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2020 WSL Discussion Thread (1 Viewer)

Stephen Holloway said:
It’s an advantage ONLY over the teams that are shorted and it could force some to take them sooner than they otherwise would have.
My totally unscientific, wild-### guess based on no data whatsoever is that a 3rd DST would add about the same number of incremental points as a 2nd PK (~1.5 ppg) but in a lumpier fashion, i.e. it might provide no benefit at all 13/17 weeks but give you 7-8 extra points three or four times a season.

Probably still less overall benefit than a comparable skill-position player at that draft slot but, to your point, that's not the real reason you do it, now is it?

 
My totally unscientific, wild-### guess based on no data whatsoever is that a 3rd DST would add about the same number of incremental points as a 2nd PK (~1.5 ppg) but in a lumpier fashion, i.e. it might provide no benefit at all 13/17 weeks but give you 7-8 extra points three or four times a season.

Probably still less overall benefit than a comparable skill-position player at that draft slot but, to your point, that's not the real reason you do it, now is it?
I only took two (so far) and was somewhat forced to take them earlier than I would have liked. My tentative plan was to take one and a position player last turn, but felt the need to add two since I was taking them in the second half of all DSTs. The real reason I suspect that some take three is to squeeze the ones that wait, force some to go solo, and possibly keep an owner from drafting any (not likely unless several folks draft three).

The twenty man roster does add some flexibility and kicks up the odds of folks playing the squeeze play.

 
The twenty man roster does add some flexibility and kicks up the odds of folks playing the squeeze play.
:thumbup:  I've always advocated expanding the roster size in the SSL / MBSL to 20. The 18-round limit forces everyone to be a lot more cookie-cutter w/r/t roster construction - you'll never see an experiment like "what happens if a couple teams back the truck up on DSTs?" because trying to corner the market in anything winds up hurting your own roster more than your opponents.

Personally I bet if you expanded WSL to say 23-24 slots you'd start to see some really creative roster-building approaches. Just something to ponder ... after all, there's an unused legacy WSL or two out there that might make for a good testing ground ...

 
The real reason I suspect that some take three is to squeeze the ones that wait, force some to go solo, and possibly keep an owner from drafting any (not likely unless several folks draft three).
Forty hours ago I took a third defense to speed up this %$#@*&> draft!   Should have been the easiest pre-draft one can make?  :confused:       

:hot:

 
once again I will campaign for this to be a prerequisite of participating in these things moving forward:

Question: Are you willing to sign up for the text message notifications that notify you when you are on the clock?

If yes..........let's party.

If not.....this may not be for you.  

 
:thumbup:  I've always advocated expanding the roster size in the SSL / MBSL to 20. The 18-round limit forces everyone to be a lot more cookie-cutter w/r/t roster construction - you'll never see an experiment like "what happens if a couple teams back the truck up on DSTs?" because trying to corner the market in anything winds up hurting your own roster more than your opponents.

Personally I bet if you expanded WSL to say 23-24 slots you'd start to see some really creative roster-building approaches. Just something to ponder ... after all, there's an unused legacy WSL or two out there that might make for a good testing ground ...
@BassNBrew what do you think about adding roster positions for PDSL? I think that an increasing to 22 would add strategy decisions mentioned above by @Mr. Irrelevant. With our increasingly long wait times and the added positions, we might need to start the PDSL about a week after this one is completed. Maybe right at the beginning of Free Agency?

 
@BassNBrew what do you think about adding roster positions for PDSL? I think that an increasing to 22 would add strategy decisions mentioned above by @Mr. Irrelevant. With our increasingly long wait times and the added positions, we might need to start the PDSL about a week after this one is completed. Maybe right at the beginning of Free Agency?
We did that a few years ago.  It just forces everything to rip off defenses and kickers back to back.  That last two rounds end up with people just drafting backups to the backups that never see the field unless injuries strike.  I think the couple of year we did it most of the players selected in the last two rounds produced donuts.  Handcuff strategy or selecting your sleeper in the 20th round is one thing, everyone throwing darts hoping for injuries to a team's RB1 and RB2 isn't that exciting to me.  In PDSL we have a flex position and 20 rounds which adds new strategy to the mix.

