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WR Laquon Treadwell, SEA (1 Viewer)

Well, I think that means he's closer to being a Texan at 22 than a Giant at 10.
Id think the narrative of them taking a field stretching wr is accurate or at least it would make more sense. So if thats the case, Hou specifically prolly doesnt grab him. But there are teams in that range that may. IMO

 
Think this pretty much cements Zeke at 1.01 and makes the second tier of Treadwell/Coleman/Doctson even more fluid. Landing spot is going to be huge. I have the 1.02 in one league and could see myself taking any of those three come draft day.

 
Keenen Allen was considered by many to be the best WR in his draft class. He was hurt and did not run the 40 till his pro day. He ran a 4.71. He fell in the draft to the 3rd round even though many considred him a 1st round pick. If you can play football you can play football. 

 
Think this pretty much cements Zeke at 1.01 and makes the second tier of Treadwell/Coleman/Doctson even more fluid. Landing spot is going to be huge. I have the 1.02 in one league and could see myself taking any of those three come draft day.
I agree and based on mock drafts and team needs I'm not overly encouraged for these 3.  I consider the Vikings, Rams, Texans and Bengals as teams most likely to take a WR and while I'm sure opinions will differ I don't view any of them as overly attractive.

What I think is going to happen in a lot of drafts is teams sitting in the 6 or 7 hole are going have shots at one of these 3 with 1-2 RB's other than Elliot getting pushed ahead of them, and possibly Henry in TE premium leagues.

 
No doubt.  The issue is,  is he still putting up those numbers when Parker develops?  Or any other WR on the team. 
No I don't see him being a top 10 WR but top 20 yes so he would be a high end WR2 that could end up a WR1 at the end of the year. He is probably one of the most consistent fantasy Wrs right now and i don't see Parker hurting that much, it would more be Parker who ends up either having a really good game or just  having maybe a catch or two. 

 
Giants beat writer Jordan Raanan writes Ole Miss WR Laquon Treadwell is "not going to be their selection at No. 10."
The reasoning? Treadwell does not have the talent to be a No. 1 receiver, and he'll never be the top option for the Giants. The team is bringing Treadwell in for a visit, but obviously Raanan doubts a marriage is down the road. We don't cover the team like Raanan, but we think the pick makes sense. The Giants are in dire need of a secondary option in the passing game. Treadwell is the kind of possession receiver teams covet and his skills compliment Odell Beckham's very well.

 
 
Source: NJ.com 
Mar 28 - 11:20 AM

 
 


Ole Miss WR Laquon Treadwell ran the 40-yard dash in unofficial times of 4.65 and 4.63 seconds during Monday's Pro Day.
A time under 4.60 would have earned Treadwell a ton of positive buzz. As is, 4.63-ish isn't a death knell to his draft chances. NFL Media's Daniel Jeremiah summed the proceedings up nicely on the NFL Network, saying, "To me, he put it in the fairway." Jeremiah went on to speculate that Treadwell will become a legitimate draft option after the Giants at No. 10. He'll have meetings or workouts with the Vikings, Browns, Bears, Bengals and Cowboys (among likely others) in the coming weeks.

 
 
Source: NFL.com 
Mar 28 - 12:49 PM




 


 
Why does he have to be a #1 to be considered by the Giants?

They've already got a guy that's pretty good on their roster, right?

 
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Why does he have to be a #1 to be considered by the Giants?

They've already got a guy that's pretty good on their roster, right?
I think the wording there is screwy.  

I think it's more about spending a top 10 pick on a WR2.  Golden Tate, Eric Decker, Marvin Jones.....these guys aren't worth a top 10 pick.  

 
Why are these analysts using certain players combine times and comparing them to Treadwell's pro day time.  I've seen Allen Robinson and DeAndre Hopkins combine times compared to Treadwell's Pro-Day time to make excuses for how slow he was.

Hopkins was timed at 4.41 and A-Rob 4.47 at their pro days.   Huge difference between Treadwell and Hopkins/Robinson pro-day times.

 
Some chatter over in Chiefs land about KC taking him if he falls. I'm sure the fantasy community would love that.

 
I hate to say he's on my do not draft list...  but it's doubtful I'll own him anywhere next year.

 
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Why are these analysts using certain players combine times and comparing them to Treadwell's pro day time.  I've seen Allen Robinson and DeAndre Hopkins combine times compared to Treadwell's Pro-Day time to make excuses for how slow he was.

Hopkins was timed at 4.41 and A-Rob 4.47 at their pro days.   Huge difference between Treadwell and Hopkins/Robinson pro-day times.
https://twitter.com/PFF_Mike/status/714541647305031680

List of WRs with 40 times over 4.6.  It's not great.  

