
Fair Tax!
In the end with my pick I kept going back and forth with Augustine and Sophocles. Solid choice.
HERBERT THE HIPPO
REAL Ultimate Power
You can't go wrong with a hippo.
Ozymandias
Footballguy
One of the problems is that some people fit more than one category. Makes them hard to classify, because the drafter has the option of changing them.
John Maddens Lunchbox
Footballguy
Also lately a lot of people aren't listing the categories as they draft someone
higgins
Footballguy
It's only a matter of time before this gets sniped, and I want it. This artist doesn't necessarily have the the quantity of work, simply because the scale of what we're talking about makes it impossible...
7.12 - Ustad Ahmad Lahauri, Artist/Non-Painter
One of the 'New Seven Wonders of the World'.
Taj Mahal
The Persian architect, Ustad Ahmad Lahauri is generally considered to be the principal designer of the Taj Mahal. Shah Jahan's 1648 memorial to wife Mumtaz Mahal, would, in 1983, be cited as "the jewel of Muslim art in India and one of the universally admired masterpieces of the world's heritage."
In 1631, Shah Jahan, emperor during the Mughal empire's period of greatest prosperity, was griefstricken when his third wife, Mumtaz Mahal, died during the birth of their fourteenth child, Gauhara Begum. In her dying breath, Mumtaz Mahal urged Shah Jahan to build a mausoleum for her that the world has never seen before. Shah Jahan granted his wife's wish, and construction of the Taj Mahal began in 1632, one year after her death. The court chronicles of Shah Jahan's grief illustrates the love story traditionally held as an inspiration for Taj Mahal. The construction of Taj Mahal begun soon after Mumtaz's death with the principal mausoleum completed in 1648. The surrounding buildings and garden were finished five years later. Emperor Shah Jahan himself described the Taj in these words:
"Should guilty seek asylum here,
Like one pardoned, he becomes free from sin.
Should a sinner make his way to this mansion,
All his past sins are to be washed away.
The sight of this mansion creates sorrowing sighs;
And the sun and the moon shed tears from their eyes.
In this world this edifice has been made;
To display thereby the creator's glory."
Typically, though not entirely, Islamic art has focused on the depiction of patterns and Arabic calligraphy, rather than on figures, because it is feared by many Muslims that the depiction of the human form is idolatry and thereby a sin against Allah, forbidden in the Qur'an.
The Mughal reign in India lasted from 1526 until 1828, when the English seized the country and created their protectorate. Architecture was accorded a place of honor within Mughal art, with the development of a distinctive plan and the creation of the Taj Mahal. The arts of jewelry and the carving of hard stones, such as jade, were also cultivated; the series of hard stone daggers in the form of horses’ heads is particularly impressive.
Estimates of the cost of the construction of Taj Mahal vary due to difficulties in estimating construction costs across time. The total cost of construction has been estimated to be about 32 million Rupees at that time which now runs into trillions of Dollars if converted to present currency rates.
The Taj Mahal was constructed using materials from all over India and Asia. Over 1,000 elephants were used to transport building materials during the construction. The translucent white marble was brought from Rajasthan, the jasper from Punjab, jade and crystal from China. The turquoise was from Tibet and the Lapis lazuli from Afghanistan, while the sapphire came from Sri Lanka and the carnelian from Arabia. In all, twenty eight types of precious and semi-precious stones were inlaid into the white marble.
A labour force of twenty thousand workers was recruited across northern India. Sculptors from Bukhara, calligraphers from Syria and Persia, inlayers from southern India, stonecutters from Baluchistan, a specialist in building turrets, another who carved only marble flowers were part of the thirty-seven men who formed the creative unit.
bonus pic
7.12 - Ustad Ahmad Lahauri, Artist/Non-Painter
One of the 'New Seven Wonders of the World'.
Taj Mahal
The Persian architect, Ustad Ahmad Lahauri is generally considered to be the principal designer of the Taj Mahal. Shah Jahan's 1648 memorial to wife Mumtaz Mahal, would, in 1983, be cited as "the jewel of Muslim art in India and one of the universally admired masterpieces of the world's heritage."
