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Are the DUI laws a joke? (1 Viewer)

KCitons

Footballguy
I've seen a lot of reports over the past few years about drivers with 2 or 3 DUI, that are still out on the streets. Usually, you hear about it after a fatal accident. I don't understand all the wasted advertising and preaching about not drinking and driving, only to have the legal system fail to follow through.

The reason for my concern is that my father in law (68 years old) received his 3rd DUI in the past ten years. This is actually his fourth DUI since my wife and I have been married. This time, he was pulled over at 2 o'clock in the afternoon and was twice the legal limit. After his last one (5 years ago), he spent 90 days in the county jail. It also forced him to retire early, since he lost his license for a year.

When he was first arrested, I did some research and found that our state laws consider the 3rd offense in 15 years and/or over twice the legal limit to be considered battery and a felony. Max fine was something like $10k fine, 10 year loss of license, and 5 years in jail. He has been to court a couple of times. First to the county court where he was arrested. They bumped it up, because of the seriousness of the offense to a higher court. (he thought because he would go to the state pen, instead of county jail due to the felony charge) Just recently, the courts knocked the charge from a felony to a misdemeanor?

Even though he's my father in law, I have no doubt that he is going to continue to drink and drive as long as the law will allow him. He still drinks every day (although not driving) When you try to discuss it with him, it only pushes him to drink more. Part of me thinks that a long stint in the Pen would dry him out and he would be better for it.

Sadly, it was his drinking that kept us from ever leaving our kids alone with him. He just couldn't be trusted.

In my younger days, I drove drunk. I know most people have at one time or another. I also know this is less about the driving and more about what is causing him to drink. Maybe it's the fact that my three kids are starting to drive now, that I don't want people like this to get a 2nd or 3rd chance to kill someone.

 
definately a problem. Statistics show that people with one DUI are far more likely to get a second/third etc. Sounds like he really needs to get some help. Good luck.

 
It's a joke that someone with no prior can have their life ruined by having one too many (and not be impaired) while someone like this is a repeat offender. He should be forced to have a breathalyzer/interlock in his car.

 
He will probably lose his license for at least 10 years if this is his third offense in 10 years. Probably do some jail time as well. Doubt he will ever legally drive again given his age.

 
He will probably lose his license for at least 10 years if this is his third offense in 10 years. Probably do some jail time as well. Doubt he will ever legally drive again given his age.
I'd like to think so. But, this change from a felony to a misdemeanor, has me thinking a 90 stint in the county jail, $1k fine and 1 year license suspension. We'll see in a couple weeks, he has another court appearance.

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
You would think, but are you fixing the problem? Or just delaying the inevitable?

I've also seen that some states are requiring offenders to check in daily or weekly for alcohol test. If they can't stay sober, then they go to jail.

 
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Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
You would think, but are you fixing the problem? Or just delaying the inevitable?

I've also seen that some states are requiring offenders to check in daily or weekly for alcohol test. If they can't stay sober, then they go to jail.
Seems like a good idea.

 
A couple of local guys have lost their license for 15 years. You know you have a problem when that happens. Drink all you want, but why get behind the wheel?

 
You should see what third offense in Wisconsin gets you...

I'm pretty sure they just give you a good scolding and then hand the keys back to you...

 
A couple of local guys have lost their license for 15 years. You know you have a problem when that happens. Drink all you want, but why get behind the wheel?
Guys in Pro sports with a free service still get them, people make bad decisions when impaired.

 
I've also seen that some states are requiring offenders to check in daily or weekly for alcohol test. If they can't stay sober, then they go to jail.
Seems like a good idea.
I'm assuming you're kidding here. I have no problem with sending people to jail for repeat offenses of driving impaired.... but sending people to jail for simply consuming alcohol is a bit of a silly proposition. As long as they're not driving they are within their legal rights to consume alcohol.

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
How about permanent license revoking instead?

Sending them to jail costs money and there's no room anyway. Just have a no tolerance law. You drive drunk, you can never drive again no exceptions. It would increase public transportation revenues too.

 
A couple of local guys have lost their license for 15 years. You know you have a problem when that happens. Drink all you want, but why get behind the wheel?
Guys in Pro sports with a free service still get them, people make bad decisions when impaired.
Sure, everyone can make a mistake, but you have to get caught 3 or 4 times to lose your license for 15 years. That doesn't count the number of times they drove without getting caught.

I understand the alcoholism part, but stay home and get bombed out of you mind for all I care. It's cheaper that way too.

