Your opinion on the religion of Islam (1 Viewer)

[PewterFan]

I'm actually proud of FFA for coming together here. On a board that's usually divided between Republicans and Democrats, we've come together (83%) to basically say that we're not fans of Islam. We should build on this.

 

[Balance]

If we were to have the poll shortly after the Crusades, I would have voted the same way. No religion is good when the extremists view kills people.

That's really the difference, though. When were the crusades? 800 years ago? Sorry, but any religion that thinks it's appropriate to kill people over cartoons isn't civilized, and it wasn't just "radicals" that believe that is appropriate.

So you are saying the christian god changed the religion over the last 800 years? In what way?

That's not what I said at all.

Please explain then what it is you are referring to when you said the bolded.

 

[timschochet]

If we were to have the poll shortly after the Crusades, I would have voted the same way. No religion is good when the extremists view kills people.

That's really the difference, though. When were the crusades? 800 years ago? Sorry, but any religion that thinks it's appropriate to kill people over cartoons isn't civilized, and it wasn't just "radicals" that believe that is appropriate.

So you are saying the christian god changed the religion over the last 800 years? In what way?

Not the Christian God. Martin Luther. And the Enlightenment. Christian civilization today is not the same as it was centuries ago. Neither is Islam. THe fact is, nation-states with a population that is majority Christian are generally more civilized than nation-states with a population that is majority Muslim.

 

[StrikeS2k]

If we were to have the poll shortly after the Crusades, I would have voted the same way. No religion is good when the extremists view kills people.

That's really the difference, though. When were the crusades? 800 years ago? Sorry, but any religion that thinks it's appropriate to kill people over cartoons isn't civilized, and it wasn't just "radicals" that believe that is appropriate.

So you are saying the christian god changed the religion over the last 800 years? In what way?

That's not what I said at all.

Please explain then what it is you are referring to when you said the bolded.

You have trouble understanding when someone indicates a specific time in history?

 

[Balance]

You have trouble understanding when someone indicates a specific time in history?

Do you feel cornered? I sense some defensiveness. If you weren't referring to the crusades being a different religion than the one now, please straighten me out.What is the difference you were referring to?

 

[perry147]

Like every other "legitimate religion" (Yes, i realize how open to interpretation this is) its good at its core. Most of the teachings of Islam are good and morally defensible. But like every other religion, there are radical morons who pervert those teachings in order to serve their own ignorant and violent agenda.

I agree with this sentiment, but I tend to think that there are more radicals that are willing to take to action in Islam then in all of the other religions and their actions as radicals involve violence, whereas a group like the born-agains (who I would consider to be the more radical Christian sect) all they do is ring a few door bells and recruit people. Plus there are many Islamic leaders who teach and preach hatred to their mostly uneducated masses, which also leads to more violence and acts of revenge for the last 1000 years of random injustices someone has suffered somewhere.

Muslim radicals have gotten more publicity in the last 8 years (and rightfully so) but 9/11 aside, Christian radicals have been significantly more hurtful throughout history. While Christian radicals here in America dont tend to be violent, their closed-mindedness bible-thumping conservatism makes headlines and headaches as well. (although obviously on a very diferent level)Obviously I'm not defending radical muslims, but at least i can see their point. The fact of the matter is that their home land IS being invaded by people of other religions. Their very way of life is being threatened (Again, I DO NOT agree with their way of life). In America, radical Christians are free to live their life pretty much however they want. Nobody's invading their home to stop them. However, they still manage to stirr up trouble and make headlines by trying to push their beliefs and lifestyle on others. (pro-life, for example)And for the record, I was raised Roman catholic and have absolutely no political leanings. (quite frankly, i dont care).

I am only referring to today's world and not the world of 100 years ago or even 1000 years ago, when the Christian push to dominate the world destroyed cultures and crushed other religions. I am surprised that Muslim is thriving as it is today since they refuse to adapt to a changing world. I might be wrong on this a bit, because radical Muslim seems to be growing as its leaders adapt to a changing world and grow thru hatred of others. Hatred and ignorance is a powerful tool and when wielded by someone who wants mayhem, things like Nazi Germany get built and their atrocities happen.

But don't you think that the society inwhich someone is raised can make them more susceptible to a particular belief?Nazi Germany come out of arguably the most advanced of our western cultures - from Bach to Einstein. Germany was at the head of almost every scientific endeavor pre-WWII. So what happened to Germnay that caused it advanced to succumb to something like National Socialism? I know the textbook answer is that the Treaty of Versailles caused so much hardship on the German economy that people turned in desperation to something like National Socialism, but I do not know how true this really is.

