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*** Official 2019 Chargers Thread **** (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter Tau837
- Start date
BoltNlava
Footballguy
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
We got off track and I'm not fighting, you might be.
I'm not sure I understand the connection with guys retired and from previous eras but if it makes sense to you all the better.
-I thought I read someone wanting to play whatever is sitting behind Rivers and I couldn't even name the back up QBs in Los Angeles. First of all, I don' think Rivers will be sat down no matter what the Chargers have in terms of wins and losses.
-I understand Mondays after tough losses, fans get frustrated, easy to point it at non-fans of the team but I think most NFL fans think Los Angeles was a lot closer to a playoff team than a potential changing of the guard or Draft 2020 by Week 8 for the Chargers.
The other team in Los Angeles made several moves last week, the Patriots are rumored and have been involved in moves, we're not hearing any of that from a team that had big expectations.
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
Let's imagine that everything MOP pre-supposes occurs. Rivers continues to perform at a Hall of Fame level for two to three more years after this one. Management somehow is able to fix glaring weaknesses with the offensive line (and maybe the interior defensive line) while keeping every other unit more or less intact. For arguments sake, let's say they somehow correct their tendency of getting crippled by extensive and long-term injuries across the board.
Then what to do this year? Why risk Rivers' terribly valuable future over what now have to be considered meaningless games?
Remember, it was only two years ago that the Chargers started off 3-6, only to win six of their next seven, miss the playoffs, and lose out on possibly drafting Denzel Ward, Quenton Nelson, Mike McGlinchey, Minkah Fitzpatrick, or Da'Ron Payne. They ended up lucking out that Derwin James was still on the board, but he shouldn't have been. I'm not encouraging a tank job, but when the best possible outcome of continuing to start Rivers is to hopefully get hot and just miss the playoffs, I struggle to see the upside of not seeing what's behind him on the depth chart.
Edit to add: I'm not sure this squad is talented enough to start 3-6.
Then what to do this year? Why risk Rivers' terribly valuable future over what now have to be considered meaningless games?
Remember, it was only two years ago that the Chargers started off 3-6, only to win six of their next seven, miss the playoffs, and lose out on possibly drafting Denzel Ward, Quenton Nelson, Mike McGlinchey, Minkah Fitzpatrick, or Da'Ron Payne. They ended up lucking out that Derwin James was still on the board, but he shouldn't have been. I'm not encouraging a tank job, but when the best possible outcome of continuing to start Rivers is to hopefully get hot and just miss the playoffs, I struggle to see the upside of not seeing what's behind him on the depth chart.
Edit to add: I'm not sure this squad is talented enough to start 3-6.
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Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
Understood Gr00vus and I agree on them finding a QB of the future. I just feel like there is still some "right now" left and maybe some Chargers fans feel like it's even more reason to ship him to a team that is pretty good but needs a QB to take them over the top. Not many but the Bears seem like a team that could use a QB upgrade desperately.
You're right about OL, Miami did that a few times under Marino with mixed results, it's never worked under anyone that came after him. We were looking solid when Jake Long was our LT but his career was short and even when he was a Pro-Bowl level player there were detractors.
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Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
I read an article before the season that said the Chargers had the most talented roster in the league from 1 to 53. I highly doubt that that was ever the case, but even then, it failed to take into account the player 40 on down all played offensive line and defensive tackle, many of whom were tabbed to be starters. Most Chargers' fans realized they were unlikely to avoid the injury bug like last year and that last year's team won an inordinate number of close games (just the opposite of what Charger teams normally do), and that this team had GLARING weaknesses. Don't believe me? Check out this thread.
You're delusional if you think that this current team is the equivalent of last year's Super Bowl competitors.
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
Tau837
Footballguy
Taylor is a known quantity. He is a bottom caliber starter/top caliber backup. He is not the long term answer, and, frankly, isn't a good short term answer, either, as a starter. So IMO the answer is no.Despyzer said:
This is the answer if the Chargers reach the point - now or later this season - that they are ready to push Rivers into retirement even if he doesn't want to go. I say it is the answer, because I fully expect Stick would be a complete flop, and the team could end up with the #1 pick in next year's draft by losing out.Despyzer said:
But I sincerely hope the team does not want to push Rivers out. I think Rivers expects to sign a 3 year deal after the season, planning to play at least 2 seasons in the new stadium. He is easily one of the top 5 Chargers of all time and IMO he will be a HOFer. I would prefer that they give him that new deal and ride him until he is done.
