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*** Official 2019 Dolphins Thread *** That's a wrap...now what do we do with the #5 pick? (1 Viewer)

Iceman03 said:
I’m not sure which of you ventured into the Steelers thread several weeks ago thank us for the first rounder but just wanted to say thanks for Minkah. Worth it.
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Any player who pouts like a little ##### and whose momma takes to twitter to complain about how his son is being used......good ####### riddance. 

Win win for both teams. 

 
Slapdash said:
Somewhat disappointed not to get the first pick, but the QB picture looks a lot murkier at the top than it did two months ago.  Chase Young is a stud
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There are few studs...so this is a great year to have multiple picks. The 2020 draft is flush with talent all over the field.

 
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Bills at home next week after they blew it vs Cleveland, think Buffalo should win handily

Then it's Cleveland up there, Miami will look good for a bit but fade. 

Philly visits

Then there are 3 actual games they could win including the Jets, Giants and winless Bungles, they could end up 5-11. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Bills at home next week after they blew it vs Cleveland, think Buffalo should win handily

Then it's Cleveland up there, Miami will look good for a bit but fade. 

Philly visits

Then there are 3 actual games they could win including the Jets, Giants and winless Bungles, they could end up 5-11. 
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The last game vs NE could be meaningless to them, so we could be in the mix to win that game. Hopefully not. There are several impact players at the top of the draft, including Tua and Joe. Maybe we should trade down and get a couple more picks, if we end up picking 6th behind the CIN, was, jets, Broncos, and Falcons. The NE m.o.

 
Flores 2-0 in November needs to be the title this week @SwampDawg 

Got a lot of thoughts but I saw that Kaep is clearly on the radar for the Phins...wondering what anyone might think about this?

I will say i'm impressed with Flores and have been since he got here. I can see the Bill Bellichick rub off on this guy, he dances to his own beat and I really feel like we don't need to ask him a lot of questions right now. I feel like we are in safe hands with him. 

Grier on the other hand? I'm not so sure, he might just be following orders, we really need a forward thinking GM that can take all these picks and boatloads of $$$ we have to spend and really put a master plan together. I have a short list of names but want to hear what some of you all think? My guy says Grier will be drafting in 2020...but I want a GM that will oversee the next 3 years in FULL, if it gets split between 2 GMs it will fail miserably. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Flores 2-0 in November needs to be the title this week @SwampDawg 

Got a lot of thoughts but I saw that Kaep is clearly on the radar for the Phins...wondering what anyone might think about this?

I will say i'm impressed with Flores and have been since he got here. I can see the Bill Bellichick rub off on this guy, he dances to his own beat and I really feel like we don't need to ask him a lot of questions right now. I feel like we are in safe hands with him. 

Grier on the other hand? I'm not so sure, he might just be following orders, we really need a forward thinking GM that can take all these picks and boatloads of $$$ we have to spend and really put a master plan together. I have a short list of names but want to hear what some of you all think? My guy says Grier will be drafting in 2020...but I want a GM that will oversee the next 3 years in FULL, if it gets split between 2 GMs it will fail miserably. 
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Title Updated.

I don't see the upside in bringing Kaep in. He's not going to be an upgrade this year over Fitz after not having played in years and winning isn't a priority this year anyway. He's also 32 years old at this point so he isn't your long term answer, you are going to be drafting one of the top QB's in the draft, Fitz because of the incentives in his contract looks like he will be back next year as the placeholder/mentor so he wouldn't even really seem to have a role next year. I guess if you are just ready to cut bait with Rosen right now and want to bring him as a backup and kick the tires in case Fitz is planning on calling it quits after this year so he could be the placeholder if the rookie isn't ready next year then fine. But to me that isn't worth the distraction, and I'm not even talking about the knelling stuff. At this point if you bring him in and then don't resign him or if you did but still drafted a rookie and used him as the place holder until the rookie is ready week 5 or 6 you are going to have a lot more media critique and backlash then if its Ryan Fitzpatrick you are replacing. He's going to polarize both sides of the situation. To me he makes much more sense in Chicago or Carolina that have more pieces in place and need the QB or a KC that has the no question number one QB but could use a backup that can play a similar style.

I to like what I have seen from Flores and the way in a difficult situation he has kept the team bought in. I liken him to a Brett Brown for the 76ers, he had a misfit team that he got to play hard during the rebuild and now is reaping the rewards.  Hopefully the Phins rebuild is a little quicker.

