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Cleveland Browns (7 Viewers)
- Thread starter wadegarrett
- Start date
amnesiac
beer is good
MAC_32
Footballguy
defensive minded coach, question marks in current pass rush, versatile. I would not be shocked, but I would not be thrilled either. We need offense.
Bobcat10
Footballguy
MAC_32
Footballguy
Yes. I think he can play with his hand in the dirt too. Guys like him are why I had no interest in Mingo last year.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Ok, so I actually had a phone convo with my friend last night.
The text was a little overblown, as he honestly asking me a question to ask me what I thought of Robinson and Mack. (because we have discussed them weeks ago)
He said very little has changed on all fronts from what he told me originally.
Low on QBs, not over the moon on Mack (but they do like him, just not with what is potentially available at 4).
So, by the sounds of it, choice remains between matthews, robinson and watkins. He fully expects that the decision will be between robinson and watkins (matthews will be gone at 2, i assume), and that the offensive choice seems more likely at the moment.
I'm 110% cool with either guy coming. I see the merits in each one, but my body and lack of awesomeness in the Browns for sooo long have me screaming for Watkins.
eta: FWIW, Schefter thinks the top 4 goes Clowney, Robinson, Mack, Watkins.
The text was a little overblown, as he honestly asking me a question to ask me what I thought of Robinson and Mack. (because we have discussed them weeks ago)
He said very little has changed on all fronts from what he told me originally.
Low on QBs, not over the moon on Mack (but they do like him, just not with what is potentially available at 4).
So, by the sounds of it, choice remains between matthews, robinson and watkins. He fully expects that the decision will be between robinson and watkins (matthews will be gone at 2, i assume), and that the offensive choice seems more likely at the moment.
I'm 110% cool with either guy coming. I see the merits in each one, but my body and lack of awesomeness in the Browns for sooo long have me screaming for Watkins.
eta: FWIW, Schefter thinks the top 4 goes Clowney, Robinson, Mack, Watkins.
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
- OT Greg Robinson
- OLB/DE Kalil Mack
I'm not sure either one of them will be available at pick #4 if the first three picks are:
1. DE Jadevion Clowney
2. OT Greg Robinson
3. OLB/DE Kalil Mack
But if OT Jake Mathews goes at 2 instead of Robins he's there and if Houston takes a QB then Jacksonville takes Clowney or Jax might take a QB at 3 so both 'could' be there at 4.
So if the pick is down to Robinson or Mack who makes the most sense?
We seem set at OLB but Pettine had super-szed OLB/DE Mario Williams in Buffalo as the lynchpin that his D revolved around.
Then OT appears to be fine but Pettine mentioned Jon Ogden when Robinson's name came-up and Pettine said Ogden began his career inside at guard his rookie season so it seemed he had given the thought of taking Robsinson some thought and I think Robinson has Pro Bowl ability if its honed so moving him inside for his rookie season is exactly what I'd do if I were Pettine and Robinson fell into my lap.
I have paid attention to what Pettine has said and two quotes stick out to me that he said right after he was hired that don't seem to fit either OT or OLB with the top pick.
"To win in this league you have to have a great quarterback and that's something we're going to put our full focus and attention on."--New Browns HC Mike Pettine
"You can't have enough explosive athletes that can score points for you. You can't have enough."--Browns HC Mike Pettine
Those quotes indicate QB or WR and the QB chatter was before any serious evaluation of this class took place. I think he honestly does want a great quarterback and so does most of the teams picking high but it doesn't appear that any great QB exist in this draft class so I don't think we'll force -it with the top pick.
That other quote rings true though eh?
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Soulfly3
Footballguy
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Hoyer has been nothing more than a journeyman QB thus far in his career. I think he looked fine last season, but it was a small sample size. Cousins showed some flashes as a rookie and looked pretty pedestrian as a second year player.
An offense is generally as good or as bad as the QB leading it - so it's difficult to try and state the Browns can match anyone weapon for weapon and act like the offense will be a fine tuned machine with no captain in place to steer the ship.
