What's new
Fantasy Football - Footballguys Forums

This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

2016-17 NBA Thread: Finals are over, please go away (5 Viewers)

Status
Not open for further replies.
Boston said:
That is not how the NBA is trending...I do think they need some size but the top teams are not generally built around guys who play in the paint... 
Click to expand...
Celtics could have probably got Okafor for a 2nd round pick in 2030, and could have given up a little of something to get Noel. Getting that st pick in the draft does change the landscape for them, but still investing in a larger body wouldn't have cost much and they would have got a good deal. I think the problem is they that front office sometimes gets too cautious and they could have made a move that wouldn't have cost the franchise much of their future at all

of course this is all hindsight, but it has seemed to make sense for the last year. Celtics had plenty of pieces, and seeing the trade the 6'er made i am sure they could have made a deal

 
Workhorse said:
Jaylen Brown is going to be an excellent player in this league, and quite soon. 
Click to expand...
I love him...he is much further along than I thought he would be...still has a ways to go (he is only 20) but he is nowhere near as raw (especially his outside shot) as many thought he would be when the C's took him at #3...

 
Going to be interesting to see what the celts do with IT.   Paying a 5'8" guy that's close to 30 max contract dollars can't be too attractive.

 
modogg said:
Celtics could have probably got Okafor for a 2nd round pick in 2030, and could have given up a little of something to get Noel. Getting that st pick in the draft does change the landscape for them, but still investing in a larger body wouldn't have cost much and they would have got a good deal. I think the problem is they that front office sometimes gets too cautious and they could have made a move that wouldn't have cost the franchise much of their future at all

of course this is all hindsight, but it has seemed to make sense for the last year. Celtics had plenty of pieces, and seeing the trade the 6'er made i am sure they could have made a deal
Click to expand...
They may have a big body coming next year with the Zizic kid they drafted in the first round last year...

 
NutterButter said:
Going to be interesting to see what the celts do with IT.   Paying a 5'8" guy that's close to 30 max contract dollars can't be too attractive.
Click to expand...
Celtics fans are pretty divided on giving IT4 a max deal. I'd seriously think about trading him this offseason and doing a mini-rebuild around the kids. This current Celtics team won't be a real contender until Thomas is well past his prime.

 
Workhorse said:
Celtics fans are pretty divided on giving IT4 a max deal. I'd seriously think about trading him this offseason and doing a mini-rebuild around the kids. This current Celtics team won't be a real contender until Thomas is well past his prime.
Click to expand...
They are the #1 seed (yes the Cavs are much better) in a Conference Final with the #1 pick this year and possibly next year and have youngsters like Jaylen Brown and others...you can compete now while building for the future...it is not an either or...you have a first-rate Coach and the team is instilling a winning culture...why take a step backwards...what purpose does that serve when you already have these Nets picks (as well as other #1's) and youngsters already on your roster...this team is in a unique situation and as Scal and others have said you can move along with basically two age groups...

 
Boston said:
They are the #1 seed (yes the Cavs are much better) in a Conference Final with the #1 pick this year and possibly next year and have youngsters like Jaylen Brown and others...you can compete now while building for the future...it is not an either or...you have a first-rate Coach and the team is instilling a winning culture...why take a step backwards...what purpose does that serve when you already have these Nets picks (as well as other #1's) and youngsters already on your roster...this team is in a unique situation and as Scal and others have said you can move along with basically two age groups...
Click to expand...
so sign IT to a max deal or let him walk after next year?   they can't sign both hayward this year and IT next year.   i mean they could using Bird exception, but the luxury tax would be really high.   

 
NutterButter said:
so sign IT to a max deal or let him walk after next year?   they can't sign both hayward this year and IT next year.   i mean they could using Bird exception, but the luxury tax would be really high.   
Click to expand...
If you are not going to sign him than you should deal him this offseason...you can't let him walk for nothing...

 
I know it's never going to happen, but imagine the Clippers re-sign Chris Paul so he can get his max deal and the Celtucs sign Hayward. Then in December, when he can be traded, they move IT, the 2019 Brooklyn pick, another of their firsts and whatever salary (if possible to even match) to the Clips for Chris Paul and Deandre Jordan. 

No, I'm not Bill Simmons or Abe. 