In 1631, Shah Jahan, emperor during the Mughal empire's period of greatest prosperity, was griefstricken when his third wife, Mumtaz Mahal, died during the birth of their fourteenth child, Gauhara Begum. In her dying breath, Mumtaz Mahal urged Shah Jahan to build a mausoleum for her that the world has never seen before. Shah Jahan granted his wife's wish, and construction of the Taj Mahal began in 1632, one year after her death. The court chronicles of Shah Jahan's grief illustrates the love story traditionally held as an inspiration for Taj Mahal. The construction of Taj Mahal begun soon after Mumtaz's death with the principal mausoleum completed in 1648. The surrounding buildings and garden were finished five years later. Emperor Shah Jahan himself described the Taj in these words:
"Should guilty seek asylum here,
Like one pardoned, he becomes free from sin.
Should a sinner make his way to this mansion,
All his past sins are to be washed away.
The sight of this mansion creates sorrowing sighs;
And the sun and the moon shed tears from their eyes.
In this world this edifice has been made;
To display thereby the creator's glory."
Typically, though not entirely, Islamic art has focused on the depiction of patterns and Arabic calligraphy, rather than on figures, because it is feared by many Muslims that the depiction of the human form is idolatry and thereby a sin against Allah, forbidden in the Qur'an.
The Mughal reign in India lasted from 1526 until 1828, when the English seized the country and created their protectorate. Architecture was accorded a place of honor within Mughal art, with the development of a distinctive plan and the creation of the Taj Mahal. The arts of jewelry and the carving of hard stones, such as jade, were also cultivated; the series of hard stone daggers in the form of horses’ heads is particularly impressive.
Estimates of the cost of the construction of Taj Mahal vary due to difficulties in estimating construction costs across time. The total cost of construction has been estimated to be about 32 million Rupees at that time which now runs into trillions of Dollars if converted to present currency rates.
The Taj Mahal was constructed using materials from all over India and Asia. Over 1,000 elephants were used to transport building materials during the construction. The translucent white marble was brought from Rajasthan, the jasper from Punjab, jade and crystal from China. The turquoise was from Tibet and the Lapis lazuli from Afghanistan, while the sapphire came from Sri Lanka and the carnelian from Arabia. In all, twenty eight types of precious and semi-precious stones were inlaid into the white marble.
A labour force of twenty thousand workers was recruited across northern India. Sculptors from Bukhara, calligraphers from Syria and Persia, inlayers from southern India, stonecutters from Baluchistan, a specialist in building turrets, another who carved only marble flowers were part of the thirty-seven men who formed the creative unit.
bonus pic
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Ozymandias
Footballguy
For example, all the following could be in the military category: (there could be more)Sun TzuGenghis KhanHannibalJulius CaesarAlexanderAttilaCharles MartelSubutaiNapoleonMao ZedongAugustus CaesarConstantineSimon BolivarCharlemagneGustavus AdolphusCyrus the GreatNow, they probably won't all be there. And as I said, I may have missed one or two.
FUBAR
Footballguy
Attilla the Honey might be as well.
Ozymandias
Footballguy
There are some great ones left; in fact, some that I believe are greater than some who have already been drafted.P.S. However, it won't be me. I achieved a certain amount of renown at my high school, where we took three years of art. They started us off drawing a cup and saucer and shading it with pencil. At the end of three years, I was the only one who was still working on the cup and saucer.
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larry_boy_44
Footballguy
hopefully this pick isn't the end of me having a good team...
7.02 King Solomon, Philosopher
Our good friends at Merriam-Webster's dictionary define Philosophy as the "pursuit of wisdom" and for that reason I have chosen King Solomon as my philosopher.
Now, I know, you all are going to say that the pick is based on the story in the Bible where Solomon sacrifices to God and God offers to grant him anything he wants in the whole world, and Solomon asks for wisdom. But that isn't really why I'm picking him (although the fact that he is portrayed as being so wise is a nice addition).
The reason I'm picking Solomon is because of the writings that are attributed to him, the books of Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Song of Songs. Specifically, however, Proverbs. A book of wisdom and wise sayings that are held in the highest of regard by Jews, Christians, and Muslims all throughout history.
If needed I could definitely elaborate on the wisdom of Solomon and his justification for being in this category...