I'm not saying Hoyer can't be successful. It's hard not to like the guy's entusiasm and grit. He does have some nice intabgibles in place. My fear would be that his tangible assets rank him as below average starting QB.
I still would not be shocked to see the Browns take a QB with the No. 4 pick - especially if they are presented with their top choice (whoever that may be).
MAC_32
Footballguy
I'm not against point one, but point two is nuts. I think relying on Hoyer would be foolish though. If you're not sold on any of the rookies, (while I disagree) fine, but still bring in someone to develop as a plan B possibility. If Hoyer regresses or proves he has issues staying healthy there's someone there to take over. If either succeeds, great, if they don't then we are in a position to draft a qb again next year anyway. Hopefully this time with a returning coaching staff.
Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
No. Everyone here remembers him beating the Browns. Unfortunately that is the only game he has managed to win.
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Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
Quick decision maker. Fastest release in the league. That is tangible.
Weeden slowest release in the league. Results speak for themselves.
MAC_32
Footballguy
Pretty much. Dominant run blocker right now, skill set to become a dominant pass protector, but lack of experience (Auburn was very run heavy) led to inconsistency. Drafting him allows us to slide Schwartz inside, effectively fixing two holes with one pick.
I don't think Matthews makes sense for us because his strength is not needed as this team is currently constructed. He's the best pass protector right now, but if we draft him it means Hoyer is likely starting week one. Hoyer gets the ball out very quickly, making pass protection less of an issue, even if it isn't the greatest (as it was at times last year).
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
The rason why QB Kirk Cousins fell when he came out was because he turned the ball over in college.
In the NFL he had limited success his rookie in very-limited playing time so that weakness didn't surface but last year when he had to play he turned the ball over Oprah style. "One for you, and one for you, and one for you....'
He's not a prospect that Pettine is looking for.
"To win in this league you have to have a great quarterback and that's something we're going to put our full focus and attention on."--New Browns HC Mike Pettine
If we don't see any QB prospects who project as 'great quarterbacks' then don't press the top pick and if we're going to take a flyer on a guy then I'm in favor of using a mid-round pick or picks but dishing picks for Cousins is basically punting and saying that we don't even want to take a shot to try to catch lightneding in a bottle because a guy who turns it over isn't what we want.
Also I love Greg Robinson. Huge, 6'5 332 lbs who threw up 32 reps on the bench quick out of his stance with super long arms, a dominating pressence and he can move. Needs work on pass-pro but if Pettine moved him inside to OG he has the feet to fit the slide-zone blocking scheme and he'd open up humongeous holes.
If we got him, or Sammy, or Mathews, or Mack, or Clowney, sheesh. I don't think we can go wrong with any of them but don't force the QB unless they are damn certain no matter what anyone says, don't force that.
In the NFL he had limited success his rookie in very-limited playing time so that weakness didn't surface but last year when he had to play he turned the ball over Oprah style. "One for you, and one for you, and one for you....'
He's not a prospect that Pettine is looking for.
"To win in this league you have to have a great quarterback and that's something we're going to put our full focus and attention on."--New Browns HC Mike Pettine
If we don't see any QB prospects who project as 'great quarterbacks' then don't press the top pick and if we're going to take a flyer on a guy then I'm in favor of using a mid-round pick or picks but dishing picks for Cousins is basically punting and saying that we don't even want to take a shot to try to catch lightneding in a bottle because a guy who turns it over isn't what we want.
Also I love Greg Robinson. Huge, 6'5 332 lbs who threw up 32 reps on the bench quick out of his stance with super long arms, a dominating pressence and he can move. Needs work on pass-pro but if Pettine moved him inside to OG he has the feet to fit the slide-zone blocking scheme and he'd open up humongeous holes.
If we got him, or Sammy, or Mathews, or Mack, or Clowney, sheesh. I don't think we can go wrong with any of them but don't force the QB unless they are damn certain no matter what anyone says, don't force that.
