***2015 San Diego Chargers - Offseason News, Notes, & Analysis*** (1 Viewer)

[BoltBacker]

I assume the team sees potential for him to grow into that role and improve with more experience.

Well I assume the team thought the same thing last season with Johnnie Troutman when they decided he was a starting G last year.

And Tyronne Green the year before.

And Jeromey Clary year after year after year after year.

I've found this blind hope for growth usually ends up with Rivers wearing a very dirty jersey and limping back to the huddle a lot.

You may be right, Watt may be a below average C and not a terrible C. I think the number 1 job of the front office this offseason is to give Rivers the best protection possible so that he's hopefully healthy by the end of the year and playing well in case they make the playoffs. Last year, even if SD would have made it to the playoffs Rivers was so banged up and playing poorly the second half of the season they would have little chance to win a playoff game. Really, the final game against KC was like a playoff game and I wasn't impressed by any growth from anyone on the OL in that game.

 

[Tau837]

Also, I really do not understand people projecting the Chargers to draft a WR. They just signed Johnson and Jones, so those guys are going to make the final roster. Obviously, Allen will make the final roster. Inman is cheap and flashed late last season, so I have to assume he will make it. They signed Pettis to a cheap contract this offseason, and I don't really expect him to make it, but it is at least possible. So that leaves Floyd, who has a fairly large cap number and will be 34 years old. Are people expecting Floyd to get cut? Wouldn't that be a bit unexpected? If he isn't going to get cut, he certainly isn't going to the bench with his cap number. So why would the Chargers draft a WR who would at best be their #4?

By NFL standards #4 WR can be a pretty significant role considering McCoy uses the slot receiver in such a prominent role. Three WR's are on the field much of the time.

Gates will be 35 at the start of the season and Floyd will be 34. I don't want to get into any more arguments as to whether athletes tend to experience a decline in their mid 30's... but some people don't find that a controversial statement and I'll just leave it at that.

Even without the age factor Floyd has a long history of health concerns as his 16 games last year was only his second full season of his career, the first one back in 2009. He's also a FA after this season and the smart teams develop replacements to learn the system BEFORE they have a desperate need. Don't get me wrong, I am a fan of Floyd and realize he's a target Rivers loves but at his salary he should be pushed to keep his roster spot, absolutely.

I like Pettis as well and hope he pushes for a roster spot but I think he's had a chance to show that his ceiling is limited. He's never been in a situation as good as this however and I have high hopes for him.

None of us really know much about Inman but that is the type of player than needs to be in a competition for a roster spot.

In a draft that is deep at WR I absolutely would like to see SD draft one in the 4th round or later, especially if a guy unexpected drops like Keenan Allen did. That's a big reason I'd like to see them move down in the draft. SEA for instance has 11 picks in the draft and their first pick isn't until pick 63. At one time I was hoping Perriman might be available at pick 48 and SEA would be interested in trading up for him but they hype train seems to really be rolling on him now. Perriman seems like a SEA type receiver though.

WR's I'd like to see SD target:

4th round

Dorsett is all over the place but I have seen one mock where he drops to pick #119. He would certainly be a guy that can be the speed compliment so many people in this thread want.

Hardy doesn't have the speed of a Dorsett but plays with quickness and has good hands. Reminds me a little bit of a younger Eddie Royal for a slot role and punt returner(Jones may only be in town for a year). Solid blocker. Just seems like a guy that fits the McCoy offense really well.

5th round

McBride is another speedster I've seen mocked to GB at pick #166 multiple places. Small school guy that could play a small role this year but pay big dividends later.

Lippett doesn't have elite speed but is a good route runner with good hands, height, and catch radius. More the type of guy that could step in and instantly contribute.

Mayle already has an NFL build and amazing productivity last year in big time conference.

6th round

Hill is a bit of a lottery ticket. If he returns to pre-ACL-injury form this is an absolute bargain. If not, he still might be a solid depth guy in the NFL. Low cost, possibly high reward pick imo.

Montgomery is a young Jacoby Jones. I see Jones as a one year rental so Montgomery could be a kick return specialist and an outside receiver.

Goodley is fast and physical. Another possible future kick returner. Might be a little bit of a project but has the tools to develop into a special slot player.

Diggs is another fast, returner type with good run after catch.

Devante Davis just seems like a Rivers guy. Big receiver with decent speed that is very physical and likes to fight for the ball. Doesn't create a lot of seperation besides decent speed but if has a QB willing to throw-him-open like Rivers I think he might surprise.

.... and lastly my favorite pet project receiver:

Waller has three numbers that raise your eyebrows. 6'6". 238. And 4.46???? Played in a run heavy system and would probably take years to develop into an NFL WR or move TE but what a piece of clay to start with. Some discipline issues. Nothing else to really like...... did I mention 6'6", 238, and 4.46? There's definitely a reason(or many) he is only drafted in the top 200 in ONE mock draft I've seen. Unless SD can trade down and pick up multiple picks they probably shouldn't take on a project like this that may never play an NFL down. But still....

How many WRs do you expect to make the final roster? They have returning starters Allen and Floyd and returning #4 Inman. They have theoretically marginally upgraded the #3 (Johnson > Royal) and #5 (Jones > Ajirotutu) spots. Pettis currently looks like a guy who won't make the roster. But if they use a draft pick on WR, then I expect one of the 6 (Allen, Floyd, Johnson, Inman, Jones, draft pick) will not make the final roster. As I mentioned previously, it seems that Allen, Johnson, and Jones are locks and Pettis is a long shot at best. So drafting WR really seems to mean cutting one of Floyd, Inman, or the draft pick.

If they want to cut Floyd -- a starter -- to save money at his position, I think that would be a justifiable decision. I wouldn't do it given his value, but I could see it as a valid decision. (Though the team hasn't really made the type of aggressive free agent moves that would seem to create the need for cap space that would drive a decision like that.)

But I do not see them drafting a WR in the 4th round who pushes Floyd off the roster (barring injury). So if they draft a WR in the 4th or later, it seems that means either Inman or the draft pick don't make the final roster. I just don't see the upside in making that move when the WR corps is good enough as is and there are so many other needs -- OL, DL, LB, RB.

All of this is predicated on them keeping 5 WRs on the final roster. If they keep 6, there is room for a draft pick, but it still implies carrying either the draft pick or Inman as the #5/#6, and I don't really see the value in doing that.

