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RB Kareem Hunt, CLE (7 Viewers)

I actually think it's too late to obtain Hunt.  It's going to take a king's ransom to get it and is anyone - other than hot sauce guy - willing to pay David Johnson when healthy prices?  He might be worth it but he also could regress and then you just traded a WR1, good RB and possibly first round pick to get him. And at this point, what's really in it for the other team to trade him? Anyone who owns feels like they stuck gold and are probably 2-0. Yup I think he's probably already nearly untouchable in any league.

 
The Jacket said:
If the Hunt owner accepts, start a league vote to kick him out of the league. Playing with owners that bad can't be fun.
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That's not a terrible offer in a dynasty league. I'm not as high on Cooper as some but he's a consensus first round pick in dynasty leagues and Cohen has looked pretty good in his own right. I would not accept that offer (if I didn't already own Cohen in the league I have Hunt) but it's not insulting at all and I'd imagine some would prefer the Cooper side.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
That's not a terrible offer in a dynasty league. I'm not as high on Cooper as some but he's a consensus first round pick in dynasty leagues and Cohen has looked pretty good in his own right. I would not accept that offer (if I didn't already own Cohen in the league I have Hunt) but it's not insulting at all and I'd imagine some would prefer the Cooper side.
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Yep. Personally think that's Hunts WR match in terms of value right now.

 
Just not enough upside from Cooper IMO. WR22 and WR15 his first 2 years. Hunt has No. 1 overall player upside -- he'll probably score more TDs before week 6 than Cooper will all year. 

Then again, maybe longevity carries a big premium in regular dynasty leagues. I only play in salary cap dynasties where things are a little more volatile every few years. I guess if you can hold onto Cooper for the next 12 years and get his solid 1100 yards and 5-6 TDs that's worth a lot.

 
zoonation said:
You know I'm on board the Hunt train with you pal, but pump the brakes on these numbers.  Ain't going to happen.  20 TDs ain't happening.   

This is long tough season. Realistic ceiling numbers would be 1250/700/16.  And that would be good enough for a top two redraft value next year. 

25 TDs?  No way.  He's not Jim Brown. 
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He has 5 in 2 games. 

 
fruity pebbles said:
In a dynasty, young WRs tend to have more value than RBs. 
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That hasn't been my experience.  But in any case, Cooper has pretty much proven himself by actual track record to be a middle WR2.  You can put whatever spin on that you like - Crabtree certainly has affected his value - but the numbers are what they are.

 
Gandalf said:
I actually think it's too late to obtain Hunt.  It's going to take a king's ransom to get it and is anyone - other than hot sauce guy - willing to pay David Johnson when healthy prices?  He might be worth it but he also could regress and then you just traded a WR1, good RB and possibly first round pick to get him. And at this point, what's really in it for the other team to trade him? Anyone who owns feels like they stuck gold and are probably 2-0. Yup I think he's probably already nearly untouchable in any league.
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I don't have to - I have him in both of my leagues. ;)  

At this point I wouldn't sell. But then both teams are deep, and 2-0, so I don't really need to make a deal at this point. 

Not to say they're perfect. On one team my QBs suck (Semien/Bradford/TyTaylor) but I can't see giving up a top 3 RB for a QB when I specifically drafted QB freefall. 

But not all teams are alike. A couple folks in here posted that they had DJohnson/Hunt. I bet that team would be willing to make a deal.  Or a team that's rockin Gronk/Luck/ARobinson - at some point a team with Hunt & a bunch of injuries would be smart to leverage Hunt into a package for players that gives them a chance to compete. 

 
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Hot Sauce Guy said:
I don't have to - I have him in both of my leagues. ;)  

At this point I wouldn't sell. But then both teams are deep, and 2-0, so I don't really need to make a deal at this point. 

Not to say they're perfect. On one team my QBs suck (Semien/Bradford/TyTaylor) but I can't see giving up a top 3 RB for a QB when I specifically drafted QB freefall. 