 
He's going to have to bust his ### in the NFL if he's going to warrant a top 20 pick.

This year's draft class at WR is full of the same guys. The ones that do the best will be the ones with the best work ethic. My $ is on Sterling Sheperd.

 
Detroit Lions' homies desperate for a Megatron replacement need to cool the jets.   Charles Rogers, Mike Williams. Titus Young are the legacy when reaching for the stars.  Stay far away !  Megatron weighed 235 lbs. at his combine, and ran a 4.35!   He will probably never be replaced, but certainly not this year.

 
Why are these analysts using certain players combine times and comparing them to Treadwell's pro day time.  I've seen Allen Robinson and DeAndre Hopkins combine times compared to Treadwell's Pro-Day time to make excuses for how slow he was.

Hopkins was timed at 4.41 and A-Rob 4.47 at their pro days.   Huge difference between Treadwell and Hopkins/Robinson pro-day times.
NFL draft scout lists Hopkins low time as 4.41 but lists his pro day same as combine which was around 4.57 and that's probably more accurate, for me anyway.

But the way I see it I could care less about Treadwell running a slow 40. What I do care about is running slow 40 with weak jumps and average  to below average 3 cone and shuttle times. Basically the stuff that measures speed, explosiveness, quickness and acceleration. Also stuff that guys like Hopkins and Robinson outperformed him on in every drill. I get down on a guy when he's weak across the board, like to have something to hang my hat on athletically.

I saw CBS Sports write a thing today trying to his say his slow 40 time was not a big deal and then threw out guys like Amendola,Landry and Sanu.  Those guys are all primarily slot guys and two are of them are average so not sure those comps made the best argument.

I thought to myself maybe Dewayne Bowe was a solid comp but Bowe was faster with a better 3 cone but in terms of size/speed/workout numbers he's pretty close and that's not giving me warm feelings inside.

All that being said I have to admit that Treadwell looks great to me on film. Classic case of a player  that film guys will love and metrics guys will hate.

 
Treadwell

6'2"

221 lbs

4.63 40

33.5 Inch vertical

117 inch broad jump

4.29 shuttle

7.05 3 cone 

Boldin

6' .5"

216 lbs

4.71 40

33.5 inch vertical

114 inch broad jump

4.33 shuttle

7.35 3 cone 

Boldin had 7 1000 yard seasons including a 101 catch,  1377 yard,  8 td rookie season and over 1000 career catches for 13000 yards and 74 tds. 

Is tresdwell automatically the same as Boldin?  Of course not.   Did Treadwell change as a prospect when he ran a 40 yard dash twice?  Nope.  He's the guy you've seen on film who won't be able to legally have a beer with the guys after minicamps.  

Here's the part that bothers me.   He's got bad running form.  Everyone said he had bad running form.  Everyone told him how important the 40 was.   Does he work hard enough to be a professional?   Does he take coaching well?  Why does he still swing his arms like that?  That's the stuff that worries me.  I would want a veteran presence at qb and wr for him.  Not a Cleveland.   Not a Houston.   That's going to make or break his career.

 
TFY Draft Insider's Tony Pauline relays that Ole Miss WR Laquon Treadwell "looked good in position drills" during Monday's Pro Day "[e]xcept for a few uncharacteristic drops."
"He looked smooth while running routes and caught the ball well," Pauline wrote of Treadwell's day. NFL Media senior analyst Gil Brandt went so far as to call it "outstanding." While all 32 NFL clubs were represented during the Rebel Pro Day, a few came out with the clear intention of focusing on the 6-foot-2, 221-pound wideout. Among those, Pauline reports, were the WR coaches of the Chargers and Cardinals, Lions OC Jim Bob Cooter and "the top brass" from the Los Angeles Rams. The analyst reports that Treadwell met with the Chargers following his workout. He ran unofficial 40-yard dash times of 4.63 and 4.65 seconds, but the teams that love him shouldn't fall out of love simply because his already-known lack of speed reared its head Monday.

 
 
Source: Walter Football 
Mar 28 - 8:00 PM

 
The GOAT ran a 4.71 40
And Bo Jackson ran a 4.12.  Have always thought 4.71 was a bunch of hooey, but the only thing I've ever found was this, from 49ers.com...

Rice, for the record, ran the dash in 4.59 seconds, according to the late Bill Walsh. (Rice bristled at the thought of recording something above 4.6 seconds 
ETA:  actually just Googled this specifically and found the article where Walsh says 4.59.

Jerry Rice timed in 4.59 and was considered to have marginal speed for a starting NFL wide receiver by virtually everyone in the NFL.

...