 
Kaep- My guess is doing their due diligence and kicking the tires. Likely thinking about this coming offseason.  I'd be surprised they sign him after what FitzMagic is doing and what they (presumably) think about Josh...both of them are relatively inexpensive.   

Grier- He's getting the type guys that Flo wants, so I think with Flo's input he's heading in the right direction. 

 
So with the recent success, the dream of being able to draft Tua and possibly even Burrow looks like it may be dying.  Unless Cinci can pull off a win, and then beat us in Miami, they look to be the first pick in the draft, with Atlanta, Washington, and the Jets all in play for the other top 4 spots.  It is conceivable that  one of Cinci, Jets, Falcons, and Skins could pass on a QB and not trade out, leaving us with Tua or Burrow, but that seems unlikely.  Looking like our recent success may require that we seek an alternative for the QB spot, unless we want to use draft capital to trade up ourselves.  Granted, there is plenty of football left to be played, and we could definitely still lose out and be in position - but what if we are on the board and Tua/Burrow are both gone? 

Take Chase Young if we are 3rd, right?  Then worry about QB either next season, or through a trade - maybe Minshew for New Orleans' 2nd rounder if we could pull that off?  I know that will be polarizing on these boards, but I personally like that as a backup plan.  I think Minshew has  that "it" that people like to use to characterize guys who find a way to succeed.  He has the feel of a young Tom Brady in both his back story and in his on-field play.  Its possible Flores sees that as well.  

Still hoping Tua/Burrow works out - but if not I can easily switch to Chase Young/Minshew as a solid rebuild formula.  I hate that they have won these 2 games for what it does to draft position, but at the same time it has been really encouraging to watch this team of undrafted or late drafted, unknown and unheralded players play up to a respectable NFL level.  Kind of like Gardner Minshew did when given an opportunity.

 
With Tannebaum saying he'd take Herbert I think there's still a chance.  There are more GMs than just MT that think along the lines that QBs must be of prototypical build 

 
I think this is a "chips fall where they may" situation.  Rosen and Fitz are signed for next year and Miami has a boatload of picks and money.  Someone like Cam shakes loose and Miami can afford to pay him and give up a draft pick and not look back. There are likely 7 QBs in the this draft and another 5 or so in 2021, and we still can end up with a top 3 pick or trade up.  Cinci needs a QB, but the others ahead of us don't really and Chase makes things easy for us as well.

As for what is happening on the field at the moment, we have built an o line this year that with castoffs and whatnot seem better than what we have had there for the past, what, 5 years? Our secondary, also with castoffs and street FAs is playing pretty well, and our LBs have been solid.  

While I am a "tank for Tua" guy, it is refreshing to see miami take the New England way (or for those of you with history, the Shula way) of a team that gets better as the season progresses, not worse.  I'd still be fine with them losing the last 7 games but playing hard, but this team at least shows signs of life, not like Gase, Wanny, Philbin, blah blah blah where you knew it was all smoke and mirrors and all about to fall apart.

 
Gatorman said:
I think this is a "chips fall where they may" situation.  Rosen and Fitz are signed for next year and Miami has a boatload of picks and money.  Someone like Cam shakes loose and Miami can afford to pay him and give up a draft pick and not look back. There are likely 7 QBs in the this draft and another 5 or so in 2021, and we still can end up with a top 3 pick or trade up.  Cinci needs a QB, but the others ahead of us don't really and Chase makes things easy for us as well.

As for what is happening on the field at the moment, we have built an o line this year that with castoffs and whatnot seem better than what we have had there for the past, what, 5 years? Our secondary, also with castoffs and street FAs is playing pretty well, and our LBs have been solid.  

While I am a "tank for Tua" guy, it is refreshing to see miami take the New England way (or for those of you with history, the Shula way) of a team that gets better as the season progresses, not worse.  I'd still be fine with them losing the last 7 games but playing hard, but this team at least shows signs of life, not like Gase, Wanny, Philbin, blah blah blah where you knew it was all smoke and mirrors and all about to fall apart.
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THAT has me the most exited about Flo.  the fact that guys are getting better.  which never seemed to happen.

secondarily is the lack of penalties. Under Shula they were amongst the least penalized... that wasn't the case under the last regimes.  

 
ChuckLiddell said:
So with the recent success, the dream of being able to draft Tua and possibly even Burrow looks like it may be dying.  Unless Cinci can pull off a win, and then beat us in Miami, they look to be the first pick in the draft, with Atlanta, Washington, and the Jets all in play for the other top 4 spots.  It is conceivable that  one of Cinci, Jets, Falcons, and Skins could pass on a QB and not trade out, leaving us with Tua or Burrow, but that seems unlikely.  Looking like our recent success may require that we seek an alternative for the QB spot, unless we want to use draft capital to trade up ourselves.  Granted, there is plenty of football left to be played, and we could definitely still lose out and be in position - but what if we are on the board and Tua/Burrow are both gone? 

