Vick Indicted ! ? (1 Viewer)

QuickSlant said:

The scope of these allegations and subsequent charges are far greater than most realize, it would seem. Folks, this is only the tip of the iceberg, mark my words. The Federal Government and FBI got involved in this case for a reason. Dogfighting in and of itself has been a growing concern among law enforcement officials for several years while they have been working towards a "landmark" case that they could bring to the courts to make precedent. Well, get ready, because this is it. The Feds have better than a 95% conviction rate, and if you think we already know what evidence they are bringing to the table, you are sadly mistaken. Sure, we know about the 65 dogs originally removed from the property, and the fighting pits and the rape stand(s) and the blood and the dead carcasses buried in the back yard...Michael Vick's back yard. Oh, and if you've read the 18 page indictment, they already have at least 4 corroborating witnesses as to Vick's presence and participation. Drop the O.J. and Kobe talk, a different animal altogether, no pun intended. A "one-time" incident with questionable intent and no witnesses. This case goes beyond the criminal aspect of it, there are serious character issues to look at here. This is where the personal conduct policy would indeed allow Goodell to act now if he wished to, in that it states you must conduct yourself in the best interest of the NFL and protect the "shield", which would include but not be limited to who you associate with and where you do it. This is where Pacman crossed the line, though he was never charged with anything. Only a number of recurring incidents. Vick's association has been an ongoing incident over a period of at least 6 years. That being said, I would fully expect Falcons owner Arthur Blank to act on this before Goodell does. Goodell is in a better position to allow the courts to take their course, while Blank is not. The Falcons are front and center, and you can bet that the Humane Society and Peta are watching very closely. It would already appear that hearings and the subsequent trial will disrupt Vick's participation with the team this season, not to mention the undoubted protesting and picketing that would take place at any and all Falcon functions, from training camp to any and all games whether they be home OR away. If Vick were to remain with the team, the public scrutiny would become increasingly unbearable for both the Falcons and the NFL. Chances are, Vick will be instructed to take a leave of absence until things are resolved, one way or another. What if he's found "not guilty", you ask? Don't you think that the Feds have considered that and what the repercussions would bring? I knew there was trouble when they got involved and were being so quiet and meticulous in their procedures. It was just too big for Surry County prosecutor Poindexter to handle or manage. This is only the beginning folks,...only the beginning. Vick has put himself in one pocket he can't escape from. I can assure you, he's headed for prison. The book on his NFL career can now be closed.

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menobrown said:

Sweat Hog said:

menobrown said:

The Fed's may have a 95% conviction rate but out of 6 players who faced Federal charges only one player, Bam Morris, got more than 4 months and the longest suspension was 4 games.NFL players and their clashes with the feds:> Former Falcons WR Tony Martin was found not guilty of money laundering.( Zero game suspension)> RB Jamal Lewis, an Atlanta native, served four months after pleading guilty to using a cellphone to make a drug deal. (2 game suspension)> Defensive ends Eric Moore and Mark Duckens both pleaded guilty to misdemeanor possession of steroids. (No jail time served, Moore got a 4 game suspension and Duckens was cut)> RB Bam Morris pleaded guilty in a marijuana distribution case.( Currently serving a 10 year sentence )> LB Mike Bell served four months for using a phone for a cocaine transaction. ( I don't know if he was suspended but he played after this conviction)I think it's a little early to assume Vick's career, or even season, are over.

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HMMMM. Let's see. Relatively minor drug offenses or running a gambling enterprise that involves the torture and murdering of dogs for financial gain and getting ones rocks off. Which one do you think is more offensive to our society in general?

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Does not matter what is offensive to society, drug dealing carries far lengthier sentences than dog fighting.And can we stop calling this murder? Murder is defined as killing a human.

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DLeo said:

in the dog fighting world dealers of drugs and drug users and yes even murderers are the key people who support this heinus activity.

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zed2283 said:

DLeo said:

in the dog fighting world dealers of drugs and drug users and yes even murderers are the key people who support this heinus activity.

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Where did you get THAT information...?

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King of the Jungle said:

I am sure someone has said it already, but how bad would the Falcons like to have Schaub back?

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DLeo said:

zed2283 said:

DLeo said:

in the dog fighting world dealers of drugs and drug users and yes even murderers are the key people who support this heinus activity.

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Where did you get THAT information...?

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its been all over the news and net as far as the drug dealers. I put in murderers becasue i am sure its true and definetly makes sense. These people who are involved in dog fighting are drug dealers and the top of the ladder gang leaders and I know what they get involved in.

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fatness said:

DLeo said:

zed2283 said:

DLeo said:

in the dog fighting world dealers of drugs and drug users and yes even murderers are the key people who support this heinus activity.

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Where did you get THAT information...?

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its been all over the news and net as far as the drug dealers. I put in murderers becasue i am sure its true and definetly makes sense. These people who are involved in dog fighting are drug dealers and the top of the ladder gang leaders and I know what they get involved in.

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Good info here.

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DLeo said:

QuickSlant said:

The scope of these allegations and subsequent charges are far greater than most realize, it would seem. Folks, this is only the tip of the iceberg, mark my words. The Federal Government and FBI got involved in this case for a reason. Dogfighting in and of itself has been a growing concern among law enforcement officials for several years while they have been working towards a "landmark" case that they could bring to the courts to make precedent. Well, get ready, because this is it. The Feds have better than a 95% conviction rate, and if you think we already know what evidence they are bringing to the table, you are sadly mistaken. Sure, we know about the 65 dogs originally removed from the property, and the fighting pits and the rape stand(s) and the blood and the dead carcasses buried in the back yard...Michael Vick's back yard. Oh, and if you've read the 18 page indictment, they already have at least 4 corroborating witnesses as to Vick's presence and participation. Drop the O.J. and Kobe talk, a different animal altogether, no pun intended. A "one-time" incident with questionable intent and no witnesses. This case goes beyond the criminal aspect of it, there are serious character issues to look at here. This is where the personal conduct policy would indeed allow Goodell to act now if he wished to, in that it states you must conduct yourself in the best interest of the NFL and protect the "shield", which would include but not be limited to who you associate with and where you do it. This is where Pacman crossed the line, though he was never charged with anything. Only a number of recurring incidents. Vick's association has been an ongoing incident over a period of at least 6 years. That being said, I would fully expect Falcons owner Arthur Blank to act on this before Goodell does. Goodell is in a better position to allow the courts to take their course, while Blank is not. The Falcons are front and center, and you can bet that the Humane Society and Peta are watching very closely. It would already appear that hearings and the subsequent trial will disrupt Vick's participation with the team this season, not to mention the undoubted protesting and picketing that would take place at any and all Falcon functions, from training camp to any and all games whether they be home OR away. If Vick were to remain with the team, the public scrutiny would become increasingly unbearable for both the Falcons and the NFL. Chances are, Vick will be instructed to take a leave of absence until things are resolved, one way or another. What if he's found "not guilty", you ask? Don't you think that the Feds have considered that and what the repercussions would bring? I knew there was trouble when they got involved and were being so quiet and meticulous in their procedures. It was just too big for Surry County prosecutor Poindexter to handle or manage. This is only the beginning folks,...only the beginning. Vick has put himself in one pocket he can't escape from. I can assure you, he's headed for prison. The book on his NFL career can now be closed.