But not all teams are alike. A couple folks in here posted that they had DJohnson/Hunt. I bet that team would be willing to make a deal.  Or a team that's rockin Gronk/Luck/ARobinson - at some point a team with Hunt & a bunch of injuries would be smart to leverage Hunt into a package for players that gives them a chance to compete. 
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So I guess that could be true for a team desperate to win now with needs elsewhere. The thing is that most teams that have Hunt, probably got him in round 3 or later based on timing of drafts. That means he's the RB2 on a lot of teams which also means that those teams barring injury are probably okay in other areas.  I just think the amount needed to get Hunt off of teams = not good value for the team trading for Hunt.  And if it's not good value, why make the deal? Hence essentially untouchable.

 
Bronco Billy said:
A middling WR2 and a gadget RB?  Really?  You could throw a 2018 1st rounder onto the Cooper/Cohen side and I wouldn't take it for Hunt right now.  I don't get your/Gandalf's valuation here at all.

.
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Well my valuation was to not overpay haha.  Not saying that it was enough...  I don't think any amount will pry Hunt off this guys roster right now.  And I'm not going to destroy my team for Hunt after two games. Hence why I think he's untouchable.  Let's try it this way.  Bronco Billy what would it take for Hunt right now?

 
Gandalf said:
Well my valuation was to not overpay haha.  Not saying that it was enough...  I don't think any amount will pry Hunt off this guys roster right now.  And I'm not going to destroy my team for Hunt after two games. Hence why I think he's untouchable.  Let's try it this way.  Bronco Billy what would it take for Hunt right now?
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Hunt is on my untradable lust.  Bonafide RB1s are just too valuable, and he looks like he might live up to that right now.  There are some guys you build a team around.  I'm gambling that I found that guy.  In any case, I'm willing to risk being wrong.

 
Bronco Billy said:
Hunt is on my untradable lust.  Bonafide RB1s are just too valuable, and he looks like he might live up to that right now.  There are some guys you build a team around.  I'm gambling that I found that guy.  In any case, I'm willing to risk being wrong.
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Exactly what I have been saying. Untouchable.

 
Yeah even regarding HSG's mention of teams with lots of injury issues, we're talking dynasty here so I doubt any of them are looking to cash out to fill temporary holes.  My team with Hunt is basically one of those teams (Luck/OBJ/ARob all missing time) and I have zero desire to sell Hunt.  I'm 2-0 because of Hunt in spite of getting basically zero points out of all those guys thus far (benched OBJ this week since I didn't have anyone else in the MNF game for a backup).

I'd rather sit here and daydream about what my team will look like when I get those guys back and still have Hunt than sell Hunt to try and replace them.

 
Concept Coop said:
I offered McCoy/Dez in a PPR dynasty league and was shot down.  Considering McCoy/Hopkins, but not sure I have the stones to do it.  I know the tickets are expensive, but dammit, I want to be a part of this journey.  
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McCoy being old AF with a ton of mileage would be a deal killer for me. 

Plus I've been burned by Dez a couple of times now, and watching him I'm unconvinced he'll ever be as good as he was expected to be. He can't get separation, isn't faster than even decent DBs and for a player his size doesn't seem to be able to fight for the 50-50 balls. Sunday he was targeted what, 16 times? Caught 7 for like 60 yards? That's not awesome. And 2 of his force-fed targets led to interceptions. 

I just don't see the appeal of that in Dynasty. Redraft, maybe someone would bite if they needed help at WR/RB. It's not an unfair offer for redraft. 

Not at all shocked it was rejected in dynasty. IMO that offer falls well short -  Maybe the dynasty players can weigh in, but it doesn't seem remotely close. 

 
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Hot Sauce Guy said:
McCoy being old AF with a ton of mileage would be a deal killer for me. 

Plus I've been burned by Dez a couple of times now, and watching him I'm unconvinced he'll ever be as good as he was expected to be. He can't get separation, isn't faster than even decent DBs and for a player his size doesn't seem to be able to fight for the 50-50 balls. Sunday he was targeted what, 16 times? Caught 7 for like 60 yards? That's not awesome. And 2 of his force-fed targets led to interceptions. 

I just don't see the appeal of that in Dynasty. Redraft, maybe someone would bite if they needed help at WR/RB. It's not an unfair offer for redraft. 

Not at all shocked it was rejected in dynasty. IMO that offer falls well short -  Maybe the dynasty players can weigh in, but it doesn't seem remotely close. 
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I am not a fan of Dez, but yoh are selling him a bit short. He did just face 2 of the best, if not the best secondaries in the league. 