 

[timschochet]

To answer Balance's question in slightly more detail:

By translating the Bible, Martin Luther moved Christianity away from an oligarchy into a religion controlled by the masses. The Enlightenment created a civilization where science and individual freedoms were revered rather than despised. At first Christianity fought against the Enlightenment, but then absorbed it into Christian teachings. These two pivotal events has brought us the civilized society we enjoy today in America and Western Europe.

The Qu'run has NEVER been translated for the common people. This is why in the majority of Muslim countries, the majority of the population is still illiterate. Just as was done with the Bible prior to Martin Luther, the Qu'run is interpreted by an Oligarchy, whether Sunni or Shia, and it can be manipulated to serve any purpose. There has never been a Martin Luther, a great reformer, among the Muslims. There might have been an Enlightenment, but the Muslim world was so devestated by the Crusades and then the Mongols that no such event occurred.

All of this is historical fact. It does not, IMO, make Christianity objectively superior to Islam in terms of the religion itself, but it does make Christian society superior to Islamic society. Again, IMO.

 

[Drunken Cowboy]

As wacky as the rest of them.

 

[timschochet]

Nazi Germany come out of arguably the most advanced of our western cultures - from Bach to Einstein. Germany was at the head of almost every scientific endeavor pre-WWII. So what happened to Germnay that caused it advanced to succumb to something like National Socialism? I know the textbook answer is that the Treaty of Versailles caused so much hardship on the German economy that people turned in desperation to something like National Socialism, but I do not know how true this really is.

There are many reasons for the rise of Nazi Germany. I don't believe that Christianity is one of them.

 

[StrikeS2k]

You have trouble understanding when someone indicates a specific time in history?

Do you feel cornered? I sense some defensiveness. If you weren't referring to the crusades being a different religion than the one now, please straighten me out.What is the difference you were referring to?

Not defensive at all. I don't like wasting my time with people who I NEVER see eye to eye with. But I'll give it a shot. What I'm saying is that Islam is at the same point Christianity was 800 years ago. Hopefully it will evolve as Christianity has done over the time since then. But at this point it's a brutal, uncivilized religion.

 

[timschochet]

You have trouble understanding when someone indicates a specific time in history?

Do you feel cornered? I sense some defensiveness. If you weren't referring to the crusades being a different religion than the one now, please straighten me out.What is the difference you were referring to?

Not defensive at all. I don't like wasting my time with people who I NEVER see eye to eye with. But I'll give it a shot. What I'm saying is that Islam is at the same point Christianity was 800 years ago. Hopefully it will evolve as Christianity has done over the time since then. But at this point it's a brutal, uncivilized religion.

More like 500 years ago, though. 800 years ago, Islam was actually SUPERIOR to Christianity, IMO.

 

[Jewell]

I'm aware that most Muslims say that Islam is a religion of peace, but it's hard to accept that when the facts suggest otherwise. The crowds that gathered in the streets to cheer 9-11 and the crowd that gathered to welcome home the Lockerbie bomber were sizeable. It was certainly more than just a fringe element. If non-violent Muslims want the outside world to view them as a religion of peace, they need to do a better job of policing their own.

Even aside from the violence, I could never support or have positive feelings about a religion that has such negative views of women. Muslim nations with a Shariah influence treat 50% of the population as though they have no rights.

 

[perry147]

Nazi Germany come out of arguably the most advanced of our western cultures - from Bach to Einstein. Germany was at the head of almost every scientific endeavor pre-WWII. So what happened to Germnay that caused it advanced to succumb to something like National Socialism? I know the textbook answer is that the Treaty of Versailles caused so much hardship on the German economy that people turned in desperation to something like National Socialism, but I do not know how true this really is.

There are many reasons for the rise of Nazi Germany. I don't believe that Christianity is one of them.

Why would a christian nation like Germany create the holocaust? I know there were a few people who stood up to Hilter but as a whole Germany embraced antisemitism. Why?

 

[perry147]

You have trouble understanding when someone indicates a specific time in history?

Do you feel cornered? I sense some defensiveness. If you weren't referring to the crusades being a different religion than the one now, please straighten me out.What is the difference you were referring to?

Not defensive at all. I don't like wasting my time with people who I NEVER see eye to eye with. But I'll give it a shot. What I'm saying is that Islam is at the same point Christianity was 800 years ago. Hopefully it will evolve as Christianity has done over the time since then. But at this point it's a brutal, uncivilized religion.

