1.76 trillion dollars (1 Viewer)

[Shula-holic]

Do all kids have an equal opp at a good education? What if mom n dad are drug addicts in one form or another, is it the kids fault? Should we just make blanket statements about everyone's soul or just what works and makes us feel better about ourselves?


Trip, I like your posts because a lot of folks feel the same as you do. I waffle some but I feel like the working poor suffer as much as anyone. How can a 14 year old know what is best for them? A lot of folks go out and find themselves in their 20s and then go to school.

A) 95% of kids have the opportunity for a good enough education to get them ahead in life. Plenty of self made millionaires in this country come from middle class/even lower class neighborhoods

B) My comments have nothing to do about myself, and more to do about the well being of this country...socialism doesn't work and will drag this country down

C) "A lot of folks go out and find themselves in their 20s and then go to school."...great, I have no problem with this.

Total garbage and made up in your head. Come teach in a Title I school with me for a few days and your tune will change mightily.

I think a lot has to do with the parents. My wife taught in a low income area when she first graduated. The kids she taught had no structure at home, no role model. She did have a few who did make it out, but in those cases it was when they had at least one responsible parent. I don't know how we fix that. How do you fix a broken/irresponsible parental situation? It's not a matter of throwing money at it. Many of those kids could go to the best school in the area and it wouldn't help them because when they get home mom could be shooting up/in jail/getting beat up by her boyfriend.

 

[Johnnymac]

Who said anything about over the top? I'm simply asking you to define "living wage", which despite your "like I said", you still haven't done. It means very different things to different people, I might actually agree with you depending on your definition.

In Los Angeles I'd guess it's about $30,000 (~$15 an hour). In places with lower cost of living, about $20,000 (~$10 an hour).I'm also in favor of universal health care so that wouldn't be an expense in that wage.

IMO that's too much when you add in the "free" health care.I've said this before, but increasing the minimum wage shouldn't be the focus. It's a band-aid solution to a much larger problem.

Low income people are already getting free health care so it's really a non-issue.

Minimum wage is part of the solution because for too long the incentives have been in the wrong place. It's should never be a logical decision to not work and choose to live off welfare yet that's what we've created. There should be more incentives for becoming educated and incentives for showing up to work every day.

I don't think people choosing to live on welfare is anywhere close to the real problem.

 

[shadrap]

Again this is the Cuba/Russian, etc. utopia. It is not up to me to provide a #######g living for an employee. It is up to the worker to provide for himself. Doesn't like the damn job, then get another. Doesn't like that one then get two more jobs. Don't like those then get your #### fired & get food stamps. Socialism is a fine experiment that went terribly wrong. You may have some fine intentions but a poor grasp of history.

So those folks who didn't win the genetic lottery like you apparently did, and can only ever be skilled enough to push a broom or dig a ditch, but are wiling to do both, just get thrown aside and paid pennies on the dollar because some ######## company owner thinks that's all their effort is worth.

This is how you think a civilized society should treats its people?

Fenced a ranch with barbwire for three months. Pounded nails for 5 years. Dug a ditch for 6 months. Pounded nails for another 5 years including concrete work. I think I know what work ethic is all about.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

I think a lot has to do with the parents. My wife taught in a low income area when she first graduated. The kids she taught had no structure at home, no role model. She did have a few who did make it out, but in those cases it was when they had at least one responsible parent. I don't know how we fix that. How do you fix a broken/irresponsible parental situation? It's not a matter of throwing money at it. Many of those kids could go to the best school in the area and it wouldn't help them because when they get home mom could be shooting up/in jail/getting beat up by her boyfriend.
Great Post

 

[humpback]

Who said anything about over the top? I'm simply asking you to define "living wage", which despite your "like I said", you still haven't done. It means very different things to different people, I might actually agree with you depending on your definition.

In Los Angeles I'd guess it's about $30,000 (~$15 an hour). In places with lower cost of living, about $20,000 (~$10 an hour).

I'm also in favor of universal health care so that wouldn't be an expense in that wage.

IMO that's too much when you add in the "free" health care.

I've said this before, but increasing the minimum wage shouldn't be the focus. It's a band-aid solution to a much larger problem.

Low income people are already getting free health care so it's really a non-issue.

Minimum wage is part of the solution because for too long the incentives have been in the wrong place. It's should never be a logical decision to not work and choose to live off welfare yet that's what we've created. There should be more incentives for becoming educated and incentives for showing up to work every day.

Then it probably shouldn't be part of your definition of "living wage" if it's already free and a non-issue.

It isn't a logical decision to not work and choose to live off welfare, but I agree that the incentives are screwed up- leave it to lawmakers to at least make it seem like some people are better off not working. However, I think paying people more for these minimum wage jobs gives them less incentive to become more educated or acquire more valuable skills, which should be the priority. Focusing on the minimum wage is counterproductive IMO.

