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Cleveland Browns (2 Viewers)

A 2014 2nd sounds like reasonable value for Mallett if they really like him.
I would agree on that being reasonable value to give up. Unfortunately, Pats could probably get a 2014 2nd for a 2013 3rd and reports are that they would not be willing to part with him for a 3rd at this point.There is also some adverse selection going on here. Given how old Brady is, if the Pats thought Mallett could be a solid starter they would hold on to him, no? And would probably only trade him if they didn't think he was the successor.
He no longer has a shot at being Brady's successor - the Pats went all-in by guaranteeing Brady's contract. It makes sense for them to get a 2nd for Mallett and draft a QB in the late rounds to develop.
The question is why. If he is no good, then why do we want him? If he is good why do the Patriots want to get rid of him? You cite Brady's contract, but let's look at his age and salary for each year:
2013 36 $1mm Base 2014 37 $2mm Base 2015 38 $7mm Base guaranteed if on roster at end of 20142016 39 $8mm Base guaranteed if on roster at end of 20142017 40 $9mm Base guaranteed if on roster at end of 2014Adding in $6mm per year for the signing bonus, 2015-2017 cap hits are $13mm, $14mm and $15mm. If I am the Patriots and I think that Mallett has a chance of being good to great in this league, surely I can find cap room for him when our starting QB maxes out at $15mm per. Take the contract the Chiefs gave Chase Daniel ($10mm for 3 yrs) and add a nice bump, lock him up a year early so you don't have to compete and throw $5mm a year at him.

That assumes that Brady is going to be healthy and able over that timeframe. Mallett would sure be nice insurance for another Pollard scenario. The greater concern is how much Brady has left though? In 2015 he will be 38 to start the season, I think 4,000 passing yds is kind of a need in the Patriots current system. Here is the list of QBs that have thrown for 4,000 yds at age 38 or older according to profootballreference:

Warren Moon x2

Brett Favre x2

I am sure there are good arguments for why he could be different and join this group, but he is quickly coming upon the end of his career.

 
A 2014 2nd sounds like reasonable value for Mallett if they really like him.
I would agree on that being reasonable value to give up. Unfortunately, Pats could probably get a 2014 2nd for a 2013 3rd and reports are that they would not be willing to part with him for a 3rd at this point.There is also some adverse selection going on here. Given how old Brady is, if the Pats thought Mallett could be a solid starter they would hold on to him, no? And would probably only trade him if they didn't think he was the successor.
He no longer has a shot at being Brady's successor - the Pats went all-in by guaranteeing Brady's contract. It makes sense for them to get a 2nd for Mallett and draft a QB in the late rounds to develop.
The question is why. If he is no good, then why do we want him? If he is good why do the Patriots want to get rid of him? You cite Brady's contract, but let's look at his age and salary for each year:2013 36 $1mm Base 2014 37 $2mm Base 2015 38 $7mm Base guaranteed if on roster at end of 20142016 39 $8mm Base guaranteed if on roster at end of 20142017 40 $9mm Base guaranteed if on roster at end of 2014Adding in $6mm per year for the signing bonus, 2015-2017 cap hits are $13mm, $14mm and $15mm.If I am the Patriots and I think that Mallett has a chance of being good to great in this league, surely I can find cap room for him when our starting QB maxes out at $15mm per. Take the contract the Chiefs gave Chase Daniel ($10mm for 3 yrs) and add a nice bump, lock him up a year early so you don't have to compete and throw $5mm a year at him.That assumes that Brady is going to be healthy and able over that timeframe. Mallett would sure be nice insurance for another Pollard scenario. The greater concern is how much Brady has left though? In 2015 he will be 38 to start the season, I think 4,000 passing yds is kind of a need in the Patriots current system. Here is the list of QBs that have thrown for 4,000 yds at age 38 or older according to profootballreference:Warren Moon x2Brett Favre x2I am sure there are good arguments for why he could be different and join this group, but he is quickly coming upon the end of his career.
In 2015 they would have $18M in dead money if they cut/traded him while his salary is only $7M - that means he's almost certainly going to be on the team. In 2016 they'd still have $12M in dead money with a salary of $8M - a little closer here but still not worth getting rid of him. Everyone has been posting that the Patriots ripped off Brady but in fact they took big risk on him in exchange for never having to worry about negotiating with him again. They must believe he has at least 3 elite years left to make the deal.