 
The problem with my father in law is two fold. One, he is a danger to society, if he continues to drink and drive. Secondly, he's has a problem that he refuses to acknowledge. He has had other accidents that injured himself as well as other people around him (sister in law got nicked by chain saw a few years ago). You just can't trust being around the guy unless you are sitting in the living room. Strangely, he's healthy for a man nearing 70 years old that drinks and smokes.

 
I don't know that they are a joke. I have a friend who's wife got a DUI when she wrecked her car into a telephone pole and nearly lost her life. When she applied for the diversion program (out patient rehab, AA meetings, UAs, etc) they found a DUI she had nearly 10 years prior, despite going through the diversion program back then. If you get a second DUI < 10 years, they revoke the diversion of the 1st and treat the 2nd AS a 2nd. As a result, she was sentenced to 30 days in jail, got out early, had to wear an ankle bracelet, can't have alcohol in the house, can't drive, thousands of dollars in fines...life is hell for her right now. And it's all her fault, for sure, but I'm not seeing this as a slap on the wrist. She's lucky to be alive and even luckier she didn't hurt or kill somebody else.

 
I don't think 10 years in jail makes a ton of sense. Revoking a liscense does though. 1st offense, 6 months no driving. 2nd offense, 2 years no driving, 3rd offense, maybe a decade or even permenant revocation.

Taking away the drunk's right to drive mitigates the problem, no need to feed and house them for a decade as a result. Unless they killed someone or something, but that should be a manslaughter charge and seperate.

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
How about permanent license revoking instead?

Sending them to jail costs money and there's no room anyway. Just have a no tolerance law. You drive drunk, you can never drive again no exceptions. It would increase public transportation revenues too.
Where do you fall on people riding a bike after drinking?

 
The problem with my father in law is two fold. One, he is a danger to society, if he continues to drink and drive. Secondly, he's has a problem that he refuses to acknowledge. He has had other accidents that injured himself as well as other people around him (sister in law got nicked by chain saw a few years ago). You just can't trust being around the guy unless you are sitting in the living room. Strangely, he's healthy for a man nearing 70 years old that drinks and smokes.
Hold on here a second. Are you suggesting that there's something wrong with knocking back a few before breaking out the chainsaw? Puritan. :rolleyes:

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
How about permanent license revoking instead?

Sending them to jail costs money and there's no room anyway. Just have a no tolerance law. You drive drunk, you can never drive again no exceptions. It would increase public transportation revenues too.
Where do you fall on people riding a bike after drinking?
I don't know the statistics on that, but it seems to me they're more likely to kill themselves than other people doing that, so it works itself out in the end.

 
I've also seen that some states are requiring offenders to check in daily or weekly for alcohol test. If they can't stay sober, then they go to jail.
Seems like a good idea.
I'm assuming you're kidding here. I have no problem with sending people to jail for repeat offenses of driving impaired.... but sending people to jail for simply consuming alcohol is a bit of a silly proposition. As long as they're not driving they are within their legal rights to consume alcohol.
I don't see much wrong with someone convicted of a DUI losing their legal right to drink alcohol for a certain period.

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
How about permanent license revoking instead?

Sending them to jail costs money and there's no room anyway. Just have a no tolerance law. You drive drunk, you can never drive again no exceptions. It would increase public transportation revenues too.
Where do you fall on people riding a bike after drinking?
More of a danger to themselves than others really.

I'm pretty okay with people endangering themselves. Darwinism.

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
How about permanent license revoking instead?

Sending them to jail costs money and there's no room anyway. Just have a no tolerance law. You drive drunk, you can never drive again no exceptions. It would increase public transportation revenues too.
Where do you fall on people riding a bike after drinking?
Drinking and using a segway is a national scourge. .

 
The problem with my father in law is two fold. One, he is a danger to society, if he continues to drink and drive. Secondly, he's has a problem that he refuses to acknowledge. He has had other accidents that injured himself as well as other people around him (sister in law got nicked by chain saw a few years ago). You just can't trust being around the guy unless you are sitting in the living room. Strangely, he's healthy for a man nearing 70 years old that drinks and smokes.
Hold on here a second. Are you suggesting that there's something wrong with knocking back a few before breaking out the chainsaw? Puritan.
Only if you try to cut of your step daughters limbs.

 
GG, the problem with your posts is that 99% of them are filled with garbage. So, even if you have 1% that are relevant, I skip over those too. But, thanks for playing.

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
How about permanent license revoking instead?

Sending them to jail costs money and there's no room anyway. Just have a no tolerance law. You drive drunk, you can never drive again no exceptions. It would increase public transportation revenues too.
Where do you fall on people riding a bike after drinking?
Drinking and using a segway is a national scourge. .
What about a Big Wheel?