I did not like either the Tyrod signing or drafting Stick exactly because I do not see either of them as the answer. Tyrod is okay as the backup, but not at his contract price. They quite obviously needed to spend that cap room elsewhere
I think this is the most likely outcome whether or not they play Tyrod or Stick this season. It is exceedingly rare for a quality NFL starting QB to end up in free agency, so they will likely have to find their next quality starter in the draft. But the draft is a crapshoot. The hit rate is pretty poor. Even with the #1 pick, the hit rate is probably 50% at best.Despyzer said:
Which is why I think they should ride Rivers as long as he wants to play.
Right, because it is just that easy? Rivers has been playing behind bottom tier OLs for more than a decade.
Tau837
Footballguy
Rivers is going nowhere. He has a no trade clause and has a huge family he didn't even move from San Diego area when the team relocated. IMO he will never play for any franchise other than the Chargers
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
It sounds like you understand why an avg NFL fan might get the idea this team has/had talent going into 2019, but then you end the same post with the word delusional, that seems off to me or not understanding of anyone that isn't looking at the team from the same exact perch as where you are sitting.
I think you got the Monday Blues but I don't want to keep posting back and forth if everything I post upsets you and it clearly is. I haven't said much but you're finding fault with all of it, even minor points you don't want to give an inch so...I stopped and you still kept going so I'll leave you be.
I'm not a Chargers hater, not the fans anyways. I lived in SoCal for 8 years and went to Chargers practices back when Marty was the coach so before you attack a poster for asking questions or putting forth an idea, maybe not get so fussy or bothered...it's just a chat board friend.
Thanks
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
We've seen Tyrod Taylor before, but not in this offense. We've seen him lead outmatched Bills teams to two winning season (including a playoff birth) and a seven-win season. We also saw him flop with the Browns when no one could have been successful. But we agree on a couple things regarding Tyrod - he's likely not the long-term answer, and his contract eats up way too much space.
I'm not ready to say Stick is going to suck when there are guys like Tom Brady and Gardner Minshew out there. Let's recall that the only QB who has ever led this franchise to a Super Bowl game was drafted in the 6th round. Is Stick likely to look more like Luke Falk than Minshew? Oh yeah! Why not give him a ride though? What's the harm in a lost season?
I'm not ready to say Stick is going to suck when there are guys like Tom Brady and Gardner Minshew out there. Let's recall that the only QB who has ever led this franchise to a Super Bowl game was drafted in the 6th round. Is Stick likely to look more like Luke Falk than Minshew? Oh yeah! Why not give him a ride though? What's the harm in a lost season?
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
I think you come at discussions much the same way you clipped my quote. I pointed out exactly why that columnist was just as delusional as you, but if you prefer uninformed or ignorant, I'm willing to comply.
Just to set the record straight though. You do honestly believe that the Chargers are in equivalent circumstances this year as the Rams and Patriots?
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
You keep using the word delusional and ignorant, I've asked you to not be so quick to inject hostile language.
Lots of ways to insinuate or call a person dumb which is your ammo and you continue to want to take your Chargers frustrations out on whatever or whoever you can aim that anger bottled up inside.
Good Luck, hope the week gets better for you chief.
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BoltNlava
Footballguy
Then what's the point of your post? I have since about the same. I lived and died the 80's/90's as well. They are cursed. Someone stepped on a trigger that lead to the holly roller to the great fumble in tom town and now to the 2 fumble no yard rb carry that cost a sad man a few million a year. Not to mention any chance Rivers had to be viewed as something more than a choker in crunch time. I keep trying to tell myself it's LA's problem now. It's still hard. Because Rivers is still there I'd like them to win. When he leaves...It's over. For me at least.
Gr00vus
Footballguy
I understand where you're coming from. At the skill/sexy positions they do have talent. But both interior lines suck and have sucked for a long time. Plus the continuous injury problems for years. Those two things are stuff that non-fans probably don't fully get, so I understand how it's surprising when the Chargers struggle for non-fans. For fans, it's very predictable. Every year we have these threads and the Charger fans beg for help on the lines. Every year since Jamal Williams left we have problems there that inevitably limit the team's success.
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
Yes, that is the point of my post. My friends who root for other teams think I'm being needlessly pessimistic. I tell them with the Chargers' history, I have no other option. That's why I said "This organization has a way of ruining a person's psyche."
