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2017-18 NBA (Playoffs): A gasping, wheezing thread begs message board poster arguing how Jordan never lost a Finals to just let it die in peace (1 Viewer)

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encaitar said:
It was a joke.  Lighten up.  

I could go on and list all the accomplishments that LeBron has that Jordan never did, but it's useless.  They are both the best players of their eras by a large margin.  I'd call them 1a and 1b in my rankings on the all time list of non centers.  

Still, you literally just had a post trying to downplay Jordan's teammates?  Scotty Pippen wasn't as good as LeBron's teammates?  Really?  The same Pippen that went for 23, 8 and 6 and took the Bulls to a 55-27 record without Jordan and was a few ball calls/unlucky bounces from taking them to the NBA finals without Jordan?  That team wasn't as good or better than the ones LeBron has played on?  

Excuse me for a moment.........       :lmao: :lmao:
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Kyrie could've done it with the Cats without Lebron IMHO. I think people underrate Kyrie. Lebron also plays in a weaker era. Where's the Bostons and Knicks of the era? The Hawks, Pistons etc that MJ had to face? The league might have better players but the rosters overall with super teams are weaker. When you have to go team up with your friends to win I call that a coward move. MJ never had to team up with Super Stars. One of the greatest parts about The Dream Team in the Olympics? Non of them wanted to play with each other. Ever hear about the greatest Scimmage never seen on TV? It was the 5 on 5 Dream Team and they all acted like they were playing a Game 7 of the NBA finals. Didn't care if they were teammates. One great player in the East these days can lead a team in the East to the NBA finals. If Lebron is so good why did he never go out West? 

 
DJackson10 said:
Kyrie could've done it with the Cats without Lebron IMHO. I think people underrate Kyrie. Lebron also plays in a weaker era. Where's the Bostons and Knicks of the era? The Hawks, Pistons etc that MJ had to face? The league might have better players but the rosters overall with super teams are weaker. When you have to go team up with your friends to win I call that a coward move. MJ never had to team up with Super Stars. One of the greatest parts about The Dream Team in the Olympics? Non of them wanted to play with each other. Ever hear about the greatest Scimmage never seen on TV? It was the 5 on 5 Dream Team and they all acted like they were playing a Game 7 of the NBA finals. Didn't care if they were teammates. One great player in the East these days can lead a team in the East to the NBA finals. If Lebron is so good why did he never go out West? 
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I think you mean one "once in a generation player" can get a team in the East to the NBA finals.  Otherwise, you need teams with a Big 3 like Boston or with an MVP candidate and the best center in the league like Miami in 2005-6.  

We really don't know what else it would take to accomplish it, since lately it's been "go to the NBA finals if you have LeBron on your team and for no other reason".  

As for why he doesn't go to the west?  Blowback.  He could've done what Durant did and joined the Warriors.  No one ever would've let him live it down.  He could've joined Kawhi and Pop in San Antonio... Same thing.  He joins Houston next year and he'll get killed for it.

Why not join a weaker team in the West?  Because he's not an idiot.  Case closed.

 
encaitar said:
I don't know what types of PEDs would really help NBA players more though?  Straight up steroids would almost be a negative IMO.  HGH maybe in a recovery sense?  It wouldn't shock me in the least to hear that EPO is the PED of choice for NBA athletes given their demanding schedule and need for extra stamina.
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PEDS AND HGH supplements that make recovery time faster would be the most successful for NBA stars. I'm by far and away not a PED expert but I would think anything that helps create faster recovery time either injury or stamina would be the best. My opinion on PEDs and HGH is more of I think it's an unfair advantage to those who have the skills to be there but are looked over because some guy had an unfair advantage. There's a lot of debate by baseball fans if Sammy Sosa was ever as great if it weren't for PED use. Bonds was great without them but it's unfortunate his big ego took over and had him do it. I think it's an unfair advantage for those who never had the required skills to get to the top but did by using compared to those who did it in a natural way. It's also IMHO false advertising to people. I'm shocked theres been no fans who have sued MLB for false advertising in the 90s considering how much the writers, Selig, players and coaches and owners all knew about the rapid use of these things. All because baseball had lost fans do to the 94 I believe strike and wanted to win fans back as fast as possible. I thought the McGwire/Sosa HR race was incredible and yrs later to find out it was do to PEDs and other drugs I feel like I was cheated and lied to. 

 
encaitar said:
I think you mean one "once in a generation player" can get a team in the East to the NBA finals.  Otherwise, you need teams with a Big 3 like Boston or with an MVP candidate and the best center in the league like Miami in 2005-6.  

We really don't know what else it would take to accomplish it, since lately it's been "go to the NBA finals if you have LeBron on your team and for no other reason".  

As for why he doesn't go to the west?  Blowback.  He could've done what Durant did and joined the Warriors.  No one ever would've let him live it down.  He could've joined Kawhi and Pop in San Antonio... Same thing.  He joins Houston next year and he'll get killed for it.