I think it's doubtful that Mallett is going to sign any contract in NE that isn't for starter money. The worst case for him is that he holds the clipboard for 2 more years and is highly sought after as a free agent. If Matt Flynn was so highly prized, imagine what a guy who actually had 1st round talent when he was drafted is going to get.

 
amnesiac said:
The Man With No Name said:
Colt McCoy about to be traded to San Francisco. Done deal. McCoy and a 2013 6th for a 2013 5th and 2013 7th
that's a ####ty deal.but you gotta take what you can get i guess.
I thought the same thing, but it sounds like the Browns were considering releasing him and were lucky to get anything for him. I think it's win-win. Colt didn't have a future with the Browns, and at least they got something for him.

 
amnesiac said:
The Man With No Name said:
Colt McCoy about to be traded to San Francisco. Done deal. McCoy and a 2013 6th for a 2013 5th and 2013 7th
that's a ####ty deal.but you gotta take what you can get i guess.
I thought the same thing, but it sounds like the Browns were considering releasing him and were lucky to get anything for him. I think it's win-win. Colt didn't have a future with the Browns, and at least they got something for him.
Turns out to be more than Oak got for Carson Palmer.

 
Former Buffalo Bills wide receiver David Nelson is scheduled to visit the Browns on Thursday, Tim Graham of the Buffalo News reported today, and West Virginia University wide receiver Tavon Austin is set to visit Cleveland next week, NFL Network’s Ian Rapoport reported this afternoon.

Nelson, 26, was eligible to become a restricted free agent this offseason. But the Bills decided not to offer him a tender, and he became an unrestricted free agent as a result.
http://www.ohio.com/blogs/cleveland-browns/cleveland-browns-1.270107/reports-former-bills-wr-david-nelson-west-virginia-wr-tavon-austin-to-visit-browns-1.386360

 
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Josh Cribbs

Phil Dawson

Mohamed Massaquoi

Sheldon Brown

Scott Fujita

Kaluka Maiava

Juqua Parker

Frostee Rucker

Usama Young

Reggie Hodges

Chances that these guys are gone: 100%

Obviously, Pat is at the top of that list as well.
Guess I should have added Colt and Gocong to the list as well...

 
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If Matt Flynn was so highly prized, imagine what a guy who actually had 1st round talent when he was drafted is going to get.
I thought you were talking about Mallet?
I wonder if some of you have ever watched him play.
Did the NFL teams that passed on him a combined 73 times watch him play? (Note: the first round is a total of 32 picks)
I think I am probably in the middle on this one. There can be a difference between first round talent and being taken in the first round. Mallett was probably close to a 1st round talent but character issues probably contributed to the drop. Most of us are not privy to the exact grade that teams had on him. Also, it is theoretically possible that every team had a first rd grade on him but he didn't go until the 3rd because different teams had different players higher and they were each available when they picked. Not likely at all, but possible - which just proves you can't say no one thought he was a 1st rd talent or value.

That said, if Mallett doesn't have get any playing time n NE, I doubt his contract will be significantly higher than Flynn's after adjusting for general cap inflation. I think if you wanted to lock him up a year early you could get him for right around Flynn's deal.

 
If Matt Flynn was so highly prized, imagine what a guy who actually had 1st round talent when he was drafted is going to get.
I thought you were talking about Mallet?
I wonder if some of you have ever watched him play.
I watched my buckeyes destroy him in the last college game that he played (and the last game that he started). Didn't like him then, don't like him now.