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
McCoy being old AF with a ton of mileage would be a deal killer for me. 

Plus I've been burned by Dez a couple of times now, and watching him I'm unconvinced he'll ever be as good as he was expected to be. He can't get separation, isn't faster than even decent DBs and for a player his size doesn't seem to be able to fight for the 50-50 balls. Sunday he was targeted what, 16 times? Caught 7. That's not awesome. And 2 of his force-fed targets led to interceptions. 

I just don't see the appeal of that in Dynasty. Redraft, maybe someone would bite if they needed help at WR/RB. It's not an unfair offer for redraft. 

Not at all shocked it was rejected in dynasty. IMO that offer falls well short -  Maybe the dynasty players can weigh in, but it doesn't seem remotely close. 
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Dez is one of the premier 50-50 guys in the league, but I get your overall point. He has a tough first 5 weeks of the schedule, but he'll rebound.  He's no longer a dynasty WR1, but he's a valuable piece still. 

 
Hot Sauce Guy said:
McCoy being old AF with a ton of mileage would be a deal killer for me. 

Plus I've been burned by Dez a couple of times now, and watching him I'm unconvinced he'll ever be as good as he was expected to be. He can't get separation, isn't faster than even decent DBs and for a player his size doesn't seem to be able to fight for the 50-50 balls. Sunday he was targeted what, 16 times? Caught 7. That's not awesome. And 2 of his force-fed targets led to interceptions. 

I just don't see the appeal of that in Dynasty. Redraft, maybe someone would bite if they needed help at WR/RB. It's not an unfair offer for redraft. 

Not at all shocked it was rejected in dynasty. IMO that offer falls well short -  Maybe the dynasty players can weigh in, but it doesn't seem remotely close. 
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While McCoy and Dez each have some mileage left, they are working on the wrong side of their careers.  Most dynasty owners place a heavy premium on young talent, and right now Hunt will cost you handsomely.  Unless you believe Hunt is a generational-type talent, I would sit back and let his value normalize.  His value cannot get much higher than it currently is.

 
msudaisy26 said:
If Hunt hits that rookie wall this thread will be epic. 
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and you'll be the first one in to say "I told you so" - just like you were when he did nothing in the first half last week.

I think 90% of the people have been pretty level headed about him - you're the only one that keeps bringing up Priest Holmes (in a derisive manner of course).

He's a young productive RB in a league that really needs some - and he's fun to watch. People should get excited. It's only natural - but I think most will also acknowledge it's only been two games and players have burst onto the scene only to tail off. If you owned him though I bet you'd be pulling for him.

If he does flame out eventually I hope you enjoy your schadenfreude.

 
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Concept Coop said:
Dez is one of the premier 50-50 guys in the league, but I get your overall point. He has a tough first 5 weeks of the schedule, but he'll rebound.  He's no longer a dynasty WR1, but he's a valuable piece still. 
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I used to think Dez was one of the premier 50-50 guys, but I haven't seen that Dez in a while.

Not trying to rip the guy or bash on your opinion of him, but I've watched him pretty closely and he doesn't seem to have that same level of ability.  From what I've seen he's not fast as he once was off the line, nor is he able to create the same separation as other big receivers. I don't know what's going on with Dez, but I don't see him as an elite receiver any more. I also question why the Cowboys don't throw slants or button hook routes that Dez seemed to be so successful with earlier in his career, so maybe some of this is on the OC.  (ETA, sorry, a "curl" route - I'm old and so I still call the hitch or curl a "hook" or "button hook". lol)

Maybe you're right and it's the schedule, but most #1 receivers do a lot more than 7/59 yards with 16 targets.  We'll see what happens when his matchups get easier I guess. 

 
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Dr. Octopus said:
and you'll be the first one in to say "I told you so" - just like you were when he did nothing in the first half last week.

I think 90% of the people have been pretty level headed about him - you're the only one that keeps brining up Priest Holmes.

He's a young productive RB in a league that really needs some - and he's fun to watch. People should get excited. It's only natural - but I think most will also acknowledge it's only been two games and players have burst onto the scene only to tail off.

If he does flame out eventually I hope you enjoy your schadenfreude.
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Absolutely not, I think he us a top 5ish rb for dynasty right now and redraft I would take him 1st. With that said, I would still take a lot of more proven guys over him in dynasty. 