 
So Cuban coming out admitting he had his team tank the last 1/4 or whatever of the season.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2710198-mark-cuban-says-mavericks-did-everything-possible-to-tank-at-end-of-season

is there any reason to think that 1/3 - 1/2 of team don't tank toward the end of the season? It is good at least that they are discussing it as an issue, but really doesn't do much when they don't put anything in place to stop it. I don't know the answer, but in all honesty if i am running the NBA i call Sam Hinkie and probably hire/ask him

 
NutterButter said:
Oh, I thought you were against that idea in Workhorse's post.  NM.
Click to expand...
I would rather keep Thomas but am open to everything (totally trust Ainge to do the right thing here)...my overall point is I would rather they toe a middle-ground and not go all in right now or take any steps backwards...keep moving forward and separate from everyone in the East that doesn't have LeBron and hope as he ages you have the pieces in place to have an extended run at the top where you are vying for Championships on a yearly basis... 

 
You sign IT because you have to spend the money somewhere. There is no better option available without trading significant assets

 
wilked said:
You sign IT because you have to spend the money somewhere. There is no better option available without trading significant assets
Click to expand...
The NBA is different than other sports...there aren't many stars available, you pretty much know exactly what they will get paid (i.e. there aren't bidding wars) and the stars in the NBA usually only want to play for a limited amount of teams (the Horford signing was a big step for the C's as it broke down that barrier for them)...how many times do we see teams clear cap space only to be shunned in their pursuit of a star...for those who don't want give IT the money I would like to know how it gets used...like you I am up for committing to him but if there is a better option than a guy who's just entering his prime and putting up close to 30 a game I can definitely be swayed...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
wilked said:
See Boston's post above. You can't say trade IT without saying what you spend the money on otherwise 
Click to expand...
If you trade Thomas, you trade him for another quality player. Something like Thomas, Crowder & Memphis 1st round pick for Butler as an example. You sign Avery Bradley.

 
Boston said:
The NBA is different than other sports...there aren't many stars available, you pretty much know exactly what they will get paid (i.e. there aren't bidding wars) and the stars in the NBA usually only want to play for a limited amount of teams (the Horford signing was a big step for the C's as it broke down that barrier for them)...how many times do we see teams clear cap space only to be shunned in their pursuit of a star...for those who don't want give IT the money I would like to know how it gets used...like you I am up for committing to him but if there is a better option than a guy who's just entering his prime and putting up close to 30 a game I can definitely be swayed...
Click to expand...
Undersized.  Horrible defensively.  Will be 29 when he needs to be re-upped.  Wherever they decide to utilize the cap space will likely be worth the opportunity cost.

 
I think you sign Thomas.  Very very very few people can score like that in the NBA.  Add in that the fans love him and it's an easy case to make, even if signing Hayward takes them into tax.  Losing avery Bradley will suck.  Thankfully they have the #1 pick in the draft to feel better. "But you can't win a title with Thomas as your best pkayer!"  Correct.  The current historical evidence shows that pretty much can only win a title if James, Leonard, or Curry is your best player. 

Saying he is "undersized" and "horrible defensively" is redundant since his size doesn't seem to be a problem when it comes to offensive. 

Also:

Aldridge to Dallas for their pick and Nerlens  

HERD 

 
wilked said:
You sign IT because you have to spend the money somewhere. There is no better option available without trading significant assets
Click to expand...
George is available when IT becomes a free agent.  I'm sure there's other guys.   If you sign IT, you might be left with the equivalent of this year's team along with Fultz and whoever else you draft.  That's a solid team, but will it get past the cavs?  

 
Short Corner said:
Undersized.  Horrible defensively.  Will be 29 when he needs to be re-upped.  Wherever they decide to utilize the cap space will likely be worth the opportunity cost.
Click to expand...
The team has only improved with him...do you disagree with that or do you think they are winning despite him?

 
Baloney Sandwich said:
If you trade Thomas, you trade him for another quality player. Something like Thomas, Crowder & Memphis 1st round pick for Butler as an example. You sign Avery Bradley.
Click to expand...
Are you willing to do more than 20 million a year on Bradley (you saw what Turner got and Bradley is much better)?  He is a very good but not elite player who has not played a full season in his 7 years...I really like Bradley but IMO he is absolutely not the guy you pay big money for in today's NBA...you can find other Avery Bradley's far easier than an elite scorer...

 
Last edited by a moderator:
Boston said:
The team has only improved with him...do you disagree with that or do you think they are winning despite him?
Click to expand...
What he has done is irrelevant.  You are obviously operating under the assumption that this season will be a baseline for his performance going forward.  I think it is more likely that we will see a regression to the mean.  Many teams have handicapped themselves chasing outlier stats.  His trade value will likely never be higher than it is this offseason.

