Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
If Howie nails the Wentz picks that deal has the potential to be an all-timer if they get rid of him.
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2022 Philadelphia Eagles - Leave Gannon in Arizona and let’s run through the NFC again in 2023. (2 Viewers)
- Thread starter The Noid
- Start date
Long Ball Larry
Footballguy
I don't think it was considered a particularly good QB draft, but I think that Goff and Wentz were thought to be legit picks at 1 and 2, even if not future superstars.
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
DJackson10
Footballguy
Said this past year if a team like SF or BAL was looking for a back at the deadline and offered at least a day 2 pick I'd have highly considered trading him already. His biggest issues are availability (Doesn't seem to stay healthy) and looking at his numbers compared to the other backs we have they aren't anything earth shattering and we have guys on cheaper deals already who can do just as good if not better in the run game.
DJackson10
Footballguy
Numbers also say a lot when the guys behind him have just as good or slightly better numbers.
DJackson10
Footballguy
Goff/Wentz were considering the kings of this draft. Some were somewhat enamored with Memphis Paxton Lynch for some reason some even ranked him ahead of both these guys. Cody Kessler was looked at as a fairly solid prospect and possible starter with time, Connor Cook was more of an exciting prospect maybe could amount to something, Cardale Jones was another well he's athletic but can he play QB or should he become a WR/RB at the next level, DaK was the unknown, talked up like the next Tim Tebow in terms of QBs and success in the SEC. Better Passer but no where near the success Tebow had at the college level and in fact Prescott was known as a choke artist in college. Dude who put up great numbers until the big game then failed in the big moments. There was things to like about Prescott but also a lot of unknowns or he may have been at least a 2nd rounder. Kevin Hogan was looked at as prospect and project. Good arm, solid intangibles. The rest were looked at as career back ups.
It wasn't a SEXY CLASS by any means but some guys with potential. Wentz was everything a team should love from college in a QB prospect and he was doing things at LOS that hadn't been done since Peyton Manning. He was doing a lot of stuff that guys in the upper level including Goff wasn't doing.
As for the two big name guys Goff went to Cal in the PAC12 where he wasn't really challenged defensively. I think The Concussion for Carson has played a bigger role as well as not regaining his confidence after the ACL and then seeing Foles lead them to the SB and brought and back the following year? That has to have shot some confidence out of him there. The other injuries as well I think play a factor.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
With all due respect he looks light years better than the guys behind him.
My logic is that he’s still under a cheap deal and not used as a bell cow. With that said you can draft another or sign one to fill his limited role. Maybe another team sees him as a 20 touch guy and pays up. I wouldn’t take less than a 2 for him.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
I remember being out of work after hernia surgery and watching a reply of his bowl game. This was before he was even in striking range for us and I was in awe of what he was doing at the LOS. I remember being shocked at us going to 2 because the Rams were taking Goff over him.
As much as I like to buy into the injuries that messed him up, I really believe it’s his family life. Not that it messed him up but that it took precedence over football and he no longer has the drive he used to have. I won’t be shocked if he’s cut, doenst like his options and retires tbh.
Terpman22
Footballguy
The funny thing to me is looking at that draft, and then the next draft, you got Trubisky going #2 (which everyone felt was a reach) and Mahomes and Watson going 10 and 12. Pretty sure this was NOT considered a strong QB class, especially compared to the 2016 1-2 punch of Goff-Wentz and even the fact in 2015 QB's went 1-2 in Winston-Mariota.
L
O
L
And here we are thinking we need a QB this year and also saying "this class is weak"
Just further proves to me 1. You never really know for a few years and 2. Situation and system sure mean a lot. Its always fun to ponder "How good would Mahomes be had the Bears drafted him" type of thoughts.
With that said haha I still don't want a 1st round QB this year...but it makes you re-consider if you look deeper.
Pigskin Fanatic
Footballguy
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Yep! Every single time I hear “this class is weak” for any position I immediately dismiss it. Most of the people saying it are no different than the people who post on this board.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
“Isaac Seumalo has to be the forgotten man amongst Eagles fans right now. Looking at OL numbers per PFF and he had 109 pass blocking snaps this past season and gave up 0 sacks, 0 hits, 1 hurry.”
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Jordan Mailata is PFF's 22nd best player in the NFL in 2022.