 
:thumbup:  I've always advocated expanding the roster size in the SSL / MBSL to 20. The 18-round limit forces everyone to be a lot more cookie-cutter w/r/t roster construction - you'll never see an experiment like "what happens if a couple teams back the truck up on DSTs?" because trying to corner the market in anything winds up hurting your own roster more than your opponents.

Personally I bet if you expanded WSL to say 23-24 slots you'd start to see some really creative roster-building approaches. Just something to ponder ... after all, there's an unused legacy WSL or two out there that might make for a good testing ground ...
I'd prefer to just go auction. Rosters between 18-24. 

Mimic the contest rules somewhat.

 
Perhaps another thread for discussion of the updating of rules might be over due.   I see that I still have a posting of the rules pinned at the top of this forum from 13 years ago!  

I would like to see more drafts and more participation.  Both of which seem to have dropped.  Both of which I find quite useful in honing the skills I desire.

We now return you to our regular scheduled programming.

 
How do you do slow draft auction?
Through MFL. The way my leagues have done it - each owner nominates two players to start, 12 hour clock with blind bids (so you know the maximum you bid but everyone else just sees the current bid), if someone beats the current max bid that owner becomes the new high bidder and the clock restarts on that player. If nobody beats the maximum after 12 hours, the winning owner gets that player and nominates the next player. 

You can have roster requirements, like every team has to have at least a starting lineup (whatever you set) by the end of the auction, but you don't have to (almost everyone always does).  We always have minimums and maximums roster size (most recent is 18-24). 

The auction ends when everyone has either reached max roster size or spent their money. 

You can use whatever amount you want, could be $1000, could be $200. Doesn't really matter as everyone has the same amount (CMC might go for $250 if you have $1,000 to use, probably closer to $50 if you have $200). 

My most recent auction took 22 days. So maybe a bit longer than these drafts but you're never waiting for a team unless that team has won a player and hasn't nominated.  The biggest risk with owners not checking in is they lose out on the players at that time, but they might be able to load up on players nominated later.  

The biggest benefit imo is everyone has equal opportunity for the players.  Also it tends to give a better idea of the player's value (there's no real reaches unless two people like the player enough to keep bidding), until you have teams start running low on cash.  And you find teams with different strategies. You might go stud heavy (you could get CMC and Michael Thomas, but then have little elsewhere) whereas I might go for a bunch of players usually drafted in the 4th-8th rounds. 

 
-OZ- said:
Through MFL. The way my leagues have done it - each owner nominates two players to start, 12 hour clock with blind bids (so you know the maximum you bid but everyone else just sees the current bid), if someone beats the current max bid that owner becomes the new high bidder and the clock restarts on that player. If nobody beats the maximum after 12 hours, the winning owner gets that player and nominates the next player. 

You can have roster requirements, like every team has to have at least a starting lineup (whatever you set) by the end of the auction, but you don't have to (almost everyone always does).  We always have minimums and maximums roster size (most recent is 18-24). 

The auction ends when everyone has either reached max roster size or spent their money. 

You can use whatever amount you want, could be $1000, could be $200. Doesn't really matter as everyone has the same amount (CMC might go for $250 if you have $1,000 to use, probably closer to $50 if you have $200). 

My most recent auction took 22 days. So maybe a bit longer than these drafts but you're never waiting for a team unless that team has won a player and hasn't nominated.  The biggest risk with owners not checking in is they lose out on the players at that time, but they might be able to load up on players nominated later.  