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QuickSlant said:

DLeo said:

QuickSlant said:

The scope of these allegations and subsequent charges are far greater than most realize, it would seem. Folks, this is only the tip of the iceberg, mark my words. The Federal Government and FBI got involved in this case for a reason. Dogfighting in and of itself has been a growing concern among law enforcement officials for several years while they have been working towards a "landmark" case that they could bring to the courts to make precedent. Well, get ready, because this is it. The Feds have better than a 95% conviction rate, and if you think we already know what evidence they are bringing to the table, you are sadly mistaken. Sure, we know about the 65 dogs originally removed from the property, and the fighting pits and the rape stand(s) and the blood and the dead carcasses buried in the back yard...Michael Vick's back yard. Oh, and if you've read the 18 page indictment, they already have at least 4 corroborating witnesses as to Vick's presence and participation. Drop the O.J. and Kobe talk, a different animal altogether, no pun intended. A "one-time" incident with questionable intent and no witnesses. This case goes beyond the criminal aspect of it, there are serious character issues to look at here. This is where the personal conduct policy would indeed allow Goodell to act now if he wished to, in that it states you must conduct yourself in the best interest of the NFL and protect the "shield", which would include but not be limited to who you associate with and where you do it. This is where Pacman crossed the line, though he was never charged with anything. Only a number of recurring incidents. Vick's association has been an ongoing incident over a period of at least 6 years. That being said, I would fully expect Falcons owner Arthur Blank to act on this before Goodell does. Goodell is in a better position to allow the courts to take their course, while Blank is not. The Falcons are front and center, and you can bet that the Humane Society and Peta are watching very closely. It would already appear that hearings and the subsequent trial will disrupt Vick's participation with the team this season, not to mention the undoubted protesting and picketing that would take place at any and all Falcon functions, from training camp to any and all games whether they be home OR away. If Vick were to remain with the team, the public scrutiny would become increasingly unbearable for both the Falcons and the NFL. Chances are, Vick will be instructed to take a leave of absence until things are resolved, one way or another. What if he's found "not guilty", you ask? Don't you think that the Feds have considered that and what the repercussions would bring? I knew there was trouble when they got involved and were being so quiet and meticulous in their procedures. It was just too big for Surry County prosecutor Poindexter to handle or manage. This is only the beginning folks,...only the beginning. Vick has put himself in one pocket he can't escape from. I can assure you, he's headed for prison. The book on his NFL career can now be closed.

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Thanks DLeo, appreciate it.I've been on top of this since the beginning, and promise to continue to do so.

Andy Herron (QuickSlant)

footballguys.com

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Chaos Commish said:

QuickSlant said:

DLeo said:

QuickSlant said:

The scope of these allegations and subsequent charges are far greater than most realize, it would seem. Folks, this is only the tip of the iceberg, mark my words. The Federal Government and FBI got involved in this case for a reason. Dogfighting in and of itself has been a growing concern among law enforcement officials for several years while they have been working towards a "landmark" case that they could bring to the courts to make precedent. Well, get ready, because this is it. The Feds have better than a 95% conviction rate, and if you think we already know what evidence they are bringing to the table, you are sadly mistaken. Sure, we know about the 65 dogs originally removed from the property, and the fighting pits and the rape stand(s) and the blood and the dead carcasses buried in the back yard...Michael Vick's back yard. Oh, and if you've read the 18 page indictment, they already have at least 4 corroborating witnesses as to Vick's presence and participation. Drop the O.J. and Kobe talk, a different animal altogether, no pun intended. A "one-time" incident with questionable intent and no witnesses. This case goes beyond the criminal aspect of it, there are serious character issues to look at here. This is where the personal conduct policy would indeed allow Goodell to act now if he wished to, in that it states you must conduct yourself in the best interest of the NFL and protect the "shield", which would include but not be limited to who you associate with and where you do it. This is where Pacman crossed the line, though he was never charged with anything. Only a number of recurring incidents. Vick's association has been an ongoing incident over a period of at least 6 years. That being said, I would fully expect Falcons owner Arthur Blank to act on this before Goodell does. Goodell is in a better position to allow the courts to take their course, while Blank is not. The Falcons are front and center, and you can bet that the Humane Society and Peta are watching very closely. It would already appear that hearings and the subsequent trial will disrupt Vick's participation with the team this season, not to mention the undoubted protesting and picketing that would take place at any and all Falcon functions, from training camp to any and all games whether they be home OR away. If Vick were to remain with the team, the public scrutiny would become increasingly unbearable for both the Falcons and the NFL. Chances are, Vick will be instructed to take a leave of absence until things are resolved, one way or another. What if he's found "not guilty", you ask? Don't you think that the Feds have considered that and what the repercussions would bring? I knew there was trouble when they got involved and were being so quiet and meticulous in their procedures. It was just too big for Surry County prosecutor Poindexter to handle or manage. This is only the beginning folks,...only the beginning. Vick has put himself in one pocket he can't escape from. I can assure you, he's headed for prison. The book on his NFL career can now be closed.

Click to expand...

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Thanks DLeo, appreciate it.I've been on top of this since the beginning, and promise to continue to do so.