When you look at the 40s of 15 or 20 years ago, the times are slow. A big part was they were not on an ideal surface. They just ran if anybody asked them, on any length of grass or any form of field. They had not practiced the start. They would get into their football stance and start. And they had not rehearsed this as if they were preparing to run indoor sprints.

 
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I keep seeing "unofficial" in front of his times. Seems like at this point we should have the official numbers. 

 
I keep seeing "unofficial" in front of his times. Seems like at this point we should have the official numbers. 
I don't think there is an automated clock stopping mechanism at pro days like there is at the combine, so his times will always be "unofficial".

There is such a device at the combine, right?  ...or did I just dream that.  Lol.

 
I don't think there is an automated clock stopping mechanism at pro days like there is at the combine, so his times will always be "unofficial".

There is such a device at the combine, right?  ...or did I just dream that.  Lol.
They got #######g clocks with freaking laser beams! Hahaha.

Thanks. For the clearly that up. You'd think that these schools would pony up for the one purchase of a laser timer.

 
I expected him to be slow but honestly, 4.65 is pathetic for a pro day.  If any other WR ran that he'd instantly be the 5th WR at best in the draft class.  That goes to show you how bad everyone else is.  I now have Doctson at an easy #1 with Treadwell behind at #2 for WR's.  Yes Treadwell looks good with jumping and at least looks decent catching but if he already has trouble separating from DB's, and is slow, on top of average 3 cones and shuttles then he's going to struggle in the NFL.  He isn't a #1 WR, but he can be for a couple years while a team finds a true #1.  More Eric Decker than DT.  Easiest example I can think of right now.  Boldin is another one that someone brought up as a athletic comp and I can get on board with that too.  Can make good plays but isn't a true #1.

 
@BuckyBrooks 


Catching the ball when it passes your eyes (over the shoulder) is the hardest catch for most receivers twitter.com/nfl/status/714…


9:50am - 29 Mar 16
 
@BuckyBrooks 

(Cont.) It's tough because you aren't able to watch the ball all of the way into your hands. twitter.com/nfl/status/714…


9:51am - 29 Mar 16
 
@BuckyBrooks 


(Cont.) Requires a pass catcher to anticipate where the ball will arrive. Exposes tracking skills & hand-eye coord. twitter.com/nfl/status/714…


9:52am - 29 Mar 16
 
 

 
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My splits for Laquon Treadwell's 40 yard dash:

10-yard: 1.70

20-yard: 2.73

40-yard: 4.67

Would you believe me if I told you Treadwell is faster running a route than he does the 40 yard dash?

Treadwell ran a 15-yard Out route where he covered the first 10 yards in 1.60 seconds.

He had horrible form on his 40. Too upright. On his route, he had a much more natural forward lean. Just looks relaxed. "Game Speed" In the last 20 yards Treadwell covered the distance in 1.93 seconds. Treadwell also covered the first 20 yards after the finish, when he "slowed down", in 1.93 seconds. How is this possible? What does it mean?


 



 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 


 
 
Zyphros said:
Yes Treadwell looks good with jumping and at least looks decent catching but if he already has trouble separating from DB's,
Sounds like Kevin White.

 
Sounds like Kevin White.
So glad you didn't quote the rest of me saying that Treadwell is also slow very much UNLIKE Kevin White.  I didn't watch Treadwell's 40 or pro day but I'll admit he does look good catching the ball.  Maybe what you say about him running faster routes is true and he could very well prove the people that view him as slow wrong, but him putting up a horrendous 40 time at an event that is suppose to be tailor made to make him look good, has my eyes wide open to anything he does poorly.  

My tie breaker before Treadwells pro day was the age when I had him ahead of Doctson, now since he proved to be not as good of an athlete as Doctson then Doctson takes the lead. 

 
So glad you didn't quote the rest of me saying that Treadwell is also slow very much UNLIKE Kevin White.  I didn't watch Treadwell's 40 or pro day but I'll admit he does look good catching the ball.  Maybe what you say about him running faster routes is true and he could very well prove the people that view him as slow wrong, but him putting up a horrendous 40 time at an event that is suppose to be tailor made to make him look good, has my eyes wide open to anything he does poorly.  

My tie breaker before Treadwells pro day was the age when I had him ahead of Doctson, now since he proved to be not as good of an athlete as Doctson then Doctson takes the lead. 
Maybe what I say is true?  It's not a maybe.  It's a definite.  It's on video.  Those who don't like Treadwell will use the 40 for confirmation bias, while ignoring the thing that actually matters: what he does on the field.  You don't get points for a fast 40 time.

What good does a player like Kevin White running a faster 40 mean if he doesn't run that fast on the field?  Treadwell is faster while playing actual football showcasing any semblence of wide receiver technique, while a player like White is faster when all he has to think about is running fast in a straight line.