RevDawg
Footballguy
Ugh. I don't like this schedule at all. I originally had thought it could be a 9 win season, maybe more. Now I'd be happy if they start 1-3. I'm afraid they're going to be shell-shocked by the time the easier games arrive in the middle of the season. No favors from the league this year.
@ Pit
NO
Bal
BYE
@ Ten
Pit
@ Jax
Oak
TB
@ Cin (Thur)
Hou
@ Atl
@ Buf
Ind
Cin
@ Car
@ Bal
@ Pit
NO
Bal
BYE
@ Ten
Pit
@ Jax
Oak
TB
@ Cin (Thur)
Hou
@ Atl
@ Buf
Ind
Cin
@ Car
@ Bal
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amnesiac
beer is good
Gil Brandt said Maziel's a better version of Fran Tarkenton.
Gil Brandt also said Colt McCoy would make a lot of people forget about Joe Montana.
now people are comparing Manziel to Favre.
i think he's a better version of Charlie Frye.
i keep seeing Manziel going to the Browns in mocks.
no. thanks.
Gil Brandt also said Colt McCoy would make a lot of people forget about Joe Montana.
now people are comparing Manziel to Favre.
i think he's a better version of Charlie Frye.
i keep seeing Manziel going to the Browns in mocks.
no. thanks.
Dr. Octopus
Footballguy
Did you ever once think of Joe Montana while watching Colt McCoy play? So there you go. The man knows his stuff.
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eric rymer
Footballguy
I guess I am feeling a little optimistic this morning but I'm with Soulfly here. I kinda like the schedule. I see a win over Pitt, then a loss to NO and Balt. A bye week followed by an easier stretch that I really believe we can win the next 7 after the bye. I think an optimistic outlook is 10-6. I may just be on the cool aid but those are very winable games IMO. I think 8-8 or 9-7 is a realistic number. But I think the possibility is there for better. Good defense got better and an offense that is definitely better IMO.
Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
They're gonna win all 3 road division games? Someone had a big bowl of happy crack this morning.
Captain Quinoa
Footballguy
BTW that last 6 games is bullspit. 4 on the road and the 2 at home are against playoff teams? Thanks.
SaintsInDome2006
Footballguy
eric rymer
Footballguy
Sheesh I just meant that they would split the series with Balt and Cinci...But thanks for spreading your cheer this morning.
B-Deep
Footballguy
amnesiac
beer is good
meh. looks pretty winnable to me.
does Indy or Cinci really seem that intimidating?
i don't see any real powerhouses on the entire schedule to be honest.
Browns will win if they're good, the schedule doesn't appear to me that it will have much influence one way or the other.
B-Deep
Footballguy
opening at pitt then the saints then at home vs baltimore is rough
if this team goes 0-3 there (not saying they will but certainly possible) people are gonna be jumping off of buildings in this thread
if they are 0-2 that Baltimore game is gonna be intense
if this team goes 0-3 there (not saying they will but certainly possible) people are gonna be jumping off of buildings in this thread
if they are 0-2 that Baltimore game is gonna be intense
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MAC_32
Footballguy
To be the best gotta beat the best.
Pittsburgh is not what it once was, New Orleans is not the same away from home, and Baltimore often struggles here + they aren't as strong as they have been either.
If we lose to all of them that's on us, not them.
I don't look beyond September on the schedule except for obvious powers and obvious doormats. The difference between the rest in the middle isn't all that much. If our coaching is improved and we find the QB we will be a contender. If the coaching blows and we continue to cycle through QB's we will suck.
B-Deep
Footballguy
but Pitt ended the eyar strong last year, it is at home to open the season. There's no way to think that is anything other than tough
the saints are always tough, sure in NO wold be tougher, but that has been a damn good team
and the ravens, hell who knows what they'lll be. No division game is easy though.
could they go 2-1 or 3-1, sure, but you'd feel better if the start was Oak, Jax, TB. All indications this is a tough start for a brand new staff on which the expectations are extremely high (too high imo)
MAC_32
Footballguy
I think starting off against bottom dwellers would be awful. Get a sense of accomplishment beating nobody's then when actually playing someone worth a damn we get curb stomped.