Andy Herron (QuickSlant)

footballguys.com

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Hey Andy, I think you're probably getting a little caught up in the Peta screaming and melodrama that's driving the story right now. It's the squeakiest wheel getting the most grease. Mob mentality will settle down and an interesting turn of events is going to unfold. Maybe the book on Vick's career is closed. Maybe he'll do time. Nothing is carved in stone.

There will hopefully be an awakening in this country to the horrors and prevalence of the dogfighting culture(s). There's three categorized and 6 or more subcategories, fwiw.

Hopefully our society gets an equally grounded education in the nonsensical madness of the US Humane Society and Peta.

Vick's in for a fight, but he can play it a number of ways to mitigate the results. Expect that. There's dozens of options beyond innocent or guilty of all charges. If he fights for a clean acquittal I think the odds are obvious, and he'll be in the kind of trouble many are certain he is in.

The court of public opinion has already tried the case, yet another rush to judgment. That always bugs me. Let's watch the system unfold before we are 100% certain of the results.

If he's "first to the courthouse door," as the adage goes, with an offer, I think some people will be surprised by the leniency available to him. He will have to give up evidence to make a deal. But it may be the evidence he doesn't turn that is the more valuable bargaining chip.

Vick making a deal could be a huge problem for the NFL. If a bunch of his fellow players are involved (and I think that's as likely as the sunrise, and I suspect dozens of big names participate in the festivities), then that becomes a bargaining chip with the league. Do the feds care? Does Goodell? I don't know, but I wouldn't presume anything for certain. This will get more complicated behind the scenes than we ever know. It already is.

Also the severity of his punishment will be directly related to what he is convicted of, and being he didn't live at the property, I suspect he has some leverage in the arguments, charges and counts. I read today none of the sentencing guidelines go beyond 10-16 months and if he cops a plea then six months or less with home detention options is most likely. He is a first time offender. So, odds are even convicted, he can make deals, do the requisite PR and try to revive his career. I'm not sure if he's a good enough QB, but some team will be intrigued.

This year is toast, I agree. I also agree his career is in jeopardy, but I'm not closing any books. This is too compelling of a story.

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QuickSlant said:

DLeo said:

QuickSlant said:

The scope of these allegations and subsequent charges are far greater than most realize, it would seem. Folks, this is only the tip of the iceberg, mark my words. The Federal Government and FBI got involved in this case for a reason. Dogfighting in and of itself has been a growing concern among law enforcement officials for several years while they have been working towards a "landmark" case that they could bring to the courts to make precedent. Well, get ready, because this is it. The Feds have better than a 95% conviction rate, and if you think we already know what evidence they are bringing to the table, you are sadly mistaken. Sure, we know about the 65 dogs originally removed from the property, and the fighting pits and the rape stand(s) and the blood and the dead carcasses buried in the back yard...Michael Vick's back yard. Oh, and if you've read the 18 page indictment, they already have at least 4 corroborating witnesses as to Vick's presence and participation. Drop the O.J. and Kobe talk, a different animal altogether, no pun intended. A "one-time" incident with questionable intent and no witnesses. This case goes beyond the criminal aspect of it, there are serious character issues to look at here. This is where the personal conduct policy would indeed allow Goodell to act now if he wished to, in that it states you must conduct yourself in the best interest of the NFL and protect the "shield", which would include but not be limited to who you associate with and where you do it. This is where Pacman crossed the line, though he was never charged with anything. Only a number of recurring incidents. Vick's association has been an ongoing incident over a period of at least 6 years. That being said, I would fully expect Falcons owner Arthur Blank to act on this before Goodell does. Goodell is in a better position to allow the courts to take their course, while Blank is not. The Falcons are front and center, and you can bet that the Humane Society and Peta are watching very closely. It would already appear that hearings and the subsequent trial will disrupt Vick's participation with the team this season, not to mention the undoubted protesting and picketing that would take place at any and all Falcon functions, from training camp to any and all games whether they be home OR away. If Vick were to remain with the team, the public scrutiny would become increasingly unbearable for both the Falcons and the NFL. Chances are, Vick will be instructed to take a leave of absence until things are resolved, one way or another. What if he's found "not guilty", you ask? Don't you think that the Feds have considered that and what the repercussions would bring? I knew there was trouble when they got involved and were being so quiet and meticulous in their procedures. It was just too big for Surry County prosecutor Poindexter to handle or manage. This is only the beginning folks,...only the beginning. Vick has put himself in one pocket he can't escape from. I can assure you, he's headed for prison. The book on his NFL career can now be closed.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks DLeo, appreciate it.I've been on top of this since the beginning, and promise to continue to do so.Andy Herron (QuickSlant)footballguys.com

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Chaos Commish said:

QuickSlant said:

DLeo said:

QuickSlant said:

The scope of these allegations and subsequent charges are far greater than most realize, it would seem. Folks, this is only the tip of the iceberg, mark my words. The Federal Government and FBI got involved in this case for a reason. Dogfighting in and of itself has been a growing concern among law enforcement officials for several years while they have been working towards a "landmark" case that they could bring to the courts to make precedent. Well, get ready, because this is it. The Feds have better than a 95% conviction rate, and if you think we already know what evidence they are bringing to the table, you are sadly mistaken. Sure, we know about the 65 dogs originally removed from the property, and the fighting pits and the rape stand(s) and the blood and the dead carcasses buried in the back yard...Michael Vick's back yard. Oh, and if you've read the 18 page indictment, they already have at least 4 corroborating witnesses as to Vick's presence and participation. Drop the O.J. and Kobe talk, a different animal altogether, no pun intended. A "one-time" incident with questionable intent and no witnesses. This case goes beyond the criminal aspect of it, there are serious character issues to look at here. This is where the personal conduct policy would indeed allow Goodell to act now if he wished to, in that it states you must conduct yourself in the best interest of the NFL and protect the "shield", which would include but not be limited to who you associate with and where you do it. This is where Pacman crossed the line, though he was never charged with anything. Only a number of recurring incidents. Vick's association has been an ongoing incident over a period of at least 6 years. That being said, I would fully expect Falcons owner Arthur Blank to act on this before Goodell does. Goodell is in a better position to allow the courts to take their course, while Blank is not. The Falcons are front and center, and you can bet that the Humane Society and Peta are watching very closely. It would already appear that hearings and the subsequent trial will disrupt Vick's participation with the team this season, not to mention the undoubted protesting and picketing that would take place at any and all Falcon functions, from training camp to any and all games whether they be home OR away. If Vick were to remain with the team, the public scrutiny would become increasingly unbearable for both the Falcons and the NFL. Chances are, Vick will be instructed to take a leave of absence until things are resolved, one way or another. What if he's found "not guilty", you ask? Don't you think that the Feds have considered that and what the repercussions would bring? I knew there was trouble when they got involved and were being so quiet and meticulous in their procedures. It was just too big for Surry County prosecutor Poindexter to handle or manage. This is only the beginning folks,...only the beginning. Vick has put himself in one pocket he can't escape from. I can assure you, he's headed for prison. The book on his NFL career can now be closed.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks DLeo, appreciate it.I've been on top of this since the beginning, and promise to continue to do so.