Read what I wrote after a half last week again. I wanted to know where his fans were, no reason to jump ship even if he sucked all game against a great front 7. Sad part is it took him scoring for anyone to say anything. Everyone has bad games. 

 
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Dr. Octopus said:
I think 90% of the people have been pretty level headed about him
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I'm in love and I don't care who knows it! :wub:   

lol - actually I'm also somewhat level headed about him. I just prefer to discuss him in terms of upside, because he's an exciting young player and he's fun to watch. 

He's a young productive RB in a league that really needs some - and he's fun to watch. People should get excited. It's only natural - but I think most will also acknowledge it's only been two games and players have burst onto the scene only to tail off.
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Yep - 2 games. 2 games he's helped me to win my weeks, and 2 games where I've seen him used as a feature back, in a typical Andy Reid "break one to the house at any moment" type role. Couldn't have asked for a better fit for Hunt than the KC Chiefs and Reid as his HC. :yes:  

 
Dr. Octopus said:
:lmao:

Who just basically posted yearningly for him to hit the rookie wall?
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I didn't, I said this thread would be epic if he did. Sorry, but this is entertaining, and that would be too. 

I wasn't the 1st to say Priest Holmes, and since you love quoting me, or at least you think you are quoting me, can you at least have decency to scroll back 4 pages and do it? I said maybe I am wrong and he is Priest Holmes 2.0 after I said he isn't Priest Holmes. 

 
socrates said:
While McCoy and Dez each have some mileage left, they are working on the wrong side of their careers.  Most dynasty owners place a heavy premium on young talent, and right now Hunt will cost you handsomely.  Unless you believe Hunt is a generational-type talent, I would sit back and let his value normalize.  His value cannot get much higher than it currently is.
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I agree with most of this, but just like last week I'd argue that it could in fact get higher. 

There are still clearly some Hunt doubters. Flash in the pan, might hit a rookie wall, without the 53 yard TD his game woulda sucked, etc types. 

Just like I said last week - he doesn't even have to have a spectacular game. But a 15+ carry, 5+ reception game against the chargers would establish a clear usage trend and would increase his value. If he also scores 1 TD, he'd help to further cement his weekly floor as a typical Chiefs RB who's floor is higher for the RZ usage and probability he'll score a TD. 

Now fast forward to the end of the season - say Hunt is a top 3 RB, leading all RBs in TDs. How much higher is his value then? 

IMO his value will continue to increase with every week that his usage is demonstrated, whether he has a poor game or not. Eventually he will have a mediocre game, I am positive. But if he has 20 touches in a mediocre game even that will elevate his value. 

 
msudaisy26 said:
Absolutely not, I think he us a top 5ish rb for dynasty right now and redraft I would take him 1st. With that said, I would still take a lot of more proven guys over him in dynasty. 

Read what I wrote after a half last week again. I wanted to know where his fans were, no reason to jump ship even if he sucked all game against a great front 7. Sad part is it took him scoring for anyone to say anything. Everyone has bad games. 
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Geez, some of us have other things to do.  Doesn't mean anyone was hiding.  It was fun to see your gloating get turned sideways on you though.

 
Hot sauce guy has an epic man crush on a guy that has played 2 games in the NFL. It is funny, he is driving the band wagon with one hand, shaking Chief pompoms in the other hand, while wearing a brand new authentic Hunt jersey by  prespending his fantasy football winnings for 2017. He is like Soulfly and Hunt is Gordon, only on steroids. 

No offense Hot sauce guy, I think it is cute. My husband has the same crush on Brady. 

 
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msudaisy26 said:
I didn't, I said this thread would be epic if he did. Sorry, but this is entertaining, and that would be too. 

I wasn't the 1st to say Priest Holmes, and since you love quoting me, or at least you think you are quoting me, can you at least have decency to scroll back 4 pages and do it? I said maybe I am wrong and he is Priest Holmes 2.0 after I said he isn't Priest Holmes. 
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You say you didn't bring up Priest Holmes but then said you did bring him up after you brought him up? I'm a little confused, I guess. 

Honestly - no worries. I'm not trying to start anything or really call you out. It was just funny to me that after your post at halftime on Sunday, Hunt then blew up. And I thought you were kind of doubling down on the "rookie wall" comment.

