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2020 Presidential Election Thread (1 Viewer)

I never said I found Klobuchar exciting or full of vim and vigor. I just said I like her. So what if she’s dull? She seems smart and pleasant. 

Gerald Ford was dull and he did OK. After the last couple of years I wouldn’t mind some dull. 

 
POLITICO‏ @politico 1h1 hour ago

Sen. Elizabeth Warren called for abolishing the Electoral College as part of an effort to expand voting rights

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/19/elizabeth-warren-eliminate-electoral-college-1226686
I know this sort of thing gets the base all excited but it will never happen. 

Once again, my first question to every candidate would be, “given the likely Republican vs Democrat numbers in Congress, what specific proposals will you seriously push for to get accomplished during your first year in office, with reasonable anticipation of success?” In other words, what are you REALLY going to do? 

 
I know this sort of thing gets the base all excited but it will never happen. 

Once again, my first question to every candidate would be, “given the likely Republican vs Democrat numbers in Congress, what specific proposals will you seriously push for to get accomplished during your first year in office, with reasonable anticipation of success?” In other words, what are you REALLY going to do? 
You're congenitally unable to get out in front of change, aren't you?

 
The overriding attitude from Dem voters must be "yeah, he or she isn't my first choice but they're an improvement over who's in the White House right now."
I don’t think you have to worry about this. No matter who it is 99% of Democrats will feel this way. We just have to get the indies on board. 

 
Then stop being such a negative nellie. "It'll never happen" guy is one of the big reasons why good things don't happen.
Tim is being realistic. It has been decades and we still haven't gotten all states to ratify the ERA, for crying out loud. I don't see the legislators of 38 states going along with this.

 
I’d expect people who post 20 times a day in a football political subforum are going to vote for a candidate regardless if they are boring.

In a country where Trump got elected perhaps your more typical person will not.

 
Tim is being realistic. It has been decades and we still haven't gotten all states to ratify the ERA, for crying out loud. I don't see the legislators of 38 states going along with this.
It took like 20 years from the passage of the Defense of Marriage Act to having nationwide same sex marriage.  Good ideas can sometimes change people's views in a relatively short period of time.

 
POLITICO‏ @politico 1h1 hour ago

Sen. Elizabeth Warren called for abolishing the Electoral College as part of an effort to expand voting rights

https://www.politico.com/story/2019/03/19/elizabeth-warren-eliminate-electoral-college-1226686
I caught a little of her town hall last night. It just seems like she is pushing out snappy ideas. The breaking up of Big Tech was one, her expansive definition of "corruption" away from an actual criminal definition, and stuff like this. - I guess I have the same criticism about negatives nancies but really I'm just making a comment about her campaign. She seems to be pushing bold initiatives to get attention. Maybe there's nothing wrong with that, as noted above you have to push for affirmative values, just a thought.

 
Buttiggieg is a guy I like on the face of things or I see why people like him - his delivery is crisp and cool and thoughtful and rational. - But again I caught some of him on the Sunday shows and he was pushing expanding the Supreme Court. Again just tell me where/when to vote but I don't think 'magic bullet' theories like this are helpful.

 
I’d expect people who post 20 times a day in a football political subforum are going to vote for a candidate regardless if they are boring.

In a country where Trump got elected perhaps your more typical person will not.
Turnout was a big deal for Obama 08, suppression was a big deal for Romney 12 & Hillary 16. It's unfortunate but that's been politics since forever.

 
I never said I found Klobuchar exciting or full of vim and vigor. I just said I like her. So what if she’s dull? She seems smart and pleasant. 

Gerald Ford was dull and he did OK. After the last couple of years I wouldn’t mind some dull. 
i like her as a candidate, too, but she's not catching fire either. i expect her to do well enough in Iowa because of her familiarity there. however, she's not staking out positions or making a case for her as *the* democratic contender for 2020 (unlike Warren most notably). most of the next tier candidates - Booker, Gillebrand, et al - are just waging a charm offensive now to raise their profiles right now. 

 
Buttiggieg is a guy I like on the face of things or I see why people like him - his delivery is crisp and cool and thoughtful and rational. - But again I caught some of him on the Sunday shows and he was pushing expanding the Supreme Court. Again just tell me where/when to vote but I don't think 'magic bullet' theories like this are helpful.
i think expanding the SCOTUS and/or ditching the EC are non-starters for many, many americans regardless of the actual merit for these initiatives. i'd rather they make a meaningful effort at fixing the voting by addressing gerrymandering, voter suppression, fixing voting systems, and the like instead of half-assed ideas like lowering the voting age to 16.

