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Don't sleep on Donte Moncrief: Draft Day steal

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dansav

dansav 33

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On September 4, 2016 at 9:32 AM, SaintsInDome2006 said:

I think I'd go Moncrief over Sanders considering the QB situation in Den.

True I posted like 3 months ago,. Thought Sanchez could dink and dunk to sandy 

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joeschmo

For the Steelers, I'd say the fact that Ben keeps going to him.

Max Power

Buy Low

Hu-Tang Clan

Sure is a lot of Landry vs Diggs discussion in a Moncrief thread.

chad in Indy

chad in Indy 220

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On September 4, 2016 at 10:10 AM, Milkman said:

#2 on Indy imo..........When Luck was playing last year T.Y. had 74 targets in 7 games. Moncrief had 55. It should be lots of the same this year. Don't see him passing T.Y. for targets.

 

That's not to say he can't have a great year as Indy's #2 but he'll be more TD dependent.

A lot depends on the O-line play. Hilton gets a lot of ydg in chunks and needs time for plays to develop. Moncrief can be a chain mover, is a better redzone target.....plus a big play threat. Sorry, but Hilton just isn't on the same level as other stud small WRs like AB or OBD. It's why Hilton never gets more than 7-8 TDs per year. For the price, I'd rather take Moncrief with what I believe to be a higher ceiling.  

As to your target analysis, this was also bc Grigson was in denial of a bad free agency move meaning an over-the-hill Andre Johnson and Hilton were the normal WRs in 2 WR sets. You should see a jump in targets now that Andre was sent packing and Moncrief will be in on those 2 WR sets.

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Ministry of Pain

Ministry of Pain 5,395

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3 hours ago, chad in Indy said:

A lot depends on the O-line play. Hilton gets a lot of ydg in chunks and needs time for plays to develop. Moncrief can be a chain mover, is a better redzone target.....plus a big play threat. Sorry, but Hilton just isn't on the same level as other stud small WRs like AB or OBD. It's why Hilton never gets more than 7-8 TDs per year. For the price, I'd rather take Moncrief with what I believe to be a higher ceiling.  

As to your target analysis, this was also bc Grigson was in denial of a bad free agency move meaning an over-the-hill Andre Johnson and Hilton were the normal WRs in 2 WR sets. You should see a jump in targets now that Andre was sent packing and Moncrief will be in on those 2 WR sets.

Hilton is like DeSean Jackson, both have big hearts in small bodies. Hilton is the playmaker, not sure what you don't see in his game. How many teams you own Moncrief on? He is still developing, glad to give him praise when he makes it there but Moncrief is still learning and a work in progress. 

I think Hilton is still the guy with the most points in 2016 ahsh

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chad in Indy

chad in Indy 220

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17 hours ago, Ministry of Pain said:

Hilton is like DeSean Jackson, both have big hearts in small bodies. Hilton is the playmaker, not sure what you don't see in his game. How many teams you own Moncrief on? He is still developing, glad to give him praise when he makes it there but Moncrief is still learning and a work in progress. 

I think Hilton is still the guy with the most points in 2016 ahsh

I own him in one league. Thx. My point was pretty direct. Andre Johnson accounted for 75+ targets last year. Moncrief should be the primary beneficiary of him leaving.  Moncrief is by far a better redzone threat and is more likely to hit double digit TDs over Hilton.  Ultimately, my point was that Hilton has a safer floor, but I didn't think Hilton was worth the WR1 price....I live in Indy so he goes for a bit of a premium here.  I'd rather take Moncrief as a fringe WR2/3 who I see outperforming that.

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the spanker

the spanker 32

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35 minutes ago, chad in Indy said:

I own him in one league. Thx. My point was pretty direct. Andre Johnson accounted for 75+ targets last year. Moncrief should be the primary beneficiary of him leaving.  Moncrief is by far a better redzone threat and is more likely to hit double digit TDs over Hilton.  Ultimately, my point was that Hilton has a safer floor, but I didn't think Hilton was worth the WR1 price....I live in Indy so he goes for a bit of a premium here.  I'd rather take Moncrief as a fringe WR2/3 who I see outperforming that.

T.Y. Has a 82-1504-10 receiving line with Luck's last 16 full games.

 

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ryno1980

ryno1980 81

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43 minutes ago, the spanker said:

T.Y. Has a 82-1504-10 receiving line with Luck's last 16 full games.

That doesn't really prove anything. Moncrief has a 57-765-8 receiving line with Luck's last 16 full games and that includes his rookie year when Reggie Wayne was around to take 116 targets. 

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the spanker

the spanker 32

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Just now, ryno1980 said:

That doesn't really prove anything. Moncrief has a 57-765-8 receiving line with Luck's last 16 full games and that includes his rookie year when Reggie Wayne was around to take 116 targets. 