 
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GordonGekko said:
KCitons, on 03 Jun 2013 - 10:20, said:I don't understand all the wasted advertising and preaching about not drinking and driving, only to have the legal system fail to follow through.
How are DUI laws a joke?I would wager they are plenty punitive but upon time and escalation, they become a sunk cost to someone in your FIL's situation. What's another 90 days in jail when you've lost your job, your license and most of your freedom anyway?However the time and resources taken up by your FIL to be in jail and for the system to process him is not cheap. It costs far more to process and house and feed him than any of the fines he's been given. Guess where it comes from? Taxpayer dollars. The same taxpayer dollars that could be used to improve schools, hire more cops and firefighters, be spent on medical research to help children, to be spent on youth sports programs and for public enrichment, like improving your local library or local parks, things for everyone in the community to enjoy.Everything has an opportunity cost associated with it.<p>Your FIL's behavior cheats every child in your community. It cheats every child from nearly every person on this board. It cheats my child, it cheats your three children. The cost to feed a bunch of drunks in jail for a year, maybe that's a music program that could have been save
The alias is losing his grasp.

 
Think of all the money that could have been given away as corporate tax breaks if only we hadn't spent it locking up drunk drivers.

 
He will probably lose his license for at least 10 years if this is his third offense in 10 years. Probably do some jail time as well. Doubt he will ever legally drive again given his age.
I'd like to think so. But, this change from a felony to a misdemeanor, has me thinking a 90 stint in the county jail, $1k fine and 1 year license suspension. We'll see in a couple weeks, he has another court appearance.
Pretty sure that part won't stop people like this.

 
Think of all the money that could have been given away as corporate tax breaks if only we hadn't spent it locking up drunk drivers.
We don't have to lock up repeat offenders. But, we have to do something to make them accountable for their actions. For those that think the penalty of losing a license and early retirement was a pretty big penalty,why does he continue to drink and drive?

Right after he retired, he worked for a family friend. She ended up firing him because he was working while drunk.

He needs to be forced to get help. If he won't listen to family members, maybe the threat of total loss of freedom would be the wake up call he needs.

 
Meh, my brother has gotten 2 DUIs and was pulled over on his street a couple houses away from his home (he had been drinking and worked right down the street from his house).He refused a breathalyzer (which avoided his 3rd DUI more than likely) for which they automatically suspend your license for 12 months here in missouri.He had to pay fines, and attend classes which were very expensive. After about 6 months without his license and after his classes were completed they issued him a sort of permit that allowed him to drive during the day and to and from work.By and large - yes I would say DUI laws are joke.

 
No jail time in Wisconsin for first offense, it's like a giant get out of jail free card. Thus far I've avoided any DUI drama, so I got that going for me, which is nice.

 
Seems like the laws are reasonable. Losing a job, lost previledges, some jail time. We can't keep every drunk behind bars, our prison system is not that big.
You would think, but are you fixing the problem? Or just delaying the inevitable?

I've also seen that some states are requiring offenders to check in daily or weekly for alcohol test. If they can't stay sober, then they go to jail.
This is how it is on FIRST offenses in NY. Mandatory daily call-ins that are linked directly and tracked with automated random drug testing. ETA: Also it's all a money grab. Pay for the actual fines/citations and automatic tow/impound. Pay monthly for probation, pay 2x for counseling, pay fist fulls for the DMV for fines, licence renewals and other 'fees' lose your license for anywhere 1-3 years. I can see for a repeat offender or egregious offenses but.....

Well i'm torn. Don't break the law and bad stuff shouldn't happen. But some minor offenders who legitimately made a single mistake by having three beers and driving two hours later to be randomly stopped and blow slightly above the limit? There should be some give or a case by case analysis instead of 'throwing them into the grinder'.

 
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I've also seen that some states are requiring offenders to check in daily or weekly for alcohol test. If they can't stay sober, then they go to jail.
Seems like a good idea.
I'm assuming you're kidding here. I have no problem with sending people to jail for repeat offenses of driving impaired.... but sending people to jail for simply consuming alcohol is a bit of a silly proposition. As long as they're not driving they are within their legal rights to consume alcohol.
I'm assuming that the no-drinking thing was part of their probation that they agreed to in a plea. So if they're sent to jail after failing a test, they're not really being sent to jail for drinking; they're being sent to jail for driving drunk because their probation has been revoked.