 

[TripItUp]

Do all kids have an equal opp at a good education? What if mom n dad are drug addicts in one form or another, is it the kids fault? Should we just make blanket statements about everyone's soul or just what works and makes us feel better about ourselves?


Trip, I like your posts because a lot of folks feel the same as you do. I waffle some but I feel like the working poor suffer as much as anyone. How can a 14 year old know what is best for them? A lot of folks go out and find themselves in their 20s and then go to school.

A) 95% of kids have the opportunity for a good enough education to get them ahead in life. Plenty of self made millionaires in this country come from middle class/even lower class neighborhoods

B) My comments have nothing to do about myself, and more to do about the well being of this country...socialism doesn't work and will drag this country down

C) "A lot of folks go out and find themselves in their 20s and then go to school."...great, I have no problem with this.

Total garbage and made up in your head. Come teach in a Title I school with me for a few days and your tune will change mightily.

Oh boy.

What percentage of the population do you think attends Title1 schools?

Let me help you out. 14.8 percent of the population is in poverty.

 

[Ministry of Pain]

Do all kids have an equal opp at a good education? What if mom n dad are drug addicts in one form or another, is it the kids fault? Should we just make blanket statements about everyone's soul or just what works and makes us feel better about ourselves?


Trip, I like your posts because a lot of folks feel the same as you do. I waffle some but I feel like the working poor suffer as much as anyone. How can a 14 year old know what is best for them? A lot of folks go out and find themselves in their 20s and then go to school.

A) 95% of kids have the opportunity for a good enough education to get them ahead in life. Plenty of self made millionaires in this country come from middle class/even lower class neighborhoods

B) My comments have nothing to do about myself, and more to do about the well being of this country...socialism doesn't work and will drag this country down

C) "A lot of folks go out and find themselves in their 20s and then go to school."...great, I have no problem with this.

Total garbage and made up in your head. Come teach in a Title I school with me for a few days and your tune will change mightily.

Oh boy.

What percentage of the population do you think attends Title1 schools?

Just out of curiosity.

Do you really think 95 out of 100 kids grows up in a great environment? Let;s look at the biggest 50 cities population wise and look at their school systems in these inner cities because they aren't good.

Now we can discuss why this is. I will be the first to tell you the teachers ARE part of the problem but there are lots of good teachers to balance this out.

It's easy for folks who don't deal with large quantities of kids to make blanket statements. Sincerely, I don't want to fight with you but I took a very personal approach which is bad in an internet forum. 95%...2 out of 3 marriages fail, that's 66% and a lot of them have kids before they throw in the towel on their marriage.

I was a B/C student in school and wasted my time when I could have been an A/B student like I was until about 9th/10th grade and stopped caring as much. I flunked/dropped out of college my first go around. I decided the fast path to sales and $$$ was better. I rocked until 2006/2007 when the mortgage crisis ensued and I watched friends wheeled out on stretchers at my offices. I went thru it in 1999 with the 125 loan crunch and then again in 2007 and I had enough at that time and realized that companies do not care about my well being.

I went back to school starting in LACC, didn't really think I would go much past a handful of film classes that I wanted to take advantage of LACC and use their equipment. Then I found myself back in Florida and at the Univ of Miami, finished my degree in my mid to late 30s. My parents told me I would never get a degree from the Univ of Miami, they were almost right.

I scraped and I clawed and I studied until 3 and 4 in the morning, worked a couple jobs that were well below my pay grade and abilities. But I never assume that others are going to find that fire and passion. Maybe I am a moron for even going back and trying to further my education. I doubt many would say that but you might find a few.

I met a lot of interesting folks from all walks of life, you can't assume some of the stuff you are posting. 50%, 60%...95%? I don't buy into that and if you spent a lot of time around folks making less than $30k-$50k a year I think your tune might change a little. Jut my opinion. But I thank you for not getting snarky and asking fro a little more clarity. I think you get my POV now. Doubt you will agree much with me and that's fine.

 

[bostonfred]

Lots of good debate about lazy poor people.

 

[TripItUp]

Lots of good debate about lazy poor people.

Let's start by understanding that a large percentage of the poor in this country had a chance to be not poor.

14.8 percent of the country is in poverty...and a decent percentage of that 14.8 percent didn't have to be...let's say half.

That means 92% of the country had a very good chance at the American Middle Class, which oh by the way, is better off than 99% of the world's population.

Just because you were born in this country, doesn't mean you deserve or are entitled to a damn thing.

 

[Ladsud]

On a global scale, its only going to get worse and worse. Humanity is an out of control virus

http://m.worldometers.info/world-population/

 

[TripItUp]

Do you really think 95 out of 100 kids grows up in a great environment? Let;s look at the biggest 50 cities population wise and look at their school systems in these inner cities because they aren't good.

Only 14.8% of the country is in poverty...let's deal with real statistics.

