Dr. Octopus

2017 New York Jets: Can They Ever Recover From Being Spurned By Jay Cutler?

309 posts in this topic

4 hours ago, Sweet Love said:

I think Glennon is the pick here.  We need help in so many spots (OL, TE, LB, CB).  If Revis moves to Safety, we should be fine there along with DL (though we could use a Tackle) and the OL could use an entire overhaul, along with LB help.  Reality is, we just have too many holes to spend another pick in this draft on a QB.  Fournette would be a huge grab, and as much as I would love hi, he is the wrong pick.  We just don't have the line to support him, and when we finally get it, he will likely be 3 years in.  I literally do not want to see us use a pick on WR, as we have a ton of depth.  Not sure how the value stacks up, but I think they need to go CB/OL with the first three picks.

 

In regards to Glennon, many people do not realize this, but Russell Wislon was pushed out of NC State because Glennon was waiting in the wings.  While he did not make anyone forget about Wison, he did not flop either.  He makes good decisions, is tall and isn't a head case (basically, the anti-Cutler).  The Jets played decent ball when Pennington was taking care of the ball, and after Sanchez, Fit and Geno, I think we need to return to that kind of QB play.

I wouldn't be terribly upset if they signed Glennon, but with the reports saying he could see $16-17MM a year offers, I'd rather them not take the risk. He looked decent as a rookie but not anything special. Frankly I'd rather let Petty and Hack (and maybe a lower level free agent) battle it out all season and address the position in next year's draft if they fail (and let's face it, they likely will). They should be drafting in the top 5 again next season once again and it's supposedly a much better QB class.

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6 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

I wouldn't be terribly upset if they signed Glennon, but with the reports saying he could see $16-17MM a year offers, I'd rather them not take the risk. He looked decent as a rookie but not anything special. Frankly I'd rather let Petty and Hack (and maybe a lower level free agent) battle it out all season and address the position in next year's draft if they fail (and let's face it, they likely will). They should be drafting in the top 5 again next season once again and it's supposedly a much better QB class.

agreed - I have a bad feeling Glennon is going to get a way over market deal....I don't think I'd go higher than $10M yr.  If it goes that high grab a stop gap like McNown and just let the kids duke it out....gives them a yr to develop and likely lands them another top 10 pick to go after a franchise QB nxt yr if they dont pan out.  

Agree with all the cuts posted earlier (though not sure how a reporter can use 60%, 80% etc) - only one that would hurt is Mangold - I'd like to see him take a big pay cut but stick around 1 more yr to mentor the OL.  Rest can go....

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Just now, Kiddnets said:

agreed - I have a bad feeling Glennon is going to get a way over market deal....I don't think I'd go higher than $10M yr.  If it goes that high grab a stop gap like McNown and just let the kids duke it out....gives them a yr to develop and likely lands them another top 10 pick to go after a franchise QB nxt yr if they dont pan out.  

Agree with all the cuts posted earlier (though not sure how a reporter can use 60%, 80% etc) - only one that would hurt is Mangold - I'd like to see him take a big pay cut but stick around 1 more yr to mentor the OL.  Rest can go....

Yeah Glennon isn't likely a franchise QB either so I think it would just set the team back further if they pay him like one. It just isn't worth the risk. I like the idea of McCown as he'd be like another coach out there and would be competent if Petty and Hack are just embarrassingly over-matched to the point where they need to be taken out of a game.

I'd like for Mangold to stay selfishly, but honestly he should likely move on somewhere where he can win some games. Wesly Johnson was decent in his place last year at least so they can use him unless a better option emerges. 

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Glennon is tall...tall like Dork Asswelder. Does he have a brutally slow release too? I cant say I've actually ever watched him play.

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Darrelle Revis has been charged with four felonies for his role in a weekend fight in Pittsburgh.

That includes two counts of aggravated assault. Revis is accused of knocking two men unconscious. It's a serious matter, likely not the kind that will disappear. It's also an ill-timed off-field issue for a 31-year-old corner coming off a lousy year. Revis is guaranteed $6 million for 2017, but this greatly increases the chances he gets cut loose, which would create $9.3 million in cap space for the Jets.

 

 
Should make the decision to release him a little easier.

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CBS Sports' Jason La Canfora continues to report the Jets have "some interest" in Jay Cutler if/when he's released by the Bears.