Andy Herron (QuickSlant)

footballguys.com

Click to expand...

Hey Andy, I think you're probably getting a little caught up in the Peta screaming and melodrama that's driving the story right now. It's the squeakiest wheel getting the most grease. Mob mentality will settle down and an interesting turn of events is going to unfold. Maybe the book on Vick's career is closed. Maybe he'll do time. Nothing is carved in stone.

There will hopefully be an awakening in this country to the horrors and prevalence of the dogfighting culture(s). There's three categorized and 6 or more subcategories, fwiw.

Hopefully our society gets an equally grounded education in the nonsensical madness of the US Humane Society and Peta.

Vick's in for a fight, but he can play it a number of ways to mitigate the results. Expect that. There's dozens of options beyond innocent or guilty of all charges. If he fights for a clean acquittal I think the odds are obvious, and he'll be in the kind of trouble many are certain he is in.

The court of public opinion has already tried the case, yet another rush to judgment. That always bugs me. Let's watch the system unfold before we are 100% certain of the results.

If he's "first to the courthouse door," as the adage goes, with an offer, I think some people will be surprised by the leniency available to him. He will have to give up evidence to make a deal. But it may be the evidence he doesn't turn that is the more valuable bargaining chip.

Vick making a deal could be a huge problem for the NFL. If a bunch of his fellow players are involved (and I think that's as likely as the sunrise, and I suspect dozens of big names participate in the festivities), then that becomes a bargaining chip with the league. Do the feds care? Does Goodell? I don't know, but I wouldn't presume anything for certain. This will get more complicated behind the scenes than we ever know. It already is.

Also the severity of his punishment will be directly related to what he is convicted of, and being he didn't live at the property, I suspect he has some leverage in the arguments, charges and counts. I read today none of the sentencing guidelines go beyond 10-16 months and if he cops a plea then six months or less with home detention options is most likely. He is a first time offender. So, odds are even convicted, he can make deals, do the requisite PR and try to revive his career. I'm not sure if he's a good enough QB, but some team will be intrigued.

This year is toast, I agree. I also agree his career is in jeopardy, but I'm not closing any books. This is too compelling of a story.

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cobalt_27 said:

QuickSlant said:

DLeo said:

QuickSlant said:

The scope of these allegations and subsequent charges are far greater than most realize, it would seem. Folks, this is only the tip of the iceberg, mark my words. The Federal Government and FBI got involved in this case for a reason. Dogfighting in and of itself has been a growing concern among law enforcement officials for several years while they have been working towards a "landmark" case that they could bring to the courts to make precedent. Well, get ready, because this is it. The Feds have better than a 95% conviction rate, and if you think we already know what evidence they are bringing to the table, you are sadly mistaken. Sure, we know about the 65 dogs originally removed from the property, and the fighting pits and the rape stand(s) and the blood and the dead carcasses buried in the back yard...Michael Vick's back yard. Oh, and if you've read the 18 page indictment, they already have at least 4 corroborating witnesses as to Vick's presence and participation. Drop the O.J. and Kobe talk, a different animal altogether, no pun intended. A "one-time" incident with questionable intent and no witnesses. This case goes beyond the criminal aspect of it, there are serious character issues to look at here. This is where the personal conduct policy would indeed allow Goodell to act now if he wished to, in that it states you must conduct yourself in the best interest of the NFL and protect the "shield", which would include but not be limited to who you associate with and where you do it. This is where Pacman crossed the line, though he was never charged with anything. Only a number of recurring incidents. Vick's association has been an ongoing incident over a period of at least 6 years. That being said, I would fully expect Falcons owner Arthur Blank to act on this before Goodell does. Goodell is in a better position to allow the courts to take their course, while Blank is not. The Falcons are front and center, and you can bet that the Humane Society and Peta are watching very closely. It would already appear that hearings and the subsequent trial will disrupt Vick's participation with the team this season, not to mention the undoubted protesting and picketing that would take place at any and all Falcon functions, from training camp to any and all games whether they be home OR away. If Vick were to remain with the team, the public scrutiny would become increasingly unbearable for both the Falcons and the NFL. Chances are, Vick will be instructed to take a leave of absence until things are resolved, one way or another. What if he's found "not guilty", you ask? Don't you think that the Feds have considered that and what the repercussions would bring? I knew there was trouble when they got involved and were being so quiet and meticulous in their procedures. It was just too big for Surry County prosecutor Poindexter to handle or manage. This is only the beginning folks,...only the beginning. Vick has put himself in one pocket he can't escape from. I can assure you, he's headed for prison. The book on his NFL career can now be closed.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks DLeo, appreciate it.I've been on top of this since the beginning, and promise to continue to do so.Andy Herron (QuickSlant)footballguys.com

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Who's this guy think he is? Adam Schefter?

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QuickSlant said:

My mention of PETA protesting in this initial post was 24 hours before they actually did. No reaction whatsoever, just simple forewarn reporting.

