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Never gonna happen. The company line from Mike Pereira (head of refs) is that protecting the QB is priority # 1.
No.And no Hotchuli wouldn't have blown it dead. Lots of guys escape jersey tugs. At no time was he in the grasp.Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
Doesn't a handful of jersey = grasp? Isn't Eli's jersey part of him?Does he need to be bearhugged? Do they need to grab some of his skin? Don't get me wrong.... I don't think it SHOULD have been blown dead. I just think that a ref or two out there would have done so. I'd like to see exactly how the rule reads on this.No.And no Hotchuli wouldn't have blown it dead. Lots of guys escape jersey tugs. At no time was he in the grasp.Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.
Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
Isn't a handful of Jersey a horse collar tackle these days? If so, they would have penalized the Patriots 15 yards.Doesn't a handful of jersey = grasp? Isn't Eli's jersey part of him?Does he need to be bearhugged? Do they need to grab some of his skin? Don't get me wrong.... I don't think it SHOULD have been blown dead. I just think that a ref or two out there would have done so. I'd like to see exactly how the rule reads on this.No.And no Hotchuli wouldn't have blown it dead. Lots of guys escape jersey tugs. At no time was he in the grasp.Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.
Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
Judgment call. Lots of guys get handfuls of jersey and it's not called. The rule isn't that the very instant the opponent gets his hand on your jersey, you're done.Doesn't a handful of jersey = grasp? Isn't Eli's jersey part of him?Does he need to be bearhugged? Do they need to grab some of his skin? Don't get me wrong.... I don't think it SHOULD have been blown dead. I just think that a ref or two out there would have done so. I'd like to see exactly how the rule reads on this.No.And no Hotchuli wouldn't have blown it dead. Lots of guys escape jersey tugs. At no time was he in the grasp.Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.
Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
Sorry, but you're not throwing a bull here. Eli was making a play and never did a Patriot have more than a few fingers of jersey.
Yes, he needs to be bearhugged. At the very least, a defender has to get an arm around him. If refs started blowing plays dead for a handful of jersey, then what next? Would one finger hooked in a guy's collar start counting as "in the grasp"? If a defender fell on the ground and grabbed a QB's shoelace, would that be "in the grasp"?The whole "in the grasp" rule is designed to recognize situations where a QB has clearly been corralled and prevent the tackle from escalating. Manning had a lot of bodies around him, but not one of them clearly corralled him- they were just slapping at him and trying to get a decent grip (which they failed to do).Doesn't a handful of jersey = grasp? Isn't Eli's jersey part of him?Does he need to be bearhugged? Do they need to grab some of his skin? Don't get me wrong.... I don't think it SHOULD have been blown dead. I just think that a ref or two out there would have done so. I'd like to see exactly how the rule reads on this.No.And no Hotchuli wouldn't have blown it dead. Lots of guys escape jersey tugs. At no time was he in the grasp.Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.
Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
The rule isn't to blow "in the grasp" on plays where a QB could get snapped in half, it's to blow "in the grasp" on plays where a QB is in the grasp. If a defender has a path unabated to the QB, refs aren't going to start blowing "in the grasp" before contact just because the QB is about to get snapped in half.
That's how I saw it.
not at the line of scrimmageIsn't a handful of Jersey a horse collar tackle these days? If so, they would have penalized the Patriots 15 yards.Doesn't a handful of jersey = grasp? Isn't Eli's jersey part of him?Does he need to be bearhugged? Do they need to grab some of his skin? Don't get me wrong.... I don't think it SHOULD have been blown dead. I just think that a ref or two out there would have done so. I'd like to see exactly how the rule reads on this.No.And no Hotchuli wouldn't have blown it dead. Lots of guys escape jersey tugs. At no time was he in the grasp.Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.
Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
In 99 out of a hundred times, the play is stopped. the Pats linement looked more concerned with getting a late hit PF than hitting him while he was held up. It's an opinion call, and they didn't make it. Conversely, if it was blown dead, the Giants fans take the other side and say let him play. Crucial play, but they had another down. to me, the two plays that lost the game were the two INT's missed. Samuel should have made the play and failed. Merriweather was a bit tougher, but a makeagle play. There's always next year.Raider Nation said:Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
You actually have to grab the shoulder pad. Jersey alone isn't enough I think.{Syrus} said:Isn't a handful of Jersey a horse collar tackle these days? If so, they would have penalized the Patriots 15 yards.Raider Nation said:Doesn't a handful of jersey = grasp? Isn't Eli's jersey part of him?Does he need to be bearhugged? Do they need to grab some of his skin? Don't get me wrong.... I don't think it SHOULD have been blown dead. I just think that a ref or two out there would have done so. I'd like to see exactly how the rule reads on this.mad sweeney said:No.And no Hotchuli wouldn't have blown it dead. Lots of guys escape jersey tugs. At no time was he in the grasp.Raider Nation said:Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.
Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
If it's the play I'm thinking of it bounced not far away from Faulk.
IIRC, the play was completely blown up Tecmo Super Bowl style and he just tossed the ball into the ground. Don't remember any Pats near the ball.
In 99 out of a hundred times, the play is stopped. the Pats linement looked more concerned with getting a late hit PF than hitting him while he was held up. It's an opinion call, and they didn't make it.Raider Nation said:Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
1000 out of 1000 times that play doesn't get stopped.
You're allowed to throw it at the receiver's feet on a screen pass. There might be more special rules for passes that are designed to be caught behind the LoS, can't remember.