 
Boston said:
Are you willing to do more than 20 million a year on Bradley (you saw what Turner got and he is much better)?  He is a very good but not elite player who has not played a full season in his 7 years...I really like Bradley but IMO he is absolutely not the guy you pay big money for in the NBA...you can find other Avery Bradley's far easier than an elite scorer...
Click to expand...
People thought Danny overpaid when they signed him to his current deal and now it is an amazing bargain. The Celts would have to rip of the last year of his deal and perhaps they can come to a deal that is similar to what Turner signed but it will probably cost more. Bradley is an elite defender and his offensive game has continued to improve. I'm advocating for signing Bradley under the scenario that they trade Thomas and parts to get an elite player back. 

 
There are exceptions (Steph Curry, Magic, the first Isiah Thomas), but you usually are not winning a championship if your point guard is your best player. 

 
Dedfin said:
I guess I'm the only one that thinks trading or not signing (wtf?) Thomas is unthinkable.
Click to expand...
I think it's the most interesting NBA sub-plot going on right now. Nothing wrong really with making the conference finals and getting nuked by the Cavs. I would pay him and hope the young kids advance, but that doesn't really make sense if you aren't getting another established star to go with him. 

They're in an interesting place. Not good enough to win it but there's nothing wrong with giving your fans a great season either. 

 
Capella said:
I think it's the most interesting NBA sub-plot going on right now. Nothing wrong really with making the conference finals and getting nuked by the Cavs. I would pay him and hope the young kids advance, but that doesn't really make sense if you aren't getting another established star to go with him. 

They're in an interesting place. Not good enough to win it but there's nothing wrong with giving your fans a great season either. 
Click to expand...
As a Hornets fan just winning a playoff series in my lifetime would be huge.

 
Capella said:
They have the 2019 Brooklyn pick too? #### why don't they just merge the franchises? 
Click to expand...
No...they just have the 2018 pick.  In 2019 they have a protect Clippers pick and a protected Memphis pick.  

The real question is a team if something like IT, Bradley, Fultz, Hayward, Horford with depth is enough to beat GS.  If it's not then they have to get off IT.

 
Ghost Rider said:
There are exceptions (Steph Curry, Magic, the first Isiah Thomas), but you usually are not winning a championship if your point guard is your best player. 
Click to expand...
Lebron is just as much a PG as Kyrie. Lakers ran their offense through Kobe.

You need a super elite wing player. Really doesn't matter if they are desginated a PG, SG, or SF.

 
Sammy3469 said:
No...they just have the 2018 pick.  In 2019 they have a protect Clippers pick and a protected Memphis pick.  

The real question is a team if something like IT, Bradley, Fultz, Hayward, Horford with depth is enough to beat GS.  If it's not then they have to get off IT.
Click to expand...
That team isn't beating GS, or probably even Lebron. 

 
Boston said:
They are the #1 seed (yes the Cavs are much better) in a Conference Final with the #1 pick this year and possibly next year and have youngsters like Jaylen Brown and others...you can compete now while building for the future...it is not an either or...you have a first-rate Coach and the team is instilling a winning culture...why take a step backwards...what purpose does that serve when you already have these Nets picks (as well as other #1's) and youngsters already on your roster...this team is in a unique situation and as Scal and others have said you can move along with basically two age groups...
Click to expand...
What good does a winning culture do?  Is there a legitimate star other than Leonard that was raised in a winning culture?  LeBron wasn't, Curry wasn't, Durant wasn't.  Those are the stars that could win a title right now.  I don't think Harden/Westbrook were but I can't remember for sure whether they came in after Durant turned the team around.  Thomas wasn't.  Rondo was though.  And he was ticketed as the next big star for a while.

It helps you get better free agents, but I'm not sure there's any evidence that it makes players better.

 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

Yo Mama
**** OFFICIAL FFA 2025-2026 Fake NBA Draft **** - Draft Has Started
17 18 19
Replies
934
Views
9K
Yo Mama
Yo Mama
Yo Mama
NBA 2024 In-Season Tournament Challenge - Yo Mama Said Knock You Out Again!
2
Replies
79
Views
2K
Yo Mama
Yo Mama
kutta
***Official 2025 Footballguy T-Shirt Exchange - OCT 12 SHIPPING DEADLINE (extended 2 weeks)***
3 4 5
Replies
200
Views
5K
nirad3
nirad3

Users who are viewing this thread

Total: 5 (members: 0, guests: 5)
Back
Top