By the way, it is worth noting that they have a mostly unused talent in Green who actually provides a semblance of a backup plan for Gates and/or WR injuries. To me, that makes it even more likely the team would keep just 5 WRs.

 

[BoltBacker]

So, can we just condense all this down to "I think Inman is good enough as the #4 WR. I just do!"?

Yeah, we get it.

It's just like repeating Rivers will have no drop off by age 38. Repeating the same thing over and over again doesn't make it any more true.

 

[Tau837]

So, can we just condense all this down to "I think Inman is good enough as the #4 WR. I just do!"?

No. We can condense it down to my belief that drafting a WR to compete with Inman for the #4 spot is much further down the list of priorities than drafting OL, defensive front 7, and RB. To use a 4th round draft pick (or higher) on that would be GM malpractice.

Yeah, we get it.

It's just like repeating Rivers will have no drop off by age 38. Repeating the same thing over and over again doesn't make it any more true.

 

[Maurile Tremblay]

For draft purposes, IMO we can pretend that Inman and Pettis don't exist. Inman and Pettis aren't really all that different from the three or four other as-yet-unidentified free-agent WRs who will be in camp with some chance to make the team. There are guys like that at every position -- they are baseline players. But they are unlikely to be difference-makers.

When you draft a player, it is generally with the hope that he could be a difference-maker. In the later rounds, of course, it's far from a sure thing. It's actually kind of a low-probability event. Plenty of late-round draft picks are cut or are relegated to the practice squad and don't end up doing all that much. They become players like Inman or Pettis.

If there's a player sitting there in the fourth round or later that the team thinks is a potential difference-maker, it should never pass him up because "we already have Inman." Who cares about Inman? We already have baseline players at every position, but we nonetheless have to draft someone.

I'm fine with saying that WR isn't especially a position of need. But when you get to the the fourth round or later, I don't think need matters all that much. I'd go after players with the best potential to be difference-makers, and I don't really care what position they play.

 

[Tau837]

For draft purposes, IMO we can pretend that Inman and Pettis don't exist. Inman and Pettis aren't really all that different from the three or four other as-yet-unidentified free-agent WRs who will be in camp with some chance to make the team. There are guys like that at every position -- they are baseline players. But they are unlikely to be difference-makers.

When you draft a player, it is generally with the hope that he could be a difference-maker. In the later rounds, of course, it's far from a sure thing. It's actually kind of a low-probability event. Plenty of late-round draft picks are cut or are relegated to the practice squad and don't end up doing all that much. They become players like Inman or Pettis.

If there's a player sitting there in the fourth round or later that the team thinks is a potential difference-maker, it should never pass him up because "we already have Inman." Who cares about Inman? We already have baseline players at every position, but we nonetheless have to draft someone.

I'm fine with saying that WR isn't especially a position of need. But when you get to the the fourth round or later, I don't think need matters all that much. I'd go after players with the best potential to be difference-makers, and I don't really care what position they play.

The way the discussion evolved was that a WR drafted in the 4th round or later might beat out Inman for the #4 WR spot. Drafting someone who ends up as the #4 WR doesn't strike me as drafting a difference maker, but I suppose it is conceivable that he could be #4 as a rookie and become a difference maker in later years.

I agree that in the 4th and later it is important to draft value. I will reframe my position. If there is a compelling value at WR and there is not similarly compelling value at the other positions of greater need, it is reasonable to draft a WR. I just don't see that situation as being very likely.

FWIW, in the past 10 drafts, there have been 184 WRs drafted in the 4th round or later. 5 of them fit my view of difference maker: Antonio Brown, Colston, Marshall, Garcon, Steve Johnson. I agree if a player that good is available, he is well worth the pick, but the hit rate is very low.

ETA: I realize the hit rate is low at all positions in the 4th and later, I just think it is likely higher for at least some of the positions of greater current need to the Chargers.

 

[BoltBacker]

I think JWB does bring up an interesting point in terms of areas of greatest need. I would like to hear the opinions of all the usual suspects in the thread. For my list I'm looking at about a two/three year window because I think that's a conservative window they will have Rivers playing at a relatively high level. They have 6 picks but let's make a list of top 10 needs(there are plenty more than 10 I realize).

BIGGEST NEEDS after FA(sounds like they are pretty much done in FA):

1) OG(Wiggins/Troutman) - These guys should be struggling to stay in the league let alone starting. The fact they endanger Rivers makes it twice as important to get a replacement, although it doesn't have to be a G to bolster the position.

2) NT(Lissemore/Carrethers) - Lissermore wouldn't be a bad backup but shouldn't start. I don't think Carrethers was the run-stuffer they were hoping for and should be fighting for a roster spot.

3) C(Watt/?) - JWB claims PFF rates Watt as the 20th center in the NFL, I would rate him somewhere in the 20's... out of 32 teams. There is no backup at the moment(I would say Watt is a backup) and like G this is a potential position that could get Rivers injured. Again. This position is the single biggest reason SD missed the playoffs last year imo. Simply plugging in one of they guys from last year makes no sense to me.

4) S(Addae/Wilson) - I like the versatility of Wilson but are either of these guys really a starter? Doesn't seem like it would take much to bring in a guy to challenge for the starting position.

5) DE(Reyes/Mathews/Unrein) - All look like NFL backups to me. The fact Liuget may be gone at the end of the year makes it an even greater area of need.

6) RB(Woodhead/Brown/Oliver) - Woodhead will be the passing down back no matter what they do. That accounts for almost half the RB snaps right there. Of the other half no matter who gets drafted I would expect Brown/Oliver to get some carries. All these people projecting a RB in the first two rounds for SD don't take into account they are talking about a guy that will likely get 35-50% of the snaps at RB even if they waste a 1st rounder on a RB. The improvements on the OL will probably do more to improve the running game more than they guy they draft.

7) WR(Floyd/Inman/Pettis) - I've been a big fan of Floyd for a long time but 34yo, last year of his contract, and injury history makes me think they need to start grooming his replacement if at all possible. Allen/Johnson are solid WR's but it's an offense that has three WR's on the field most of the time.

8) OLB(Attouchu/Williams) - You have to hope Attouchu is worth the 2nd+4th they spent to get him because they need a starter across from Ingram.

9) CB(Verrett/Robinson/Williams/Davis) - Flowers should be solid on one side but with nickel defenses on the field all the time in the NFL you really need 3 starting quality CB's. Verrett looked great... while on the field. Robinson has been up and down and is only on a one year deal. Davis/Williams should probably be battling to simply stay on the team. With the price of FA CB's you almost have to draft one every year and try to develop the eventual replacement for Robinson/Flowers.