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QuickSlant said:

cobalt_27 said:

QuickSlant said:

DLeo said:

QuickSlant said:

The scope of these allegations and subsequent charges are far greater than most realize, it would seem. Folks, this is only the tip of the iceberg, mark my words. The Federal Government and FBI got involved in this case for a reason. Dogfighting in and of itself has been a growing concern among law enforcement officials for several years while they have been working towards a "landmark" case that they could bring to the courts to make precedent. Well, get ready, because this is it. The Feds have better than a 95% conviction rate, and if you think we already know what evidence they are bringing to the table, you are sadly mistaken. Sure, we know about the 65 dogs originally removed from the property, and the fighting pits and the rape stand(s) and the blood and the dead carcasses buried in the back yard...Michael Vick's back yard. Oh, and if you've read the 18 page indictment, they already have at least 4 corroborating witnesses as to Vick's presence and participation. Drop the O.J. and Kobe talk, a different animal altogether, no pun intended. A "one-time" incident with questionable intent and no witnesses. This case goes beyond the criminal aspect of it, there are serious character issues to look at here. This is where the personal conduct policy would indeed allow Goodell to act now if he wished to, in that it states you must conduct yourself in the best interest of the NFL and protect the "shield", which would include but not be limited to who you associate with and where you do it. This is where Pacman crossed the line, though he was never charged with anything. Only a number of recurring incidents. Vick's association has been an ongoing incident over a period of at least 6 years. That being said, I would fully expect Falcons owner Arthur Blank to act on this before Goodell does. Goodell is in a better position to allow the courts to take their course, while Blank is not. The Falcons are front and center, and you can bet that the Humane Society and Peta are watching very closely. It would already appear that hearings and the subsequent trial will disrupt Vick's participation with the team this season, not to mention the undoubted protesting and picketing that would take place at any and all Falcon functions, from training camp to any and all games whether they be home OR away. If Vick were to remain with the team, the public scrutiny would become increasingly unbearable for both the Falcons and the NFL. Chances are, Vick will be instructed to take a leave of absence until things are resolved, one way or another. What if he's found "not guilty", you ask? Don't you think that the Feds have considered that and what the repercussions would bring? I knew there was trouble when they got involved and were being so quiet and meticulous in their procedures. It was just too big for Surry County prosecutor Poindexter to handle or manage. This is only the beginning folks,...only the beginning. Vick has put himself in one pocket he can't escape from. I can assure you, he's headed for prison. The book on his NFL career can now be closed.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

Thanks DLeo, appreciate it.I've been on top of this since the beginning, and promise to continue to do so.Andy Herron (QuickSlant)footballguys.com

Click to expand...

Who's this guy think he is? Adam Schefter?

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Just doing my job. By the way, do you go by "Steve", "Lee", or simply "6"?

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Keith Lewis said:

The pool is dark yellow in color. Thanks for the good contribution DLeo.

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mad sweeney said:

If you believe that, then sure. Anyone else who goes back and rereads your posts will know different. I especially liked the ones where you were defending Vick's character against the witch hunts, but I love cheap entertainment. I believe you that you've changed your stance, most have. But your spin on your previous stance is laughable. Are you by any chance represented by Drew Rosenhaus?

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Let's leave the future superbowl and pro-bowl QB alone and let him dazzle us on the field. Get off Vick's jock, he'll be dominating the NFL for many years to come, get used to it.The Feds aren't gonna charge Vick with anything, they don't waste their time on cases they have no chance to win.This is being completely blown out of proportion, there is a reason your not hearing about it on any major news sources, because it's a non story. This is like the Salem Witch Trials, sad.He might get a token game suspension from the NFL just to appease the public. sometimes you have to give in to the lunatic masses to get closure. Can someone please PM me if they ever find any evidence linking Vick to dogfighting or get some "named" sources?VICK IS INNOCENT OF ALL CHARGES. I hope his lawyers can find a way to sue for slander.Wow, so looks like not only do they have no evidence to charge Vick, but they don't even have evidence to charge anyone with dog fighting.Some of you must feel pretty ridiculous right now for this witchhunt.Once this all blows over i expect all of you who came out swinging to post in my Vick apoligy thread. I will try to find a way to send him the link so he knows people can admit when they are wrong. All i ask is that people be man enough to admit when they are wrong, and in this incident there are a lot of people who should feel ashamed for forgetting that people are innocent until proven guilty in our judicial system.

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If the Feds charge AND get a conviction on Vick I will take a voluntary 1 year vacation from the message boards.

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Keith Lewis said:

The pool is dark yellow in color. Thanks for the good contribution DLeo.

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madoka said:

mad sweeney said:

If you believe that, then sure. Anyone else who goes back and rereads your posts will know different. I especially liked the ones where you were defending Vick's character against the witch hunts, but I love cheap entertainment. I believe you that you've changed your stance, most have. But your spin on your previous stance is laughable. Are you by any chance represented by Drew Rosenhaus?

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Yeah, it's pathetic how this guy goes from telling people to be "man" enough to admit they were wrong and then claim that what he wrote was "tongue in cheek."Here are my favorites from iluvbeer99 (and these are all from only ONE thread!):

Let's leave the future superbowl and pro-bowl QB alone and let him dazzle us on the field. Get off Vick's jock, he'll be dominating the NFL for many years to come, get used to it.The Feds aren't gonna charge Vick with anything, they don't waste their time on cases they have no chance to win.This is being completely blown out of proportion, there is a reason your not hearing about it on any major news sources, because it's a non story. This is like the Salem Witch Trials, sad.He might get a token game suspension from the NFL just to appease the public. sometimes you have to give in to the lunatic masses to get closure. Can someone please PM me if they ever find any evidence linking Vick to dogfighting or get some "named" sources?VICK IS INNOCENT OF ALL CHARGES. I hope his lawyers can find a way to sue for slander.Wow, so looks like not only do they have no evidence to charge Vick, but they don't even have evidence to charge anyone with dog fighting.Some of you must feel pretty ridiculous right now for this witchhunt.Once this all blows over i expect all of you who came out swinging to post in my Vick apoligy thread. I will try to find a way to send him the link so he knows people can admit when they are wrong. All i ask is that people be man enough to admit when they are wrong, and in this incident there are a lot of people who should feel ashamed for forgetting that people are innocent until proven guilty in our judicial system.

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And my personal favorite:

If the Feds charge AND get a conviction on Vick I will take a voluntary 1 year vacation from the message boards.

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We are halfway there!

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I'm going to help you out and I'll break it down for you, "Three people are going to be indicted, Michael Vick is not one of these people".I hope that is clear enough.Maybe the reason he won't get indicted is because he wasn't involved at all? I don't think you're following along...GAME OVER, VICK CLEAREDThere have been a whole bunch of false/unproven accusations towards Vick in this whole DogGate LifeTime drama series going on and I've seen ESPNs name on some of this BS

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Couch Potato said:

fatness said:

DLeo said:

zed2283 said:

DLeo said:

in the dog fighting world dealers of drugs and drug users and yes even murderers are the key people who support this heinus activity.