"They believe he can play in the elements that are a reality in the AFC East, and they like his moxie and arm talent," writes La Canfora. "And that was well before the Jets hired Jeremy Bates as their quarterback coach." Bates and Cutler have mutual affinity after working together in Denver and Chicago. The current Jets regime needs to find a way to put wins on the board to save their jobs. No quarterback currently on the roster or in the draft will be able to do that, so Cutler makes some sense as a veteran bridge. La Canfora also mentions the Bills, 49ers, Dolphins, Texans, Jaguars, and Browns as potential landing spots for Cutler.

 

 
Fire them all now, if that's the way they are going to approach things. This is when you need a team president/owner to step in and let the GM know it's ok to rebuild.
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8 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

 

 
Fire them all now, if that's the way they are going to approach things. This is when you need a team president/owner to step in and let the GM know it's ok to rebuild.

If Cutler goes to the Jets lock them up for 7-9 and a signature home win versus Pats. 

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I will write a nasty letter to the Jets when I have some free time later this month. If they read it, then Cutler will not be acquired. 

 

If they acquire Cutler, then I will become a fan of some other team.

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Jets release Nick Folk and Breno Giacomini which clears $7.5MM in cap space.

Folk was pretty solid but if they go into full rebuild mode, then who cares? Breno was mostly a bust anyway. Hopefully the purge continues.

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This is totally fantasy football, but I would love to see them continue to purge and clear enough room to go for Cousins.  Trade the first pick (I am not too hot any of these guys at the top) to Washington and let Washington parlay that pick to NE for Garrapolo.  They get a QB at a cheaper price, and we get someone who should be good for a while.  Another option would be to move Richardson and a lower pick, but I am not sure they would want to deal with him (and what could be a contentious contract negotiation).

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Mangold cut - end of an era......dude was the best center in the league for a long time....plus a great teammate/locker room guy.....it was the right move under the circumstances but still hurts....one of my favorite all time Jets...everything Revis is not.  I wish him well and hope he plays for a contender if he comes back - outside the AFC East of course! 

$18M under the cap with Revis, Harris, Marshall and lots of other possible cuts...probably will end up around $40M under - good base to rebuild with youth

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Wondering from you guys how much you think Mangold still has left in the tank.  seems like a clear cut at that price but how has his play been?  My Bengals have the worst starting center in the league - does Mangold offer any hope (not that I think we'd actually, y'know, sign him).

Thx

-QG

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3 hours ago, QuizGuy66 said:

Wondering from you guys how much you think Mangold still has left in the tank.  seems like a clear cut at that price but how has his play been?  My Bengals have the worst starting center in the league - does Mangold offer any hope (not that I think we'd actually, y'know, sign him).

Thx

-QG

It's been tougher for him to stay healthy the last couple of years, but he can still play. His age and salary and the fact that Johnson played fairly well in his place are the reasons he was released. He can still help a contending team.

 

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Revis will be released per twitter 

I admire the Jets acknowledging the situation and cutting bait on these guys, but it doesn't jive with keeping Bowles around. Only logical explanation  (as if the Jets would ever be logical) is that he's basically a sacrificial lamb so that whoever they hire next year will have a 100 percent clean slate along with a potential number 1 pick

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2 hours ago, TLEF316 said:

Revis will be released per twitter 

I admire the Jets acknowledging the situation and cutting bait on these guys, but it doesn't jive with keeping Bowles around. Only logical explanation  (as if the Jets would ever be logical) is that he's basically a sacrificial lamb so that whoever they hire next year will have a 100 percent clean slate along with a potential number 1 pick

Or they plan on keeping Bowles around through the rebuild - which seem like a poor idea but maybe his style will mesh better with a young team.

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Yes, that would be worse.

It's not just a coaching style thing with Bowles. It's a "he has no idea what he's doing" thing.

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3 minutes ago, TLEF316 said:

Yes, that would be worse.

It's not just a coaching style thing with Bowles. It's a "he has no idea what he's doing" thing.

I agree. Generally I'm all for stability but said a while back that if they are blowing up this thing they should start with a whole new staff and let them grow with the team. Say they do draft Watson or Trubisky at 6 - do we really want to have either learn a whole new system after their rookie season?

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I hope that releasing all of these veterans (with hopefully more to come) means they will really embrace the full rebuild this team needs. If they clear all of this cap space just to turn around and sign more veteran band aids to terrible contracts I am going to be doing this :wall: all offseason.

This cap space must either be used to sign young up and coming players or be carried over for future years. Hopefully last season opened some eyes, and Big Mac was given assurances that he does not need to make the playoffs to keep his job.