10) ILB(Butler/Conner) - What if Butler never returns to his former self? The salary cap implications of parting ways are dire, but at some point you have to think about drafting a guy to at least compete with him for playing time.

So what are the teams top ten needs to you guys? JWB, 'Gunz, MT, Groovus, BSS, and the rest..... let's hear your list of needs before we come up with a list of possible guys as possible draft targets in different rounds.

 

[Tau837]

I would be surprised if the team is done in free agency. They still have $18M available under the 2015 cap, after accounting for dead money and rookies. Don't we expect them to do something with that money? That's one reason I have been frustrated that the team hasn't done more already.

I can't really list 10 ordered needs. I don't think they truly have that many, and IMO it isn't reasonable to think they can address that many, anyway. To me, there are some very specific holes that need to be addressed. In order:

1. NT

2. OL #1 - Can be C, G, or T as has already been discussed in this thread.

3. OLB #1 - Freeney (590), Johnson (556), and Walker (90) played a combined 1236 snaps last season and are no longer on the roster. The remaining OLBs -- Ingram, Attouchu, Williams, Law -- played a combined 902 snaps. it seems foolish to count on that group to absorb another 1200 snaps. On top of that, Freeney and Johnson were easily the best two performers of the group, so there is a void in both snaps and performance.

4. RB - With only 3 RBs on the roster, and having just had a season in which 3 RBs missed games due to injuries, they obviously need another RB. And, with one of the current 3 RBs being Donald Brown, who ideally shouldn't see many snaps, and another being Woodhead, who isn't suited for a heavy rushing workload, they need a RB who can handle 200+ rushing attempts and perform well in doing it. I do not think they should draft a RB early. I'd rather see them sign a vet like Ridley and skip this position in the draft, but there are no signs that Telesco is interested in doing that.

5. ILB - Teo played well last year, but in just 465 snaps. Gachkar and Walker were the Chargers' next best ILBs last year, albeit on limited snaps, and are gone. Conner was a solid run defender but pretty bad in coverage. Butler was a complete disaster for the second year in a row. I'm sure the team plans to start Butler and Teo, but they have to add at least one ILB for depth and it needs to be someone good enough to step in and play for Butler, who should be benched if his awful play continues.

6. OL #2 - Specific position probably determined by position of the first OL and/or by BPA in the draft. I was tempted to rank this higher, but adding a second OL means adding a bench player or pushing Watt to the bench, and I think it is more important to add guys who will play a lot of snaps.

7. OLB #2 - See above. I expect the team will disagree here, expecting Attouchu to step up this year.

I know the Chargers could stand to improve in areas other than those above, but IMO there is a huge gap in need between those above and anything else.

I have already made my position clear on WR. I think they are fine to stand pat there, especially since they should consider giving Green some more routes. If they want to add a WR, IMO they should add a top 3 caliber WR for this year and cut Floyd. The problem is, I don't think they can do that without using one of their early draft picks, all of which need to be spent on the needs above. So I think they should pass on this position in the draft.

As for DE, I think the group they have can be good enough if they solve the NT and OLB needs effectively. I do think they should cut Reyes, who has been awful the past two seasons; that move would save just under $1M in cap space, and would amount to addition by subtraction in terms of performance at the position. I'd be surprised if the team cut him, though, so I assume he will stick. Liuget is not particularly good against the run but is good overall. Mathews played very well last season and should be given more snaps. If they get a NT who would start over Lissemore and Unrein, then both of them can take snaps at DE. Lissemore has been effective there in the past. If they keep Reyes, they should reduce his snaps and give them to the others mentioned, particularly Mathews. Either way, this position is pretty low priority IMO.

As for S, I think they clearly added Wilson to replace Gilchrist, and there is every reason to believe he can be more effective. Addae and Stuckey are good enough for depth IMO. Could this position be better? Of course, but it isn't a true need at this point.

As for CB, I don't see it as a need now. They have clear starters in Flowers and Verrett who should be very good. They replaced Wright with Robinson, which should be an upgrade. Steve Williams only played 130 snaps last season but played well, and should be a solid depth guy if he can stay healthy. Chris Davis could be an okay depth guy. Wilson can play CB if needed. No doubt there is some risk that this group could falter if Flowers and/or Verrett miss significant time, but I just can't see prioritizing this above the needs on my list. If they make a move here, I think it should be to add a veteran, if possible, to replace Davis, since Jones theoretically eliminates some of Davis's value, which was as a returner.

So I would like to see the 51 man roster like this:

QB - Rivers, Clemens (Sorensen emergency)

OL - Dunlap, Franklin, Fluker, Watt, OL#1, OL#2, Troutman, Robinson (Sirles out, or possibly Robinson, if OL#1 or OL#2 is a C)

TE - Gates, Green, Phillips

WR - Allen, Floyd, Johnson, Inman, Jones (Pettis out)

RB - RB#1, Woodhead, Oliver, Brown

FB - Johnson

NT/DT - NT#1, Lissemore, Unrein, Carrethers (Palepoi out)

DE - Liuget, Mathews, Reyes (Square out if Reyes stays)

OLB - Ingram, Attouchu, OLB#1, OLB#2, Law (Tourek Williams out if the team brings in 2 OLBs, in if they only bring in one)

ILB - Teo, Butler, Conner, ILB#1

CB - Flowers, Verrett, Robinson, Williams, Davis

S - Weddle, Wilson, Addae, Stuckey

K - Novak

P - Scifres

LS - Windt

I don't think you can assume the 5th and 6th round picks make the team. But if the top 4 picks slot into 4 of my 7 need positions in the roster, then that means Telesco can use the remaining cap money to sign veteran free agents to fill the other three.

I also wouldn't mind seeing him cut Troutman and sign a 4th veteran free agent to replace him. Earlier in the thread, there were some bargain free agent OL mentioned. Cutting Troutman would save $1.5M in cap space. I don't expect Telesco to do this, though.

So my take is pretty different from BB's. We have similar views on NT, OL, RB, but our views are very different on the rest.

Thoughts?

 

[BoltBacker]

So my take is pretty different from BB's.