 
It took like 20 years from the passage of the Defense of Marriage Act to having nationwide same sex marriage.  Good ideas can sometimes change people's views in a relatively short period of time.
I'm ready to take on every "it'll never happen" guy on this bored. I'm fired up and as soon as I finish my nap, I'm gonna launch into all of them.

 
GOP state legislators in Florida are doing their part to keep Florida red in 2020. They're trying to prevent restoration of voting rights for perhaps hundreds of thousands of felons whose rights were just restored by Amendment 4. 

"Voting along party lines, Republicans advanced the measure, which would require felons pay back all court fees and costs before being eligible to vote, even if those costs are not handed down by a judge as part of the person’s sentence."

Some are calling it an illegal  Poll Tax.

Local county election boards have already registered many felons, because Amendment 4 was clear to them. Some just voted in Jacksonville. 

 
I think Kamela is likable, and Klobuchar. 
For about three seconds I tried to find your post where you claimed that southern black women would determine the DNC nominee, and then I laughed, I'm looking for a needle in a haystack, so pardon me for posting out of order.

Long story short, I'm a long-time resident in a MS apartment complex,  and my ex-neighbor (I moved from one unit to another) is a 70-year-old plus black woman who is deeply rooted in the traditions of the Southern Baptist church.  We had some silly conversations about Hillary vs Bernie back in 2016. ( I was borderline BernieBro and she was in the tank  for HRC)  ... Anyway,  I had not spoke to her for the past six months, until today.   There was NO hesitation - she's all-in for Biden, and she was kind of dismissive of Warren, even after the CNN Town Hall on Monday night.  I'm sure younger generations might lean more towards Harris, but there was no hesitation in her opinion.

 
SoBeDad said:
GOP state legislators in Florida are doing their part to keep Florida red in 2020. They're trying to prevent restoration of voting rights for perhaps hundreds of thousands of felons whose rights were just restored by Amendment 4. 

"Voting along party lines, Republicans advanced the measure, which would require felons pay back all court fees and costs before being eligible to vote, even if those costs are not handed down by a judge as part of the person’s sentence."

Some are calling it an illegal  Poll Tax.

Local county election boards have already registered many felons, because Amendment 4 was clear to them. Some just voted in Jacksonville. 
Wouldn't it also violate double jeopardy laws? 

 
Wouldn't it also violate double jeopardy laws? 
I haven't heard that objection. It is estimated that about 80% of felons are unable to pay court fees and costs. The ACLU is calling it an illegal poll Tax.  This proposed bill has potential to determine the 2020 presidential election.

When Floridians like myself voted over 2 to 1 in favor of an amendment to "restore the voting rights of Floridians with felony convictions after they complete all terms of their sentence including parole or probation", we weren't expecting the legislature to override. This is headed for the courts.

 
For about three seconds I tried to find your post where you claimed that southern black women would determine the DNC nominee, and then I laughed, I'm looking for a needle in a haystack, so pardon me for posting out of order.

Long story short, I'm a long-time resident in a MS apartment complex,  and my ex-neighbor (I moved from one unit to another) is a 70-year-old plus black woman who is deeply rooted in the traditions of the Southern Baptist church.  We had some silly conversations about Hillary vs Bernie back in 2016. ( I was borderline BernieBro and she was in the tank  for HRC)  ... Anyway,  I had not spoke to her for the past six months, until today.   There was NO hesitation - she's all-in for Biden, and she was kind of dismissive of Warren, even after the CNN Town Hall on Monday night.  I'm sure younger generations might lean more towards Harris, but there was no hesitation in her opinion.
I think I wrote that Biden was the one candidate who could challenge Kamala for their support, and it would not surprise me at all, given the conservative nature of these women. If they’re mostly for Biden, forget it; he will be the nominee. But we’re a ways off from finding out who they’re for. 

 
Nate Silver‏ @NateSilver538 1h1 hour ago

The narrative that Beto has never taken any substantive policy positions is…pretty wrong. He said quite a bit about the issues in his run for Senate last year. He was also in Congress for 6 years and voted on a lot of stuff.

There's also a lot of middle ground between (A) "empty vessel" and (B) "must issue at least two dozen 60-page white papers on the major issues of the day before setting foot in Iowa and New Hampshire".

Sure (B) is better than (A). But maybe being 3/4 of the way to (B)—"here are my principles and priors but we'll fill out some details as we learn more, including about political constraints"—is also better than (B). It's what most people would do when taking e.g. a new CEO job.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/what-does-beto-orourke-believe/

 
Yeah I don’t get it. Have watched her on a few interviews and she’s amazingly boring. Her announcement speech to the race was setup to be a Hollywood scripted moment, with the snow, and I couldn’t make it through more than a couple minutes.