 
I've also seen that some states are requiring offenders to check in daily or weekly for alcohol test. If they can't stay sober, then they go to jail.
Seems like a good idea.
I'm assuming you're kidding here. I have no problem with sending people to jail for repeat offenses of driving impaired.... but sending people to jail for simply consuming alcohol is a bit of a silly proposition. As long as they're not driving they are within their legal rights to consume alcohol.
I'm assuming that the no-drinking thing was part of their probation that they agreed to in a plea. So if they're sent to jail after failing a test, they're not really being sent to jail for drinking; they're being sent to jail for driving drunk because their probation has been revoked.
^ That's what it is. If you 'plea' to probation instead of jail-time, the probation terms are pretty strict. Most don't allow you to leave your home DISTRICT (not even to go out of state or city) and most prohibit any forms of alcohol.

 
GordonGekko said:
I don't understand all the wasted advertising and preaching about not drinking and driving, only to have the legal system fail to follow through.
How are DUI laws a joke?

I would wager they are plenty punitive but upon time and escalation, they become a sunk cost to someone in your FIL's situation. What's another 90 days in jail when you've lost your job, your license and most of your freedom anyway?

However the time and resources taken up by your FIL to be in jail and for the system to process him is not cheap. It costs far more to process and house and feed him than any of the fines he's been given. Guess where it comes from? Taxpayer dollars. The same taxpayer dollars that could be used to improve schools, hire more cops and firefighters, be spent on medical research to help children, to be spent on youth sports programs and for public enrichment, like improving your local library or local parks, things for everyone in the community to enjoy.

Everything has an opportunity cost associated with it.

Your FIL's behavior cheats every child in your community. It cheats every child from nearly every person on this board. It cheats my child, it cheats your three children. The cost to feed a bunch of drunks in jail for a year, maybe that's a music program that could have been saved a local high school. Maybe there's a kid at that school with real talent, all they needed was a chance, a place to learn, a place to realize a potential dream.

The system and DUI law are not a joke.

Your FIL is a joke. He could be 500 miles away from your three kids but he's still punishing them for his stupid horse ####.

What do you want the "legal system" to do? Drag him behind the barn and strangle him with piano wire? Because your FIL is lucky that there are places in the world that would do just that to him. He's fortunate the liberal feminist welfare happy America is much more merciful than many countries around the world.

If you want to blame your FIL for his failings, go right ahead, there's along list for you to work your way down to get through. But let's ease back on squatting over and dropping a Code Brown on the system because apparently the only solution really is some piano wire.

I detest drunk drivers. That you were one once is reprehensible. That softball excuse that "everyone did it once" is also reprehensible. You want your FIL to own it, but look how much you dance around your own indiscretion. You want to blame the system. You want to minimize your own harm. Understanding you have to take pure and total accountability for your choices in life, that lesson learned is when a boy becomes a man. I'm curious, who is going to teach your sons how to be men? Because they aren't learning it from Dad and Grandpa. So you can grit your teeth at someone spending 3K on their dog's ACL, but you can't grit your teeth at yourself for getting loaded and trying to be a freeway hero looking for some last chance power drive?
And the biggest load of crap goes to....

 
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I think they need an expert level license. If you can pound a six pack and maneuver a police designed obstacle course, your limit goes up to .15 or so.

But seriously. Most places in America have abysmal public transportation and are not walkable communities. Probably 90% of vehicles leaving any bar on a weekend night are DUI. The system sets people up to fail.

I wish it was like europe and there was a tavern on every corner. Some of you big city FBG's probably have it like that.

I've driven home over the limit thousands of times in my youth. That said nowadays I severly limit my intake when out unless the wife is going to drive. But it would sure be nice to have some drinks and be able to walk a block or two home but in the midwest that is pretty difficult.

 
GordonGekko said:
I don't understand all the wasted advertising and preaching about not drinking and driving, only to have the legal system fail to follow through.
How are DUI laws a joke?

I would wager they are plenty punitive but upon time and escalation, they become a sunk cost to someone in your FIL's situation. What's another 90 days in jail when you've lost your job, your license and most of your freedom anyway?

However the time and resources taken up by your FIL to be in jail and for the system to process him is not cheap. It costs far more to process and house and feed him than any of the fines he's been given. Guess where it comes from? Taxpayer dollars. The same taxpayer dollars that could be used to improve schools, hire more cops and firefighters, be spent on medical research to help children, to be spent on youth sports programs and for public enrichment, like improving your local library or local parks, things for everyone in the community to enjoy.

Everything has an opportunity cost associated with it.

Your FIL's behavior cheats every child in your community. It cheats every child from nearly every person on this board. It cheats my child, it cheats your three children. The cost to feed a bunch of drunks in jail for a year, maybe that's a music program that could have been saved a local high school. Maybe there's a kid at that school with real talent, all they needed was a chance, a place to learn, a place to realize a potential dream.