You could end up being right about him fading away - it certainly wouldn't be the first time a player blew up and then fell back into obscurity.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
You say you didn't bring up Priest Holmes but then said you did bring him up after you brought him up? I'm a little confused, I guess. 

Honestly - no worries. I'm not trying to start anything or really call you out. It was just funny to me that after your post at halftime on Sunday, Hunt then blew up. And I thought you were kind of doubling down on the "rookie wall" comment.

You could end up being right about him fading away - it certainly wouldn't be the first time a player blew up and then fell back into obscurity.
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Read the whole post, I said I wasn't the 1st to bring Priest up. 

I don't think he fades away, he looks the part, but it is too new and I am not going to pay the sticker shock price for him. 

 
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msudaisy26 said:
Hot sauce guy has an epic man crush on a guy that has played 2 games in the NFL. It is funny, he is driving the band wagon with one hand, shaking Chief pompoms in the other hand, while wearing a brand new authentic Hunt jersey by  prespending his fantasy football for 2017. He is like Soulfly and Hunt is Gordon, only on steroids. 

No offense Hot sauce guy, I think it is cute. My husband has the same crush on Brady. 
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You're damn right I am! Toot toot, all aboaaaaaaaaaaard!!! 

Go Hunt go! Go Hunt Go! 

I :wub:  Hunt with the passion of 10 men.  And why shouldn't I? He's dreamy! 

To be fair, I started crushing on Hunt before Ware was known to be out for the season, happily taking him 6.05, which now looks like an absolute steal. I then took him 1.07 in my draft the day before the season started (with 50 points in the bank) - still risky. 

So not only am I driving the bandwagon, I rotated the tires & started the engine. And after last year's disaster in both of my leagues where literally none of my sleepers worked out for me and my RB2 freakin retired in week 3 (Foster), it's really nice to strike gold on a player. 

Now that all said, I don't take any offense to it - it's all in fun, including my exaggerated mancrush (though I haven't taken a FFB relationship this seriously since LT2, when I literally named my FFB team "Tomlinson Mancrush").  

And all that fun aside, I am rather serious in player evaluation. And to me, though it's just 2 games, Hunt absolutely passes the eye test. He's a shifty power back with great vision, hands, smooth route runner, good football IQ and an engine that doesn't quit. I was more impressed by his 2 yard TD than his 53 yarder. The week before his 1st receiving score was the most impressive as Smith's throw was not great - Hunt made it look easy, both extending and subtly changing his route to bring in the catch, then breaking a tackle to get into the end zone. The kid is the real deal, and in an ideal situation to succeed. IMO health is the only thing that could prevent a top 3 season. He legitimately reminds me of Tomlinson. Hopefully he continues to do so. ;)  

ETA: I am most certainly NOT like Soulfly. I prefer to invest my emotions in players who are actually capable of helping me to win a FFB league. The heart is a tender thing, not to be trifled with lightly, nor is it large enough to idly fill with players who can't stop smoking weed. :lol:  

 
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Dr. Octopus said:
You could end up being right about him fading away - it certainly wouldn't be the first time a player blew up and then fell back into obscurity.
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Absolutely. It has happened before and could happen here.  I just think it's less likely when a guy has shown that he is such a complete RB.  He's a nice combination of speed and power, plus he's a real asset in the passing game.

I haven't seen any weaknesses yet (please note - that is not the same as saying he is great at everything).  He looks like he's got some staying power.

 
Dr. Octopus said:
and you'll be the first one in to say "I told you so" - just like you were when he did nothing in the first half last week.

I think 90% of the people have been pretty level headed about him - you're the only one that keeps bringing up Priest Holmes (in a derisive manner of course).

He's a young productive RB in a league that really needs some - and he's fun to watch. People should get excited. It's only natural - but I think most will also acknowledge it's only been two games and players have burst onto the scene only to tail off. If you owned him though I bet you'd be pulling for him.

If he does flame out eventually I hope you enjoy your schadenfreude.
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10 points for using "schadenfreude" in a post!

 
fruity pebbles said:
Mind sharing the list of guys you'd rather have? Im still kinda fortifying his value in my mind as well.
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Leveon Bell - Love him as a player, plus he went to my school

David Johnson - He is their offense, and even though he was an older rookie, I also expect him to last a little longer than normal backs because less tread on the tires

Zeke Elliot - He only had one year of great production and behind the leagues best line, but I have a hard time thinking that Dallas won't have an above average line for a while. Legal troubles scare me a little.