The biggest benefit imo is everyone has equal opportunity for the players.  Also it tends to give a better idea of the player's value (there's no real reaches unless two people like the player enough to keep bidding), until you have teams start running low on cash.  And you find teams with different strategies. You might go stud heavy (you could get CMC and Michael Thomas, but then have little elsewhere) whereas I might go for a bunch of players usually drafted in the 4th-8th rounds. 
not sure that we can get 16 folks that will check in regularly, unless the 12-hour periods began at the same time every day. Is that how the schedule works?

 
not sure that we can get 16 folks that will check in regularly, unless the 12-hour periods began at the same time every day. Is that how the schedule works?
Not that I've done.

You really just have to check in once every 12 hours, or the clock can be as long as you want it

 
Not that I've done.

You really just have to check in once every 12 hours, or the clock can be as long as you want it
I'd be down for this.  Probably between SSL and MBSL would be the best timeframe (plus things before TCs are more settled).  Didn't you coordinate one of these several years back?

 
Missed getting the Vandy rookie Vaughn by one pick. The speed of the draft numbs the mind and I think that I am more excited for it to be over than I was for it to begin.

 
Missed getting the Vandy rookie Vaughn by one pick. The speed of the draft numbs the mind and I think that I am more excited for it to be over than I was for it to begin.
yesterday was two weeks....not sure what the average is but that seems about right.... maybe...?

couple spots were rain delays during prime drafting hours no doubt.....but I also know I could have been better as I got caught on the wrong end of the overnight/EST time thing a couple times....

 
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Screw 3 defenses, I'll go 3 kicker and hope they have jobs. 

With one round, one useless player to go...

QB: Mayfield and Wentz

- should be among the best QBBCs, I think Baker bounces back next year. 

RB: Cook, CEH, Mack, Pollard
I slightly regret not taking Mattison. I might take a 5th, I might not. Two guys I think I can count on if they're healthy, two guys who could do something but need to get lucky. 

WR: AJ Brown, Cooper, Gallup, Mims, Ross, Mike Williams
- the strength of the team, assuming mims is slightly useful. 

TE: OJ, Hurst, McDonald
- Howard and McDonald should bounce back from down years. Hurst might get traded or is an Andrews injury away from being very useful. Not a strength but only need one score each week here.

PK: Carlson, Gano, Z leg
- Gano was possibly a wasted pick but he should get healthy and he's pro bowl caliber when he's healthy. Carlson is, well my brother (not really, but could be a cousin)

😧 J E T S
- got stuck with only one, Maggot took the last one (which I kinda didn't want but would have taken). I think they're underrated but I wouldn't have chosen to fly solo with these guys in green. 

If I make it far it's because I got lucky with RB and TE. I do think the 3 kicker plan makes sense, heck I might grab a 4th.  

 
Thanks for the draft gentlemen!    :thanks:

Lets fire up another!   :football:

QB     Kyler Murray QB7,  Gardner Mishew QB31

Sitting at the ends of a 16 team draft one has to anticipate runs.    I believed I would see a substantial run on QB before I would get a chance to pick again at the 5-6 turn (29 picks).    Murray had the highest upside of the remaining QB's and a bonus was that I could (and did) grab Christian Kirk first knowing Bronco's was set at QB.    Minshew in the 15th was a very solid pick.   I am certain he will start the season and has upside potential.  He was very serviceable as a rookie last year and there is a buzz in Jacksonville that will make him tough to bench.   B

RB    Josh Jacobs RB11, Devin Singletary RB20,  Duke Johnson RB40,  Rashad Penny RB65, Jaylen Samuels RB 72  

My second round pick Jacobs was a safe pick as his receptions and health I expect to improve.  Health because he simply will have an off season to get healthy instead of preparing for the draft,  and receptions as he will start to learn the Gruden system better.    Singletary was a homer pick that I regret.   Should have taken Drake.   Drake is more of my kind of grinding RB.   Bills will likely add a compliment to Singletary.   I was please that Duke Johnson was still there in the beginning of the 9th.  He is solid in this format, and should provide steady bye week/injury relief.  Penny in the 17th was also a surprise.  Yes,  I am aware of the reports that he might start the season on IR.  If that should happen and I survive this could be a ok pick.   But, if the conjecture on his availability is wrong, and he is available at the start of the season,  he will be a steal in this draft.   He was trending up in a big way week 12 and 13 before he got injured.  I would have throw a flag if Bass had selected him!   Samuels in the 19th is a dart throw for a young player who's receptions are trending up!    A