Why not join a weaker team in the West?  Because he's not an idiot.  Case closed.
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Joining Mia with Wade and Bosh didn't get him blowback? Come on thats a weak argument. He doesn't go west because he knows it's easier to get to the Finals in the East Wouldn't have 7 possible 8 straight finals if he was out west. I remember people here last year who said they'd like to see Lebron with SA and see how Lebron handles having Pop as coach since Lebron has never had to run a teams offensive scheme or system. The system and scheme is always around what Lebron does not the coach in his time. Would some complain that he went to SA? Sure but your blowback argument is weak since it already occurred when he formed the Super team in MIA. Lets not play dumb here. 

 
encaitar said:
I think you mean one "once in a generation player" can get a team in the East to the NBA finals.  Otherwise, you need teams with a Big 3 like Boston or with an MVP candidate and the best center in the league like Miami in 2005-6.  

We really don't know what else it would take to accomplish it, since lately it's been "go to the NBA finals if you have LeBron on your team and for no other reason".  

As for why he doesn't go to the west?  Blowback.  He could've done what Durant did and joined the Warriors.  No one ever would've let him live it down.  He could've joined Kawhi and Pop in San Antonio... Same thing.  He joins Houston next year and he'll get killed for it.

Why not join a weaker team in the West?  Because he's not an idiot.  Case closed.
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what i've always wondered about the "Lebron only wins because the East is so weak.." argument is..... why don't "smart" players head back East and challenge Lebron in the "weak" East if it would be such an easy path to the Finals?

why are the cream of the crop heading West to play in the "tough" conference for a 1 in 8 chance at the Finals instead of teaming up with another top 10 player and taking a 1 in 2 chance at the Finals (allegedly, if the East is so bad).

is it because "smart" players realize that Lebron is blocking everyone's path to the Finals and the easier route is actually out West? 

sure looks that way

 
i also think that cp3 is one of the biggest flopmaster generals who will cheapshot a guy and then run behind another bigger guy shouting hold me back bro and that poopbeard well he is poopbeard and there is no bigger flopatronic in the universe than him and it is like a stiff breeze from the upper deck will blow that guy over and i hope that they never win anything ever as a result because i think they are like having european flopcer in the nba but the thing is i am just a lot less wierd about it take that to the bank brohans 

 
I don't think anyone joins a team in the East or West simply because there was a better chance to get to the Finals.  In those kind of decisions coaching, style of play, contracts offered, etc. weigh in more heavily than what other players/teams are in the conference. 

If Boston hadn't lost their 2 big free agents to injury, the East/West debate would be a lot less valid as they would probably be a legit threat to LeBron and anyone out West.

 
mr. furley said:
what i've always wondered about the "Lebron only wins because the East is so weak.." argument is..... why don't "smart" players head back East and challenge Lebron in the "weak" East if it would be such an easy path to the Finals?

why are the cream of the crop heading West to play in the "tough" conference for a 1 in 8 chance at the Finals instead of teaming up with another top 10 player and taking a 1 in 2 chance at the Finals (allegedly, if the East is so bad).

is it because "smart" players realize that Lebron is blocking everyone's path to the Finals and the easier route is actually out West? 

sure looks that way
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Who exactly are you talking about?

 
Bobcat10 said:
Many things are ignored here on a daily basis, so that's a good question.  I don't recall much about that besides Lebron and a bunch of other big/small name athletes being named by a whistle blower.  Then MLB and Braun (and whoever else got suspended there?) took the fall for all athletes?  Maybe I have the ending of the story wrong, no idea.

Does unnatural = illegal?  
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I don't think James gets linked to the Biogenesis report if his hands were completely clean especially when you look at his physical growth now.

Unnatural/illegal are blurred lines.  I don't think it's difficult with modern science to create something that is undetectable (or that is not yet known as a substance that should be banned). 

 
trader jake said:
The thing I don't understand about the Sixers offense...why don't they run more (almost any?) pick n' roll?  The roster is full of players that could set picks and also hit the outside shot.  Watching Redick & Belineli run floppy 50 times doesn't make a whole lot of sense against Boston.  Neither does going to a winded Embiid in the post against Horford & Baynes over and over.

All that said, the #1 thing the Sixers are leaving on the table is transition opportunities.  Simmons needs to be flying up the court every single time Philly gets the ball (including after makes).  I'd also like to see Fultz playing the point every minute that Simmons is off the court.  He's not a winning player right now but he needs to get that valuable playing time in these situations, even if it's limited.  If Brett Brown is going to take out McConnell for Simmons (which I agreed with) he also should be playing Fultz some.
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because everything runs through Simmons and he can't shoot to give any kind of a credible threat so everyone would just go under and hang back.  They have done it with Redick a little bit.  I don't think that Ersan and Belinelli are good enough ball handlers to do it.  Ersan, Redick, Belinelli and Saric (and Covington a bit) did all kinds of ball screens, DHOs and re-screening during the regular season and some vs Miami, but haven't seen it nearly as much vs. BOS.  You are right about the floppy stuff and I hadn't been looking that closely, but Duncan mentioned the other day how hard that is in the playoffs because the refs let so much more holding go.  