I was a B/C student in school and wasted my time when I could have been an A/B student like I was until about 9th/10th grade and stopped caring as much. I flunked/dropped out of college my first go around. I decided the fast path to sales and $$$ was better. I rocked until 2006/2007 when the mortgage crisis ensued and I watched friends wheeled out on stretchers at my offices. I went thru it in 1999 with the 125 loan crunch and then again in 2007 and I had enough at that time and realized that companies do not care about my well being.

There you go, you had a shot and you didn't take it. You took the easy route. While you were dicking around getting B/Cs...I stayed up til midnight 3 or 4 nights a week taking a full slate of AP courses preparing for college while working part time jobs to pay for my own clothes, sports equipment and lunch money.

I went back to school starting in LACC, didn't really think I would go much past a handful of film classes that I wanted to take advantage of LACC and use their equipment. Then I found myself back in Florida and at the Univ of Miami, finished my degree in my mid to late 30s. My parents told me I would never get a degree from the Univ of Miami, they were almost right. I scraped and I clawed and I studied until 3 and 4 in the morning, worked a couple jobs that were well below my pay grade and abilities. But I never assume that others are going to find that fire and passion. Maybe I am a moron for even going back and trying to further my education. I doubt many would say that but you might find a few.

Great, you took advantage of the opportunity, something that a large percentage of Americans don't do. Good for you.

I met a lot of interesting folks from all walks of life, you can't assume some of the stuff you are posting. 50%, 60%...95%? I don't buy into that and if you spent a lot of time around folks making less than $30k-$50k a year I think your tune might change a little. Jut my opinion. But I thank you for not getting snarky and asking fro a little more clarity. I think you get my POV now. Doubt you will agree much with me and that's fine.

I'm not "assuming" anything, I'm dealing with statistical certainties. I'm not getting "snarky" either, I'm breaking it down with some straightforward talk.

The lack of gratitude this country has for its opportunity is astonishing to me.

 

[Johnnymac]

Lots of good debate about lazy poor people.

Let's start by understanding that a large percentage of the poor in this country had a chance to be not poor.

14.8 percent of the country is in poverty...and a decent percentage of that 14.8 percent didn't have to be...let's say half.

That means 92% of the country had a very good chance at the American Middle Class, which oh by the way, is better off than 99% of the world's population.

Just because you were born in this country, doesn't mean you deserve or are entitled to a damn thing.

Not sure if middle class(whatever that means) is attainable for 92% of the population. That seems like a high number to me. I'm not even sure what is middle class anymore. Seems to me we are moving closer to a 2 class system, wealthy and poor.

 

[heropretend]

Lots of good debate about lazy poor people.

Let's start by understanding that a large percentage of the poor in this country had a chance to be not poor.

14.8 percent of the country is in poverty...and a decent percentage of that 14.8 percent didn't have to be...let's say half.

That means 92% of the country had a very good chance at the American Middle Class, which oh by the way, is better off than 99% of the world's population.

Just because you were born in this country, doesn't mean you deserve or are entitled to a damn thing.

Imagine a world without poors. Everyone works hard and saves and invests enough to own a house, car, and retire by 50. There are less workers, more retired people, and more money is held in low risk bonds and cds. No one spends enough of their income for economic growth. How does this world grow? Why does anyone invest?

I don't like the idea of welfare either. I don't like the wealth gap. But it works. Welfare and entitlements solve the problem of distribution of goods and services. Unfortunately the hard working middle class support the system. The real problem isn't your idea of fairness and entitlement, but how do we make the world safer, better and more livable and how do we take care of our inner circle.

Why you mad bro? The ability of the world to produce lazy entitled poors who spend everything is propping up your stock prices and lowering the cost of production of goods and services. The system makes your life better, keeps your family safe, and lifts the poors out of extreme poverty and starvation.

I think you absolutely can't have a suffering class who are willing to behead you for a bowl of rice and beans. I think you absolutely need people on welfare who save 0% and consume 100%. Who said life is fair??? Jesus I guess. Who gets to retire by 50? Some of us lucky working stiffs.

 

[heropretend]

Since no one has any answers:

1. Set the lowest tax rate to 0% on the first $15,000. Poors will spend it all immediately anyway.

2. Shift welfare spending to a universal basic income. But only do this after we see how it goes in Denmark.

3. Transparent and competitive market pricing on all health coverage open across states. We should know what's in a medical bill. Can't go universal health care cause every hypochondriac will abuse the system.

4. Have a 25% income tax rate on all income after 15,000.

5. 75% estate tax above $2 million. The current system leads to overcharging olds in the last years of their lives on health care and sucks capital out of the economy. Force horders of assets to pass along money to their younger heirs and charities while they are alive....its just dumb to leave the money in the pockets of the olds while they die.

6. Don't tax financial transactions because jesus, liquidity is important. No extra taxes on the rich.