Thanks you just helped prove my point.

What it proves is that it is an "assumption" Moncrief will score more TDs than Hilton.   

Regardless I expect Hilton to get more targets overall than Moncrief over the season.

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ryno1980

ryno1980 81

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1 hour ago, the spanker said:

Thanks you just helped prove my point.

What it proves is that it is an "assumption" Moncrief will score more TDs than Hilton.   

Regardless I expect Hilton to get more targets overall than Moncrief over the season.

No, not at all. There's no doubt Hilton is more probable to see more overall targets, but it should be very close.

Moncrief has proven to score more TDs/target than Hilton. T.Y. has 110 more targets than Moncrief the past 2 seasons and 3 more TDs (12 to 9). 

The assumption I'm making is, since Moncrief was on pace for 120 targets with Luck under center in 2015, he should finish within 10-20 targets of Hilton overall. (T.Y.'s career-high is 139).

Edited by ryno1980
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ryno1980

ryno1980 81

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22 minutes ago, the spanker said:

Hilton's last 16 games with a healthy Luck don't lie -- 1500/10. Ignore them at your own risk. 

 

 

 

There was a good argument about Hilton's consistency throughout his career: 

Among top-tier WRs, and excluding his rookie season, Hilton leads with highest percentage of games under 10 PPR points at 37.5 percent, just ahead of Sammy Watkins. For where you had to draft Hilton, there are more consistent options. 

But isn't this a Moncrief thread? 

Hilton's presence doesn't hurt Donte, it helps him. 

Dorsett is the guy that could put a dent into both of of those guys, potentially.

Edited by ryno1980
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the spanker

the spanker 32

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1 minute ago, spider321 said:

No one is ignoring them.

Hilton will be a very good 2nd option for Luck this season.

Surely you jest?  On average from what I've

 

6 minutes ago, ryno1980 said:

 

 

 

There was a good argument about Hilton's consistency throughout his career: 

Among top-tier WRS, and excluding his rookie season, Hilton leads with highest percentage of games under 10 PPR points at 37.5 percent, just ahead of Sammy Watkins. For where you had to draft Hilton, there are more consistent options. 

But isn't this a Moncrief thread? 

Hilton's presence doesn't hurt Donte, it helps him. 

Dorsett is the guy that could put a dent into both of of those guys, potentially.

Yes and those stats are without Luck so your cherry picking here.

In PPR, if you want to compare floors, Hilton in Luck's last 16 full games has a total of 3 games scoring less than 10 points (wk 2 vs Jets, wk 8 at CAR in 2015; wk 11 2014 vs NE).  That's as many as OBJ and Megatron and one fewer than AJ Green in their QB's last 16 completed games.

 

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ryno1980

ryno1980 81

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Posted (edited)
5 minutes ago, the spanker said:
5 minutes ago, the spanker said:

Hahaha...Okay it meant something a minute ago because your brought those Hilton stats up not me, correct?

 

 

It just meant I don't think Hilton is a lock for 1,500 and 10 TDs as you seem to think. My previous post about Moncrief is what I find relevant for Moncrief:

Quote

 

Moncrief has proven to score more TDs/target than Hilton. T.Y. has 110 more targets than Moncrief the past 2 seasons and 3 more TDs (12 to 9). 

The assumption I'm making is, since Moncrief was on pace for 120 targets with Luck under center in 2015, he should finish within 10-20 targets of Hilton overall. (T.Y.'s career-high is 139)."

 

And they've both been without Luck the same amount of time during that time.

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the spanker

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22 minutes ago, spider321 said:

No one is ignoring them.

Hilton will be a very good 2nd option for Luck this season.

Surely you Jest?

Unless Moncrief adopts Hilton's work ethic and football IQ, he will always be second fiddle.

The truth of the matter from my observations is a lot of people don't trust Hilton because of his build. Seems like every time a new WR shows up on the Colts roster with a bigger physique, they are quick to latch on with something like "He'll overtake T.Y. as the number one before long".  

T.Y. just keeps ripping up DBs like he has since his rookie year.  4,400 yds and 24 TDs in 4 years.  If he was 6'4" those same people would be drafting him at half the number he's going at now (around 14th WR off the board according to FBG averages) with Luck back at full strength this year.

I like Moncrief, too.  I just don't think T.Y. is going anywhere when it comes to the #1 in Indy, barring injury.

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spider321

spider321 1,124

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On ‎9‎/‎9‎/‎2016 at 11:58 PM, the spanker said:

Surely you Jest?

Unless Moncrief adopts Hilton's work ethic and football IQ, he will always be second fiddle.