 
Jayrod said:
I don't think anyone joins a team in the East or West simply because there was a better chance to get to the Finals.  In those kind of decisions coaching, style of play, contracts offered, etc. weigh in more heavily than what other players/teams are in the conference. 

If Boston hadn't lost their 2 big free agents to injury, the East/West debate would be a lot less valid as they would probably be a legit threat to LeBron and anyone out West.
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Irving was traded to the Celtics.  

 
Jayrod said:
I don't think anyone joins a team in the East or West simply because there was a better chance to get to the Finals. 
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i don't believe it either but there's a narrative out there a lot of people buy in to (it seems) that say "Lebron stayed in the East because it's the weaker conference, he doesn't want real competition and he knows the path to the Finals is easy..." as though hundreds of other guys can't also make decisions that would impact the outcome.

 
mr. furley said:
i don't believe it either but there's a narrative out there a lot of people buy in to (it seems) that say "Lebron stayed in the East because it's the weaker conference, he doesn't want real competition and he knows the path to the Finals is easy..." as though hundreds of other guys can't also make decisions that would impact the outcome.
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what is always funny to me when people say that is that they act like this has been the trend for 15-20 years and would sustain. In all reality, I would think the East would be stronger than the west in 2 years or so. the youth in Boston, Mil, Philly, etc. we will be getting better and we will see if Klay stays with Golden State

 
i dont know cappy but it needs more dungeon master that little guy just brightens up my day take that to the bank bromigo 

 
SWC said:
i dont know cappy but it needs more dungeon master that little guy just brightens up my day take that to the bank bromigo 
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you know what is funny, is that the avatar of Dungeon Master totally does it for me too. I see the little guy and think back to the old cartoon and yeah, gives me a smile too.

 
i wanna drink beers with ole dungy and get him all lit up and just see what type of crazy stuff that guy starts talking you know its gonna involve a demogorgon and be trippy as hell and that my friends beats listening to some of the crap in here right now take that to the bank brodungeos

 
modogg said:
what is always funny to me when people say that is that they act like this has been the trend for 15-20 years and would sustain. In all reality, I would think the East would be stronger than the west in 2 years or so. the youth in Boston, Mil, Philly, etc. we will be getting better and we will see if Klay stays with Golden State
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All signs point to him staying there, if you can believe his dad (which I do).

 
modogg said:
that stinks, but it does make sense. Would have been a dream fit in Philly
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You guys should be focusing on prying Kawhi away from the Spurs. And you should shoot the lock off the wallet to do it. Only untouchables would be Simmons and Embiid.

 
Bobcat10 said:
Many things are ignored here on a daily basis, so that's a good question.  I don't recall much about that besides Lebron and a bunch of other big/small name athletes being named by a whistle blower.  Then MLB and Braun (and whoever else got suspended there?) took the fall for all athletes?  Maybe I have the ending of the story wrong, no idea.

Does unnatural = illegal?  
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Are contact lenses illegal?

 
:lmao: @ anyone suggesting Lebron is on PEDs.

2008-  "He'll never be as good as Michael"

2011-  "He'll never be as good as Michael"

2014-  "He'll never be as good as Michael"

2017-  "He'll never be as good as Michael"

*2018- Stats and accomplishments are simply too strong to deny he's a good as Michael*

"Ummmm....he's on steroids"  

 
On a side note, what does TNT keep playing these gosh-awful Claws promos?  They have to know that the NBA demographic is nowhere near the target audience for that show, right?

 
I don't know why, but I feel like one of these 2 teams on the brink tonight is going to at least force a game 6 and I am actually feeling a game 7. Just a feeling, no reason behind it. I am not sure which though, logic says it is Philly, they are at home tonight, they could have stole one in Boston. For some reason my heart says the Raptors, despite the fact LeBron owns them, they are on the road tonight, and they are a mess.

 
Gr00vus said:
You guys should be focusing on prying Kawhi away from the Spurs. And you should shoot the lock off the wallet to do it. Only untouchables would be Simmons and Embiid.
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will be a good test for Colangelo this summer. I can't blame him for Fultz trade. Gave up a hefty asset, but if the Fultz they had in July had stayed the course i am sure both Boston and Phily would have been happy with the deal. Will be interesting how much Colangelo feels he needs to make a huge move, and how much they rely on Simmons to work a jumper all summer and Fultz get his head straight. That Lakers pick can give them a nice fit like Bridges, so in all honesty they don't have to feel forced to do something. 

but yeah, i certainly won't be upset if they get Kawhi. Brown has some good insight being good friends with Pop, so he should have an idea what the Sixers would be getting. 

 
Horford is playing Embiid well, but i also think the refs just like Al and look the other way when he is guarding Embiid. Watching Embiid all year, i can't remember seeing anybody guard Embiid as physical as Al and the refs just don't call anything

 
Embiid is a monster on those picks. He took out Tyler Johnson last series and is just a brick wall when these guys run into him

 
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