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Where did you get THAT information...?

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its been all over the news and net as far as the drug dealers. I put in murderers becasue i am sure its true and definetly makes sense. These people who are involved in dog fighting are drug dealers and the top of the ladder gang leaders and I know what they get involved in.

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Good info here.

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And the mostest evilestest of them all -- circus clowns. I put in circus clowns because I am sure it's true and definitely makes sense.

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ILUVBEER99 said:

Dear madoka and madsweeney,

The past few days I've done a lot of hard thinking about what happened over the past couple weeks. I want you to know that everything that I'm about to say is coming from the bottom of my heart. I know that it will be very difficult for you to accept my apology, but I want you to think about our message board-friendship as well.

The main reason I decided to write you this letter is because our message board-friendship is too valuable to lose over a silly argument. I feel that I could have handled the situation in a better way, but you never gave me a chance to explain myself. I hope this letter will give us both a chance to understand one another better.

I admit that I was wrong for telling you that Vick was innocent, but the reason for that is I did not agree with what you were saying. I want you to know that I am very sorry and this is a special letter from me to you, saying that I am sorry! I think that I have made the right decision.

Sincerely,

ILUVBEER99

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Keith Lewis said:

How about you let it go mad sweeney...I have read the whole indictment and am 98% sure that Michael Vick is a world class piece of trash. I am not going to apologize for somebody who is involved in these cruel acts.I'm done, now the question is can you let it go.

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Fat Drunk and Stupid said:

Seriously, who are you people?

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phthalatemagic said:

Fat Drunk and Stupid said:

Seriously, who are you people?

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I don't know, but don't get in their way. This is awesome

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3C said:

Sen Byrd is mad

And I shouldn't laugh, but this line is funny: ""Barbaric," Sen. Robert C. Byrd, D-W.Va., shouted four times in a Senate chamber that was mostly empty except for two dozen somewhat startled tourists."

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phthalatemagic said:

Fat Drunk and Stupid said:

Seriously, who are you people?

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I don't know, but don't get in their way. This is awesome

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Tom Servo said:

3C said:

Sen Byrd is mad

And I shouldn't laugh, but this line is funny: ""Barbaric," Sen. Robert C. Byrd, D-W.Va., shouted four times in a Senate chamber that was mostly empty except for two dozen somewhat startled tourists."

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Coming from a past member of the KKK and veritable voice of moral authority...

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Big Score said:

Called the Falcons ticket office the other day & told them we would not be renewing our season tickets if Vick remains an active member of the organization.Tough decision as there's lots of players on that team I really like. Warrick Dunn is definitely one of my favorite players & not just because he's the little guy that could when so many said he couldn't, but also because of how he put his family on his back even before he got to the NFL & pulled them up & out of poverty, his continuing & unwavering humanitarian work. Keith brooking is another one of my favorite players. Salt of the earth lunch pail blue collar guy from Senoia Ga. Loved watching him play at Ga Tech & then was thrilled when the Falcons drafted him.Now I know that dog fighting is a world wide sport that is wildly popular & even condoned in other parts of the world (South East Asia in particular), but this is here, it's our culture & we have laws against it as we recognize that dog fighting is wrong.I'm also more than aware that sometimes dogs are put down for failing to perform. When I was first out of school, I traveled a lot & during my travels I happened to work a on a sheep farm & then a cattle station (in Australia). On both farms there were of course working dogs, pets somewhat, but first & foremost, they were working dogs. I did see where some dogs from a litter were given a couple of years to show if they had the talent / instinct / smarts to pick up the skills needed to be working dogs. If they didn't show the aptitude, one day I'd see them head off for a ride they never came back from. Quickly & humanely put down with a 22. Every man, woman, child & dog has to pull their weight on a working farm. No free rides there.But I never saw any of the farmers take any satisfaction. In fact when they returned without the dog, they were always subdued & quiet for the rest of the day. They certainly never took any perverse pleasure in putting down the dog(s) & never got off on electrocuting, drowning or beating a dog to death.But Vick's actions are different. I don't care that he was raised around it. It's illegal & in our culture we know it's wrong. The "But everyone else is doing it" is an excuse when you're a little kid, but a grown man knows better. The sick & perverse ways he had dogs dispatched is just cruel. I do think Child Molesters, Murderers, Rapists etc are much worse criminals than Vick, but he's not far behind.

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LAUNCH said:

He's gone.

LAUNCH

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zed2283 said:

Big Score said:

Called the Falcons ticket office the other day & told them we would not be renewing our season tickets if Vick remains an active member of the organization.Tough decision as there's lots of players on that team I really like. Warrick Dunn is definitely one of my favorite players & not just because he's the little guy that could when so many said he couldn't, but also because of how he put his family on his back even before he got to the NFL & pulled them up & out of poverty, his continuing & unwavering humanitarian work. Keith brooking is another one of my favorite players. Salt of the earth lunch pail blue collar guy from Senoia Ga. Loved watching him play at Ga Tech & then was thrilled when the Falcons drafted him.Now I know that dog fighting is a world wide sport that is wildly popular & even condoned in other parts of the world (South East Asia in particular), but this is here, it's our culture & we have laws against it as we recognize that dog fighting is wrong.I'm also more than aware that sometimes dogs are put down for failing to perform. When I was first out of school, I traveled a lot & during my travels I happened to work a on a sheep farm & then a cattle station (in Australia). On both farms there were of course working dogs, pets somewhat, but first & foremost, they were working dogs. I did see where some dogs from a litter were given a couple of years to show if they had the talent / instinct / smarts to pick up the skills needed to be working dogs. If they didn't show the aptitude, one day I'd see them head off for a ride they never came back from. Quickly & humanely put down with a 22. Every man, woman, child & dog has to pull their weight on a working farm. No free rides there.But I never saw any of the farmers take any satisfaction. In fact when they returned without the dog, they were always subdued & quiet for the rest of the day. They certainly never took any perverse pleasure in putting down the dog(s) & never got off on electrocuting, drowning or beating a dog to death.But Vick's actions are different. I don't care that he was raised around it. It's illegal & in our culture we know it's wrong. The "But everyone else is doing it" is an excuse when you're a little kid, but a grown man knows better. The sick & perverse ways he had dogs dispatched is just cruel. I do think Child Molesters, Murderers, Rapists etc are much worse criminals than Vick, but he's not far behind.