More like 500 years ago, though. 800 years ago, Islam was actually SUPERIOR to Christianity, IMO.

Electric Lights anyone.

 

[RudiStein]

I'm not a big fan of organized religion as a whole but if every Muslim embraced the positive, peaceful aspect of their religion the world would be a better place.

Go ahead and replace "Muslim" in the sentence above with "Christian" while you're at it.

 

[Balance]

You have trouble understanding when someone indicates a specific time in history?

Do you feel cornered? I sense some defensiveness. If you weren't referring to the crusades being a different religion than the one now, please straighten me out.What is the difference you were referring to?

Not defensive at all. I don't like wasting my time with people who I NEVER see eye to eye with. But I'll give it a shot. What I'm saying is that Islam is at the same point Christianity was 800 years ago. Hopefully it will evolve as Christianity has done over the time since then. But at this point it's a brutal, uncivilized religion.

Thank you, that is all I was asking.Of course it leads to an obvious series of questions from here. But we've been 'round this one a few times before.

 

[Multiple Scores]

Not a big fan.

 

[Brutis]

I'm aware that most Muslims say that Islam is a religion of peace

Yeah lol, Im not buying that one either. :X

 

[The Commish]

You have trouble understanding when someone indicates a specific time in history?

Do you feel cornered? I sense some defensiveness. If you weren't referring to the crusades being a different religion than the one now, please straighten me out.What is the difference you were referring to?

Not defensive at all. I don't like wasting my time with people who I NEVER see eye to eye with. But I'll give it a shot. What I'm saying is that IslamMuslims are at the same point Christiansity were 800 years ago. Hopefully it they will evolve as Christiansity have done over the time since then. But at this point it's a brutal, uncivilized religion.

Fixed and Why people can't see that the religions/teachings are constant and the people practicing the faith are the ones actually changing is beyond me.

 

[tommyboy]

Again, discussing Islam is fine, but not in this context. The OP says: 8 years later; obviously the implication being that 9/11 was caused by the Islamic religion. This is just as insane as suggesting that Oklahoma City was caused by the Christian religion. It is, sadly, bigoted ignorance on the part of the person who started this thread.

what I meant by that is 8 yrs after 9/11. no one ever talked or thought much about Islam until 9./11. I know I didn't. I spent a lot of time since then reading and talking about it though. That's what I meant by that.

 

[Parrothead]

we need a "battle of the gods" reality TV show to settle this #### once and for all..

 

[perry147]

Again, discussing Islam is fine, but not in this context. The OP says: 8 years later; obviously the implication being that 9/11 was caused by the Islamic religion. This is just as insane as suggesting that Oklahoma City was caused by the Christian religion. It is, sadly, bigoted ignorance on the part of the person who started this thread.

what I meant by that is 8 yrs after 9/11. no one ever talked or thought much about Islam until 9./11. I know I didn't. I spent a lot of time since then reading and talking about it though. That's what I meant by that.

I think most of us understood that.

 

[RudiStein]

we need a "battle of the gods" reality TV show to settle this #### once and for all..

When God gives you lemons....YOU FIND A NEW GOD!

 

[perry147]

we need a "battle of the gods" reality TV show to settle this #### once and for all..

When God gives you lemons....YOU FIND A NEW GOD!

Tell the followers that lemons are valuable and others want to steal your lemons - they just don't want to admit it and must be tortured so that they will confess to wanting to steal your lemons (this way GOD can then save them).

 

[The Big Guy]

Nazi Germany come out of arguably the most advanced of our western cultures - from Bach to Einstein. Germany was at the head of almost every scientific endeavor pre-WWII. So what happened to Germnay that caused it advanced to succumb to something like National Socialism? I know the textbook answer is that the Treaty of Versailles caused so much hardship on the German economy that people turned in desperation to something like National Socialism, but I do not know how true this really is.

There are many reasons for the rise of Nazi Germany. I don't believe that Christianity is one of them.

Why would a christian nation like Germany create the holocaust? I know there were a few people who stood up to Hilter but as a whole Germany embraced antisemitism. Why?

You were pretty spot on in your first question/answer. the treaty destroyed the German economy, just brutalized it and this is also the same time as the great depression was going on in the US. It was worse in Germany. When Hitler started up his machine, he gave the country a reason to be proud to be German again, went after the minds and souls of the young-Hitler Youth, and gave people a scapegoat on which to blame their ills on-The Jews. It only takes a few people at the top to implement a policy like total extermination and when your soldiers know that they must follow orders or else, you can get amazing bad things happening. The average German had no clue that anything was amiss, other then first the marking of and then the collection of the Jews.