Wrong. And a common misconception. The jersey is considered part of the pads for this foul. You still have to grab at or very near the collar and pull the guy down with your own weight. You could grab Eli by the back of the neck (pads or jerse) and whip him flat on the ground and if you never leave your feet it's not a penalty.You actually have to grab the shoulder pad. Jersey alone isn't enough I think.{Syrus} said:Isn't a handful of Jersey a horse collar tackle these days? If so, they would have penalized the Patriots 15 yards.Raider Nation said:Doesn't a handful of jersey = grasp? Isn't Eli's jersey part of him?Does he need to be bearhugged? Do they need to grab some of his skin? Don't get me wrong.... I don't think it SHOULD have been blown dead. I just think that a ref or two out there would have done so. I'd like to see exactly how the rule reads on this.mad sweeney said:No.And no Hotchuli wouldn't have blown it dead. Lots of guys escape jersey tugs. At no time was he in the grasp.Raider Nation said:Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.
Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
You're entitled to your opinion too. I guess I'm misinformed. I thought there were rules in place in the NFL to specifically stop that type of play before 1000 lb of lineman crush the QB. Oh yeah, there are. Just as I originally said, it's an opinion call. I could have seen it called. I can see it not being called. Vantage point is huge. I've seen far less restriced QB's called down, and far others more restriced not ruled down. Judgement and vantage point are huge.In 99 out of a hundred times, the play is stopped. the Pats linement looked more concerned with getting a late hit PF than hitting him while he was held up. It's an opinion call, and they didn't make it.Raider Nation said:Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
1000 out of 1000 times that play doesn't get stopped.
I agree partially. I think 1000 out of 1000 times the plays shouldn't get stopped in that scenario. However I've seen them call in the grasp with less of a grasp on the QB and wouldn't have been shocked (and actually expected the play to be called dead) if it was called. But I do believe there would have been some refs that make that call (not 99 out of a 100 though).You're entitled to your opinion too. I guess I'm misinformed. I thought there were rules in place in the NFL to specifically stop that type of play before 1000 lb of lineman crush the QB. Oh yeah, there are. Just as I originally said, it's an opinion call. I could have seen it called. I can see it not being called. Vantage point is huge. I've seen far less restriced QB's called down, and far others more restriced not ruled down. Judgement and vantage point are huge.In 99 out of a hundred times, the play is stopped. the Pats linement looked more concerned with getting a late hit PF than hitting him while he was held up. It's an opinion call, and they didn't make it.Raider Nation said:Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
I was going to post the exact same thing. There was a time when a lesser "in the grasp" was called regularly. Just ask Randall Cunningham.
One of the best?No, I don't think any ref would have blown that play dead. As I watched that play, never did I think it should be whistled dead, never did anyone around me mention such a thing at the party I was at and never did I even think about it until I read this thread.
There was no point where Tiki was "in the grasp"... I don't know what point you are trying to make.Raider Nation said:Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
For "having no horse in the race" all of your posts that I've seen have been rather, pro-Patriot, anti-Manning. Maybe you just aren't sure what bias is.... if you are looking for a definition, try a mirror.Anyway, there was no way ANY ref, not getting his pocket filled, would have blown that play dead.
I never made any point about Tiki. ELI, on the other hand.......Straight from the man himself:There was no point where Tiki was "in the grasp"... I don't know what point you are trying to make.Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.
Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
http://www.projo.com/patriots/content/sp_f...28.37f0510.html
Well this should about sum it up here......
Well, unless Pittsburg is in the Super Bowl that is...
It's called flag football... and there's no way in hell I'm going to pay to play "Fantasy Flag Football"... it would look like some kind of massive celebrity reality therapy group hug I wanna gome home thing... :X followed by :X leading to
The gang I was with had a quick discussion right after it happened. More along the lines of, "Imagine if the ref had blown the whistle for an "in the grasp" call!? Holy #### that would suck!" none of us thought it should have been called. GREAT play by Eli to escape that scrum and have the focus to even find Tyree. His getting the ball there and the tremendous play by Tyree to hang on to the ball were the icing and cherry on that cake.
Is this the play where he was in the end zone. I wanted to see a replay to see if a player was in the vicinity, but never saw one. Another poster said Faulk was in the vicinity, but I would want to see the play again. I remember thinking at the time that it could have been intentional grounding in the end zone which would have been a safety. 12-7 Giants at the time if called. I don't know, but in the end it really didn't make a huge difference.
I would like to see ONE play where this is called. I have never seen it called where the defender only has the jersey for a second, which is the case here.In 99 out of a hundred times, the play is stopped. the Pats linement looked more concerned with getting a late hit PF than hitting him while he was held up. It's an opinion call, and they didn't make it. Conversely, if it was blown dead, the Giants fans take the other side and say let him play. Crucial play, but they had another down. to me, the two plays that lost the game were the two INT's missed. Samuel should have made the play and failed. Merriweather was a bit tougher, but a makeagle play. There's always next year.Kinda looked like the only reason Carey didn't blow the play dead is because his view was obstructed by all the linemen.Ed Hochuli stops that play, IMO. Eli looked like he was about to get DRILLED by three guys.
Agreed that this is a great posting, which should put an end to all this nonsense. Eli clearly was no in the grasp and was not in jeapardy.duece2626 said:Well this should about sum it up here......
If you watched SNY's post game coverage they showed peyton coming in to talk to Eli after the game. After the hug and everything Peyton said something to that effect, about how Eli had the where with all to look down field after he escaped.