Those guys all above Hunt

These guys are same tier

Todd Gurley - I think 2016 was the outlier for him, the Rams will get better and he is the biggest beneficiary of it. I could see him being in the discussion for top overall back after this year.

Melvin Gordon - The Chargers use their backs in a variety of ways, if they ever get decent at run blocking Gordon could crack the top 3

Leonard Fournette - he is on a bad team and doing well right now, similar to Gurley's rookie year

Dalvin Cook - I just love his talent, I think he ends up being the best back from this class, it is my opinion

Jay Ajayi - He is a workhorse, getting more involved in the passing game and I love that fact that people are always sleeping on him. I have traded for him and feel like I have gotten him cheap. In one league where I have tried to sell him, I can't get fair value for him

Derrick Henry - The writing is on the wall in Tennessee, at worst this is Henry's backfield starting 2018. Plus there are weapons galore and a young qb that can run.

Saquon Barkley - I know, I know he hasn't played yet. This kid just looks special, like really special, the type of guy that comes around once a decade type.

Guys that just missed Christian McCaffery, Joe Mixon, Devonta Freeman, Nick Chubb, Derrius Guice

Take this with a grain of salt, I only try to predict 2 or 3 years out at the most in dynasty, too much change happens year in and year out. I also believe next years running back class could be special, like 1983 qb class special.

 
msudaisy26 said:
Leveon Bell - Love him as a player, plus he went to my school

David Johnson - He is their offense, and even though he was an older rookie, I also expect him to last a little longer than normal backs because less tread on the tires

Zeke Elliot - He only had one year of great production and behind the leagues best line, but I have a hard time thinking that Dallas won't have an above average line for a while. Legal troubles scare me a little.

Those guys all above Hunt

These guys are same tier

Todd Gurley - I think 2016 was the outlier for him, the Rams will get better and he is the biggest beneficiary of it. I could see him being in the discussion for top overall back after this year.

Melvin Gordon - The Chargers use their backs in a variety of ways, if they ever get decent at run blocking Gordon could crack the top 3

Leonard Fournette - he is on a bad team and doing well right now, similar to Gurley's rookie year

Dalvin Cook - I just love his talent, I think he ends up being the best back from this class, it is my opinion

Jay Ajayi - He is a workhorse, getting more involved in the passing game and I love that fact that people are always sleeping on him. I have traded for him and feel like I have gotten him cheap. In one league where I have tried to sell him, I can't get fair value for him

Derrick Henry - The writing is on the wall in Tennessee, at worst this is Henry's backfield starting 2018. Plus there are weapons galore and a young qb that can run.

Saquon Barkley - I know, I know he hasn't played yet. This kid just looks special, like really special, the type of guy that comes around once a decade type.

Guys that just missed Christian McCaffery, Joe Mixon, Devonta Freeman, Nick Chubb, Derrius Guice

Take this with a grain of salt, I only try to predict 2 or 3 years out at the most in dynasty, too much change happens year in and year out. I also believe next years running back class could be special, like 1983 qb class special.
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Based on your post almost half the teams are looking at having superstar rbs in their backfield with 1800 total yards and 12-15tds.  It's been a long time since that happened.  

 
killface said:
Based on your post almost half the teams are looking at having superstar rbs in their backfield with 1800 total yards and 12-15tds.  It's been a long time since that happened.  
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The league goes in cycles, I posted it a couple of weeks ago that I think the 3 down back is coming back. I am not predicting that type of production though or them being superstars.

 
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Philly, who has a top front 7 anyways, sold out to stop the run. In watching his carries last Sunday, Philly had 8 or more in the box on 62% of his runs. Twice having 9 men in the box. Every other time they had 7 men in the box. His long run came against a 7 man front.

 
So far I have been wrong about my thoughts on Hunt.  He didn't pass my eye test but that's why I am here and not in an NFL front office.

What I was right on in the fantasy gold of being a RB in an Reid offense.

My question is what the hell did West do to get no looks/carries. lol  The guy has like 1 carry for 25 yrds and a TD.  He must have slept with someones wife

 
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