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You guys kill me sometimes. So it's perfectly acceptable to put a round into a dog's skull because he didn't "pull his weight"? No free rides! I guess you're right and he deserved it after all, not like those pit bulls. I find that pretty funny.Edited to add that I think it's a good idea to rip up your season tickets and stop going to see your favorite team and your favorite players (guys like Dunn and Brooking whom you can look up to) all on account of a guy like Vick. Good call!

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Big Score said:

Called the Falcons ticket office the other day & told them we would not be renewing our season tickets if Vick remains an active member of the organization.Tough decision as there's lots of players on that team I really like. Warrick Dunn is definitely one of my favorite players & not just because he's the little guy that could when so many said he couldn't, but also because of how he put his family on his back even before he got to the NFL & pulled them up & out of poverty, his continuing & unwavering humanitarian work. Keith brooking is another one of my favorite players. Salt of the earth lunch pail blue collar guy from Senoia Ga. Loved watching him play at Ga Tech & then was thrilled when the Falcons drafted him.Now I know that dog fighting is a world wide sport that is wildly popular & even condoned in other parts of the world (South East Asia in particular), but this is here, it's our culture & we have laws against it as we recognize that dog fighting is wrong.I'm also more than aware that sometimes dogs are put down for failing to perform. When I was first out of school, I traveled a lot & during my travels I happened to work a on a sheep farm & then a cattle station (in Australia). On both farms there were of course working dogs, pets somewhat, but first & foremost, they were working dogs. I did see where some dogs from a litter were given a couple of years to show if they had the talent / instinct / smarts to pick up the skills needed to be working dogs. If they didn't show the aptitude, one day I'd see them head off for a ride they never came back from. Quickly & humanely put down with a 22. Every man, woman, child & dog has to pull their weight on a working farm. No free rides there.But I never saw any of the farmers take any satisfaction. In fact when they returned without the dog, they were always subdued & quiet for the rest of the day. They certainly never took any perverse pleasure in putting down the dog(s) & never got off on electrocuting, drowning or beating a dog to death.But Vick's actions are different. I don't care that he was raised around it. It's illegal & in our culture we know it's wrong. The "But everyone else is doing it" is an excuse when you're a little kid, but a grown man knows better. The sick & perverse ways he had dogs dispatched is just cruel. I do think Child Molesters, Murderers, Rapists etc are much worse criminals than Vick, but he's not far behind.

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Sweat Hog said:

zed2283 said:

Big Score said:

Called the Falcons ticket office the other day & told them we would not be renewing our season tickets if Vick remains an active member of the organization.Tough decision as there's lots of players on that team I really like. Warrick Dunn is definitely one of my favorite players & not just because he's the little guy that could when so many said he couldn't, but also because of how he put his family on his back even before he got to the NFL & pulled them up & out of poverty, his continuing & unwavering humanitarian work. Keith brooking is another one of my favorite players. Salt of the earth lunch pail blue collar guy from Senoia Ga. Loved watching him play at Ga Tech & then was thrilled when the Falcons drafted him.Now I know that dog fighting is a world wide sport that is wildly popular & even condoned in other parts of the world (South East Asia in particular), but this is here, it's our culture & we have laws against it as we recognize that dog fighting is wrong.I'm also more than aware that sometimes dogs are put down for failing to perform. When I was first out of school, I traveled a lot & during my travels I happened to work a on a sheep farm & then a cattle station (in Australia). On both farms there were of course working dogs, pets somewhat, but first & foremost, they were working dogs. I did see where some dogs from a litter were given a couple of years to show if they had the talent / instinct / smarts to pick up the skills needed to be working dogs. If they didn't show the aptitude, one day I'd see them head off for a ride they never came back from. Quickly & humanely put down with a 22. Every man, woman, child & dog has to pull their weight on a working farm. No free rides there.But I never saw any of the farmers take any satisfaction. In fact when they returned without the dog, they were always subdued & quiet for the rest of the day. They certainly never took any perverse pleasure in putting down the dog(s) & never got off on electrocuting, drowning or beating a dog to death.But Vick's actions are different. I don't care that he was raised around it. It's illegal & in our culture we know it's wrong. The "But everyone else is doing it" is an excuse when you're a little kid, but a grown man knows better. The sick & perverse ways he had dogs dispatched is just cruel. I do think Child Molesters, Murderers, Rapists etc are much worse criminals than Vick, but he's not far behind.

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You guys kill me sometimes. So it's perfectly acceptable to put a round into a dog's skull because he didn't "pull his weight"? No free rides! I guess you're right and he deserved it after all, not like those pit bulls. I find that pretty funny.Edited to add that I think it's a good idea to rip up your season tickets and stop going to see your favorite team and your favorite players (guys like Dunn and Brooking whom you can look up to) all on account of a guy like Vick. Good call!

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Zed, I saw Pulp Fiction. I thought you were dead. Or was that just your brain???Read slowly, ok?One dog is humanely put down with no pleasure involved and for logical reason. Vick killed dogs in very cruel and painful ways because they did not support his gambling habit in a way that suited him. See the diff??Regarding season tickets - HE'S SENDING A MESSAGE TO THE ORGANIZATION SO THEY WILL SEE THE BIG PICTURE AND CUT OUT THE CANCER. I can post a connect the dots diagram next time if you still don't get it.