Checks a lot of boxes otherwise though. Look forward to the debates to see if she can shine
I have pointed out her lack of charisma in several threads. She is the 2020 version of another Minnesotan Walter Mondale (hell of a nice guy, everybody liked him but someone that most voters found bland and unexciting).


The problem with Klobuchar isn't a lack of charisma or personality.

The problem is the electorate doesn't properly value being the most effective minority party Senator in over 20 years.

 
The problem with Klobuchar isn't a lack of charisma or personality.

The problem is the electorate doesn't properly value being the most effective minority party Senator in over 20 years.
Hillary was amazingly qualified. Getting people excited to vote for you is the job until you get elected. 

The “want to have a beer with” factor is always going to be a part getting elected. 

 
Hillary was amazingly qualified. Getting people excited to vote for you is the job until you get elected. 

The “want to have a beer with” factor is always going to be a part getting elected. 
This does nothing to disprove my point. But thanks for the response.

 
My point was just a lack of charisma is a big problem with someone running. 

It is so early though and a million things could happen. 
Yes. I see your point and we are not necessarily in disagreement.

Back in the 2016 GOP primaries it was clear that Kasich was lacking in the charisma dept. vs. Trump. But clearly one of these candidates had far more substance than the other.

But was it Kasich's fault for not having more charisma? Or the GOP electorate's fault for overvaluing charisma at the expense of much better governance?

Trump jokes aside, my point is that charisma can be seriously overrated. 

 
Yes. I see your point and we are not necessarily in disagreement.

Back in the 2016 GOP primaries it was clear that Kasich was lacking in the charisma dept. vs. Trump. But clearly one of these candidates had far more substance than the other.

But was it Kasich's fault for not having more charisma? Or the GOP electorate's fault for overvaluing charisma at the expense of much better governance?

Trump jokes aside, my point is that charisma can be seriously overrated. 
Hadn’t really thought about who is at fault but your job as a politician is to get elected. You can win as a wonky person, a charismatic type not necessarily one blueprint.

Ultimately it’s on the politician to figure out how to win. 

 
What are dems feeling these days? Are there too many candidates? 

I dont necessary want trump in 2020, but the dems have to put forward someone worth the nomination and not cannibalize themselves in the process. 

I think a betting man takes Trump vs the field at the moment. 

 
I would like to see these two threads about 2020 merged. 
People in hell would like ice water. :hophead:

I was told by some in the other thread that the two should not be merged as then they would have to see my posts of occasional tweets, plus links to news related articles (and perhaps the other thread might have been started for that reason even though mine preceded it by several months).

The two threads, although hitting on similar subject matter, have different posters and a different flavor to the discussion. Plus we currently have several threads (Trump Years, Trump Tweets, Russia Investigation, etc.) that simultaneously are discussing exactly the same thing, but no one seems to have an issue with that - so no reason these two threads can't coexist.

 
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What are dems feeling these days? Are there too many candidates? 

I dont necessary want trump in 2020, but the dems have to put forward someone worth the nomination and not cannibalize themselves in the process. 

I think a betting man takes Trump vs the field at the moment. 
It is early yet, we are a ways from the first debate. Plenty of time for things to sort themselves out and 2-3 of the top candidates to emerge for Democrats to take a closer look at and then reach a consensus.

 
Nate Silver‏ @NateSilver538 2h2 hours ago

Per http://NewsLibrary.com , Elizabeth Warren has gotten 5x more media coverage than Pete Buttigieg over the past 30 days, but Pete Buttigieg has gotten 1.3x more Google search traffic.

What that means to me: interest in Buttigieg is fairly organic and is *not* especially media-driven. There are various critiques you can make about e.g. Beto's media coverage, and none of them apply very well to Buttigieg.

https://twitter.com/NateSilver538/status/1110200512161431552

 
Nate Silver‏ @NateSilver538 52m52 minutes ago

Congrats to Gov. John Hickenlooper, who has qualified for the Democratic debates on the basis of this poll, joining the already-qualified Biden, Bernie, Harris, Beto, Warren, Booker, Klobuchar, Castro, GIllibrand, Buttigieg, Inslee and Yang (fundraising). https://53eig.ht/2OtapTJ

Granted, that is probably not the most interesting aspect of this poll, which also shows a mini Buttigieg surge.

Also seems from the consensus of polls that Beto did get a bump post-announcement. But those things can be fleeting; you see the Bernie and Harris bumps fading now.

 

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