Take Chase Young if we are 3rd, right?  Then worry about QB either next season, or through a trade - maybe Minshew for New Orleans' 2nd rounder if we could pull that off?  I know that will be polarizing on these boards, but I personally like that as a backup plan.  I think Minshew has  that "it" that people like to use to characterize guys who find a way to succeed.  He has the feel of a young Tom Brady in both his back story and in his on-field play.  Its possible Flores sees that as well.  

Still hoping Tua/Burrow works out - but if not I can easily switch to Chase Young/Minshew as a solid rebuild formula.  I hate that they have won these 2 games for what it does to draft position, but at the same time it has been really encouraging to watch this team of undrafted or late drafted, unknown and unheralded players play up to a respectable NFL level.  Kind of like Gardner Minshew did when given an opportunity.
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I am going to keep stalking you Chuckie. Minshew is not the answer long term. Going to disagree about this vehemently. 

We will have one of Tua, Herbert or Burrows by the time the season ends. I don't see another win other than maybe the Bengals.....maybe.

 
Todem said:
I am going to keep stalking you Chuckie. Minshew is not the answer long term. Going to disagree about this vehemently. 

We will have one of Tua, Herbert or Burrows by the time the season ends. I don't see another win other than maybe the Bengals.....maybe.
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LOL its all good!  You and I saw Minshew differently.  Limited sample size, but I saw an NFL starter with some solid playmaking ability and a ridiculous grasp of the game given his draft pedigree and lack of experience.  I saw a potential future elite QB with charisma, leadership, and enough talent to lead a team.  Put up a 92.8 passer rating with DJ Chark and Chris Conley as his only weapons in the passing game (if you count Conley as a "weapon"), and probably zero first team reps until week 2.  

I would be excited to get Chase Young with our first rounder, 3 other exciting prospects with our other two first rounders and our very early 2nd rounder, and Minshew with New Orleans' second rounder if we could make that happen.  I am not so sure that Jax would part with him for a late second - its tough to gauge what his NFL value is after so few games.  It woudl not shock me even a little if New England gave up a late first for him, and Brady retired with another ring.  Thats a very New England move.

Minshew has shown us that he can play in the NFL and play well.  I get why people would far prefer one of the top 3 rookies, and I will not argue against it - but my opinion is that if Minshew had been drafted on day one and did what we saw him do, the fantasy and NFL community would be abuzz with excitement for his future.  The fact that he was drafted in the 6th round puts a stain on him.  Honestly, it put a stain on Brady from my perspective no matter how well he played.  For a little while at least.

 
Todem said:
I am going to keep stalking you Chuckie. Minshew is not the answer long term. Going to disagree about this vehemently. 

We will have one of Tua, Herbert or Burrows by the time the season ends. I don't see another win other than maybe the Bengals.....maybe.
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They're beating Buffalo, this isn't the same Bills from September, it's November now and there's cracks, ask Cleveland. 

It's 6-10 all over again

Purgatory Forever!!!

 
pulled from CKParrot on twitter...

According to data from @PFF, Miami Dolphins defensive players have accumulated 534 tackles this year, but only 59 missed tackles. That percentage (11.05%) is 3rd lowest in the NFL in 2019.

 
Beating Cleveland in 2 weeks became more of a possibility with the inevitable suspension of Garrett. But the Browns still have so much more talent than Miami. If the Dolphins win, Flores should get a few votes for coach of the year.

 
Let's say Miami does rack up a few more wins...5-11/6-10 something like that. Plus he knows something we don't but I'm going to tell you now. 

Some dude listed his home for sale, always walks in the shadows of his coach, that's right folks, get ready for the Brady Years! 

Tom Brady will be the Miami Dolphins stop gap QB for the 2020s as we still search for our QB of the future. Flores knows hm well and I'm sure can sell Miami as good retirement spot for Brady and Giselle 😂

I don't want to see Miami trade picks to move up, that would be a big waste. I also think they should trade down like the Patriots do and load up on guys that are going to be hungry, out to prove they should have been selected higher. 

Get used to it folks, this place is Massachusetts-South!

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Let's say Miami does rack up a few more wins...5-11/6-10 something like that. Plus he knows something we don't but I'm going to tell you now. 