Not to sound like a broken record, but please stay away from Romo and Cutler. I'm coming around a bit on DeShaun Watson, but if they pass on him (or the other rookie QBs) just bring in a super cheap veteran on a one year deal like Hoyer or Gabbert, for depth and emergency situations, and let Bryce Petty and Christian Hackenberg start all season. I doubt either is the long term answer but we need to see if they could be, and if not "earn" a high enough pick next season to get a QB.

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Jets coach Todd Bowles said the team is "looking into" veteran quarterbacks.

"We have our eye on a few people," Bowles added. With just Bryce Petty and Christian Hackenberg under contract for 2017, the Jets have to add a veteran during free agency. They have been linked heavily with Bucs backup Mike Glennon.

 

I liked Glennon as a rookie, but I just can't shake the feeling that this would turn out to be a huge mistake (maybe it's just because of years and years of being beaten down). "Looking into" veteran QBs also scares the heck out of me as it indicates that this team may not embrace the full rebuild it should and will try and put band aids in place in order to try and win and keep their jobs. There will be nothing worse than a 7-9 record next season while using up cap space on veteran players..

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5 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

I liked Glennon as a rookie, but I just can't shake the feeling that this would turn out to be a huge mistake (maybe it's just because of years and years of being beaten down). "Looking into" veteran QBs also scares the heck out of me as it indicates that this team may not embrace the full rebuild it should and will try and put band aids in place in order to try and win and keep their jobs. There will be nothing worse than a 7-9 record next season while using up cap space on veteran players..

 

From the cuts being made I am optimistic that they understand what needs to be done....Gelnnon is young with upside so as long as they dont throw crazy money at him Im ok with it....if not Glennon though I am fine with creaky vet to mentor Petty/Hack and let em sink or swim.  If bomb then should have a top pick for a real franchise QB....if they develop then problem solved....

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17 minutes ago, Kiddnets said:

 

From the cuts being made I am optimistic that they understand what needs to be done....Gelnnon is young with upside so as long as they dont throw crazy money at him Im ok with it....if not Glennon though I am fine with creaky vet to mentor Petty/Hack and let em sink or swim.  If bomb then should have a top pick for a real franchise QB....if they develop then problem solved....

From what I'm reading, Glennon will command at least $15-16MM, which is why I've soured on signing him. I'm just not convinced his ceiling is any higher than a middle of the road starter.

I feel the same way that these recent cuts could/should be viewed as a positive - but until I see the results there's still a part of me that is afraid they are just going to use that money to try and stay competitive.

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Marshall released. Well they seem to be doing the right thing.

I read yesterday that Glennon wants to sign somewhere with stability so that he can be successful. I'm guessing that he will likely avoid the Jets now unless they overpay (which would obviously be a mistake by them).

Decker could be next from what I've read, as his injuries put him in jeopardy for the start of the season anyway. 

I like the young WRs on this team, so it will be interesting to see them getting a chance.

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NJ Advance Media's Connor Hughes reports the Jets are expected to target free agent S Tony Jefferson.

Jefferson is the top safety available after Eric Berry re-signed with the Chiefs earlier this week. Jefferson just turned 25 in January and played the first two years of his career for Jets coach Todd Bowles in Arizona. The Cardinals want Jefferson back but already have a lot of money tied up in their secondary. Jefferson showed elite run-stopping skills as a box safety in 2016.

 

 
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19 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

From what I'm reading, Glennon will command at least $15-16MM, which is why I've soured on signing him. I'm just not convinced his ceiling is any higher than a middle of the road starter.

I feel the same way that these recent cuts could/should be viewed as a positive - but until I see the results there's still a part of me that is afraid they are just going to use that money to try and stay competitive.

In Jet mode today so heres some thought to mull

I agree with Doc - would pass on Glennon at $15-16M yr...my max would be $12M tops with an out clause after yr 2.....if thats not enough then so be it...grab a journeyman and go with the kids.