I think we have a lot of similar views. I actually agree with you in regards to Reyes at DE but I just don't think this is the draft that has the players to address it. I will admit most people seem to share your view in terms of OLB. I thought I was the biggest critic of the Attaouchu trade last year but there must be a lot of closet doubters. I still don't see the rigid line of deliniation between the 4th and 5th round of the draft.

Of the things we strongly agree on DL seems to top the list. What are some of the players you'd like to see SD target? Here is my list....

1st ROUND

Shelton(NT) - As I've said since the season ended, but lately there have been mocks showing him slipping to #17.

Goldman(NT/DE) - Tough to say if he's a true NT in a 3-4 despite his size. Might be DE on running downs and NT on passing downs.

2nd ROUND

Armstead(DE) - Assuming Goldman wasn't drafted in the first round. Doubtful he falls this far.

- elite OT candidates - Flowers, Humphries, Peat, Collins, Clemmings, Fisher

Phillips(NT) - Assuming no DL in the first round, a lot of variance in his projected pick.

3rd ROUND

Davis(DE/NT) - A lot of talent but attitude concerns and didn't dominate his senior season like people expected. Kind of a boom/bust pick.

4th ROUND

Anderson(DE) - Would probably beat out Reyes for starter by week 1.

6th ROUND

McCarthy(NT) - Disappointment in college but imo in the 6th you are looking for upside and he could definitely challenge for a rotational spot at NT. Might even start if no other DL were added.

I don't think there are a lot of guys in this draft to help the DL. What are some of the DLman other Charger fans would like to see the team target in the draft?

 

[Tau837]

^IMO it would be a perfect start to the draft to get Shelton in the 1st and one of the OTs you listed in the 2nd. I think it would be criminal not to take Shelton if he is there, barring other unforeseen developments.

 

[BoltBacker]

I thought there was no chance for Shelton back when 90+% of mocks had him going to CHI at pick 7, but he isn't being mocked there often anymore. FA has also helped a ton as WAS picked up Knighton, MIA signs Suh, HOU signs Wilork. Suddenly the list of potential teams taking him ahead of SD has dwindled.... CLE is probably the biggest obstacle.

If Shelton is gone I see it as a 3 player decision assuming Scherff is also gone. Dupree might be there with the most upside and is a physical freak, although I don't see OLB as the big need everyone else does. Both Erving and Goldman are reaches but fill big needs and would both start immediately and make a huge difference.

 

[cstu]

I thought there was no chance for Shelton back when 90+% of mocks had him going to CHI at pick 7, but he isn't being mocked there often anymore. FA has also helped a ton as WAS picked up Knighton, MIA signs Suh, HOU signs Wilork. Suddenly the list of potential teams taking him ahead of SD has dwindled.... CLE is probably the biggest obstacle.

If Shelton is gone I see it as a 3 player decision assuming Scherff is also gone. Dupree might be there with the most upside and is a physical freak, although I don't see OLB as the big need everyone else does. Both Erving and Goldman are reaches but fill big needs and would both start immediately and make a huge difference.

What don't you like about Erving?

In 6 full games of pass protection at center, he was only beat 6 times, gave up 2 QB hits, and allowed zero sacks.

 

[BoltBacker]

What don't you like about Erving?

Oh, I do like Erving very much.Since the season ended I've been saying SD should:

- Draft Shelton or Scherff if they somehow fall to pick #17, but until recently that seemed pretty unrealistic.

- If those two guys aren't there trade down because they have so many needs they can easily get a guy that fills a need.

- If they can't trade down, I would still draft Erving. Dupree has the physical traits to be absolutely dominant in the NFL but I guess I am one of the few people that hasn't written Attaouchu off as a bust just yet, though I complained about the trade more than anyone else I can remember. Goldman has great size and is very talented but I'm not sure if he's the perfect fit for a 3-4, but he's the only other DL I would consider in the first round. Honestly, I would even consider Collins at S but I'm sure I'd hear criticism that he doesn't fit in the SD defense. As MT wrote earlier, the SS position in the SD defense isn't much different than the FS. I would counter by pointing out SD tends to play CB's at SS, and then they have a 7th rounder(Lissemore) and 5th rounder(Carrethers) playing as their NT's. At the end of the season people scratch their head and wonder, "I wonder why we give up 4.5yards/attempt rushing?!".

Anyway, that's a long winded answer why I like Erving and would draft him because I dare anyone to go back and watch the 2014 season and come away thinking, "yeah, Watt and Robinson pretty much have that position under control". Center is a position that isn't drafted high all that often, and you can get guys at C fairly inexpensively in the FA market but Telesco seems disinterested thus far. For instance Will Montgomery recently signed with the Bears. Experienced playing both C and G. He'll count $665,000 against the cap. And the beat goes on. The beat goes on. I'm sure I'll throw something when I hear the contract Brian DeLaPuenta signs.

 

[Tau837]

Telesco has made it clear that he plans to build through the draft and rely upon growth of young players. I would be very surprised if he acquires sufficient OL talent that Watt is on the bench. Watt actually played okay at center last season, especially given he had no prior experience at the position.

There is a case to be made that Telesco would be justified in expecting Watt to start and center and play well enough that he can divert his attention to other positions. I think reasonable people can disagree with that, but Telesco is the guy in charge, and I expect Watt to start at center.

 

[BoltBacker]

I think reasonable people can disagree with that, but Telesco is the guy in charge, and I expect Watt to start at center.

... but Telesco was also the guy in charge when he decided Troutman was a starting quality OG in the NFL last year, right? I have no opinion whether Telesco thinks Watt is an NFL caliber starting C. Or who he thinks is an NFL starting caliber NT. Or SS. His assessment in those cases have been suspect to say the least so no, I wouldn't be shocked if he thought C was a position of strength last year and expecting similar production from the same guys makes a lot of sense.

Since he wants to build through the draft let's cross our fingers and hope he can only spend three of his top four picks to somehow find a starting OLB, since he proved last year that two of his top four picks aren't enough to find a starting OLB. lol

 

[BoltBacker]

Bleacher Report had an interesting article about a day ago giving approximate salaries of the top remaining FA. I would love to put a link to it here but Bleacher Report wins the award for best NFL content that can't be accessed by the absolute worst website on the web, so they don't get a link I guess. Or in Bleacher Reports style.... WORST<next slide>, WEBSITE<next slide>, ON<next slide>, THE<next slide>, corner popup"want to follow something you have no interest in?", WEB<next slide>.