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
So this unnamed guy wanders into a thread and wants to argue a point that no one made. When he gets called out on it, he makes statements that strain credibility and keeps trying to shift his argument to something he thinks he can defend until he's defending the most obvious point ever made. He makes comments like "If I was the GM, I'd rebuild the offensive line" as if no one's ever thought of that before and was as simple to execute as it was for him to state it. Seeing he can't simply leave a conversation without having the final word, he keeps making ridiculous comments that fail to make much of a point. In desperation, he makes a claim so ridiculous that even he can't defend it, so instead he clips responses so he can argues against that and tries to make the conversation about the other person instead of the stupid things he said.
Use any adjective you think is appropriate, but at this point I'd try out "embarrassing."
Ministry of Pain
Footballguy
I actually thought this was funny and your way of saying let's let it go until...
There is no arguing with you...it's not even a debate. You just want someone to help you re-charge your batteries.
Sorry Desp, I seem to remember you in a positive light, I've been away for a while and maybe things are a lot different. I wish you would focus more on Xs and Os with me but you have been vocal that you want to bench Rivers at this point and anyone who thinks otherwise is delusional and ignorant to use your words and terminology.
I've been a lot nicer than most, haven't called you a single name or name called/classified any of your posts with derogatory terms like you have done repeatedly.
I would have enjoyed just reading your insight but that was not to be today. It became a whipped up argument that was one-sided on your end. If you need the last word, take it. I let it go but you can't get my name out of your mouth or hands at the moment, maybe in a week or two maybe we can re-visit.
JWB and I argue a lot but we usually know when to hit the brakes. I'm not mad, wish you weren't either but we're not making anything positive in these posts so maybe we should stop.
I was at the "Epic in Miami" at the Orange Bowl, you should show some respect for your elders
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Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
See? This is the thing. I never said we have to bench Rivers and that anyone thinking differently was delusional or ignorant. What I actually said is that as much as we hate to even think about it, it's essential to plot it. There doesn't seem to be anything to be gained this season, so why not now? Seeing you don't seem to be able to counter that, you invent an argument that never existed. You did it from the very start, and you continue to do it now, just as you have done so throughout. How can we debate anything meaningful when you confess to not even knowing the backups?
I"m not mad either. It's more like I'm perplexed why anyone who has so little to say continues to talk. This is the fourth time you've said goodbye, and yet you keep returning. I imagine this time will be no different, "chief." You don't need to worry about me though. I spend so little time on this site that if it wasn't football season, you'd probably go months without seeing my name.
Edit to add: I do agree that we've probably muddied up this thread enough. If you wish to continue (because how could you resist?), please message me directly or post on my profile.
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Despyzer
Lousy Attention Whore
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
almost pulled off the hodges tannehill trubisky trifecta
Bracie Smathers
Footballguy
inscrutable
adjective
in·scru·ta·ble | \ in-ˈskrü-tə-bəl \
Definition of inscrutable
: not readily investigated, interpreted, or understood : MYSTERIOUS
-----------------------------
Rich HribarVerified account @LordReebs
Chargers rushing yards the past four weeks: 35, 32, 39, 36.
A combined 63 attempts for 142 yards (2.25 YPC).
They are the first team to rush for fewer than 40 yards in four straight games since 1946.
12:50 PM - 28 Oct 2019
adjective
in·scru·ta·ble | \ in-ˈskrü-tə-bəl \
Definition of inscrutable
: not readily investigated, interpreted, or understood : MYSTERIOUS
-----------------------------
Rich HribarVerified account @LordReebs
Chargers rushing yards the past four weeks: 35, 32, 39, 36.
A combined 63 attempts for 142 yards (2.25 YPC).
They are the first team to rush for fewer than 40 yards in four straight games since 1946.
12:50 PM - 28 Oct 2019
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
whiz is fired....scapegoat
they should trade gordon today
what a waste of a season....
they should trade gordon today
what a waste of a season....
Maybe he wasn't being tricky enough like Gase, Nagy, Taylor and the rest of the young so called offensive geniuses.
The Big Donkey
Footballguy
Tau837
Footballguy
Whether or not he is being used as a scapegoat, he deserved to be fired, and I am glad he was.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
the genius that shut down lamar jackson last year has certainly wore off.....they have been beyond banged up.....but the heat should be on....phil has played like garbage too
Tau837
Footballguy
Agree on both points. I think some of the shine has worn off of Telesco as well.