Terpman22
Footballguy
For real! But with how great our line played, it was easy for him to be overshadowed, especially since he got injured and the Alabama kid seems to be a complete MONSTER. I hope he can come back and play RG, b/c I REALLY like the Mailata/Dickerson left side.
babydemon90
Footballguy
If I were a GM there Id absolutely try and get him. He looked fine in service this past year, and losing out to Mailata who looks like a stud isn't like he lost out to some scrub. I dont want the Eagles to give him away for a song tho.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
And if I’m Howie you’re paying up for what you see is a starting LT. OL depth is HUGE and we seem to be loaded with it. Keep building these lines back up.
The Noid
Avoid me!
Regarding our OL, heard it mentioned a few times on shows and radio recently that our OL is "old" but it's really not. Lane and Kelce are vets, yes, but still playing at a high level for now. But then we have young guys in Mailata, Seumalo, and Dickerson, with Herbig and Dillard as young depth.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
I think they’ve always factored Brooks in there as well. Maybe that’s it.
Driscoll also played well too
Tom Hagen
Footballguy
One thing the Eagles do well is prioritize versatile guys especially among the backups (other than Dillard). Dickerson and Seumalo can play guard and center. Driscoll can play at least tackle and guard and was originally drafted with the potential to learn center I believe. Herbig can play all 3 positions.
JohnnyU
Footballguy
DJackson10
Footballguy
I was talking to a former coach who coached QBs about a lot of this and misses. 32 NFL teams have 32 different ways on scouting a QB and not one of them is full proof of being the best. If a QB can learn and adapt his pre and post snap reads he can have success but it's very rare. A lot of guys have to want to improve as a talent as well. Unfortunately many of todays athlete don't want to strive to that success
In interviewing QBs I think teams need to ask these questions
1. What motivates you as an NFL QB and after reaching that goal how do you plan to keep motivated?
2. How do you prioritize your job in the NFL compared to pleasure, family life and extracurricular?
3. Any plans on upping fitness, eating healthier etc when coming into the league?
4. How much time are you prepared not just during the season but off season of striving to get better, practicing, studying film and the playbook?
5. Ask them their thought process going through controversial moments during games as well as possible locker room and off the field problems.
If your answer is to these is a generic answer or I don't know you take them completely off your draft board. These guys need to want to get better as well as understanding their success just won't come because of talent alone. How much are you truly willing to sacrifice for this opportunity?
DJackson10
Footballguy
I had problems with MM and Winston and didn't see them as strong. I remember some people saying Goff/Wentz would be clear cuts 1 and 2 if they came out with MM and Winston did.
MM issues was he was in a gimmick offense and not much of a pro offense. Not able to make most NFL throws and a back up at best.
Winston had numerious issues:
Red Flags character wise (Talking to someone in the know she actually overheard the FSU defense lawyer at a party with other FSU people bragging how they won the case despite Winston really being guilty paying people off). Not just the women but some of the other issues where he came off as someone who couldn't be a leader on and off the field
Skill set and mechanics: Mechanically with Winston's motion he was more prone to have strip sacks. His throwing motion wasn't great and he tend to miss high which in the NFL leads to INTs. His last 2 yrs in college he led all D1 QBs in 1st half INTs. Without the Defense FSU had at the time FSU is probably an avg team.
Overall I saw Winston having success but Numbers like this 3.5K-4K in Passing yes a year 30-35 TDs 20-25INTS and a few lost fumbles. Putting up great TD and Passing yard numbers but not someone who could protect the ball.
DJackson10
Footballguy
JetMaxx
Footballguy
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
It could actually be argued that Howie is one of the games best at picking and acquiring OL. Seems like ever since he’s been here we’ve always had top tier somewhere on the OL. He also does a phenomenal job of getting them late as well.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Not sure what this means exactly. He’s seemed unlucky getting rolled up on. I don’t see that as limited physically.
JetMaxx
Footballguy
Just get a sense based upon build and continuous injury that Driscoll is playing an NFL position that his body isn’t meant to play. It’s unfortunate because the player is a technician when on the field.