Sorry, it drives me crazy. Anyway I was surprised that they project Wisniewski to sign for just over $1mil/yr, Brandon Spikes for $1mil/yr, and Barksdale for $1mil/yr.

It got me to wondering just how many starting positions could SD sign a starter for a short term $1mil/season contract and go into the draft able to simply take the best player available and not have to throw rookies into the starting lineup until they were ready.

RB Jackson

C Wisniewski

RT Barksdale

DE Red Bryant

ILB Spikes

OLB Briggs

S Pollard

I'm not saying these guys would all start for the entire season, but worst case scenario they would provide better depth than players already on the roster. In particular Bryant/Spikes/Briggs/Pollard would improve the run defense on early downs even if they were only part time players.

 

[BoltBacker]

I was hoping we could get some more talk generated in regards to specific players targeted in different rounds of the upcoming draft. Here who I have at RB for instance:

3rd ROUND

Ajayi

Duke Johnson

Abdullah

4th ROUND

Coleman

Yeldon

5th ROUND

Davis

Cobb

David Johnson

Allen

Langford

6th ROUND

Malcolm Brown

Artis-Payne

Robinson

UFA

Jones

Crockett

Karlos Williams

Hilliard

MaGee

Dominique Brown

Dyer

Zenner

Agnew

As you can tell, I'm willing to waite on running back longer than almost anyone. In fact, I think people forget that Brandon Oliver was an UFA in a worse RB class than this. It wouldn't surprise me at all if a UFA or two could take either his place or Donald Brown(because of salary reasons) on the roster.

Let's hope Acee is wrong about this.....

https://twitter.com/PFTonNBCSN/status/585564228095971328

 

[BoltBacker]

I would be interested to see the 6 players SD would end up with in a mock draft or two. Hopefully cstu, JWB and the rest will give us at least one result...

http://fanspeak.com/ontheclock/

... and also mention which "Big Board" you chose to use. If you use some of the smaller ones you can get some pretty crazy results.

 

[B Maverick]

I would be interested to see the 6 players SD would end up with in a mock draft or two. Hopefully cstu, JWB and the rest will give us at least one result...

http://fanspeak.com/ontheclock/

... and also mention which "Big Board" you chose to use. If you use some of the smaller ones you can get some pretty crazy results.

That was fun. Admittedly I do not know much about most of the players outside some skill guys, but here is what I had in a 7 rd using Matt Millers board:

17: R1P17 DT DANNY SHELTON, WASHINGTON
48: R2P16 RB MELVIN GORDON WISCONSIN
83: R3P19 G TRE' JACKSON FLORIDA STATE
117: R4P18 OT DONOVAN SMITH PENN STATE
153: R5P17 S CODY PREWITT OLE MISS
192: R6P16 QB SEAN MANNION OREGON STATE
I wasn't looking at RB at 48 but if Gordon fell that far would be hard to pass on.

Did another using a different board:

17: R1P17 OT JAKE FISHER OREGON
48: R2P16 S ERIC ROWE UTAH
83: R3P19 RB TEVIN COLEMAN INDIANA
117: R4P18 WR DORIAL GREEN-BECKHAM OKLAHOMA
153: R5P17 DT CHRISTIAN COVINGTON RICE
192: R6P16 G JAMON BROWN LOUISVILLE

DGB in the 4th seemed like a decent risk.

 

[Tau837]

I would be interested to see the 6 players SD would end up with in a mock draft or two. Hopefully cstu, JWB and the rest will give us at least one result...

http://fanspeak.com/ontheclock/

... and also mention which "Big Board" you chose to use. If you use some of the smaller ones you can get some pretty crazy results.

That was fun. Admittedly I do not know much about most of the players outside some skill guys, but here is what I had in a 7 rd using Matt Millers board:



17: R1P17 DT DANNY SHELTON, WASHINGTON

48: R2P16 RB MELVIN GORDON WISCONSIN

83: R3P19 G TRE' JACKSON FLORIDA STATE

117: R4P18 OT DONOVAN SMITH PENN STATE

153: R5P17 S CODY PREWITT OLE MISS

192: R6P16 QB SEAN MANNION OREGON STATE

I wasn't looking at RB at 48 but if Gordon fell that far would be hard to pass on.

Would love Shelton at 17. I don't really want a RB early but would be fine with Gordon at 48. Assuming Jackson is a projected starter, I'm good with that pick, though I'd be happier with an OT who could push Fluker to RG. I wouldn't be thrilled with a second OL in the 4th but I could live with it.

I wouldn't be thrilled with a S in the 5th, as I think the group on the roster is good enough and the odds of improving it in the 5th round are low. Rather than filling a hole, the likely best case for this pick would be to bump Stuckey off the roster as the #4 safety.

I absolutely disagree with taking a QB anywhere. They already have two backup QBs and a 6th rounder is unlikely to make the team. Meanwhile, the team still has a big problem at LB which is unaddressed. I realize that no 6th round pick is likely to make a big impact, but IMO it should at least be a player at a position of need and who can play special teams.

 

[BoltBacker]

I really like Donovan Smith at pick #117 and he seems like a Charger OT. The OT's that are projected to be available between picks 48-117 has really turned me around on drafting an OT in the first round.

Which big board did you use? I'd be willing to bet I like your draft more than whatever Telesco comes up with.

 

[BoltBacker]

I absolutely disagree with taking a QB anywhere. They already have two backup QBs and a 6th rounder is unlikely to make the team. Meanwhile, the team still has a big problem at LB which is unaddressed.

The pick I liked least was Mannion as well, but he wasn't a bad value where Mav took him. Most are expecting Brandon Bridge to go undrafted and I wouldn't be against bringing him in as a developmental, practice-squad type guy. I think he has a better chance of ever being an NFL starter than Sorenson. Bridge may never amount to anything but he has a lot of tools you can't teach, so if you can teach him some of the rest you never know.

 

[B Maverick]

I did that with the Matt Miller board. I appreciate the comments and surprised some of the picks are liked as admittedly I dont know much about any of them (outside skill guys).

I dont want a RB early either but getting what seems to be a possible 1st rounder at 48 I think would be too much to pass on.

 

[Gr00vus]

I don't have specific names in mind, but in order of preference position wise I'd say: NT/DT, T, G, C

After that I'm not sure. It'd be nice to have another pass rusher. Maybe S. They have got to get a stud NT if they're going to stick with the 3-4.