 

[Jefferson the Caregiver]

Again, discussing Islam is fine, but not in this context. The OP says: 8 years later; obviously the implication being that 9/11 was caused by the Islamic religion. This is just as insane as suggesting that Oklahoma City was caused by the Christian religion. It is, sadly, bigoted ignorance on the part of the person who started this thread.

Then again Tommyboy started the thread, so this should be no surprise.

 

[SKribbles]

Better than christianity but still ridiculous.

How is it better than Christianity? Christians don't tell their people to blow up themselves and innocent people. Christians don't treat their woman like objects. You are a fool.

Spoken like a true christian

 

[perry147]

Nazi Germany come out of arguably the most advanced of our western cultures - from Bach to Einstein. Germany was at the head of almost every scientific endeavor pre-WWII. So what happened to Germnay that caused it advanced to succumb to something like National Socialism? I know the textbook answer is that the Treaty of Versailles caused so much hardship on the German economy that people turned in desperation to something like National Socialism, but I do not know how true this really is.

There are many reasons for the rise of Nazi Germany. I don't believe that Christianity is one of them.

Why would a christian nation like Germany create the holocaust? I know there were a few people who stood up to Hilter but as a whole Germany embraced antisemitism. Why?

You were pretty spot on in your first question/answer. the treaty destroyed the German economy, just brutalized it and this is also the same time as the great depression was going on in the US. It was worse in Germany. When Hitler started up his machine, he gave the country a reason to be proud to be German again, went after the minds and souls of the young-Hitler Youth, and gave people a scapegoat on which to blame their ills on-The Jews. It only takes a few people at the top to implement a policy like total extermination and when your soldiers know that they must follow orders or else, you can get amazing bad things happening. The average German had no clue that anything was amiss, other then first the marking of and then the collection of the Jews.

It is late and I am going home, but the answer I believe as more to do with the mixing of deep seated religious hatred and ideology to create Nazism.

 

[tommyboy]

Again, discussing Islam is fine, but not in this context. The OP says: 8 years later; obviously the implication being that 9/11 was caused by the Islamic religion. This is just as insane as suggesting that Oklahoma City was caused by the Christian religion. It is, sadly, bigoted ignorance on the part of the person who started this thread.

Then again Tommyboy started the thread, so this should be no surprise.

Funny how asking a question is deemed bigoted and "no surprise". Is this the method you two choose to argue your points?

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

And what does "eight years later" have to do with it?

Obviously he meant 1403 years later.

---

Also, JOE BRYANT SIGHTING!

 

[SaintsInDome2006]

And what does "eight years later" have to do with it?

Obviously he meant 1403 years later.

---

Also, JOE BRYANT SIGHTING!

Yeah I noticed that in the TSP Marshawn Lynch thread, he actually logged on to congratulate/thank a poster for being first in with news of the trade from Buffalo.

 

[PlasmaDogPlasma]

And what does "eight years later" have to do with it?

Obviously he meant 1403 years later.

---

Also, JOE BRYANT SIGHTING!

Yeah I noticed that in the TSP Marshawn Lynch thread, he actually logged on to congratulate/thank a poster for being first in with news of the trade from Buffalo.

Wow, I feel pretty dumb for not noticing that this was bumped from 2009. The 8 years thing makes a lot more sense though.

I guess the question I have now, is why the hell was this bumped?

 

[jon_mx]

And what does "eight years later" have to do with it?

Obviously he meant 1403 years later.

---

Also, JOE BRYANT SIGHTING!

Yeah I noticed that in the TSP Marshawn Lynch thread, he actually logged on to congratulate/thank a poster for being first in with news of the trade from Buffalo.

Wow, I feel pretty dumb for not noticing that this was bumped from 2009. The 8 years thing makes a lot more sense though.I guess the question I have now, is why the hell was this bumped?

Jesus >>>>>>>>>>>......>>>>>>>. Mohamad

Discuss.

 

[Run It Up]

Slightly unfavorable, which is to say, equally unfavorable as Christianity/Catholicism and less favorable than Judaism. On the surface Islam and Christianity are not too dissimilar, of course however no one actually practices what they preach so its all garbage.

Overall opinion of organized religion, incredibly low.