WR     Davante Adams WR4,  Christian Kirk WR32,  Sterling Shepard WR42,  Curtis Samuel WR43,  Tyrell Williams WR56, Tyler Johnson WR98

I love Adams and will see him on many of my teams.    He burned others and myself last year with injuries,  here is to his health :banned: .   Christian Kirk was explained above with the Murry pick.   Note to self,  this is not DFS.   Atticipating a run at WR, i went back to back here.   Shepard was an easy conservative pick that can provide the occasional WR2 score and is a steady WR3.  Time for the risky pick.........hoping that the change in Carolina will give Samuel a boost.   Hoping he can stay out of the trainers room as his health has held him back......imo.   Williams was a solid pick in the 10th for this format!  Love it!  Should provide more steady production this year as a true WR1 is likely to be the Raiders roster to start the season.  With the WR class said to be deep,  I'll deviate from standard procedure and draft a rookie.   We're does Tyler Johnson end up?   B

TE   Austin Hooper TE7,  Albert Okweugbunam TE28 , Tyler Eifert  TE28

Anticipating a run on TE's so I grabbed Hooper 4th.   Run didn't really occur,  and now it looks like he won't get tagged.     Got goofy in the 14th trying to figure out which TE BB might be eying.  Eifert was the only pick I liked.  Think you all are undervaluing him.   He might save me at this position.    D  

 K     Steven Hauschka K18

Didn't anticipate the kicker run.  But believe I got one that should not be replaced.   My SOP for the many years has been one kicker.   I don't believe it has ever cost me,  and I know I have won with just one.  C

DEF   Niner's (D1), Bills (D3), Saints (D12)

Tried to force a run on Defense at the 11-12 turn,  hence the Niner's and the Bills.   You guys either weren't paying attention are didn't care about my threat to take a third.     Took a third in the 16th to carry thru on my threat.  A

 
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Screw 3 defenses, I'll go 3 kicker and hope they have jobs. 

With one round, one useless player to go...

QB: Mayfield and Wentz

- should be among the best QBBCs, I think Baker bounces back next year. 
I wasn't planning on taking a 3rd QB, but I've been putting off taking Tua entirely too long.  It's a risk to take him, but in the 20th the choice was entirely too easy.  Had one other player at the opposite end of his career I considered, but I like tua more.

 
Thanks for the draft gentlemen!    :thanks:

Lets fire up another!   :football:

Murray, Kyler QB ARZ, 

Minshew, Gardner QB JAX    

Jacobs, Josh LVR RB

Singletary, Devin BUF RB

Johnson, Duke HOU RB

Penny, Rashaad SEA RB

Samuels, Jaylen PIT RB

Adams, Davante GBP WR

Kirk, Christian ARI WR

Shepard, Sterling NYG WR

Williams, Tyrell LVR WR

Samuel, Curtis CAR WR

Johnson, Tyler FA WR

Hooper, Austin ATL TE

Okwuegbunam, Albert FA TE

Eifert, Tyler CIN TE

Hauschka, Steven BUF PK

49ers, San Francisco SFO Def

Bills, Buffalo BUF Def

Saints, New Orleans NOS Def
3 def....1 kicker.....minshew is no guarantee.....and maybe 1 te score?

 
lots of variables on the squad but i really like it

Allen, Josh BUF QB
Newton, Cam CAR QB

Barkley, Saquon NYG RB
Dobbins, J.K. FA RB
Freeman, Royce DEN RB
Guice, Derrius WAS RB
Vaughn, Ke'Shawn FA RB

Brown, Antonio FA* WR
Gage, Russell ATL WR
Golladay, Kenny DET WR
Jeffery, Alshon PHI WR
Moore, D.J. CAR WR
Pittman Jr., Michael FA WR
Reagor, Jalen FA WR

Henry, Hunter LAC TE
Knox, Dawson BUF TE

Fairbairn, Ka'imi HOU PK
Sanders, Jason MIA PK

Broncos, Denver DEN Def
Chargers, Los Angeles LAC Def

 
I'll trade Gano for the Bills ;)
 was actually going to suggest to shake things up every once in awhile that we could maybe be able to make one trade per team within like 48 hours of the draft being over....(we potentially may have to hold the last pick of the draft to do this)......