I'd dump Gilchrist, Decker (coming off 2 major surgeries) and Harris (guy cant cover anymore and $6M way too high) - this would free up another $14M...I'd then trade Sheldon for the best offer.....no need to play poker like they did with Mo....his value has been nuked with off field nonsense and stupidly playing him out of position last year....I think they get a 3rd which is what they would get in 2 yrs if he walks so just take it and move on....it does save another $8M which is nice so we are looking at around $47M of space (plus would give them 3 3rd rd picks) ....I also think Revis signs somewhere for cheap but would likely add back $2M to put them around $50M 

As far as a rebuild goes, I dont think that has to mean not spending $ on FA's but rather spending $ on the right ones....they have enough $ to land a nice base and at least 2 big FAs and one solid one- that would fill some massive holes..I can see them going in on Bouye (26 yrs old) and Tony Jefferson (25 yrs old) to fix the secondary....then get some young depth to compete on the OL...so besides QB the team is not a disaster....I can see the below being competitive

QB: Hack/Petty with McNown as vet ins - key to the team....one of the kids steps forward could be 8-8 or better....they flop its a 4 win team

RB: Powell, Forte - solid - could be spectacular with Fournette but could hold the fort another yr easily between the 2

WR: Enuwa, Anderson, Peake, Jalin Marshall, D Smith - young with upside....wouldnt be shocked if they added a WR as BPA early in draft but for now its fine

OL - W Johnson, Carpenter, Winters, Shell, Ijalana with a 2d or 3rd rd LT prospect drafted - not a mauling OL but not bad...no great young LT in FA and 1st rd so they may go mid rd value and fill in for 1 more yr....LT big weakness

TE - ASJ and 3rd rd pick to compete - need to solidify this position as its been irrelevant 

DL - Wiliams, Mo, McClendon - darn good DL even without Sheldon.

LB - Lee, Jenkins, Young FA or 2d rd pick - need to replace Harris so I can see a decent FA or early pick here. 

CB - Bouye, Williams/Burris/Skrine - Bouye shores it up nicely - wont be the old days but should be fine

S - Jefferson, TBD - Jefferson is a beast and has Bowles connection so can see him being his Bart Scott...I think Pryor gets dealt for a 4th or 5th rder to make room and they grab another safety more suited to play next to Jefferson - maybe Hooker or Adams in the 1st?  

Looking at the above this is not a horrific team...there is talent and less drama in locker room without Sheldon and BM.....I dont have a problem making a big FA splash or 2 if on the right young players that will be here in 3 yrs when they make a real run....1st rd pick is key - do they solidify defense with one more stud or finally get a playmaker on O.....either way this is a team that could easily compete but everything turns on the QBs....if they stink then no amount of talent will help...and im ok with that..keep filling holes and see what the kids can do....if its a flop then there is a top pick and a very good QB draft waiting for them.

Problem is as Dr alludes there is conflict on the team in that Bowles is in a must win now where MAc may have a longer leash...it's dumb and what did in Rex/Idzik...they should be on the same page or it wont work....hopefully from the way the cuts have gone Mac has authority and is in for the long term not win in 2017.  

whew a lot for MArch but why not - offseason is all we have to look fwd to!  

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13 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

Marshall released. Well they seem to be doing the right thing.

I read yesterday that Glennon wants to sign somewhere with stability so that he can be successful. I'm guessing that he will likely avoid the Jets now unless they overpay (which would obviously be a mistake by them).

Decker could be next from what I've read, as his injuries put him in jeopardy for the start of the season anyway. 

I like the young WRs on this team, so it will be interesting to see them getting a chance.

What is the latest on Decker?  I've always liked him...if the Jets cut him I would love to see the Pats pick him up...I think he would be a fantastic fit in their offense...the fact he is still recovering (as well as already having made some good money) could make him even more affordable...especially if you don't need him right away...

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Odds on favorite to pick #1 in 2018 draft. Front runner for Sam Darnold which is a good thing. Of course, he may not even declare.

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1 hour ago, Boston said:

What is the latest on Decker?  I've always liked him...if the Jets cut him I would love to see the Pats pick him up...I think he would be a fantastic fit in their offense...the fact he is still recovering (as well as already having made some good money) could make him even more affordable...especially if you don't need him right away...

Hanging out banging his smoking hot wife. 

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2 hours ago, Boston said:

What is the latest on Decker?  I've always liked him...if the Jets cut him I would love to see the Pats pick him up...I think he would be a fantastic fit in their offense...the fact he is still recovering (as well as already having made some good money) could make him even more affordable...especially if you don't need him right away...

The latest reports are that he will miss camp and may not be ready for Week 1. I like him a lot as well, but with the Jets current situation I think it would make sense to release him and there's speculation that they will.

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On 3/3/2017 at 9:33 PM, lod001 said:

Odds on favorite to pick #1 in 2018 draft. Front runner for Sam Darnold which is a good thing. Of course, he may not even declare.

Jets arent that bad or lucky....I think we are looking at worst at another #5-7 pick even if they stink...

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Brock O 2.0 - pass on this please......