Tom Hagen
Footballguy
For all of the things Howie does wrong not only drafting Mailata but trading up to make sure the Steelers didn’t take him deserves a lot of credit. I get that Stoutland loved him but most GMs wouldn’t have made that deal.
need2know
Footballguy
DJackson10
Footballguy
He was responsible for only 11 of 52 sacks and 19 of 122 pressures according to PFF for what I remember during that time
DJackson10
Footballguy
Howie has done a lot he doesn't get credit for. People just go to pro bowls but thats something unintelligent fans and low IQ fans use as it's easy for them to use that argue about a GM then going by other factors. Look at the trades he's made to help out and he's drafted most of the starting line up which is hard to do
Yes he's had high misses but a lot of teams have had that. I would argue Howie is generally a top 5 GM in the NFL and I think a lot of teams would kill to have him as well as fan bases. Howie gets an unusual bad rep because of the sports talk radio neanderthals and the papers and reports such as McLane turning nothing into something just for the sake of clicks.
Someone online did an excellent breakdown of his moves since he's been here on twitter if I find it I'll post the thread again here. It's a good interesting read.
Also Howie is excellent with the cap each year. With Howie here we'll never end up in a cap hell like DAL, NO, TB etc are right now. He's also getting better at correcting his mistakes
The Noid
Avoid me!
We also started 13 different OL combinations in 16 games that year due to injuries, often with 1 or 2 3rd string options. Not exactly a fair representation of our otherwise consistently above-average OL the last 10 years.
babydemon90
Footballguy
Yea, the injury depletion last year was historic. Also the experience some of the guys got for the first time last year led to significant improvement in their play THIS year. Ideally you aren't rotating 20 different players into the OL to get experience tho, we didnt have a choice.The Noid said:
DJackson10
Footballguy
ESPN + Sub required but ESPN did a breakdown on top 50 FA's with 2 fits to the Eagles
Saints Safety Marcus Williams
A game-changing safety who can flourish in the box, while tracking the ball in open space, Williams would give Jonathan Gannon the perfect chase piece for his matchups against high-profile quarterbacks.
Why it makes sense: Williams will have several options as a high-level free safety with 15 interceptions and 38 pass deflections in five seasons. The Eagles’ safety unit is in transition, and the team could be willing to outbid the Saints and others. — Fowler
Scheme fit: Williams is a fit for Jonathan Gannon’s defensive scheme as a post or quarters defender who has elite range — and the ball skills to make plays down the field. — Bowen\
Back to the Saints though I heard a rumor or saw this mentioned awhile back about The Eagles maybe trading Minshew to NO with a pick for CHancey Gardner Johnson at Safety. NO has massive cap issues and won't be able to keep all their safeties and two might have to move. People will ask but they can get rid of Malcom Jenkins no? Not exactly his dead cap to move him this offseason doesn't make sense for a team trying to shed cap. CGJ is going to need a big contract despite him being young NO also needs a cheap QB fill in. I don't just like the move because CGJ is a former Gator but because he's young, fits the scheme and I think he'd be cheaper then Williams. Both are great players however
Juju Schuster Smith WR Steelers
Smith-Schuster would immediately upgrade the Eagles passing game while giving quarterback Jalen Hurts a dynamite target underneath.
Why it makes sense: Smith-Schuster seems destined to leave Pittsburgh. The Chiefs were interested a year ago and could circle back. Smith-Schuster has battled knee and shoulder issues, but when healthy, he can make tough catches over the middle and is a strong blocker — which would help Eagles coach Nick Sirianni’s run-heavy attack. — Fowler
Scheme fit: The Eagles have speed and vertical ability in the wide receiver room, but they are lacking a slot target with physical traits. Smith-Schuster is more explosive than you think, with the catch-and-run ability to work as a big slot in Sirianni’s offense. — Bowen
I've been pounding th table for JuJu since before he was an FA. Change of scenery and I think he comes cheap and you aren't going to find WRs with his talent come as cheap as I think he could be. Like the article says he is a tough catcher and has speed, vertical threat despite his physical size and he is a physical run blocker which fits what the Eagles do running wise. JuJu comes with some negatives but I don't think his negatives in terms of social media involvement is any worse then Joel with the Sixers and if you can get him to control that he's going to be a hell of a player like Joel.
Saints Safety Marcus Williams
A game-changing safety who can flourish in the box, while tracking the ball in open space, Williams would give Jonathan Gannon the perfect chase piece for his matchups against high-profile quarterbacks.