After seeing which teams seem to win consistently over the last 10 to 15 years, it seems like a full complement of top tier skill guys on offense isn't that big a deal. You need an elite QB, one top skill guy (could be a TE, an RB or a WR) who demands the defense's focus and then role guys who can succeed in your particular offensive system. So I'm not big on drafting many guys like that early. That said I don't think the Chargers have that guy on the roster right now, but the other stuff is more important, so I think they can get by with Rivers and what they have at the skill position right now.

 

[massraider]

Chris Mortensen on ESPN talking about Rivers having no plans to re-sign with SD,and mentions the idea of San Diego going up for Mariota, and trading Rivers in the deal.

 

[BoltBacker]

Chris Mortensen on ESPN talking about Rivers having no plans to re-sign with SD,and mentions the idea of San Diego going up for Mariota, and trading Rivers in the deal.

They would just franchise tag him.

I would be more worried about Rivers entertaining the idea of retirement if he gets beat up this year as badly as he did last year.

Of course I don't think anyone is untradeable, but I would guess it would take a lot more than Mariota to land Rivers. I would have rather had Bridgewater last year than Mariota this year.

 

[BoltBacker]

Groovus, what round of the draft would you start targeting RB?

 

[cstu]

Hey Chargers fans, do you want to hate Beathard some more?

Ryan Leaf didn't want to play for the Colts and concocted a plan to skip his combine meeting with Irsay.

Beathard went along with it and thought nothing of the character of a guy who would want to do this.

Leaf should have been taken off the Chargers board right then.

“If you go to the combine,” I told Ryan, “but fail to show up for a meeting with Mora, that should do it. Jim is a real prideful person who has a tendency to explode. I am not recommending you do this, but if you are desperate to go to San Diego, this is the way.”

Ryan approved, but I first cleared the idea with Chargers general manager Bobby Beathard, lest San Diego also question my client’s reliability. Beathard went along with the ruse. If he’d had a problem, Ryan would’ve shown up for his meeting with Mora.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/01/how-ryan-leaf-convinced-the-colts-to-draft-peyton-manning

 

[B Maverick]

Hey Chargers fans, do you want to hate Beathard some more?

Ryan Leaf didn't want to play for the Colts and concocted a plan to skip his combine meeting with Irsay.

Beathard went along with it and thought nothing of the character of a guy who would want to do this.

Leaf should have been taken off the Chargers board right then.

“If you go to the combine,” I told Ryan, “but fail to show up for a meeting with Mora, that should do it. Jim is a real prideful person who has a tendency to explode. I am not recommending you do this, but if you are desperate to go to San Diego, this is the way.”

Ryan approved, but I first cleared the idea with Chargers general manager Bobby Beathard, lest San Diego also question my client’s reliability. Beathard went along with the ruse. If he’d had a problem, Ryan would’ve shown up for his meeting with Mora.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/01/how-ryan-leaf-convinced-the-colts-to-draft-peyton-manning

What am I missing here? Sounds to me like the agent came up with the plan, Ryan liked it since he wanted to be in SD and Beathard was happy to get his man.

This seems to be more an indictment of Steinberg and to a lesser extent, Beathard but not really Leaf.

 

[BoltBacker]

I appreciate the comments and surprised some of the picks are liked as admittedly I dont know much about any of them (outside skill guys).

Cody Prewitt is an interesting prospect, some places I see 2nd round other places I see as low as the 6th round. Personally, I am convinced that SD could draft a starting RB in the 6th of this years draft(and maybe even an UFA) and draft a starting S in the 5th because I'm not convinced Addae should be on an NFL roster and nobody knows if Wilson will be able to play S for a season. Here are my thoughts on S:

2nd ROUND

Collins

3rd ROUND

Rowe

4th ROUND

Tartt

Sample

Drummond

Amos

Holliman

5th ROUND

Eskridge

Geathers

Cambell

6th ROUND

Harris

Prewitt

Cox

Jarrett

UFA

Carter

Jefferson

Richards

I would also remind people that Weddle is in the last year of his contract, counting over $10mil against the cap. I have always been a huge fan of Weddle but that is a lot of money for a S and it's anyone's guess what he'll be asking for in his next contract. Since Weddle is the only starting quality S on the roster it makes sense to draft one and bring in another as an UFA imo. Unless, of course, Charger fans are comfortable with the possibility of Wilson and Stuckey being the only S's on the roster at the end of this season. The position of safety should definitely be considered a priority in this draft.

 

[BoltBacker]

Hey Chargers fans, do you want to hate Beathard some more?

This is nothing. The whole Wimpy act, "I'll gladly give you a 1st rounder next year, for a 2nd rounder today" approach to the draft was enough to make me hate Beathard.

If Leaf didn't want to play for INDY, or Eli didn't want to play for SD, or the rest..... meh, I would rather they just be upfront and let the franchise know before the draft. There are places/companies in the U.S. I would not work for ANY amount of $ because I think I'd be miserable and I can certainly understand other people that feel the same way.

 

[cstu]

Hey Chargers fans, do you want to hate Beathard some more?

Ryan Leaf didn't want to play for the Colts and concocted a plan to skip his combine meeting with Irsay.

Beathard went along with it and thought nothing of the character of a guy who would want to do this.

Leaf should have been taken off the Chargers board right then.

“If you go to the combine,” I told Ryan, “but fail to show up for a meeting with Mora, that should do it. Jim is a real prideful person who has a tendency to explode. I am not recommending you do this, but if you are desperate to go to San Diego, this is the way.”

Ryan approved, but I first cleared the idea with Chargers general manager Bobby Beathard, lest San Diego also question my client’s reliability. Beathard went along with the ruse. If he’d had a problem, Ryan would’ve shown up for his meeting with Mora.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/01/how-ryan-leaf-convinced-the-colts-to-draft-peyton-manning

What am I missing here? Sounds to me like the agent came up with the plan, Ryan liked it since he wanted to be in SD and Beathard was happy to get his man.

This seems to be more an indictment of Steinberg and to a lesser extent, Beathard but not really Leaf.

Scheduling a meeting when you're planning to cancel shows lack of character. If he didn't want to play for the Colts then either tell them that or don't schedule a meeting. Even if it was Steinberg's plan anyone with character would have said 'no, that's not the right thing to do'.

 

[cstu]

Hey Chargers fans, do you want to hate Beathard some more?

This is nothing. The whole Wimpy act, "I'll gladly give you a 1st rounder next year, for a 2nd rounder today" approach to the draft was enough to make me hate Beathard.