This seems like a bit of an overstatement IMO.
Among QBs with at least 100 dropbacks, PFF grades him out at #9 for the season to date (though to be fair, Brees is under that threshold and has played better). This is despite the fact that Rivers has the 2nd highest number of dropbacks under pressure in the league. His receivers have dropped 17 passes, including a few TDs and first downs, and his kickers have missed multiple potentially game-altering FGs. His OL is terrible and he has played most of the season without key players including at times LT Okung and C Pouncey - their 2 best OL, TE1 Henry and even TE2 Green, original WR3 and WR4 Benjamin and Inman, and original RB2/3 Jackson. The offensive playcalling has been bad, and the coaching staff forced Gordon into snaps when Ekeler had been dominating.
I think Rivers would tell you he should be playing better, but I think he has played reasonably well under the circumstances.
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BoltNlava
Footballguy
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
BoltNlava
Footballguy
Tau837
Footballguy
No, but I recogize that among this team's many problems, Rivers is not one of them. Just off the top of my head, these are all bigger problems this season:
- Ownership
- Injuries
- Pass protection
- Run blocking
- Offensive playcalling
- Dropped passes
- Field goal kicking
- Interior DL play
- Head coach
- Front office/Telesco decision-making this past offseason
- Defensive playcalling
- Gordon's holdout and the handling of his return
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bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
lol....
12/7 td to int.....game ender vs lions...those two vs pitt were awful...dont get me started on that denver game......
BoltNlava
Footballguy
I get your point. I really do. It's not all on phil. It really can't be given his body of work. Sure players get old and start the decline but he has had no chance. none. That o-line is beyond bad and given no time what can you do? He's not mahomes but who is? Given time you will see what is possible with rivers. I get the fact that that ship has sailed tho. Shame really. He does deserve better. Okung may be back from the dead fwiw.
Tau837
Footballguy
Sure, and I can recall at least 4 dropped TD passes, and one of the interceptions was batted up at the line. Just off the top of my head, that would drastically improve that ratio.
Don't worry, it probably will not be much longer that Chargers fans will have him and his garbage play. That is definitely something to look forward to with optimism!
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
guess you didnt see my post where i said beyond banged up.....sorry to criticize your crush....but he deserves some blame too....
Tau837
Footballguy
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
of course they beat rodgers after sucking vs hodges and tannehill
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
Tau837
Footballguy
He should be. He is the 2nd highest paid player on the team and the 16th highest paid player in the NFL. Von Miller is the only non-QB paid more than Ingram. While I'm happy with his production yesterday, he is not returning value on that contract. I think there is a high likelihood that they release him this offseason for that reason.
bicycle_seat_sniffer
Smells like chicken
The Athletic's Vincent Bonsignore reports the Chargers "would listen" if the NFL approached them about relocating to London.
According to Bonsignore, the possibility "has been broached among league personnel" and owners are "concerned enough about the Chargers’ situation in L.A. that they would provide the necessary support for a relocation to London if the Chargers pursue it." Tottenham Hotspur Stadium opened earlier this year with the NFL in mind and hosted two of the four London games this season after the across-the-pond series concluded this past Sunday. It seats over 62,000, and the Chargers are currently playing in a tiny soccer stadium is Carson, Cali. that seats a mere 27,000 where the Chargers are essentially the road team every week as it gets flooded with opposing fans. The Chargers are slated to join the Rams in their new $4.5 billion venue, but L.A. has not embraced the Bolts as it has the Rams. Moving to London would make a whole heck of a lot of sense, as the fans over there have totally embraced the NFL. It would likely require the Chargers switching divisions.
According to Bonsignore, the possibility "has been broached among league personnel" and owners are "concerned enough about the Chargers’ situation in L.A. that they would provide the necessary support for a relocation to London if the Chargers pursue it." Tottenham Hotspur Stadium opened earlier this year with the NFL in mind and hosted two of the four London games this season after the across-the-pond series concluded this past Sunday. It seats over 62,000, and the Chargers are currently playing in a tiny soccer stadium is Carson, Cali. that seats a mere 27,000 where the Chargers are essentially the road team every week as it gets flooded with opposing fans. The Chargers are slated to join the Rams in their new $4.5 billion venue, but L.A. has not embraced the Bolts as it has the Rams. Moving to London would make a whole heck of a lot of sense, as the fans over there have totally embraced the NFL. It would likely require the Chargers switching divisions.
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