Why it makes sense: Williams will have several options as a high-level free safety with 15 interceptions and 38 pass deflections in five seasons. The Eagles’ safety unit is in transition, and the team could be willing to outbid the Saints and others. — Fowler
Scheme fit: Williams is a fit for Jonathan Gannon’s defensive scheme as a post or quarters defender who has elite range — and the ball skills to make plays down the field. — Bowen\
Back to the Saints though I heard a rumor or saw this mentioned awhile back about The Eagles maybe trading Minshew to NO with a pick for CHancey Gardner Johnson at Safety. NO has massive cap issues and won't be able to keep all their safeties and two might have to move. People will ask but they can get rid of Malcom Jenkins no? Not exactly his dead cap to move him this offseason doesn't make sense for a team trying to shed cap. CGJ is going to need a big contract despite him being young NO also needs a cheap QB fill in. I don't just like the move because CGJ is a former Gator but because he's young, fits the scheme and I think he'd be cheaper then Williams. Both are great players however
Juju Schuster Smith WR Steelers
Smith-Schuster would immediately upgrade the Eagles passing game while giving quarterback Jalen Hurts a dynamite target underneath.
Why it makes sense: Smith-Schuster seems destined to leave Pittsburgh. The Chiefs were interested a year ago and could circle back. Smith-Schuster has battled knee and shoulder issues, but when healthy, he can make tough catches over the middle and is a strong blocker — which would help Eagles coach Nick Sirianni’s run-heavy attack. — Fowler
Scheme fit: The Eagles have speed and vertical ability in the wide receiver room, but they are lacking a slot target with physical traits. Smith-Schuster is more explosive than you think, with the catch-and-run ability to work as a big slot in Sirianni’s offense. — Bowen
I've been pounding th table for JuJu since before he was an FA. Change of scenery and I think he comes cheap and you aren't going to find WRs with his talent come as cheap as I think he could be. Like the article says he is a tough catcher and has speed, vertical threat despite his physical size and he is a physical run blocker which fits what the Eagles do running wise. JuJu comes with some negatives but I don't think his negatives in terms of social media involvement is any worse then Joel with the Sixers and if you can get him to control that he's going to be a hell of a player like Joel.
Pigskin Fanatic
Footballguy
i agree with all of this. clearly howie doesn't believe in drafting a big receiver. it's like the second coming of al davis, speed speed speed. okay maybe not that bad. not a fan of Juju but his size and skills is a good fit.
My FA WR preference is Alan Robinson.
The Noid
Avoid me!
Interesting note: Howie is in the last year of his contract. So we’ll know at some point where his future will be with the Eagles. The longer time goes by without him signing an extension, the more likely we could be going in a different direction. Cash in on that GM factory assembly line?
No one has ever thought Lurie would fire him, but there is the possibility he uses this as an opportunity for a “mutual parting of ways.”
No one has ever thought Lurie would fire him, but there is the possibility he uses this as an opportunity for a “mutual parting of ways.”
DJackson10
Footballguy
Very good observation here. I think Lurie respects Roseman too much to fire him so he'd more likely let his contract run out and say Mutual terms we parted ways for the better or Howie wanted to pursue other opportunities and interests.
need2know
Footballguy
Tom Hagen
Footballguy
Pip's Invitation
Footballguy
He survived the Reid, Kelly and Pedersen purges. And other front office conflict. I won’t believe that he’ll go until I actually see him go.
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
Rank these Howie trades:
A) Bradford to Vikings for 1st and 4th
B) Wentz to Colts for 1st and 3rd
C) Kiko, Maxwell and 13th overall to Miami for 8th overall pick
D) Kolb to Arizona for DRC and 2nd
E) 6th overall and 3rd for DeVonta Smith and 1st
A) Bradford to Vikings for 1st and 4th
B) Wentz to Colts for 1st and 3rd
C) Kiko, Maxwell and 13th overall to Miami for 8th overall pick
D) Kolb to Arizona for DRC and 2nd
E) 6th overall and 3rd for DeVonta Smith and 1st
ProstheticRGK
Footballguy
need2know
Footballguy
Bigboy10182000
Footballguy
was that him or Banner and Co.?Similar threads