 
If Matt Flynn was so highly prized, imagine what a guy who actually had 1st round talent when he was drafted is going to get.
I thought you were talking about Mallet?
I wonder if some of you have ever watched him play.
I watched my buckeyes destroy him in the last college game that he played (and the last game that he started). Didn't like him then, don't like him now.
Destroy? Ohio St. won by 5 points and would have lost if Joe Adams could catch the football - 2 dropped TD's and another near the goal line. I saw at least 3 other drops by his WR's in that game.
 
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Yes, destroy. If tressel wasn't so damn conservative in the 2nd half like he always was, it would not have even been a game. I like Tress for what he did for our program in all the BCS championship games he took us to, but be was always easing up on teams in the 2nd half and letting them back in games.

I am glad we have Urban and his take no prisoners attitude now...we are up 20 at half? Cool, let's hang another 30 on em.

 
If Matt Flynn was so highly prized, imagine what a guy who actually had 1st round talent when he was drafted is going to get.
I thought you were talking about Mallet?
I wonder if some of you have ever watched him play.
I watched my buckeyes destroy him in the last college game that he played (and the last game that he started). Didn't like him then, don't like him now.
Destroy? Ohio St. won by 5 points and would have lost if Joe Adams could catch the football - 2 dropped TD's and another near the goal line. I saw at least 3 other drops by his WR's in that game.
Mallet was not good in that game. Special teams gave the Razorbacks a chance, but Mallet threw it away.

 
Just about every mock draft I see has the Browns taking Dee Milliner if he's there. What's the next best move if Milliner isn't available at pick #6?

Trade down?

Xavier Rhodes?

Dion Jordan, if he's there?

Chance Warmack?

Geno Smith?

Tavon Austin?

 
Just about every mock draft I see has the Browns taking Dee Milliner if he's there. What's the next best move if Milliner isn't available at pick #6?

Trade down?

Xavier Rhodes?

Dion Jordan, if he's there?

Chance Warmack?

Geno Smith?

Tavon Austin?
Trade down best option

Then Jordan or Ansah

Too high for Rhodes

I would be ok with Warmack but I would be surprised if they did

Absolutely not on the last 2.

 
Just about every mock draft I see has the Browns taking Dee Milliner if he's there. What's the next best move if Milliner isn't available at pick #6?

Trade down?

Xavier Rhodes?

Dion Jordan, if he's there?

Chance Warmack?

Geno Smith?

Tavon Austin?
If it were me

Geno

Trade down (depending on compensation)

Jordan

Millner

If I had to guess what the Browns are thinking

Trade down (good compensation)

Millner

Jordan

Ziggy

Trade down (less compensation)

 
Fallerjw said:
Just about every mock draft I see has the Browns taking Dee Milliner if he's there. What's the next best move if Milliner isn't available at pick #6?

Trade down?

Xavier Rhodes?

Dion Jordan, if he's there?

Chance Warmack?

Geno Smith?

Tavon Austin?
Assuming he checks out medically, I think Jarvis Jones needs to be in this discussion. I would prefer Jones to Jordan - Jordan is strictly a speed guy in my mind.

 
Fallerjw said:
Just about every mock draft I see has the Browns taking Dee Milliner if he's there. What's the next best move if Milliner isn't available at pick #6?

Trade down?

Xavier Rhodes?

Dion Jordan, if he's there?

Chance Warmack?

Geno Smith?

Tavon Austin?
Assuming he checks out medically, I think Jarvis Jones needs to be in this discussion. I would prefer Jones to Jordan - Jordan is strictly a speed guy in my mind.
I won't be upset if we pick Jarvis, but I couldn't disagree more with your speed only eval of Jordan.

 
daveR said:
"Hey, David..."