 
Maybe what I say is true?  It's not a maybe.  It's a definite.  It's on video.  Those who don't like Treadwell will use the 40 for confirmation bias, while ignoring the thing that actually matters: what he does on the field.  You don't get points for a fast 40 time.

What good does a player like Kevin White running a faster 40 mean if he doesn't run that fast on the field?  Treadwell is faster while playing actual football showcasing any semblence of wide receiver technique, while a player like White is faster when all he has to think about is running fast in a straight line.
How is it definite?  Who are you comparing to?  What is classified as a good time for those splits?  It's on video that he plays football, the rest is conjecture and opinion based on what we see when we watch him.  You have yet to prove that "it's definite" that he runs great routes and is truly fast doing so.  

Both from me watching him play, and from what I've read, the only mention's are that he's a "good" route runner.  It just seems to be there's a lot of things to be desired when it comes to Treadwell.

 
Some questions i have about him at the next level.  

Is he capable of beating a jam?  Can he run routes? Can he catch a ball that's not exactly on target? 

https://usatthebiglead.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/laquan-treadwell-one-hand-catch.gif?w=1000

If he can't use his speed to get free, can he make tough,  contested catches? 

https://cdn1.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/I8x-oUu2io6SS3SPfvI0EXLiT5E=/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/4217027/twe.0.gif

https://www.profootballfocus.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/Treadwell.gif

If he can't get deep,  can he run after the catch? 

https://media.giphy.com/media/PdSsHGIzJBKgw/giphy.gif

Is he physical?  Can he block in the running game? 

https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/FB99VnQpKGLPv5HAuPMFB8jo0bI=/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/4195065/treadwell.0.gif

I know these are all highlights,  but he's got some pretty nice highlights, especially for a kid who will be drinking sparkling grape juice when he gets taken in the draft. 

 
BostonFred, I will watch those highlights every time. I'm not sure if I want to use only those for an evaluation but really enjoy them.

 
There have been some successful NFL receivers who had workout numbers similar to Treadwell's. I calculated similarity scores based on Treadwell's 40 time, vertical, and broad jump. These 15 guys all had numbers in a similar ballpark to Treadwell, and have had some receiving success in the NFL (sorted from most similar to least similar):

Code:
Name			40	Vert	Broad
Laquon Treadwell	4.67	33	117
Fred Davis		4.68	33	116
Michael Clayton		4.67	32.5	116
Martellus Bennett	4.68	34	118
Charles Clay		4.73	33.5	118
Kelvin Benjamin		4.61	32.5	117
Owen Daniels		4.65	34.5	114
Jermaine Gresham	4.66	35	113
Gary Barnidge		4.61	31	117
Plaxico Burress		4.59	33	115
Dennis Pitta		4.68	34	113
Mario Manningham	4.59	32	117
Aaron Hernandez		4.64	33	113
Willie Snead		4.62	33.5	112
Anquan Boldin		4.72	33.5	114
Julius Thomas		4.64	35.5	111
Treadwell does have a different body type than most of these guys - only Clayton & Boldin are similar there too (within 2" of height and 15 lb. of weight).

 
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There have been some successful NFL receivers who had workout numbers similar to Treadwell's. I calculated similarity scores based on Treadwell's 40 time, vertical, and broad jump. These 15 guys all had numbers in a similar ballpark to Treadwell, and have had some receiving success in the NFL (sorted from most similar to least similar):

Code:
Name			40	Vert	Broad
Laquon Treadwell	4.67	33	117
Fred Davis		4.68	33	116
Michael Clayton		4.67	32.5	116
Martellus Bennett	4.68	34	118
Charles Clay		4.73	33.5	118
Kelvin Benjamin		4.61	32.5	117
Owen Daniels		4.65	34.5	114
Jermaine Gresham	4.66	35	113
Gary Barnidge		4.61	31	117
Plaxico Burress		4.59	33	115
Dennis Pitta		4.68	34	113
Mario Manningham	4.59	32	117
Aaron Hernandez		4.64	33	113
Willie Snead		4.62	33.5	112
Anquan Boldin		4.72	33.5	114
Julius Thomas		4.64	35.5	111
Treadwell does have a different body type than most of these guys - only Clayton & Boldin are similar there too (within 2" of height and 15 lb. of weight).
Half these guys are TEs though. Isn't that a tad concerning?

 
Half these guys are TEs though. Isn't that a tad concerning?
And the WRs in that group are different sizes.  Plax was freaky tall, and Benjamin and Boldin are thicker.  

Pretty sure I like the player, hate the draft spot people are talking about.  Treadwell as a top 20 pick, I dunno.  

 

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