7.02 King Solomon, Philosopher
Our good friends at Merriam-Webster's dictionary define Philosophy as the "pursuit of wisdom" and for that reason I have chosen King Solomon as my philosopher.
Now, I know, you all are going to say that the pick is based on the story in the Bible where Solomon sacrifices to God and God offers to grant him anything he wants in the whole world, and Solomon asks for wisdom. But that isn't really why I'm picking him (although the fact that he is portrayed as being so wise is a nice addition).
The reason I'm picking Solomon is because of the writings that are attributed to him, the books of Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Song of Songs. Specifically, however, Proverbs. A book of wisdom and wise sayings that are held in the highest of regard by Jews, Christians, and Muslims all throughout history.
If needed I could definitely elaborate on the wisdom of Solomon and his justification for being in this category...
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Ozymandias
Footballguy
Well, if you're going to have some more T, you might want Honey with it.What the L, I blew it!
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John Maddens Lunchbox
Footballguy
Can't believe this guy hasn't been drafted yet.
I checked, I double checked and still not picked.
Oh well he is now.
I'm not doing justice to him, by just cutting and pasting some internet biographies, but it's all I can do for now.
7:13 - Mark Twain - Novelist
I checked, I double checked and still not picked.
Oh well he is now.
I'm not doing justice to him, by just cutting and pasting some internet biographies, but it's all I can do for now.
7:13 - Mark Twain - Novelist
Andy Dufresne
Footballguy
Ah. Excellent pick. I was considering him myself. I love Twain, especially his more sarcastic works.
""In God We Trust." I don't believe it would sound any better if it were true."
(Mark Twain / 1835-1910)
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larry_boy_44
Footballguy
if I were drafting just based upon what was said in the Book of Kings (I Samuel-II Kings), I probably wouldn't have drafted him...But the books of Proverbs, Ecclesiastes, and Song of Songs are attributed to him... which at least puts him on the same level of viability as Sun Tzu, Homer, and Aristotle (I think...)...
Thorn
Footballguy
I have him on my list, but I still have a lot of novelists ahead of him, because I think his achievements as an essayist/commentator don't fit into either literary character. Was thinking he'd make a pretty good WC.
Ozymandias
Footballguy
Yes, indeed. When I said there was an American missing from the GREAT category, this is who. Huckleberry Finn comes very close to being The Great American Novel. It has tragedy, humor, pathos, and conscience, at a time when we had a racist society. Huck's decision to do the right thing, and not go to heaven, when he conceals the fact that Jim is in the boat, is a triumph of conscience over culture.Great choice.
By the way, another great writer said: All American prose writing goes back to Huckleberry Finn.
timschochet
Footballguy
Hi everybody.
Just got in, and now the OPs are fully updated. Lots of interesting picks.
I have a pet peeve...
Some of you are not giving a category for your picks. This makes me upset. This makes me have to guess, and that is exactly what I'm doing. And then you will correct me later, and it is a pain in the ### to go back and retype some long Italian name in a different category. Do NOT write, "I don't know what category he goes in yet." #### that. If you're drafting the ####er, you better know what ####### category he's in. You can change it later if you must.
And don't list three categories trying to impress everybody with how versatile your pick is. I'm not impressed; I'm confused and pissed off. Choose ONE category.
If I sound a little pissed off, it's because just now I had to guess where to put Edmund Burke, Cardinal Richelieu, Martin Luther King, and Atilla the Hun.
I probably got all of them wrong. Oh well.
Just got in, and now the OPs are fully updated. Lots of interesting picks.
I have a pet peeve...
Some of you are not giving a category for your picks. This makes me upset. This makes me have to guess, and that is exactly what I'm doing. And then you will correct me later, and it is a pain in the ### to go back and retype some long Italian name in a different category. Do NOT write, "I don't know what category he goes in yet." #### that. If you're drafting the ####er, you better know what ####### category he's in. You can change it later if you must.
And don't list three categories trying to impress everybody with how versatile your pick is. I'm not impressed; I'm confused and pissed off. Choose ONE category.
If I sound a little pissed off, it's because just now I had to guess where to put Edmund Burke, Cardinal Richelieu, Martin Luther King, and Atilla the Hun.
I probably got all of them wrong. Oh well.
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