Some dude listed his home for sale, always walks in the shadows of his coach, that's right folks, get ready for the Brady Years! 

Tom Brady will be the Miami Dolphins stop gap QB for the 2020s as we still search for our QB of the future. Flores knows hm well and I'm sure can sell Miami as good retirement spot for Brady and Giselle 😂

I don't want to see Miami trade picks to move up, that would be a big waste. I also think they should trade down like the Patriots do and load up on guys that are going to be hungry, out to prove they should have been selected higher. 

Get used to it folks, this place is Massachusetts-South!
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Fitzpatrick might be as good as a 43 year old Brady. 

 
He's making chicken salad out of chicken $h!t ... I can't wait until Flo's has a good roster. 

To that point, if they LOVE a dude... I'm not opposed to moving up to get him, ala PHI/Wentz.  Not preferable, but I'm not opposed. 

 
Reading a lot of talk about signing Cam and I dont hate the idea.  Of course, he would have to pass a physical and his shoulder would have to check out, but if we could get him for no draft capital, then use all of these picks on useful pieces around him, we could contend very quickly.  I realize Cam is not perfect - but we wont be in positon to get the perfect prospect either, so we will have to come up with a different plan.  Especially after Tua went down today with what appears to be a very serious hip fracture that threatens his career.  

We passed on Brees because of a shoulder injury as a free agent.  Instead, gave up a 2nd rounder for Dante Culpeper.  To me, Cam is worth the risk, which is just salary cap space (and potential lost opportunity on drafting our guy) as he wont cost us draft capital.  High upside, low downside, low risk, and we get to use all of those picks on other positions, possibly even trading down and acquiring a ton more if someone falls in love with a prospect at our spot.

Thoughts?

Edit - I see now that he is signed through 2020, free agent 2021 - not sure if that 2020 is an option year for Carolina.  If he satys, they ar epaying him $18.6M plus a $500K workout bonus which is not unreasonable if he is healthy.

 
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Man, I don’t know about Cam. I’m a fan, but he looked terrible before shutting it down. I know it could have been because he was playing hurt, but he was bad.  A lot of time to go before April, things can and will change by then. Still a chance we have 1.01. 
 

Really sucks for Tua. Hope it’s not a career ending injury. Seems like he’s been hurt a lot. Not sure how he’s going to hold up if he plays at the next level. 

 
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Based on the team's performance and the Tua injury, it is definitely shaping up to be a year where invest in the trenches is the value.  I wish we had a better opportunity to evaluate Rosen

 
things couldn't have gone much worse this weekend if we wanted a franchise QB in this draft. Redskins lose what might have been the only winnable game left on their schedule, Haskins continues to not look like an NFL QB. Bengals continue to lose, Finely only throws for 115 yards. Even if the Dolphins somehow lose to them I don't see the Bengals winning any other games. So best case we pick third with two teams that need QB's in front of us and Tua no longer an option. Burrow and Herbert go 1 & 2, we get a stud in Chase Young who along with a couple good O-line picks will make us a solid 6 to 8 win team with Fitz or whatever journey man we get for the next several years. And just wait Tua will end up in New England, set and rehab behind Brady for a year and then take over and haunt us for the next 10 years.

 
I am all about Cam Newton if he is 100% fit and wants to play football. Something that was not happening in his limited time this season. He looked done, like burnt toast. If he is 100% healthy...yeah. But if not? Forget it. And I would still draft a young QB if one of Burrows or Herbert is available even if we landed Cam Newton. Then there is no pressure for that QB to start right away on a rebuilding team.

I am not in the camp that the Redskins will take a QB.   

The fact we have won two games is in my opinion....incredible. Our roster is awful. Our OL and DL are by far the worst in football. We need to draft the trenches big time. But we still need to somehow land a franchise QB either in 2020 or 2021. 

 
SwampDawg said:
things couldn't have gone much worse this weekend if we wanted a franchise QB in this draft. Redskins lose what might have been the only winnable game left on their schedule, Haskins continues to not look like an NFL QB. Bengals continue to lose, Finely only throws for 115 yards. Even if the Dolphins somehow lose to them I don't see the Bengals winning any other games. So best case we pick third with two teams that need QB's in front of us and Tua no longer an option. Burrow and Herbert go 1 & 2, we get a stud in Chase Young who along with a couple good O-line picks will make us a solid 6 to 8 win team with Fitz or whatever journey man we get for the next several years. And just wait Tua will end up in New England, set and rehab behind Brady for a year and then take over and haunt us for the next 10 years.
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I don't think the Redskins are drafting a QB again after taking one in the top 10 last year.  The Rosen situation was an outlier and Herbert is no Murray.