Soulfly3
Footballguy
amnesiac
beer is good
amnesiac
beer is good
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
This is what I see when I look at the Browns schedule:
Week 1: Browns at Pittsburgh Steelers Week 6: Browns vs. Pittsburgh Steelers
Week 1: Browns at Pittsburgh Steelers Week 6: Browns vs. Pittsburgh Steelers
Soulfly3
Footballguy
B-Deep
Footballguy
i don;t think it should matter
this team should be judged not on its start and not on unrealistic expectations but on thei growth and potential
this team at 6-10 could be MILES better than last year's at 4-12. i think last year's 4-12 was heading in the right direction
but you have to wonder given the pumped up expectations of fans AND the owner if that is truly how they will be judged
MAC_32
Footballguy
I have maintained for a while that we are good coaching and a QB away from playoff contention. I don't think those are unrealistic expectations. If we are going to make the playoffs we either have to beat good teams or do what the Bengals routinely do - beat who they are supposed to beat, lose who they are supposed to lose to, then get bounced round 1. Because their QB blows. That doesn't sound like fun.
Random
Footballguy
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
Last year, at this very same time, the core talent on the team consisted of:
- OT Joe Thomas
- C Alex Mack
- CB Joe Haden
- SS T.J. Ward
- NT Phil Taylor
- DL Ahytaba Rubin
TE Jordan Cameron was on the brink of stepping-up and WR Josh Gordon was facing a two-game suspension at the start of the year and he hadn't stepped-up.
This year add in both TE Jordan Cameron and WR Josh Gordon and I think it is safe to also add LB Karlos Dansby and to substitue S Donte Whitner for TJ Ward so basically our core group of solid players had increased by three.
The blind spot we had last year was QB as we were heading into the year with QB Brandon Weeden with backup QB being Jason Cambell, Brian Hoyer was seen as the third QB. Moving on from Weeden and Cambell has to be viewed as addition by subtraction and I think we all are higher on Brian Hoyer and we all know that we will be adding at least one quarterback from the draft. Basically the quarterback situation has not yet worked itself out but their isn't any doubt right now we are better since we aren't going into the year with Brandon Weeden as the starter.
I think we add at least one more solid core player to an already strong core. Its very possible that DE Desmond Bryant and/or DE Billy Wynn or DT John Houston could also step-up. Won't even mention RB Ben Tate or who/what we might add in the draft with the extra high picks.
We have a very strong core.
We don't need to have too many breaks fall our way to make hay. I have no idea how many games we win but we will bloody noses this year.
- OT Joe Thomas
- C Alex Mack
- CB Joe Haden
- SS T.J. Ward
- NT Phil Taylor
- DL Ahytaba Rubin
TE Jordan Cameron was on the brink of stepping-up and WR Josh Gordon was facing a two-game suspension at the start of the year and he hadn't stepped-up.
This year add in both TE Jordan Cameron and WR Josh Gordon and I think it is safe to also add LB Karlos Dansby and to substitue S Donte Whitner for TJ Ward so basically our core group of solid players had increased by three.
The blind spot we had last year was QB as we were heading into the year with QB Brandon Weeden with backup QB being Jason Cambell, Brian Hoyer was seen as the third QB. Moving on from Weeden and Cambell has to be viewed as addition by subtraction and I think we all are higher on Brian Hoyer and we all know that we will be adding at least one quarterback from the draft. Basically the quarterback situation has not yet worked itself out but their isn't any doubt right now we are better since we aren't going into the year with Brandon Weeden as the starter.
I think we add at least one more solid core player to an already strong core. Its very possible that DE Desmond Bryant and/or DE Billy Wynn or DT John Houston could also step-up. Won't even mention RB Ben Tate or who/what we might add in the draft with the extra high picks.
We have a very strong core.
We don't need to have too many breaks fall our way to make hay. I have no idea how many games we win but we will bloody noses this year.