The truth of the matter from my observations is a lot of people don't trust Hilton because of his build. Seems like every time a new WR shows up on the Colts roster with a bigger physique, they are quick to latch on with something like "He'll overtake T.Y. as the number one before long".  

T.Y. just keeps ripping up DBs like he has since his rookie year.  4,400 yds and 24 TDs in 4 years.  If he was 6'4" those same people would be drafting him at half the number he's going at now (around 14th WR off the board according to FBG averages) with Luck back at full strength this year.

I like Moncrief, too.  I just don't think T.Y. is going anywhere when it comes to the #1 in Indy, barring injury.

:coffee:

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Buck Bradcanon

Buck Bradcanon 1,434

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Roto

Quote

 

ESPN's Adam Schefter reports Donte Moncrief will have an MRI on his shoulder Monday.

Moncrief took a big hit from T.J. Ward in the second quarter of the Week 2 loss and never returned. Moncrief was thought to be dealing with a concussion initially, but a shoulder injury makes more sense considering he was allowed back on the sidelines during the game. If he is forced to miss any time, Phillip Dorsett would become a must-start option.

 

 
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bicycle_seat_sniffer

bicycle_seat_sniffer 5,109

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2 minutes ago, saintfool said:

Colts are brutal to watch right now. Playing the Chargers at home is a better match up than the Broncos on the road. They need this win badly and Moncrief - if he plays - can do good work here.

Chargers actually have really good corners. Its rb n tes that been killing them

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saintfool

saintfool 2,759

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Just now, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Chargers actually have really good corners. Its rb n tes that been killing them

Chargers defense might be good but it's a big step down from the 10000 Immortals in Denver. I think the Chargers should win but that doesn't mean the Colts can't put up some points.

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Bucsfan5493

Bucsfan5493 645

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1 hour ago, bicycle_seat_sniffer said:

Chargers actually have really good corners. Its rb n tes that been killing them

Who is opposite of Verrett? I know to usually stay away from whoever he is guarding and I would think that would be TY. Was hoping this would open up some more room for Moncrief (if he plays) and Dwayne Allen.

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bicycle_seat_sniffer

bicycle_seat_sniffer 5,109

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9 minutes ago, Bucsfan5493 said:

Who is opposite of Verrett? I know to usually stay away from whoever he is guarding and I would think that would be TY. Was hoping this would open up some more room for Moncrief (if he plays) and Dwayne Allen.

Brandon flowers. The slot cb is casey haward. Manti teo cant cover anyone so he gets exploited. Edit to add. Their starting saftey addae just got hurt so the middle should be open more too

Edited by bicycle_seat_sniffer
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Buck Bradcanon

Buck Bradcanon 1,434

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Posted

I don't like the clues we are getting.

 

http://www.indystar.com/story/sports/nfl/colts/colts-insider/2016/09/20/how-long-donte-moncrief-sidelined/90746796/
 

Quote

 

INDIANAPOLIS -- The Colts are awaiting additional medical opinions on the shoulder injury sustained by wide receiver Donte Moncrief in Sunday's game at Denver.

Those opinions will, the team hopes, help establish a timeline for long how the receiver will be out of the lineup.

Moncrief's injury occurred in the first quarter of a 34-20 loss to the Broncos. He did not return to the game.

If Moncrief is out of the lineup for any length of time, the Colts will have to lean heavily on Phillip Dorsett, who would become the No. 2 receiver behind No. 1 T.Y. Hilton. Moncrief's potential absence would mean an expanded role for backups Quan Bray and Chester Rogers.

In two appearances this season, Moncrief has seven catches for 73 yards and one touchdown.

 

 

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shadyridr

shadyridr 14,320

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Donte Moncrief - WR -  Colts

The Colts are awaiting further test results on Donte Moncrief's shoulder.

The Indianapolis Star senses it's a matter of how many, not "if," when it comes to the number of games Moncrief will miss. Reporter Stephen Holder does believe the issue is not "season ending." Moncrief has yet to be formally ruled out for Week 3, so there's really not much to go on for the time being.
 
 
Sep 20 - 5:23 PM
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steelwind

steelwind 375

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15 minutes ago, shadyridr said:
Donte Moncrief - WR -  Colts

The Colts are awaiting further test results on Donte Moncrief's shoulder.

The Indianapolis Star senses it's a matter of how many, not "if," when it comes to the number of games Moncrief will miss. Reporter Stephen Holder does believe the issue is not "season ending." Moncrief has yet to be formally ruled out for Week 3, so there's really not much to go on for the time being.
 
 
Sep 20 - 5:23 PM

Just want to point out the article says they are getting a "sense" not sources told.  Two huge distinct differences.  I'm not saying Moncrief is okay.  But their guess is as good as ours.

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