If Leaf didn't want to play for INDY, or Eli didn't want to play for SD, or the rest..... meh, I would rather they just be upfront and let the franchise know before the draft. There are places/companies in the U.S. I would not work for ANY amount of $ because I think I'd be miserable and I can certainly understand other people that feel the same way.

Eli told the Chargers through his agent that he didn't want to play for them.

Using your work example, it would be like you accepting a job and then being afraid to tell the company you changed your mind. Instead you go to the company you want to work for and tell the boss that you aren't going to tell the other job you're quitting and just not show up and wait for them to fire you. No boss in his right mind is going to trust you if you pulled a stunt like that. Beathard should have been appalled at the idea.

 

[B Maverick]

Hey Chargers fans, do you want to hate Beathard some more?

Ryan Leaf didn't want to play for the Colts and concocted a plan to skip his combine meeting with Irsay.

Beathard went along with it and thought nothing of the character of a guy who would want to do this.

Leaf should have been taken off the Chargers board right then.

“If you go to the combine,” I told Ryan, “but fail to show up for a meeting with Mora, that should do it. Jim is a real prideful person who has a tendency to explode. I am not recommending you do this, but if you are desperate to go to San Diego, this is the way.”

Ryan approved, but I first cleared the idea with Chargers general manager Bobby Beathard, lest San Diego also question my client’s reliability. Beathard went along with the ruse. If he’d had a problem, Ryan would’ve shown up for his meeting with Mora.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/01/how-ryan-leaf-convinced-the-colts-to-draft-peyton-manning

What am I missing here? Sounds to me like the agent came up with the plan, Ryan liked it since he wanted to be in SD and Beathard was happy to get his man.

This seems to be more an indictment of Steinberg and to a lesser extent, Beathard but not really Leaf.

Scheduling a meeting when you're planning to cancel shows lack of character. If he didn't want to play for the Colts then either tell them that or don't schedule a meeting. Even if it was Steinberg's plan anyone with character would have said 'no, that's not the right thing to do'.

Any 20 year old kid with or without good character could have been led astray as described in this article. His agent comes up with the plan and floats it past a GM who is ok with it. As a kid getting advice from 2 people in power and should be respected in their fields, you think he is going to say no? I think very few would have gone against his agents plan as backed by the gm of the team he wants to play for. As it says in the article if Beathard wouldnt have been on board Leaf would have gone to the meeting with Mora and this becomes a moot point.

In the context of Ryan Leaf this all looks like more character issues. In the context of another player it looks like a kid being misled by his agent and a GM.

 

[Marauder]

So, we're saying Ryan Leaf had character issues? Shocking news.

 

[BoltBacker]

So, we're saying Ryan Leaf had character issues? Shocking news.

Agreed.

Now.... can we all agree SD needs a S? And if so who?

 

[bicycle_seat_sniffer]

Hey Chargers fans, do you want to hate Beathard some more?

Ryan Leaf didn't want to play for the Colts and concocted a plan to skip his combine meeting with Irsay.

Beathard went along with it and thought nothing of the character of a guy who would want to do this.

Leaf should have been taken off the Chargers board right then.

“If you go to the combine,” I told Ryan, “but fail to show up for a meeting with Mora, that should do it. Jim is a real prideful person who has a tendency to explode. I am not recommending you do this, but if you are desperate to go to San Diego, this is the way.”

Ryan approved, but I first cleared the idea with Chargers general manager Bobby Beathard, lest San Diego also question my client’s reliability. Beathard went along with the ruse. If he’d had a problem, Ryan would’ve shown up for his meeting with Mora.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2014/01/how-ryan-leaf-convinced-the-colts-to-draft-peyton-manning

It was long rumored that Beathard wanted to swap with Indy so he could be sure to get Leaf.

Im sure the colts didnt budge because they didnt want to be rused into missing on peyton

 

[Gr00vus]

Groovus, what round of the draft would you start targeting RB?

I wouldn't be targeting RB. If a screaming deal came along in the 2nd or later I'd consider it, but they've got bigger problems to solve. What a screaming deal would be, I'm not certain. If the talent is there, I'd be fine with them drafting nothing but offensive and defensive linemen. Maybe a S or pass rusher thrown in somewhere.

 

[Tau837]

I appreciate the comments and surprised some of the picks are liked as admittedly I dont know much about any of them (outside skill guys).

Cody Prewitt is an interesting prospect, some places I see 2nd round other places I see as low as the 6th round. Personally, I am convinced that SD could draft a starting RB in the 6th of this years draft(and maybe even an UFA) and draft a starting S in the 5th because I'm not convinced Addae should be on an NFL roster and nobody knows if Wilson will be able to play S for a season. Here are my thoughts on S:2nd ROUND

Collins

3rd ROUND

Rowe

4th ROUND

Tartt

Sample

Drummond

Amos

Holliman

5th ROUND

Eskridge

Geathers

Cambell

6th ROUND

Harris

Prewitt

Cox

Jarrett

UFA

Carter

Jefferson

Richards

I would also remind people that Weddle is in the last year of his contract, counting over $10mil against the cap. I have always been a huge fan of Weddle but that is a lot of money for a S and it's anyone's guess what he'll be asking for in his next contract. Since Weddle is the only starting quality S on the roster it makes sense to draft one and bring in another as an UFA imo. Unless, of course, Charger fans are comfortable with the possibility of Wilson and Stuckey being the only S's on the roster at the end of this season. The position of safety should definitely be considered a priority in this draft.

Completely disagree on safety. (Surprise!)

The priority should be on extending him. And if that doesn't happen, they can tag him next offseason.

 

[B Maverick]

Groovus, what round of the draft would you start targeting RB?

I wouldn't be targeting RB. If a screaming deal came along in the 2nd or later I'd consider it, but they've got bigger problems to solve. What a screaming deal would be, I'm not certain. If the talent is there, I'd be fine with them drafting nothing but offensive and defensive linemen. Maybe a S or pass rusher thrown in somewhere.

I would like to get a RB at some point as I do not believe any of the backs on the roster are worthy of being a lead back. To me Rivers is a lot like Romo. Once Romo had a strong run game and limited his pass attempts he improved and the dallas offense went crazy. Rivers has shown he needs a healthy run game to thrive. Matthews two seasons ago provided that. Last year without him the offense struggled. Ideally a trade down at some point to get a few extra picks may do the trick. With the RB draft being considered as deep, wouldnt mind dropping a few spots in the 2nd or 3rd, picking up an extra pick or two and being able to use it on Coleman, Ajayi, Duke or Yeldon. But to your point I would not want a 1st rd back and in the 2nd it would take a guy like Gurley falling there to make me want to jump.