 
So Adam Humphries as the last pick on the off chance that Brady signs with Tennessee.
Even if he doesn't that's probably as solid a pick as you get here.

It might just be that I've become used to larger rosters, but I expected Jason witten, snell Jordan love, Herbert, and brissett to be drafted. But the last round was solid. 

Gage might be the SOD. 

 
QB - Ryan, Bridgewater: Ryan is huge every even year.  Bridgewater should get a chance somewhere.  Happy with the results since I only spent a 5th and 11th.

RB - Drake, Ingram, David Johnson, Burkhead, Dare Ogun: Concerned here.  Placing a lot of faith in Drake which he doesn't deserve and 2.06 seems like an overpay.  I expect Ingram to drop-off, but apparently everyone thought the same with him slipping to 4.11.  He finished RB11 last year and only cost RB25.  DJ was Drake insurance at worst.  Best case would be a trade to start in Tampa and a return to prominence.  If Bulkhead doesn't get cut, he'll outperform the 17th round price.  I debated hard about Ogun.  Rather than swinging for upside, I decided to try to avoid eating a donut or two during the year.

WR - Beckham, John Brown, Hardman, D. Johnson, N;Keal, T. Smith: Very happy with how things fell fell in this draft at WR.  Beckham should return to stud status.  Brown finished WR20 last year, I got him at WR36.  Huge bargain.  Hardman's TD will support this pick and started a trend.  Rather than chasing rookies, I focused on year 2 WRs that showed promise last year.  I like Johnson with Ben coming back.  N'Keal would get a shot in NE.  For a WR6, Smith is serviceable.

TE - Kelce, Brate: Not much to say about Kelce.  With him on board, TE2 needs to have upside.  Maybe Brate gets traded.

D - Rams, Titans, Browns: I felt pretty good about my roster, so rather than adding speculative picks, I add Ds that I think can post some points.  This strategy worked great for my one year when I was getting 12-20 pts a week from 3 Ds.  It's also been a horrible fail for me.

K - Gay, McManus: Two that should have jobs.

Overall, I should be above average at WR, TE, D, and K.  Average at QB.  RB could end up anywhere on the scale.

Enjoy drafting with you guys.  Will comment on others when I have the chance.

 
QB - Stafford/Roethlisberger - Ton of upside, ton of risk as these aren't the most healthy guys. 

RB - Bell/Swift/Hill/Edmonds/Love - Slightly above average at best.  Bell and Swift should give good weeks as good pass catching backs.  Didn't grab my 3rd until 13th round so probably should have looked a bit earlier, but the value didn't seem to be there.  Hill/Edmonds both have upside but likely need injuries in front.  Who knows about Love, but hoping he gets the Chris Thompson role in Washington.

WR - MT/JuJu/Metcalf/Jeudy/Ruggs/Isabella - Obvious team strength here.  Barring major injuries/bad bye weeks, should get 3 strong scores a week.  Last two guys could be 1-2 pts or a 15 point on one play. 

TE - Ebron/Dissly/Sternberger - Blech.  Waited too late here.  Had I suspected I could have gotten the WRS where I did, would have gone Andrews instead of JuJu and Slayton over Ebron which makes things look MUCH stronger.  Have to hope Ebron lands somewhere good, Dissly comes back decent/strong (and Olsen doesn't steal too much), and Sternberger doesn't get hit by a free agent pickup. 

PK - Gonzalez/Bullock - Arizona offense should be better.  Bullock was the last one I thought could last the season; hoping there will be at least some points there.