The system and DUI law are not a joke.

Your FIL is a joke. He could be 500 miles away from your three kids but he's still punishing them for his stupid horse ####.

What do you want the "legal system" to do? Drag him behind the barn and strangle him with piano wire? Because your FIL is lucky that there are places in the world that would do just that to him. He's fortunate the liberal feminist welfare happy America is much more merciful than many countries around the world.

If you want to blame your FIL for his failings, go right ahead, there's along list for you to work your way down to get through. But let's ease back on squatting over and dropping a Code Brown on the system because apparently the only solution really is some piano wire.

I detest drunk drivers. That you were one once is reprehensible. That softball excuse that "everyone did it once" is also reprehensible. You want your FIL to own it, but look how much you dance around your own indiscretion. You want to blame the system. You want to minimize your own harm. Understanding you have to take pure and total accountability for your choices in life, that lesson learned is when a boy becomes a man. I'm curious, who is going to teach your sons how to be men? Because they aren't learning it from Dad and Grandpa. So you can grit your teeth at someone spending 3K on their dog's ACL, but you can't grit your teeth at yourself for getting loaded and trying to be a freeway hero looking for some last chance power drive?
Who gave posty the keys to GG?

 
GordonGekko said:
I don't understand all the wasted advertising and preaching about not drinking and driving, only to have the legal system fail to follow through.
How are DUI laws a joke?

I would wager they are plenty punitive but upon time and escalation, they become a sunk cost to someone in your FIL's situation. What's another 90 days in jail when you've lost your job, your license and most of your freedom anyway?

However the time and resources taken up by your FIL to be in jail and for the system to process him is not cheap. It costs far more to process and house and feed him than any of the fines he's been given. Guess where it comes from? Taxpayer dollars. The same taxpayer dollars that could be used to improve schools, hire more cops and firefighters, be spent on medical research to help children, to be spent on youth sports programs and for public enrichment, like improving your local library or local parks, things for everyone in the community to enjoy.

Everything has an opportunity cost associated with it.

Your FIL's behavior cheats every child in your community. It cheats every child from nearly every person on this board. It cheats my child, it cheats your three children. The cost to feed a bunch of drunks in jail for a year, maybe that's a music program that could have been saved a local high school. Maybe there's a kid at that school with real talent, all they needed was a chance, a place to learn, a place to realize a potential dream.

The system and DUI law are not a joke.

Your FIL is a joke. He could be 500 miles away from your three kids but he's still punishing them for his stupid horse ####.

What do you want the "legal system" to do? Drag him behind the barn and strangle him with piano wire? Because your FIL is lucky that there are places in the world that would do just that to him. He's fortunate the liberal feminist welfare happy America is much more merciful than many countries around the world.

If you want to blame your FIL for his failings, go right ahead, there's along list for you to work your way down to get through. But let's ease back on squatting over and dropping a Code Brown on the system because apparently the only solution really is some piano wire.

I detest drunk drivers. That you were one once is reprehensible. That softball excuse that "everyone did it once" is also reprehensible. You want your FIL to own it, but look how much you dance around your own indiscretion. You want to blame the system. You want to minimize your own harm. Understanding you have to take pure and total accountability for your choices in life, that lesson learned is when a boy becomes a man. I'm curious, who is going to teach your sons how to be men? Because they aren't learning it from Dad and Grandpa. So you can grit your teeth at someone spending 3K on their dog's ACL, but you can't grit your teeth at yourself for getting loaded and trying to be a freeway hero looking for some last chance power drive?
Who gave posty the keys to GG?
Posty is incapable of a rambling, sanctimonious, long winded diatribe like this. This has Ham written all over it.

 
I think they need an expert level license. If you can pound a six pack and maneuver a police designed obstacle course, your limit goes up to .15 or so.

But seriously. Most places in America have abysmal public transportation and are not walkable communities. Probably 90% of vehicles leaving any bar on a weekend night are DUI. The system sets people up to fail.

I wish it was like europe and there was a tavern on every corner. Some of you big city FBG's probably have it like that.

I've driven home over the limit thousands of times in my youth. That said nowadays I severly limit my intake when out unless the wife is going to drive. But it would sure be nice to have some drinks and be able to walk a block or two home but in the midwest that is pretty difficult.
yeah, we have a bar on every corner...

and we still have the highest rate of drunk driving in the country.

Please try again to make an excuse for it... Because that one absolutely does not work.

 

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