 

[BoltBacker]

I appreciate the comments and surprised some of the picks are liked as admittedly I dont know much about any of them (outside skill guys).

Cody Prewitt is an interesting prospect, some places I see 2nd round other places I see as low as the 6th round. Personally, I am convinced that SD could draft a starting RB in the 6th of this years draft(and maybe even an UFA) and draft a starting S in the 5th because I'm not convinced Addae should be on an NFL roster and nobody knows if Wilson will be able to play S for a season. Here are my thoughts on S:2nd ROUND

Collins

3rd ROUND

Rowe

4th ROUND

Tartt

Sample

Drummond

Amos

Holliman

5th ROUND

Eskridge

Geathers

Cambell

6th ROUND

Harris

Prewitt

Cox

Jarrett

UFA

Carter

Jefferson

Richards

I would also remind people that Weddle is in the last year of his contract, counting over $10mil against the cap. I have always been a huge fan of Weddle but that is a lot of money for a S and it's anyone's guess what he'll be asking for in his next contract. Since Weddle is the only starting quality S on the roster it makes sense to draft one and bring in another as an UFA imo. Unless, of course, Charger fans are comfortable with the possibility of Wilson and Stuckey being the only S's on the roster at the end of this season. The position of safety should definitely be considered a priority in this draft.

Completely disagree on safety. (Surprise!)

The priority should be on extending him. And if that doesn't happen, they can tag him next offseason.

Well the franchise tag of S is just under $10mil this season and you said you expected a 20% increase every year so they might be talking about nearly $12mil for a 31yo S in 2016. Not so sure about that, and I am one of his biggest fans. At 31yo I'm not even sure I'd want to extend him to a three year contract. Keep in mind Troy Polamalu is 33 and he's retiring.

When you talk about the need to invest(even more) into the LB's who are you actually talking about? A starter? When you mock out a draft what LB's are you coming up with and in what rounds? Nolan went up and met with Shaq Thompson which in a general way I like but the #17pick is way to early and the #48pick is probably too late to draft a guy like that. Which leaves SD the option of "pulling a Telesco" and trading a 2nd+4th for a 2nd rounder. Ughhhhhh! I don't hate Thomspon as a player as he reminds me a little of Thomas Davis who was also looked at as a LB/S and is a 3 down LB.

 

[Tau837]

The franchise tag value for safety this year is $9.6M. That is up 14% over last year's $8.4M, which was up 22% over the 2013 value of $6.9M, which was up 12% over the 2012 value of $6.2M. So, first off, it has not been a steady and consistent increase year over year.

I assume the jump this year was due in part to big contracts given to Thomas, Chancellor, and McCourty. I'm not sure there are as many safeties likely to get big contracts over the next year, especially if we ignore Weddle, so that tag value may not go up as much next season.

Regardless, this past season, Weddle was All Pro and was well worth a top safety salary. If he performs similarly this season, it would be a nobrainer to pay him $11M, give or take, on a franchise tag at age 31. As of right now, it seems more likely that he will continue to play well than drop off significantly. So franchise tagging him next season seems perfectly reasonable as a strategy that allows deferring a decision on a contract extension for him or as a fallback position if an extension can't be worked out.

The main point is, that means there is no sense of urgency to draft or acquire a safety this offseason beyond what Telesco already did by bringing Wilson in to start beside Weddle.

 

[Tau837]

When you talk about the need to invest(even more) into the LB's who are you actually talking about? A starter?

I don't know enough about LB draft prospects to comment intelligently about who they should target. But I know this. The Chargers' OLB play was propped up by Freeney and Johnson, who are gone, and the Chargers' ILB play was poor last season.

I expect Telesco views Attouchu and Ingram as the OLB starters. So I doubt he will be looking for a starter, but I have serious doubts about those two being able to absorb the majority of the 1200 snaps the Chargers lost at OLB from last season while playing well. It is important to have guys behind them who can step in and play well.

At ILB, Butler has been a disaster for two straight seasons, and the Chargers lost their best reserve in Gachkar. Hopefully, the ILB play will improve if Telesco improves the DL, but, again, it seems important to have someone who can step in for Butler and play well if he continues to play so badly. I'm not convinced Conner is that guy, and, besides, Teo hasn't shown that he can hold up for a season yet, so they need more than one backup who can play and even start if necessary.

 

[BoltBacker]

I know you are an analytics guy JWB, so according to the analytics what is the highest rated FA LB and highest rated S still available on the market?

 

[BoltBacker]

The main point is, that means there is no sense of urgency to draft or acquire a safety this offseason beyond what Telesco already did by bringing Wilson in to start beside Weddle.

Well, Attaochu was brought in as a starter less than a year ago using a 2nd and 4th to acquire and Ingram's fifth year option was recently picked up which will pay him close to $8mil in 2016.

Wilson on the other hand will make just over $2mi this year, and has no $ guaranteed to him next year(the last year of his contract) at all.

If Telesco is sending any messages through his actions I would read those actions as saying he thinks of Ingram as an unquestioned starter, Attaochu as a starter, and Wilson as more of a rotational player THIS YEAR with no guarantee he'll even be returning next season.

 

[Bucky86]

These Rivers to Titans rumors seem to be picking up. Some mocks have now started showing us making the trade and grabbing Mariota.

 

[cstu]

These Rivers to Titans rumors seem to be picking up. Some mocks have now started showing us making the trade and grabbing Mariota.

I can't imagine this would be a straight up trade - think the Titans are going to want #17 or next year's 1st as well as Rivers.

 

[Gr00vus]

These Rivers to Titans rumors seem to be picking up. Some mocks have now started showing us making the trade and grabbing Mariota.

What, purportedly, would the Chargers be getting back in such a deal?

 

[B Maverick]

i would guess Tenn would get Rivers and #17 pick and SD gets #2. I dont like the move anyway but adding more to that would be absolutely insane of SD IMO.

 

[Bucky86]

i would guess Tenn would get Rivers and #17 pick and SD gets #2. I dont like the move anyway but adding more to that would be absolutely insane of SD IMO.

This is what it sounds like. Rivers and their 1st for the #2.