DST - SEA/IND - Got two middle of the road.  Hopefully won't play KC and NO same week.

Overall, WR is the obvious strength along with top 2 RBs. Two things that will likely determine the year: 1) QB health and 2) getting something stable at TE.  If those two hit, this team could go pretty far.  But any QB injury or drop-off at RB could doom the team early.

 
If I make it far it's because I got lucky with RB and TE. I do think the 3 kicker plan makes sense, heck I might grab a 4th.  
Pretty similar to my team IMO, with more stable QBs, a bit weaker at WR, and slightly better TEs across the board.  Doubling up Cooper/Gallup could be an issue if Amari stays in Dallas.  Needs the TE somewhere to hit but should be enough to make it to mid season otherwise.

 
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by_the_sea_wannabe said:
lots of variables on the squad but i really like it
Variability is right.  QB could be an issue, and piecing together RB2.  Steal on AB if he comes back.  could go far, risk of a week 1 exit too.

 
BassNBrew said:
Overall, I should be above average at WR, TE, D, and K.  Average at QB.  RB could end up anywhere on the scale.

Enjoy drafting with you guys.  Will comment on others when I have the chance.
I really like this team.  Good stability at most slots with some upside.  Biggest risk is that bye weeks or injuries for QB1 and TE1 overlap as I don't trust the backups.  This one has a chance to make it far, but as most things, upside will be the factor at the end.

Thanks for coordinating these.

 
Hate my team

QB. Carr, Burrow, Fitzpatrick. Waited too long. Even though if Landry goes or Aaron lasts one more pick would be different. Hope Fitz lasts long time as starter as imperative to this average group. Need this group to tread water and it is capable with 3

RB Taylor, Michel, Akers, Edwards, Dillon. It could be ugly or interesting. Took 4 out of 5 rookies last year in WSL2 on way too title. The rookies all have a chance. Michel should help me here and there and Edwards is okay 5th guy. If rookies fail, I could be out early

WR. Hopkens, Evans, Landry. Davis, Lazard, Bowden. One of the better overall units. Love my top 3 and rest might help here and there. Bowden is interesting as they might use as special weapon in the end. Carries, catches as look to create with him

TE. Engram, Giescki. If they stay healthy will be good. But maybe should have gone 3rd. Was looking at Hurst till Oz swooped in. Looked at Moreau in round 20 also. So know there is some risk with Engram. See Giescki only getting better

PK. Lutz, Koo. Both will have starting jobs. Wished waited to round 20 as guy I liked never drafted. Did not expect so many teams to go with 1. 

D. Raiders, Dolphins. I expect both to improve quite a bit. Money and picks to help cause. Was goal to wait till round 19-20 but teams taking 3 forced my hand a little early. Knew with pre selects, that would get 2 and have a choice of 3 at end and was correct

You know. Maybe I don’t hate as much as I thought I would. See how Fitz helps QB and how RB proceeds. After combine, feeling more comfortable. 

To comment earlier about not getting getting text alerts. I don’t get and still took only 18 minutes to do my entire draft. You don’t have to worry about me not having cellphone. 

 
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You know. Maybe I don’t hate as much as I thought I would. See how Fitz helps QB and how RB proceeds. After combine, feeling more comfortable. 

To comment earlier about not getting getting text alerts. I don’t get and still took only 18 minutes to do my entire draft. You don’t have to worry about me not having cellphone. 
Unfortunately I think there's a lot of risk that really isn't supported here.  You may have only 1 starting QB and a weak one at that.  RB rooks need to find good homes (Taylor should, Akers maybe).  Landry's surgery puts his start of season at risk.  TEs are good.  Might last for a while, but any week where the TE's are meh and both Hopkins and Evans don't go off will be an issue.  Probably out early-mid.

MFL after the upgrade went awry on how I was getting notices.  I usually just do email for when I'm on the clock (especially during the day) but everything started going to spam.  Wasn't until about the 16th round that I got that cleared even though I pretty much did everything I could to flip it back on.

 

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