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/04/cleveland_browns_signing_forme.html#incart_river

"Nelson has dropped just six of the first 141 passes thrown his way"

what do you guys think about him? assuming the knee has healed?
IMO, just another Average Joe filling the hole created when they cut Average Mo.
Nelson may be average, but Mo is nowhere near average. Definite upgrade.
Disagree. I think people still lump Mo and Robiske together. Mo was way better.

 
daveR said:
"Hey, David..."

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/04/cleveland_browns_signing_forme.html#incart_river

"Nelson has dropped just six of the first 141 passes thrown his way"

what do you guys think about him? assuming the knee has healed?
IMO, just another Average Joe filling the hole created when they cut Average Mo.
Nelson may be average, but Mo is nowhere near average. Definite upgrade.
Disagree. I think people still lump Mo and Robiske together. Mo was way better.
"Way better than Robo" is still nowhere near average. Nelson is an upgrade. Not to mention missing half the games.
 
I don't like it. I felt we were pretty good at RB already with Trent, Hardesty, Brandon Jackson, and Ob-gyn. OLB was a position we were already short handed at, and this trade makes us even weaker there. Sam Acho has turned into a fairly decent player over in ARI, and I was hoping Horton could replicate that success with his younger brother. Now we will not get the chance to see.

I did like Dion Lewis coming out of Pitt, so maybe he can surprise me.

 
"Hey, David..."

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/04/cleveland_browns_signing_forme.html#incart_river

"Nelson has dropped just six of the first 141 passes thrown his way"

what do you guys think about him? assuming the knee has healed?
IMO, just another Average Joe filling the hole created when they cut Average Mo.
Nelson may be average, but Mo is nowhere near average. Definite upgrade.
Disagree. I think people still lump Mo and Robiske together. Mo was way better.
"Way better than Robo" is still nowhere near average. Nelson is an upgrade. Not to mention missing half the games.
Ding ding ding, Massaquoi was adequate when he was on the field, but he was rarely on it. Mediocre, unreliable players are end of the bench types. I think Nelson is a little bit better than that.

 
"Hey, David..."

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/04/cleveland_browns_signing_forme.html#incart_river

"Nelson has dropped just six of the first 141 passes thrown his way"

what do you guys think about him? assuming the knee has healed?
IMO, just another Average Joe filling the hole created when they cut Average Mo.
Nelson may be average, but Mo is nowhere near average. Definite upgrade.
Disagree. I think people still lump Mo and Robiske together. Mo was way better.
"Way better than Robo" is still nowhere near average. Nelson is an upgrade. Not to mention missing half the games.
Ding ding ding, Massaquoi was adequate when he was on the field, but he was rarely on it. Mediocre, unreliable players are end of the bench types. I think Nelson is a little bit better than that.
Thought Nelson was injured, no?

 
"Hey, David..."

http://www.cleveland.com/browns/index.ssf/2013/04/cleveland_browns_signing_forme.html#incart_river

"Nelson has dropped just six of the first 141 passes thrown his way"

what do you guys think about him? assuming the knee has healed?
IMO, just another Average Joe filling the hole created when they cut Average Mo.
Nelson may be average, but Mo is nowhere near average. Definite upgrade.
Disagree. I think people still lump Mo and Robiske together. Mo was way better.
"Way better than Robo" is still nowhere near average. Nelson is an upgrade. Not to mention missing half the games.
Ding ding ding, Massaquoi was adequate when he was on the field, but he was rarely on it. Mediocre, unreliable players are end of the bench types. I think Nelson is a little bit better than that.
Thought Nelson was injured, no?
Momo was never really a big factor for the team...Nelson never has been a huge factor in his career. So I like it, but I like 6'5" wr's.
 
I don't like it. I felt we were pretty good at RB already with Trent, Hardesty, Brandon Jackson, and Ob-gyn. OLB was a position we were already short handed at, and this trade makes us even weaker there. Sam Acho has turned into a fairly decent player over in ARI, and I was hoping Horton could replicate that success with his younger brother. Now we will not get the chance to see.

I did like Dion Lewis coming out of Pitt, so maybe he can surprise me.
 

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