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Truman said:

Big Score said:

Called the Falcons ticket office the other day & told them we would not be renewing our season tickets if Vick remains an active member of the organization.Tough decision as there's lots of players on that team I really like. Warrick Dunn is definitely one of my favorite players & not just because he's the little guy that could when so many said he couldn't, but also because of how he put his family on his back even before he got to the NFL & pulled them up & out of poverty, his continuing & unwavering humanitarian work. Keith brooking is another one of my favorite players. Salt of the earth lunch pail blue collar guy from Senoia Ga. Loved watching him play at Ga Tech & then was thrilled when the Falcons drafted him.Now I know that dog fighting is a world wide sport that is wildly popular & even condoned in other parts of the world (South East Asia in particular), but this is here, it's our culture & we have laws against it as we recognize that dog fighting is wrong.I'm also more than aware that sometimes dogs are put down for failing to perform. When I was first out of school, I traveled a lot & during my travels I happened to work a on a sheep farm & then a cattle station (in Australia). On both farms there were of course working dogs, pets somewhat, but first & foremost, they were working dogs. I did see where some dogs from a litter were given a couple of years to show if they had the talent / instinct / smarts to pick up the skills needed to be working dogs. If they didn't show the aptitude, one day I'd see them head off for a ride they never came back from. Quickly & humanely put down with a 22. Every man, woman, child & dog has to pull their weight on a working farm. No free rides there.But I never saw any of the farmers take any satisfaction. In fact when they returned without the dog, they were always subdued & quiet for the rest of the day. They certainly never took any perverse pleasure in putting down the dog(s) & never got off on electrocuting, drowning or beating a dog to death.But Vick's actions are different. I don't care that he was raised around it. It's illegal & in our culture we know it's wrong. The "But everyone else is doing it" is an excuse when you're a little kid, but a grown man knows better. The sick & perverse ways he had dogs dispatched is just cruel. I do think Child Molesters, Murderers, Rapists etc are much worse criminals than Vick, but he's not far behind.

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How long have you been a season ticket holder for? Why didn't you give your tickets back when Babineaux stomped on his girlfriends' dogs' head? Or when Cornelius Bennett was convicted of sexual assault?The Falcons don't need simple minded fans like you, if you really have a problem with how players behave off the field you should be watching the WNBA.

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Two Deep said:

Stealthycat said:

as I write this my Pembroke Welsh Corgi is at my side

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my wife ran over mine a few weeks back and I had to put her down - Corgi's are great dogsdamn you Vick, this is somehow tied to your sorry thug ###

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Thats a little harsh don't you think? I'm sure it was an accident.

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Truman said:

Feel free to go back to vilifying Vick while Leonard Little is still running around carefree. It's not as if he's killed anyone. Oh wait....

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ILUVBEER99 said:

mad sweeney said:

I've read your very moderate and spun "retractions", however they came nowhere near the vehemence of your denunciations of those that didn't agree with your blind 100% conviction of Vick's innocence. And no it wasn't a "wait and see" position you took, although you were firm in innocent until proven guilty. You took any story against Vick and turned it into a 'witch hunt' piece and denounced anyone who felt differently. I doubt based on all your previous threads that if the tables were turned you would find statements like yours to be adequate. They're like TO apologies. They satisfy some minor legal definition of the word but don't really cut it base don your previous actions. But yes, I do know that you have changed your stance, but I wouldn't consider you to have "manned up" like you called others to do when things looked differently.

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I never said Vick was 100% innocent, i said we should wait until we actually have some credible evidence before we consider him guilty.I made a post where i posted in big letters saying Vick is innocent of all charges just to show how ridiculous it was that people on the other side were doing the opposite before we had any real info one way or the other.

Like i said you won't be happy no matter what. I changed my stance based on the information that was in the federal indictment and admitted it looks like he is most likely involved. If that isn't enough for you i'm sorry.

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2stix said:

ILUVBEER99 said:

mad sweeney said:

I've read your very moderate and spun "retractions", however they came nowhere near the vehemence of your denunciations of those that didn't agree with your blind 100% conviction of Vick's innocence. And no it wasn't a "wait and see" position you took, although you were firm in innocent until proven guilty. You took any story against Vick and turned it into a 'witch hunt' piece and denounced anyone who felt differently. I doubt based on all your previous threads that if the tables were turned you would find statements like yours to be adequate. They're like TO apologies. They satisfy some minor legal definition of the word but don't really cut it base don your previous actions. But yes, I do know that you have changed your stance, but I wouldn't consider you to have "manned up" like you called others to do when things looked differently.

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I never said Vick was 100% innocent, i said we should wait until we actually have some credible evidence before we consider him guilty.I made a post where i posted in big letters saying Vick is innocent of all charges just to show how ridiculous it was that people on the other side were doing the opposite before we had any real info one way or the other.

Like i said you won't be happy no matter what. I changed my stance based on the information that was in the federal indictment and admitted it looks like he is most likely involved. If that isn't enough for you i'm sorry.

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So what of your self imposed year ban from back when you were swearing vicks innocence? Are you "manning"up.



See you next year or........

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cobalt_27 said:

Truman said:

Feel free to go back to vilifying Vick while Leonard Little is still running around carefree. It's not as if he's killed anyone. Oh wait....

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So, it's beyond your sensibilities to vilify both?

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ILUVBEER99 said:

2stix said:

ILUVBEER99 said:

mad sweeney said:

I've read your very moderate and spun "retractions", however they came nowhere near the vehemence of your denunciations of those that didn't agree with your blind 100% conviction of Vick's innocence. And no it wasn't a "wait and see" position you took, although you were firm in innocent until proven guilty. You took any story against Vick and turned it into a 'witch hunt' piece and denounced anyone who felt differently. I doubt based on all your previous threads that if the tables were turned you would find statements like yours to be adequate. They're like TO apologies. They satisfy some minor legal definition of the word but don't really cut it base don your previous actions. But yes, I do know that you have changed your stance, but I wouldn't consider you to have "manned up" like you called others to do when things looked differently.

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I never said Vick was 100% innocent, i said we should wait until we actually have some credible evidence before we consider him guilty.I made a post where i posted in big letters saying Vick is innocent of all charges just to show how ridiculous it was that people on the other side were doing the opposite before we had any real info one way or the other.

Like i said you won't be happy no matter what. I changed my stance based on the information that was in the federal indictment and admitted it looks like he is most likely involved. If that isn't enough for you i'm sorry.

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So what of your self imposed year ban from back when you were swearing vicks innocence? Are you "manning"up.



See you next year or........

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Ummm, he hasn't been convicted. I said if he was convicted ILUVBEER99 would take a year ban, and that will happen if he indeed gets convicted.I could just have the mods change my sign in name though, that way ILUVBEER99 is banned, but i could still post with this account. So i have an out if he in fact goes down.

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Truman said:

cobalt_27 said:

Truman said:

Feel free to go back to vilifying Vick while Leonard Little is still running around carefree. It's not as if he's killed anyone. Oh wait....

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So, it's beyond your sensibilities to vilify both?

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I'm more interested in watching them perform for my entertainment.

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