 

According to Yahoo's Charles Robinson, "multiple NFL sources" anticipate free agent Mike Glennon landing a deal worth $14-15 million per year.

It's only $3-4 million short of last year's Brock Osweiler benchmark. (Osweiler landed $18 million annually from the Texans.) Glennon showed plus decision-making skills as an 18-game starter his first two years in the league, but he is timid in the pocket and a poor downfield passer, offering what amounts to a game-manager skill set. He may end up as 2017's most overpaid free agent.

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1 hour ago, Kiddnets said:

Brock O 2.0 - pass on this please......

 

According to Yahoo's Charles Robinson, "multiple NFL sources" anticipate free agent Mike Glennon landing a deal worth $14-15 million per year.

It's only $3-4 million short of last year's Brock Osweiler benchmark. (Osweiler landed $18 million annually from the Texans.) Glennon showed plus decision-making skills as an 18-game starter his first two years in the league, but he is timid in the pocket and a poor downfield passer, offering what amounts to a game-manager skill set. He may end up as 2017's most overpaid free agent.

I'd pass at that price tag.

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This is kind of interesting as a stopgap/what the heck type option - assuming he'd come very cheap (7th round pick). At 30 he could at least be part of the future if he showed well and has a cheap contract for a starter ($7MM).

 
Quote

 

NJ Advance Media's Connor Hughes believes Chase Daniel would be the "best possible option" for the Jets.
The Eagles have made Daniel available for trade with his $7 million salary hefty for a backup, and the Jets are looking for a veteran bridge quarterback as they embark on a rebuild. Daniel has experience in West Coast systems, and new OC John Morton figures to bring one to New York. Both Morton and Daniel cut their teeth under Sean Payton with the Saints. Mar 5 - 11:25 AM

 

 
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1 minute ago, Dr. Octopus said:

This is kind of interesting as a stopgap/what the heck type option - assuming he'd come very cheap (7th round pick). At 30 he could at least be part of the future if he showed well and has a cheap contract for a starter ($7MM).

 
 

im intrigued but agree on only if a late pick/salary dump - I'd even go 6th this yr with a late pick next yr with upside to a 4th if he has a great year. 

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2 hours ago, Dr. Octopus said:

I'd pass at that price tag.

I'd pay it, but cite Osweilier as the reason to only guarantee the first year salary with performance options to guarantee future money.  Win/win.  You know the player is always going to bet on himself and if he earns it the team will fall all over themselves to pay him.  There was nothing wrong with taking the shot at Osweiler, and just about any other team would be willing to develop him another year, but he was so, so awful, and they are legit contenders with that defense, it's just untenable for Houston right this moment.  I think it's totally unfair to give up on him after just one year in the system, but I get it given their situation.

Actually, a team flush with cap space should trade for Osweilier.  Houston would only eat $6M in dead money and thus save $10M, I bet they'd give him away at this point, and the new team can walk away next year scot free so there's near zero risk to a non-contender.  If you're a team confident in your QB coach/OC why not?  With the required minimum spending and how much room teams like Cleveland and SFO have I'd consider it if I didn't love my other options.  Spending the 1.02 on a guy you're not in love with, or a 7th on a guy you're not in love with is an easy decision for me.

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Posted (edited)

8 minutes ago, Hankmoody said:

I'd pay it, but cite Osweilier as the reason to only guarantee the first year salary with performance options to guarantee future money. 

Under those circumstances I may as well, but I'm assuming that he gets at least his first two seasons guaranteed on the open market. I suppose the demand may not be there to the extent some reports suggest, but I've read that there's a few other teams interested as well.

Edited by Dr. Octopus

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16 minutes ago, Dr. Octopus said:

Under those circumstances I may as well, but I'm assuming that he gets at least his first two seasons guaranteed on the open market. I suppose the demand may not be there to the extent some reports suggest, but I've read that there's a few other teams interested as well.

Easy to walk away in that case.

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Manish Mehta of the New York Daily News reports the Jets do not believe free agent Mike Glennon is worth $14 million per year.

Reports suggest that is what the Bears are willing to pay, meaning the Jets will likely be out of the running. Glennon did have his moments as a young starter in a bad situation with the Bucs, but he has thrown 11 regular-season passes since 2014. Signing him to a big-money deal would certainly be a risk.

 

 
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Sources: @NYJets WR Jalin Marshall facing four-game suspension for violating NFL's drug policy. More details: http://nydn.us/2mAW24k

Supposedly Adderall - This sucks. I have high hopes for this guy.

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