 
SwampDawg said:
things couldn't have gone much worse this weekend if we wanted a franchise QB in this draft. Redskins lose what might have been the only winnable game left on their schedule, Haskins continues to not look like an NFL QB. Bengals continue to lose, Finely only throws for 115 yards. Even if the Dolphins somehow lose to them I don't see the Bengals winning any other games. So best case we pick third with two teams that need QB's in front of us and Tua no longer an option. Burrow and Herbert go 1 & 2, we get a stud in Chase Young who along with a couple good O-line picks will make us a solid 6 to 8 win team with Fitz or whatever journey man we get for the next several years. And just wait Tua will end up in New England, set and rehab behind Brady for a year and then take over and haunt us for the next 10 years.
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As a Bills fan, stuff like this will probably happen.  NE decides to trade down 47 times, accumulate more picks and end up with the next best thing.

 
Walton released while suspended. Guessing the only RB's back next year that have played this year are Laird and Gaskin and they have a combined 5 carries and 9 receptions on the season (all in the past two weeks).

 
FreeBaGeL said:
I don't think the Redskins are drafting a QB again after taking one in the top 10 last year.  The Rosen situation was an outlier and Herbert is no Murray.
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Not that it changes your argument really, but the Skins took Haskins at 16.

 
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SwampDawg said:
Walton released while suspended. Guessing the only RB's back next year that have played this year are Laird and Gaskin and they have a combined 5 carries and 9 receptions on the season (all in the past two weeks).
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We can overpay Melvin Gordon.  He will probably cost too much but will give us a legit RB for the next 3-4 years.  i think Ekeler is a free agent also but I bet they keep him.

 
So who is the RB to own in this backfield, aside from the obvious answer of "nobody"?  Ballage is really terrible.  Anyone taking a flyer on Patrick Laird?  Had 6 catches on 6 targets last week, but just 1 carry.  Maybe they give him a look though.  I think they know what they (dont) have in Ballage.

 
ChuckLiddell said:
So who is the RB to own in this backfield, aside from the obvious answer of "nobody"?  Ballage is really terrible.  Anyone taking a flyer on Patrick Laird?  Had 6 catches on 6 targets last week, but just 1 carry.  Maybe they give him a look though.  I think they know what they (dont) have in Ballage.
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Probably nobody. Laird look good in the preseason, albeit versus 2nd teamers.

 
I saw enough from Ballage in August.  Laird has more wiggle and vision IMO.  

Beat reporters and practice attendees have said that they keep waiting for the guy they saw in camp to emerge.  Maybe he's trying too hard?  Maybe this system isn't as good for him? I dunno... Last year take away that long run against Minn and he avgd 3.3 hard to believe he can't get to that mark. 

 
Cinci is 0-11, they would need to win a game before they play us, beat us and then we could go 2-14 and take the No 1 spot...we still might win a game or two. 

Miami 2-9...probably No 2 pick is as bad as we can do...or as good as we can do, not sure how to frame that. 

Washington 2-9 and they beat us

Atlanta 3-8

Arizona 3-7-1

Detroit 3-7-1

Denver 3-8

I would prefer Miami NOT leapfrog this bottom 4-5 teams and end up with the No 6 pick let's say, that would be a disaster IMO. 

-Pitt won again today, 6-5 now...Fitz trade is looking more like a MId 1st, not as good as I had hoped when Pitt was 0-3. 

 
Ministry of Pain said:
Cinci is 0-11, they would need to win a game before they play us, beat us and then we could go 2-14 and take the No 1 spot...we still might win a game or two. 

Miami 2-9...probably No 2 pick is as bad as we can do...or as good as we can do, not sure how to frame that. 

Washington 2-9 and they beat us

Atlanta 3-8

Arizona 3-7-1

Detroit 3-7-1

Denver 3-8

I would prefer Miami NOT leapfrog this bottom 4-5 teams and end up with the No 6 pick let's say, that would be a disaster IMO. 

-Pitt won again today, 6-5 now...Fitz trade is looking more like a MId 1st, not as good as I had hoped when Pitt was 0-3. 
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Pittsburgh is in big trouble the rest of the way.  The can easily lose 4 of their last 5. Like really easily. They were life or death to beat the Bengals. 

We will not win another game this season including the Bengals.

#1 or #2 overall collision course. 

 
Pitt's record looks miles better than they do, but Fitz looks like the real deal.  Shame Flores couldn't work it out with him

 
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